Guild Wars 2

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Commander-tag-abuse
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Option-Disable-Commander-Tag

Lishtenbird.2814:

Come on, people are just happy with that update and want to fool around with the new shiny next to other happy people on day 1.

Give it a week, most people will get used to it, the effect will wear off, and everything gonna get to normal, but better with new abilities

Lishtenbird.2814:

NO.

First people turn off commanders tags because they don’t like several days of happy people, then whole maps yell at hordes of clueless randoms who turned off chat and commander tags simply ’cause they could change “something” in options, and ruin Teq and Wurm runs for the rest of the map.

We’ve had it with chat lang filter. No, just no.

Making commander tags 75-50-25% opaque? Yeah, okay.

Looks like it got changed from a scaled down full-texture full-polygon Eir mesh to a separate low-poly low-texture full-size mesh. If you consider the performance cost of rendering another fully textured player constantly among other minis, that makes sense and I won’t be surprised if other minis got similar treatment before the “permanent minis” patch. Not saying that I approve of such drastic measures, though.

By the way, it explains why Fire Ele, Maw, Wurm have been severely nerfed back at April Feature patch and have never been buffed since… It was all planned till September.

Behe got a reduced amount of champs and vets AFAIK.

Paradox.1380:

and the biggest whining on the forums is because of people and their precious alts…

I can’t agree that the “biggest whining” is limited to “our precious alts”, though. The biggest whining is about treating players as five-year-olds and the direction the game is heading, which goes for both categories – old and new.

By the way…

Paradox.1380:

which my post was about the things that AREN’T locked if you know where to find them.

Paradox.1380:

If you already know how to do it, just do it.

“Hello, I’m a brand new player who read about the awesome wardrobe, and dyes, and minis and bought the game to roleplay! Wait, wha… Why the hell can’t I change my armour dyes and apply skins and get an Ember to RP with my friends?!”

Paradox.1380:

This video is in accurate and was filmed before they fixed bugs.

Removing something which had a locked icon and a “This feature is locked until level 6” tooltip is not “fixing bugs”, it is “making undocumented changes shortly after release”.

Vayne.8563:

And rightly so. Because they have to worry about more than just us.

I managed a store and if someone came to me with concerns about my employees, I’d listen to them, and then generally defend my employees.

I wouldn’t necessarily say the customer was wrong, but the fact is, many times what the customer was complaining about wasn’t the fault of the employee. On a more important note, what if Chris didn’t defend the employee.

How would a customer feel if I said, look, I know Richie is a problem but he’s the best I can get?

As soon as you start blaming your employees people will start calling for heads, and that helps no one. Particularly if employees aren’t at fault. WHere does the fault lie? Management? Miscommunication? Sabotage even? No one really knows.

But yes, when employees see a manager stand up for them, in increases their loyalty to the company.

And you know, like it or not, Anet worked really kitten this patch and if I were an employee, I’d feel shattered. The fact is, just as a decency thing, I’d support an employee and if they did something wrong, I’d talk to them in private later. No one really deserves levels of ridicule and hate that are being poured on Anet employees right now.

No one asked Devs to defend or shame employees, it was their own choice. What people want to hear is:

"

• We had hard decisions to make, and I personally think we did the best we could in the given situation. My team was really helpful, thanks to them!
• Here’re the reasons why we did this and once again diverted from our Manifesto to a Generic MMO: 1, 2, 3…
• Here are the customers we need to keep providing you, veteran players included, with new non-sub content: 1, 2, 3.
• Here’re the people who we used to test these changes: 1, 2, 3…
• Here’s the behaviour data we’ve been seeing before the patch, here’s what we hope to see after the patch. Yes, these are the non-vocal majority. Here’re the people from vocal minority we’re ready to lose as a result of these changes. New data will come in a week, month – let’s compare it together.
• Things A, B, C are bugs. They should only work for new accounts, we’re fixing it!
• Here’re the reasons these bugs passed our QA. As you can see, it’s complicated and we were not able to test downscaling issues with the new system and huge XP losses.
• Things D, E, F are intended; tell us what you think can be done better, we’ll compare it with our metrics and come to a compromise!

"

What people hear and equal to “silent”:

"

• We’re proud of the work we’ve done, it’s awesome!
• Some minor fixes will make it even better.
• Now we can talk about guilds.

