Guild Wars 2

Carighan.6758:

I also like how it’s apparently normal to compare two abilities of two different classes directly, in the same sentence as admitting that they’re totally different.

exasperated sigh

I compared the functionality. They are mechanically different but serve the same role, get in the your enemy’s face. One works most of the time, one works maybe 25% of the time.

Lucentfir.7430:

shimmerlessEU.6841:

DPS Guardian isn’t well-designed. Classes need to be a lot less like DPS Guard rather than more.

Yes pls, moar all in one package builds/classes please, kick the sacrifice from other specs already ;P

Yah, I seriously don’t understand the hate for Medi Guard. It is one of the more high risk-high reward builds out there. It’s strong but has several big weaknesses. It’s not like trip kit of D/D Eles that have an answer to everything.

Also, I’m getting really fed up with people not reading the full post before responding. It’s obvious because some of you are referring to things that have already been addressed.

I’m going to further elaborate. I know that Warriors are not magical, I also would never want them to be. I only chose teleport because when it comes to reliability that mechanic it much better than the current one.

As for the aesthetics, this is my vision. I’ve dropped the concept of it being instant first of all. It would have a 1/2 second “cast time” and the tell will be the Warrior taking the shoulder rush stance the skill currently uses followed by them flashing that orange-yellow color we’re all familiar with. They will then “teleport” (again, this is only in game mechanics) which would leave a Flash-style streak behind them. The enemy will have time to react, but once the skill starts it should be a guaranteed hit if they aren’t evading/blocking etc.

If you’ve ever seen a battle anime imagine the trope where the non-magical brawler type suddenly moves faster than the enemy can see, It’s like that. While as far as the game is concerned you just teleported, but from player’s perspective you just moved really fast.

Also, this will decrease Warrior’s ability to run away because just like JI you will require a target for it to work. It will be slightly different because JI can activate if you don’t have a target but that won’t work for this, it will need a in-range target to activate.

You can say you just want the current gap closers “to work” but the problem with that is that the reason they are failing might be a problem with the game’s engine and would require tons of new code. Every thing I have suggested already exists in the game. As far as I know it would not require making new systems since a skill like what I describes already exists, it just has a different effect.

witcher.3197:

I hope you do realize warriors aren’t magic users, so they will never add teleportation to the class mechanics.

As I said in my post it will only be a teleport as far as mechanics are concerned. As far for looks you could just speed up the current BC and make it look like you became the flash and leave behind a speed trail.

As for those doubting the reliability of teleports, I’m only focused on Judge’s Intervention, which for me only fails if you’re not on the same elevation and I think this was intentional.

bobomb.5209:

insanemaniac.2456:

BurrTheKing.8571:

I’ve avoided it by simply walking towards the player using it, which causes it to either overshoot or they knock you down but are facing the wrong way to follow up before you recover.

this happens when a player is not using autotarget and does not have you selected. of course it goes straight through you, he isnt “trying” to hit you. if he wants to “try” to hit you, he needs to click on you first, or its just going to be a 1200 range dash with a melee single target aoe at the end.

thats why its perceived as unreliable. and its an l2p issue.

judges intervention circumvents this play pattern by requiring a target to be used.

No. You are completely wrong. I have experienced this multiple times and Burr King is correct. I have used Bulls Rush and it DOES overshoot your target even when locked on. It is not a “L2P” Issue it is an issue with the skill not tracking.

Correct, I always have a target selected. I have see 3 main ways that BC often fails:

• Target is only running in any direction, not evading or doing any action to avoid the attack. BS misses and you move past them or just stop moving once you reach them.

• You connect, but go past your target and by the time you can turn around and take advantage they are already standing.

• You connect, and it initially looks like everything is fine, then either you or your target teleport a few feet away. Probably due to lag, but what makes it bad is that it can apparently be affected by the other person lagging. If it was just on your side it would still be a pain but it’s still “on you.” The fact that you can’t control that someone else is lagging makes it a nightmare.

Considering all of the gap closers in this game don’t work that well It’s just a sad fact that making BC “just work” is unlikely to happen. It’s been 2 years and it has only gotten worse but even at its best it wasn’t great. I want it to work as intended too but if that’s impossible then I’d rather have it be a modified version of something that does.

Doon.2364:

No! I don’t want Bullcharge to be a teleport. It’s one of my favorite moves in the game. I like the animation. I like that feeling of charging at my opponent at high speed. So I say no to the teleport idea. I just want it to work right. That is all.

I don’t think it ever will work with the current system. Even before it was totally broken it was never really reliable in the first place. With how little (possibly no) “netcode” this game has if either you or your target is lagging the skill will either send you flying past, one of you will teleport after it connects (I’ve had friends see this happen on numerous occasions, you hit them and then suddenly one of you just pops up in a different spot a few feet away out of range), or any other number of crazy things.

I don’t see how a 2 second KD on a 45 second knockdown that reliably hits would be any more OP than a skill that allows you to start an attack animation and then instantly appear next to your opponent and set them on fire (which when traited deals extra damage) like JI. Making it like Swoop doesn’t help much either since that’s another gap closer that isn’t that reliable either. The difference is that the CD isn’t 45 seconds can you could argue that it’s more for creating distance than attacking. Frenzy will still not be that amazing because of the nerfs it received and it’s 60 second CD. Not using frenzy means you only hit with a little over half of 100bs recently nerfed hits. If they open up with it, you probably have your stun break still. If they force you to use it first, they outplayed you.

Also, while the aesthetics of the skill are nice, I will always prioritize functionality over looks. A skill that looks good but hasn’t worked properly for 2 years might as well not exist. Even in the old days it only hit more reliably because players didn’t know how to dodge yet. It not being reliable means that double melee isn’t viable unless you’re a Shouts + Warhorn with Hammer or using overpriced food. In PvP…when was the last time you felt threatened by a War w/o a bow?

