Guild Wars 2

It is 450 gold that is 100 (~9gold per crafting process, output of 2 portals each) watch work portals and in line with most other permanent items and twice as much as an other popular toy (executioner’s axe). Even your argument about the price is wrong.

Cyninja.2954:

I mean I’d imediately buy all the permanent merchant, hair contract, etc. items at 1/10th their price. Waiting 30 minute to reuse would be not an issue.

If you read my earlier post or do the math yourself, you will realize that the white mantle portal device (well actually the ghostly infusion as that is what the price is based on) is already in line with the ratio of other permanent items compared to their single use counterparts with the exceptions of banker and hairstylist. The permanent bank access is much more expensive and the permanent hair stylist is much cheaper in comparison. The thing that is is not in line is its functionality.
And it is great that you would not mind a 30m cool down but literally everyone who has bought the mystic forge and/or the trading post access to make money (gambling or converting karma into crafting materials) would mind a 30 minute cool down as that would entirely remove the purpose of the items for them.

poor guy who has to be the ball

Rednik.3809:

Tell that to 3k+ for hair contract or personal banker.

The argument is silly, yet funny because the ratio between single use item and permanent one, is actually much in favor of the hairstylist. A permanent hairstylist costs as much as ~53 single use items. The permanent portal device on the other hand costs as much as ~100 portal devices.
It is way worse in case of the banker though. Repair canisters are around the same value as portal devices. So is the merchant. Trading post is around 80 single use items for a permanent one. This assumes you only buy single ones and don’t use the discount for buying multiple but also that you buy lodestones and don’t craft them.
If you really want to argue about this on the basis of the price of single use gem store items compared to their permanent counterpart, the white mantle portal device should be buffed to watch work level aka 90seconds cool down (which is not even what people ask for, e.g. 5minutes would be fine)
edit: math corrected. Didn’t pay attention to the crafting recipe. Neither did Cyninja.
edit2: update with more recent prices.

450g/1000 magnetite shards is far away from cheap. Try being less selfish for a moment and try imagining it as an (usable) item that is actually worth using as – you know – that it what usable items are for. Or just read OPs post as it explains what is wrong with it, how it worse than an item that is already so bad that barely anyone uses it.
The goal should be an item that people want to use, not one that nobody wants to use because the cost is absurd. Nobody in this thread asks for something that is better than or replaces mesmer portal, people are just asking for something that doesn’t suck and is actually worth its price.
10g/use does NOT promote using it, it promotes the exact opposite. It is an absurd price for giving someone else some convenience. We already have that and nobody uses it. There is a reason for that. I could craft a stack or two of them and there are people who could craft more stacks than they could ever use but nobody does that because it doesn’t make sense. What you get for your money is not worth it. Before I start putting watchwork portals for strangers, I’d give them the gold directly. At least that way they get something for it that might make them happy for more than a minute.
Yes, they will probably leave the item as it is as it is no gemstore item so it doesn’t get them any money but most people will just do the only reasonable thing. They wont buy it and forget about/don’t care about it.

edit: It is actually <5g per use (the recipe is for 2 portal devices) and that is still more than people are willing to pay.

You can always just watch a video/read a guide so you know the mechanics and then join, just so you are not completely clueless. Most people’s definition of experienced in this game seems to refer to “experienced at getting carried” anyway.
But yeah people are asking for experience as early as day 1, they also asks for insights because having killed vg and gorseval 20times will totally make you good at the new raid wing :^)
On the one hand it is silly but on the other hand, having someone who has successfully played the more difficult content in this game, might give you hope that he/she can at least press his/her his buttons and perhaps even walk out of red and into green circles. I don’t mind first timers though, if they bring a proper build/gear and are not completely inept.

edit: You could also open your party with whatever requirements you like because if you gear/LI vcheck them, they wont check you Or maybe you have an experienced friend who vouches for you.

@musu: No, I am simply not buying the “I am just concerned about the general game balance” argument. As it turned out, for a good reason.
also: Core mes and other core classes are already completely useless in a world of elite classes.

