I can’t see where they said they’ll have better stats.
They said they’ll add more update related items, that’s it.
Do the halloween exotics have better stats? Nope.
@above
At launch we will only have ring and back items, they’re going to add the rest of the slots as they go.are you serious? did you not even read what Ascended items are? go read the release adn then come back. turn the lights on, and maybe have your browser turned to font 40. it’s in plain as day english, ascended stats are better than Exotic. no if, ands, or buts. They’ve even stated that it’s a new tier, and will make existing content easier for you! (meaning it’ll be a big increase on your character’s performance). Not to mention, it has alot of +magic find, which is the highest rated stat.
It’s the start of the never ending god kitten treadmill. they want to be like WoW for whatever reason despite having success with their original design.
And legendary stats are better then ascended which is also better then exotics? What is your point? Your already grinding for legendary… they are just adding a inbetween gear…. it won’t be the best in the game. Therefore the whole argument about a gear treadmill is totally debunked.
This nothing but this i dont see why people cant understand this
Currently there is no “progression” from exotic to legendary. They have the same stats. The only “reward” is aesthetic.
Now with Ascended gear, you have to grind for them, as their “rewards” are not only aesthetic but also have stat increase.
They are creating a stat gap between exotic and legendary with ascend being in the middle…… at least thats how it reads in the announcement made by Chris.
They are not. They’re adding a gap in between exotic and the new tier, Ascended. There is no gap to legendary (which will be EQUAL to Ascended with the patch), there never was. It was a problem they invented.
to clear stuff up folks (cuz the devs PR is purposely muddy), legendary = same stats as exotic. After patch, legendary = same stats as Ascended.
so dose this mean if we get our legendery we NEVER have to worry about a “gear grind” again as it will always be the equivalent to the strongst wepon?
For the patch this week, yes. Legendary will be equivalent to Ascended. For the future, who knows. (judging from other MMOs “item progression”, dont count on it.)
There was never any stat gap between legendary and exotics anyway, so the entire Ascended thing with better stats is why people are pissed. We all bought the game to get away from stuff like that since that is what they marketed GW2 as.
Exotics were basically a freebie when you hit 80. I am sorry thats the truth.
60 gold is a freebie? Because thats how much it costed to fully exotic out/set up a character of mine and transmute it to look decent.
Last I check, ppl saying it take an average of 1 hr and 30 mins to get 1 gold, assuming you totally focus on grinding gold that entire time. So inorder to get 60 golds, that would mean you need to delicate 90 hours of farming gold. So unless that player play the game 24/7, the 90 hours isn’t freebie >.>
I don’t know about you but when I hit 80 I had plenty of gold….. and karma.
Heres the difference you didn’t grind for it you got it along the way while questing and completing story…. that is not the same.
Now this new gear could be entirely rewarded based on your new content progression the further you progress the new content the more new gear you get…. that is not =/= to grinding.
When new gear is introduced and the way you get it is say through some point system that has nothing to do with story or progression THAT IS GEAR GRINDING. When new gear is introduced as part of the story line that you get alone the way THAT IS NOT GEAR GRINDING.
They are creating a stat gap between exotic and legendary with ascend being in the middle…… at least thats how it reads in the announcement made by Chris.
That is the whole point. They are creating a stat where before there was not.
So that they can say that ascended are the stop gap for legendaries. They are creating their own need for a stop gap.
The only difference from legendaries and exotics before was aesthetics. Now after creating this new stats gap (in the first place), they are going to fill it up.
It makes no sense, other then to add Gear Progression and Power Creep.
But this is where you are assuming. You are assuming that they will create a new tier above legendary, if it is a true gear treadmill there is no end.
Creating gear that is lower stat’d then the “best” gear in the game doesn’t scream gear treadmill to me, in the sense of how wow runs things….
Again people are making assumptions and freaking out over it.
Had GW2 launched with exotic > ascend > Legendary, you would not be throwing a fit right now. And thats the truth of it.
Yes I am unhappy, because they went back on their promise made.
Here is one of their quote:
“Here’s what we believe: If someone wants to play for a thousand hours to get an item that is so rare that other players can’t realistically acquire it, that rare item should be differentiated by its visual appearance and rarity alone, not by being more powerful than everything else in the game. Otherwise, your MMO becomes all about grinding to get the best gear. We don’t make grindy games — we leave the grind to other MMOs.”
-Mike Obrien, President of ArenanetAnet is clearly going back on their promise to all of us. I and many others came to GW2 because it was promised there was no gear grind or “brand new gear that is better then the current best” releases.
Exotic and Legendaries stats are ON par with each other pre-15th Nov.
If Ascended was introduced before GW2 came out. They would have been the best, stat wise, from the start of GW2.
It was not introduced when GW2 came out. Instead exotics were.
So clearly Anet broken their own promise. What is keeping them from doing it again in 6 months time when the grinder scream bloody murder again.
They have proven that their word is flexible.