Shockwave.1230:

What if Bull’s Charge was a “Teleport?”

Then warriors would be calling for targets when roaming between points and it’d be on every warrior bar, and greatswords would probably be meta, and warriors would potentially replace thieves.

• There would have to be a target there, teleports like JI require a target.

• The disengaging power would be less so they could just stealth away like a Thief

• Hammer would still be better

• LB would still be better

• It would make DPS War “playable” and that’s about it. Medi guard will still have better sutain, Thieves better disengage/burst/boon stealing.

You know what the major difference between a DPS focused Medi Guard and a DPS Warrior? There are many but the major one is that the Medi Guard’s gap closer, Judge’s Intervention, is reliable. You can teleport to your target in the middle of using a skill like Binding Blade/Whirling Wrath or Ring of Warding/Mighty Blow, making normally difficult to land skills more reliable.

Now let’s compare this to a DPS Warrior, something which honestly isn’t that viable these days. A big problem is Bull’s Charge. It has a very high failure rate for many players. I’ve avoided it by simply walking towards the player using it, which causes it to either overshoot or they knock you down but are facing the wrong way to follow up before you recover. But what if BC was a “teleport” like JI? It would solve many issues such as:

• Being able to reliably land highly telegraphed attacks like 100b and Skull Crack.

• It would be unaffected by movement impairing conditions.

• Here’s something for those who dislike mobility Wars, it would require a target, meaning that it can’t be used as easily to run away. Sure, in WvW you could still target a bunny or something, but that applies to and skill that teleport.

Now, for thematic purposes the Warrior using the skill would need to leave some sort of after image, so it looks like they just moved incredibly fast. We have to keep some class distinction. Part of me thinks that it would need some sort of tell but really JI doesn’t and I don’t think many view it as being OP because of it. Since it would be used to combo something with a big telegraph and has a fairly long CD and if you have a stun break then it would do that much to you anyways I think it might be fair for it to be instant. While I understand you can’t directly compare too different skills from different classes the skills are VERY similar in what role they play, however one works and one doesn’t.

While I’m on this topic, Guardian has another skill that preforms better than a Warrior skill of a similar function, Leap of Faith. Die to how the skill is designed, it connects much more reliably than the Warrior skill Rush. By the time you reach a target with Rush and then stand in place to begin the attack they have already moved away. It’s no wonder it’s often saved to run away because as a gap closer it totally fails. Leap of Faith is AoE and the attack animation is fluid and doesn’t force you to stand still to attack after you reach your target. I personally would gladly accept some form of Ride the Lightning treatment where if you don’t connect you get a greater CD (but not double, Warrior has less skills than Ele) if in return it moved faster and was AoE like LoF. The only reason for the AoE is that is what appears to make LoF so reliable is that it has a sort of cone rather than a straight line.

Changes like these would make DPS focused double melee Warriors a bit less garbage because when your combo has such a huge CD it should not fail just because the game didn’t let it connect.

EDIT: I’ve clarified my post, please look here

EDIT 2 : I’m getting tired of repeating myself, the skill will feel very similar to how it does currently. The power of the skill should remain the same, all this change will do is make it hit when it’s supposed to with higher frequency.

While I don’t like the passive nature of it, I don’t think it needs a functionality change. Right now Warrior heals are set up like so:

Healing Signet: Constant tics which is meant for builds focused on attrition. While the passive is strong if someone with high DPS can put a big burst on you it’s hard to gain it back without running.

Healing Surge: Large burst heal for more damage based builds. Too bad it punishes you for using your class mechanic which makes it totally unattractive. Especially with the high CD.

Mending: For builds with low condition removal. Would be good if the CD was lower.

Defiant Stance: Either great or totally worthless depending on the situation. Would maybe see more use if affected by Sure Footed for an extra second of use.

They all are tailored to different play styles, however ANet has systematically made any playstyle that isn’t attrition too weak to bother using. A Medi Guard or Shatter Mesmer will have better sustain and damage than say a Bull’s Charge + Frenzy + 100b or an sort of pure glass build that Warrior has. By the time you’ve traited to deal even slightly decent dmg you are totally weak to conditions and if your gap closers fail (as they often do) you’re basically screwed.

Buff the other heals, leave Heal Sig alone.

D/D is a problem due to how imbalanced might stacking is due to runes and sigils. It stands out even more on Ele that say, Warrior because they can stack a lot of might without interacting with the enemy while a War has to gain adrenaline to use Combustive Shot. Celestial is a problem as well. With the variety of healing and both condition and power damage it makes it even more powerful. The ammy now has way more stat points than any other as well. Now, if might stacking is nerfed it might not be a problem, but it is certainly a contributing factor.

Ele as a class is still pretty weak, it’s gear that makes them strong.

Xae Isareth.1364:

They really need to split PvE and PvP and cone to accept that they are very different game modes. Until they do this, you never reach a state were everything is useful in every game mode because what’s useful and what’s powerful are just so different between them.

I actually agree with the devs that doing so isn’t necessarily the best idea. More splits means more ways to break something. It would be better in the long run to fix the mechanics and design of PvE. For example, instead of almost every boss being “avoid the red spot or die” have some that do consistent small damage so having someone heal is actually needed. Designing content so that you can’t just bring the same builds to every encounter might actually get me interested in PvE again.

Fay.2357:

BurrTheKing.8571:

What I’m looking for:

• PvP/WvW builds
• Lockdown and Interrupt focused
• As little reliance on clones as possible
• Anything I can do to be a support player
• Can i still do this and be viable? If not, I’ll just play something else.

You can do many of these, but absolutely not all of them. No matter what you do, you’re going to be reliant on clones to an extent, especially in a lockdown build where diversion shatter can be really key. It’s up to you to decide if that’s a gamebreaker. I’d look at the lockdown mesmer thread currently on the front page of this forum for some ideas.