Cyninja.2954:

Come on, your just making yourself look more and more silly. Also I’m not seeing how this has to do with class uniqueness and portals, then again, I’m not the one derailing this thread.

Since you still dont understand it: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Watchwork_Portal_Device
A similar device is already in the game. The white mantle one does not affect your beloved class uniqueness at all. All I and others ask for is to make the newly introduced white mantle one worth it/useful. If people really want a portal on non-mesmer classes, they already have access to it. But you know, endless items (be it tonics, toys, bank access, portal devices, even mining tools, whatever) are always nicer to have than limited ones because they are more convenient (not necessarily cheaper). It doesn’t change anything for your mesmer. It just makes portals more convenient/more fun for others.
As a result, your arguments only serve one purpose (whether intentional or not) and that is prevent others from having more convenience. You make up arguments about balance and uniqueness and fail to realize that this is not about the introduction of a new functionality or tool but about making the new toy’s usefulness at least reasonable and not worse than one of the already existent item, which barely anyone uses.

You know what, if the watchwork one didn’t exist, I might be on your side and argue against the introduction/improvement of the white mantle one for the sake of keeping classes unique but this is not up for debate as there is already a better item than the white mantle one.

Yes I know that reddit post. Now hop into the game and check out what raid groups look like. You will be impressed by the absurd amount of thieves and engis. If you wonder why, just check the forums, I am confident there are enough threads that discuss classes and their roles in raids.
The last time I had a thief in raids, was my own because I was bored and wanted to try something else. Tell you what, it sucked compared to every other class I have played in raids so far. Sure, it is playable but there is 0 reason to pick it over something else.

Cyninja.2954:

I think you’re right. I was supprised Thiefs and Engineers are useless now. Last I checked Thief got a major damage buff a while back and is in one of the top dps spots in raids with autoattacks and engineer was always useful, just very difficult to play.

I think this is the part where rational people back away very very slowly.

Perhaps if you start playing the game instead of making up non-sense based on patch notes you might realize what is actually going on. I just leave this screenshot (taken a couple of minutes ago). You might be surprised but it hardly looks any different in terms of engis and thieves during prime time. Engi was desired before the slick shoes nerf because of its insane cc but that is gone. Thief is simply an ele with less utility and less dps most of the time. If you think that doesn’t prove anything, feel free and check out more recent quick and successful runs on raid bosses. Or even things like 6 men boss x. Everyone runs a mesmer (without portal btw), warriors, eles and druids. nearly nobody runs thief or engi. Although it’s not what this topic is about, I hope it shows you why I and others disagree with the points that you are making, It appears, that you are very poorly informed.

musu.9205:

was used

You got the tense right, congratulations.

I am sorry to blow it for you but, despite having more than enough magnetite shards, I haven’t bought the portal device simply because it is not worth its cost with its 30m cool down, which is exactly the issue. It is a new toy with an incredibly high cost (more expensive than any other toy) but because of its cool down its neither fun nor particularly useful. I don’t want to play a game of LoL or Dota or whatever between every usage of an item.
And no we are not in agreement, people would not stop playing mesmer if the portal device had a reasonable cool down. This is not 2014 where people brought mesmer for portal. Mesmer is not an endangered class. Stop playing the victim. If your care so much about balance and classes being used less frequently, you should start making threads about making thief and engineer useful instead of your “but this is one of the many things that my class can do, others should not have access to it without paying a high amount of gold per usage mimimimimi”-posts. It has absolutely nothing to do with balance but with convenience and fun aka things that make a game entertaining.

edit: wow how can you be so kitten. People just want an item that is actually useful and fun and thus desirable instead of one that is awkward, terribly priced. OP has made good points and a usable and reasonably priced portal wont make mesmer obsolete. Nowadays, the class isn’t even remotely taken for portal in what is supposedly gw2’s end content (fractals&raids). Most of the time, you should not even bring portal.

