Guild Wars 2

Classic speedrun ignorant elitists, just let them be.

However, if you want me to rate your build… low crit chance + semi high crit damage, ZERO attunement swap % and tempest defense is subpar in pvp lets not talk about pve…

Pretty bad. You have 0 boon duration, you can’t give ANY boons to your party or even yourself (if you had access to reliable might you would match your power numbers while having extra trait points available, fire traits suck), and you don’t seem to use other weapons no matter which encounter you’re facing.

I hope you at least have arcane wave in your utilities, otherwise it’s a 2/10 for your build, would not advice anyone to follow it.

They could have made the orb more appealing, instead, they turned them into karkas (seriously it’s the same animation).

Poor, redundant change.

ele is a complex and rewarding class, it has probably the most active playstyle out of any gw2 profession and I can dare say that it’s also the most fun.

of course they are worth it, but only to those that bother learning through trial and error until they finally master elementalist.

After reading most of this thread I conclude that this was most likely a l2p issue

/close ty

inb4 PVT

Edit:
This is my ele, classy and glassy!

Using +100 prec + 10% crit dmg food and master maint oil (6% prec <→ toughness 4% w/e)

for real?

great news.

Is the 2x guild commendation / week global? or is it guild-wise?

If I do guild missions on 2 different guilds, will I get 4x guild commendation items in the same week? or after I received 2 from one of the guilds, I’m already unable to receive more no matter which guild I do it from?

Info pls.

Mil.3562:

With every update, Anet is trying to make our characters weaker. They call it Dynamic levelling adjustments. I call I dynamic nerfing. This is why I have stopped playing. A level 80 charc struggling to survive in a lv 10 mob map is called ridiculous, not challenging.

I guess 1 shotting monsters with one autoattack while running a full defensive build is a much greater challenge, right?

I have 0 issues with downscaling, I always 2-3 hit monsters even if they come in groups of 5+ and solo champs with ease.

Perhaps it’s time to revise your build? It’s not even funny how fast monsters die even when downscaled.

Don’t quit your day job.

Hahaha, moved to the graveyard forums ;D good riddance with your bleep ideas.

OP you’re rude and inconsiderate.

use them all.

I need to get myself a focus lol

mesmers op whats new

Pretty good troll thread, you almost got me into posting seriously.

Some advice tho (because some people might not find it that obvious), change “Redesign” for “List of proposed nerfs”.

well in closing… I hope it gets nerfed to oblivion.

you guys going off topic lol

improve scaling then! that’s what I meant in theory.

well, my estimations are based on 1900 power which is a pretty decent amount on it’s own.

as you can see, the base damage on certain abilities, for 1900 power, is horrifyingly low… so that’s why I think it should be buffed.

Gonna try jeweler then.

I heard good things about artificer though?

any insight would be appreciated tho

there must be a couple that are commonly known as “more profitable” than the rest :|

doesn’t every spell scale equally on power?

o_O

I really didn’t know that

Jusanden.3897:

First off all, buffing auto attacks doesn’t do anything on elementalists. They are the sole class that almost never uses them. Second of all, Puandro is right saying that landing ele burst is the problem. Dragons Tooth -> pheonix has a stupidly long delay, like a hundred blades with all of the damage on the last strike. Fire grab is also….. not accurate, if your moving or your target is moving… its not hitting for what ever reason.

The S/D set is technically the epitome of bursting. Staff skills have too long of a delay, and is mostly damage over time, while d/d has too many channel skills. The only problem is how hard it is to land a proper S/D burst. Fixing it would really just entail making fire grab hit more consistently, decreasing dragons tooth delay, and increasing phoenix missile speed by a bit. Even better, they could make grounded work with blowout skills like updraft, its kinda useless atm.

It’s a good thing that none of my proposed changes involve scepter spells…

and got so far…

topic .

Lord Aargadon.4135:

Magnet is 1.25s cast(with a grossly visible visual affect) with a spec of delay inbetween completion and pull. If you want to cry OP, do please check your facts before doing so.

Razor.6392:

Even if it fails, an engi can stall long enough with the snare, ridic knockback and offhand shield until it’s back up. And it’s not that much time until then.

Almost all 100nades engis will carry a -450range knockback with rifle or shield(shield also has melee stun on top of knockback) and an immobilize or daze. They are basically the bane of melee. Dont get in melee range.

