Guild Wars 2

Personally I have seen people do the dive when Im chasing them, I cant stop laughing at it everytime! (mostly because it has happene to me more than once )

I dont know about you, but personally for me it is one less login screen, not that I actually gather it anymore though, but I try to have as many stuff as possible, so collectionist here <;—-

Any chance you will review the Backstab damage? Perhaps move it to other skills and give HS a small 1 sec internal CD. Right now it is very unfair to be hit by 8-9k in PvP even wearing defensive traits/armor, and 14-15k in WvW unbuffed. I dont have a problem with thieves having burst, only that having the strongest hitting spell on the game without any counter is not very much fun to deal with.

Lots of good changes, glad about the warrior ones, as for eles lets see how it goes,

I would say arcane is the one that needs the most focusing, traits that is, specially Blasting staff, glad is was moved down, it definitely opens up more options. Definitely will be looking forward to this.

What I lvoed the most was the clarity and reasoning of each changes, thank you for that!

Dean Calaway.9718:

The commander tagged should be hard earned, not a money sink.

To fix the commander tag ANET needs to refund the people that bought it and implement the “earning it” method.

And this comes from a player that can afford the tag for his major 4 chars.

For WvW? Yes. For PvE? Heck no!!! . I love doing guild misions having 20-30 blue nachos all over the place. As for the requierements I guess a minimum of rank 50, lvl 80 and at least 6000 AP, but only when they make it so that commander tag is account bound and so is Wxp, until then no.

Though necessary, this is a bummer for people like me who already have a terrible time making any kind of income, I guess it will take me longer to reach that precursor at this rate, -sigh- , yay for more boring time at making 800 gold im so excited about this……………

Well, I think they are trying to push “supports” into the meta now, but damage/mobility is still king. Unless you are a guardian/warrior, support is very subpar because this game as a serious lack of healing and sustain, which means that eventually you will get wore down while doing insignificant damage to the enemy and providing little to your team in terms of [non-existent] heals or boons, which atm most class are self-sufficient about that

I think mesmers could use some regen too, or at least more accessible condition cleansing. Right now any damage or condition you put on a mesmer sticks like glue for the entire fight

Lets hope we can give warriors some balancing to bring them down to everyone’s power level, next to follow should be necros, spirit rangers, D/D thief.

Personally I dont understand why some people dont like her, I can assure you they are very few compared to the amount of people that do like her. Sure, the plot of the game is deviating from the dragons a bit, and sure I would like to see more dragon stuff, but what they fail to see is this;

the game has only been out for a year, thats a fairly young game, many people are still buying the game, some are starting the story, I havent even finished mine (and I have dungeon master already) so imagine if people bought the game and suddenly the entire story changes all of the sudden. I actually like all these LS, it would be better is they were spaced out for a month but oh well. I like the Scarlet character, Im also very glad it is a sylvari, a race that barely gets any action or story coverage (all sylvaris in LS have been bad guys, and only 2 of them).

Personally I would like if the dragon saga wasnt touched until the game’s 3rd year or so, I actually enjoy the entire dragon minion fights and speculation, the mystery, the struggles. For The Pale Tree’s sake, these are giant mounstrous dragons, responsible for wiping entire civilizations in endless cycles and being undestructable, I would definitely would not enjoy if suddenly a zerg of people waltzed into their lair and killed them in one swing.

They should do one for PvP ele, I would pay to see a Dev play the worst best PvP class in the game in high ranked matches.

That aside, I hope to see the dev with Kudzu, that would be really cool.

sorrychief.2563:

Because warrior use to be really bad?

so…?

Does that mean that since ele have been terrible for more than 6 months should they deserve a year of godlike status?

Im glad people like you dont work at balancing game, it would scare away the few players playing it…

thats pretty effed up, the fact that most of them are running LB/hammer shows it, I stopped at around 4 minutes because of how cheesy that is.

The community’s biggest fear became true; 5 warriors new meta, and the excuse of “but pro’s dont do it! a pro team would defeat that easily” is no longer valid….

for PvE anything works, even condition staff (-sigh-), so dont bother about it. As for sPvP, I will advise you to stay from it. Hotjoins are all nice and all but even there they have problems, so please dont burden your team by handicapping them with an ele.

Other than that I would say enjoy the class PvE, they are quite fun to play from the mechanic point of view (as compared to warriors which are very effective but totally boring). Yes they are weak in PvP but its ok, Anet actually wanted that, the proof they succeeded was the fact that there was 0 eles in the last MLG and the ele who dared to play that class in the next compettion after MLG costed the game to his team, so he wont be daring to that again anytime soon.