No you are assuming that the new gear is going to be hard to get…. you have no idea if its just another part of your progression when they release the content…. just like how you aquired exotics with pretty much 0 effort you just played through the content and got them.
You have no idea really. You are just mad that there is a stat change its that simple. It could be hand me out gear just like exotics. While legendaries take a lot of effort to get.
They didn’t break their promise. They said they don’t want to make it a gear grind, and since you don’t know how the new gear is aquired you can’t assume its going to be some grind. Because it very well may be that you get the gear by simply doing the new content ie. the new dungeon.
Unless you don’t like new content in which case you probably wouldn’t do it either way. So why does the reward even matter to you at that point?
I can’t see where they said they’ll have better stats.
They said they’ll add more update related items, that’s it.
Do the halloween exotics have better stats? Nope.
@above
At launch we will only have ring and back items, they’re going to add the rest of the slots as they go.are you serious? did you not even read what Ascended items are? go read the release adn then come back. turn the lights on, and maybe have your browser turned to font 40. it’s in plain as day english, ascended stats are better than Exotic. no if, ands, or buts. They’ve even stated that it’s a new tier, and will make existing content easier for you! (meaning it’ll be a big increase on your character’s performance). Not to mention, it has alot of +magic find, which is the highest rated stat.
It’s the start of the never ending god kitten treadmill. they want to be like WoW for whatever reason despite having success with their original design.
And legendary stats are better then ascended which is also better then exotics? What is your point? Your already grinding for legendary… they are just adding a inbetween gear…. it won’t be the best in the game. Therefore the whole argument about a gear treadmill is totally debunked.
This nothing but this i dont see why people cant understand this
Currently there is no “progression” from exotic to legendary. They have the same stats. The only “reward” is aesthetic.
Now with Ascended gear, you have to grind for them, as their “rewards” are not only aesthetic but also have stat increase.
They are creating a stat gap between exotic and legendary with ascend being in the middle…… at least thats how it reads in the announcement made by Chris.
They are not. They’re adding a gap in between exotic and the new tier, Ascended. There is no gap to legendary (which will be EQUAL to Ascended with the patch), there never was. It was a problem they invented.
to clear stuff up folks (cuz the devs PR is purposely muddy), legendary = same stats as exotic. After patch, legendary = same stats as Ascended.
so dose this mean if we get our legendery we NEVER have to worry about a “gear grind” again as it will always be the equivalent to the strongst wepon?
For the patch this week, yes. Legendary will be equivalent to Ascended. For the future, who knows. (judging from other MMOs “item progression”, dont count on it.)
There was never any stat gap between legendary and exotics anyway, so the entire Ascended thing with better stats is why people are pissed. We all bought the game to get away from stuff like that since that is what they marketed GW2 as.
Exotics were basically a freebie when you hit 80. I am sorry thats the truth.
They are creating a stat gap between exotic and legendary with ascend being in the middle…… at least thats how it reads in the announcement made by Chris.
That is the whole point. They are creating a stat where before there was not.
So that they can say that ascended are the stop gap for legendaries. They are creating their own need for a stop gap.
The only difference from legendaries and exotics before was aesthetics. Now after creating this new stats gap (in the first place), they are going to fill it up.
It makes no sense, other then to add Gear Progression and Power Creep.
But this is where you are assuming. You are assuming that they will create a new tier above legendary, if it is a true gear treadmill there is no end.
Creating gear that is lower stat’d then the “best” gear in the game doesn’t scream gear treadmill to me, in the sense of how wow runs things….
Again people are making assumptions and freaking out over it.
Had GW2 launched with exotic > ascend > Legendary, you would not be throwing a fit right now. And thats the truth of it.
Also on that note GW2 has no progression you get to 80 get all your discovries and such done and thats it really, grind for your legendary. There is no progression there is nothing to hold a good majority of people in the game. If you think they are adding this based solely on forum postings, you are sadly mistaken. They probably have a great deal of data behind this choice.
(edited by Namu.5712)
I can’t see where they said they’ll have better stats.
They said they’ll add more update related items, that’s it.
Do the halloween exotics have better stats? Nope.
@above
At launch we will only have ring and back items, they’re going to add the rest of the slots as they go.are you serious? did you not even read what Ascended items are? go read the release adn then come back. turn the lights on, and maybe have your browser turned to font 40. it’s in plain as day english, ascended stats are better than Exotic. no if, ands, or buts. They’ve even stated that it’s a new tier, and will make existing content easier for you! (meaning it’ll be a big increase on your character’s performance). Not to mention, it has alot of +magic find, which is the highest rated stat.
It’s the start of the never ending god kitten treadmill. they want to be like WoW for whatever reason despite having success with their original design.
And legendary stats are better then ascended which is also better then exotics? What is your point? Your already grinding for legendary… they are just adding a inbetween gear…. it won’t be the best in the game. Therefore the whole argument about a gear treadmill is totally debunked.
