Guild Wars 2

Thief is one of the most broken classes i have seen in a mmorpg, , the mechanics of that class are terrible designed, SPAMING is their main mechanic, trying to copy the energy system of wow but implemented it without the finishers that prevented rogues to spam their abilities, they couldnt spam their most powerfull abilities with that mechanic, but here in thieves of wars we have anything like this so they can cheese spam all day.

Stealth is broken, leting them to spam abilities from stealth until they hit, entering stealth can be achieved in combat and by multiple abilities.

They have the ability to evade and teleport all day preventing their opponents to catch them, but they can catch their foes with ease.

Ando now the blind…

But all this problems come from one origin, the cheap spam core mechanics of thief class, i never going to take any thief seriously in this game because of this, any thief is using and abusing a broken game class period.

As someone stated before, on paper we can say a lot of things but the reality is that thieves DO spam blinds.

Zerging should be punished, really is a gimmick playstyle, and promotes cheese gameplay, like reducing everyones exp taken from kills and damage output or something that makes people think “hey, i should not zerging like an idiot here”.

Try to return to a town, then let the server conection is ok, you will notice it because all the stuff its going to get a brief period of “loading” even sound will not load until this period is completed, when the scenario loaded and everything seems fine, then the server conection will be stable, then go to the mist now, and see if this fixes the problem, it did make a difference for me, i was having lag with only 1 character, and was for this matter.

jportell.2197:

One suggestion is to make regen stack intensity. A trait could read “Gain x stacks of regeneration for each condition on you”< not class specific btw.

That could be the boon to counter conditions, but the problem is that poison countes regeneration.

We have to think of a stat that reduces condition damage too, vitality could be the candidate, or toughness but i think vitality should be, that will make all of those vit amulets more usefull than right now.

Navzar.2938:

It definitely should not go back to swinging your weapon in the air removes blind. That kind of ruins it for non spammable blinds.

Definitely i dont want a unjustifed nerf on someone that dosent deserves it, but thieves spam needs to be stoped, the problem is that is their main mechanic, so, this goes to the devs to see how they can manage this problem.

The problem is not the amulets, the problem is that there is no stat or boon to reduce/mitigate condition damage, the current condition preferance is going to continue until this is adressed, then things will balanced and someones would prefer conditions and other power, in fact, some teams would need to have some guys go conditions and others go power, right now is best for everyone to go full conditions.

I dont think the current condition meta is going to change untill they introduce a real mitigation mechanic on condition damage stats/boons.

Amaterasu.6280:

The only problem with blinds right now are they are literally stuck on you until you hit someone. There should be a short duration before it is automatically taken off…maybe a 3-5 few secs at most.

I’ve come out of fights being completely blinded for the entire duration of until I find someone else to hit across the map…

Pretty much, but lets be fair here, the big problem here is thief spamming capabilities, i dont think any other class can perma blind you like thieves.

Jourdelune.7456:

Actually, Mace + Shield is Overpowered.

If you don’t happen to meet that 5 warrior man team… you will surely do, if you become more serious about your gaming.

So, if warrior is boost in a direction, they surely deserve nerf in another direction.

Moot points. Warrior have the best HP pool of the game. And in doing so, are the more easiest to simply do 30/30/… build than all others classes. More, they have the same armor has guardian with more CC and DPS.

Bunk Guard + Bunk Warrior with all shouts are invincible on mid fight.

So please, go find a build that is reliable (yeah many in the warrior class are reliable) and practice more.

Its not OP, anyone has stunbreak or teleport, if the gimmick of skullcrakc+ hb or eviserate is killing you, maybe you should reconsider telling people to practice more when you do clearly need it too.

Player Character.9467:

Three weapon sets would be too OP.

I dont think it would be Op because they for sure would tone the damage output of warriors a lot, but instead its going to make a chore to play warrior, like pressing your change weapon button 2 times or even 3 if you need an specific weapon set, Maybe the OP thinks more like the attunement of the elementalist, but that would require to rework the UI of the warriors and mechanics, this also isnt a solution to anything.

The Boz.2038:

Don’t worry, I’ve got more arguments. I’ll bring them up if you refute any of mine.
To me, this entire thread looks like a “I’m a berserker warrior in PvP, make me viable” whine.
Do warriors need some help? Well.. kinda. But they need a very, very, very slight push, because they already have most of the tools needed to do the job.
However, the things you mentioned are not the true weaknesses of the warrior right now.

I refuted everything you got, that is why you are mad now, just leave please or i will report you for doing offtopic rages.

Im not even answering to you anymore, im done with you.

