Guild Wars 2

JUST CURIOUS

if necros are so bad, why arn’t the developers doing anything to balance things out and make us more viable?

I can only think of two answers

1) the developers dont want a balanced game

2) necros dont suck. you guys just dont know how to use them well enough.

having watched the PvP tourney, and how abjured lost, does this show that right now in organized 5v5s, necros have no place in PvP?
seeing how the enemy focus and tear down the necro in the finals so easily.

Main character name : Eremiteangel
Account name : EremiteAngel.9765
Favorite game mode (eg. WvW/PvP/PvE) : WvW
Server : Tarnished Coast
Number of Necromancers (if you have more than 1) : 1

How about Reaper’s precision?
is it a reliable way to get our lifeforce up?

Crius.5487:

EremiteAngel.9765:

Personally I think it is legit. You cut the head of and the rest die with it.

Unless your guild is a hydra—cut off one head and two more shall grow.

you have a good point…but I have only seen this happen once on TC…in 1yr+ of game play…
the commander dropped and immediately a new commander tag popped up…once…in 1 yr+

I got a very easy solution for this.

Every other class fights on the same terms against anyone that resets. You reset and heal back, every class also resets and heal back. and all the cool downs get reset and everyone starts off equal again.

EXCEPT THE NECRO.

they lose lifeforce that they cannot regain easily.

Solution:

Lifeforce refills to max when necros are out of combat. Like Health. So every time a thief resets, a necro’s lifeforce also regenerates back to the max so the next time the thief engages again, we fight on equal terms as when we first started as well.

@Cogbyrn

I hate to say this, but I fully agree with you.

Actually having played 1600+ hours on my necro mostly roaming alone in WvW, I already came to the same conclusion as you did.

I just couldn’t BEAR to admit it.

Unlike other classes that can still fight on equal terms against a thief that resets and reengages many times, a necro can’t because a necro is dependent on lifeforce which drains with each engagement and is not easily replenished if the thief knows what he is doing.

I just couldn’t bear the thought that a necro can never win against a patient thief…

what I do nowadays is as you advised…I teleport away if they blink far enough to go out of combat against me…

They run…I run…nobody gets to kill nobody…

well i see 90% of the posts here did not answer my questions >.<

I think most of you are concerned about whether it is right or wrong to commander snipe rather than whether it is a good strategy/easy to execute/what are the effects on the enemy zerg

Personally I think it is legit. You cut the head of and the rest die with it.

I play a carrion/dire necro in wvw.
solo roam.
sometimes I run into thieves that have at least 2 stun breaks and commit into the fight only when their stun breaks are up.
and every few seconds they will blink out of range or out of combat and just shadow you and keep repeating until they drain all my life force.

then they go in for the kill.

I can’t seem to burst them down because they just break stun and blink away. then repeat when their break stun is available again.

and after a while, my lifeforce is gone. and I’m a goner.

well…i’m still undecided
that guy is more necroish than my necro

well i dont mind you dissing the video making guy since it isnt me.
like i said I’m from TC. that video guy is from BG =D

well since i am in TC so I know the HIRE and SE guild commanders they pulled are real.
cant say for JQ since i dont know one char from another kitten.

as per title

does your guild do commander sniping in zerg fights?
i saw a video by blackgate’s guild and they use engineers to pull commanders into their zerg and kill them before charging into the enemy zerg.

is this a good strategy and is it easy to do?

videos here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mhTF9q8uciQ

does your zerg/guild usually have a deputy commander? someone who will tag up if the original commander is dead?
or does the zerg just fall apart once the commander dies?

i know the video is at least credible since that is indeed HIRE’s and SE’s commander they are pulling in the middle of the video

Have you started shopping for your GS skin?
I have!
Bought the Chiropractor GS skin.
With all the bats animation and batty GS look!

some of my asura necro

just a question…u got no condition duration in your build? how does your condition stack?

very nice video holl! u definitely are one of the top 5 necros in the world.

not to mention all the condi removals that rangers have

so i take it since necros got only one easily dodgeable gap closer, they are naturally disadvantaged against a LB ranger in open field?

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

(assuming the players have the same skill level on power builds)

Fitg is a great way to keep on your toes while expecting a knock back especially vs pew pew rangers in WvW. (Retal + cleanse in DS)
Positioning determines the fight, LoS (line of sight) determines the place.

