Bringing DB up to T2 would mean SOS would drop to T3 and face SBI, and IOJ. Wouldn’t be a fair matchup, but that’s nothing new in T3, so I don’t have a problem with this suggestion. (I’m on SBI)
It would be nice to see a playoff week like this where the servers on the bubble know everything is on the line and there will be a certain, tangible reward/punishment based on how well they do.
As hateful as a week of pure ppt-pushing would be, I wouldn’t mind it if it sorted out the rest of T2 for the Gold League.
DB could roll low this week and guarantee a spot without a single matchup with more than one gold server since last summer.
Prime time is generally agreed to be 5-10pm in that zone. 6-9 pm is the busiest part as some guilds get on later and leave earlier.
It’ll get really interesting once the Asian servers go online. Already Russian guilds are sought after since they play in a dead zone between late SEA and early EU.
What screwed T3 and T4 was massive migrations before Season 1. Too many people bought into the hype and around 8+ servers lost a ton of guilds.
Furthermore, the end result of the season ended with DB down in T4, and occasional T3 visitors (Maguuma and Sea of Sorrows) coming out a lot stronger than when they went in.
Don’t even joke about losing Mag from Gold. They are among the few who understand the game was designed to be Blue and Red focusing on Green.
It only makes sense to do rating on the 28th just in case a server at the top of the league gets super stacked or a server near the bottom completely implodes.
Currently the only servers that this really affects is DB and FA; but it could have been more.
First, Dragonbrand better not get another free pass. I’m ready to make accusations of match fixing (FA likely to have a lot of transfers, a lot of gems to be bought….).
On the same note, it’d almost be worth rolling the nigh impossible odds that would take SoS to T1 (for one week only) to see BG vs DB.
1. Ok, Marjorie’s sister off to find bandits in Brisban Wildlands.
2. Asura Gate behind bandit fortress guarded by lvl 80’s
3. Fortress borders most likely home of the new dragon
It’s going to be disappointing if that Asura Gate is nothing but a limited time dungeon.
I don’t know what to make of the stuff you guys say in your posts. You talk about 60 man groups, and I can tell you right now that no one in T2-T4 run more than 40; and that’s only rarely or in a multi-guild battle. If NSP was rocking 80+ man zergs in each BL they’d be in T1.
So either some remedial math is needed or something smells.
Oh by all means if a guild approaches you then its fair game but if CD thinks its going to get transfers by coming onto our server and advertising for their server then they really need to pull their heads out of their kitten .
I got no skin in this game, but it’s not like they are like most upper tier servers coming down and offering to buy guilds.
If anyone is enticed by their offer, chances are they are leaving your server anyhow. Since CD will not be in your league, is it really any skin off your back? Better someone in a different league than a direct competitor.
I can’t speak for all of FA, but we might be willing to go at SoS once Gold league is solidified.
And no SoS, you are not ready to compete with Tier 1.
I hope you are down for the 2v1 against T1 though. Save us the trouble if you are not, we’ll get DB up in Gold if you are going to be that useless.
Yes, SoS does not expect to match up with T1. As the only server in the top 6 that is not buying guilds; we obviously have shown no inclination to move in that direction at this stage.
We know Maguuma is down for the 2v1 on the stronger server, but FA has a history of playing for 2nd that they have to get over if it’s fun.
SoS won’t place higher than fourth unless there is some weird crap like when TC beat SoR. We go from queing 3-4 BLs at our peaks to only queuing one map when it’s slow; so expect a lot of close calls but no wins against T1.
(edited by Chris.3290)
Something you guys should point out, is that transfers will be free through the 28th for you (it’s based on current ranking as of Friday); no matter what happens to ranking between now and then, so there is no fear of stacking so high that you lose the free transfers.
Unfortunately SBI will not be free this season. They are solid T4, maybe a T3 contender.
and this is why people don’t like TC anymore.
CD looks to be the best bet right now. Of those listed, they are the only ones who have a consistent SEA presence.