Daecollo.9578:

Gathslan.1870:

Hilarious thread, a player coming to complain about a warrior who uses a pretty common build by now. It is especially funny because the OP gives completely wrong weapons for what he is describing the warrior of doing

The warrior has a mace and sword mainhand, a shield offhand, a longbow and a greatsword.

LOL this is hilarious.

The Boz.2038:

True. You can’t dodge the fireball that is already inside your face.
Working as intended.

I guess that means you are out of arguments, if thats so then i ask you to leave the topic so we stay on the main subject here, wich are warriors, please.

Agreed……….

The Boz.2038:

…you are aware that you can dodge/evade/block/invul/etc. condition inflicting attacks, right?
Also, there is a mechanic in this game that states clearly it “reduces condition damage”. It’s called condition removal.

Nah, that is BS, im talking about a real stat and a real boon that clearly states “reduces condition damage”, condition cleanes is another thing.

You cant dodge/evade/block/invul/etc. while you are beign affected by the conditions already so…

The Boz.2038:

…that’s like saying “damage has no counter except healing”.
But sorry, here, you can have your topic back.

Direct damage has, evasion, toughness/armor, aegis, blocks.

Condition damage bypasses everyone of those in fact there is not a single mechanic in this game that states clearly this " reduces condition damage " there is no one.

The Boz.2038:

Fenrir.5493:

-Health pool dosent matter at all in this game, is like toughness, what matters in this games is boons, protection is one of the most importants, the most important probably, warrior cant have that but he has 2k more hp, 3k, 4k?, whattever it dosent compensate the fact that mitigation damage its better, also having high health pool is wrong in a warrior because that way their heals are not enought like the heals other classes have (even with the minor buff to the heals). The regeneration of ranger is not only coming for the passive regeneration boon, they have other means to regenerate life, and that is why they can achieve immortality.

Oh lord… Suddenly, all the “conditions are OP” cries make sense. If this is what the majority of people honestly believe, then no wonder you think conditions are OP. Everything is OP if you avoid all possible counters to it.

Except that condition damage has no counters only condition removal, and this topic is not about that.

Shumy.1529:

If Warriors are so ok, then let me ask you a scientific question, more of a statistical to be honest. Why Warriors are least used in professional tournaments?

You say Wars are balanced. Well they may be balanced, maybe they really are, but for every role they do ok, there is a profession that does much better. Then why would people go for warriors in tourneys anyway?

Statistically speaking, in professional Guild Wars 2 tournaments, Warrior is the least used, and in some of them not used at all. Why? Is he useless? I doubt it. Is he weaker than every other class? Not really. Does he exceed at anything? Er, no. So why should we use him, when every role or action he does well, always exists a profession that does it better.

Not to mention that everytime you see a warrior you know is a free kill you feel it you know you can eat them really easy, that feeling is not true with other classes.

NO, this will make things just very bad for warriors, too much a hassle switching 3 weapon sets.

And that solves anything of the warrior problems.

I knew this thread is gona make blind spam thieves mad, but well is a cheap mechanic really, its a really bad implemented core mechanic is the thief itself, they, because of that spam mechanic should have not easy acces to blinds, im tired of seing blind spam on thieves its ridiculous is cheap.

Juan Ignacio.8903:

im sure that if u keep whining about this they will nerf it and then all the thieves will be using sword and then u dudes gona start whinning about the unlimited dodge.

Well if the mechanic is broken then yes… but the core problem is the thief itself, the spammable core of the class is the problem, no CD on skills is a completely broken mechanic.

Thief is the problem with the blind as it is now, is so spammable that is ilegal at this point.

apt.9184:

Warrior I think has gotten sufficient changes and does not need more (So same thing that happened to necros does not happen to warrior) once this meta becomes less dependent on condi spam I think teams will be looking to out in warriors.
I mean if you look at the changes the healing surge got huge buff, berserker stance is quite good, and the changes in traits were good except for the berserkers power going grand master, and lastly the skull crack change was huge I mean right now a warrior with good timing is close to unstoppable in team fights, in a way it is kinda OP.

Warrior is a frekill for any class seriously.

OMG, how can people die to the stun+hb gimmick, really??, did you people know what stun breakers are?, teleports anyone?… my god this really is a l2p issue, warriors suck man.

Sword dosent stun by the way, probably you are talking about the inmovilisation of the sword burst skill but that isnt a stun.

Edit: tell us the name of the warrior and the server and we can check him to confirm that is a typicall skull crack gimmick build.

Geff.1930:

Warriors are balanced right now.

-Whirlwind does more or less damage than Phantasmal Berserker depending on the build of the warrior and the build of the mesmer.