Cyninja.2954:

bla bla

Because it is so hard and difficult to make a mesmer, level it to 80 and unlock portal. I guess only talented and superior human beings that main mesmer can do it :^)
I mean you have to create a character, click 79 of your 2k+ tomes of knowledge and then unlock the skill. Tough task.
Sometimes i really wonder if the outrageous entitlement and jealousy that others might have access to portal without paying 9g/use comes automatically with playing a mesmer.
Its especially astonishing since most portals are probably used in open world to help other players. (!)
Would be funny if every warrior and thief player behaved like mesmer players, the complaints about the executioner axe toy would be endless as it challenges your superior mobility.

My current class is already 2nd lowest dps and other players can already get pets via consumables Mesmer wouldn’t lose anything for raids if they lowered the cd. They would actually profit from it in other content as it means they can keep wells/reflects instead of wasting a slot on portal.
30minute cd is simply crap, id rather waste shards on asc trinkets just because they have different icons than spending them on a 30minute cd item. Or you know, get 400 gold instead.

You can soloheal sloth and trio in zerk+scholar or viper, too.

make the game fun because as it is now, the game is simply not enjoyable to many people:
- matches are unfair and you can tell the winner 90% of the time before the match has even started
- skill/class design is awful and literally every meta build is unfun to play against because of passive dmg/cc, AI and too many spamable high damage and/or high defense skills and evades.

fun fact: the infusion is invisible to everyone who has “animations” on low. Regardless of the game mode. Just imagine you spend 450g/1k raid tokens on it to find out that your hardware is not supported

anduriell.6280:

Erzian.5218:

More damage on weapon skills would be appreciated because ranger dps is disgustingly low. Yes druid is a healer/support but other classes bring support and still 50-250% more dps.

by that logic the nimbus we gor as a weapon should be the only one with low damage (thou not that low).

no, ranger has such a low damage because of the pet. get rid of the pet and give the ranger all the dps back!!

The damage I was referring to was ranger+pet not only the ranger. I said weapon skills because it is not fun to play against a pet as main damage source in pvp/wvw but for all I care they could put the damage on the pet, too. Just put it somewhere instead of nowhere.

Tomiyou.3790:

Darknicrofia.2604:

other classes have more than twice the survivability of an ele?

am I missing a Kappa at the end or is my /s meter off today?

Try playing marauder amulet and using damage traits. Let’s see how long you last.

Exactly. Compare marauder ele to revenant, scrapper, thief, reaper, condition mesmer and you will be amazed how bad the survivability acatually is.

More damage on weapon skills would be appreciated because ranger dps is disgustingly low. Yes druid is a healer/support but other classes bring support and still 50-250% more dps.

Damage is good (air/fire overload, dagger air auto, dagger fire skills) but other classes have comparable or slightly lower damage but more than twice the survivability.

You should have spent less time on playing matches and more time on looking up a proper build.

Red Daing.7804:

To OP, please learn how to use statistics before posting. 8,9% chance to have an ascended box (armour or weapon) in T4+T3 +T2 chests is totally wrong.

You cant add percentages….

Edit : In this case and just for armour and weapons :
Master : 3,4% for armour and 1,4% for weapon
Expert : 2,4% for armour and 0,5% for weapon
Adept : 1,2% for armour and 0,2% for weapon

Gives for armour : 3,4+2,4+1,2 = 7 : 3 = 2,3333% chance to get an armour chest from doing a T4 fractal (3 chests)

For weapon : 1,4+0,5+0,2 = 2,1 : 3 = 0,7% chance to get a weapon chest from doing a T4 fractal (3 chests).

According to your maths, the chance to get a weapon/armor would be higher if you opened only the t4 chest (3.4%) instead of all chests. I hope you realize that this does not make any sense.

You also lose the achievement if someone triggers a turret because he is visible (regardless of revealed) for example because he doesn’t run back with stealth.

maybe if you wait another 3 years, the next elite spec brings a broken gm trait again that makes power nec viable for 1 week before they turn it into something utterly useless.

how does it even matter, the only class that has trouble vs entangle is necro and perhaps other druids. Everything else has 23490328423 blinks or evades that remove immob or spamable condition removal.