This nothing but this i dont see why people cant understand this
Again, legendary stats are the same as exotic. do you ‘defenders’ of this change, who are so ‘bored’ with GW2, actually play the game?
Did you actually read and understand what Chris was implying? With saying there is going to be an intermidate between the two? Logic says that if exotic is below ascend and legendary is above ascend then clearly legendary will have boosted stats over ascend……
It doesn’t make much sense to have ascend gear have higher stats than exotic but legendary lower then ascend now does it?
I can’t see where they said they’ll have better stats.
They said they’ll add more update related items, that’s it.
Do the halloween exotics have better stats? Nope.
@above
At launch we will only have ring and back items, they’re going to add the rest of the slots as they go.are you serious? did you not even read what Ascended items are? go read the release adn then come back. turn the lights on, and maybe have your browser turned to font 40. it’s in plain as day english, ascended stats are better than Exotic. no if, ands, or buts. They’ve even stated that it’s a new tier, and will make existing content easier for you! (meaning it’ll be a big increase on your character’s performance). Not to mention, it has alot of +magic find, which is the highest rated stat.
It’s the start of the never ending god kitten treadmill. they want to be like WoW for whatever reason despite having success with their original design.
And legendary stats are better then ascended which is also better then exotics? What is your point? Your already grinding for legendary… they are just adding a inbetween gear…. it won’t be the best in the game. Therefore the whole argument about a gear treadmill is totally debunked.
This nothing but this i dont see why people cant understand this
Currently there is no “progression” from exotic to legendary. They have the same stats. The only “reward” is aesthetic.
Now with Ascended gear, you have to grind for them, as their “rewards” are not only aesthetic but also have stat increase.
They are creating a stat gap between exotic and legendary with ascend being in the middle…… at least thats how it reads in the announcement made by Chris.
I can’t see where they said they’ll have better stats.
They said they’ll add more update related items, that’s it.
Do the halloween exotics have better stats? Nope.
@above
At launch we will only have ring and back items, they’re going to add the rest of the slots as they go.are you serious? did you not even read what Ascended items are? go read the release adn then come back. turn the lights on, and maybe have your browser turned to font 40. it’s in plain as day english, ascended stats are better than Exotic. no if, ands, or buts. They’ve even stated that it’s a new tier, and will make existing content easier for you! (meaning it’ll be a big increase on your character’s performance). Not to mention, it has alot of +magic find, which is the highest rated stat.
It’s the start of the never ending god kitten treadmill. they want to be like WoW for whatever reason despite having success with their original design.
And legendary stats are better then ascended which is also better then exotics? What is your point? Your already grinding for legendary… they are just adding a inbetween gear…. it won’t be the best in the game. Therefore the whole argument about a gear treadmill is totally debunked.
Legendary right now is on-par with Exotic. They are going to increase the stats of Legendary to match ascended based on these changes (when the Ascended items get patched in – not necessarily this patch).
So basically they are adding a new tier of gear after Exotic – there is no “in-between” exotic and legendary as currently exotic = legendary (in stats) and after the patch (which adds ascended weapons) ascended = legendary.
BTW, it’s complete BS, especially for the WvW community. It was said earlier – just make everyone in WvW EQUAL – same as in sPVP and they can do whatever the kittening kitten they want with PvE.
Well thats fine, I have no problem with wvwvw being like spvp…. but again what is the reward?
But pve wise, I don’t know anyone that doesn’t want to see their character grow…. no matter how small the amount is. New skins are cool but really its just more of the same after a few expansions. Same skills, same everything. Not sure how people cant consider that anymore or less boring.
Nor do I understand the argument about a gear grind….. when HELLO your doing the same thing if it were just a skin…. I mean comon folks pull your heads out!
You can do the new content with exotics.
That is not how the dungeons work.It is true you can enter the new content with exotics. The problem comes from as you progress through the dungeon you will hit a wall no matter how good you are because you dont have ascended gear because of the new condition that enemies will cast on players. You cannot get far in the dungeon no matter how good you are without having grinding out gear ahead of time.
Whats wrong with that? Every hero needs a mighty weapon to fight against whatever evil they are trying defeat. You obtain the gear in the dungeon from what I understand…. so you get it as you progress, no?
I think people should hold off on the OMFG this is a gear treadmill, drama queen freak outs till its actually here.
I can’t see where they said they’ll have better stats.
They said they’ll add more update related items, that’s it.
Do the halloween exotics have better stats? Nope.
@above
At launch we will only have ring and back items, they’re going to add the rest of the slots as they go.are you serious? did you not even read what Ascended items are? go read the release adn then come back. turn the lights on, and maybe have your browser turned to font 40. it’s in plain as day english, ascended stats are better than Exotic. no if, ands, or buts. They’ve even stated that it’s a new tier, and will make existing content easier for you! (meaning it’ll be a big increase on your character’s performance). Not to mention, it has alot of +magic find, which is the highest rated stat.