Hope that helps, /cheers

The A in Anet stands for RNG

esit.3927:

Please Please Please do not RNG this, I will pay 1500gems for it even just don’t hide it from me lol

Shhhhh, dont hype it too much and definitely do not give them those ideas!

Anet, 600-800 is all Im willing to pay for it, specially given how I plan to buy it for 3 characters

a t s e.9614:

Warrior is not the old D\D ele because even the OP ele had to press dozens of buttons but the current warrior only uses 3 .

^

and not only that, the old D/D ele would be ashamed of today’s warrior, old D/D today would be balanced among all the other OP stuff in the game.

Right now the balance is quite bad, yo have Warriors dominating in all aspects of the game, multiple viable builds and outshine most (if not all) classes in any role if traited for it, except maybe stability sharing and projectile reflection in which guardians are still king.

elementalists have been nerfed to the bottom of the pit, being not even bordeline unviable, but almost full blown unviable, only exceptions are glitching with FGS on bosses and staff ZvZ which received a couple of nerfs since now AoE take into consideration block and dodges, incredibly diminishing their damage.

Other than that balance for other classes has remained static, lots of unnecesary buffs, (which is the main reason why eles are so subpar rigth now; everyone but them got buffed in the right places, all eles got where their niche gimmicky conjure weapons buffed, and some QoL fixes to staff)

Not a full blown rework but steps towards it would be appreciated, for now lets see how the Cooperative Development thread develops, which to be honest, and I wish this is total cynicism from my part, I really hope they actually intend to take those stuff into consideration rather than have that thread as a way to shush people about how they are not “doing” something about it (like a political campaign).

Take too long and people will start to lose interest, but I have my faith in the devs, after all, for being only 2 dudes they have done well, and I feel so sorry that they are so overworked with all this, Anet really needs to redirect more resources from LS to balancing overall, not just sPvP (PvE is a mess, with warirors being top tier since day -2, now that also translated to PvP , their only “weak” spot til then)

Hype.8032:

Fortus.6175:

Hype.8032:

snip

WHo would have guess, a person playing more than one class, one build, right? Have you thought that maybe, just maybe, I dont play tanky guardian all the time? Is it even justifiable to hit 9-10k on a class with 11k hp, even if you are an assassin? No.

I dont care if the thief blows in about 2-3 hits, most of the time they stealth too quickly to be able to do anything about it anyways. I dont want more rock/scissor/paper gameplay. I want interactions! I dont want a game where the first one to jump on the other wins, and right now, given the lack of counters to stealth, a thief will have the jump on you 99% of the time.

No sir, this is not healthy for any game, I wont name any more games, but I can guarantee you that any non-FPS game where battle is decided by whoever gets the first jump or by rock/paper/scissor will get as much esport attentions as hello kitty.

And like I said, once again, you only want to take into consideration “top” players, which might not even represent the “skilled” bunch, nor the majority. Should we ignore the people in a democracy and let a selected few have the saying? No, it is called dictatorship, because I can assure you (been born in a dictatorship myself) they dont know whats best!

A 1000 ranked person has a much say in the matter as a non-1000, learn to accept that, or live to see that you will only see 1000 players in sPvP, which is [sadly] becoming a reality already.

Wow you played the dictatorship card! That’s awesome! That’s an auto-win move in my book.

The numbers you’re basing your argument on are wrong so I find fault with it. Fix them and we can have a deeper conversation. Annnnddddd….. since you asked, I think it is VERY JUSTIFIABLE AND DESIRED for an extreme glass cannon to be able to VERY QUICKLY dispatch of another extreme glass cannon. It is extremely fun knowing you have to be so aware of your surroundings to stay alive. It is very rewarding when you do it right. For people that don’t like living on the edge there are more balanced and even bunker builds available to them. This game is fast paced and it is awesome because of it.

Cheers!

P.S. I don’t think you understand what 99% means. That means 99 times out of a 100 fyi. You just claimed that out of 100 engagements the thief will have the jump 99 times. Four horned unicorn this time?

-sigh-, ok, I now understand whats going on, you just want to derail the thread, aka, old-school trolling.

Thanks sir but I will now refrain myself lowering to that. Thanks for the “arguments” but I believe there is nothing else you can add to this discussion since you are purposely trying to sabotage it.

I will however leave you with a note;

99% means 99 out of 100 times,meaning that whoever has stealth will engage first most of the time, hint; eles dont have stealth.