"

Some of the really important things are hard to say from a PR point of view, but it has to be done if they want a loyal community which brings their friends to the game and keep it running! Otherwise, I can’t blame people for raging. Yes, a large part of the feature patch is awesome – but we’re not complaining about the awesome part, we’re complaining about how the whole spirit, the main idea of the game has been altered in a way which many people consider to be degradation, not evolution. The new patch came, and it was just as before – lots of small cool stuff… and a big letdown which nullifies my overhyped trust and makes me hide my wallet again.

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

You might try reading the Dev tracker.

What Dev Tracker says about the leveling changes is that they’re honestly proud of the work their team have done.

Paradox.1380:

Dye Armor
Can Use Wardrobe just open it up
Can use Minis

http://youtu.be/D-On3Ya0_4Y?t=6m10s

Zaxares.5419:

Still, if the PS now works like the LS, I’m concerned that this means that mobs throughout the PS steps now also don’t give experience. That brings up the same problem that afflicted parts of the LS; namely, that players who have builds that are setup to take advantage of kills (e.g. Bloodlust sigils, gain health/energy on kills, the Sweet Revenge trait of Warriors) are handicapped in these missions, because slain enemies do not count as far as the “on-kill” mechanics are concerned.

Jumped into this thread to check if the bloodlust thing has been finally fixed. Very sad to see that it is still not a priority fix, and now even made worse…

Butter.3024:

Living Story is a mistake, it is not what most people want. We want update contents on Dungeon, WvW, PvP, new classes, new mechanics, constant class balances, etc Make the game exciting again, wow all of us with your new innovation again, please, no more Living Story.

Sigh… Again. Please stop speaking for everyone, people. Seriously… I know I like Living Story, I know I don’t want new classes and new mechanics.

Butter.3024:

Please use your advantage as GW2 has some of the best combat system and expand on it by developing new mechanics for WvW, modes for PvP, or new dungeons etc

Two PvP maps have been datamined in this patch.

LordByron.8369:

Stephane Lo Presti.7258:

Hey everyone,

While this is currently working as intended, it’s definitely something that we’ll be working on and tweaking in the future. We want you to be able to enjoy your minis so hang in there!

I think its not.
Asking to be moved from a low population map, while the mini is hidden due to high population seems not to work as intended.

It most likely means that population has increased on the server where this instance was being run.

You know, it’s like being asked in a large hotel to move out of an empty hall to a better one with more people, while also saying that lighting will be reduced because of increasing amount of people (in other halls).

Virtus Draco.8936:

• An option to treat search times in an AND fashion rather than what seems to be an OR fashion. For example if I enter the search words “superior water” it seems like the search still lists all items with the word “superior” plus all items with the word “water”, I always wished that searching this way would drill down to “Superior Rune of Water” as the most likely match.

I would prefer to always have AND as the default behaviour. Anything else is as intuitive as Windows 7 start menu search (read: very unintuitive and providing unexpected results).

I think I reported it about half a year ago…

Fixed a bug that prevented interact UI from showing while moving the camera.

Yay!

You should write with such issues to Support, not Forum.

Top of page – Support – Submit a request. Good luck!

I feel something weird’s happening with “Interact” objects and right mouse button camera after the patch.

(I think that) previously, interacting with some objects while RMB was held had been possible. Now, I have to release RMB to get the “Interact” prompt for many objects.

This usually does not happen for something large like crafting stations. This does happen for objects in dynamic events and renown hearts (like green F.O.O.L. oozes from killed mini-animals, poisonous plants in Caledon Forest).

I’m checking the new leveling system with my alt and it is really annoying because now I have to stop the camera each time to interact. I have already killed one gaming mouse’s right button because I always use that camera mode, I do not want that to happen again

To each his own

I like it, it’s shiny as I expect from a fantasy game, it has an energy theme, it’s different enough from Zenith (yes, it is – look closer) but still resembles it so can be used in a dual-themed weapon set, it’s purple and fits mesmers

Probably it will be somehow connected to the (buffed?) Shatterer, or to some new LS events with the Branded. But I won’t be surprised to see it as the future 20k+ AP rewards – makes even more sense with the Radiant and Hellfire chest skins in wardrobe.

Happened to a guildie in a dungeon, a drop from 80-60 FPS to 8 FPS. We were fine. It got fine back for the guildie after a game restart, too.

Apart from that, I haven’t noticed a decrease; on the contrary, the picture looks smoother but the FPS is okay.

Sounds like a massive lag to me.

Didn’t have any problems with opening bags/boxes from the dungeons today. (Yet.)