It’s the start of the never ending god kitten treadmill. they want to be like WoW for whatever reason despite having success with their original design.
And legendary stats are better then ascended which is also better then exotics? What is your point? Your already grinding for legendary… they are just adding a inbetween gear…. it won’t be the best in the game. Therefore the whole argument about a gear treadmill is totally debunked.
GW2 was supposed to be different, a bastion of hope for those who wanted skill to be greater than gear. We held dearly to that Manifesto and so it was truely heaven…for a little while.
Now that has change and it will become just another direct competitor to a game that will crush GW2 just like it has done to every other clone out there over the past 8 or so years.
GW2 was unique and now it will not be. Such a sad turn of events.
And what is wrong with skill =/= gear? why can’t a dungeon require both? Its a bit selfish dont you think? Gives you a sense of completion and that sense that your character has gotten a tad stronger through his trials in the new area….. the gear is not a override to skill you still need great skill to get there. Your blindly making assumptions and cutting out one factor entirely for your argument.
A backpack and a ring… We didn’t have many backpacks anyway, was about time for a good one.
As for the future, they said they will add the rest of the ascended gear and all.. They could give players the opportunity of upgrading their existing gear up to that level by putting it in the forge with 3 other items obtainable by playing the content, even casually. So yes, I want gear progression, I would rather not lose my existing items, and to tend to the casual majority, not have it as a month grind.
= gear treadmill, and GW2 was supposed to NOT be a gear treadmill.
GW1 NEVER made a single gear treadmill, and you never get bored because of the deep gamplay offering.
Actualy, GW2 have a poor gamaply offering ( low skill number, impossibilitie to really build your own skill build, poor stat / trait management )
So yeah once lvl 80, and all skill unlocked, no rare skin like in GW1 to farm, not a single skill build exeperimentation to do.. yeah, nothing else to do.What Anet offer ? lazy gear treadmill way instead of really improove the class gameplay.
That’s really desapointing. ( see what Anet are doing, and see player like you without any imagination who only except a gear treadmill as “progression” )
Now this is true.
However i still disagree with the gear treadmill label.
Simply put many are getting bored with gw2 because at end game it really doesn’t offer you much in the way of having something to keep you occupied.
Any new gear it should be for skin only.
First you ahve a massive Karma grind for exotic armor, then you add DR. Finally you correct that with jugs of liquid karma. Then you go and do this?
I don’t want to re grind stat gear again. I could live with that if it were skin only gear. Its almost like Anet will not be happy until they piss off every last player and make them leave. What, theservers aren’t empty enough?
I had 800k karma by the time I hit 60 from wvw when the game first launched…. you cant tell me karma is a massive grind I got it while leveling and had more then enough by the time I hit 80….
Again, people need to learn the difference between a gear treadmill and progression.
Currently GW2 as no real endgame progression aside from your legendary. Regardless of what you guys say or think a game that adds content that can be completed in a week will get stale.
Anet is a company first and foremost. When a title gets stale money is lost. They have to have some sort of progression to keep peoples interest. Their intended progression is nothing like a gear treadmill from say wow…
Honestly who cares…. I mean really.
Gear doesn’t affect competitive pvp.
Gear really only effects WvW and pve… wvw is zerg vs zerg anyways.
And pve well…. its not like its hard to begin with, and really honestly for many there is no point in pve at all.
And exotics weren’t hard to get lol. And I doubt the new gear will be hard to get either.
For those saying blah blah blah i logged in every day now with this news im quitting…. oh please. What do you login and do all day then? run in circles because you have completed everything? seriously. Some of you need to get a grip and stop the over reacting drama queen acts.
Well Maybe warrior does do 20k dmg crit with a skill that needs full “rage” and fully depels it so he needs to recharge it again.
In meantime You and your pet can do twice if not 3 times that dmg to him.
Also with proper build You as ranger have 12s of “immortality” where warrior can’t do kitten and you can just laugh at his face.
Look some ranger vids/ screen shots where pets do 3-5k crits alone with base attacks. att to that bleeds from hawks etc or might buffs from tiger and seriously you will outdmg that warrior and you have much more utility.
Thats assuming:
A. your target doesn’t move
B. your arrows actually hit
Just pointing the obvious flaw in your argument out to you. Its fine on paper but in real game play where the player is actually, you know. Moving about, dodging and fighting back…. well your pet effectiviness just dropped to 0 because as we all know pets don’t attack and move. And if they are strafing back and forth… well your arrows don’t hit so well either.
Now if arrows couldn’t be dodged by a simple side step… and pets could stay on target and attack. You would be 100% correct. But they don’t, so your not.
Could be a pet trait higher up in the BM line.
I mean if you had a wolf out or something along those lines, when you get attacked by a thief your pet knows his scent thus you can track him.
I also see rangers as being master trackers as well…. being able to follow a thief’s trail seems only natural.
The ranger profession to me is like a thief with no stealth….. nor the killing power of what you expect from a expert marksmen in archery.