But put a ranger and necro on flat ground without cover and the necro has to have lifeforce to engage, has to blow his stunbreak and cleanse when getting close and finally try finish the ranger. (iow catch rapid fire, roots, the pets cc and the knock back) if you succeded with that then the ranger can be killed.) once you are close and the ranger doesn’t kite, then the ranger should be lunch.

If the ranger knows how to kite you have blown your cd’s and you need to hide/run or go all out in the hope the ranger makes a mistake.

The approach (start of the fight) is crucial, if the pew pew gets the jump on you from elevated range, it’s a auto K.O. (yeah yeah but lifeforce yep yep..) no. you dead period.

Best reply so far IMO =D

L Step.8659:

The game isn’t balanced aorund 1v1, as a necro you just need to accept an equal skilled power ranger will hard counter you since you can’t do anything against projectiles or reach them if they play properly.

I agree! Which is why this thread popped up to find ways to get closer to them efficiently D=

DeadlySynz.3471:

Rampage.7145:

That is assuming u play power necro right? cuz if you play condi there is no way in hell a ranger power or condi ranger can beat you.

Not true.

I’ve beat many of them sitting on a zerk ranger; and that’s after being jumped and them getting the first couple skills in. Even killed them sitting in their own wells before the LB was even buffed.

well…if they jumped you it means they WERE IN RANGE. which well, I understand you were replying to Rampage’s incredible claim that a condi necro shouldn’t lose to any ranger. Which I understand isn’t true either. So no comments.

X T D.6458:

I main a power necro for wvw, and dont have any problems with rangers, they are predicatable and easy to counter. Its more about knowing the class then anything else, knowing what skills to use when, when to pop DS, etc

I can’t say for a power necro because I have not fought as one against a good LB ranger before! But I would think that a power necro MIGHT have an easier time trading blows with the LB ranger from 1200 range with DS’ auto blasts! I say might because you still need to make that 300 range run to get into range, and our blasts are slow and easily dodged. But anyway that is not the point of this thread! it is how to get close to the ranger! not how to fight him when you get in range!

ArchonWing.9480:

I would guess Survival of the Fittest + Empathetic bond. You’d lose 3 condis every 10 seconds, and each survival skill would remove 2 condis.

^ THIS D=
Have you condi necros fought a ranger with this? Prepare to struggle T_T
But anyway that is not the point of this thread! it is how to get close to the ranger! not how to fight him when you get in range!

oscuro.9720:

A good necro should have no problem with Rangers. If you hit them with chill, they are done. DS2 or Staff 3 is a great utility. Also, dagger 3 (I run power necro) is a good root if you want to use daggers or wells. I personally haven’t found a Rangers who can beat me. I have no doubt there is one out there, just haven’t found it yet.

That is not the point of this thread T_T
It is not what to do when you get in range…it is how you get in range fast and well and what skills or evades or HP or DS to sacrifice in order to get in range T_T

ArchonWing.9480:

The spectral walk won’t work on a ranger that knows what they’re doing. . Use Spectral Walk for stunbreak and to get yourself out of trouble.

I agree with this! I seldom get to use this though cause I am not usually on Spectral Walk but the few times I tried it, it worked! perhaps those rangers were just not good enough =D

ArchonWing.9480:

A unheard of tactic is to walk away from them. (dodge away). Longbow has zero pursuit ability

Can a GOOD ranger who is reading this confirm this quote above? Because I am not too sure if a LB auto attack cannot track a running target…
If you mean he can’t chase you with a LB then um I dont really agree either because assuming you were already in his range, he could dodge after you and still be in range

ArchonWing.9480:

extreme advantage when they have a terrain advantage. Don’t let that happen, and use obstacles to block his arrows.

Totally agree! Give a ranger a hill to stand on or fight him near a body of water and you are asking for trouble!

ArchonWing.9480:

It’s just that I think the tactics in OP are only good for prolonging death and not for actually winning

Uh no that is not the point of my thread! T_T
What I am trying to drive at is, HOW TO GET CLOSER TO THE LB RANGER MOST EFFICIENTLY to actually start the fight.

ArchonWing.9480:

No offense to OP because it is very hard to fight and I think the advantage goes to the ranger if you run power, but if you’re giving advice like this, then of course you’re losing 90% of fights to LB rangers.