The others on the list might have something cooking but the trees have yet to bear any fruit.
An assortment issue is that oceanic players tend to go to oceanic servers, like IOJ, db or sos, understandably. They want to be on a server with people on during the times they are on. The result however is that it creates mismatchs.
I think the whole system is flawed, I’ve never seen a game punish people for logging off, but, I cant think of what to do about it.
The system is setup so that servers with greater coverage move up until they cannot move up anymore. IoJ should be moving up next week and CD is getting some SEA transfers; so in the near future the “night coverage” servers will all be in the top 3 tiers.
It’s all about who you p.ay with. If I didn’t like my guild and the people in it, then I probably would not be playing it anymore.
ATM? Were they ever a good idea?
The first season wrecked this game mode and the 2nd season may just finish it off.
I see a big problem on the design of WvW here. And thats ANETS fault. Not DB. You all complain that DB doesnt deserve to go into gold? Yes DB does as a DB players since launch I know for a fact that we have had our ups and downs and we have been matched up against some of the best. Yet we did lose our fair share we have been working really hard as a community to push for higher teirs. You’d be suprised if you were actually on Dragonbrand and knew the half of it. We do deserve to move up and publicly bashing a whole server just because you might get kicked out of GOLD League its kittening immature. Get a life and try harder. We didnt ask 2 have 3 weeks of the most boring matches of our WvW life. We want to move up so we don’t have to deal with dead servers everyweek for the next 9 weeks. Silver will be boring and will kill off most server because of that. Atleast in Gold we can make mistakes and Learn from them.
So complain all you want but don’t go bashing my server until you have been on it as long as the majority of the players on DB have. We are one of the few servers that doesnt BUY guilds to move to the top. We keep working with what we have the old fashioned way. If we get moved up, GREAT JOB DB! If we dont then we will keep working harder and harder for it.
So Ill say it one more time. Do your kittening research first. Then come and talk.
Noizy/Skigoboom/Ovi Bell
Royal Dragon of [KING]
You’ll get to prove your point on Friday. The general understanding is that Mag and SoS are going to 2v1 the crap out of DB BL and your section of EBG.
If you manage to thwart these actions and hold your own, the 2v1 will be off and we’ll accept that you deserve T2.
The facts are that DB got rolled by Mag before they had acquired a night presence worth mentioning. No one thinks that DB is up to it but as said; you’ll have your chance.
The Good:
NSP gets high marks for having a great attitude going into Silver League. They haven’t seen any major fluctuations since the AA folks left them during 1 day matches.
IoJ has the strongest nighttime south of Dragonbrand. They will be a major player in Silver League.
SF seems to be on some sort of powered upswing (I have no idea as to why)
The Shaky:
FA is at a crossroads; with a great NA and some of the best GvG guilds around. Once a nighttime powerhouse, they have had all their nighttime guilds bought by other servers (rumors say at 150% xfer costs for the latest). Staying the top 6 will guarantee a rebuild, but dropping to 7th for the 2nd League in a row will be crippling. Especially since it’s out of their hands right now.
DB for the same reason as FA. If they fold in their first fight with 2 Gold servers since their implosion; they will not shake the PvD enthusiast label. However fighting hard will ensure their place in Gold League and a guaranteed last place finish. It’s in their hands.
SBI They are better off than they were before the bandwagon. They are probably a solid T4 and their NA is still pretty good. If they ever learn to stop blobbing EBG they could be in line for a 2nd comeback.
HoD keeps growing and getting very little traction for all the activity
The Bad
SoR is being abused by the horrible glicko system. They should be in Bronze League but are losing so slowly that they are a lock for Silver. They will be a non-presence for the Season.
BP once the hope of Silver, they are backsliding badly. A lot of transfers off apparently.
YB A nerf to arrowcarts would send this server to T6. Their defense culture is the only thing that is keeping them in the higher tiers.