Oh and companions are like the animals no one wanted because they fight like they have downs. (not meaning to be offensive or insult people with the actual illness don’t make my statement into some hate remark, thanks)
lol to those saying if these are real…… did you not read the op’s whole post? Or are you all that daft that you didn’t understand his friend were playing a prank on him…..
L2R folks… lol
“now its my lunch hour and i’ve been able to confirm that my “ex-friends” have had me going all morning
Lets hope the real patch notes include fixes and make us all happy rangers."
For those that clearly missed the part about these not being real.
(edited by Namu.5712)
i dont know what everyone is talking about. i never lose to warriors of any spec as a ranger. especially rifle warriors. i can’t understand how any ranger would lose to a warrior in a 1v1
I don’t know where in this thread people are complaining about losing 1v1 to a warrior. That wasn’t the topic of the thread lol….
The complaint is warrior does it better on every front.
Higher hp
Higher defensive even when not traited for it.
Huge burst
Huge sustained damage
Bleeds don’t require a positional shot… sorry but an arrow shot into your gut is gonna make you bleed just as much as a bullet shot into your gut. Not sure where this bleed from the side/behind logic came from in Anet. But its rubbish.
When you can crit someone for 20k then kill them with the next attack if you didn’t one shot them already there is something seriously wrong.
(edited by Namu.5712)
No one cares what Anet considers a ranger to be lore wise. People rolled a ranger because its traditionally a bowmen type class that has a companion. But both bows and pets are so flawed right now in comparison to other ranged weapons for other class’s its not even funny.
I just want to point out that ANET actually does consider ranger to be unparalleled at using the bow, contrary to what some forum posters may claim. Here is the Ranger description from the GW2 website (with picture of ranger with BOW in hand):
“Rangers rely on a keen eye, a steady hand, and the power of nature itself. Unparalleled archers, rangers are capable of bringing down foes from a distance with their bows. With traps, nature spirits, and a stable of loyal pets at their command, rangers can adapt to any situation.”
Well thats sad then considering the state of things. Fingers crossed
No one cares what Anet considers a ranger to be lore wise. People rolled a ranger because its traditionally a bowmen type class that has a companion. But both bows and pets are so flawed right now in comparison to other ranged weapons for other class’s its not even funny.
They better have big fixs coming and increased damage to keep many competitive players in this class…. other wise it will just be even more warriors.
Anet will never nerf warrior burst, you can probably figure out why (class favorites anyone?)
Gotta love ranged warriors critting people for 20ishk…. and aoe’ing for 15k. Go go rangers with your 4k crits!!! GET SOME!
Anyways. Heres hoping Anet has something actually worth while for this class come the 15th, if not I see alot of people quiting their ranger for good.
Fate-
I don’t think anyone would be complaining about dps if our pets hit while moving and didn’t bug out.
Thats what your not understanding our profession is largely broken. Its not that people don’t know how to play its that your FORCED to play without relying on your pet as part of your dps because of the way it functions currently.
Anyone in pvp thats worth beating wont stand still for your pet to dps them…. nor will they be immobile long enough for your pet to beat on them even if you try to stop them.
Thats what your not getting.
People started trying to make their rangers dps with no pet because really the pet is worthless in many pvp situations, which means you dont have that added dps.
Take a look from different perspectives. People are annoyed by a great number of things with this profession and all them added up does make us rather hard to pvp with, compared to other class’s. We have lower solo dps, because of our pet…. thats fine IF our pet actually did its job and could keep up with people kiting it….. but it cant.
People need to stop saying its a L2P issue when someone doesn’t run a bunker build just to avoid being insta gibbed by thieves thats about kitten
This game is about being able to choose how you want to play and it being balanced.
Because someone didn’t choose to go full vit/tough just to survive our imba profession doesn’t mean they dont know how to play.
Coming on the ranger forum and calling everyone noobs basically, because we are making legit complaints about a broken profession is a good way to make friends I hear.
Fate, your bad, always will be bad, and clearly haven’t played other class’s because your whole wall of text screams I don’t know what im talking about our class has “minor” bugs thats all guyzzzz!
I think things like server wins in WvW open up access to special armor and weapons that can’t be transferred would be a good way of handing things. This way, winning in WvW actually has some benefit and incentive for staying with a server.
Or creating more of a server transfer issue then there already is…..
People already flock to the winning servers… now if you start giving the winning server special items….. ya its just going to make that much much worse.
Well thats true I wouldn’t play the profession without those skills flat out. But your right the stacking to increase damage to a amount where the person getting hit is like “what just happened” oh invisible thief…. has gotta change. But not so much that players are in a situation where if they go any other build other than pure dps/burst that they do no damage and cant take anyone down.
Blazer- I wasn’t saying they weren’t designed to be mobile I was just stating that the mobility on top of massive dps is the problem…. and evades count as mobility in my book. Especially since you can increase endurance recharge rate on a thief. 25% speed boost plus rolls…. thats mobility. Far better mobility then other professions save maybe a ele. Oh and almost forgot swiftness on roll…. if you trait for it.