None taken! In fact, thank you for taking the time to respond! To clarify, I don’t lose 90% of the fights to LB rangers. I lose 90% of the fights to GOOD LB rangers =D. There is a difference! Which so far there is just one, and his name is GLAD from BLACKGATE.

ArchonWing.9480:

First off, taking Foot in the Grave for stability is a BAD idea for 1v1. You do not go this deep in soul reaping just for that. The Ranger’s PBS is on a 15 second cooldown untraited, comes out fast, and you must preemptively get DS for stability, of which you had to not been in ds.

Hmmmm I think you have a point here. I was thinking of ways to gap close to the ranger without taking too much damage and I was thinking using it as an opening to run to the ranger with stability on is a viable method! One could build around going max into the shroud traits, like for example a Tanky Full Condi Necro! BUT for a hybrid like me and for a Power Necro I would think it is not wise! and like you said Death Perception would be better for a Power Necro!

ArchonWing.9480:

Plague form is also a bad idea as you move slower, has no range and thus no pressure, so the ranger will laugh at you (yes they will have time to use the emote), barrage you, and just walk away until your plague form is wasted. Why not use flesh golem, and knock him down? Or use lich form and shrug off his attacks, also gaining stability anyways. Though yes, for lich form can only be used if you managed to get through.

UH I dont think you actually move slower in plague! Also plague gives insane toughness and vitality! and STABILITY! he won’t tickle you much with his rapid fire/barrage and can’t knock you back!

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Plague

Good thing is most rangers don’t walk away, they try to tickle you with their barrage/rapid fire!

Could you expand more on lich form? like what range it has, how to use it to gap close to the ranger? I have never used lich form! it is a foreign skill to me!

Golem not really because he is also capped at 1200 charge range! The point of this thread is how do you get near enough to the Ranger most efficiently!

Not what to do AFTER you get into range!

TY for all the replies! Much appreciated! I had a good laugh and teared as I read through. Now let me reply to them!

Firstly I am a ‘hybrid’ necro. 1800+ power, 1500+ condi, 34% crit chance.
Some ppl claim i am still a condi necro but that is irrelevant!

Rampage.7145:

That is assuming u play power necro right? cuz if you play condi there is no way in hell a ranger power or condi ranger can beat you.

Not true! The point here isn’t whether you are power or condi or hybrid! The point is whether you can even get close fast and efficiently enough to even start engaging the ranger!

Rampage.7145:

just make sure u run +40% condi duration for roaming power or condi chills, fears, crippples are a kitten for a power ranger or any other class with poor condi removal.

You have not fought a good power ranger traited with anti-condi traits then! You will cry when you face one! They have insane condi removals!

Rampage.7145:

U can also, condi or power run spectral armor as stunbreaker, if he uses pointblanshot as oppening to go for RF just pop it, protection is extremly powerfull vs power classes then just try to outburst him.

Agreed that is one way to close the gap!

Jim Hunter.6821:

Actually a condi ranger has a pretty good chance of beating a condi necro especially if the ranger is running regen. Rangers can cleanse conditions pretty fast and have a good amount of evades to avoid having their conditions returned to them.

I feel condi ranger vs condi necro is 50/50! But advantage to the necro! if he times his condi returns well, like after the ranger dodges and stuff, advantage to necro!

Rampage.7145:

All that it takes for the necro is to run plague signet wait for the range to put 12 bleeds and fire on you pop it, use fear+necro condi burst GG ranger.

Shall we assume it was a chance encounter with no time to check if the ranger is condi/power and no time to swap utilities? I don’t think many necros actually run around with plague signet active! Correct me if I am wrong! But ya if you do run plague signet then I agree with Rampage! advantage to you against other condi classes!

Junkpile.7439:

No idea why you think that ranger would let necro get close enough actually use skills. 1500 > 1200.

^ This! Well said Junkpile. I agree! BUT you won’t stop a good necro from getting into range, the only variable here is how much life/DS the necro has left when he gets into range!

ArchonWing.9480:

And so does LOS. It’s a great thing marks are nice big circles though.

What is LOS? Sorry I noob. uh actually not totally noob. but…uh what is LOS? Thanks in advance!

Assuming both players are good with their classes,

if you are playing a necro, you are going to cry if you meet a LB ranger in WvW.
90% of the time you are going to get crushed.

