Guild Wars 2

Clownmug.8357:

It seems somewhat obvious, at least to me, that Karl cared a lot more about making the Daredevil decent than he did the Tempest. I mean, he even forgot the name for Ether Renewal during the livestream when comparing it to Channeled Vigor.

i doubt this is honestly the answer, its easily done to forget things when on the spot, the likelyhood they’re told what role to fulfill with these new elites and they have to build something to lean towards it, maybe that intended role couldnt fit the more offensive weapons.

Also, its pretty known the rogue class always gets the cooler things, that comes with playing the assassin styled proffession and it links in very well with the roles they do aswell as us, our Playstyles are based around Bunkerish with more Damage (D/D) and Bunker Staff (Celestrial staff) therefore to fit something that will fit a bunker more Is Likely..

thief isnt bunker on any level therefore used for other things.. such as Damaging Ninja Playstyles.

Lightsbane.9012:

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Lightsbane.9012:

everyone knows how brainless bearbow used to be considered, now there’s PU and stealth spamming on mesmer. add perplexity runes to the mix and you have a build that can beat nearly everything, whether or not you’re even the slightest bit talented.

is this ever going to be addressed? it’s really one of the strongest builds in wvw/pvp right now and very hard to counter. (fun fact, old PU wasn’t this strong. it still had more cheese than all of wisconsin, but wasn’t as strong as it is now.)

1. Perplexity runes require interrupts to be effective. Interrupts aren’t easy for people who aren’t “the slightest bit talented”, unless facing other people who aren’t “the slightest bit talented”, in which case what’s the problem?

2. It’s not one of the strongest builds in pvp, because stealth spamming in pvp is counterproductive. This has been explained (and ignored) exhaustively.

3. When combined with PU, The Pledge adds more stealth than PU itself does. And since that’s a bug, fixing the bug will have a dramatic impact on your complaint.

4. You’re implying that new PU is cheesy because it’s even stronger than old PU. Old PU wasn’t cheesy because it was strong, it was cheesy because clone death allowed PU builds to run around spamming clone bombs from stealth, which is troll play at its finest. No clone death means combat requires coming out of stealth, now. If power were cheesy, elementalists would be limburger.

5. WvW is a terrible basis for build balance. There are far too many factors in WvW to make it a good indicator of build power.

6. PU mesmer is only powerful in WvW roaming…a play case that is not central to WvW itself. The majority of play in WvW involves the zerg and group play, which PU builds are really not great at. So you are wrong, it’s not “really one of the strongest builds in wvw/pvp right now,” it’s one of the strongest builds in “WvW roaming” specifically.

In sum:

• PU builds are only overpowered in WvW roaming.
• WvW roaming is the very least important segment of GW2 game play, balance-wise
• The Pledge is a bigger issue than PU itself.
• PU condi builds using Perplexity runes are not easy mode.

tl;dr: you are right that stealth mesmer is very powerful in WvW roaming, to the point that it may be worth looking at balance of it after dealing with all the spvp and pve balance issues surrounding mesmers.

You’re wrong about pretty much everything else.

so PU is NOT a crutch build. okay. That’s why 7/10 mesmers in wvw run it. whether it does anything to the benefit as a whole wasn’t really my point, and I ..kind of thought that was pretty obvious. Though that’s not fully true, when you have a mesmer that can get 40+ seconds of stealth that’s hiding in a keep, it becomes a serious problem when they are that difficult to get rid of simply because of the traits they have taken.

it isn’t a crutch at all, if the Mesmer balls up they have a stealth, it makes the situation more forgiving but ur acting as if mesmers have 101 different abilities which give them invisibility, given most run with Moa you only have like what 1 stealth + 1 stealth under 30% health so theres no way once its happened the mesmers turning around after this.

Implying it was a crutch it’d need a good ratio of Actually pulling the player through where realistically it actually doesn’kittens easier then a Mesmer without PU sure it is but it isn’t as big of a crutch as some proffessions seriously have, the profession isn’t accessing anything really else outside of it. we don’t really have survivability coming out from anywhere else but escape.

a Bad Mesmer will still instantly lose points, will still die in the actual fight and still wont kill anyone, just cause they now prance around invisable to escape preventing you actually getting the kill doesn’t make it a crutch at the end of the day nothing was achieved the Mesmer fleeing via stealth.

Kinda been the perk of playing a stealth styled profession since the beginning of MMos and yet only now being viewed as a crutch.

7/10 mesmers use it because its listed in a Meta Build, just like if it was nerfed and suddenly removed no one would use it again, Most competitive players use what works the best, anything less is a handicap therefore will use whatever is considered meta… to use that as reasoning to ur opinon of a ability is just ridiculous.

10/10 thief use D/P, does this make their entire weapon set a crutch they lean on? no it doesn’t just shows its stronger then alternatives. Same goes for PU, people will adapt to whatever is reaching the highest numbers, its how ur ment to play and will prove those who are and arnt good at their profession.

Lyger.5429:

Fay.2357:

To take chrono, you’re losing out on another trait line. That’s the sacrifice compared to normal Mesmer. You could probably dig up some ancient threads that discussed this half to death. Losing a trait line from a normal build is a difficult sacrifice. Just take any standard build and try and pick which one to drop.

Besides, how is that second argument not applicable to warrior/ele too? They don’t ‘lose’ anything other than a traitline either, so go cry nerf somewhere else.

I’m not asking for a nerf just trying to understand the expansion from a point that doesn’t seem pay-to-win because if expacs owners have an advantage over non-expac owners, no matter how smaller, is bad news for any game. But only time will tell I guess. But I trust Anet to deal with these issues…

I disagree with this, P2W would be I dunno, a Ingame item or Subscription benefits being overtuned, a Expansion is NOT p2w, MMORPGs are DESIGNED for players to buy into further benefits.

if a WoW player opts to not Pay into the expansion and He cannot progress those further 5-10 levels in PvP woW does bands of 5 so u’d be 90 v 95, with no normalisation, Does this make the game P2W just because he has DISABLED himself of the content in the Next expansion.

No, MMos are designed on the bases of those bursts of income from the expansion and are Designed to Barrier off Non-Paying Customers, Such as WoW increasing its levels by 10, the fact is this Expansion offers NOTHING but those Elite specs and New Proffession to PvPers, to lower this makes the expansion worthless for a Solid PvPer in GW2 this is Stupid, the game was Created on the bases of PvP.

Would a paying player feel their monies Wasted on paying into something that benefited them 0? yes they would, would it discourage the Sales of Expansion in the pvp community? Yes, there has to be something there saying BUY ME and the elites becoming Firmly Placed in the Meta is the Way to do this.

Its a Expansion its Ment to be a Extention of ur Class… Age ur Proffession to become better and that is Exactly what it is bringing, u cant suddenly take the The genre out of what it is because some players don’t want to give Anet a Dime for their game… the games built on making Profit, they give F2Pers ENOUGH in this game theres a Line where it Starts to become Self-Entitlement.

rchu.8945:

nerfed Mesmer traits just so Chronomancer would be balanced in Anet’s eyes, pay to win pretty much.

That’s like Saying Every MMO on the market is P2W for having expansions, its a New expansion it has to be balanced FOR the new expansion… if they made normal Mesmer balanced it’d just make chronomancer insanely overpowered Causing the EXACT same effect on that balance.

Chronomancer has to be Aknowledged during the process of balancing,

MMOs are built on the Expectation of u Paying into each Expansion, if ur unwilling to pay for that then ur in the wrong genre of games, it isn’t P2W it follows the EXACT rules of every other game.

Either way on topic

Worrying, Awesome, Fun..

I’m currently using a Crit build Using

Sword+Sword / Hammer

Corruption 1 1 2

Devastation 2 3 3

nvocation 3 3 1

with runes of Rage and Maruaders amulet With rune of Rage and Rune of blood in my dual swords

Rune of Energy and Rune of Flame in my Hammer

with the Ironhammer and Ventari Legends for my utilities.

was curious to what have u guys found to use c:

imhop its opinon based, people find different playstyles easier

for example

I found it easier to pick up the engineer, yet I cant grasp the elementalist in the slightest, I found the necro really easy to pick up yet I cant play a ranger or a warrior for the life of me, therefore i’d say

Elementalist, Warrior and Ranger to be the hardest, they’re playstyles I cant work or adjust to so I cant be good playing with them, no profession is hard to play, its just simply what does and does not fit ur playstyle and preferences.

I havnt had a mass of playtime on the profession however, great job in design, it feels refreshing and very different to the other proffessions playstyles, it defintly is a lot of fun to play and brings a new playstyle really to the table with the little features it has such as the utilities being tied to weapons and the legends and no CD on Utility skills, I defintly am loving the profession.

I feel The healing skills are too weak, I don’t really feel any boost in health over a fight due to delays and things, I understand this is low cause we effectively have 2 heals over a normal proffessions 1, but it really does feel so very low in comparison to any other healing In the game I’ve used so far.