Yah, i went and read that right after posting this. I hate the idea of clones but it looks like that 4/4/6/0/0 build focuses on timing which is something I can get behind. I get the thematic idea behind clones to cause confusion, but it still feels like I’m some sort of pet class which I generally only like on Rangers.

So, I really enjoyed Mesmer in GW1. I tended towards playing lockdown builds. I wasn’t the one doing the killing, but I was making it easier to kill the enemies for my friends. I’ve tried twice to make a Mesmer in GW2 and deleted it both times because I HATED the whole mechanic of using clones. Of course I know that I can’t get around that if I want to play the class, but have recent changes make interrupt/lockdown builds more viable?

What I’m looking for:

• PvP/WvW builds
• Lockdown and Interrupt focused
• As little reliance on clones as possible
• Anything I can do to be a support player
• Can i still do this and be viable? If not, I’ll just play something else.

If anyone has watched Log Horizon, I kinda wanna be Shiroe. :p

P.S I’ve read all the traits and came up with some concepts, but I don’t want to buy another character slot to test them out, which is why I came here to ask for a more “expert” opinion. I’ve seen posts about lockdown Mes but I don’t know if they are actually viable.

Healing Signet has the strength of constantly healing you with the weakness of a worthless active. Before, the amount of healing is what made people complain about it. In it’s current form I think it’s hard to say that the heal itself is OP. Is it boring mechanically? I think yes. Does it have a unique function compared to other Warrior heals? Yes. Healing Surge is for healing after a big spike. Mending is for countering condi heavy builds but is weak vs pure power. Defiant Stance is situational but can be useful for zerg surfing and bosses with high single damage hits (would have interesting synergy with Frenzy if not for that long CD).

The problem now is less about Healing Signet and more that the other heals are just not worth taking. Healing Surge is now a even bigger joke then it was before. With the adrenaline changes I can never see myself using it. It is not skill based, it’s luck based. If you don’t have adren when you need it, you don’t heal for much and have a long CD.

Mending seems like it would be great for pairing up with Restorative Strength, if it didn’t heal for such a pitiful amount. Warriors lack mechanics such as protection, aegis, and stealth that allows other classes to mitigate damage. So while the amount would seem reasonable on other classes, for Warriors it just isn’t practical. Either needs a higher heal or a slight reduction in CD (which is what I would prefer). It would allow double melee/non-LB builds to be more resistant to movement impairing conditions in PvP. Despite what the forum believes, Warriors do suck against conditions, the one exception being having a LB. You can take CI, Zerk Stance, and Brawler’s Recovery with Hoelbrak runes and still get overwhelmed by condis if you don’t have a LB.

Make Defiant Stance an actual Stance that is affected by every Stance trait, not just 1 or 2.

If you’re complaining about Heal Sig still…it just boggles my mind. I can match if not exceed that healing easily on other classes and not be so vulnerable to poison.

dominik.9721:

Actually you need longbow in WvW at the same way you need it in spvp. As Burtheking mentioned, you won’t be really viable without longbow on the contrary, longbow is the strongest weapon the warrior can use.
If you win fights in WvW with GS /hammer or GS/Axe builds actually means your oppenent suck or probably his build does.

The one exception would be Sword + Horn/Hammer with Condi Clearing + Healing Shouts. However the goal of that build is less to kill and more to support and control.

The animation change sounds like a good first step for balancing. It’s very similar to what they did with Pin Down. Right now, you can’t really know when PBS is coming. This just means that you’ll have to be a bit more clever then just using 4 -> 2 on CD.

As for War GS, really? The new burst wasn’t buffed that much, in fact it’s kind of rubbish considering the damage nerfs that the other skills received because of it. Rush still connects maybe 1/10 times if you’re lucky. Same applies to Bull’s Charge which means 100b is harder to use. I don’t really see it used at all in PvP these days and it’s mostly used for mobility in WvW.

Guard GS has massive tells that generally involve spinning to win. It has a great combo when timed well but if you miss it gl spamming your AA until you can swap sets again. Complaining about this weapon is silly.

Ranger LB is not being changed because it’s too frequently used, it’s being changed so that your foe has a chance to react to it. It’s a good way to “nerf” a skill without actually nerfing the effect it causes. Good Rangers will still do well, bad ones will blow their PBS and get crushed, as it should be. Why it OK with it happens to Warriors but not when it happens to Rangers?

Elitist.8701:

This November balance patch shows basically nothing. They didn’t nerf cele ammy and autofear necro. They buffed random stuff. Only good thing is nerf to bearbow ranger.

I understand the annoyance and agree. However, I can’t in good conscience repeatedly say “I want more frequent but smaller patches” and then yell at they when they start doing it. Small steps, it might be too late but MMOs are long lived and this one has the least problems atm. I don’t have to pay a sub, and hackers are generally not a huge problem like other games cough Archeage cough.

Rune/Sigil/Ammy changes are more important than class balance though atm and I would like to see it addressed.

Penguin.7906:

But it’s pointless arguing that warrior’s need longbow. The only reason we use it is because of how conquest works, theres a reason why nobody runs longbow in wvw roaming.

It’s also for a reliable condi cleanse. Try running a build without it, you’ll just get eaten alive by condis even with runes like Hoelbrak/Mel, Zerker Stance, and Brawler’s Recovery. People scoff when Warrior’s weakness to conditions is brought up, but without food or a LB it’s the truth.

These sort of small balance changes are the sort of thing I want to see going forward. If these come with every major patch instead of every six months then the meta can hopefully gradually change rather than being thrown into chaos. That being said I hope there’s some fix for gap closers they just hadn’t mentioned.

P.S Look even i can be positive when I see something I like.

Cygnus.6903:

Who is, or is not at a greater risk of failing due to a skill not working is irrelevant. What is relevant, is that these skills not working properly are severely limiting warrior usefulness.

Fix it.

Why is this topic so incredibly long.

spots the dancingcoglin combo

Sigh.

