And the point is, Name one successful REAL MMO, that has no stat progression. And I will stop telling players that they are looking for their casual game in the wrong genre.
Because everything that´s been succesful in the past is automaticaly succesful in the future. And nothing new can ever be as good.
Take gear progression out the game, might as well take gear out the game, and then what do you have? Super smash bros on a large scale? Another arcade beat em up. Stat progression with gear, gives battles interesting variables.
“Stat progression with gear, gives battles interesting variables”
Horizontal progression that has more interchangeable skills and combos gives more interesting variables.
Their are no interesting variables in vertical progression. It’s all about overpowering your enemy and not skill.
The stat change affects the future of the game. Players will be mostly grinding in content gated towards only high level players. And never revisiting low level areas to create meta events.
Before once you reach level 80 and get your exotics. You still had access to all the content and can play for fun on new skins.
Grinding the same high level areas for gear you must have to play future content is not fun.
(edited by Onshidesigns.1069)
Who ever leaves over the stat increase should still check up on how the game is doing.
Areananet may realize their mistake and make Ascended stats the same as exotics. And the infusion would only be for the lower floors of the endless dungeon. Or they can make all exotics have a infusion slot and highest stats.
Players who are talking about a grind or treadmill are referring to what the game will become.
I was going to spend some cash for some new minis with the Lost Shores event, as I did with Halloween, but they decided that they could try to make more money by adding them to the limited time chests as rare drops and try to get people to gamble their money away on a ton of chests
No cash from me this event. Maybe next time.
I may have spent some real cash on the mini’s or skins. But AreanaNet in stead put them in the new chests. So I used in-game money to by two chests. I was lucky and got one mini and the shoulder armor I wanted. I then sold the mini and made 13g.
Their should be a skins and mats grind. And, more horizontal progression to support it.
And still nothing from ANet about the course of this…..getting disheartening here.
They know they f-up. Question is if they will continue the treadmill or not.
I’ve decided to buy 800 Gems per month whether I need them or not. I’m having super fun with the game, and have no problem giving them $10 per month to show my support.
Finding Ascended items to transmute skins is not going to be easy.
This game isn’t “Free to play”. Just pointing that out. You had to buy the game to play, even the beta…
I used FTP in the title, so people will think cash shops are what pays the bills. FTP is associated with cash shops or PTW.
Vertical progress seems to require a monthly fee to pay the bills.
Horizontal progress requires new content everyone can enjoy with a good cash shop.
If you have not seen this, watch it:Power Creep
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bxszx60ZwGw
My friends and I love these changes. And I am almost certain that most of the people whining are the GW1, GW2Guru guys. lol
Watch this video if you want to know why vertical progression is bad.
Power Creep
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bxszx60ZwGw
If infusions are only for endless dungeons, we don’t have to take part in them.
No, but it will leave behind the not infused playerbase that would want to play the endless dungeons…..i.e. why go back and do stuff you have already surpassed yourself when there’s no incentive to do so?
Until you get a Ascended item, you can not reach the beyond a certain point in the endless dungeon anyways. People already discriminate against other players over exotics, so nothing will change.
Infusions are not the problem because they are for lower tiers of the endless dungeons. It’s stats on infusions that carry over to WvW and PvE that’s the problem.
There has to be a middle ground and this is it!
Infusions are the problem. They are a gating mechanism and a gear treadmill in and of themselves. Say you deck your 12 piece ascended gear set out in the best infusions that are available at the tame(rare, for arguments sake). Guess what happens when ANet feels like too many people have gotten those? Yes, they introduce exotic tiered infusions with +X resistance over rare infusions.
And it doesn’t even matter what they do in the future, the fact that ascended armor and infusions were even added started the treadmill. A treadmill is not characterized be the amount of work you have to put into it. That is grind. A treadmill is characterized by the fact of whether or not you will ever be able work towards the best in slot gear that won’t be devalued in the future of the game’s life.
Infusions are a treadmill, therefore a problem. Agony won’t stay confined to FotM or some other tiny areas of the game, because it would be extraordinarily stupid to work in a new tier of gear and an infusion treadmill for only one or two measly dungeons.There is no middle ground, just as you can’t say someone’s “a little bit dead”, or “a little bit pregnant”. There is no “a bits treadmilly” with infusions. It is one. There is no middle ground.