Shiros Damage output seems abit too low for a assassin, I don’t really feel like the burst is there (this could be cause I’m new so I will keep trying it and learning it before ireally confirm that) but as far as I’ve gone so far its damage isn’t all the great currently,

however, hammers damage is kitten good, defintly is strong in situations i still feel the Cast times on some of their abilities may need adjusting as some attacks are just quite slow without hitting harder, I havnt tested staff yet, not sure if i can rely on Shiros damage enough to really throw the support weapon in with it as i feel i may just lose all my damage trying that so maybe for a bunker build it’d do well but prolly not if ur looking to use Shiro for assassin styled play.

I love the trait options – i feel like there is a good variation of both defencsive and offensive traits with this profession, I wont really comment on if i feel any of them are underpowered, there are some such as Assassins Annihaliation that i’d say maybe are abit too situational requiring u to attack from the side of back given people generally don’t stand still for you in pvp however i could see its uses in PvE situaitons.

The utility skills seem interesting, being locked into them per weapon set is different for sure, i know without CDs u have to be careful with what u create but i feel some of them arnt really strong enough when u put them into action, the Revs inability to swap between utilities lowers its capability in countering other builds which is the fall of it, i feel that some just don’t provide enough of what they do to give the rev enough defence.

Overall though a good experience i feel this will defintly become my new main, Only issues I’m having is finding the damage with Shiro and our healing options and I’m sure if it flags as a actual problem and not just down to how new i am at the profession it’ll be sorted before its release anyway

So really Good job Anet, and Thankyou for this brilliant profession c:

tbh I’m really liking the rev c:

I think its too late to really redesign the proffessions abilities to introduce that into their legends as it’d be a hard balancing job to do last minute, I feel the damage output is a tad too low but it defintly has potiental as it is and since the last time u can really feel the difference in strength your no longer just down state fodder..

Luna Leon.3480:

My opinion is that Specializations is a FAIL.

By having Trait lines and points we could have so many different builts.
e.g. (3-4-4-3-0, 6-6-2-0-0, 3-3-3-3-2 etc)

Even if many compinations were a “mistake” to use… We had the option to do it. It was OUR way of playing. And instead of giving us more… you limit us?

F-A-I-L !

Consider improving the game not downgrading it. Reason of an upgrade is not to see a new pretty city in GW.

Reason of an upgrade is not just give my Warrior a Greataxe to use.

Reason of an upgrade is to…

- Give my Warrior a Greataxe to use BUT most important,
- LET ME USE IT THE WAY I LIKE!

You had that and instead of improving it… You are KILLING it.

check: Specializations vs Trait Lines, Ricochet trait (Thief), etc. You are killing the fun of the game.

People make these complaints, but they were never true to begin with, this game has always had Top builds, and generally very limited, sure you can say “oh well, i could just make fun builds”… well they werent fun for ur group to play with cause more often then not it put them at a disadvantage playing with a player who Handicaps himself through building incorrectly.

this game has ALWAYS been limited in what u can viably do with ur proffession so i really dont understand the difference tbh, the way they are doing it is the most balanced way they can possibly do it, it also is alot better then just openly giving them a winner due to how much it’d really break combination wise, the idea is the NOT allow things

its much easier and more effective when it comes to balancing it also will prolly push players closer to Actual builds rather then troll ones aslong as all these elites are effective. lol, i feel the arguments invalid because the game just never had this “limitless build capacity” people try to claim it ever has had.

1) These Elites will have no effect on combinations, They are balancing it with The other specializations, not making the Elites overpowered.

2) They only offer another way of play just like any other Specialization, you dont walk into Mesmer and play Illusions / Domination / Dueling to play a PU Mesmer do you?… you take Losses in the specializations u sacrifice for your build, theres no reason why u should expect to be able to use any weapon anywhere, its just not what it is a Magic Necromancer isnt going to pick up a Greatsword… it just makes more sense they cant wield it.

3) the elites ALone havnt changed games or proffessions only given additional options, so There has been a Increase in combinations and New Playstyles which can be used in multiple ways… its also mainly done this way to make it easy to disable it for those who havnt purchased HoT.

i think reaper will be great in PvE, it’ll suck pvp wise..

Its just too slow, im sorry but GW2 pvp is basically entirely based on mobility, part of the reason necromancers arnt great is the lack of mobility, which tbh makes me wonder why they made reaper as it currently is.

but i do think it’ll bne a upgrade for pve necros, i dont think it’ll benefit the pvp playerbase at all though tbh…

GS will prolly be good in pve tbh, i cant see much for it pvp wise though… Just too Slow and lacks in too many areas, Necromancers will be stuck with the standard Terrormancers and powermancer builds overall tbh, cant realistically seeing ..

Maybe Reaper will introduce new ways to play, the Reaper Shroud is good it’ll make u 100% melee but we’ll see on the numbers, but GS wont be useful to a pvper

it wont stop that, Mesmers still hold onto PU builds, so still will forever be QQ’d on til thats nerfed too haha.

nearlight.3064:

Greatsword’s main niche will be a downcleave weapon. Things like gravedigger are the perfect tools for denying rezzes since you won’t want to eat that. Still without dagger/wh on your other set, you’ll have poor 1v1 potential because of the slowness.

I’ll take reaper on every build simply because the stability uptime is strong and RS skills are so much faster and more fluid than base DS skills. And thats a fact.

I don’t really know about shouts, cele signets will still be the way to go. Condi reaper may be viable as well, but it probably won’t be able to run signets without giving up curses, so it needs better utilities to function since corruptions are useless in their current state.

your crazy if u think reaper will be viable in pvp :P… its going to be a PvE only specc, Most can see that it just isnt going to have the mobility for GW2 Pvp…. ur only as Viable as how much Mobility u have All people have to do is run circles around you and Evade the moment u manage to get hit them (if at any point you do) Proffessions like Mesmers are litterally going to run rings around you all day all Night and the moment u manage to somehow get close ur going to be shot back 30 yards.

Well: Given our very small pool of Weapons it’d have to be 2handed, I’d of prolly rather’d the 2handed Sword as i like their looks and Skins better then hammer, but i guess Hammer makes more sense.

Well we know theres Drones and a chain attack on his 1, which looks cool, im hoping we get some Leaps and Knockdowns with the Specialization and hoping we get something else but more kits although i think the drones are within a kit or the Elite, but overall im hoping to get tricks or something.

I think we’ll get Cantrips with the Drones as a Elite, i think we’ll get Some Defensive CDs as currently we dont have any, with Electrical Shieldings and Some other AoE CC and Protection boosters.

Im thinking it’ll be Mechanic as Rumoured, it seems Fitting if we build drones.

Cecilia.5179:

It has been quite a while since Reaper was released, but it seems like every other class since then has been out to upstage Reaper. Revenant Shiro Elite laughs at Reaper Elite and Ele shouts are infinitely better than Reaper shouts (what happened to “damaging shouts should have a cast time?”). Personally, I’d like to know what has been changed with Reaper to adjust for the chill nerfs and the ever more apparent lameness of reaper utilities. It would be super cool if we could get a dev that can reassure us the class is still moving in a positive direction.

this depends on what ur looking for tbh.

PvE i think the reaper will be great, specially if they do bring raids out, they will be the new hardest hitters and will do so much DPS, with sustain so i feel like in PvE this will take the meta, it will be the go too specc.

PvP its Doomed 110% Doomed, no way in hell will u get this to work in any form of PvP Skirmish Teamfight 1v1 Duels Zergs all of it, lame, it doesnt stand a chance 0 Mobility barely any CC without close Combat we knew from the moment we saw it, it just doesnt stand a chance

a Amazing concept, it looks like great gameplay wise and alot of fun but it just will not stand up against another proffession PvP Wise… its too slow.

tbh, we’ve seen the the weapon skills, these wont be forced on anyone This is why:

1) if they did give us Utility skills to build, it’d never be Viable u’d just keep on using Double Kits with Elixir S with Rampage Potion, This game will NEVER in pvp or pve support pets properly so who cares? U just get some wasted Utilities hope trait lines good and Hammer hits hard.

2) Necros already crying on another proffession getting wells, trust me they wont do this unless they WANT people to quit.

3) I find it unlikely, We’re more likely to get Signets or Tricks, we wont be getting no robot army, they hate pets as it is why would they give us pets after all these, Espically when it is attached to Hammer, The Elite will summon the drones by my thinking.

Although if they did looking at the Drones movement.

They travel WITH the engineer, like as if they are attached to him and Just fire Extra Shots at what hes fighting, so AI would never affect the Pets from a Engineer anyway because they are As if ur weapon hits 3 times not Exactly a Seperate being doing damage… they cannot run a Robot army on this new version they are bringing, so i dont think they would.

I can see us getting a new Turret and and Like AoE Damaging Utility not robots

PookieDaWombat.6209:

OK, so having just watched the POI about the Rev and the ability to weapon swap it got me thinking.