-If you are comparing to the tool kit skill gear shield, that and magnet are the only worthwhile skills in that set. You have to waste a utility on it whereas you do not have to waste a utility for shield block. You also get shield bash with shield which is a really good skill.

- Bull’s rush stuns. Rocket boots does not. Would you rather have bull’s rush not stun and have all the facilities of rocket boots? I for sure would not prefer that.

-Guardians have much fewer hard CC’s. As a result all the damage output from Whirling Wrath can be easily mitigated with a dodge roll. Warriors have many options by which to keep people in Hundred Blades with CCs. Whirling wrath does a fraction of the damage of Hundred Blades.

-Rangers have a fraction of the health pool of Warriors(all classes do as a matter of fact) and are therefore more prone to CC burst than Warriors. Warriors can gain perma regen, not only for themselves but also allies if they waste a single slot on a banner and get the banner regen and banner CD traits.

-Guardians cannot build as a DPS spec. They can, but they won’t be as effective as Warrior DPS for instance. Similarly Warriors can build bunker, but they won’t be as effective as Guardians. Survivability is not the issue. Warriors can build survivable bunkers, but they won’t provide as much team support as Guardians especially if the enemy team has access to stability.

-No

-Warrior needs to carry a weapon to use the defence stance engineers no, and has less cd, no utility of warrior can compare to that OP utility engineer has.

-Bulls charge dosent stun…

-Only stupid people stay in the hundred blades damage at this point of the game really. Guardians have good cc too by the way, but the topic is that they dont need to land a cc to do it.

-Health pool dosent matter at all in this game, is like toughness, what matters in this games is boons, protection is one of the most importants, the most important probably, warrior cant have that but he has 2k more hp, 3k, 4k?, whattever it dosent compensate the fact that mitigation damage its better, also having high health pool is wrong in a warrior because that way their heals are not enought like the heals other classes have (even with the minor buff to the heals). The regeneration of ranger is not only coming for the passive regeneration boon, they have other means to regenerate life, and that is why they can achieve immortality.

-Guardians CAN, AND DO, build for damage, and they can do it in a better way and more reliable, IM TALKING ABOUT PVP (this forum is pvp by the way if you didnt noticed yet), if you are basing your facts in the stationary enemies of pve, then yeah warrior rocks, really but guess what, in pvp no one is a free kill, well only warriors.

And warriors dont bunker, there is no bunker warrior, and not will be unless it has acces to protection or a massive regeneration like rangers.

Well, this topic is not to list the improvements that the devs could and should make to the warrior, this topic instead is to make a list of all the inconsistencies that warrior has compared to other classes, i can remember a few right now, but i hope the warrior community could add more to make the list bigger wich im sure it is:

Whirlwind
-Damage from the berserker phantasm of mesmer is greater than the actual Whirlwind of a warrior.

Shield stance
-Engineers have a better blocking shield stance than warriors with less CD , remember one thing here, warrior cant bunker, engineer can, so why warrior has a high cd on this?, should be the opposite, warrior needs to expend a trait in order to make his block cd 24 seconds wich is still HIGHER than an engineers without a trait.

Bulls charge
-Rockets boots of an engineer are better than bulls charge of a warrior, they remove the things that affect the warrior most wich are " immobilized, crippled, and chilled", not only that, they do more damage and have less CD, half less cd with all those features included (more damage and remove those conditions).

Hundred blades
-Guardians have better damage output and a more reliable too comparing greatswords, whirlwind wrath allows movement and has a combo finisher attached and does similar damage to hundred blades, wich is a skill that does not offer combo capabilities and roots the warrior in place, guardians are the tanks they are suppoused to be rooted not the warrior that cant bunker.

Sustain
-Rangers have greater sustain via regeneration and protection mostly regeneration, how is it coherent to have a ranged class bunkering or being a tank while dishing tons of condi damage, while in the mean time we have a warrior wich has heavy plate armor that cant mitigate damage, needs to stay in melee range to do anything and dosent have enought sustain to regenerate all the damage he is suffering to try to catch a ranged class that not only is ranged he is bunkering, wich means he is mitigating/regenerating most of the damage when you manage to catch him.

Forgot to mention rangers added stealth, that is a huge survivality boost to an already survival class.

Bunkering
-Which leads to one of the core things of warrior inconsisntencies: Warrior dosent have acces to bunker, warrior a heavy armor class cant bunker, but light armor classes or medium armor classes are mitigating and enduring more damage than a warrior that has heavy armor, this can not be good, by any reasonable perspective this is wrong.

CC dependant

-Warrior is a class that need to land cc in order to make damage, but the problem is that there are so many stun breakers and teleports in the game that warrior damage output in pvp is lackluster compared to other classes that simply press their damage output skill without the need to do anything else to be able to use it.