Lishtenbird.2814:

Come on, people are just happy with that update and want to fool around with the new shiny next to other happy people on day 1.

Give it a week, most people will get used to it, the effect will wear off, and everything gonna get to normal, but better with new abilities

Lishtenbird.2814:

NO.

First people turn off commanders tags because they don’t like several days of happy people, then whole maps yell at hordes of clueless randoms who turned off chat and commander tags simply ’cause they could change “something” in options, and ruin Teq and Wurm runs for the rest of the map.

We’ve had it with chat lang filter. No, just no.

Making commander tags 75-50-25% opaque? Yeah, okay.

Edv.2640:

Bump. Anyone have to say anything?

Yes. You can change the game to that one you got all these mounts-dueling ideas from

Cheers!

I’m afraid that may be a fix to this: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/lwd/Default-Character-Animations-Spoil-It-All …

Blude.6812:

Rather than reporting tags, there should be an option implemented for the player to disable the tags (same as turning off player/npc names in the settings).

I would only turn them back on when I wanted to join an activity that requires a CMD for organization/leadership.

NO.

First people turn off commanders tags because they don’t like several days of happy people, then whole maps yell at hordes of clueless randoms who turned off chat and commander tags simply ’cause they could change “something” in options, and ruin Teq and Wurm runs for the rest of the map.

We’ve had it with chat lang filter. No, just no.

Making commander tags 75-50-25% opaque? Yeah, okay.

Vol.7601:

I don’t like the version so far.

I salvage a lot of rares, which ends up giving me a ton of rare sigils. Having to sell them one by one is brutal. Old TP made it pretty easy.

Now I’m just going to be saving up all my sigils in my inventory and selling them each week rather than when I get them.

The previous sliding panel was really neat in letting us sell items one after another, agreed.

Maybe they should reintroduce it – turn the popup into a panel on the right; slide the current inventory from the bottom to the left (narrow panel); slide away the bags when in “sell/buy” mode.

Missing: “There’s a new unexplored area in the map!” icon which lures you to an unclimbable rock.

Come on, people are just happy with that update and want to fool around with the new shiny next to other happy people on day 1.

Give it a week, most people will get used to it, the effect will wear off, and everything gonna get to normal, but better with new abilities

What I really want to see is the metrics on people staying and leaving after this patch.

• Completely new players.
• Players currently in lower levels.
• Veterans.

All I want to know if people buying the game and starting it really deserve as much respect as the new changes imply. Unfortunately, we’ll never see true data on this… unless in some miraculous way the changes get rolled back in a month or so, which would clearly show that dumbing down the game had a fast undesirable effect. And unfortunately again, the real effect will most likely be postponed till a later stage, when the game will be craving for loyal paying veterans but instead would have them washed out and the only ones staying would be young children with zero dollars to spend and zero attention to the game past lvl 80 personal story.

Temujin.2587:

When you sell something you get a popup with two buttons “OK” and “Close”.
What is the difference between them?

I was surprised by this too when I saw it in the preview, but I think that [OK] returns you to the sell/buy popup in case you want to buy/sell more, and [Close] closes the sell/buy popup and returns you to TP inventory view.

AlexEBT.7240:

Danikat.8537:

I’m fairly certain that around the time of the China launch they said the VIP system would never be added to EU/NA servers.

If it is then I’m going to need a new MMO.

They also said they’ll not introduce the levelling systems from the chinese release to the western client. And they sure kept their promise……..for a few months.

Some key people from GW2 development have moved from the game during that time IIRC.

They’re bringing the Chinese “teleport to a friend” function soon too, if you trust datamined info. So… yes, I won’t be surprised if they do.

I endured megaservers and their problems and effects on the living world, I endured the dumbing down of leveling with overcomplicating of traits… But I will likely not stay in the game if they implement the VIP system, regardless of what cool features they introduce along it. Some things could work in Asia with the natural “hierarchy” mentality… but we’re not Asia, we’re equal, independent and “proud”.

Yes, this.

It felt like a free world. Like, you know… a second life. An adventure, where your choices were all that mattered. You could do content above your level if you were good, and fail if you were not. You wandered around the world and enjoyed that “living world” with dynamic events and tons of stuff to explore.

Now you log in, press [F], hit 1, get a cookie for it and are directed by large arrows to the next press [F] and hit 1 on the map. You know, like those linear Crysis, Need for Speed and browser flash games.

Oh, exciting!.. not.