All of the same reasons they’ve given for allowing the new class to have weapon swap applies to Engie (and even Ele) as well.

I think its about time they allow us to have weapon swap in the game if they are going to just give it to the revanent.

Thoughts?

the issue was, Rev had 0 Access to any variation in play, making their Damage so predictable as they only ever had the same 5 buttons to use, also none of their weapons are strong enough to be the only weapons, It was imbalancing to give them Weapon Swap, also as a a Proffession that has no Kits and No Attunements it shouldnt balanced with us who do, it isnt really fair we have 15 buttons with 0 Kits yet they get stuck with us knowing they only ever have 5 offensive attacks from weaker weapons.

Elementalist would be too imbalanced and to rebalance them to fit weapon swap would cause SOO many CDs they’d come out worse off with Weapon swap introduced and us engineers barely use base weapon as it is, we dont rly need it + our Weapons have 0 Synergy.

We dont need Weapon Swap, Even with a Pure melee Weapon we have Elixir Gun Gerandes and Motar which all are Ranged Weapons, to give us Weapon swap would be broken specially having Rifle with our Hammer, the idea is to keep our proffession balanced so it isnt Nerfed 1 Patch into HoT and made worthless by a Over Nerf hammer.

Weapon swap fits the Rev but it doesnt fit us.

NiBlack.3149:

I Don’t think Engi need weapon swap either.
BUT
I wouldn’t mind making these weapons viable enough on their own to not need to have at least 1 kit equipped.
Generally I am waiting for specialisation (I will probably drop explosive line for it). There was somewhere data-mined that hammer will have blast finisher on third AA, and it is hammer so it at least will have some higher than avarge dmg (but on other hand I am scared, when I look no how Anet kittened new traits… for me anyway).

Well this will be even more pressed into hammer, Why? Cause 0 ranged capability to not be kited u will be required to take on Ranged Kits and imho that is Exactly how it should be.

your Secondary Resource and your main mechanic Lie in Kit Swaps, to give players a Capability to bypass that entire process is kinda taking away the point of the Proffession, the proffession is here to provide a Playstyle, Which is a jack of all trades within Multiple Kit uses to have abit of everything.

It should Never be nullified, U dont see them deleting Attunements for Elementalists.. Or Deleting pets for Rangers… or Deleting Clones from Mesmers… We shouldnt lose our core mechanics either.

what if Hammer engi isnt hammer engi at all?… What if its a Staff Engi Keepo.

On a Serious note, Im hoping we’re the next Teaser, i really would like to see if it really is hammer (i know we saw it, but it didnt set it in stone nothing datamined as lead towards it, we just saw something idicating it) also what sorta role it’ll play.

eduardo.1436:

The drones from the elite spec are both signets AND minions?

is it datamined that engis getting Signets? o.o i thought we’d More likely get Tricks or Cantrips.

Well, i think thief will be next personally, it was Datamined Within the same Pack as the Tempest, and Tempest was the Next after that establishment which means they’re Weapon sets were likely Finishing up at the same time.

I tbh think staffs going to be a full support weapon, they dont seem to be changing weapon uses as much as we think specially given the fact Warhorn did actually turn out to be a Buff/Support Specialization, Staff will prolly follow its normal Support/healing Lines.

I dont think druids going to be as good as people think tbh :/.

Dreamwolf.7423:

Phineas Poe.3018:

Dreamwolf.7423:

I don’t like kits, elixirs, and all the other things that take my weapon skills away.

You really can’t complain that ArenaNet is limiting your options when you’re really just limiting yourself.

I’m not limiting myself, I’m playing the way I want to play, which is how the game was advertised, which was the main draw for me. Now, unless I spam grenades or bombs or elixirs or flamethrower, I can’t play my engineer because I get destroyed by the OP kit/bundle set. I don’t see how playing with options that were made available is limiting myself. I’m supposed to be able to PLAY HOW I WANT, not how Anet dictates it.

Well, true to a extent, not it isnt “advertised” each proffession has its own second Resource, the Second Resource is pretty required to play properly, Engineers is Kits, to play a proffession without its core mechanic is ridiculous it wont ever work if 1 proffession suited everything they’d only need 1 proffession for everyone, different playstyles, If u hate the Engineers Core mechanic your never going to get along with it.

tbh im worried it’ll come to Beta weekend we’ll test it… a ton will flame it and Next day it’ll get nerfed into the floor and when we finally get to test it again after its actual release it’ll prove worthless after how much they took away from it :/… Generally what im expecting to happen tbh.

lighter.2708:

Rip skill change
Pull the enemy towards you and rip the sword for extra damage.

@above, protection aegis way too op, not for war. too many blind? nerf mesmer’s blind, not our problem, have you heard too many dodges for warrior? me either.

u cant just nerf another proffessions skills to incoperate them into your own lol, not really how things work, neither does Warriors wielding blind..

Ur a Ferious Berseker… a Master of Arms… you hack and Slash not Precision and Tactics… u overwhelm ur opponants through brute force Not Dirty tricks :P…. try to keep the Core of What a Warrior actually is within it…

Although im all for bringing the skill floors up on proffessions i dont think it’ll happen, u need a range of difficulties to suit Players of all backgrounds.

tobascodagama.2961:

Drayos.8759:

well yes that is true, but Mesmers are 1200 Range, you arnt going to really be near the actual Damage itself

Hahaha, ok. If you say so.

If i say so?… Its a classic MMO thing for Melee to be at more danger then Ranged, 1200 Range should be enough Distance to see things coming, which gives u more time to react to it rather being upfront where it’ll fall on you faster.

Im sorry, but In PvP Mesmers Survivability with a Full Zerker builds pretty strong, they dont need a Shield to survive, they havnt since the release of this game and have made it through everything.

Arguing this Shield will be a required for Mesmers to survive the Upcoming PvE Content is silly, if Mesmers survivability was that bad it’d of been identified in PvP, sure pure Focus will but Lets face it ur not face tanking the monsters.

Silverkey.2078:

@Drayos
I think an important question is how will HoT new PvE mode be. Depending on how they build it, it may form a bridge between PvE and PvP content. Staying alive may become a more important part of everyone’s builds, stacking enemies will most likely not work anymore reducing the importance of cleave etc… But that is very much an unknown.

The good news is that aNet seems to be aware that they need to balance PvE, the best example being I believe the reaper. Too slow to be useful in PvP, based on melee combat, benefitting from the number of enemies around (while the necromancer usually lacks scalable defense/offense)… that is the definition of what the current PvE needs. I still think the damage is too low for reaper, but that’s hopefully something they will change.

The shield alacrity could be welcome… if it hit more than one ally. As of now, I don’t see the slightest reason to use it in PvE. WvW zerg may be where the chronomancer is the best addition to the mesmer.

well yes that is true, but Mesmers are 1200 Range, you arnt going to really be near the actual Damage itself, I can see Proffessions as a whole Sinking into the Abyss at a time rather then just skillsets.

Lemme give u a Example from WoW… the Paladin, Started good in vanilla, Got reworked in WoTLK, It now sucks Every expansion in PvE cause they cant buff it because of PvP reasons and everytime they try it turns into a FoTM before being Nerfed back to useless, we will see this happen in GW2 now..

Something gets Strong in PvP it gets Nerfed Direct effect on proffessions capability in PvE and becomes useless, Suddenly We start rejecting those proffessions Because they just dont stand up and a Pure disadvantage to have in our teams. same other way round when something gets too much DPS they nerf it and it loses everything in PvP.

by assumption these weapon sets are to pidgeon hole us so they Can treat them differently if everyones forced to run staff ele in PvE then they know not to buff/nerf it for PvP reasons and leave it as it is… where if both ran on D/D they’d be constantly nerfing/buffing it conflicting with the other side of the game.

Do i think a Sustain Mesmer will be taken while Elementalists get sustain and Support all while doing more DPS then the Mesmer No, i dont i think Mesmers will be taken as Glass Cannons to do pure DPS While the elementalists Supply the main portion of support.

MMOs cannot be devided between PvE and PvP they are going to have to pick one Side they Want to focus on and let the other Rot as its swished around all the time between speccs and Rerolling to be decent in the raids or PvP content, thats how every MMO goes, this is why MoBAs are sooo successful offering Nothing but PvP to that community that gets out of MMO PvP.

They need to DUplicate the speccs into 2 so they can buff PvP versions without affecting PvE Versions or this will be doomed from the get go, the only reason why the balance is so close atm is Because theres no PvE to worry about when it comes to nerfing/buffing.