I’m talking about when I’m already pulled.

Magnet is the initial move, it’s like bull’s charge.

If I get hit by bull’s charge or basilisk I’m not doomed yet, it’s the initial part of their burst combo.

But if I do get hit by magnet, the reaction window is incredibly small for how punishing it is to get hit by it. More punishing than BC or Basilisk for sure.

Puandro.3245:

Damage isn’t an issue with eles, its delivering it.

please elaborate…?

if this has to do with “can’t do damage while you’re dead” then tough luck, I don’t think ANet will reverse any change.

I came up with this a few days ago, pretty simple actually ANet!

Increase the base damage of some abilities.

-Lightning whip (12% increase) (currently it has 400-450 base damage x2)
-Ride the lightning (15% increase) (currently it has 675-725 base damage)
-Lightning touch (25% increase) (currently it has 400 base damage)
-Fire D/D autoattack (15% increase) (currently it has 275-300 base damage x3)

^Those calculations are done with 1900 base power.

Voila! This doesn’t benefit bunker eles because they aren’t big on crit chance / damage numbers, but it helps glass eles greatly to make up for what they lost.

It wouldn’t hurt… would it? Currently I’m forced to take 20% cooldown reduc. on my air traits now instead of +10% damage…

I never said they weren’t OP.

Personally I harbor a deep hatred for anything related to mesmers and their apparent high skill cap that deceives most of the playerbase when they’re nothing more than a facerolling bunch of wannabes.

A skill-kit can be complex, only if it’s balanced to use. Mesmer’s tricks and assets can indeed require a high skill ceiling, but due to the nature of their mechanics, the simplicity of them and how forgiving they are even for bad players… that high skill ceiling ends up really kitten close to their skill floor.

About guardians, they can be defined by what I’ve heard ever since I started playing and noticed people complaining about ele’s low leveling speed in pve: “a guardian can tank with ease 4+ monsters that outlevel him greatly, and still come on top with lots of hp left”.

In other words, mind numbingly easy to play, and very rewarding at the same time.

Anyway… all of this was kinda off topic was it?

Can’t even be compared with thieves’ burst or warrior’s 100blades imo.

When I face an engi I have to be expecting the pull at all times, because it’s instant and the reaction window is lower than 0.75 seconds I’m pretty sure. Other 100-0 bursts are 100% avoidable because the reaction time is higher. (100blades is predictable after the knockdown and it isn’t instant, even with frenzy it takes like 2 seconds to finish the channel. Thief is a different story: stealth? you know he’s coming. Basilisk’d? stun break before he backstabs).

Even if it fails, an engi can stall long enough with the snare, ridic knockback and offhand shield until it’s back up. And it’s not that much time until then.

My reflexes are pretty good but 100nades is just too unforgiving. Expecting huge nerfs.

Balanced or not?

Whatever the answer is, I feel that ANet will soon enough obliterate that build.

Rovus.5428:

30/0/10/10/20
Knight’s Armor(PvE and WvW)
Pow/Vit/Tough/ trinket(sPvP)

After a long time of messing around with daggers to see if they worked, I tried out this combo and was quite dissapointed by the lack of survivability and damage. Then i tried out the staff.

It felt like something just clicked inside my head. I hit like a truck, going from about 600-800 dmg up to 1200-1400 dmg just from the fire attunement autoattack. Once I had built up a respectable amount of might(12-15 stacks) a single hit from a Meteor shower would crit for 4800 on enemies. I could actually stand a chance 1on1 in sPvP and I would actually avoid siege weapons because my meteors and lava fonts did so much more damage.

I shudder to think about what would happen if i went Berserker gear…

How are you doing damage with literally ZERO critical chance and damage lol…

International.7980:

20/10/10/30/0 for auramancer support
or
x/x/x/x/30 for evasive arcana combo field popper

Ur choice on what you value more.

support + 0 in arcana don’t fit well in the same sentence.

People seem to underestimate these sort of changes.

It’s a pvp game (or pvp aspect) what we’re talking about. Even one second increased cooldown could mean the difference between victory and defeat. Even that autoattack you failed to dodge or land…

It’s more complex than you could possibly imagine, judging by the responses in this thread.