Hype.8032:

snip

WHo would have guess, a person playing more than one class, one build, right? Have you thought that maybe, just maybe, I dont play tanky guardian all the time? Is it even justifiable to hit 9-10k on a class with 11k hp, even if you are an assassin? No.

I dont care if the thief blows in about 2-3 hits, most of the time they stealth too quickly to be able to do anything about it anyways. I dont want more rock/scissor/paper gameplay. I want interactions! I dont want a game where the first one to jump on the other wins, and right now, given the lack of counters to stealth, a thief will have the jump on you 99% of the time.

No sir, this is not healthy for any game, I wont name any more games, but I can guarantee you that any non-FPS game where battle is decided by whoever gets the first jump or by rock/paper/scissor will get as much esport attentions as hello kitty.

And like I said, once again, you only want to take into consideration “top” players, which might not even represent the “skilled” bunch, nor the majority. Should we ignore the people in a democracy and let a selected few have the saying? No, it is called dictatorship, because I can assure you (been born in a dictatorship myself) they dont know whats best!

A 1000 ranked person has a much say in the matter as a non-1000, learn to accept that, or live to see that you will only see 1000 players in sPvP, which is [sadly] becoming a reality already.

Valentin.2073:

i dont want ele’s to get nerfed. that’s not my point.

maybe, i was wrong believing in an elementalist’s potential. idk.

i roll a spirit ranger build and i am aware how strong this build is but i never asked an ele to reroll in a tpvp match. i may not be a pro but i really don’t think they are a liability on a team as long as they know how to play their role well.

Once again, and let me emphasize this again;

unviable =/= useless.

Just because they can do something doesnt mean they still dont suck. This isnt about min/max anymore. An ele will pull your team down matched agaisnt equally skiled players.

LEt me put this even more simple; imagine every class had a number on a scale from 1 to 3 based on how useful they are. Warriors are 3, ele are 1

A team with a score of 12-15 matched agaisnt a team with score 9-12 is a no brainer. Eles still contribute one point, but thats still bad.

Hype.8032:

snip

Nope, guardian here, 15k hp, 2.7k toughness almost 2.8k, dont have screenshot but I have definitely been hit for 8-9k BS, and 5-6k HS, on my ele 9-10k in valkiry (ele in valkiri has 11k hp) and 10-11k BS on zerker are normal sightings too.

edit: No, I wont bother to climb a ladder to prove my point, so either take my word and about everyone else’s word for it or simply drop it because we are not going to get anywhere any time soon.

I can guarantee you that many(not all, but many) of those people high above 1000 have been “carried” by cheap cheese builds, just like it happened in SC1 with zerg rush. What happened when it got nerfed? Or when Xin Zhao or Vayne or Ezreal got nerfed in LoL? Bunch of people’s ranks plummeted, and we are not talking about small figures here! I wont bother to go farm rank here in the hopes I get a team with bad builds agaisnt my strong builds. The few times I have done tournaments they have been plagged with FoTM builds, enough to deter me from playing it.

3 hammer/LB warrior, another game 2 condi necro and 2 spirit ranger , both games games in a row, most games boild to that; pick the OP combo for better cahnces to win rather than truly display skills with an “alternative” build to the cheese builds.

Valentin.2073:

Fortus.6175:

Valentin.2073:

i notice some ele’s are getting tanky nowadays. i dont think that they are always the first one to die in a team fight.

eles move so fast. it’s really hard to catch them.

What are you playing, a guardian? lol, seriously, if you cant catch an ele you might definitely want to recheck your build!

i only get speed buff from my storm spirit proc. you all know how slow a ranger moves without a signet.

what i’m saying is that eles are getting viable after the latest patch. i see them getting stronger. believe me.

btw, guardians are not slow pokes. they can also move really fast.

well then, put on a speed signet, it is your fault not to use it! If you want to catch someone you will need it, not only for eles but for everyone, so that argument that you only have one swiftness is no excuse. A warrior activating signet elite will outrun you, lets not even count the GS skills that he can use for said purpose. A guardian will escape you too, staff or a swiftness shout + GS and he is already faster than ele. If you truly, TRULY thing eles have godlike mobility then let me pop you down of your cloud; if you see an ele using RtL to get away from you, that ele wont have any engage/disengage for 40 seconds, use it! relay that info to your mates if you are on voice chat. The only swfitness an ele gets from S/D combo is from switching to air, which isnt even specific to D/D because thats an 10 arcane trait, the other one is from updraft which needs to hit an enemy and has a 50s CD. Let me tell you even more, Scepter nor focus have any gap closer/gap opener nor swiftness other than, once again, switching to air, use it to your advantage! i assure you they wil NOT be able to outrun even a slug.