(edited by Chris.3290)
This is a blatant example of what people have said since RNG became a factor. There needs to be a ANet control in place to do something about broken servers. SoR has been ticking less than 100 points for almost two months now and they are still in Tier 3.
If ANet had put in a backdoor to manually skew ratings for servers that are obviously in decline; then they would save a lot of people a lot of pain. If any server loses by 150k or more, they should automatically drop down. If a server wins by 150k, they should automatically move up.
FA is now focusing on Maguuma; meanwhile they just lost their last off hours guild (not counting the late EU/Early NA Brazillians).
There’s also a good chance now (since DB did not move up) that we may not be able to prevent DB in Gold League. DB will roll T2 either this Friday or (even worse) the following Friday.
Though the T2 servers are committed to a vicious 2v1 (DB, you’ve been warned and it’s not personal) there is no guarantee that it will be effective to the point that the server that drops down will be able to gain enough points to swap back with DB. There’s also the possibility. that RNG might keep them in T3 all the way until the Season starts with them in #5 without ever facing a T2 server.
Oh, and stacking CD isn’t going to help. They just lost KOME so GG T5.
Why does anyone care, the queues on these FULL (even if it’s not full for a 5 minute window at 2:55am server time) will be insane once the season starts.
Remember, no PvE updates during the Tournament (unlike last time) so people will drift into WvW due to a lack of other things to do.
IoJ and SBI need to put aside any past differences and 2v1 the #7 server to keep things interesting for them.
The lead-up to the season was worse than the season itself.
Maguuma and SoS are in a much better position to shape events than they were last season, and even FA is looking pretty good if their OCX/SEA will stop bailing on them and they can get some more.
If nothing else, we might get some 2v1 (2 T2 vs 1 T1) going to keep it interesting; along with the chance to play spoiler in a match with only one T2 server.
The potential for fun and hijinks is there.
SoR has lost enough points that this week’s T2 guest will have extreme difficulty getting juice from fruit that has been thoroughly squeezed. If DB stays there, they will gain very little this coming week and it will be statistically impossible for them to gain the following week; especially since that would see one or two of the more able T4 servers step into the fight.
The worst possible outcome would be for DB to stay in T3 this week, pop up next week the same time as IoJ and possibly BP enter the match in T3.
As whole the DB thing, the pressure will let up if they comport themselves well and show they really want Tier 2. We just don’t really want them if they don’t want to be there; if you catch my drift.
We know FA wants it, and they will keep things interesting during crappy matchups just by the nature of being good fighters.
We don’t know anything about DB other than Maguuma completely wrecked them and the same groups that have been ppt’ing them this hard were complete no-shows that week (this was before Maguuma had much SEA, so it was very telling).
No one, wants a no-show in the #6 spot in Gold League. It’s going to be a 9 week suckfest as it is, and having a ppt sink is not going to help that.
So it’s up to DB, in the end. With their good coverage they’d be more valuable than FA in that spot if they came to fight. If they wobble, if their PuGs don’t show; we’ll push them down not out of cruelty, but because it’s the best thing for all involved.
There’s too much probability. I do think that if DB and FA switch places and that if SoR/SBI are still the opponents; that you will most likely be going to Silver barring a truly heroic effort by your server.
Having been where you are now (SoS at the start of the first season) I’m familiar with the discussions that are going on within your server. I think you should just give it your all and let things fall where they may. If you don’t do well, you will drift down; with your heads held high and a nod of respect for trying. If you do well and fight a good fight, you will end up in Gold simply because that’s where you rank.
I know of no case of a server throwing a matchup that did not reverberate into a long-term backlash that usually sees that server stripped of most of it’s WvW talent. Even the perception of reluctance (SBI and FA, didn’t have a say in dropping out of Gold but they were too happy not to go) can make WvW-minded people and guilds reconsider a move to your server.
I’ll be out of town for the weekend, but I predict a lot of ballistae outside DB spawn if they don’t bring their ‘A’ game.