I’ve stopped caring, those two will contradict literally ANYTHING I say. I could say grass is green and they would probably reply “well actually, it can be brown if it doesn’t receive enough water.” This isn’t personal to me, I dropped Warrior. However whenever I win a fight due to to these issues I can’t help but pity the War.

I play every class with gap closers and Warrior’s gap closers not working screw you over more severely than any other class.

• A 45 second CD KD missing means you have no setup for skills like Skullcrack or 100b which leads to a dramatic loss of damage.

• Rush can hit for up to 5k but because your character stops just before the attack it not only never connects but also means it totally fails as a gap closer because during that swing animation your target can just move away from you.

• Savage Leap can be combo’d with Leg Specialist to reliably land Final Thrust/Flurry and keep them in range. Unfortunately, if you’re under the skills range your character just sort of hovers once it reaches them and doesn’t connect or you go right past them.

• Earthshaker and Evis can cause you to rubberband if you have even a tiny amount of lag.

These issues make it all but impossible to run a double melee build because it makes it stupidly easy to kite said War. You can kind of get away with it in WvW with -condi duration food (although the skills mentioned will still fail just as often) but in PvP it’s go Bow or go home (your home, not the maps home).

Idk what you’re saying, I think it’s fine. I mean really there’s no problem here.

In all seriousness though, this is the one build that is able to stack this much immob. To do it effectively means not stacking too much because if you blow all of your CDs in one burst then suddenly you’re about half as effective as you would be if you spaced them out. Even then, only Flurry can apply AoE immob, everything else is single target. It sucks to be the one being targeted. You also can’t deny that it’s nice to have someone like this when you down a Ele outside of a gate in WvW.

I personally don’t fear immob unless I’m on my Engi, and that’s because I just fear condis in general when I play it (although I’m getting pretty good at managing them). Other than that I feel like on my Guard and War I got enough removal.

The bugs involving immob and stuns really need to be fixed though.

Archaon.9524:

aaaand…let’s start this all over again..like 2 years ago…

problem is that ele (This time) is pretty balanced…celestial + might stacking isn’t…and not only on eles…just look at sword offhand wars and celestial engis for example..

celestial amulet+might is the problem…not the single class/spec abusing it..

+1 to that. Ele itself hasn’t recieved many game changing updates, but the changes to gear/runes/sigils made it as strong as it was around launch.

A slight nerf to might stacking would probably bring several meta builds down a notch while keeping them viable.

I think the difference between PvP now and a few months ago is that while there was a meta, you could generally build to counter the meta in some way and therefore be considered viable. Now, it’s generally better to beat the meta using the meta because the meta is just head and shoulders above anything else.

Look at how many meta builds rely on running a tanky ammy like Celestial/Soldiers and stacking might. Before, running these sigils meant you would have good sustain but terrible damage, now you can get both via Sigil of Battle and fire fields for an extended duration. Factor in the Sigil of Intelligence changes and even having low precision is no big deal.

Only a few builds on Thief, Mesmer, or Ranger are viable when using Zerker, and that’s due to the “cowardly” (using stealth/clones/range to avoid being a target) nature of those builds. Trying to run power on any other class is generally just flat out worse than using tanky + might. You’ll only have a bit more damage and they’ll simply outlast you.

All my old gimmick builds used to be pretty strong against the meta, now I just run them as a sad joke. Variety is all but dead, it’s pretty much run the meta or be useless.

I’m confused as to how more dodges = faster game. I would say that it is the opposite. The more dodges both players have the more drawn out the fight becomes due to how much damage they are avoiding. The more times you can evade, the less important it becomes to time them for your foe’s most powerful attacks.

Fewer dodges means that fights end more quickly because you can’t avoid as much damage.

Draknar.5748:

IndigoSundown.5419:

It’s not just different materials though.

The Armageddon, Draconic and Scale chestpieces are all metal, and the Midnight Ice applied to all three is a different color.

Perhaps they are metal but with different finishes (regular, polished, matte)?

I assume that’s the case. It would be great if we could actually choose that finish though.

Vayne.8563:

IndigoSundown.5419:

It’s not just different materials though.

The Armageddon, Draconic and Scale chestpieces are all metal, and the Midnight Ice applied to all three is a different color.

Okay that’s just weird. lol

Yah, it makes it really, really hard to the the look you want. This sort of existed in GW1 as well, but you can mix dyes so you could generally get what you wanted eventually.

I don’t disagree that for the price (although I bought the collectors edition with the statue) it is certainly worth the price. However, the same holds true for GW1 but that held my attention much longer as someone who likes to theorycraft due to how often the game was updated.

Like I said, I don’t dislike the game, if I did I wouldn’t post this and I would just stop playing. The criticism is because I care.

6. Lack of visual representation for Stability: It has been stated on multiple occasions that the devs want us looking at the health bar of our foe as little as possible. However, a boon as important as Stability has no visual cues at all. Something like a circle at their feet with the same pillar as the boon icon would go a long way.

7. Inconsistency with tells: While this was somewhat fixed in PvP, it would be nice if some animations were given more pronounced animations on smaller races when it comes to WvW. Same thing when it comes to some spells regardless of race. There has been improvement in this area but I would like to see it continue.

4. Very few new non-gemshop skins: GW2 is a game about aesthetic progression more than stat progression. While there has been new items added the vast majority has all been unobtainable except for gem purchases. I don’t mind that there are skins in the store but it would be nice to have more armor/weapons that you can earn by collecting different items around the world as a sort of scavenger hunt. If it’s hard enough those who obtain would have a sort of status that legendaries (used to) have. If it was Ascended quality then it would also be a nice alternative to those unwilling to partake in the current system.

5. Consistency of dye colors: This is a minor gripe, but if you have ever tried to mix armor sets you’ve probably discovered that some pieces dye completely different even with the same dye. Some sort of option to change the “material” so that you can get them to look like they belong together would be amazing. It’s not something I’m holding against the game, but like I said it’s a game about looking cool and dyes are a big part.