Paynful-
You make it sound as everything you said apply’s the most to this profession…. it applies to every profession.
A bad warrior is a bad warrior nothing changes.
The only difference is other class’s aren’t as forgiving. A thief can get away with not knowing how to play and still be better then average.
Opps I messed up, run away stealth try again. Other class’s dont get a get out of jail free card when they screw up…. well maybe mez’s, which are much harder to master imo.
Going to disagree there big time.
I have thief and mesmer at 80 in full exotic (I can prove it too unlike most) that I use in wvwvw and sometimes in spvp. Mes was hands down the easiest to master between the 2.
I played mesmer for a little bit I just didn’t like the feel of it, thought it was much harder then my thief. Guess its a matter of opinion really, that and play style.
Paynful-
You make it sound as everything you said apply’s the most to this profession…. it applies to every profession.
A bad warrior is a bad warrior nothing changes.
The only difference is other class’s aren’t as forgiving. A thief can get away with not knowing how to play and still be better then average.
Opps I messed up, run away stealth try again. Other class’s dont get a get out of jail free card when they screw up…. well maybe mez’s, which are much harder to master imo.
Thief has more “get out of jail free cards” because they will get in jail faster. Other professions don’t need get out of jail free cards because they are more durable.
But that durability doesn’t mean much against a thief. Thats where the problem comes in with our profession. Risk vs reward, we have high risk, sure if the opponent can lock us down…. which most of the time they can’t in my experience anyways.
We have the high burst/dps, and we have the mobility to get out if it goes the wrong way. Those two things are cause for concern and why there is so much chatter about this profession in particular. We are in a way more durable because taking no damage is better then tanking damage. And we are the best profession at avoiding damage completely.
Its not hard to dodge a backstab build, but its hard to dodge a back stab build when:
A. they are invisible
B. have more mobility
This assumes the thief didn’t throw away their mobility.
But the stealth issue is still a problem.
The real problem is the people abusing it intentionally I think. People that KNOW the other player can’t see them when they are attacking.
Paynful-
You make it sound as everything you said apply’s the most to this profession…. it applies to every profession.
A bad warrior is a bad warrior nothing changes.
The only difference is other class’s aren’t as forgiving. A thief can get away with not knowing how to play and still be better then average.
Opps I messed up, run away stealth try again. Other class’s dont get a get out of jail free card when they screw up…. well maybe mez’s, which are much harder to master imo.
I believe the Thief should be a high damage, low survivability class that is slippery and hard to pin down; very mobile.
This should be a viable way to play a thief, but GW2 professions should not be so strictly classified. There’s no one way to play each profession.
The problem is, if you’re slippery, hard to pin down, and very mobile, you’re also highly survivable.
A lot of people here don’t understand that (Edit: And I don’t mean “here” as in this forum, I mean game-wide). This game’s survivability is partly build and partly class. Mobility is a huge defensive advantage.
Exactly. This is why certain builds need to be adjusted; too much survivability for the amount of damage they can dish out. There needs to be more of a trade-off.
Which is why I was saying stealth coupled with a thiefs mobility combined with the bug that occurs with rendering makes thieves pretty much not only hard to kill but one of the games best burst on top of it.
Something has to give either way.
Ya hoping they reduce damage without breaking the effectiveness of the profession.
least we aren’t in the position rangers are in. Don’t think we can really complain about nerfs until your damage is a bad as a rangers in pvp.
This is what happens when you let people transfer whenever and whereever they want daily.
They had a good plan but they didn’t think it through to well.
People by nature are nasty, greedy, and want to win. Thus you have what you see here. People flocking to winning servers from losing servers. And its not just a few people.
Even with transfers not free they are dirt cheap….. so really it wont even matter when they end. Transfers need to cost a good amount of gems…. not just a few hours worth of farming to have enough for transfer.
And you should be limited to like 1 transfer a month.
Actually I disagree trapline, go read the warrior forums they are having a grand time….. lol
My opinion is that BS does too much damage for an easily applied skill. …
Backstab:
Attack your foe from the shadows, striking for double damage if you hit from behind.
Front damage: 403
Back damage: 806
Range: 130Hundred Blades:
Repeatedly strike multiple foes. The last strike does extra damage.
Damage (8x): 1,624
Final strike damage: 406
Range: 130That’s twice the damage of Backstab. Backstab requires being stealthed and maneuvring to get behind the target.
Apples and oranges m8.
HB can be moved away from. and if they move no more damage… sooooo.
Your comparing an instant attack to an attack that roots the person doing it and can simply be sidestepped… you cant do that against a thief that just jumped you.
Position requirements… who cares, we were given stealth and mobility for a reason, its not like its hard lol.
Hey, guys! i have a great idea, Lets nerf every single skill on every single profession and go back to hitting each other with foam clubs and water guns. Oh wait, that’s how mmos are ruined.