The D/D speed increase can only be proceed in combat and we are usually forced to take signet of air, which is a sacrifice, a sacrifice apparently you are not willing to take, so all I gotta say is; deal with it. We already have one of the lowest mobility in the game after necros and mesmers, we dont need to be gutted anymore.

PS: Oh yeah, you are a zoo pet ranger, I guess you shouldnt have much validity in topic given that you play that easy and OP specc, my bet is; you are trying [in vain, truth cannot be denied] to make others think that everything is ok so that your specc can remain dominant, wont happen, mate, most plyers are starting to slowly realize in how much of a bad state eles are.

Hype.8032:

The great thing about these forums is that everyone can voice their opinion as long as it’s not breaking the forum’s rules. What I challenge people to do is to look up the stats on the people making suggestions on balance. Try something like gwshack to see a person’s history on the leader board. Then, decide of you trust someone’s opinion about spvp balance by knowing their rank. Finally, if they’re not ranked it means they have not completed 11 games of tpvp and/or solo queue. Knowledge is power

FYI, in case anyone cares, thieves don’t have guaranteed 7-8k HS in spvp.

Cheers!

Disregarding the opinion of non-top-100 players is another thing that kills many games. Just because person has decided not to invest time into grinding for a leaderscore place doesnt mean they dont know what they are doing. Personally i find that the game is so unbalanced that it boils down to whoever has the strongest specc rather than skills. The fact that there was no ele in the last MLG and there was only 1 ele in the other pro scene (which costed them the game) , coupled with the fact that there was around 3x% zoo pet ranger (more than the combined ratio of 3 classes) tells you a whole lot about this! The more you know

Yes, certainly they dont hit 7-8k everytime, sometimes it doesnt crit and it hits for about 2-3k, but lets be honest, do you REALLY think it takes all that much skill to take a 15k hp class with 2.8k toughness down to 0hp in less than (not exaggerating here) 1.5 seconds? 9k BS followed by 3k HS and a 5k HS (which is overkill) for which you cant see at all or use Aegis nor any other block, and even if you dodge one the next HS will come shortly after. Do you really believe so? Cmon! Lets get real. Sure is fun for the thief, but as an observer if I see this the first thing Im going to do is mouse over the [x] button on the tab. If I enter a match and see a ranger using #1 skill and running, see the poor ele blow in a sec without any notice, after said ele stunlocked the ranger the entire time but still the ele dies a horrific death, yes, i (and many others) will hit the [x].

You really have to take those things into considerations. Fights that last too long are boring, but fights that last less than 1 seconds are even more boring.

Valentin.2073:

i notice some ele’s are getting tanky nowadays. i dont think that they are always the first one to die in a team fight.

eles move so fast. it’s really hard to catch them.

What are you playing, a guardian? lol, seriously, if you cant catch an ele you might definitely want to recheck your build!

Wintel.4873:

Currently I hate to have an Ele on my team, I would rather see them on the enemy team because they barely do anything.

Ele’s either use that awful Fresh Air build which dies instantly the moment anyone sneezes in their direction, dying so easily to autoattacks, random AoE splash damage, conditions, anything.
Or they’re that water+arcana “bunker” build with about half the survivability of a REAL bunker (warrior or guardian) and putting out absolutely terrible damage/pressure.

Ele players, I know you like how the class handles (15+ buttons/cooldowns, lovely), but please stick to PvE or WvW. Currently you have no role or purpose in SPvP.

If you must play then roll a Warrior or Thief, they take only a few minutes to learn and you will be VERY effective.

Pretty much this thread in a nutshell

Yes while I do agree that there should be certain traits and weapon for certain which are noob friendly, I also believe these shouldnt be more effective than aything else, which is the point of this thread.

It creates this false sense of skills in the game, and then you have players which come to the forums defending their [OP] classes since at their level of skills, they are still getting beaten playing them, but a skilled player will not only make the OPness of their class shine, but make it painfully obvious.

Example; take a warrior. Most warriors dont know when to disengage, they go all in and use bezerker stance right off the bat. These warriors are bad, really bad, but most of the time they are effective, because during that time, it is very difficult to stop the pain that will come your way. A good warrior will not only time said skill for when it is really necessary, but will also know when to use their GS skills to disengage if they feel they are not going to win (and given that warriors have the best mobility in the game), a well played warrior that knows what he is doing will not die easily, if at all, unless more than 2-3 people completely coordinate all their CCs to have a cahnce.