If infusions are only for endless dungeons, we don’t have to take part in them.
Who are the “whiner”?
Players who want more Endgame.
Players who beg for higher numbers.
Players who want to grind.
These “Whiner” will not be satisfied until all new content is gated towards them.
The gem shop keeps the game servers running and this type of “whiner” do not pay the bills.
*Downgreade Ascended to legendary gear with Exotic stats.
*Only Agony resistance on Infusion slots
*Add Infusion slot to all exotic gear and legendary gear.This still give players progression through agony. And future
content can still be tied to agony.Again, the biggest part of the treadmill are the infusions. If they did that, people that had max stat gear would still need to upgrade in order to be where they were before. Additionally, they will be adding rarer tiers of infusions, devaluing your old ones and stealing away your achievement of getting the best gear available. Even if infusions just carried an agony resistance stat, it would still be a treadmill.
Infusions are not the problem because they are for lower tiers of the endless dungeons. It’s stats on infusions that carry over to WvW and PvE that’s the problem.
There has to be a middle ground and this is it!
It would be great if the different harvesting tools actually had different icons. I carry Orichalcum tools with me just so I can swap to them when I find top tier nodes, otherwise I used mithril or darksteel tools.
However, the only difference between the tools is their name which requires mousing over the tool to see which one I need to switch to. While not a huge deal if I’m trying to switch tools in a high risk area it can be a bit awkward. Changing the tools so that the different tiers of tool have different icons would make life so much easier.Cheers,
:)
I would like to see this or:
Having one harvesting tool for wood, mining, and gathering. That the price is based on your level and is damaged based on how your downgraded.
*Downgreade Ascended to legendary gear with Exotic stats.
*Only Agony resistance on Infusion slots
*Add Infusion slot to all exotic gear and legendary gear.
This still give players progression through agony. And future
content can still be tied to agony.
Exotics/legendary gear/better agony will be you reward in
endless dungeons and future content.
This also creates more endgame for people who want to put a
agony on all their exotics.
“Ascend: to move upward”
A Item just can’t be Ascended. It has to evolve to a Ascended.
That’s anther reason why upgrading Exotics makes more scene.
that’s a lie , in wvw is all about the zerg, armor does not matter that much. i always bring my low levels characters in wvw to level them up and i am doing just fine. lol
Wait for more players to have a Ascended items before you think everything is fine.
Seriously,
They aren’t going to do that just give it up ans submit a refund request if you are unhappy with the produce
It’s not hard for them to change this.
“Ascend: to move upward”
A Item just can’t be Ascended. It has to evolve to a Ascended. That’s anther reason why upgrading Exotics makes more scene.
- Downgrade Ascended to legendary gear with Exotic stats.
*Only Agony resistance on Infusion slots
*Add Infusion slot to all exotic gear and legendary gear.
This still give players progression through agony. And future
content can still be tied to agony.
Exotics/legendary gear/better agony will be you reward in
endless dungeons and future content.
This also creates more endgame for people who want to put a
agony on all their exotics.
Old content will become obsolete.
New content will become geared towards grinders and not all players.
Grinders do not spend real money in the gem shop and the game will die.
They stop spending buying gems in the cash shop with real money. Grinders who want Ascended items will rarely ever buy gems with real money.
Level 80 should always remain the cap!
Exotics stats should be the stat!
Infusions on all exotic can provide progression without gating content. As long as their is only a small different between weak and strong infusions. And not all new content requires a infusion.
(edited by Onshidesigns.1069)
Or, you know, expansion packs that are worth it to buy.
That could never work though…
Expansion packs that are worth buying must be accessible to all level 80s. If they are only for players with Ascended items, thats lost gem store sales.
That’s why I think infusions should be on all Exotics. And Exotic stats should be top tier.
Seems like most people think horizontal progress focused new content and gem store sales is what pays Areananet’s bills. As long as the game is not PTW.
This game wasn’t free to play.