Go wherever you think you will have the most fun, whether you are a loaner or as a guild. Just ask yourself if it’s worth 144 Gold or almost $30 if you are going to go to a server that’s FULL or does not want more transfers atm.
Look up the matchup wishlist here on the forums and see Snowreap’s probability numbers for the upcoming matchups (usually posted on Thursday, so some variation happens).
There is no way to mathematically predict what will happen regarding DB going to Gold League or staying in Silver.
The general consensus is that it’s 75% in DB’s control if they go or not. If they get their full population out and press hard during SEA (they’ll have a challenge on their hands if it’s SoS and Maguuma; a little bit easier if it’s SoS and FA); there will be little to stop them from securing a place in Gold.
Tomorrow’s reset will determine it all as well. With SBI and SoR dropping, the #7 server only has one more week to collect the easy PPT from both servers. Whoever drops down to face them (if SoR or SBI do not drop down out of T3) will have to PPT hard to get back up, but should be good to move up the proceeding week.
So the main factors are:
1. Does Dragonbrand move up this week?
2. Does Dragonbrand play hard if they do?
3. Does Dragonbrand move up the week after this one?
The only factor out of DB’s control is that the current Tier 2 servers like their matchup and GvG variety. Any combination of servers will focus DB very hard at first to determine if they are going to fairweather it and purposefully tank down. If DB keeps coming back and fights hard, they’ll probably let up a little; DB will gain points and will probably be a lock for Gold unless RNG rolls extremely low.
Statistically even odds of either Maguuma or FA dropping down to T3… I hope it happens this week and not a week from tomorrow.
I’m kinda hoping it will be Maguuma, as Maguuma will focus on SoS for fights and that might allow DB to gain more points. I know we can count on FA to focus the weaker server.
Oh wow TC fill up to full already, that was quite fast.
Quick everyone there still is time to make another T1 server.
All who cannot enter TC, transfer into SoS now and bring them glory!
No, no, no and HECK no!
Everyone in T3 this week can use some more NA peeps. 2nd place in Silver is completely up for grabs; make a play now before it’s too late!
Compare it to the other 4 back row towers. Blue and Green towers are much more defensible, being right under the nose of the keeps. The only defense of Mendon’s is to port everyone back home and run there quickly.
OTH, it also balances out the hard as nails to capture Veloka.
Langor and Jerrifer’s are not easy caps; but they might as well be Supply camps compared to Veloka.
The design is set to encourage both Red and Blue to focus on Green. (Blue has a harder path to attack and Red needs to go on the offensive to defend it’s exposed flank on that half).
Blame idiots who don’t understand map diplomacy as much as the crappy tower design.
We are kept in WvW by an incredibly strong Pacific presence (mostly China and Australia, maybe some Japan and Korea). You’ll see it in the morning when our chat goes Mandarin. They’ve been putting in more time too. I see TFV running well into 1pm eastern (like 2am their time). Our NA presence is regarded to be weaker than most servers but it buys time for the Pacific presence to kick in. If we hit T1 silver I expect to see a large jump in activity during NA primetime and possibly Euro primetime. That part will be what drives us to compete with Gold league in season 3. If we hit T2 gold then we’ll get destroyed and probably sink back down to T10 or lower (and get to fight Straegen’s guild again on a more frequent basis).
In this regard hoping for silver is not weak, it’s looking out for my server’s longevity in WvW. We don’t have the capability to fight off Gold league servers yet.
If you guys keep saying you can’t handle T2 after PvD’ing <T2 into oblivion then you will never get the transfers you need to be competitive.
DB is in a crucial decision moment. I fail to understand understand why anyone on DB is talking about wanting to stay in Silver and karma train. You might as well PvE champ farm, the rewards are higher.
Servers that tanked last season have had a stink/stigma to them that is not easy to shake.