Ur example the Reaper is a Perfect example, Its too slow for pvp, Its just not going to function pvp wise in anything more then maybe the new shroud til People QQ enough on the shroud and it gets Nerfed Destroying it for both PvE and PvP Players, til new players die to reapers GS Attacks because how hard they hit every swing QQ til Reapers Damage is Lowered to match other proffessions which will again destroy it for both pve and pvp players

PvP = a Boat of QQ about one anothers Proffessions being OP, the Devs will take so much of it and it’ll be shown in Nerfs done because of this, right now your going to get the backlash of this effect forcing you to play specific things cause what u want to play just wont work and wont be usuable… U cant run the same weapon sets for pve and pvp they are two completely different demands.

nah, chronomancer is Prolly the strongest of the ones seen so far, Reaper Lacks mobility which makes it a easy kill, how is ment to survive if its taken 50k Dmg before it reachs a target? Not to mention the animations are so slow they’ll be the easiest specialization in the game to Simply evade/block or Reflect. This games balance is basically on the shoulders of mobility.

Tempest is just too Easily countered everything they have shouts INTERUPT ME, not to mention the Utility skills dont measure up too cantrips in the slightest, so unless those warhorn skillsets are just ten times stronger in damage and utility then Offhand Focus or Dagger you wont even Use the specialization for anything.

Alacrity is going to be OP, Double Shattering is going to be OP the Increased Sustain on a proffession that can hit for 22k Damage in 1 hit will be OP… atm what stops Mesmers breaking is the fact how squishy they really can be once focus’d, adding sustain to them will litterally Decrease that counter which will cause them to become broken.

Chronomancers going to hard nerfed within a week of release… Reaper will be nerfed within a week cause the QQ will be in Masses and tempests will get buffed making them strong.

Grimreaper.5370:

I can’t help but find the tempest design to look underwhelming from a PvP perspective…

-Shouts probably wont replace Cantrips

-Being locked out of an attunement for 16+ seconds means very little use of overcharge, being locked out of attunements for longer than you already are is poor game design when it comes to the functionality of the elementalist.

-The majority didn’t want warhorn, we got warhorn. Hoped that warhorn could at least provide a unique playstyle, warhorn turns out to be another support based off hand weapon which doesn’t seem to offer a whole lot different compared to focus or OH dagger besides a water field and some ally boon application.

-If I try and live in a delusional fantasy world then maybe wash the pain away will see some use but lets be honest whos going to want to get rid of healing signet? Even if Wash the Pain away turns out to actually be decent when considering your allies, how many people will be selfless enough to use it?

Like a lot of you competitive spvp people I was really hoping to break out of the support role and play around with a sword main hand… I can live with this not being the case but after also seeing what the Temepest brings to the table I’m left very disappointed, I was hoping for something a bit more complex.

Anet, I plead you! Please reconsider the route you’re taking tempest!

tbh, be thankful, the fact its underwhelming means the proffession will be buffed and brought up, Proffessions such as the Necromancer and Mesmer are going to just have their Elites nerfed repeatively til they are worthless to any circumstance.

So tbh your one of the few proffessions who will see any long term play from their Elites tbh.

TyPin.9860:

Zenith.7301:

I don’t understand how anyone can say Chronomancer is the coolest when they effectively got the least new toys.

Alacrity, Quickness on shatter, slow, slow and slow, F5 and Wells. To state only a few things that may be huge game changers. The number of new toys is unimportant, the quality is what matters.

this is why:

Chronomancer Mechanically advanced ALOT:

the capability to bring Shattered illusions back for a second round Opens TONS of new Plays and set ups.

the New buff added Alacrity, which is New to the game providing tons of useful plays and capabilities allowing mesmers to actually control how often their team can get out those muchly needed abilities at the right times.

The capability to reverse everything that happens to you will add SOOO MANY new playstyles New Counter plays New Capabilities and More Strategys and Gameplay, it is going to change how u play the Mesmer COMPLETELY.

More Risk for the Rewards: the Counterplay introduced against Mesmers will bring out that higher Risk for those reward su get in the end, a Mesmer can now effectively either Kill it self or Kill Everything.

mesmers new mechanics are so much more depthful Increasing the actual Counterplays and Plays by masses..

Reaper is Just a Copy of the Deathknight that now every game has, they’ve just moved everything to melee and given u a Hammer weapon set with Greatsword Looks, it has no Mobility no Unique capability or been given anything that Will truly Affect how the game plays at all, its Just going to become ur Next hard hitting GS Wielder theres tons of them in the game already… it has no real impact on the Actual Synergy or way teams play out.

Tempest is again Not providing anything that will affect anything else but themselves, it holds some new interesting playstyles but thats as far as it goes and how limited the playstyles are we dont know yet due to some of them being… Very unseeable in PvP capability.

Dragonhunter, imho is the second most interesting, but it doesnt hold any gamebreaking concepts it just looks Amazing and holds alot of interesting ways you can play it specially when synergizing it with other weapon sets.

so no as Far as Gamebreaking and Teamplay changing Chronomancer has the most punch and Impact, however if its nerfed into the floor instantly and becomes useless, nobody knows… Likelyhood is in actual gameplay it’ll be useless due to harsh Nerfs that will defintly come in.

Then again Reaper will suffer this same fate..

So u may aswell Disreguard both these Elites, u wont use them after a Month of the elites release..

Tempest and Dragonhunter are the only two builds that can possibly see any long term play.

Levetty.1279:

Now that everything about Tempest has been revealed, yes Chrono is outclassed. Ele can now pretty much do everything we can to support better on top of what it could do before.

I disagree, we are moving into a era where the game has both PvE and PvP different weapon sets must suit different game modes to perserve balance, thats just a limitation u have to accept while Demanding PvE in the game, this will happen, U will prolly use chronomancers wells, but not the weapon set in pve.. u dont need survcivability you need DPS..

I mean sure u do to a extent but i feel like giving up two weapon skills for blocks just wont be effective Outside support roles, which elementalist will prolly take the majority of for healing purposes, Alacrity is there with or without the shield so theres no need for u to drop ur Damage for the Shield, the Shield will prolly see More pvp use for its sustain.

Same as tempest will see more PvE use then PvP as PvP is much more unpredictable making Overloads not so useful most of the time not to mention the lockouts and 5 seconds in 1 attunements makes it impossible to use in some situations.

this is a Pve/PvP limitation and its in Every MMO which supports both styles of play, its something we arnt used to but now must accept.

i think we’re all going to suffer the worries of the OP. from both a PvP and PvE Point of view, i beleive the reason it has taken Anet to put proper PvE into Guild Wars 2 is because it will bring out the typical MMO Argument.

throughout MMOs which incoperate both PvP and PvE on a Supported level, have always had the issue with certain builds and set ups being for specific areas, I.E Shield, Shields amazing in PvP it offers sustain which always will be needed so this will making Chronomancer 100% in one of the weapon slots to be fully used, however in PvE where DPS is what matters for the Mesmer u arnt going to use the shield, it’ll provide no damage, however the wells will be used as they do Damage and Add support.

So sadly, some of these Elites will be PvE Focus’d (the Tempest) where it is another support, now pvP already have a D/X build, but in PvE they use staff not D/D so this will give a D/X build for PvErs also with the l;ayout it’ll always be more viable in the PvE world then the PvP, having Dead set mechanics like Overload in a Unpredictable enviroment is weaker.

Chronomancer seems reasonably split, it seems it wont be used in power runs however in Raids and stuff support will be needed and Chronomancer does provide Alacrity which would become needed in bigger events, however they will prolly lose DPS having this and Would be taken for more of the role of support then a DPS. due to the brawler play shield will bring with additional survivability i think more pvp builds will include in comparison to PvE so it will always be Slightly pvp sided for that reason.

it is going to happen and with the game becoming split between PvE and PvP more and More builds are going to been thrown out of meta and Just Unusuable in parts of the game as the devs can no longer just focus on balancing for pvp from this expansion onwards… its going to bring both good and bad to the game, Mostly bad for strict PvP players, We’re all going to feel alot more pidgeon holed with whats happening.

but the Limitations on Some weapon sets being Useless, and the Inevitable outcome that these Elites will be Unusuable for part of the game weather thats WvW PvP or PvE is something we will have to accept, Anet cannot Balance 1 Specc to work in 2 Completely different styles without Duplicating them 1 for pvp and 1 for pve so u can swap across to PvP orintated versions of the Speccs or pvE orintated versions, which likely will never happen, balancing would just consume so much having balance Doubles of Every proffessions weapon sets.. Specially on proffessions such as the Elementalist.

With Elementalist becoming the FULL Support, I cant see u using the shield in pve, I can see u using the specc for Wells (Wells provide the alacrity too u dont need the shield to do so) but u’ll be taking something with More DPS then the 2 blocks.

Zenith.7301:

Have we even seen solid tooltip numbers for shield phantasms? It’s also worth mentioning that shield phantasm is the only phantasm besides iwarden and izerker that cleaves.

And the advantage of shield phantasm is that unlike iwarden its attack is neither stationary nor is it a long channel that fails to complete because the phantasm immediately dies to cleaves.

Doesn’t the shield also slow? Slow is rather powerful against bosses.