In all seriousness, nerfing a class because of the community whining is not the way to go with it. In the end, a nerf to a skill does achieve much. yea sure, the people who do the high burst dmg do less dmg, but wot about the people who don’t do full burst but still use that skill, they would be doing no dmg. and good players will learn to adapt and find new ways to burst you down because u are caught out of position.
You can nerf the skills and the class, but you can’t nerf the player.
Nerfing damage output will just make bad thieves stand out good players of the profession will have no problems. And this is because they usually dont rely on a full damage/burst build in the first place they dont spam one or two skills to kill someone they use all their skills when the situation calls for it.
So good players will remain largely unaffected by any nerfs that come that are within reason of course.
The main problem I see is stealth not rendering properly, happens to me and I see it happen to people I fight all the time, and it gives me the winning hand in a otherwise good fight.
Fight is 50/50 either could win, im getting low on health, I stealth…. bam I just won because now without them being able to hit me I pull ahead in damage and finish them off with an unfair advantage, that advantage being that they couldn’t even see me while I was doing the damage that put me ahead in the fight.
A good player will avoid your burst, and come back with their own. But when you throw stealth into the mix it becomes a win for the thief.
Good music…. beyond that…
well lol.
If they would just throw a few lines that they are working with it, this forum wouldn’t be a negative pit of doom.
I mean all they have to do is say ya we acknowledge you guys are a bit underpowered we are working on fixing things. Bam instant crowd quelling. But the fact that they are silent means.
A. they dont care
B. they think the profession is just fine, and dont care enough to tell us to kitten off.
For the first time ever playing a mmo I feel that I cannot continue with this game due to the lack of response and actions taken by a gaming company- what they are doing is tantamount to suicide for their game.
Do they not think people will be asking themselves these questions and what future this game has?
I would just like a clear response from them with the directions they plan to go.
Ignoring thousands of players thinking your game is safe will not make it safe- people read forums and follow other forums that are not moderated by yourselves where their voices can be heard!
For example mmorpg.com- you have not control there of what people say and believe me when people voice their concerns it will be on those site like that and reddit and twitter which will give a true picture of the state of the game!
So closing posts here and burying your head in the sand wont work!
Please let us know what you plan to do with this ranger class and others or you might find you got a dud of a game on your hands very quickly!Don’t take my word for it- the proof is all around what happens when you ignore your playerbase- just ask funcom with Age of Conan or even better ask Bioware after their massive failure with Star wars Old republic!
The hype phase is over there is no more good communication with them. Thats how it works. Pre launch during beta they are super active act like they care about everyone, fixing problems fast…. adjusting class’s based on the community’s needs etc etc.
Then come launch…. well we all see how its going.
I came from playing a thief (currently a very op class btw, hence why I dont really play it now until they fix stealth)
But ranger damage is severely hurting.
And this is because they built the class around the expectation that your pet helps with your damage….. good in theory not so good in practice…. unless of course your opponent just stands there there and your pet doesn’t die in few seconds.
Fact: Thief is going to be nerfed.
Its not a L2P issue, its a broken mechanic issue and the might nerf bat is going to come down upon you.
And yes people are complaining about condition thieves as well because really what can you do against most of them?
Perfect example: You claim a thief is a glass cannon, okay. A glass cannon that can kill you before you can do anything to take advantage of that 90% of the time.
And the other is a condition thief not a glass cannon, but their mobility and surviablity is unrivaled.
The problem? In one word, stealth.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEWOGcU61ng&list=PLdRu-1piROblxmQL9HcyqJKzgITtf9TTg&index=5&feature=plpp_video1 button spam ftw.
I play this build.. it isn’t 1 button.. and I encourage you to try it if it is so easy. Wild Bill is a freak at hitting his CnD’s and I regularly rewatch these videos to continue to get better at it and pick up the subtle things. Sure this build is very strong, but it has counters to which he himself would attest. Condition Necro’s can absolutely destroy this build and well place immobilizes and stuns also give it issues. Sure I’ve had those awesome 1v3 win moments with the build because of the defensive nature of stealth, but most of that was because those 3 people didn’t ever work together to try and take me down.
Just set Namu to ignore.
If you read his post history you’ll come to realise he’s just a scrub not willing to adapt or learn his class and would much rather scream & whinge on the forums demanding nerfs. You’ll find him stretching the truth quite often to try and validate his points. Truly sad.
I haven’t demanded any nerfs.
I just said its gonna happen and your fooling yourself if you think otherwise. Stop putting words in my mouth.
Btw I main a thief. Doesn’t change anything at all. And most fights against another thief come very close to a draw if they are equal skilled.
The other class though are just easy mode to kill.
Im not so foolish to think that we are not op, and this OP comes from our stealth mechanic. Because in reality if you hit someone for a crazy amount if they can see you and are decent they will turn around a lay down the hurt…. but thats the problem they cant see you.
