Guild Wars 2

Well, you also need Huntsman to craft torches…

The RNG gods are the ultimate trolls.

Tigaseye.2047:

Cuchullain.3104:

PS If you do go into WvW as a ranger, get used to being called a ’rallybot" meaning every time the enemy rallies from the downed state due to the death of a player that fired at them, it will be blamed on you. Get used to people bypassing everyone else to dogpile on you because you are correctly considered an easy kill.

Very true, sadly.

Sebrent, I’m not sure what your problem is, but unless you are a developer of this game and of Rangers in particular (in which case, you should really just come clean and say so), I think it is safe to say you are taking all this way, way, too personally.

This is a feedback forum and we are giving feedback.

No one is “crying” and we (or, at least most of us) are just trying to tell the truth, as we see it.

That is why it is hilarious to play a tanky spec and run/evade around as the enemy zerg fails to kill you, leaving your zerg free to kill unhindered.

You are correct. They mean after a trap is thrown, nothing will happen for about a second. Then the trap will become triggerable. Keep in mind trap stats will likely be buffed to accommodate this.

rager.4963:

Here is a question. You guys are saying that toughness makes pets get aggro correct? So does pets scale off your stats? if i get toughness on my armor. Do I risk stealing aggro?

Unfortunately, no. Pets’ stats are independent from the Ranger.

this is one of those things that Rangers either really like — or really hate. Personally, I am on the side that dislikes it, but I don’t see any change coming in the future.

Druid will likely have an F5 skill.

mistsim.2748:

Razor.9872:

I think the reason is as Cafard said. Reducing the cooldown could make RaO “spammier,” essentially changing the skill from being an impactful decision to a no-brainer-use-off-cooldown sorta skill.

lol. RaO doesn’t impact anything right now. at the very least it needs to be instacast so we can get that stab when we actually need it. and because it’s a bad elite that doesn’t impact the outcome of fights, keeping it on such a long CD is really counterproductive.

I’d have to disagree with that. I find the high swiftness, stability, and fury uptime to be invaluable while avoiding getting stun-locked and to dish out the most damage possible uninterrupted. Making the pet hit like a truck is a bonus.

snow.8097:

Razor.9872:

Peakitten.6412:

I have to come down on the side of the folks who do not want to have an arming time on HS. When I use it, I am at the point of needing a heal that regen isn’t going to cover. I also double dip on it by blasting HS with warhorn providing the extra area healing.

There are already so many heals that just ‘heal instantly’. Wouldn’t it be a change of pace to have a heal that you have to time for (much like A.E.D.)? Of course, due to this variation, the skill would have to be balanced around this, but it would turn high-skill high-reward.

Either that, or A-net could just make this one trap not have an activation time.

Either one works.

We have troll unguent and water spirit, i think thats variation enough
i dont want HS to be placable trap.

idk what speaks against signet
it changes nothing to HS itself, just when it has no cd on it, we have an effect thats new.
i dont see any reason why it should be not as good as a trap spring
from trap category we gain nothing, no good effect, just we can place it.
with signet we could have an additional way to gain might and OS.
i am #teamSIGNET.

Actually, trap category would make it larger, have longer boon duration, and make it double-activatable. For one, it was a trap in GW1. For another, the artwork doesn’t really match that of a signet :\

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Care to give a reason why you say nope?

What’s the difference between a RaO that lasts 10s and recharges in 60s and one that lasts 20s and recharges in 120s? Ability to use it again in a minute is much better imo, two minutes is a long time.

I think the reason is as Cafard said. Reducing the cooldown could make RaO “spammier,” essentially changing the skill from being an impactful decision to a no-brainer-use-off-cooldown sorta skill. In Caford’s opinion, Rangers already have access to many spammable utilities (i.e. SotH, Guard, ST, MT, and Entangle).

misterman.1530:

soxfan.3189:

Just for clarity I am on HoD also. We ran last night on CD BL it was dead so we qued for EB. The about 20 of us took around 30 min to get everyone into EBG. Once we all get there it was dead and we just stated running laps for the next hour praying that NSP and CD would come out of their keeps and play with us.