I feel like in all honesty, In games with supported PvE bosses are generally immune to slows and things which may transfer into GW2 when they go out to make it more challanging etc etc, so i feel theres a chance slows maybe wasted on bosses.

so no i feel theres a chance that the shield as a weapon set will be useless to a PvEr the traitline will still be good though i feel this is why Anet have seperated these mechanics from its weapon set in all honesty, as they know some weapon set skills wont be useful in PvE or PvP where things such as Utility skills and Trait line bonus’s / New Core mechanics will always be useful in both.

U will use Chronomancer as a PvEr the Utility from wells will always be useful in most situations but i doubt u will use the shield.

Zenith.7301:

Drayos.8759:

tbh, Mesmers are currently very strong, and some traits need nerfing, PU for example which is currently making mistakes sooo forgiving, but i wouldnt deem the proffession as “overpowered” really, PU Carries alot of Bad mesmers but thats all.

I don’t understand these kinds of posts. PU is useless in any competitive pvp, it’s useless in PvE, it’s useless in large scale WvW.

And because it annoys some dumb WvW duelists/roamers, it should be nerfed? This game’s pvp should be balanced around spvp and teamfights, not this constant torrent of tears from duelists.

It isnt “useless” lol, Stealth is a Escape from any situation.. u can walk in kitten everything up and then stealth for free for quite a lengthy time, Also the boon stacking means When u initate back into them from Stealth ur Damage is going to extensively buffed for Virtually doing nothing.

It rewards passive playstyles relying on a Mechanic which increases the duration to something which a Enemey player cannot react too due to the mechanics of stealth.

Having stealth is forgiving to begin with, the Instant escape from any situation will always give the proffession the ability to escape when he messes up, PU just aids that cause.

P.S COmpetitive players are all using PU, Check out the Metabattle builds lol PU Shatter mesmer is 100% PU and is Copied from tier 1 player builds from tournaments etc etc, if they werent using it nobody would be listing it, so i feel like u havnt really Done any research to see if any of the tier 1 mesmers actually run it and just blindly yelled it Underestimating the capability of the trait.

apharma.3741:

I hope Anet takes their time and brings things down slowly. A good place to start is the stats and to scale the damage aspect down a little. Another good place to look is that horrible torch trait.

we all know that wont happen :P…

They’ll just Nerf every skill and Trait we have by 25% and hope the proffession dont drop too underpowered.. then it’ll spend another expansion being the underdog lolololol I feel for the players who have picked Mesmer up because its strong but FoTM Rerolling, so they deserve it.

tbh, Mesmers are currently very strong, and some traits need nerfing, PU for example which is currently making mistakes sooo forgiving, but i wouldnt deem the proffession as “overpowered” really, PU Carries alot of Bad mesmers but thats all.

Ithamir.5928:

The elite skill of the elementalist’s specialization, Tempest, is: “Rebound!” (Elite) – Cause nearby allies to have 25% faster skill recharge. Steps on the toes of the mesmer’s elite specialization, Chronomancer, special effect: Alacrity – 66% Skill Recharge Rate.

With the elementalist and very likely the tempest as well, having superior dps to mesmer and chronomancer. It will further diminish the unique role of the chornomancer. For an existing example, look at the Guardian’s Wall of Reflect and the new(ish) elite skill “Feel My Wrath!”. While a mesmer can both reflect and provide quickness (and even slow) better than a guardian can, a guardian is more desirable mainly since he has superior dps.

Hence, while a chronomancer can provide superior recharge rate for his team, he’ll be less desirable than a tempest with much better dps. Which can still provide quicker recharge, albeit not as much. It is a much unneeded competition, that can only harm the chornomancer.

Disclaimer: I main a mesmer. I wrote this with only PvE in mind. Anyone who also mains a mesmer and plays fractals, know where I’m coming from.

the Tempest is 60seconds and is no where near actually threatening imho, the Tempest has many flaws, one being its Overload mechanic is pretty weird to deal with as it locks them out of areas etc etc.

Also i dont think many will use it cause of the fact its a 1 time thing every 60seconds, it’ll be useful to a warrior if no mesmer is around to help, but i feel overall the chronomancer will be stronger then the Tempest.

tbh, i disagree, the attunements are the base proffessions mechanic, nothing should Replace that its vital to keeping a proffession in its core and offering second playstyles which bypass that completely would just cause so many complications, the fact is 1 will always be better then the other and power players would be forced to constantly swap between these two playstyles no matter what they want.

Keeping proffessions on one Playstyle at core is Much better then offering multiple ways as Power play just throws players back and fourth stopping players mastering their proffessions or getting to any reasonable level of capability with it when they cant Just learn one thing.

the Secondary resources are created to give the proffessions complications to deal with, Instead of things like Mana to give them these other limitations they have to deal with i feel removing this would not only make Elementalist Easymode but would take the ENTIRE purpose from the proffession we are from ground up Jack of Trades the Everquest 1 Bard, take that from us and through and through our capability at anything vastly drops.

Balancing attuements to play just as well Solo would make them Brokenly overpowered when combined using everything will always win i feel like we should just keep proffessions using their resources and keep them on the playstyle tracks created for so long.

i dont mean it badly, but thats why the game has multiple proffessions, not everyone loves the same thing… there are plenty of proffessions which do not swap attunements constantly.

xarallei.4279:

Guizao.4167:

Elementalist is the strongest class? Every profession has equal potentials.

Well, that’s simply not true. Any ranger and necro will tell you.

That said, OP why would buffing underperforming classes be a bad thing? They need the buffs.

Rangers are no longer bad, Just saying Loads are now jumping on the proffession its really strong since the patch, so to say they still suffer is a Lie.

The issue with necromancer has existed LONG before tempest, to now see a reveal and be like WOAH! guys WOAH! what about necro they so bad?! why u giving this to tempest???? Im sorry but its just ridiculous to pull up that argument, the proffession has been bad for ages and it isnt ONLY tempest which proves that so just isnt a valid argument really.

Kidel.2057:

Insane and gamebreaking. Pulsing area blind? What the… and that huge fire field? How long does it last? You can blast it like 6 times alone.

WP is going to be happy, but those are serious issues. Ele is already the strongest class, so those things are going to provoke a ele nerf or a buff of all the other classes (maybe after a couple of years…), both bad things.

If classes are too strong, content is not fun.

Most ridiculous thing i’ve ever read.

How is elementalist “The strongest proffession” seriously? we’re locked into ONE BUILD atm, we litterally are forced into 0 Diversity because how little really does work in the proffession sure we’re good at something and that makes us a top tier pvp proffession but no where near broken.

we can even be D/D Sustain and Decent Damage or a full bunker, we have 0 Competitive Condi builds 0 Effective Power builds…. we’re litterally forced into One Jack of Trades which has abit of everything but not as powerful as any other proffession can really excel in.

The burn field? its called Moving out of it…. its a Pathway of Fire, do u just Stand in our fire expecting it not to do any damage cause ur lazy? No, it isnt like we have incredible range we’d have to follow u OFF the field to do anymore damage so effectively MOVING is a complete counter to the effects. we’re giving up Ring of Fire for it anyway lol.

Dust stom?… it does look strong very strong in situations, wouldnt say OP though – Most can clear condis if it was to effect them too much and also tbh its within a area again so u can easily just move away from it, we’re getting some good AoEs which will require u to actually move yes… that doesnt make it broken.

it does NOT provoke Nerfs to Elementalist, With the amount elementalist will lose it actually takes ALOT from the elementalist which people like u deem “strongest”.. Alot of now muichly needed skills are dissapearing without offhand dagger, it isnt like they’ve moved any of those Amazing skills across to keep us using them, the inital loss of those Will put us far beneath the belt so that none of this will effect us.

Remember, u have to look at a Elementalist with only 3 of its attacks, (without offhand dagger) to see what areas will be good/bad not Imagine it with BOTH Weapons and Stack these Ontop cause thats just NOT happening, Were REPLACING our off hand weapon with this new one not combining them.

Kidel.2057:

xarallei.4279:

That said, OP why would buffing underperforming classes be a bad thing? They need the buffs.

of course, but if all classes become like ele/tempest then it’s bad. Atm ele can reach 17k dps, now pulsing area blind lol. Not even squishy anymore

the Pulsing blind wont even have that much of a Effect in PvE, its two pulses with a huge CD like 2 strikes will make that massive difference in its Survival lol, seriously if ur going to actually try to press this It’ll only make a Impact in PvP, we all know that, Challanging Content, THe bosses will likely be immune to Blinds etc etc as part of mechanics Dont know if u noticed BUT EVERY GAME HAS THAT STANDARD!!!

this will only effect PvP and Im seeing With the Loss of Mobility a Loss in its Sustain And becoming hugely countered by Mesmers and Thief it’ll Suffer Nothing close to a nerf for this, it isnt Overpowered or broken.

Against Monsters in PvE, ur ment to win, the designs are for u to WIN, so why would it matter lol.

After seeing what the tempest will and will not do, i see it isnt a zerker build as i hoped but yet another brawling styled weapon set, which isnt solely based on support but offers alot of utility for both itself and others.