The only reasons to run reaper in pvp now are chill to the bone and mobility on rs2. It has less damage, worse boon corruption, more telegraphed and harder to set up burst on a very long cd (compared to ds2+geomancy proc+scpeter 3). One of the problems that core nec always had, is how unreliable your damage becomes once you start facing build that have more than one removal every 10 seconds. Reaper now has the same problem, which puts it basically into the same tier as core nec aka trash.
Then on other hand necro has always been good at stomping bad players (who just random dodge after you hit them with a mark, never dodge ds2 and use their condition removal whenever they see conditions on them, so they can complain about conditions afterwards), so it will most likely still be playable in most unranked/ranked games.

Ravenmoon.5318:

Erzian.5218:

Ravenmoon.5318:

Everybody shouts nerf this nerf that nerf this nerf that. How about you suggest something innovative like i don’t know … maybe rework ventari stance in something useful and have it match healbot ele or bunker druid and not being a complete trainwreck with 0 synergy with everything else and borderline impossible to control tablet.

Because also having an underpowered set of utility skills makes the broken meta build less broken :^)
pro tip: ventari (and jalis) are both useful in the games most popular game mode and literally EVERY SINGLE class in the game has a variety of utility skills as well as weapons that are useless in at least one if not multiple game modes. That does not justify broken meta builds and revenant is no exception here.

#logc #noneofit

#referringtoyourself #revenants #playingthevictim

Ravenmoon.5318:

Everybody shouts nerf this nerf that nerf this nerf that. How about you suggest something innovative like i don’t know … maybe rework ventari stance in something useful and have it match healbot ele or bunker druid and not being a complete trainwreck with 0 synergy with everything else and borderline impossible to control tablet.

Because also having an underpowered set of utility skills makes the broken meta build less broken :^)
pro tip: ventari (and jalis) are both useful in the games most popular game mode and literally EVERY SINGLE class in the game has a variety of utility skills as well as weapons that are useless in at least one if not multiple game modes. That does not justify broken meta builds and revenant is no exception here.

Current meta builds (revenant, reaper, scrapper, druid, tempest, chrono) are very dull and boring to play and sometimes even frustrating to play against but at the same time much more powerful than the remaining builds. As a result, if you want to play an offensive ele build, a power nec, a warrior or something similar, you have 3 options:
a) play unranked
b) smurf
c) get destroyed by superior builds in legend/diamond
c gets frustrating very quickly, so if you don’t like unranked your only option is to smurf.
Obviously, there have always been meta builds but before HoT the amount of subpar but still playable builds was much higher as the difference between builds wasn’t as massive as it is now. I have recently played fresh air ele on my f2p and it doesn’t even deal enough damage to kill scrapper or druids. In 1v1 situations, they don’t even need to dodge, as long as they walk around to not get hit by dragon’s tooth 24/7 and use defensive skills randomly they cannot die. Revenant can technically die but unfortunately all of its relevant damage skills 2 shot you, while it has 4x your dodges and twice your mobility. Same goes for power nec/reaper vs revenant/scrapper/druid. Reaper might be beatable in 1v1 but has much more positive impact in team fights and skirmishes. Diamond/Legend are simply unfun if you don’t play the single best build that’s available for your class (necro/reaper being an exception as it has several similar playable condition builds, same for rev which has power+condi)
I am not saying that better balance would prevent smurfs, but it removes one of the incentives to smurf. Queue times, queuing with inexperienced friends etc. would obviously remain.

kdaddy.5431:

if you are complaining about revs and everyone is pointing out that its on equal level with 3 other classes wouldnt that be fine? Out of the 9 classes 4 play at a elite level.

Except that rev is better than the other 3 because contrary to the others it excells at a variety of things and can fill any non support role. If you had a team of 5 different non revenants, you could replace any of the following by a revenant and the team would get better: daredevil, reaper, berserker, dragonhunter, druid, scrapper, chronomancer. Yes, that is any non (support) tempest. Rev is so good that it is even worth stacking 2 of them instead of bringing a different class or stacking another class. Yes it loses vs condi mes in1v1 but the best 1v1 result vs condi mes for any of the meta builds is a draw.