Why would we bother (NSP I mean)? We rarely number more than 20 people at a time on a BL…even that would seem abnormally blob-ish. Since the last tournament, fewer and fewer people are playing. In fact, I don’t think we have had a queue to get into a BL in quite some time.

So, we log in, see the map is entirely red and we are ticking 10 or less, and just go PvE instead.

Until Anet figures out a viable handicap feature, there’s little fun to be had 2 vs 15 like it was this afternoon in our BL – though it was CD outnumbering us there.

BL had a queue 4 about days ago, actually

OGDeadHead.8326:

Q: Does the #1 on every weapon count as a “weapon skill” – meaning it would be possible to waste this if you accidently use an autoattack first thing you do on weapon swap?

This is a very good question. I would like to have this addressed.

Peakitten.6412:

I have to come down on the side of the folks who do not want to have an arming time on HS. When I use it, I am at the point of needing a heal that regen isn’t going to cover. I also double dip on it by blasting HS with warhorn providing the extra area healing.

There are already so many heals that just ‘heal instantly’. Wouldn’t it be a change of pace to have a heal that you have to time for (much like A.E.D.)? Of course, due to this variation, the skill would have to be balanced around this, but it would turn high-skill high-reward.

Either that, or A-net could just make this one trap not have an activation time.

Either one works.

I think we can all agree A-net hates Necromancer.

Shen Slayer.3058:

same here, I never really got into Dry Top or knew what to do there, but want to get into it now that there’s more ppl.

One question…what happens when you hit Tier 6?

The prices of all the items purchesable with Geodes become very cheap.

I think it is one of those things that is a “wait and see” issue. Personally, I don’t find the trait OP at all. Strong, yes; Build/role defining, yes — but not OP.

The double rapid fire would be strong for sure, but it is one of those things that grows easier and easier to exploit/counter the more it is used. Besides, Mesmers are getting loads of reflect. Might end up killing yourself.

In my opinion, I prefer the way RaO is currently because, to me, it makes the skill more “valuable” and worthy of being an elite skill. The longer cooldown/duration makes you have to think about when to use it, rather than just spamming the skill off cooldown.

Those are my two cents, anyhow.

Not 100% sure what you are asking/looking for, sorry. Can you possibly elaborate?

Majic.4801:

What We Currently Know…

To unlock a full core specialization, you must bring the Knights of ArenaNet… a shrubbery! One that looks nice, and not too expensive.

To unlock an elite specialization, you must bring the Knights of ArenaNet… another shrubbery! When you have found the shrubbery, you must place the shrubbery there, beside the first shrubbery, only slightly higher, so you get a two-level effect with a path through the middle.

Once you have accomplished that, then you must cut down the mightiest tree in the forest with… a herring!

In other words, basically the same system we have now.

If you don’t, A-net will assault you ears with “KNNEE!” relentlessly.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Razor.9872:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Maybe make another signet, but leave my HS alone!

I don’t know man, I think it would be worth a try to have it function as a trap. The possibilities are vast.

I was referring to the post above me that suggested making it a signet. Trap would be great.

Oh. Oooohkay that makes sense now that I read it a second time. Yeah, I agree.

I’m going to have to disagree on the activation time change with traits. Personally, I think it is a fantastic idea — as long as they are balanced around it. This is one of those things where we will just have to wait and see.

Gotejjeken.1267:

It is a nerf to me because the pets bleeds can overwrite the ranger’s. Before we could control that by not taking a pet that had a chance to bleed, now we have to avoid the trait too.

No. No they cannot. At least, they will no when all this hits.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Maybe make another signet, but leave my HS alone!

I don’t know man, I think it would be worth a try to have it function as a trap. The possibilities are vast.

borya.2964:

Substance E.4852:

borya.2964:

kiwituatara.6053:

Guard may be useful and a lot of apothecary rangers run it, but its still a very very badly designed skill.

Most rangers use Guard only because of its access to Nature’s Voice on a short cooldown. You will hardly see any rangers running Guard without the trait. Honestly, there are no viable builds out there that runs Guard without taking Nature’s Voice.