This list is going to appear long, I’m sure some will want to say “if you hate the game so much, why don’t you stop playing?” The answer to that is that I don’t hate this game, I am simply frustrated because I know the game isn’t living up to its potential. I thought maybe posting this would lead to at least one dev reading it because I feel like my gripes are shared by a good number of players.

These first few points focus on game balance.

1. The infrequency of balance updates: There is letting the meta settle, there there is letting it sit for half a year. These giant balance updates every 6 months often dramatically change the game and lead to a massive amount of new bugs being introduced. Personally, I would much rather game small patches every month focusing on 1 or 2 things per class. I would even be fine with patches focusing on a specific class so long as they are ordered in such a way that no one class has to wait too long for their turn.
If the current rate of updates has to do with a lack of resources or some other reason then please, tell us. Otherwise, we have to draw conclusions for ourselves as to why. One theory I have is that you don’t want to have too many patches so players are constantly downloading updates. As someone with a slow DL speed I understand that, but I’d rather have a 15-30 min update every month for a constantly evolving game then a 1-2 hours one that drastically changes how things work.

2. Runes and Sigils have too great of an effect on your build: The last few content patches shifted runes and sigils to being a fairly minor part of your build to being almost as, if not more important than, your traits. I like that I can have an “on crit/hit” and an “on swap” sigil on each weapon but being able to stack 2 of the same kind of sigil means I can use both Fire and Air or Battle and Energy on one set. This is absurdly powerful, and I think it this is to the game’s detriment.

If you could only have 1 of each type of sigil on a weapon set, as in the game will simply not allow you to put 2 “on crit/hit” or “on swap” on, it would make sigils go back to being something that enhances a certain part of your build or slightly covers a weakness rather than totally covering it up.

As for runes, the changes to the +might duration sets such as Strength, Hoelbrak, and Pirate allows you to run tankier gear yet still do decent damage via might stacking. Not all classes/builds can take advantage of this, but many can and it is especially prevalent in PvP. There are a lot of runes that are really interesting mechanically, but are never used because others simply overshadow them completely. They aren’t bad, it’s just that the alternative is better (a problem shared with build diversity).

3. Weak/buggy traits and skills: There are tons of cool build possibilities that are not viable simply due to things not functioning correctly. One that has been discussed a lot frequently is how this last patch totally broke the already unreliable gap closers in this game. You can miss Bull’s Charge on a stationary target even with no lag. This means that double melee builds involving weapons that requiring something like a gap closing knock down to be effective aren’t as strong as they should be simply due to skills not working.

The same thing applies to traits, some have cool effects but they don’t work as described so they’re totally worthless. In addition, there’s still a healthy number that you would never take under any circumstances. It’s hard to know what exactly will be viable as well due to the aforementioned sigil/rune changes. If the current go-to items were slightly weaker, we might see more variety like we used to. There’s always going to be a meta, but it would be nice to be able to build to specifically counter it. When it comes to might stacking, very few can actually build to counter because of how low on the strip/steal priority list the boon is.

I agree that forums are generally there for negative feedback. Threads gushing with nothing but positive feedback doesn’t generally help the devs improve the game. That being said it’s good to point out when they do something well so that they continue doing things that we like. If no one complains about things that need to be fixed, they probably never will be.

In a game that is supposed to be based around visual and build diversity, being forced into 1-3 builds per mode in order to be competitive is NOT OK. There’s always going to be a few builds that are the best for a specific situation, but you should still be able to run something else that is designed to counter the meta. In GW1 I would almost always be able to come up with something that shuts down w/e the recent changes brought (these changes also came much more frequently). In GW2 it seems better to just run the meta and play it better rather than countering it. These builds are also often times easier to play than others. Why run something that requires good timing and skill usage when you can run something more forgiving and do better with it?

I think the changes to gear such as runes and sigils are a big part of the problem. Some are simply so amazing that other stuff that is just “good” never gets used. Runes intended for specific classes tend to have interesting effects, but why bother when you can run a + might duration rune with sigils of Battle and Energy or Fire and Air.

For theorycrafters and people that aren’t satisfied running the same build all the time this is a huge issue.

I agree with Carighan.6758 that atm several runes/sigils affect your build/balance too much. Design wise I like the concept of runes like Citadel where they have minor effects but can be combined with traits to make them more powerful (I’m fairly sure the bomb summoned is effected by explosive traits). That’s really interesting mechanically but you never really see those build-focused runes being used because something like Strength is simply better.

Same with sigils, it’s almost never a bad idea to have Battle and Energy. Some builds are obviously better with other options but more power/condi damage and more dodges is never a bad thing. Being able to double up on Fire/Air was also probably not the best idea. I would have been satisfied if they made “on crit/hit” sigils have a separate CD from “on swap” sigils. This would mean that you couldn’t have Battle and Energy or Fire and Air on the same weapon. They could probably just disallow you from even placing them on the weapon so players can’t make the mistake of doing so.

There’s always going to be an “optimal” choice more than likely, but either the underpreformers need to be brought up or the current options everyone uses need a slight tone down. Even reducing the might gained by 1 and reducing the endurance gain by a little bit would probably keep them viable but not make them such a universal answer. The Ferocity patch lead to gear/runes/sigils being just as if not more important than your traits. Some may like that but personally I want my traits to be the meat of the build and everything else to either add to it or slightly compensate for weaknesses, not completely cover them.

Once you killed their pet that didn’t evade attacks the Ranger was also easy pickings.

This thread adds more credibility to those that said (myself included) that some won’t be satisfied until Warrior is a free kill like pre-buff Rangers.