Problem: PU condi mesmers are overpowered in 1v1.
Solution: Nerf all condi traits across all mesmer builds. Further buff thieves in 1v1 as a result.

Problem: Warriors are overpowered and can easily disengage from situations when they’re not due to superior mobility.
Solution: Nerf adrenaline across all warrior builds and don’t touch their mobility.

/shrug

I may not be used to the new TP yet, but for me, it looks more confusing than helpful.

Here are some things that I find disturbing:

• Cannot insta-buy/sell multiple items easily. Say, I need 4 foxfire clusters; they’re sold for 40s 01c (2x), 40s 02c (1x), 40s 09c (1x). Previously, I could skip setting the price and just buy 4 of them; now, I have to buy 2+1+1, clicking several times instead, or tick the price and change the quantity later! The (!) colourful notifications are more confusing than helping. If we stick to the current interface, an “auto match price for instant sell” tickbox which removes restrictions on the quantity bar and greys out the price field may solve the problem. The tickbox setting should persist. However, I do not think this is a perfect solution – some kind of unified “max quantity + auto price” button could’ve worked faster, but it’s extra buttons in a small UI, so..

• No real “projected profit”. Discussed thoroughly before, over and over again in this thread. No, I don’t want to use an offline calculator or alt-tab to a browser in 2014; that javascript can subtract for me.

• No “max” button. The slider is nice, but as for me, it isn’t really helping set max amounts.

• “My lowest listing” no longer visible. This is a step back: it is not nice for trading in markets which like to shift.

• Number of buyers/sellers no longer visible. This is a step back: seeing these numbers lets you get the idea of the market at a glance.

• Hard to tell whether you’re selling or buying at a glance. If you’re selling/buying while doing other things (like chatting) and lose concentration, you get the unified interface when you return, which is confusing. “Just look at the buttons!” – you say; “Why not make it clearer regardless?” – I say. For example, by changing the backgrounds of buy/sell popups – like blue/yellow. While writing the post I realised that there was color differentiation, but it is too subtle to be noticeable. And an extra title wouldn’t hurt – there’s enough space on top.

• If we stick to the current button positions, than moving the [Ok] [Close] buttons on the green popup a bit to match positions of [Sell Instantly] [Cancel] would speed things up a bit – double mouse click without moving the mouse.

• “I hateAnnoying Animations” mode extra to the “I amEvon Gnasblade” mode, or whatever it is spelled. Please, please let us disable animations! I’ve always found them annoying and distracting in all OSes and applications and disabled them; I understand that it is “pretty, cool, modern” for some people, but for others it’s just an eyesore.

I still don’t think the suggested changes would make the new TP perfect, because I believe that the whole “Sell/Buy instantly” concept of trading should get a larger, separate focus – as before (tabs? auto buttons?), but those can make TP a bit better and less confusing for people who’re really using it, at least.

More suggestions on how to fix the newly introduced UI confusions are welcome.

Edit 1:

• No way to refresh listings while thinking about selling/buying.
• Cannot see your previous buy orders in listed order.

Noticed this too. The highlight is nice in cluttered inventory with karma stuff mixed in, but it should persist through uses.

The AoE mantra effects look AWESOME.

No cooldown to swap after clone spawn on iLeap is really nice, too.

The decoy nerf is meh, but not surprising with the whole PU nerf QQ campaign in mind.

Having a larger AoE on GS3 looks promising.

azzy.6485:

None of the above makes it ok to make gem store items worth AP, imo.

How about the fact that…

• A full set of BL weapons gives 1 (one) AP.

?

Infernia.9847:

It’s a shame they couldn’t code a check box after character creation for additional alts:

• I got this, I know what to do, no hand-holding please
• I’m still fuzzy please help

Most software miss this good ol’ approach nowadays unfortunately. You have to deal with the simplest version of UI whether you like it or not. I guess it’s the image of the epoch.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

So our levelling process has to be handicapped for the “less gifted”?

Something has to be sacrificed, either on the “casual” side of the game, or the “pro” side of the game.

GW2, unlike many “serious” sub-based MMOs, is focused on the B2P model which, obviously, attracts many fairly casual people who are not ready to pay a sub but want to play a true non-free non-junk MMO (like me, yes). So obviously, unleashing full potential at early levels for pro players has to be sacrificed. Am I happy with it? Not really. But am I happy that it still lets me play an MMO after a year for free because other people pay for it? Yes.