Bunker eles got hit, but every other build (balanced ones) were also hit in the process just as hard if not harder. That’s what annoys me, and many more people as well. Because the effing 0/10/0/30/30 was the one that caused the “ele op” cries, and the one that caused these nerfs, and even after all of this, it will still be used and abused while my own personal spec was severely nerfed more in comparison! So my build is now less effective against anyone and even less effective against those bunkers.

Tis annoying man.

I hope I get many matches where I face only 3-4 opponents.

free wins are free!

DiogoSilva.7089:

The strongest ele builds were the 0/10/0/30/30 bunkers, and close to them and with similar traits, the auramancers. Both builds were godlike at stacking boons, being able to have as much as 20-30s of boons at once, the former with ridiculous sustain, the later with very strong party support.

Let’s look at the patch notes, excluding the buffs to focus and to staff:
Renewing Stamina: Offensive critical builds can still maintain vigor. Boon builds can no longer stack vigor to ridiculous amounts. Nerf to boon builds, like bunkers and auramancers.
Soothing Disruption: Significant nerf to cantrip builds and to boon builds. That means bunkers and auramancers.
Zephyr’s Boon: Less fury and swiftness for MH Dagger elementalists. A nerf to all MH dagger builds, be them either burst or boon oriented. A significant nerf to all auramancers.
Evasive Arcana: Only affects the healing scale. A nerf to builds with healing power, like bunkers.
Glyph of Elemental Harmony: Three stacks of might instead of one. A buff to burst builds.
Ride the Lightning: General nerf to all OH Dagger builds, be them either burst or boon.
Frost Aura: Less chill, more defense. Neutral. Won’t count this one.

Bunkers: 5 nerfs (most of them being significant)
Auramancers: 4 or 5 nerfs (most of them being significant)
Burst builds: 2 nerfs (none being significant), 1 buff

None being significant… do we even play the same game?

Mobility and dodging is more important on glass builds compared to bunker ones because they have no innate survivability or ridiculous healing / condition removal to survive without them.

But what would you know?

Even more simplified for you:
Burst / glass / dps ele: high damage, relies on dodging, 100% defensive utility spells and mobility to survive.

Faceroll bunker build: average damage, relies on condition removal, massive healing and boons to survive. mobility and dodge rolling are the icing on the cake of OP.

I’ll leave the rest for you.

Kodiak.3281:

Razor.6392:

divinity / ruby orbs.

man I can’t wait until they nerf 0/10/0/30/30.

I am laughing so hard right now. You couldn’t wait, and now you’re upset in how they nerfed it. There were 3 elements that made the D/D Ele strong:

1. Perma vigor with renewing stamina and Soothing Disruption
2. Easily maintained perma Fury with double Shocking Aura
3. Balled up healing efficiency where nothing is really OP but when combined it’s very strong

Nerfing 3 is hard and messy from a development standpoint because there’s really no one thing that’s OP in the mix. Even cutting Evasive Arcana’s water effect isn’t going to have a whole lot of changes of game play.

Nerfing 2 was expected. It can still be maintained, but now the user has to give up a bit more offense to do it (IE: Rune slots). I imagine in the future they will reduce it a bit more as well.

Nerfing 1 was also expected. Soothing Disruption is arguably one of the best traits in the game previously able to offer a huge amount of Regen and Vigor on demand on top of what are already some of our best utility. Coupled with Renewing Stamina you could very easily have perma Vigor which is another thing (in addition to Fury) they’ve been trying to reduce/remove. The truth is however I have a Mesmer and Guardian and Vigor is constantly up with high enough crit rating. The difference is that if you don’t have high enough Crit Rating (such as going more defensive in PVT gear and boon duration) your crit still won’t be as high (50%) as someone who’s in Zerker gear and usually has Fury up (70-90%).

Be careful what you wish for.

The only direct nerf that 0/10/0/30/30 received was the soothing disruption one. Every other nerf, and I mean EVERY ONE OF THEM, impacted other builds on a much greater scale.

@Malcastus: hi bunker player

Yesterday for the first time my forge daggers started to glow at the mists.

I was like lolwut, I guess it’s finally night time now!

Maybe the mists are in the south pole?

Morkai.7645:

You borked non-bunker glass canon D/D elementalists. By nerfing RTL and Zephyrs Boon you successfully reduced our mobility and crit. None of the new changes help glass cannon.