So, I’m still pretty hung up on the gimmicky Minegineer build in my sig, but I’d like to make it as WvW viable as possible. I’ve done plenty of WvW but I never tried to actually make by build something worth having in a large force. I also never bothered with min/maxing stats. I’m still not willing to put forth the effort to get Ascended armor/weapons but I’d like to get as close to helpful as possible.

Here’s what i have so far, please tear it to shreds and tell me how awful it is.

You can make Bunker Down more useful by using Forceful Explosives. It makes it much easier to make them connect. The Minegineer build in my sig is the most viable I’ve made the spec. The concept is that you use Static Discharge attacks and auto attacks at range until you go for a Overcharged Shot -> Magnet -> Mine Field. The trick is to also pull them so that they get dragged through your Bunker Down mines. I’ve one shot a good number of builds with that combo. Unless you stun break after OC Shot you literally can’t avoid being pulled. Also, if you’re being focused evade so that the bombs you produce on roll will connect and if those crit you also drop a bunker down mine that detonates right after. You can half kill someone just by evades. The bomb summoned by your runes also appears to be affected by the traits as well.

I’m going to start working on different variants that actually have that 5 points in explosives for the Steel Packed Powder. The problem is that figuring out what’s a reasonable sacrifice is hard. Losing either Static Discharge or Speedy kits hurts. So far I have this and this but I feel like the sig version is the most well rounded.

Idk why I wrote so much, I just figured that if you were asking you were looking to make a build and thought I’d give you what I’ve come up with.

Please support this thread where the matter is being discussed.

As a former Skullcracker I understand your pain.

Are there really that many Medi Guards being used in either PvP? I can’t really say that I personally encounter than very often and generally I’m the only one in the game. Medi Guard also has a ton of risk/reward involved considering popping one thing at the wrong time or too early=death. They can generally beat many builds 1v1 but in a team fight that effectiveness drops off pretty fast.

As for bunker Guards…they aren’t supposed to die to 1 player

• I would rather see it be a 20 seconds kit/transformation than a stationary object. I just can’t see it being useful outside of a few situations otherwise. If you wanted to get fancy you could have it so that you can enter it at any time like other kits but each attack has longer CDs.

• Perhaps have it on your back and give it a damage bonus when you fire it while standing still.

• To make it feel different from the Nade kit perhaps make it have the same mechanic as WvW Mortars do, a charge up. It would make it tricky to use for those not used to it but after you pick it up it could be pretty fun in all game modes.

coglin.1867:

For me, I want them ALL fixed. I would presume they all have the same problem, thus need the same fix.

Demanding to everyone who plays warriors as well as other professions, that the warrior requires special attention, makes it appear you support fragmenting the community. Your not a VIP by any means, and something tells me your intentionally demanding the profession you desire to main, deserves special treatment, only to try to bait others.

Sure, someone made this thread in the context of warriors, but to attack posters for suggesting it would be good to look at the problem as a whole, and not in a profession specific manner helps no one. It only serves to bring a negative light to yourself. Particularly when you make it clear your putting effort to make it personal.

So, for the warrior community who play warrior exclusively, I would like to point out that this is a problem amount these type of skills in all professions, and would like to ask that you support them being fixed as a whole.

To be fair, I didn’t attack anyone. It was said that Warriors didn’t deserve any special attention and then a few other gap closers that you rarely ever hear about being an issue were brought up as if they were just as broken.

It’s just a fact of life that devs can only spend time on so many things. However, I feel that the issues of the skills mentioned in this thread are so painfully broken that it is harming the class much worse than any other leap skills. As for what i would change, I would make them more like Leap of Faith, there’s a whole area in front of you that you can connect with the attack and from I can tell the animation changes based on your distance to the target as opposed to Bull’s Charge which likes to play out the whole charge even if you’re right on top of them (then you suddenly teleport 6 feet back or they teleport 6 feet forward). You could even make Bull’s Charge cleave and I don’t feel like it would make it too strong considering the CD.

I never said I don’t want other skills fixed, just that Warrior skills are more borked than any of the gap closers on other classes.

I’ve decided that once again I’m going to go back to ignoring your posts. The discussion never gets anywhere, you accuse me of doing something then do the same thing in the same post, and you’ll switch the topic whenever the argument turns against you. I notice quite a few have already done that it’s just that my hardheadedness prevented me from doing so earlier. I honestly had forgotten that you were the one I decided to ignore in the past.

As to the less hostile and more constructive posters, please continue.

dancingmonkey.4902:

BurrTheKing.8571:

NO CLASS should be able to maintain high might stacks without any team interaction. The duration pre-buff was fine, you could have a brief surge in damage but not a sustained one without help from teammates. I would much rather have back the old crit damage values and low might stacking because then it would require having glassier gear in order to deal damage and not a rune/sigil combo.

Why should no profession be capable of stacking a lot of might? You make a lot of suggestions, assumptions, and exclamations of how you believe things should be, but you do not go very far in defining why it is a problem. You also do appear to fail to realize something. Professions do not stack might, builds do. You really should list the specific builds that you feel are problematic. It is almost never one or two things, but generally a specific combinations of traits, gear, weapons, and utility skills, in specific combinations that are a problem.

You go out of your way to bold the term, yet completely fail to comprehend that professions do not natively do anything in the form of your accusations, but that specific builds do.

All I have done is lay down reasons as to why excessive might stacking is bad:

• Allows tanky gear to still deal good damage. Massive boost to sustain with marginal DPS loss.

• Pre-Buff the might was a temporary damage boost, now it is a sustained one. Being able to have an almost permanent 10-15 might + Runes of strength means you’re dealing +15% more damage. What is the point of glassier sets like zerker when most builds gain little from those might stacks while sacrificing a ton of sustain. Only Thief really benefits. In general a glassy build won’t have enough sustain to kill a tanky set with might stacking, they’ll outlast while still dealing good damage.

• In PvP it is now basically tanky v tanky.

• There’s little to no specialization now. Most builds are basically self contained and can do everything on their own.