Same for thieves. A badly played thief (pretty much most of those who picked up the class and have little understanding of what they can do) will blow in teamfights, they wont know how to use stealth effectively and will run in straight lines which makes them walk right into AoE. A thief that knows what he is doing will not cast stealth right in front of any enemy, which makes said enemy weary of thier presence. A god thief will sneak around, cast a 10k backstab and back away, after the enemy wastes some long CDs in the hope to hit them, the thief will repeat said 10k backstab, apply blindness if necessary, will dodge if necessary, will teleport if necessary, instead of all the newbs who spam HS HS HS. After the enemy is out of dodges, the thief will use HS for a guaranteed 7-8k it.

The problem isnt that those two arent newb friendly, on the hands on a newb they are “balanced” and thats what they think they are because they dont know any better. In the hands of someone with a clue they are OP and greatly outdo anyone. This goes to well played spirit rangers, S/D and D/D thieves, warrior, condi necro, minion necro, etc etc

Normally my day to day schedule goes something like this;

AC p1/p3, FGC, go to bank and deposit. Open daily and see whats left to do, and do just enough to get it done.

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Seriously people, what did I just read.

Obviously, the Guardian is better than the Mesmer, with the one exception, that the Mesmer is better than the Guardian.

So it is a simple choice.

I….. well….I mea…… You kno……..

Um….

yeah…..uh yes, I mean, no? I dont ….. ahh

Hmm, I was thinking of maybe Guardian Monk, dunno but I like the idea of healing while healing some more.

Personally I love the casual nature of champ trains, they are friendly and give chance for social interactions in between. I go to FGC and in between bosses we usually have a 1 minute wait. We play mini games, we talk abut the most random stuff you can think of, a good chance to test damage agaisnt enemy fully debuffed and you having some nice buffs.

I can get in and out whenever I want, I dont depend on being stuck with a random elitist group of players.

is it fun? No, it is boring, yes. Do I want to do it? No. Do I need to do it? No. Do I need gold? Yes, yes I do. Everything in this game is base don gold and mats and currently this is probably the best and most reliable way of doing so.

What I dont get is; if they are not bothering you, why must you bother them?! I understand the gold inflation thing and I hate it as much as you do, in fact i really REALLY hate it since Im trying to play catch up with people but gold keeps decreasing in value everyday. But I dont have any other alternative. I like dungeon, I do AC and CoE and CoF, but I also want legendaries, and I already spent too much gathered mats into attempting on MF with no luck, so now I need gold, and need it fast.

Give me options, give options to people who want to spend time and get something out it. I still buy stuff on the gem store with $$, so the answer is not limit our options.

I dont want gold, I want what I now can only get with gold, so either give me the options to get it how I want to play or bite it and let me farm

Ronah.2869:

… and all females are equal to males. ha ha ha
Sorry, but I always laugh at the threads about “how to make all the professions be the same and then ask for more professions to be added to the game”

Terrible extrapolation, that does not correlate to the topic at all. Not only do you invalidated your own post by yourself but you made yourself look ridiculous.

It is quite obvious that many classes are suffering from being too uneven in most aspects of the game. The fact that Warr/Mes/Guard are the strongest classes in all aspects of the game shouts imbalance. Sure everything else can work in certain scenarios, but whereas an ele has to setup a ridiculously hard combo that can be easily avoided with the touch of one bottom as oppose to a warrior that can achieve the same [if not better] results with the touch of 2 buttons which are pretty much unavoidable tells a lot.

There is an obvious imbalance in this game, failure to see shows only chosen ignorance.

Actually, no, screw the part with GS and staff, just the class as whole, thoughts?

runeblade.7514:

Avead.5760:

Dont go 30 water..its a trap.At least not if you dont want to go pure bunker.
In fact dont even go 10 there..Sustain/bruiser ele builds are the biggest kitten there is atm.They die so fast doing nothing in terms of pressure.

This is completely wrong.

This is spreading misinformation at the finest.

Oh im sure you must be referring to all those eles who after you put some pressure on them thye run away and you cant catch them, all while you are capping the base they were standing at.

Show me a video of player playing agaisnt experienced players of an ele holding a point alone or with one mate where the ele doesnt have tor resort to run away with its tail between the legs. Remember, just because they can run away and you cant kill them doesnt mean they are fine, in fact, thre fact that you are now standing on the base and he is running away is prove that you won the fight (reminder, you win the fights by capturing points, not by running around)

DeckerDontPlay.1639:

Zord.6130:

dreztina.4820:

Zord.6130:

Good job using rtl while immob.
There actually is no targeting skill which can hit an ele during rtl as it is too fast. Rtl is the best escape in the game, period.