There’s a lot of talk in DB’s guilds about trying not to get to gold but stay top tier silver. We would get crushed for 8 weeks in gold league while if we were top silver league we would prosper to the point where we have a stable WvW community after the league. Whether that means we’ll throw a match remains to be seen.
What keeps you guys in WvW? Your SEA does nothing but PvD, but they are at it every night. Don’t they long for anything close to an even fight?
Rotscale as the meta-event boss and the Mausoleum beneath being a dungeon (like Gates of Orr)
Totem Axes in the falls.
The one to the north would open up to Majesty’s Rest and the Mausoleum. I see great potential for a dungeon there and maybe a new dragon boss (Rotwing?)
If one were to go straight through the bandit fort you would end up at Mamnoon Lagoon (you can see the blue patch just past it in uncovered areas.)
Just to the SouthWest you can see a circular structure in the dirt, that is Dry Top. On the West end up that are low Hills that lead to Ventauri’s Refuge.
The Sylvari origin story says that it must have been near there that Ronan found the cave with the Pale Tree seeds.
That means that the cave is in the Falls (already known to a be a magical locus point due to FoW access and Zinn’s Lab) and that is where the events at the end of the current LS took place.
They lost MEOW last week and now they’ve lost SERN, both to Maguuma.
I am still a little confused about this new tourny set up. So It looks like my server DB is probably gonna be ranked 6th going into the tourny. Does that mean we will face 2 other gold league servers who have much greater coverage then us the first week and lose. Then the second week we face 2 more gold league servers who lost the first week and lose again cus they still have much greater coverage then us and so on and so forth for 9 weeks. Or will at some point we will get to face a silver or bronze league server and get a win?
There are pros and cons for DB in trying for Gold.
Pros: With Tier 1 completely FULL; people looking to move up will be looking at Tier 2. Everyone knows that DB has a powerful SEA group that plays well into early EU. That makes DB NA an attractive move. If DB can prove to people that they are serious about WvW and not a fairweather PvD server; then they will grow and will be competitive in Tier 2.
If you need examples, look at Maguuma. They add KH (late NA/early OCX) during the first season, and have grown a lot since in coverage. They were attractive because they played hard. Likewise, whoever the #7 server is will have hardcore WvW guilds looking for a new home. The former #7 server will be an attractive choice.
Likewise SoS went from having a T4 NA to now being called a T1.5 server.
Compare to FA and SBI which both tanked down to Silver. SBI is a shell of it’s pre-season self and FA is bleeding guilds despite heroic efforts by it’s NA.
Cons: The Season will be brutal. You will lose every match, you will lose every match by amounts so bad that they will have to change the scoring to a logarithmic value. Though there is a lot of potential for gains, there is no guarantee or promises that can be made.
Maguuma is in ppt try hard mode, FA can’t realistically beat that. The supreme irony will be if FA ppts just enough that DB comes up the following week, instead of next week.
I want DB up in T2 next week. If they want gold and play hard they’ll get it. If they are a fairweather ppt sink, then we will get FA back up here in time for the tournament to start.
CD has lost guilds but you know what? We are in the same exact position we were in months ago right at the start of season 1 even after losing over half a dozen guilds.
Yes, but if your competitors are also bleeding guilds to T1/T2 – and I’m fairly sure that applies to pretty much everyone south of Dragonbrand these days – then that’s not really saying much.
Both of you are wrong. The reason CD has stayed in the same position since Season 1 was because all 4 mass exoduses happened before it.
No, we lost 2 major guilds that were good people [KA] and [Tofu] post seasons. We lost a couple havoc groups that were kinda there sometimes and kinda not. that was post season for CD. The gap between t3 and t4 is huge, t4/t5 probably not as bad. These were home grown guilds which stung a bit.
The guilds we lost pre season weren’t really home grown, they came in taught us some new tricks and gave us an umph.
Losing 2 guilds several weeks apart is not an implosion. Losing multiple within 1-2 weeks is an implosion.