• Some professions are better at stacking might than others. However, there’s rarely a reason not to bring Strength/Might because it’s still a consistent +6% or more damage. The Sigil of Intelligence buff also made having a low crit chance less of an issue as well.

• Basically, the Ferocity patch did way too much at once and shifted the meta away from specialization and more towards each player being the whole package on their own.

• Finally, I never said that no class should be able to stack high amounts of Might. Notice the words maintain and team interaction. Once again you pick and choose my words and twist them.

Liewec.2896:

Bolas!
you should always have Bolas on your bar if you plan on playing greatsword,
your other CC is subject to stability, but not Bolas,
for me it is the perfect setup for 100b.

also for me i sacrifice my weapon swap for sword and shield (with hydromancy and endurance sigils) and always use “Warrior’s Sprint” and “Fast Hands”,
i play a zerker but die very little since if things aren’t going my way i can get out of the fight and NOTHING can catch me
this combo also makes you the best of the best for running between points giving you a huge advantage since “Conquest” is all about capping the points.

I just can’t bring myself to like Bolas. They aren’t bad, but I would much rather have Bull’s Charge just work reliably. With Bolas they can cleanse/teleport/block/reflect/attack back while with Bull’s you have a gap closer that requires stab or stun breaking to avoid. Of course since it doesn’t work currently you probably are better off with Bolas.

So wait, my personal experience with all the gap closers on other classes isn’t good evidence? The builds I run are all theoretically viable, but not with the skills I’ve mentioned several times being broken. I have little to issues with other gap closers because most of the time they are ONLY for closing a gap and any damage they do is minimal. The exception would be Judges Intervention since that burning damage is important for followup attacks doing more damage. On Warrior it’s different.

On Bull’s Charge, just closing the gap is not enough for such a long cooldown. If it doesn’t knock the person down and set me up for 100b or some other highly telegraphed attack, it’s worthless. Rush can be a big part of GS DPS. On my setup it can hit anywhere from 3-5k on crit. Of course it never does so it’s just another kill you’re forced to use as a kitting skill instead. Savage Leap can be really strong when paired with Leg Specialist for when enemies try to run and you land that Final Thrust. Alas, it’s used to run away because it can’t be used as intended. I only brought up what other War players say as a way to point out that this isn’t a problem that only affects me. How often do you actually get hit by any of the skills above?

Also, just as you don’t care about what I play/hear/think, the exact same can be applied to you. Ever since I’ve been on this forum you’ve singled out mine and a few other users to harass. I wouldn’t mind if you were like a couple others who disagree because they are generally constructive and in the end we come to some form of an understanding. With you, it’s like slamming your head against a brick wall or trying to use a gap closer.

What do YOU want done then? Who should get the priority? This isn’t some utopia where all classes can receive equal focus, every patch one class receives more in-depth changes and in my view as someone who plays every sort of close range spec there is I find Warrior to be the most clunky and in the greatest need of help.

dancingmonkey.4902:

I suspect that if warriors stacked might like eles do, the OP would not have made this thread. Evidence of this is in some other threads, such as once about the recent movement skill bugs. When someone makes 4 post claiming the warrior deserves special attention to the bugs effecting its skills and the other professions should be secondary to that and list 11 paragraphs attempting to convince you that is a fact, it says a lot about the bias for and against other professions that a poster has. In this case I feel a similar bias is clear.

I love that you now basically forum stalk me and try to spread this whole “Burr r War, he knows nothing” message when atm it’s my least played class. Have you forgotten that Warrior is very, very good at might stacking? They would be hit just as hard as Eles by nerfing Might stacking since the reason most Hambows use Soldier ammy is because the Runes of Strength/Battle with the Combustive Shot + Arcing Arrow + Earthshaker combo makes up for the lack of crit damage. You act like i have an issue with Eles when I don’t.

NO CLASS should be able to maintain high might stacks without any team interaction. The duration pre-buff was fine, you could have a brief surge in damage but not a sustained one without help from teammates. I would much rather have back the old crit damage values and low might stacking because then it would require having glassier gear in order to deal damage and not a rune/sigil combo.

dancingmonkey.4902:

Lol. Someone is wrong because they disagree with you claiming that warrior fixes should take priority of equivalent fixes for other professions. I don’t even know what to say. you think S/X mesmer, bomb engineers, greatsword or sword rangers and so on and so forth have less trouble with their skills and gap closers that don’t work. Posters who feel they deserve special treatment just for being warriors are why they get so much flack.

Did you read ANYTHING I said? I don’t play my Warrior anymore purely because of these issues. If you don’t use a bow, you aren’t doing well. This wouldn’t necessarily be the case if gap closers worked. You also talk as if you know what I play, so for future reference I have every class but Ele and Mes and I’ve played them but always ended up deleting them.

As I said before, I’m no saying that other classes don’t deserve fixes, but on my Engi my entire viability is not tied to Rocket Boots, and Swoop is mostly used for putting distance between me and the target before swapping to my 1500 range LB. I encounter and hear about others dealing with their gap closers much less frequently on other classes than I do from Warriors. It isn’t just me, it isn’t just laggy players, it is almost EVERY Warrior I know. When you can miss your gap closers on stationary targets a few feet away something is very, very wrong.

How many Warriors do you see running around with a double melee set in PvP and doing well? They’re all locked into either Hambow, Axebow, Macebow, GS/Bow (rarely), or some kind of s/s + bow hybrid (again, rarely). In WvW you’ll see GS/Hammer or Sword/Shield/Horn + Hammer and the rare Skullcracker roamer (unlikely though because again, dependent on Bull’s Charge) and that’s only for mobility.

If things were worse on another class I would rather they get fixes first, but right now Warrior needs these changes first and fast. Waiting another 6 moths for something as important as this is unacceptable. Those who disagree are letting their prejudices against Warriors take over.

coglin.1867:

BurrTheKing.8571:

dancingmonkey.4902:

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

BurrTheKing.8571:

coglin.1867:

Juba.8406:

dancingmonkey.4902:

Don’t be greedy. lets take this beyond just the warrior profession.

just fix the freaking thing.