Lol, stuff like this is why the elementalist got so horrendously overnerfed. You are sitting here stating falsehoods as if they are definite fact, and the other clueless people are sitting there thinking ‘ya, this guy knows what he’s talkin’ about’

Ele is fine as it is. It’s the most balanced class out there actually, the nerf it took were necessary. The problem is that such nerfs should be applied to other classes too.
If rtl was brought back to 15s cd and 1550 distance we would see a lot more complaints about ele being op because “omg can’t kill the ele he always rtl and flees”.

Rtl is fine. Rush is fine. I just can’t stand people asking for unneeded nerfs.
And I play an Ele and a Mesmer, and hate the warrior current state as much as you do.

Hahaha, but the exact same complaints of warrior disengaging combat is completely acceptable and “is fine”?

….wut

Rush can even be spec’d to break immobilize….

\Double Standards/ [at its finest]

runeblade.7514:

Fortus.6175:

runeblade.7514:

Fortus.6175:

disengage at will,

We can disengage at will?

Is Rush, Whirlwind attack and Savage leap not effected by immobilize, chill and cripple anymore?

Berzerker Stance no working for you anymore? Brains to not use said skills when cripple/chilled/immo or to cleanse it not working anymore? I dunno man, if I have to choose in between having 3 disengages, one of them with 1550 range at the cost of only one cleanse, than having none at all, I would go with the warrior ones O_o

So he gotta waste tankiness skills that could be used to be op in a fight to escape. okay.

I know right?! A warrior having to make a mindful decision every profession has to make, the horror!

a t s e.9614:

Pro eles can win , maybe you need to learn your class a bit more .
I never said backstab hits for 2k , I said maybe whiners want
it to hit for 2k for a perfect balance . As I said S\F burst ele
is beter because it’s a RANGED burst . I don’t even play ele
and I know it’s strong in the hands of a GOOD player .

Argument fallacy; “hey, im sure someone ou there must be doing well, everyone must be total noobs, im sure of it, yep, total nobs” Im well aware im not the best ele in the world, let alone in NA. Yet I have 1500 hours on my ele, so I would dare to say Im quite experienced (gasp!). But I see where you want to take this thread: “ele vs thief”, and I will stop you right on your tracks, this is not what this thread is about, this thread is about problems that affect the game overall. And if you bothered to read the Opening Post (gasp, I know, too hard, right!?) you will see I mentioned that scepter ele needed some tuning down (GASP!, im starting to run out of air) but not for the reasons you are saying, but rather because it is holding back the class from getting the fixes it needs, since right now we are coined into playing this one-trick pony that only works agaisnt inexperienced players who have no coordination, but in any respectable team, focus the non-stealth, lacking-clones, right-in-plain-view-with-only-1-cantrip ele and he wont be able to burst anyone because he will be too busy healing himself up or eating the ground.

runeblade.7514:

Fortus.6175:

disengage at will,

We can disengage at will?

Is Rush, Whirlwind attack and Savage leap not effected by immobilize, chill and cripple anymore?

Berzerker Stance no working for you anymore? Brains to not use said skills when cripple/chilled/immo or to cleanse it not working anymore? I dunno man, if I have to choose in between having 3 disengages, one of them with 1550 range at the cost of only one cleanse, than having none at all, I would go with the warrior ones O_o

Between both, which one is in your opinion better and more fun in all aspects of the game. Weapons to focus are GS and staff, aspects include but not limited to; PvE, sPvP, tPvP, ZvZ, sWvW, dungeons, Open world exploration, etc…

go

BlackBeard.2873:

snip

Define ok; if by ok you mean having to depend on your team carrying your weight and having to run away from more than half the other classes, then we have two very different opinions of what ok is.

If you go into a match saying “please let there be no thief, mesmer, warrior, necros or ranger, PLEASE!” then you are going to have a very bad time.

Is it too much to ask to be able to go into a match and play without having to worry on when the next spawn is? I mean, I do get that some people enjoy playing eles because they get to see a lot of scenery when they are walking back to the battle, but I, for once, would like to be able to fight toe to toe with any opponent, or at least most.

a t s e.9614:

Lol 10k backstab.. trust me if he hits you for 10k , he has
2k armor and 10k hp . And warriors yes the healing signet
allows you to faceroll stuff and the cleansing ire but if they fix
warrior necro would be OP . They need to nerf their signet only.

It is hilarious to watch badly played thieves who go in, burst someone and then die, most of them are jumping on the wagon and picked up the class a few days prior to that. Well played thieves get away with stealth, teleports, blinds and then go and repeat the combo on somebody else. Then those “new thief” players get decimated because they die to quickly and come to complain about how their class is UP.