I think, Its 240 tokens but that is still pretty slow.

Funny how people still think that reaper counters rev also lol at the guy who said that rev has no stab
Oh and about dh. The only two elite specs that do not win 100:0 vs dh are daredevil and berserker. Everything else has both, better 1v1s and better teamfights. Just kill the dh first or dodge when you enter the node.

Its totally fine that a class does 8k+ Damage + evade + hard cc by hitting 1attack skill, 6k+ by hitting a 4sec cd skill , having god-tier mobility, 8 dodges/evades in a row + blocks, close to perma stability, party buffs
Totally fine.

Shala.8352:

Erzian.5218:

You could start with proof for:

Crit is 10k (3k+150%)

I know 3k + 150% is 9k.

No, this is not true. It is a bit ridiculous if you tell people to “Learn to math” when you cannot even do basic math.

You could start with proof for:

Crit is 10k (3k+150%)

Shala.8352:

Astralporing.1957:

Shala.8352:

From official wiki:
“Weakness is a condition that decreases the rate of endurance regeneration and turns half of all hits into glancing blows (that deal 50% less damage)”.

This means ALL attacks can be 50% less dmg, not only crits.

No. Half of all. That’s 50% of 50%.

and 50% of 150% is? 75% less dmg.
so average between ALL attacks, crits and not crits, 50% less dmg in total.
Example: eviscerate non crit is 3k
Crit is 10k (3k+150%)
Total dmg on a crit and a non crit: 3k+10k =13k

weaknes on non crit: 1,5k dmg
weakness on crit. 5k dmg
Total dmg on a crit and a non crit with weakness: 1,5k+ 5k= 6,5k dmg, for a total lost of 50% dmg than the 2 evi without weakness.

Learn to math man. Of course as i said, the more ferocity you have, the more dmg you lose, so an high ferocity stats will lose more of 50% dmg. Seems legit, when condi is not affected by it right?

Your calculations are wrong on so many levels

You guys sound like people in mobas complaining about elo hell because they don’t realize that they are bad themselves.
If you insist on getting thrown onto the worse team because of your mmr consider this:
– Starting mmr is, according to an official post in another complaint thread, around ‘average’
- why did you start with low mmr in the first place?
- at one point i lost 7 games in a row in ruby and guess what. The matches actually got easier and not harder, because i was facing worse opponents
- from ones own point of view it might look as if one did well when inreality one is doing terribly. E.g. If you keep successfully +1ing fights that dont need the +1 (you are getting kills but you should actually be somewhere, where you are needed)
- your division last season and your former winrate mean absolutely nothing as the mm matched you against your own skill level. A terrible player could reach legendary by beating other terrible players.

Burtnik.5218:

Covis.6037:

Burtnik.5218:

Also losing 66% on ability 2 and 60% damage on ability 3 to single target in teamfight.. On top of dealing less damage than intended due to wep str not being taken into account.
Now if anyone could show me an ability that lose damage as more targets show up i would be grateful.

i knew this would happen. forum comedy.

I knew noone can show me ability that lose damage to single target. But instead we have emeralds that crying about anything. Forum comedy

I guess you have absolutely no idea who you are talking to

Change the -10% damage trait to +10% damage against chilled foes and add further damage modifiers in reaper and other traitlines. E.g. Replace blighters boon or soul eater (they are both terrible) or change reapers onslaught (which is ~ok but imo missplaced as grandmaster traits that want you to sit in shroud should be/are in sr – yes there is unholy sanctuary but the trait is complete trash)

One mistake very many thieves do, is that they simple don’t attack enough. They keep porting in and out and spamming evades to draw out all or at least many important skills (which is good) but fail to capitalize on it because they dont realize when they have to focus on attacking instead of spamming random evades.

I wish i could play vs 4 necs instead of double rev + tempest + something every game

Because necro wins most fights if your opponts dont dodge as such its pretty effective vs bad players.
Problem is: assuming both players barely dodge/block anything, necro kind of has to win as it has less access to dodges/blocks than any other class and relies od generating life force+absorbing damage with it -> if both players hit most of their abilities necro should always win otherwise the class couldnt even with if everything goes in its favor. Yes, the design philosophy is kittened but that is exactly how nec/reaper is designed currently.