I will add to this list anything you people add wich i encourage you to do, so the devs can see many of the things that cause warriors to be in the state they are.

Tsezar.6950:

Fenrir.5493:

Tsezar.6950:

well i have a warrior and a thief (and 4 other 80s) and compared the warrior was the easiest at leveling and the fastest (have mesmer ele guardian and ranger too). thief wvw roaming is just boring u have way more fun with a warrior in wvw.. i run a berserker warrior with 0 20 20 0 30 with full berserker gear and accesoirs and survivabilty is better then expected and u can kill everything. i love how thiefs run after u and u insta gib them with a stun and axe burst skill way to funny.. and if u see thief running d/p just use berserker stance and kill him while he thinks hes invul coz of perma blind

Terrible players really, anyone now knows how to counter that gimmick stun+hb or eviserate is really easy and predictable.

If you ever want to do pvp go thief, and even wvw.

ofc because 99.99 ppl in wvw are just bad but counting dodges and stuning from point blank helps alot. if u do a point blank stun its not be able to dodge unless its a random dodge and evenf u dont hit you f1 burst you do alot of dmg with axe autoattack. one chain up to 10k dmg. thief is just boring in wvw just 5 and 1 or 5 2 if d/p its not a chellenge and gets rly boring fast

I think there are so much stun breaks and teleports that is just like a rudeness to make the warrior class the one that rely on melee attacks mostly to need to land a CC in order to make a fair amount of damage, warrior seriously has serious problems, at least like you said, eviserate can be used without the stun, but hb no, and this is why this skill needs to be reworked seriously.

On the mean time we have mesmers doind berserker damage more high than the actual true whirlwind of a warrior, thieves doing 80% health backstabs from stealth, rangers/elementalist/engineers bunkering like a warrior should bunker, guardians dealing more damage in a more reliable way than warrior does….

PistolWhip.2697:

Warrior and Thief are similar.

No……….

I think the main problem here is maybe not the blind, but THIEVES.

Tsezar.6950:

well i have a warrior and a thief (and 4 other 80s) and compared the warrior was the easiest at leveling and the fastest (have mesmer ele guardian and ranger too). thief wvw roaming is just boring u have way more fun with a warrior in wvw.. i run a berserker warrior with 0 20 20 0 30 with full berserker gear and accesoirs and survivabilty is better then expected and u can kill everything. i love how thiefs run after u and u insta gib them with a stun and axe burst skill way to funny.. and if u see thief running d/p just use berserker stance and kill him while he thinks hes invul coz of perma blind

Terrible players really, anyone now knows how to counter that gimmick stun+hb or eviserate is really easy and predictable.

If you ever want to do pvp go thief, and even wvw.

Bump for truth.

I only agree on conditions our conditions and the lack of condi cleans, mesmer dont aply a lot of conditions and the main condition (confusion) is very underwelming.

Other than that warrior is still the free kill of the game.

TGSlasher.1458:

Fenrir.5493:

Right now as it is a thief can spam and perma blind you all the time and you cant do anything about it, you dont even want to waste a condition removal on that because they are so easy applicable that is really unfair to have you all the time unable to attack, i find that this mechanic needs to go back so we can remove it just with the swing of the weapon is the only way to make it fair to the current state that is so spammable.

This thing makes aegis look like a baby.

As a blind spamming ele, I agree with what you say. Your blinded, how are you going to know if you hit something or missed it? I find blind to be weird in games where you control your character from 3rd person, doesn’t make sense. If your whole screen went black (or even murky like) for no more the 2 or 3 seconds, that would open some interesting gameplay.

I know that thiefs at the moment are the most anoying class with this blind mechanics, other classes seem to be fair or i never had noticed any kind of abuse of blinds only thieves.

LoL at this, why we play warrior?, lets roll an engi….

Warrior is just designed to fail in pvp, i see, i didnt know that enginers shield had less cd.

shimmerless.4560:

black powder is not spammable if anything it’s a fine line to keep initiative from tanking even with initiative signet.

It is.

Schlieffen.2054:

However, I agree that it’s silly to schedule a tournament where one side of the bracket has to play all the way through in one day. It doesn’t make the result less valid but they should change that in the future. It’s also silly for a TO to change the tournament just before the finals. I don’t think it gave either team an advantage

Oh but it is, if you play all day you get tired and you are exausted, and if this was a drastic change made out of nowhere i can see that is a pretty kittenty tactic to lower the succes of that team.

Daecollo.9578:

The warrior’s base mechanic is based around spam, unlekittenanges skills have to be made around it.