Elite

Right the elite everyones saying its bad, but no imho no it really isnt, to offer Low CD for anything is pretty good, extending that to the entire team within teamfights or even solo play this will have many uses to bring up important skills such as ur healing or a cantrip/shout back quicker.

Weapon Skills

as we saw some of the skills we are getting are utility or support, but even then we are getitng some really nice damaging capabilities in majority the attunements which will offer some nice stuff.

overall i like the skills, it isnt a zerker build as i suspected but it is offering Damage it is Offering Utility and everything Elementalists do actually need, i dont feel like this transition will be impossible and i feel assured we will get a chance where all of these will become useful

Overloads

I among others (although i have said from the start i think this will be good) were worried how situational these really would become, ALot of players stated Mesmers have 1200 Interupts Thief has Spammable Interupts, how badly will this affect us, well by the looks of things they have looked after this correctly it doesnt seem to be such a vunerable state as we once thought.

Im not seeing anything to prevent these interupts entirely so far, maybe they need it in beta to see how badly this will affect us before they launch any early changes to our traits or something to prevent this being such as Easy thing for certain proffessions to counter.

however defintly potiental in these getting Super strong and becoming very useful with a high risk high reward factor, its always nice to have those things in ur belt for situations.

What we’re losing

We arnt getting anything to replace the mobility we’re losing and nothing to really fend ourselves off utilikty sided, no invuns no mobility no reflects no blocks or anything,

we seem to be losing survivability in areas, which for a front line specializations seems very odd they shouldnt be taking these things completely away from us, i mean the mobility loss is replaced by heck loads of swiftness everywhere but i was expecting to see some Invuns or Reflects among the new capabilities specially looking at the earth side or Shouts (fully offensive shouts might make them too situational)

What we’re gaining

However, We are getting some really neat things too, Instant might stacks will be amazing to Might stacking builds and it even does go to ur team (At the end of the day we want our abilities to work in more then one game mode) Our earth overload is a invun so we do have that.

with the CD Reduction on overloads through traits, i feel this will assure many that we do have a way to bring the high Costs down on our overloads putting it on the same tier as our Might stacking capability might be harsh alittle (then again even as strong as some things in shouts look i dont know if we can afford to lose cantrips if the case then CDR will defintly triumph this talent might push us further towards cantrips though in itself.

My opinon

im sure there are LOADS that hate this, however im sure there are LOADS that love this, the thing is with any sort of Introduction to classes or proffessions in Any MMO this will cause some to reroll their mains some to stick others to come to the proffession/class this will have a affect on the Most and Least popular proffessions in the game it is perfectly natural that some will turn away from the proffession or come to the proffession seeing these changes, Anet are never going to make something EVERYONE Loves, if they did there would be 0 need to create anymore then 2 proffessions and Labelling them “ranged” and “melee”

My opinon, I love the look of the specialization it does seem strong in multiple fields and seems to have good things for all game modes, it’ll be very different to what i currently know, but that isnt always bad change is good, so yes im looking forward to seeing this coming into the game during betas and to see how this evolves and what its final release will be in comparison to now.

Bryzy.2719:

Arobain.8274:

another elitist

I see wot u did ther m8

I don’t need to see the livestream or read about any more of the traits to know that I don’t wanna play an elementalist with a sodding warhorn and more support skills :’) GG not being given sword.

hmmm wheres the support? everything we’re getting is PURE damage lmfao, what the buff mechanic in the Elite? every proffession is getting some sorta Useful buff to help everyone out, not just elementalist.

Tempest is a Zerker built Specc, it’ll be used for our all in builds with alot less survivability as a trade off, im sorry but its ridiculous to look at Overload and Singularity and assume support, they have NOTHING but pure damage!

Kodiak.3281:

Remedy.3429:

Mark my words, Tempest will return dagger/x to PvE.

Oh I’m marking your words and rest assured there’s a very active speed clear community who will be doing the math on how actually useful it will be for PvE.

That said I don’t need to have a live stream presentation on a dog kitten to know it stinks and I shouldn’t pick it up. I have pre-existing knowledge and thought that tells me all I need to know about it.

The same is applied here. I don’t need a stream to explain to me why a front line Elementalist won’t work, I have game play knowledge that understands why current front line classes work and enough of a preview to know that we’re not getting anything that gives us those necessary front line tools.

But stream in 3.5 hours! I can’t wait to be able to factually discuss the new Tempest skills/traits and this ridiculous, “Wait and see!” argument no longer can be used.

its not a “wait and see!” Argument, its simply the fact that 1) Numbers arnt balanced til its release, you only seeing what the specc will do, not Numbers etc etc, everything can be buffed, Look at rev, it Sucked now its prolly 500x More powerful after the beta weekend, this will take place with all the Elite specializations too, Taking the “balance” of the Proffessions elite is Stupid, U wont know the balance Meta or Strengths UNTIL the expansion.

this merely shows u what to expect gameplay wise, Animations Spell Effects and the Mechanics of the Proffession nothing to do with what metas or game modes it’ll fit or its balance….

it would be amazing if this was all a trolling act and the Ele actually got 2 weapons a Sword and Warhorn for the elite specialization

I know it wouldnt happen but seriously it’d be GENIUS to troll the community THAT hard xD.

Jonandu.2073:

This Elite Spec is so so awful. I could give 2 million reasons why, but why should I when my words will go on deaf ears… This proves they haven’t listened to the community at all… We have a Elite Spec based on support!!!!!! Everything else we have is SUPPORT!!!! This doesn’t even change the way the ele plays!!!!! This is just Horrible. I am glad I didn’t preorder, maybe I will be back next x-pac… See you guys when GW2 The Awakening of Jormag comes out, than may we get a true weapon and a true Elite spec.

Right lemme start at the beginning

they only have ONE Supportive ability the Elite, the shouts are Damage, the Abilities are all Pure damage, it is OBVIOUS that the kitten Elite is a Zerker will people kitten about it being “support” it doesnt even LOOK SUPPORT let alone fecking have anything in it worth support.

YES the elite is a CD Reduction, Just like Chronomancers have Alacrity, everyone has been given buffs in ALL elites so far it hasnt made them support, dont be so ridiculous to try claim Just because its a warhorn it has ANY Reason to be linked with Support.

How is Singularity Overloading Any of the Shouts Wildfire or Dust storm have ANY capability in Supporting?…. how are they even LINKED to support, it was obvious there would be a SLICE of Support in elementalists, Water is SUPPORT and ALL weapons have supportive/healing capabilities within the Water attunement.

Its a ZERKER Specc, if u want to finally not be a Sustain bunker with Decent Damage and Want to blow people up like other proffessions do this is your Specialization if your really not going to buy it BECAUSE it has a element of support in it then ur ridiculous, Elementalists have and Always will be a Jack of All Trades holding something for EVERY role, this is to make up for the lack of Weapon Swap among other things.

PlatinumMember.5274:

meeflak.9714:

Jonandu.2073:

This Elite Spec is so so awful. I could give 2 million reasons why, but why should I when my words will go on deaf ears… This proves they haven’t listened to the community at all… We have a Elite Spec based on support!!!!!! Everything else we have is SUPPORT!!!! This doesn’t even change the way the ele plays!!!!! This is just Horrible. I am glad I didn’t preorder, maybe I will be back next x-pac… See you guys when GW2 The Awakening of Jormag comes out, than may we get a true weapon and a true Elite spec.

Doesn’t change the way ele plays?….. I’m done trying. I’ve tried too hard to speak against this ignorance.

You are free to believe that people are speaking out of ignorance. Your comment reads like someone who hates it that people have a different opinion about a toy he likes and is taking it too personal, aka “I am done trying” crap.

the tempest sucks, you can disagree or be done trying to convince us that it doesn’t suck. You can even stick your head in the sand to avoid listening to our complaints, but it wont make the tempest suck any less.

Explain then please, How does the tempest suck? please give us a Indetail Valid Correct statement and Gameplay Proof that u can use to back up ur Accusation Against a Specc which does not even Exist in the game right now? that is Completely balanced for a COMPLETELY different to the expansion then the current one? that is applied to a completely different Power creep Stat Stacking Runes Armour Defence Damage %s to the current one u play on..

U act as if this Elite is for the CURRENT game and it isnt, you have no idea WHAT will work and will not work UNTIL you see what changes Numbers wise in the expansion so dont act as if u know EXACTLY what will and will not happen, u know maybe 3% of Some Mechanics being added and a Few Elite Speccs.

Numbers wise, this does NOT have any more negatives then any other proffessions elite currently has, Reaper = No mobility no Leap and without melee range cannot actually do ANYTHING useful, Dragonhunter is some sorta Combination of Support and Ranger Pushed into 1 Skillset and Chronomancer Looks like some sorta Buffing Supporter with some More shatters. Which boon stripping would nullify instantly.

U know nothing and u have no stats to prove anything ur saying.

