You transferred to TC thinking they were going to win?
Analysis is not your strong suit, but your talent for grinding is. You are slightly right about rewards. While they should never equal dungeon grinding, even casual PvE can provide a greater avg income than WvW. It is a lot better than it was at launch though; and I get some decent drops from WXP rank chests.
There is a lot of variation on what makes a guild “good”. A defensive guild might be able to hold a keep against almost anything; but the simplicity of it (compared to dominating in other ways) keeps them out of the limelight.
Likewise a guild that blobs or rallies PuGs to them might be quite good at it’s core; but doesn’t dominate as much due to the influence of those PuGs.
The guild that has impressed me the most lately, has to be EP. They are extremely flexible, their members and commanders are willing to be flexible and help anyone who’s tagged up outside of their raid times, and even when they are raiding they will respond to urgent calls if a key structure is in trouble.
There are not many guilds at that level that manage to retain that level of flexibility.
lol BG is full server now… bandwagon reached it’s limit it seems xD
oh don’t worry, if you are bringing a guild over they will have some large groups log off for a few minutes.
Plus, don’t count out the devs yet. Just because they don’t have the time to update WvW doesn’t mean they don’t have the time to expand server caps again.
Usually the first to come into range + threat calculation. If you have a high range of stats (PVT really sets if off) you would probably get picked up on as the biggest threat.
Just as PvE foes focus on characters who rez or who are putting on the most DPS.
To play devil’s advocate; they might be in a huff because they went to the trouble of replacing GvG with WvW; and all people do is complain about GvG.
It’s certainly a much larger undertaking and the vitriol is so high that he can’t post without getting a ton of negative comments.
Blaming the whole server because of few bad apples isn’t fair. If they are rude to you, PLEASE (I am not screaming, but requesting) report them. They have no right to misbehave with anyone. You can go to YB’s official forum and share their names among us so that we identify them.
Except for dailies, I don’t go to WvW anymore due to same match-up over and over again and I know of many people who is in the same boat as me.
You guys should just take all that supply you have been using for siege and build golems so that every person on the map either has a golem or is a mesmer. Just wreck SBI and Mags all over. It would be a fun one-time event that would also help towards changing the matchup.
Just read this, thought I´ll share it because it´s on topic: http://www.votf.net/page/index.html/_/articles/farewell-guild-wars-2-r22
The summation was a little estoteric (game studio vs. corporation); but mostly spot on.
The original Guild Wars retained a large population for over 7 years; from 2005 through the 2012 launch of GW2. At the current pace one wonders if GW2 is going to make it to the 3 years or even 2 years.
The Living Story concept was implemented in GW1 and was mostly successful, as the updates were spaced out and made long term changes.
The ADHD pace, along with the complete disregard for the awesome PvP/WvW environments they created is not a successful mix.
The lack of desire to improve upon the largest scale PvP I’ve ever seen in any game is unforgivable not just from a fan standpoint, but as a simple matter of business-sense.
@ Chris: yaks and eBay would double team bp anyway then yaks would rise back up, they becoming the Pve server they always have been slowly.
But looking at mos. fa is completely owning tc. Did tc lose guilds to fa or they on break?
FA got two guilds from SoR, and both SoS and FA realized that either could roll low and end up in T3. Both servers have large night populations who get nauseous at the thought of another week of SBI blobbing and YB’s arrow cart fetish.
It mixes cooperative team play vs real human opponents.
Your opponents vary greatly in skill and the team that pulls off the greatest coordination and smarter playstyle wins 4 out of 5 times (in an even fight).
Maybe the other members of your server are tired of losing every week and are more interested in having some fun, instead of hugging towers and arrow carts in a desperate move to stay in Tier 3.
Dropping down one spot would be the most popular move in NA right now, as T4 is miserable with the SEA heavy DB; while YB can’t provide the fights that T3 servers crave.
didn’t DN leave for SBI? Apparently everyone wants to fight SoS and Mag.
Lol don’t even bother with Chris, it’s almost as if he is paid to trash talk tier 1 on every opportunity he gets. I think he is still bitter about BG replacing SoS in tier 1 and JQ for the implosion.