Warrior really dont spam, for spaming things, thief.

Volrath.1473:

here is the fix you are looking for:
- Do not stand on smoke fields

Here is the answer to that:

Stop your BS.

Jzaku.9765:

Yes that is definitely the problem, not the black powder shot applying blind, the heartseeker through it also applying blind ,the gap closing shadowshot also applying blind, and I have just describe practically the whole of a D/P thief’s repeatable rotation

Not saying it’s not counterable but it requires far far more effort on your part and practically requires the thief to make a mistake, but just saying that little blind pulsing field is the only cause of blind issues is just a show of massive ignorance.

True, +1 to this.

This class is broken and really a mess.

evilapprentice.6379:

Fenrir.5493:

Evilek.5690:

Fenrir.5493:

Right now as it is a thief can spam and perma blind you all the time and you cant do anything about it, you dont even want to waste a condition removal on that because they are so easy applicable that is really unfair to have you all the time unable to attack, i find that this mechanic needs to go back so we can remove it just with the swing of the weapon is the only way to make it fair to the current state that is so spammable.

This thing makes aegis look like a baby.

Stay out of Black Powder

Problem fixed

So if im a warrior and i need to stay close to hit the thief i am now forbiden to do so because the thief ca spam this field?… eonugh with your bs.

And even if i did so, the blinds of thief are not only comming from that field, they have tons ways to put blind is a joke completely and mark my words is getting nerfed.

Black powders field isn’t big enough to deny your melee range – there’s no place the thief can stand where you can’t get melee range on him and still be outside the field – just don’t charge into it blindly and you’ll be fine. If he retreats into the field, circle it and you’ll have him back in range in a second. Let’s also note that if he is hiding towards the back of the field and you can’t hit him with melee without entering it (again, by just blindly walking into it instead of intelligently circling around it)….he can’t hit you with melee.

It’s really just a matter of skill, don’t stand in the field.

Also lets note that a skill that costs half a standard initiative bar isn’t “Spammable”.

Sure, everything seems very legit on paper but the reality is other man, sorry your blinds are broken and are going to get nerfed.

dukefx.9730:

Fenrir.5493:

dukefx.9730:

Fenrir.5493:

If people dont want to spend adrenaline they should roll a guardian.

I dare you to spam F1 on a GS or try to land a Kill Shot w/o getting interrupted or the target not getting into cover. Not to mention under water bursts. Some F1 abilities just suck and you simply make use of your adrenaline passivly.

Adrenal Health is fine as it is. Heal on burst would only force you to spam F1 and having it on cooldown when you need it most.

Who said spam?, i love when people put words in my mouth, if you dont know how to use adrenaline wisely then how is that my problem?.

Alright… you don’t spam it. So what’s the problem? You get healed until you hit F1. On top of that you can take burst mastery and still benefit from AH even after hitting F1. It’d be actually a lot worse with the modifications if you don’t spam F1. I’m not even sure what your point is anymore. You constantly contradict yourself.

Im not contradicting, you are just too kitten to understand my point.

Evilek.5690:

Fenrir.5493:

Right now as it is a thief can spam and perma blind you all the time and you cant do anything about it, you dont even want to waste a condition removal on that because they are so easy applicable that is really unfair to have you all the time unable to attack, i find that this mechanic needs to go back so we can remove it just with the swing of the weapon is the only way to make it fair to the current state that is so spammable.

This thing makes aegis look like a baby.

Stay out of Black Powder

Problem fixed

So if im a warrior and i need to stay close to hit the thief i am now forbiden to do so because the thief ca spam this field?… eonugh with your bs.

And even if i did so, the blinds of thief are not only comming from that field, they have tons ways to put blind is a joke completely and mark my words is getting nerfed.

If its going to stay the way it is it should not be spammable is simple as that, right now it is.

Manuhell.2759:

Fenrir.5493:

Yes burning should be only on warriors,eles and guardians since they have poor acces to conditions, then nerf it.

So you’re saying an engineer’s flamethrower shouldn’t burn at all?

My bad i forgot that, include flame angies too =P …

And for the other guy… burning arrows is based on real life not in magick.

Right now as it is a thief can spam and perma blind you all the time and you cant do anything about it, you dont even want to waste a condition removal on that because they are so easy applicable that is really unfair to have you all the time unable to attack, i find that this mechanic needs to go back so we can remove it just with the swing of the weapon is the only way to make it fair to the current state that is so spammable.

This thing makes aegis look like a baby.

Yes, the stances trait should reduce cd not add like 2 seconds.

Yes burning should be only on warriors,eles and guardians since they have poor acces to conditions, then nerf it.