I’m greedy now ? for asking simply that my skills actually hits, instead of facepalming ?

A little bit, yeah. Perhaps we could go with fixing all the skills and not just the ones you favor. So yeah, you kind of are greedy the Second your reply was anything short of “good iedea, we really need all of them fixed equally”…….

I think the point is that Warriors are a melee class and when your gap closers don’t work properly you’re more and more inclined to bring a LB. This patch would have oppened some more options for double melee sets but not when Bull’s Charge doesn’t hit the vast majority of the time. There’s no substitute for that skill in particular. On my Engi I don’t HAVE to take Rocket Boots and the like. They should all be fixed, but the ones that are hurting the classes the most should be prioritized.

Thank-you for stating it so diplomatically. After 12 pvp matches using bulls’ rush, shield bash and rush (mace/shield-greatsword) The success rate of all the movements has become noticeably unreliable. At first if you used them in relatively short proximity to how far they could travel they connected often (80%) But currently it seems the skill insists on making its full movement distance before activating the strike. It made running duel melee sets ungainly to use and frustrating.

There is no such thing s a melee profession. As well, your excuse to claim your main profession, should take priority in bug fixes is the opposite of saying anything diplomatically.

Well, let’s look at it this way. Longbow isn’t really a “ranged” weapon because it’s strongest at close-mid range. The rifle is the only real weapon that encourages you to stay at range, and it’s not that great of a weapon. The other five weapon are melee range. Guardian’s have teleports so when I play one it doesn’t pose as much as a problem because teleports are more reliable.

Unreliable gap closers make double melee sets almost unusable. I think lag is a big factor but they broke them on their side as well. If I use a gap closer on a target that isn’t evading or blocking I should ALWAYS HIT. It should not be a roll of the dice. They should be fixed on all classes but Warrior depends on them way more than any other class. I can not take Rocket Boots and still be viable (it doesn’t fail that often for me anyways), my Ranger has a 1500 range bow if Swoop acts up, and Leap of Faith has a cone so it actually hits reliably.

So yes, if ANet has to pick what leap skills to focus on first, Warriors should get it first. If they worked we wouldn’t be forced to use LB on EVERY. STINKIN’. BUILD.

Sorry. I prefer to use facts, over twisting reality with a “let’s look at it this way” style of reality warp. We both know your bias in this case. No need to try to talk in circles to convince ever one that your main profession actually deserved special treatment. I can offer a convincing argument for every profession as to why they deserve there’s fixes. Although they may haves less wholes then I feel your argument has.

Wrong.

I’ve all but dropped Warrior because of these issues. We have been forced into using a LB because doble melee set builds simply don’t work in PvP. I played Warrior to be a WARRIOR. I’m not opposed to having ranged weapons as an option, but I should not be forced into using it just because my gap closers don’t work properly. I can play a Medi Guard just fine because teleports generally work and the skills have a cone that makes it reliably connect. On Engi I don’t experience the Rocket Boots issue nearly as often, and in addition my whole playstyle is not totally dependent on it.

Bull’s Charge not working invalidates using GS, I seriously miss it while targeting a a stationary training golem. Savage leap screwing up makes it harder to stay on target and makes Leg Specialist a much less potent combo. Rush actually hits hard and would be great for use as an offensive gap closer if it actually connected. Even Earthshaker bugs out and rubberbands me around making it impossible to combo off of it. Other classes don’t have it nearly as bad. I’m not saying that other leap skills don’t need to be fixed, I am saying that the majority of last patch changes weren’t buffs if it’s impossible to take advantage of them.

I now have no reason to play Warrior over Guardian. They are now better at tanking and damage dealing, and the mobility issue isn’t that big of an issue in PvP. As for WvW I also now prefer Guard.

Cam Ron.4170:

Just revert that stupid crit damage nerf. This will make berserkers a lot stronger which is necessary because celestial kittens all over it. The crit damage nerf is a big reason everybody is celestial

I’m pretty sure part of the reason crit damage was nerfed was because they tested the changes to the might stacking runes and found that zerker sets did too much damage. Rather than just reverting that change they decided to nerf crit dmg/ferocity which has lead to this issue of it being better to have tanky gear and might stacking than something glassy.

I have no proof of this but it seems to make sense. I for one would much rather have the old crit damage values and less might than what we currently have.

a t s e.9614:

Celestial is only broken on 2 classes : ele/engi I dont think they need nerf might stack just because of 2 classes or it will affect the full zerker builds aswell like shatter mesmer and S/D thief that heavely rely on might stack.

Just nerf the condi damage of celestial amulet and problem solved. I think direct damage attacks are easy to avoid but ele’s burning is hard to dodge and engi burning is a passive trait that gives bruning so nerfing the condi dmg on cele amulet will fix the problem.

I wouldn’t expect you to forget that Hambow also has an absurd amount of might stacking potential as well. Heck, you can put Runes of Strength and a Sigil of Battle on most builds and chances are you’ll maintain enough for it to be worthwhile.

Using tanky stats and might stacking is going to take you farther than a glassy set and might stacking. A tanky set without stacking is tough but lacks killing power, with it you can do both. You may not kill as fast as a zerk set but it’s a small loss with a huge boost to sustain. Add in a Sigil of Intelligence and even lacking crit chance isn’t a huge deal.

I like that Sigils and Runes can dramatically change a build, but it shouldn’t make up almost completely for what is supposed to be an armor set’s weakness.

I have to say that while I’m glad that Rangers have a place, now, they were much more interesting mechanically in GW1. They were generally focused around timing interrupting skills. While Moment of Clarity kind of encourages that style it’s still not the same. There was nothing more satisfying then locking down an opponent and THEN pew pewing.