It’s actually a lot of fun to poke the collective ego. Watching the goings on here, much like watching senior citizens argue in public. It’s always fun to point out the logical contortions folks make in T1 that justifies or re-explains the shifts in their fortunes.
BG trying to say they are not stacked like a brick outhouse and trying to claim that SoR is still a viable contender is amusing to me because it’s so insulting to the intelligence of whoever you think is reading it.It’s like really bad propaganda from the 40’s and 50’s.
Stacked has always been a relative term. ET would call your server stacked. BG’s coverage has diminished post leagues, but not as much as SoR’s and JQ’s has. Their night time coverage is just a shadow of what it used to be.
I have to admit, winning these days isn’t nearly as much fun as it used to be. @SoR&JQ, hope you get some EU transfers.
There is a lot of truth in what you say, but BG is stacked in relation to all servers (NA, don’t know about EU).
JQ had a lot of pre-season mojo and are now falling more and more behind.
I think BG forgets how many individuals move there on a constant basis. You don’t need large guild transfers when you have a steady stream of recruits.
Does anyone know which server FEAR transferred to?
FA, though they don’t seem to be running the numbers they had on SoR so I’m sure a lot of individuals from these transferring guilds are skulking off to BG or JQ, not helping the problem.
YB needs to get off their kitten arrow carts and just open field for a few weeks on order to drop. That will give EhmBay and BP a break and give DB a challenge. That right there would solve the two most miserable tiers in NA.
He’s not kidding about consistent. TS is active all day ( they help out in NA and EU when they can) and they always bring in the bacon for us in OCX.
If you play at that time I can’t recommend them enough.
It continues to amaze me how many SEA players still have their head in the sand and refuse to see the unfairness of it all. As about whining, this is not a whine , I solo roam 99% of the time. I don’t really give a crap about wining a match up. I’m just pointing out facts that’s pretty plain to see. BTW I play on SBI , when I logged off last nght at 11 we were ticking at last place. This morning as I write this post SBI is ticking 515.
From the horse’s mouth. SBI SEA, you are obviously not appreciated by your NA. ( totally ignoring the fact the OP is SBI NA and is sticking up for you)
Don’t worry, lot’s of other servers ( read all of them) would treat you better.
A better solution to this is if a server experiences a negative delta of >200 glicko, they should have xfer costs off of that server decreased slightly and xfer costs to that server decreased greatly for a period of up to 4 weeks.
I think an opposite ( increase of >200 should increase transfer costs to that server) to stop bandwagoning.
Oh look, I just solved two of the biggest complaints on these forums. Stopping bandwagoning and what to do when former high tier servers experience an exodus and need to rebuild.
If Mr. Carver and the ANet dev team were to implement this, a lot of the whining would be reduced and you can ignore the “Team Murica” and “continental Europe” complaints.
comes down to fairness. If a keep took 50 people 2 hrs to take it should worth more than the same keep taken by 3 person. Yes I have taken keeps with 1 golem and 3 players a few times in the morning. I really don’t think my 10 mins of pvd with 2 friends is the same kitten people at 8pm est working 2 hrs to take the same keep.
You SEA player keep whining about how your effort should count as much as prime time players. The fact is you fail to see that right now your effort is worth WAY MORE than NA players. It is the NA prime time players who are getting shafted because their hard work counts for little in wining a match up.
Shouldn’t you go with your namesake and just Rage Quit?
Lol don’t even bother with Chris, it’s almost as if he is paid to trash talk tier 1 on every opportunity he gets. I think he is still bitter about BG replacing SoS in tier 1 and JQ for the implosion.
It’s actually a lot of fun to poke the collective ego. Watching the goings on here, much like watching senior citizens argue in public. It’s always fun to point out the logical contortions folks make in T1 that justifies or re-explains the shifts in their fortunes.
BG trying to say they are not stacked like a brick outhouse and trying to claim that SoR is still a viable contender is amusing to me because it’s so insulting to the intelligence of whoever you think is reading it.
It’s like really bad propaganda from the 40’s and 50’s.
If the offer to “help” is made before-hand, it’s buying. It’s one thing to say “we are transferring and we have a few people who don’t farm much waiting to transfer”. It’s another that the agreement is made before-hand that 25%-75% of the costs will be covered by the new server. Talking with some people who made the transfer said the process was handled very professionally and with great caution to make sure they were not scammed (both sides).