Calling it bad now isnt really… Excusable right what has been given has shown we are being given Resistance to most things During the cast time

100% Reduced Conditional Damage
55% Reduced Direct Damage
Stability for first 2 Seconds.
Takes 2/3 interupts to break.

So no fully casting isnt Impossible, Now tempest does have capability in PvP, but i feel like it’ll be more WvW Focus’d Because:

how the Tempest is going to work will well have capability 1v1 providing ur not going to headbutt ur hardest hitting spells and hope they go off in time, during the teamfight when u will want to call on that AoE Capability ur going to need a team which actually will take notice of u using these spells and React when the team try to stop you.

you’ll also need to track what spells are being used and capable of knowing what proffessions are currently there fighting you, ur not going to want to slap on the Longest channeling One (5seconds) Against 3 Mesmers who are targetting you, Cause they’ll Just spam Mantra Disrupt you til it breaks it off of you.

REMEMBER also

Although the mechanics are pretty set, the Balancing is not, things can be buffed Just like the revenant nobody saw anything in it til they saw Shiro and things which was coming for it.

20second Lock out maybe written now, doesnt mean it’ll stay that high, imho 15seconds would be better.

Fresh air Resets Air Instantly, so just make use of the Elemental Air more as it seems to be the way its pushing us when going into this zerker build, i hope the abilities on warhorn wont be centered around using those Overloads as it isnt always possible to manage… to have those as ONLY a bonus would be nice and to see some nice Fire field Finishers to synergize, and Some mobility to make up for what we lose on the off hand Dagger.

Also like to see More Burst capability in the 8 skills

I’d just wait for tomorrow to see whats Really happening.

Fact is, Every proffession released on paper was called bad, Every Elite was raged on apart from Reaper but theres just the ongoing joke it’ll be weak and rubbish if anything NEcro is born to be the underdog of the elite speccs, to hold a specc with 0 mobility 0 leaps and Hammer Slow attacks is just going to be Kited every 5 seconds not to mention focus’d the hell out of..

Dont fear, Tempest might not be as good as Chronomancer, but it’ll never be as bad as Final result Reaper

FrownyClown.8402:

I expect it to be terrible in 1v1 fights. I do see potential for it as an on point bunker in pvp.
For wvw its kind of a waste for on the move waters since staff water fields are normally passively blasted anyways on the engages and you still need to retreat for empowers.
All in all, I feel it is going to be overshadowed by better builds.

imho we cant possibly know that without knowing the 8 skills we get with warhorn, Zerker is the Meta and this is super Zerker focus’d with massive damage, providing the theme runs into the Abilities and aslong as the 8 skills we get are Worth it, we could be strong.

I cant see it outdoing staff on bunker though, Remember this IS our Zerker specc, this is what Every zerker build for the next 3 Years will be, We’re going to have 0 Tanky in this build, it’ll be like Playing a Thief by my thinking tbh.

its the one playstyle our Proffession is actually missing, no matter how much people say we needed sword so badly, We do not have Anything for a actual Zerker all in build, we have Just sustain and bunker builds running left right and centre, so to have this option on the board will actually be really nice.

Im waiting out to see the 8 skills tbh, It looks Melee, but we dont really know much else tbh. the Mechanics will never come out as shown now for any elite tbh, no point taking cast times and CDs etc etc into account til its release, they’ll be changed almost garunteed to the ideas just to show u what the Ability will actually do

Take everything but what the Actual effect is with a grain of salt tbh, I mean we all hated rev saying it sucked…. Yet they COMPELTELY changed it 1 day after Beta… these elites will hit Beta weekend at one point and We’ll Say if its bad or good and they’ll fix it 1 day later in the exact same order…

We’ll be fine, dont doomsday it yet.

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

The new elite shout is so bad I don’t even believe it’s real. It maybe useful in pve – but even then only when you’re in teamspeak. In pvp it’s basically unusable.

25% less recharge isn’t much, it’s only really useful for skills with cooldowns above 2 minutes, i.e. other elites. So eles get an elite that doesn’t even do anything for them. Wow.

“Elite for teamplay? wtf? Dat bad” no it isnt, its a Capability aimed at other playstyles such as premades and Support, not everything has to make u uber tbh…. I’d of prefered a more offensive capability for elite yes, its alittle annoying that they put this down given the fact most of our elites is team giving capability anyway to have a more selfish elite would have been nice.

but it isnt bad, it does have potiental and its place, a very hard place to get to but if ur playing with friends its worth the pick up.

Have u not noticed ALL the reveals of Elites have been Stronger then Generally any proffession is currently?… Thats because these are set for the POWER CREEP of HoT, Which will happen, as the game introduces more and more it happens

Why do u think in WoW they had to physically reduce EVERYTHING, because how ridiculous numbers got lol, bosses had like 500billion hp and your were punching em for a Million a hit, its what happens, Ofcourse there is a reason to play any other proffession.

but you know keep QQIng on a 5 second cast with 2 Seconds of Stability Covering, Which u can just instantly interupt providing u reliese to wait for the stability to wear off, Keep QQIng on the one proffession that CANT blow ur hp out the waters within 3 seconds due to having No Zerker builds currently viable.

Keep QQing on a Proffession that is Litterally Locked into Arcana/Water no matter what they try to do, and referring to that as the Strongest proffession in the game, Yes Elementalists are strong Yes Tempest will be strong, No What they’re doing isnt Unrealistic it does match what other proffessions are getting.

but if u want to ignore the new mechanics for chronomancers being able to Double Shatter on you instantly for Even more Instant damage and able to actually pull their abilities off CD with Alacrity boon and the fact Reapers Can Pull u into them and Forever chill u just off of basic attacks to attack Elementalists about a subject that realistically wont ever happen go for it

Read those Shouts, Litterally they stand NO CHANCE of replacing Cantrips, we’ll be using Cantrips for the next 3 years with or without shout capability, we’re just too squishy and lose too much taking those away, the only way they’ll manage to swap that is litterally Deleting Soothing Disruption and Nerfing both mist form and Armour of Earth pretty hard.

I realistically dont understand how u can be here yelling how overpowered Overloading will be when as u can read 99% ofd elementalists are actually explaining it’ll be rubbish and how weak its going to turn out with those lengths of lockouts, no damage capability will be able to make those cast times irrelevent, specially as they require channeling and can be interupted by any mesmer at 1200.

Overloading will have perks and at times will be crucial and not to mention output alot of damage when we do it right, but we’ll lose ALOT of survivability with this new playstyle, not only do these effects have only 180 Range putting us MUCH closer to the fight then we already are, but we’ll No longer be using Cele Amulets

Also take into account what the proffessions losing taking off hand dagger off.

Fire:
Ring of Fire
Fire grab

Water:
Frozen Aura (goodbye to those trait benefits)
Cleansing wave (Goodbye Condi remover or atleast one of them)

Air
Ride the Lightning (there goes a ton of mobility)
Updraft (one interupt gone AND a evade gone)

Earth:
Earthquake (another interupt out the window)
Churning Earth (not too relevent, long Cast but did put 8 stacks of bleeds out)

not to mention freezing us into Elements will actually Lose us

Regen 1000 Health

Fury 20% Crit

Putting those Elements on actual CDs using Overload will

Lock us out of Sustain (Earth)

Lock us out of Damage (Fire)

Lock us out of Healing (Water)

for Unstated amounts of time, only reason i dont mention air is because they had already stated that the fresh air will actually take Air off CD when using the overload, which means we’ll keep air as a popular swap.

Now take into consideration are any of our mainhands ANY good for Camping a Single attunement

Answer? No it isnt, our main hands support our current playstyle Jack of All Trades, which consists of Constant Attunement swapping to give us exactly what we need to sustain anything, So no this will Reduce our Healing our Sustain and how much we can swap in and out of attunements.

Which means they HAVE to give us something good for all this trade off for using tempest… its basically a must or the elite will be worth dogcrap, it has ALOT to cover in 1 Item set which ALREADY puts mechanics into the game which so far will conflict with our mainhands Mechanics.

nearlight.3064:

lordhelmos.7623:

While it will be god mode in pve, in pvp the entire elite spec is shut down by mantra of distraction.

Most mesmers precast them before going into battle. Unless theres a no out of combat rule to the overcharge mechanic, you could likely begin the channel as you go into a fight. Even if you use them in the fight, mantra mesmers are able to consistently channel their mantras without getting focus fired and chain CCed to death, even though they have no stability at all on a mantra build. Its because of two things, positioning, and protected mantras being baseline that allow them to charge in combat, in high level tournaments with no problem. When you channel a mantra you get +600 toughness during the channel. When tempest channels their overcharge, apparently traits can get enhanced damage mitigation from traited protection (again all the details are unclear). If a mantra mesmer, in marauder or zerker amulet can get a mantra channel off in combat with no problem, then I don’t see any reason why a celestial elementalist would fail to get off if they have good positioning, as they can take so many more hits.