But I’ll be fair and answer the question anyway, since with no sub they do need to continue to make money somehow:
We don’t know what makes them money. They don’t release those numbers to us. Such as what the average player spends in the shop, what the average player buys, what their research shows that players in other games buy and what game mechanics will make players spend more money.
We can make guesses and gather snippets of info from various places, but in the end, we are left in the dark.
I already made a comment on why I called it FTP.
A loyal fanbase created by trust from the developers who understand what their aimed audience would like to see in the gem shop.
This. And the game isn’t FTP its B2P with a cash shop. Cash shop games that aren’t P2W rely heavily on casuals. This new system is anti-casual since the new gear requires a huge time investment: skill doens’t make you get through the dungeons any faster, essences are random drops (RNG FTL), and to get rings you need to be level 10+ (community segregation).
It will be FTP if I don’t spend any more money into it.
vertical progress or horizontal progress
Ok so here’s the way to please both the “I need more power” crowd and those who don’t like gear treadmills in 3 simple steps.
1) Remove the extra stats from Ascended gear or come out and say there won’t be any higher stats placed on gear in the future
2) Clearly state that, while Agony resist will make it easier to complete FOTM, it won’t have any bearing on future content
3) Make all future content have a progression system using the Ascended/Agony system, but make past upgrades worthless in the new content. What I mean by this is, Agony resistance obtained in FOTM is only good for that dungeon. New dungeons will require a different type of Agony resist that you get from said dungeon. This gives progression and power without gating content.
Pleases everyone and make lots of money. Do it now!
On 3 I would make the progression system using Exotic/Agony.
Ascended would then be a type of Exotic.
“Power Creep” aka vertical progression and why it’s bad for games. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bxszx60ZwGw
Discuss alternatives to combat “Power Creep”.
I’ll go first:
Housing and crafting items for your house.
Everyone arguing in favor of a gear treadmill as a matter of course should really watch this.
Good video, I’m going to make it a post.
(edited by Onshidesigns.1069)
This is about future content being accessible for all or only for some who like to grind. And a game where old content does not become obsolete.
This would be a good and fun way to learn the lore of the game.
It would take a lot of power-leveling for a new player to play MOP.
It’s only common sense. Look at what WoW has become. No new players are playing their expansion.
If +10 stats doesnt matter then why all the complaining? Think about it… Please explain to me how it ruins your experience at all? If you want to progress horizontally and focus on map clear and dynamic events and customizing the look of your armor what does +10 really matter? You can still do all those things. No one is here trying to stop you. Now that is if +10 in stats truly isn’t a big deal. Some qq on here seem to suggest it is a big deal and will unbalance WvW. So what is it? Either way, if you don’t like it. Stop playing. Go create your own game.
Progression is like a snowball affect rolling downhill. It’s small at first but grows bigger over time.
Then all future content will now be made to cater to player who grind all day.
I don’t know why AN wants this because the rich players are the ones who grind and they don’t by gems with money.
What if I like the look of both? Why should I be forced to choose?
If Exotics still had the top stats with a infusion slot this would not be a problem.
GW2 was meant to be a game where both casual and hardcore players can play all the content together. This type of progression will segregate the community.
Why does one for the ascended items have to be a backpack? When many people just completed the Halloween event to earn the Mad King backpack.
GW2 was meant to be a game where both casual and hardcore players can play all the content together. The way it is now will segregate the community.
Why couldn’t it have been infusion slots on exotics with no stat change. Then players can play the dungeons for skins and better infusions.
“Just 1 day, someone already has a pink(red) backslot equipment.”
Someone has to win the lottery.
A theater house that preforms NPC plays on past holiday events and game lore.
Add dye option the the re-breather.
No limited time items of value should ever be in a consortium chest or black lion chest again.
Just no. If you want PvP, there are places for that in the game already. After experience the dueling in WoW, done in the most annoying way possible toward other people to be disruptive, even in towns.. there is just no place for it in this game.
People in PVP and WVW don’t want other players dueling anywhere. The solution is just to limit where people can duel.
How hard will ascended be to find? It seems to me finding the right infusion upgrade might be the hard part.
Within the guild only.
Many bosses should be a little taller then a Nord at-least.