The vehemence of your denial accentuates the point(s) I was making in that T1 Logic is a different beast than anywhere else. You have to offer these denials to keep the shine on the server to keep recruitment up less you fall behind.
It’s clear to see to anyone with spare 5 minutes to spend on MOS where BG is in terms of coverage and population. The fact that this has to be argued accentuates where I was coming from.No hate on my part btw, why you assume there is….shrugs. Just observing upon the obvious shouldn’t get such a reaction.
Lord knows I don’t often agree with you but you are 100% on the money here and apparently BG is again actively on the market for new guilds despite their dominance.
That goes into my point, they have to always be recruiting and have to defend their image from even the slightest mention of problems.
Take SoR; it’s not in as bad of shape as it appears. If they were to drop to T2 next week, they would at least do as well if not better than TC. From the perspective of Tier 1, they are the SS Titanic. If SoR had made a play for ZDs (instead of asking for a more balanced matchup) and gotten them, they would be riding high.
The reality for BG and JQ is totally different from that of the rest of WvW; and it amuses me when anyone wants to argue that or imply that their standard should be applied to all other servers (which led to my post here to begin with, coming full circle).
I heard Choo is also thinking about leaving, maybe to JQ…If that happens it would be best for SoR to drop tiers and rebuild.
I hope some of the guys transferring consider TC (not that I want Tier 2 to become tougher for SoS.) since they will be the ones to take the 3rd spot and they are not Tier 1 material in their current state. The last thing we need is two super-servers at the top and a revolving door of sacrificial lambs going in and out of T1.
Being overstacked is a good thing. It reflects a strong community and high morale.
If our opponents are outnumbered then they need to do more recruiting.
The problem that SoR has always had is that they consistently refuse to pay people to transfer and they’ve turned away good guilds because they didn’t want to get “too strong” in certain timezones,as if that’s a bad thing. Then they come on the forums and post about not caring about the score and I just don’t think that’s a very good sales pitch. They also don’t attract a very strong PvE crowd because many of their big guilds actively show disdain towards PvE.
JQ has never had these sorts of hangups and I think that’s why JQ will usually be the bigger threat. They’ll take anyone, they’ll pay and they always play to win.
Not paying for guilds = problem = Tier 1 logic
To the best of my knowledge BG and JQ are the only servers who have bought guilds. SoR helped IRON after they decided they were coming. FA bought RISE and swore off buying after that went South.
You know…SoR was the server that consistently said that the do not help guilds move and will not offer gold to help guilds move…
Also since this still seems to be a subject…be a doll and show me the “best of your knowledge” and name some guilds that were bought by JQ and BG…do you best to remember what bought means as it is different then “helping” a guild with transfer costs…
If the offer to “help” is made before-hand, it’s buying. It’s one thing to say “we are transferring and we have a few people who don’t farm much waiting to transfer”. It’s another that the agreement is made before-hand that 25%-75% of the costs will be covered by the new server. Talking with some people who made the transfer said the process was handled very professionally and with great caution to make sure they were not scammed (both sides).
The vehemence of your denial accentuates the point(s) I was making in that T1 Logic is a different beast than anywhere else. You have to offer these denials to keep the shine on the server to keep recruitment up less you fall behind.
It’s clear to see to anyone with spare 5 minutes to spend on MOS where BG is in terms of coverage and population. The fact that this has to be argued accentuates where I was coming from.
No hate on my part btw, why you assume there is….shrugs. Just observing upon the obvious shouldn’t get such a reaction.
I would be fine if this was an experience that was leading up to a true expansion. Some of this stuff has been good and a lot of it has been a snore. I feel like the quality has dipped a bit since they went every two weeks and I hope that the month+ that they’ve had off was taken as an opportunity to do some really great stuff.
FC numbers are growing.
Maybe your players are transferring here?
I love your enthuisasm Solstice, but it’s time this was said.
SoR had lost a good amount of players after season 1, but I do not think people are burned out, we lost some wvw focused guilds and thats why we have fewer people playing.
You lost your WvW core and that usually results in an exodus where your diehards will pick the server back up and you will have to rebuild. Luckily you have some true diehards like Choo and GSCH that will always hold the line. Is TW staying, because if they are you shouldn’t drop much.