Anyway yeah, so if mesmers have no problem charging mantras in combat, I don’t see how elementalists would have a major problem, especially when the earth one has defiance. Sure it will get interrupted sometimes, but clearly not every time they go for it if they know what they’re doing. Its high risk, high reward, something that elementalists have never had to worry about before given how low risk, high reward their cele builds in pvp have always been.

Sorry but what? Mesmer lost its high risk Back in the patch, i’d love to se ethe risk in 30second invis’s with free boon Regenerations?… I’d love to see the high risk in the current condi builds which pretty much play themselves even with enough survivability… i’d love to see the risk in Just blowing everyones HP Out the waters in 3 hits no matter what armour types they are.

U even destroy ur own hard counter without any problems, let alone dealing with anything else, Risk factor was Killed in mesmer, even half the people who use ur Proffession admit that much, thats the whole reason Mesmers are QQIng hardcore currently due to the reductino in the Skill Floor for the proffession with all these new Shiny Safety nets installed into everything you do.

Elementalists have 0 burst, meaning THey have to actually Fight for more then 3 Seconds to actually win a fight, and Bunkering with a Non-bunker build which the build is almost is harder then 3 hitting everybody lol.

lordhelmos.7623:

The flashy animations are going to be a giant kill me sign for stunlock slayers like war thief and mes.

When I see a solar nimbus on my screen that looks Captain Planet taking a radiation bath in the center of an exploding nuclear reactor, I know who is going to eat my bulls rush > 100 blades

and when you notice they’re reducing your damage by 55% Reducing ur Condi damage by 100% Gaining Stability and If in Earth Will be immune to any crits u manage to pull out, you’ll notice very quickly they wont die lol, we’re already tanky, with those Sorts of Damage reductions u aint got a hope in hell doing anything but causing urself to get focus’d by the entire elementalists team.

Anyone with a brain will use Elementalists as Bait with this new stuff coming out, and ur quickly going to be desolved by Insta-gibbing Thiefs and Mesmers.

If we allowed u not to wield ur weapons how will u ever take on the true Elementalist form:

lucadiro.4519:

And btw in seeing more people complaining, rightly, about the specialization than about the warhorn

THeres nothing wrong with the Specialization, its bringing so much new to the proffession and some of it looks really good, we dont only lack in one field, our capabilities to get to a bursty build has always been very difficult, ALOT have asked for more power orintated elementalists rather then the normal Sustain D/D builds going around currently.

Rahveiz.7461:

You’re godkitten right.
+ ranged weapons are often used in melee atm…

Well tbh, they are xD Currently from HoT the only Ranged Weapon shown so far is a Ranged hammer, so actually tbh ur statement weather was ment as sarcasm or not (not rly sure if it was or not) its true all the same.

lucadiro.4519:

I really dont care about the fact we will get warhorn. I really care and in qqing and will qq more for the fact that arenanet seems forget that elementalist have another main hand. Not only the dagger

Well yes, i’d of preferred to see the Warhorn as a Mainhand weapon not a offhand, but at the end of the day i Suspose we’re still getting more the nany other proffession will be in this so we cant complain so much that they didnt wanna release 12 more skills and instead bring it to 8.

however with Singularity and Overloading coming, With the different effects throughout, and getting Shouts (which hopefully will be rather powerful so we have a other option to not Loading Full Cantrips as we are currently) and the Animations make up for the lack of Aethetics in Warhorns currently..

We kinda asked for it when we Mass Flamed Warhorn :P Anet prolly love all their weapons Equally and Felt the need to prove us wrong when they read all of that hehehe.

and Plus if they would Finally rework Sceptar to be Equal in its own right to the Dagger, a new main hand wouldnt be in such demand tbh, they only need to fix sceptar and they could fix it all together. not that i think that condi damage will have any synergy with whats coming..

the Offhand weapons bringing ALOT of burst damage and Power hits so i cant see Condi being the ebst thing to run with it, given that i love Dagger mainhand and Feel like i prefer what warhorns bringing to what the Sword was datamined to bring, i mean the Skillset for Sword looked rubbish even if only half complete, i dont want more Sustain to be put into the Elementalist via Evades.

I wanna Powerhouse Nukage!

at the end of the day, Rerolls was inevitable, they’re changing things, in every MMO not everyones happy with the evolution of their proffession they loved before, Rerolling is a common thing in the starts of Expansion

and Between the people wanting rev to be their new main to others who love the other Elites some of the other proffessions are happening, im sure between ALL the proffessions people will be changing mains and making Revs to become their mains from the get go, and thats fine.

Not everyone will love the same thing throughout everything that happens to it, but thats how it is, If u dislike wha tthey do to one proffession u look into another u can love not simply Demand Reverting the entire thing.

Stop with the “OMG IT ISNT A SWORD QQ” trains, jesus, ur complaint was a lack of a Melee Weapon, the Warhorn is OBVIOUSLY a melee weapon, 180 Range on singularity, The fact ALL the overloads are based Around you, shows that this is a melee weapon,

Ur getting your Melee weapon for all the Melee action you want, this is just pure QQ over aethetics, but at the end of the day Sword Wielding Mages would look stupid anyway, Swords are for Precise attacks and Elementalists are about Setting everything on Fire and Blowing kitten up with Electricity, Nothing to do with Precision. Warhorn fits the proffession better in every fashion and Nothing will change that.

Even Hammer would fit a Elementalist Before a sword.

lucadiro.4519:

In sure a lot of people here will be glad to hear from you something about scepter warhorn sinergy

It wont have any synergy, Sceptar Just sucks lol, by the pure looks from the info on it this is going to be a 100% Burst Melee Ranged weapon set, So will come More in line with Shorter ranged weapons such as the dagger.

Dagger mainhand will stay in… we’ll Just run around like Necromancers now, with the Dagger/Warhorn saying that, Necros playstyle is ALOT of fun, so im fully welcoming this new weapon set not to mention both the new mechanics look awesome as a whole.

Raif.9507:

Drayos.8759:

lordhelmos.7623:

While it will be god mode in pvp, the entire elite spec is shut down by mantra of distraction.

how do u even know that is the case without any insight of the specc? Lol. Ur Just making stuff up now and throwing at the fact he does not have a Sword, lmfao you have no idea what will and will not counter it til the preview goes live.

Reaper will be SLow as hell and shut down by merely being ranged and capable of kiting, people will still be using it in pvp and it prolly still work in a way, Just because ONE proffession counters it, doesnt make it useless Everything NEEDS to have a counter.

It’s not 1 counter, its multiple. There are a ton of interrupts in the game that are spammable and on low cooldowns. Mantra of Distraction is just 1 that has no cast time or animation, but there are plenty of others in game that are on meta builds that will make the Overload something you want to use sparingly and only when you’re sure you can get it off.

yes but thiefs spammable Daze on pistol, Trolls Every proffession tbh, It Disables abilities for some time which would affect anyone and everyone the exact same, but yes i can reasons why it wont be sometihng u Just hit at any moment you want for it does have alot of problems..

but saying this, High risk skills are generally the best, also tbh we arnt the only one running the risk if we cast something to be focus’d Squishy proffessions like thief generally get blown up for doing it badly.

PlatinumMember.5274:

lordhelmos.7623:

Drayos.8759:

lordhelmos.7623:

While it will be god mode in pvp, the entire elite spec is shut down by mantra of distraction.

how do u even know that is the case without any insight of the specc? Lol. Ur Just making stuff up now and throwing at the fact he does not have a Sword, lmfao you have no idea what will and will not counter it til the preview goes live.

Calling it now though, tempest will be interrupt food until changes are made months after launch. Right now armor of earth and mist form are the only skills giving you a safe channel and is rather save those for safe stomp/res.

D/d will live on though. I will have fun wrecking pve with this spec. Tempest will be the penultimate speed clear boss

I suspect all elite specs will get the nerfs they deserve later.

D/D will still be useful, war horn was never really in competition with /d. Tempest trait line will be useful in PvP to give elementalist higher amounts of protection duration. I foresee Water, arcane and tempest.

In PvE if they actually push through with smarter AI, which i highly doubt it, it might not be as viable.

only if they’re actually Overpowered, with those sorts of channeling and risks i doubt Tempest will ever be considered Overpowered,

We havnt seen the tempests abilities though, so we dont know what it’ll actually do outside of these new mechanics, it may just generally outdo the offhand Dagger ability wise, also im sure the traits will cater to the long casts on the Overloads.

lordhelmos.7623:

While it will be god mode in pvp, the entire elite spec is shut down by mantra of distraction.

how do u even know that is the case without any insight of the specc? Lol. Ur Just making stuff up now and throwing at the fact he does not have a Sword, lmfao you have no idea what will and will not counter it til the preview goes live.

Reaper will be SLow as hell and shut down by merely being ranged and capable of kiting, people will still be using it in pvp and it prolly still work in a way, Just because ONE proffession counters it, doesnt make it useless Everything NEEDS to have a counter.