Do you have a viable build using untraited traps, untraited spirits, untraited survival skills ? A lot of utitlities need traits to work, no matter the class. I don’t see your point.

Those skills have specific purposes that they are brought for on their own. Regen builds would still bring Guard to spam NV even if guard did absolutely nothing.

Send your pet where you want without a target is absolutley nothing, stealth your pet is absolutley nothing, giving him high protection up time is absolutely nothing. I get it. Now that you can take a third line like BM, Guard will even be better , send your
pet somewhere and taunt your traget from stealth etc. Guard + NV is great, “+”, you know, like in addition to. But keep thinking i like it for NV + absolutely nothing.

Anyway, i am done to talk about absolutely nothing.

I’d say the high protection uptime is the best thing about the skill currently. I hope that would stay. If the CD were to be increased, then I’d like to see the protection application duration increased as well.

borya.2964:

Look at wvw, 90 % of LB power rangers doesn’t care of the pets, it’s just an extra F2. They are tied to a dead class mechanic, the pet is dead half of the time. How do you want to explain why Guard is a good skill ? It’s sad.

Aren’t you the one trying to explain why Guard (currently) is a good skill? Bringing in Noobish ranger players into the argument does little to strengthen your position, just fyi.

naphack.9346:

So you are saying, it has no actual function right now?
Make pet invis, grant protection, send to place…
Let’s go on: While the pet is invis, it will hold back the special ability, which means, you can command dogs to knockdown, whenever you want.
The ability to place an invis pet at a target location and have it pop up behind the enemy to set up a coordinated burst attack.
Seems like a great package on a small cooldown to me.

1) you can hold back your canine’s knockdown by keeping it on standby. If you say you don’t want to keep your canine on standby because you want it to still attack, then it doesn’t matter if you keep your pet invisible or not (as the CD on the knockdown is far greater than any stealth duration can account for).

2)Can you not pop a coordinated burst attack with taunt? Arguably you could do so further, as the knockdown still exists and would likely take effect just before the taunt is gone.

Yeah, the cooldown might change, but 25 seconds (base) is still excellent.

borya.2964:

I believe you, but don’t forget you’re in a thread where the op don’t give a kitten of the synergy between Guard and Natures’ voice (will be an adpet, again, much better) and also want to improve the skill, no matter the CD, to make it useful in a kitten dungeon.

Every proposal with a higher CD and a stealth removal is just dumb to me.

I give a pretty big kitten, actually, I’d say a kitten close to a lion. Further application of taunt would allow your regeneration and swiftness to take a more meaningful effect. You say you like Guard for more than just its effect with Nature’s Voice, yet one of the main reasons you keep defending it is on the basis of party swiftness…

My proposed change would be useful in far more than just dungeons; the skill could allow for camp wipes in wvw in much the same way a Guardian’s GS 5 accomplishes, and in PvP it would pull your opponent away from you on points so you could mess up their orientation and, again, give more time for your regeneration and swiftness to mean something.

I’m sorry, but I still can’t see for the life of me what you like about the current Guard so much. Everything besides the stealth aspect would still be easily accomplished.

Oslaf Beinir.5842:

no matter how much this trait gets buffed it wont be picked in the future with the hot competition for that grandmaster slot. SoTF and EB are there too right?

the only hope for it is for it to move somewhere or if EB or SoTF were moved around instead

I think people could pick this trait over the other two in a trapper build if HS becomes a trap (would allow for double the condi clear in a short time period). But, yeah, even then further effects on the trait would be desirable.

borya.2964:

kiwituatara.6053:

Guard may be useful and a lot of apothecary rangers run it, but its still a very very badly designed skill.

Most rangers use Guard only because of its access to Nature’s Voice on a short cooldown. You will hardly see any rangers running Guard without the trait. Honestly, there are no viable builds out there that runs Guard without taking Nature’s Voice.

Do you have a viable build using untraited traps, untraited spirits, untraited survival skills ? A lot of utitlities need traits to work, no matter the class. I don’t see your point.