I know people who said they had to wait an hour just to log onto the server (not WvW, the server; during Leagues).
Wait. What? You’re saying they were unable to load a character onto the server at all? If that’s what you’re saying, those “people you know” lied to you. I played every week during seasons, never had a spot where I couldn’t log into the server, and while yes there were queues I had no problem getting into WvW reliably and getting my achievements done and gaining plenty of WvW ranks without even trying.
Yes BG has more players actively participating in WvW than the other server right now. But that will change. It always has and always will until they turn the lights off on the game.
Just what I was told from someone who was there, I wasn’t so I can’t verify.
I will point out that during the ramp up to leagues that BG (along with JQ, not to point only one finger) were saying how they almost never have queues and they were short when they did… and the amount of QQ threads from those who stacked there was full to the brim.
I’m sure your queues aren’t too bad, but I’m sure you have them and there is a wait.
Being overstacked is a good thing. It reflects a strong community and high morale.
If our opponents are outnumbered then they need to do more recruiting.
The problem that SoR has always had is that they consistently refuse to pay people to transfer and they’ve turned away good guilds because they didn’t want to get “too strong” in certain timezones,as if that’s a bad thing. Then they come on the forums and post about not caring about the score and I just don’t think that’s a very good sales pitch. They also don’t attract a very strong PvE crowd because many of their big guilds actively show disdain towards PvE.
JQ has never had these sorts of hangups and I think that’s why JQ will usually be the bigger threat. They’ll take anyone, they’ll pay and they always play to win.
Not paying for guilds = problem = Tier 1 logic
To the best of my knowledge BG and JQ are the only servers who have bought guilds. SoR helped IRON after they decided they were coming. FA bought RISE and swore off buying after that went South.
The WP thing….should be expensive as all get out, be single use, and take a long time to save up for. That should be a clutch maneuver thing. I’m just thinking of how much pain some of the blobbier guilds could cause and how it would be ripe for abuse if it was spammable. (Picture that blobby guild from your tier, that you hate. Imagine them popping up in SMC every time you are about to cap)
I agree that it should be expensive (but not overly), and that it should be single use (one tower at a time). although i think that it should be a common thing for a guild to claim a home base.
In regards to the blob guilds abusing it to defend SM. This is already happening with the way-point timers, so i don’t see this having an effect at all.
Preacher
In most of the matches I’ve been in lately, it’s very hard for a server to maintain SMC long enough to put up a wp.
I haven’t heard about any Germans on the US side. All the top 3 tiers have some EU and if you are comfortable typing/speaking a lot of English you’ll find lots of people who would be glad to have you.
It all depends on what kind of play you are looking for. Roaming, T2 and T3. Small guilds kitten. A zerg once in a while, T1.
Wow, this became a T1 ego stroking circle….(fill in the blank) real quick.
BG, you are overstacked. The scores consistently reflect this and it’s just the truth. I know people who said they had to wait an hour just to log onto the server (not WvW, the server; during Leagues).
It’s all good, it’s your privilege and I’m sure you’ll continue being the number one destination for those looking for a challenging (but not so challenging that their team loses) WvW scene.
JQ, best of luck
SoR, condolences.
It amazes me how many people complain about this non-stop. No one likes losing everything during their time gaps. Even T1 servers have weak time zones and gaps; so it’s not like it’s a problem exclusive to YOUR server.
Take SBI, they lost last week due to SoS’s OCX (I’m SoS NA, and I have no trouble admitting that; they carried a lot of weight for us last week). However, they are stomping all over Maguuma and YB during the nighttime this week.
It’s all relative.
I actually like this idea, especially the guards notifying in guild chat. With Guild Missions getting long in the tooth; it would be nice to have something to spend influence and merits on.
The WP thing….should be expensive as all get out, be single use, and take a long time to save up for. That should be a clutch maneuver thing. I’m just thinking of how much pain some of the blobbier guilds could cause and how it would be ripe for abuse if it was spammable. (Picture that blobby guild from your tier, that you hate. Imagine them popping up in SMC every time you are about to cap)
Edge of the Mists is coming out this month, that’s a solution for the Season; when the season is (thankfully) over with.