How does either of these help?

Frost Aura: Incoming damage is reduced by 10% while under the effects of this aura. Enemies are only able to be chilled by this aura once per second. This affects all frost auras.

You’ve increased my cool down to 40 on frost aura but compensate me with 10% reduction? 10% is jack kitten with 14K hp. With the increased cool down you have reduced my fury proc using Zephyr Boon. Why would a bunker build need a 10% reduction? They are already bunker. Why would a glass cannon build need 10% reduction? They rely on mobility. Who does this benefit?

Flame Aura: In addition to the burning condition, this aura now grants 10 seconds of might each time the player is struck. This aura can activate only once per second. This change affects all flame auras.

As a glass canon with 14k HP incoming damage kills me. Why would I want to get “struck” for might? I rely on mobility to play. You increased my RTL in place of giving me might upon the premise that I stand there and get whacked.

Did you forget that elementalists are one of the hardest classes to play with the steepest learning curve? Is there no compensation for this as a glass cannon? Instead you bork us. At 14k HP I have less mobility and less crit chance. Awsome. Even as a full glass D/D cannon ele I still have less mobility and burst then a thief. Most thieves have perma stealth with the ability to burst damage up to 17k. As a glass cannon ele I have to mash buttons and flip through attunements and don’t even come close to that kind of damage unless I crit multiple times.

Your changes haven’t made other D/D builds viable as claimed it would, Its actually reduced the viability of other D/D builds. Stovepiping into specific builds. Now people are forced to invest 30 points in Arcane. Have you even fixed Arcane precision proc rate or windborne dagger?

Most people are saying your changes don’t even change the bunker build as advertised in the SOTG address. Instead you borked the glass cannon builds most people aren’t even playing. WTF…

I get you want to balance between classes but what about balance within the class?

Agreed 100% and bumping to show my approval.

It hurts to know that my favorite glass / dps spec took MASSIVE nerfs compared to what the actual root of the problem, the bunker build, had to endure this patch.

Revert changes please.

@all last posts: an example since apparently this is too hard to understand.

Eles receives 20 nerfs.

Out of those nerfs, 4 addressed the infamous 0/10/0/30/30 build specifically.

The other 16 nerfs hit every spec including the bunker build, but the damage suffered by other specs compared to the problem one can’t even be compared.

Basically ANet is forcing people to run 0/10/0/30/30 because other specs were severely affected, and it wasn’t even indirectly because that renewing stamina nerf WAS targeted at glass / dps ele alone.

Grevender.9235:

the nerf on renewing stamina is not welcome, but is mildly attenuated by “on boons granted by activating cantrips have been reduced from 10 seconds to 6 seconds”.
I suppose all high mobility Ele equips cantrips, so…

I have arcane shield, wave, and mist form.

So that’s only one cantrip >_>

They could have made it so you only get 3 seconds vigor on crit, instead of adding a cooldown to it.

OP is in for a surprise when he discovers that those unkillable eles were barely nerfed. Instead, ANet focused their artillery at the ele class as a whole and killed off some nice specs with these nerfs. So if anything you’ll be seeing MORE bunker 0/10/0/30/30 eles now!

Inb4 more QQ posts.

Wizardauz.3761:

I can deal as long as all the other classes can shut up with the “OP FOTM” when i kick their kittens.

actually the fotm build barely suffered any nerfs ;D

Indeed… I don’t even know man.

How can ANet manage to balance EXACTLY in the opposite direction they were supposed to be heading at…

Steps to fix this mess:
1. Revert all the changes
2. Reduce healing power ratio across the board (on D/D water 2, 5, attunement swap, signet of restoration, scepter 3 and EA)
3. Add a cooldown to that water grandmaster trait: 5 seconds cooldown after removing a condition through regen gain.
4. Soothing disruption grants regen and 33% energy gain, vigor gain removed.

There, fixed eles for you ANet. And without killing other specs! I’m a genius. You can hire me anyday.

Xeph.4513:

Firstly you decide that nerfing bunker eles isn’t necessary, instead you end up nerfing balance/dps eles.

^

I don’t understand in what planet those nerfs could pass as reasonable.

THE REASON why eles were labeled as op → dat bunker build.

And then we get nerfs that barely touch said build, instead they seem to be focused on destroying other balanced builds.