But suddenly if we want to make skillful eles be able to get that amount of damage from nowhere without any warning nor casting and the ability to disengage like thieves at will, then everyone loses their mind.

\Double standards/

Counterplay;

Stealth is the biggest offender IMO. Lets take for example stealth in various games.

Usually stealth is a clutch, that comes with handicaps or interesting ways to counter. I will use the WoW and LoL example. In Wow stealth was permanent, with the draw back that if you blatantly walked in front of someone in an open field, you would have a great chance of being visible for a split of second. This created a counterplay wher eyou would actively look around for the thief, you would try to get in their shoes and step where they stepped. You knew that they were most likely going to come from the sides or behind. You could position yourself and your team accordingly, to make it so that they have to think about it. Rogue felt sneaky but at the same time vulnerable, if he failed at it he had a skill to go into forced stealth at a very long CD, so it was a meaningful skill that couldnt be spammed. Movement speed was lower than normal and under no reason could they take 90% to 100% of your life in 1 ability no matter how squishy you were. (this is coming from a glass cannon mage/resto druid, which reached 2.2k arena rating).

LoL, you have wards that have some cost but the benefices greatly outweight the drawbacks, since stealthy characters could also use said wards to clear enemy wards, same goes for the teammates of the stealthed units.

In most balanced games, stealth is by itself the reward!. Here? You get movement speed, insta nukes that cant be blocked by nothing, you get to spam it, you can heal on it, you can still have access to plenty of hard hitting skills that require no more than pressing #2 without minding your positioning, without any drawback except a couple of seconds CD in which you can repeat it all over again.

Same goes for AI, you ignore it, you die, you dont ignore it, you still die. Passive regen which cannot be skillfully interrupted, unmatched mobility, highest base hp, immunity, insane damage, no drawbacks. There is no depth to those things, there is no fun for the one in the receiving end, basically you are not playing agaisnt other players but rather trying to beat a unfair system.

A good video of counterplay and how it plays:

Avead.5760:

Oblivion.8307:

u guys should try my 10/30/10/0/20 mlg zerker d/d ele build.

You should have played the suicide staff build .The great minds in anet hasve listened to us and conceived the 30/30/0/10/0 with lava tomb
Its revolutionary in the whole gaming world. Your goal is do die on top of them while being on top of lava font and then mist form for a third lava font.
More should run it in hot joins.The first time i got a kill this way i was laughing for whole minutes

Yah I have done something similar but with 10 in earth for 10% more in melee than water at 10% above health (which is what im guessing why you put those 10 in water) given how we are going kamikaze. Fun the first few times I got them low, then they kinda learned from it and started ranging me, basically the tactic only worked on those who dont know what AoE is.

sinzer.4018:

Fortus.6175:

Elementalists;

doesnt have a passive heal ticking 500 every second

Signet of Restoration is a passive heal and ticks for 202+0.1*Healing Power each spell cast.

Fortus.6175:

doesnt have condition or damage immunity,

Never heard of mistform eh?

For your information (which you seem to be quite ignorant about it), the signet of restoration is on ability cast, most of eles skills (staff) are on 3/4 to 1 1/2 seconds cast. The reason why warrior’s signet is so effective is because of their large hp pool and base armor. Lets assume this is a warror in Pvp with zerker amulet, which base hp is 18000 + 3200 from zerker amulet thats 21200, 500 with adrenal healing and signet no healing power. 1000 in 2 seconds.

Lets assume the ele is using scepter, 11k hp base plus 3200 zerker amulet, total of 14200 hp, and 260 less toughness (armor rating, thats 260 toughness less for eles). Also for argument’s sake lets say that said ele used a rotation of 6 spells; phoenix, dragon tooth, blinding flash, switching to air, lighting, RtL, updraft, all that took around 2 seconds rounded, 1200 total.

Sure ele won in that healing, but now lets look at the bigger picture. Before that both were hit by an ability that hit for 3000 damage followed by 2 autoattacks both 1000 each. Total damage 5000 in 2 seconds.

Ele lost nearly 40% of their hp in that, his skills are now in CD, he wont be able to heal all that unless he now blows 2 attunements for another 1200 healing, thats a LOT of CDs, now you are sitting out of attunements for 12-16 seconds. Thats 12-16 seconds you wont be healing much if at all, since you will most likely have to blow the active.

Now lets see the warrior, 5000 damage is actually less than 25% of their hp, not even counting the base armor. in 2 seconds they heal 1000 of that. In the same 12-16 seconds the ele wasnt healing anything the warrior healed a total of 6000-8000.