BUT if you really want to do better against a ranger in WvW, doing one or all of this will help you, from most effective to least effective:

*use the elite skill plague form and enter it for long stability with increased toughness and HP and use it to close the gap to the ranger
Analysis: Probably the BEST way you are going to get close to a good ranger because he can’t do a thing to stop you from coming closer UNLESS he turns and run the other way but most rangers don’t so ssssshhhh!

*you trait for stability upon entering deathshroud
Analysis: 3 seconds of stability, combine with a dodge and try to DS 2+3 the ranger when you get in range!

*use utility spectral walk and run AWAY from the ranger, make him chase you, then teleport BACK when he is close or past your starting spectral walk point so that you end up right near him
Analysis: MOST LB rangers are going to chase you and run right into your spectral walk start point in which case VOILA you are right near them when you teleport back…yes they are that dumb sssshhhhh!

*use utility spectral grasp to pull the ranger in
Analysis: Try to combine this with a fear so the ranger doesn’t dodge it BUT without stability you may not get close fast enough to even pull this off!

*you trait for retaliation upon entering deathshroud
Analysis: Not going to help you much to close the gap but returning some of the RF damage is better than nothing while you try to gap close with other means!

*pack your utility bar with 3 stun breaks and just use your DS to tank out the RF damage and do the usual running and dodging to get close
Analysis: Um well aren’t we all doing this now? XD

FEEL FREE TO ADD YOUR TIPS AND TRICKS!

i always found zerglings weak.
individually that is.
u run into one alone 1v1 and they collapse without a fight
u run into one in a zerg 1vZ and they suddenly become very brave.

i am almost maxed out in WXP so nope

i transferred to TC =D

So i transferred to TC.

Was roaming my first hour on non-NA time and fought 8 enemies.
That was an average of 1 every 7-8 minutes.
WHICH IS GREAT!

Previously on lower tier I could roam an hour on non-NA time and if I were lucky, I would find one person to fight, and if I were even luckier, that one person would give me a decent fight.

The sad thing was, of the 8 enemies I fought that first hour, all 8 were THIEVES.
Whats up with thieves? Is every roamer in T1 a thief?

The next 2 hours were just spent right after reset roaming.
Did not meet a single REAL decent roamer. Or at least none of those I fought pushed me hard at all.
I had many fights but the opponents all felt like zerglings. They were either trying to cap the ruins or trying to run from me.
I did not meet anyone out there who seemed like they were roaming and looking for a good 1v1 fight.

So my guess is…best to roam a few hours after reset on non-NA-peak hours, when the REAL roamers are out?

this video is a winner.

ty for the suggestion guys.
From what i gathered from the replies, T2 is better than T1 in terms of solo roaming.

I have decided to remain in CD though because I just realized it costs 1800 gems to transfer and I don’t have that sort of financial capability.

just to add, i am a SEA time player looking for more SEA time roaming solo fights

where should I transfer to for the best and most frequent chances for SOLO roaming WvW fights?

to kill thieves especially good ones who don’t overcommit and just reset until you make mistakes or run out of DS, you need to burst them.

for condi builds, essentially you want to get the thief down to at least 75% HP.
After that, try to chain fear him with this:
While on your staff, enter DS, fear him, leave DS immediately, press staff 5 to fear him again and follow up with staff spells spam on him which should have a good chance of killing him.

for power builds, essentially you want to get the thief down to at least 75% HP.
After that, enter DS and fear him. a couple of autos should have a good chance of ending him.

idk why we are complaining.
I win most of my wvw 1v1 fights. in fact i think necros are too strong.
only thing is if the enemy runs in time, I wont be able to catch them.
but if the enemy runs and resets the fight, i count it as my win too.

cooool is it a new update?

why would anyone spectral armor and then enter deathshroud right after?
wont you lose the spectral effect of regaining your DS with each damage?

the build posted by Nex looks decent enough.
but for wvw, dagger mainhand? is it good? i rarely see it being used!
(though i just saw one a few days ago)

3 conditions in 8 secs? that is sick! no wonder my i lose half my fights against them!

oh and yes I tried the binding blades earlier today against a SR thief and got him out!
Great advise shanks thanks!

True enough shanks!
I decided to go with GS instead and took out radiance 6.
And I found myself with too low crit chance for my liking!
I am currently using precision foods to get higher but i still dont seem to be doing enough damage!