Official point of view:

Yeah we thought so too. After tens of thousands of usability testers and interviews with players who tried Gw2 and left leading up to China launch both in NA/EU and in China – we learned we were wrong.

Honestly, we were kind of shocked how many systems, downed included a surprising number of players just didn’t understand. For downed, we tried a downed tutorial, building downed into the level 1 tutorial, etc. We found after usability testing with numerous different groups, the best rate of people learning and understanding it came from having it be layered complexity and the solution we went with above. Intuitively that wouldn’t have been my guess either initially, but we found people understood it better this way than all other options we tried.

This same level of testing led to the other changes as well. At the end of the day the biggest take away I’d say is: all of us, especially people who go to a reddit to discuss a game, probably know games (and Gw2) really really well. We have millions of users, and a tiny % of them frequent game forums or reddit. Just because all of us, me included, learned those systems well and thought it was all really easy doesn’t mean we are the norm

Source: http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/2etzxq/a_fresh_start_the_new_player_experience_in_guild/ck35771

My point of view: while I agree that gating such things behind levels implies thinking of your players as Facebook Farmer clickers, I also agree that there is an overwhelmingly surprising amount of people who just can’t handle the simplest things without being spoonfed – globally, outside gaming as well. I don’t like it and don’t think the game should be adapted to the lowest common denominator, but oh well… maybe if they do speed up the 1-15 leveling as I’ve heard in the preview, they’ll find a balance between ultra casual people who pay for the game and still let us play without a sub, and the amount of frustration such things bring to veteran players leveling alts.

I’m okay with it since

• it’s optional and insignificant in terms of the core part of the game
• it lets ANet get more money from people who want to pay to do more stuff for people who don’t want to pay.

Ltomato.8649:

Wait wait wait, so you collect a bunch of exotics and you get Ascended Armor, but you complete all the sets of Ascended Armor and you get an exotic?

Please tell me I’m not the only one that this doesn’t make sense for.

You’re not the only one. I was excited as this could give me an incentive to craft ascended for alts, but not anymore.

It would’ve made sense if these included expensive mystic forge exotics, but a couple gold champ bag exotics… not excited.

Are you/your team consulted when releasing information about upcoming patches which could affect economy, or is the system flexible enough to handle it on its own? Like, the UnId dye speculations, mini flipping, spike in prices for collection items seen in Wooden Potato’s video, ambrite stuff etc.

Are all of these speculations healthy for the economy? I remember you saying that on average people lost money on UnId dye flipping, but what about current items? Is the larger TP tax for items which spiked good enough on its own in the long run?

WGuardian.1028:

Lishtenbird.2814:

Then just remove the total price (which is only important to buyers) and replace it with total profit, which is what is most important to every seller (and seller is that very person who’s using the sell panel, not the buyer).

So u wnat to enter not the “price per unit” in sell tab but “profit per unit”.

No no no we should go to the armoury, I mean that I want to input the price per unit (which makes total sense as I can see other prices in the bottom part of the screen), but the largest price which says “total price” can be replaced by “total profit”, because there’s no point for me, seller, to know how much it will cost someone else per several items; I as a seller want to know how much I would get totally with the current price and the current amount.

WGuardian.1028:

Best solution will be forced tutorial as 1 of steps in PS or something like that.

• A new hint, similar to skill hints and so on.
• The basics explained on the 1st “intro” panel. It has repetitive information anyway.
• An (i) or (?) small icon to click/hover over to show that additional info tooltip is available.

WGuardian.1028:

So numbers will differ and this will make some troubles for ppl who r not used to TP (but in TP v1.0 it’s not better; I had issues with seeing different numbers in pick-up tab and in sell tab) or who dont use it frequently. Your suggestion to give 3 numbers will lead to same issues as we have now.

If people don’t care to read the info they are presented, that’s their problem. However if the “projected profit” lies about the actual profit, that’s the problem of the UI. But I agree that adding – and = might oversimplify things; still, the same layout can be done without them.

WGuardian.1028:

U will care if it’s not 5s fee but 100g, will u?

• I will see that fee in the “listing fee” field.
• Selling an item with a 100g listing fee and never ever learning the basics of TP is very unlikely.
• If one fails to read “listing fee” and understand that it’s a fee taken for listing an item… I don’t think anything in the UI can be done to help that person.

And again, what I care about over everything else is how much money I will receive in the end once I sell the item. That’s the bottom line, while everything else can be optional information – not the other way around.