If you fail to see the flaw in that then you might want to revisit your math classes. Raw damage mean nothing if the percentage they come with are low. A person with a lot of money will not feel the same way about a college tuition of 1000 per credit when they have millions and their income is above 1000 a day, than say a poor student who barely makes it through the month and its income barely gets above 800 a week.

Also, mist form actually benefices the enemy more than you; you cant heal while in it, conditions still tick, enemy can use that time to cast long casting spells such as mantra, or cast healing skills without being interrupted, re-position themselves, put circles on the floor, meanwhile, you cant do anything at all, nada.

Anet, I have made a [small] recompilation of some of the things that wont let this game shine as long as this things happen.

> High hp, high regen, disengage at will, insane CC, insane damage, immunity to all conditions and CC, all in one build. Yes, warriors.

> Conditions spamming. Conditions should be tactical, just like condition cleansing are, thats why you have most condition cleansing skills on 40-80 seconds CD and cleanse only 2-3 conditions. Yet you have abilities that spam more than 2-3 conditions in 8-12 secs CD, some go as far as spamming it on ever autoattack.

> AI still too strong, nobody likes to go to a PvP to play PvE, only to be eaten by people who have never played the class before and are just running around. It is not fun to watch as an observer, it is not fun for the losing aprty, and the winning party doesnt feel any reward other than simply running around and getting points.

> Insta bursts. This is mostly about 10k Backstabs and 7-8k HS, isntant, from stealth, without any counter, same as AI, not fun to watch, no skills required.Yes, Im an ele defender but I admit that scepter needs some tuning down. Not because it is OP, but because it is not letting the real problem get addressed.

Let me explain a very important point. This is something that has killed many games in competitive environment. First you have to take into account 3 group of players; Your Team, Enemy Team, Observers.

For the health of the game, I advise you to fix it ASAP, because this is what killed SC 1 when zerg rush came out. Brain dead easy, effective, but required no skills. What happened to the community? When someone does this to good players it negates any skills they have acquire, the game becomes a cheap excuse, therefore these players leave. The ones that used the cheap technique think of themselves as good players, and when they start to experiment outside said build (either out of boredom, because all thats left is said build or because like in SC1, it got nerfed) they dont do well outside of it, but they fail to realize that they now need to improve themselves, they still think of themselves as good players, their “rank” drops and so they also start quitting. Then you have the observer, which gets no satisfaction from seeing people blow in a second without any legit counter, or get melted by invisible conditions which, once again, adds no counterplay, or simply get bored of trying to figure out whats going on in the midst of all those minions and pets.

But dont take my word for it, watch this video, it explains in detail the problem. I want to see the game to succeed, but you have to start somewhere.

a t s e.9614:

So a caster that throws fireballs from 1500 range should have a
higher mobility than a melee class? What a joke

typical ignorant forum goer

“fire ball” and “mobility” in the form of RtL in the same weapon, lets see, last time I check we didnt have weapon swap, I might be wrong, I havent logged in 12 hours so things might have changed in that extended period of time.

Xaos.3257:

19K and hit like a truck? please link this build i need it badly !
( for reality checking though we have only 70 trait points and we are not talking about wvw )

a’ight sir, I may have to ask for your forum posting card, since you have absolutely no idea of what you are talking.

First of all, the only way you can achieve 19k is by having 30 in water, and runes that have vitality on them, and even then the highest you can get is 18k, so you sir, are a blatant lier, and a really bad at it. Also, please “enlight” us on how a 30 water/30 arcane hits like “truck” when he has no power, no damage trait, no power runes, no critical chance, no critical damage, even if you dont take 30 arcane that ele will be dead long before the first rotation is over since each element has 16 sec CD.

Whats wrong with a elementalist wearing a full metal suite? Heck, I have been trying to get that look, the closer I have gotten is dredge, Vigil and a little of Kodan.

I do agree with the OP, I doubt it will ever be implemented but we can only hope.

PS: I dont want to wear a full-metal elementalist. In fact, quite the contrary. I play sylvaris and my favorite armor in the game is the TA heavy, which doesnt even look heavy at all, thats what i wear on my guard, thats what I want to wear on my ele.

No thanks. You want to see the skin? Ask for it. You want to see my gear? Ask for it. I play zerker for all my characters and I would never allow other people to scrutinize me or my mates’ gear.

Want to be an elitist? Go away, there are plenty of other games that will give you the pleasure of said thing. Warning though, most of those games are so unfriendly due to that attitude that the only thing it does is scare potentially new players and old players who have had enough.