And it becomes a game of catch up, you jump them take a good majority of their health. They go to fight back and your already stealthed, dodge their aoe that you know is going to come, and attack again before they can even retarget and see you on their end. If you think everything is fine and dandy with that then cool.
Oh, and really you don’t need to resort to calling people you don’t agree with names, grow a pair and talk like an adult.
(edited by Namu.5712)
Fact: Thief is going to be nerfed.
Its not a L2P issue, its a broken mechanic issue and the might nerf bat is going to come down upon you.
And yes people are complaining about condition thieves as well because really what can you do against most of them?
Perfect example: You claim a thief is a glass cannon, okay. A glass cannon that can kill you before you can do anything to take advantage of that 90% of the time.
And the other is a condition thief not a glass cannon, but their mobility and surviablity is unrivaled.
The problem? In one word, stealth.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEWOGcU61ng&list=PLdRu-1piROblxmQL9HcyqJKzgITtf9TTg&index=5&feature=plpp_video1 button spam ftw.
I play this build.. it isn’t 1 button.. and I encourage you to try it if it is so easy. Wild Bill is a freak at hitting his CnD’s and I regularly rewatch these videos to continue to get better at it and pick up the subtle things. Sure this build is very strong, but it has counters to which he himself would attest. Condition Necro’s can absolutely destroy this build and well place immobilizes and stuns also give it issues. Sure I’ve had those awesome 1v3 win moments with the build because of the defensive nature of stealth, but most of that was because those 3 people didn’t ever work together to try and take me down.
I have and its a 1 button build. Hitting CnD when apporiate IE down states or when you need some breathing room…. other then that the only other things your doing on this build is hitting your 1 skill and keeping bleeds up, elite skill if the situation calls for and putting your buffs on for more cond damage when needed. Oh and every now and then steal just because spinning around from a warriors skill is good damage.
Point is if you didn’t have CnD, or the other stealth ability’s along with the mobility, people would be able to kill you…. instead as it stands a thief can rofl stomp 3-4 players pretty much with them all focusing you, because again you can stealth and attack without being seen….. and theres no “working” penalty for it. Then top that off with the stealth bug and well what you get is what thieves are currently. Damage isn’t so much a concern its the fact that you just cant hit us. And if you do happen to get in and hit us its hahaha, cool you got me down to 50%…. stealth heal, and attack while the other player cant even target you to attack back. Whats that? you closed the gap again and stunned me??!!?! oh noes….. stun break , CnD…. lol sucker.
Welcome to what HoD turned into.
It sucks it really does. Gotta hate the devs for their incompetence.
Top servers should have been locked from people transfering to them. Bad planning really.
Actually not bad planning. People should know by now that people are greedy and many people could care less about fighting the good fight, they just want to win.
- the game has not even been out 2mo.
- I remember them saying it will take 3-4mo to gather data to get WvW balanced
- DAoC was great PVP due to 3 factions.
It’ll be fine and fixed.
Gotta give them time.Look at the brightside. NO MONTHLY FEES….
So in 6 months when the problem still is here what will you say? Because ive heard the same song and dance from hopeful players in the past 5 years each time a new hyped mmo comes along….
“Its new guys dont worry, it will be fixed just give them time!”
Not a single one of those mmo’s turned around major problems.
Just pointing out what should be obvious to everyone here thats played any other mmos in the past 5 years.
Anet said they would have super advanced anti hack/botting things in place….. uh no they dont, hackers are all over the place same with bots. Faith is good…. blind faith however is a fools faith.
I love it!
All the smack talk about HoD, the only reason it turned into a horrible server was because of Anet and their utterly short sighted free transfers.
Now JQ knows how it feels. For all those that were smacking talking HoD before, now you know. It wasn’t HoD players it was everyone from everywhere else that ruined the server.
Shame on Anet for continuing to let people just transfer to top servers. They should be blocked.
That or they’re trying to weed out the wow players who call professions classes, ahahahahaha i’m so funny….
In all seriousness though rangers aren’t that bad, infact i’d argue they’re one of the stronger profs at endgame (especially in PvE) however, to me they’re about as boring watching plants grow though… all i do is stand really far back hit F2 every so often and hit 3, 2, 1, 1,1,1,1,1,1, 3, 2 ,1, 1, 1, 4, 3, 2 1 1 1, it’s dull…
Your account name suits you.
Some posters here are right though, thieves will get nerfed, there is no way to justify the downgrades to the other classes if thieves remain as they are. Thieves may be “right” on their own, they’re not that overpowered in general, they’re just way too good compared to other professions. Anet said they want fights to last something like 30-40 seconds, while a thief will end a fight in half a second, and a lot of people are getting seriously frustrated getting instagibbed by the army of people who all jumped on the thief bandwagon. Hitting two buttons to kill someone in half a second, may suit the lore of the thief, but it causes too much frustration.
This.
No class was meant to kill someone in the speed a thief can.
You are fooling yourselves if you think this class isn’t going to be nerfed into the dirt.