F12 character select → tempest/rev is pretty good

If that is not an option you will have to use the vastly inferior gs+d/wh combo

No class (except condition chronomancer in 1v1 perhaps) should beat rev. Rev is better than every other class in the game (that includes reaper and scrapper). In lower brackets it might not seem that way as rev appears to be more difficult to do well on than for instance reaper.
Precision strike hits for 6+k damage, surge of the mists hits for 7+k damage (if you land a good one) while also evading and hard ccing. If you combine it with shiro heal and weapon swap you can easily get 14+k damage from hitting 1 ability. Meanwhile you have more dodges and mobility than any other non-thief class in the game.
I am 100% sure if you were allowed to run class in multiples on ESL, every good pro team would at least run 2 revs.

it ok, anet implemented the no class stacking rule so people cannot play 2+ revenants on their esl teams aka balance is fine :^)

core nec is worse than any of the strong meta builds. reaper without deathly chill is worse than core nec.

rev (too many dodges, evades, blocks and mobility, damage on s2 is too high, damage on staff 5 is too high given that the skill also knock backs and evades)
>
scrapper (weapon damage skill is too high for the amount of utility they offer)
reaper (rise, deathly chill, plague signet, and passive chill application from runes)
>
druid , ele, thief, mesmer
>
warrior
>
dh

I’d like to see what happens if you had to chose between elite specialization and the old class specific traitline (as in the one that modified the class mechanic: soul reaping, trickery, virtues etc)

funnily enough deathly chill is the only thing that makes reaper strong/viable. Without it the specialization would simply blow.

Idk guys, i have a f2p account that has only played enough unranked matches to play ranked and enough matches to reach emerald in season 1 because i wanted to help a friend to get to ruby. We still lost a fair amount of matches back then so i don’t think its mmr is too high. I still had no trouble to get out of amber in season 2 and the other players on both teams were really terrible. That was on a coreclass, would have been even easier with a proper build.
end of the story: I have a hard time believing people who claim at they only lose because they are matched with bad teammates vs much better opponents.

Yesterday i had a player in ruby whose team had 0% winrate, regardless of whether he was on my team or against me. Obviously, he did not realise that the issue might be himself, but blamed his team instead.

If you keep losing perhaps rethink your build or your plays (or queue when more players are available as queueing late night can be fairly random due to the limited playerpool) 1v1 is helpful but not sufficient to win matches/being better than other players and far away from carrying your team because while you win 1v1 your team still has to win or at least stall (but a draw nearly never happens in lower brackets) 4v4 on the rest of the map aka your team has to better than he other team.

Teutos.8620:

Erzian.5218:

According to the season 2 announcement, matchmsking is primarily based on pips not mmr

Please don’t spread wrong information.

Gaile Gray

While we’ll be using divisions to match you against your immediate opponents, we’ll still use your MMR to place you on teams with similarly skilled players (from your division point range) to help ensure that you’re not forced to play with individuals that are of a much higher or lower skill than you.

Source: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Upcoming-Changes-for-PvP-League-Season-2

“from your division point range”
hence the word primarily but thank you for a more detailed depiction of the matchmaking

anyways: the system is flawed either way as you cannot prevent abuse without punishing players who play “at the wrong time” (= when there are not enough people available to match players of equal skill with and against each other), if your goal for leagues is to represent skill.

Teutos.8620:

Erzian.5218:

According to the season 2 announcement, matchmsking is primarily based on pips not mmr

Please don’t spread wrong information.

Gaile Gray

While we’ll be using divisions to match you against your immediate opponents, we’ll still use your MMR to place you on teams with similarly skilled players (from your division point range) to help ensure that you’re not forced to play with individuals that are of a much higher or lower skill than you.

Source: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Upcoming-Changes-for-PvP-League-Season-2

“from your division point range”
hence the word primarily but thank you for a more detailed depiction of the matchmaking