WGuardian.1028:

Part of my job is development of interfaces for different applications and i can tell u that interface of new TP is close to the limit of numbers of buttons/tabs/pop-up windows/links between windows which is user freindly. Of course it’s only first impression from what i saw in blog post. If u add more elements u will just confuse ppl even more. If interface is used for not just pick out “ok” or “cancel” then some part of functionality should be done on user side. As for now i dont like the implementation of this particular feature but i like overall changes that they made to TP.

Then just remove the total price (which is only important to buyers) and replace it with total profit, which is what is most important to every seller (and seller is that very person who’s using the sell panel, not the buyer).

WGuardian.1028:

Pretty good placement of the “projected profit” but answer some questions pls:

1. When this transaction is made what number u will c in your pick-up box?

2. Goes from 1 – your 3d picture have “minus” and “equal” signs but are TP’s fees work like this?

I think devs already answerd this and some more questions when they had discussions about TP v2.0 and it’s more complicated to make it more userfreindly then players think.

If u just update your 3d picture with even more signs it won’t be any better cause players will just “get lost” in the interface.

1. If you sell an item for 1g, 5s will be subtracted from your wallet the moment you list, 90s will be put into pick up tab the moment it sells.

2. It doesn’t really matter how TP fees work. What matters is that the profit from the operation is +85s, which is the ultimate information a player needs, even if it works kitten + 90s = 85s. That’s why gw2spidy does it that way. As for supplemental info, the best option is hovering tooltips which say “Listing fee is subtracted immediately from your current funds when listing items. It is unrefundable even if you remove the item from listing.” and “Exchange fee is taken upon successful transaction. Exchange fee will not be taken if you remove the item from listing.”, respectively.

If I have 9g 15s and need 85s more in my wallet to get 10g, I list an item for 1g and see I’ll get 85s once everything’s done. I don’t care that my funds are now 9g 10s, I don’t care that I pick up 90s, all I care that in the end I get 10g.

Because if I do it with the current system, if I list something with a “projected profit” of 85s, I won’t get 10g total. Which is silly, because “projected profit” has the word profit, and doesn’t say “projected amount of money I’ll pick up” instead, even though that’s exactly what it means currently.

Ridley.3691:

since you’ve probably tried out most of the different gamemodes before hitting 80, like WvW, sPvP, dungeons etc,

I left all these things till 80, as many other “cautious” players who prefer to level up before trying anything suicidal.

Disagree.

Being non level 80 is boring.

Behellagh.1468:

And there isn’t aesthetically room for a third piece of information in that layout.

Here you go.

For me, the extra space there looks exactly like something to put “projected profit” into.

(Also, while making these images, I once again saw that having leading zeros would’ve been really good for improving clarity).

Curtis Johnson.8456:

‘Get More Gold’ button simply connects to the existing Currency Exchange. It’s not a new feature, just a more connected UI.

For complaining about the new button, here’s this thread: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Get-more-gold-button-new-TP

As a side note, reading the main thread on a feature usually answers most questions: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Trading-Post-2-0-Last-Feature-pack-Arcticle

Erukk.1408:

Lishtenbird.2814:

It works both ways. Think of it like you’re a child who runs into grown-up businessmen in a conference hall and they get extremely annoyed by you. It may turn out that tomorrow they may wander into your kindergarten and will annoy you and your friends. And in 30 years you’ll likely become that grown-up who’s annoyed by children. So just try to be considerate and go play with your own type of people without accusing anyone, okay?

The difference being that the “child” would run into a conference hall full of “businessmen” because it might be fun and they don’t know any better. The only way a “businessmen” wanders into a kindergarten is because s/he purposely goes in with intent.

They may as well be doing business there, looking for ways of improving the site, trading supplies. Children may as well annoy grown-ups because they crave attention and find malicious behaviour to be effective. There’s no difference, really. I’ve seen more annoying noobs (like, intentionally speaking German in an international group, not listening to tactics overview in fractals, and then kicking instance owner on 3rd fractal; or ragequitting at Mai Trin because they fail to run out of AoE and die there) than elitists actually (in a whole year I’ve been kicked from a party once, only after several wipes, and because I really was a noobish condi-tank staff mesmer at that time; on the other hand, I was carried once in a “rush” party I joined even though I was the same non-DPS character).

So this stuff happens from both sides. Unless you see the whole picture, judging people by a couple of (most likely biased and omitting) sentences is not a healthy approach.