I have swapped out half my cleric armor to valkyrie and once I have more gold I will try changing the rest too!

also i love the shield because of its looks

AND

against thieves’ shadow refuge, i activate my bubble and they get knocked out!

I think it is a stroke of genius for PvP

oh hmm…someone told me bow warriors have a skill/trait that removes 3 conditions every 10 seconds or something like that XD

but thanks!

Also no offense to flow but i think his build is terrible.
it looks weird!

Black Box.9312:

For a sword and scepter build I’d recommend going 6 into radiance instead of 6 into honor. Also don’t use shield; it’s absolutely terrible and torch is a much better choice for the ranged nuke alongside the scepter immobilize.

If you DO go 6 into radiance, you really don’t need any more than 30% crit chance because RHS and fury from meditations will allow you to crit enough anyway. Once you get to around 30-40% crit chance, start building power and crit dmg with valkyrie gear (pwr/vit/fer) so that you’ll actually be able to hit hard when you crit.

Thanks for replies guys!
Esp black box. I think this valkyrie thing will work for me!
(I’m currently using full clerics armor)

what is a good overall stats for wvw solo full medi build to aim for?

Power = ?
Crit chance = ?
Vit = ?
Crit dmg = ?
toughness = ?

Thanks!

Edit: I’m asking because my guardian is going full medi with scepter/shield + sword/focus and has a lot of problems doing enough damage to kill the enemy!
I always feel like I am not doing enough damage during the fight to keep the enemy under pressure. So i am not sure if my own skills are terrible or my stats are not giving me enough damage XD

I have about:

Power = 1800+
Crit chance = 38%
Vit = 1400+
Crit dmg = 189%
toughness = 1700+

Sagramor.7395:

Swap Mark of Evasion for Vital Persistence for starters. You’ll get much better mileage out of Dhuumfire.
Also probably switch your Dagger and Staff to Rabid. It’s really just a condition build which happens to have 1771/1811 Power. With your setup the way it is, you’re better off going full condition instead of throwing in a Zerk OH Dagger and Sent Staff and trying to sell it as hybrid.
Maybe try switching sigils of Malice and Momentum to Geomancy.

Are you having trouble with anything in particular or just looking for improvement?

um well dhuumfire is casted on the first hit so I don’t need to stay long in DS for dhuumfire to proc unless the enemy dodged the first shot.
mark of evasion provides some good regen and bleed!

mmm i was thinking of swopping my staff too. Just using what I found as a drop until I have more gold lol. don’t think I will go rabid though, probably zerk.
I have tried fighting anti-condi builds using full condi and the result was not pretty for me. like diamond-skin eles? they eat full condi necros.

do you have a link for a real hybrid build? I always thought a mix of power/condi = hybrid XD I must have been too simple minded lol.

hmm is sigil of geomancy good? the radius i find it really small, and very hard to be useful. not tried it though. it is like enfeebling shroud trait…i find the radius so small it is almost useless! though I still use it purely for fighting thieves lol.
I am thinking of removing momentum though as you don’t always enter a fight in WvW with it anywhere near max unless you spend time maxing it first XD
any other sigils to consider apart from geomancy? unless someone can confirm geomancy is good even with the small radius XD

as of now…I struggle most against good bow warriors for reasons i do not know why lol…i think they are full condi? not sure…i also heard their bow auto-cleanses condi after some time too…

I use this build mainly for solo WvW roaming.
Would appreciate if anyone can help point out improvements for my build thanks!

I am hoping to have a build that is able to handle fights against a variety of other classes/builds out there decently.
It is mainly a hybrid power/condi build.

Edit: just to add, my middle utility skill Well of Power, I change when I face up against different classes if I spot them from far in time. If not then I generally fight anyone with WoP.

But if I spot them in time to change, generally I will change WoP to:
Vs warrior, elementalist, guardian = Corrupt Boon
Vs thief = Spectral Wall
Vs ranger, engineer = Blood is Power
Vs Mesmer = no change

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fRQQNArYWjc0UbbPNO2wfbCchaqnA6FIAi2o/gJIfB-T1SFABMq+DAHCg42fw3TAAaaB+TJ4daCeS5Hc6AU+IAk8DAIAwBwu1twDHY91Xf91XvhHe4hHe4SBAzaA-w

quite a strong build against melee but very weak against range