I doubt the gap between t3 and t4 is that big anymore. SoR isn’t even t9 at this point, and DB is t2.
We, on SBI, don’t really know what we are, but we were beating BP each match, but I don’t really count that cause we had big brother Maguuma stomping both of us.
Since BP lost LOST, we probably will do better than them, and I think our overnight presence will be what would decide the match with IoJ (we did lose OLAF to Mag, since they purcahsed OLAF from us).
So, we are eager to see how we actually compare to other servers, cause so far, we are outnumbered by Bandwagon server #5 and we outnumber Mass exodus server #1.
Bandwagoning kills communities, and I wonder how many guilds are gonna hop off of TC, SoS, DB, Mag, and FA during and after season 2 based on the pressures of winning, and the drama is causes (that is what broke SBI).
Sorry SoR, but you are in a really bad place right now. I respect everyone that has stayed with the server through all that has happened.
TC is now a contender for #1 so they’ll probably stick around post-season. The only high ranked servers on implosion watch is whichever server ends up at #7. If DB embarrasses itself when they go to tier 2, they’ll be written off as a destination for serious WvW transfers.
If FA or Mag drops down you can expect many to transfer off for the season and you can’t be sure they’d come back.
I’m not sure how SoS would handle it but it’s hard to see that happening with current scores.
No, SoR is in the worst position EVAR!
Calm down friends from FA, unless DB has been sandbagging we’ll bring you back if you drop down next week. No promises if it’s the following week because you’d have to tick +695 for 7 out of every 8 hours to not lose score.
I’d rather see…
Tier1-T3
T4-T6
T7-T8
T3 gets wrecked by the top server in their tier, and you want to throw them to the Tier 1 wolves?
It’s been over two months since T3 stopped being viable against Tier 2 servers. Not since SBI lost that heartbreaker in the final hours of the 1/3 match, has any match involving a Tier 3 server not involved over 100k point difference at the end of the match?
There’s no solution that won’t result in some ridiculous matchups.
I think Mag and SoS are committed to stomping on DB when they pop up. (I hope it’s next week while there is still juice left to squeeze out of SBI and SoR.)
If they hold their own, then they’ve earned the spot. If they fold like even their own folks are saying, we’ll have you back in no time.
Despite completely scrobbing over the 2nd tier of Silver and Gold, this could get interesting if some folks do engage in a little server hopping.
I feel really bad for servers 10-12. Either FA or DB is going to win Silver by default, not even having to raise a finger.
Don’t get me wrong, this is a GREAT first step in addressing the problems that come along with this.
I also think it screws up long term prospects for Fort Aspenwood and Maguuma. They need some transfer love for competitive T2 and this is just throwing a giant spike into those works.
As someone mentioned, this will wreck the recovery of SBI and SoR. No matter what your individual feelings might have been of those servers when they were riding high; they don’t deserve to get squatted on right as they are trying to pick up the pieces.
Judging from the price changes it looks like a return of the Gold, Silver, and Bronze leagues.
I will be the first to admit that the lower half of the Gold League actually bettered their situation in the last Season; but now that winning matters; doesn’t the new pay system kinda take a squat on servers 4-6 and 10-12?
No one in Tier 2 is going to beat anyone in Tier 1 unless backdoor arrangements (not in the spirit of the game) are made, so why do we get stuck with the Mercedes price tag? Don’t get me wrong, we shouldn’t get the 0 gem treatment but the post-start costs seem reasonable for 4-6 and 10-12? At least give us a break and drop it to 1600 (between the 800 and 2400 costs)
The pricing seems to be implying that each league’s 4-6 have a equal chance at taking 1-3; and everyone knows that it won’t work that way. Sure, we might have a repeat of #4 taking #3 or something.
However, I know in Gold league people have already done the math and even with the Swiss System it will still end up 1-6 being 1-6.
Silver is more in doubt due to the unstability of two of the T3 servers but that might resolve itself pre-tournament as well.