I think that many servers are just now falling in line with the population shifts from the pre-season vs the numbers they had during the season and the inevitable drop off afterwards.
It also seems like many servers are in untenable positions and are either teetering on the edge of collapse or may soon be. A lot of servers are locked into tiers where they cannot compete with the other servers.
SoR is no longer able to compete with BG and JQ (JQ having a hard enough time with BG as it is), Maguuma got dragged down into T3 heck; and EhmBay and BP are never going to get rid of Dragonbrand (and vice-versa).
They might have to resort to manually manipulating the RNG if there are too many dead fish in the tiers.
At least there is a chance we can let SBI get face time with FA and TC for a week or so. Getting both SoS and Mags would be good for YB as that will give them time to come out and get some practice open-field fighting.
Would love see more NA guilds and a larger NA presence on our server.
To add to what he is saying, we could really use roamers and small groups that don’t mind operating independently; but keep in touch on our Teamspeak.
If you are looking to make a huge impact (become a key player or guild in our efforts) we could really use defensive oriented folks, and also people who log in early in NA.
If these attributes describe you and/or your guild; you would play an integral part in moving us into direct contention with FA and TC; where we can compete to beat both servers.
Lol people still care about PPT?
Apparently. Not having those numbers and the jumble of transfers caused by the Season is spreading 3utthurt really thick on a lot of bread.
I know my server because of the seasons has lost more than half its wvw guilds there’s only like 2-3 left : (
and its showing we haven’t won in months it feels like
Don’t you want to hunt those guys down and ask if their limited use finishers were worth it?
Rooster created the previous one, so he probably won’t mind. I think he’s just tagging on a wish that RNG would fluctuate a bit higher when you have the same matchup go on for too long.
Lol people still care about PPT?
Apparently. Not having those numbers and the jumble of transfers caused by the Season is spreading 3utthurt really thick on a lot of bread.
I get a lot of hate when I have said this in the past; but it’s the only true answer to this.
When you face a server that dominates you in off-hours coverage and they win the matches due to this; you have three options:
1) Make the most of the times you are on, remaining secure in that your WvW experience is as enjoyable for yourself as possible.
2) Stay up later / get up earlier and focus on PPT
3) Transfer to a server with better coverage
Every other solution penalizes someone who paid for the game just like you did.
I think everyone is missing the true scandal here. A keep in the possession of Yak’s Bend was not sieged up to the max.
I’m sure this will come up in server-wide meetings where there will be acrimony and accusations about why there were not at least 5 arrow carts already in place on that wall.
If you need a break from the logging on outmanned scene, come to SoS. Our current matchup is not as exciting for our nightcrew as they would like; but it would be a good time to come over, meet the guilds and commanders who run at your time, and join them so that you are up to speed when we get a challenge again.
You use SoS as an example ( I play there). Most of these proposals would unfairly punish our OCX and SEA.
You say “they are only in T3 because of their Oceanic”; but it’s just as easy to say that we are “down in T3 because of our EU and NA”
You say that is an error, but if SoS were to gain a late EU guild or a very early NA group, our ppt would increase to the point where we would push out of T3 and be back in T2; where the two higher servers in that tier have a lot of off hours coverage as well; and no one would be complaining like they do now about coverage differences.
TL;DR servers will either find equilibrium, grow, or shrink. It’s just off right now because of the Season One debacle where too many server communities were devastated and population shifts through everyone off.
Sniping Dolyaks and escorting them are beyond crucial to WvW IMHO, but here’s the big problem. Let’s say you have a great server that mobilizes and gets those yaks safely to your keeps and towers and upgrades them all, and then…you all basically go to sleep and have no coverage. Then mini night crew zerglings come in and paper everything you work toward building up. It makes those of us that like the idea of playing defense feel like its pointless in the long run, or worse yet, it makes it harder for us to sell new WvW players on it since joining in with the zergs is far more appealing in an excitement/loot gain way. If defending was as rewarding for both PPT as well as loot gained from it more people might be apt to do it. Right now, its not challenging or rewarding for many people.
The coverage issue is a completely different debate. Besides, being able to upgrade your fortifications quicker; will give your server’s token off-hours crew a much better shot at defending than if everything was only T2 with no defensive siege.