…I-I just can’t… I CAN’T I REALLY CAN’T DO THIS, CAN ANYONE HELP ME UNDERSTAND THE REASONING BEHIND THESE CHANGES?!

I’m losing it!

1. spend all your tourney tickets into copper chests
2. salvage
?????????????
3. over 9000 tokens!

Gallrvaghn.4921:

Leo G.4501:

emikochan.8504:

But now when I heal in fire I get 7 stacks of might… hmms

What? GoEH!?

Get out.

I read it was 3 in the patch notes. o__O

It can be more with inscription and whatever tricks he’s using.

anyway, noted OP! if I see a dev at the mists or anywhere I’m just gonna sit in one attunement and spam autoattack until I die.

Minion of Vey.4398:

I certainly agree.

Though I wonder why we keep hearing that bunker eles are basically untouched. I’ve heard it in about 10 different threads now.

Mobility is nerfed (RTL)
Survivability is nerfed (Less regen and vigor)
Damage is nerfed (Less fury).

RTL was nerfed for everyone, not just them.
Survivability is still top notch with that ridiculous condition removal and healing ratios.
Bunkers were not known for their epic damage. Critical chance is nearly useless without critical damage.

Even if those nerfs were targeted at them… it’s obvious that some other builds got it worse. MUCH worse.

I have remained quiet until now.

RtL nerfs? Okay, I’ll work around it.
Worthless focus buffs? don’t care much about it.
EA nerf? It’s ok, at least that hurts eles with excessive healing power more.

…

Shocking aura nerf (or bugfix)? Annoying but oh well, could’ve been worse.
Soothing disruption nerf? Finally a direct nerf for the infamous, problematic build that has caused all these nerfs in the first place.

But now, after checking back after a couple hours, I have also found out that you decided to nerf Renewing stamina (gain vigor on critical hit).

Let me ask you something Arenanet:

Do you keep in mind that when you nerf something because of a certain build, you also indirectly nerf all the other “balanced” builds in the process?

Are you aware that elementalist was deemed OP because the extreme survivability of one build, coupled with ele’s mobility? It was not ele’s mobility what started the complaints.

You do realize that in the process of these nerfs, you have hurt other builds a lot, ALL while keeping the problematic build (the one that caused every complaint) basically untouched?

Every other change I don’t care much about. But this one kinda matters. A dodge is the difference between survival and death, and considering how fragile glass elementalists are, I find myself with less options than ever before. Glass cannon builds rely on their utility / escape spells and dodge rolling to survive, and when you take that away… you are hurting them, greatly. I am not hitting stuff constantly. Sometimes you gotta keep your distance and that’s when this change really starts to show.

I hope you reconsider and at least revert the renewing stamina change and start addressing the real trouble with this class.

tl;dr: RtL + renew stamina nerfs add up and cripple glass ele’s already fragile survivability (mess up once and you’re done for) badly. But the best part is that 0/10/0/30/30 was barely touched in this patch.

Khalic.3561:

So I finally got patched up and in game… Really annoyed they changed renewing stamina. I see WHY they did it, but it’s kinda brutal for non-bunker D/D.

EDIT: You can now only receive vigor every 5s.

WHAT THE kitten

LOL wow, that change once again addresses DPS elementalists because they are the ones constantly proc’ing vigor with a very high crit chance.

Obviously glass ele’s are so OP bro! kittening useless monkeys balancing this game.

I srsly can’t believe this trash. Like caffynated said, they managed to destroy the viability of other non-bunker builds, while barely touching bunkers at all. ALL in one patch.

I cannot comprehend such incompetence. I really can’t.

If OP was in ANet balance team he would probably move RtL to the elite slot and give it a 480 seconds cooldown.

Rhoto.8791:

The issue I am seeing is that nothing has really changed.. People were complaining about the super hard to kill FOTM 0 10 0 30 30 build, and after these changes it is still very viable and it is STILL about the ONLY viable build for us. So we will still have the FOTMs, we will still get the complaints, and we will just be slightly less mobile now.

Exactly.

RtL nerfs affect every x/D spec, but screws over the glassy ones more than the bunker ones, because they actually needed the mobility to make up for their low survivability.

While bunker builds can just laugh it off while enjoying their mindless op spec.

Trash balance ftw.