Outside of SoS/FA OCX and DB SEA; no NA server outside T1 can really run a map queue overnight anyhow; so defending key points should not be that difficult.
When this was taken out of the game, it was very necessary. People would set their character to auto-walk behind dolyaks and would afk for cheap rewards.
I even had one guy complain when I started speed-buffing a yak.
At the start of the game when reaching lvl 80 was still a challenge and not everyone had geared up characters; this was a good step.
Over 14 months have passed since then, and the lay of the land is different. Rewards in other activities have increased, there are 1000 guides on power-levelling to 80 and most guilds will help new players get top level gear.
It’s time to bring back Dolyak rewards to reward an under-appreciated; but crucial support role in WvW.
This has many positives:
1. Allows those with slow reflexes or slow computers to help their teams more.
2. Will increase the small fights that so many players complain are lacking (how many roaming topics?)
3. Will reward people who play defense and who put team victory above cheap thrills.
It’s hard to think of any reason this would not be a positive. There are easier ways to grind for xp, money, and karma than this. It would shake up some older tactics and make small guilds and teams more important and take a more central role.
In short, there is no reason not to do this.
In the end, all this thread does is make me want to form a guild on a low EU server called [PvD] and we’d dedicate ourselves to cheap karma trains.
Too bad I like being in an NA guild on a NA server that has more non-NA than NA players.
I agree it should scale better with the population levels.
Well you have a problem there. How does the game know what fights are “fair”?
If team A is outmanned but team B consist of kittens running around doing mostly nothing while a guild group from team B captures a keep from team A after a fantastic and lengthy battle… Does team B get nothing because team A was outmanned?
Nah, tbh its still really, really simple, because there is only one way.
Get rid of PPT.
New scoring system (incredibly simplistic idea with random numbers):
- Capturing a T1 keep = 10 points, T2 = 20 points, T3 = 30 points. Garrison/bay/hills/EB border keeps add +10 points, SM add +50 points.
- Every defense tick of a keep give the defenders +10 points but at the same time add + 10 points to the objective when it is captured (up to a limit of say +100 points.The end.
Meaning, a scenario such as the following:
Team A (night shift) cap a wooden keep quickly, unopposed.
Team B (primetime) retake the now T3 ugraded keep after a battle and 3 defense ticks.Score results: Team A capping that wooden keep during the night shift get 40 points (10 points for the cap, 30 points for defense). Team B capping the same T3 keep during primetime get 60 points for the cap
Nice idea, coming from a server with better night coverage than day coverage I really like this (being facetious).
The daytime folks hold the objective for hours, upgrading it; and then it’s capped when few people are on at night, the night crew gets the extra points for cap; and of course won’t bother upgrading it since they won’t keep it during the day….
Look, it’s kinda a sucky deal; but you have to accept the fact that it’s a 24/7 game and if their server can cap your stuff when you have few people on; then they have the win.
Just do what you can do, with the people you have; and start there. If you are good, and the other folks on your server maintain a high level of skill; then other guilds will want to come there and eventually that will include off-hours folks.
Why should a player in Austrailia or in Europe make less of an impact on an NA server than other members?
This is not the question. The question is:
- Why did ANet made Australians/Pacifics and Europeans be more important than Americans on NA servers?
- Why did ANet made an Australians/Pacifics and Americans be more important than Europeans on EU servers?And why should Americans on NA servers and European on EU-servers be satisfied with that decision, that discriminate them?
Should someone who works a late or early shift in NA be penalized while playing on a NA server? Should someone who is unemployed or on a break from school be penalized while playing on a EU server?
Where do you set the boundaries and why should it be determined that one person cannot contribute the same because of where they live, when they work, or how much time they have available?
Why should a player in Austrailia or in Europe make less of an impact on an NA server than other members?
I think people who are too obsessed with winning will run off to T1 and either learn the hard way that winning the match isn’t what they think it is; or they will quit the game.
The situation is hosed right now because of all the sand-bagging and massive transfers shook up the order prior to and during Leagues.
It will sort itself out as more transfers will occur and people will either go back to their previous servers or build new communities elsewhere.
There’s no campaign against solo roaming, it’s just not what this game-mode was designed for. They added sentries and had their kills count towards the score to accommodate roamers.