Actually, I see lots of builds using untraited survival skills, and I think I did see one power hybrid build that is popular now in WvW roaming use only partially traited traps (spirits are another matter, untraited spirits feel useless). But the point is if Survival skills and signets can do it, there isn’t any reason our shouts can’t either.

Just a note, traited HaO will have a 16sec cooldown.

anduriell.6280:

Razor.9872:

Jim Hunter.6821:

I use guard in multiple builds, increasing the cooldown would destroy the skill, and there is no way they would give us a taunt on such a low cooldown. You’d be better off asking for the taunt to be added to protect me.

With Heal as One becoming a shout now, as well, do you think Guard still needs to have the short cooldown it has currently? If so, do you think there is a way to modify the skill to make it “better” and still keep its current cooldown? Or do you still prefer it the way it is now? If so, why?

As i pointed before , to make the Guard shout unique i would do this:

• As about guard, it should bring Revealed for 10 secs as well. Although i think revealed should work this way:
• any stealthed target will be attacked by the pet but it will not be reavealed The point of this is: if you get in the area the pet will attack you, and most probably the ranger will know where you are because of that. But you will not loose the stealth so you still can hide/escape, also you would be safe from any ranger skills that need an active target (RF channelling wouldn’t work for example).
  This will bring two unique mechanics to the ranger by using the pet: detect stealth enemies and resurrect allies. So more group support.

That would be interesting. Although, don’t you think having two skills in the same category (ie Sic’em) doing roughly the same thing with stealth would be a bit much? And would the pet prioratize stealthed targets over visible ones?

Jim Hunter.6821:

I use guard in multiple builds, increasing the cooldown would destroy the skill, and there is no way they would give us a taunt on such a low cooldown. You’d be better off asking for the taunt to be added to protect me.

With Heal as One becoming a shout now, as well, do you think Guard still needs to have the short cooldown it has currently? If so, do you think there is a way to modify the skill to make it “better” and still keep its current cooldown? Or do you still prefer it the way it is now? If so, why?

naphack.9346:

Razor.9872:

4) I’m glad I made you laugh, hopefully lightened up this debate a bit. But could you explain why it did so?

Not sure if troll or serious.

From the way, you always try to pacify opponents of your idea by claiming, nothing would change(and all the explanations you did always included the low cooldown) to now suddenly acknowledging, that your changes would indeed cause the low cooldown to go away, it seems like you intend to force your point of view through, no matter what.
That’s not, how a discussion works. If you aren’t here to discuss, but merely to state your point of view, then there’s no need to discuss any further.

I was being completely serious (although, that is something a troll would say…you will just have to take my word for it). It never occured to me I was trying to “passify” anyone (lol, guadian skill), I was simply pointing out the effects from traits would still take effect and the pet would still gain protection — something I felt was being ignored despite my repeated attempts to highlight it. I’m sorry if it feels like I’m forcing my point of view on you, I can assure you I’m trying to do nothing of the sort. If anything I’m trying my best to make this a discussion.

Please understand: at no point did I claim nothing would change (wouldn’t be a revamp if nothing changed). Please don’t twist my words. On the topic of the flimsy low cooldown stance, I think my change of mind is exactly how a discussion should go down. Don’t you think my thoughts remaining static would impose a forceful viewpoint further?

If anything, I feel like this comment of yours was a personal attack. Really, I feel like it is personal attacks that have no place in discussions. Please, if you are going to contribute, do so by making clear what you feel is still good (or could improve) with Guard and S&R. Despite what you may feel, I am open to criticism and the other side’s point of view. That is why I created this thread to begin with. I, of course, will defend my viewpoint, but if I see wellmade points, I will not hesitate to allow them to change my opinion.

borya.2964:

I am not going to further discuss about rhetoric.

Razor.9872:

When one uses Guard, they are generally sending the pet in the direction of the enemy, no? This same task can be accomplished easily be selecting the enemy and pressing F1 (That’s what you can do with our profession mechanic).

That’s why you failed to understand the utility of guard and the pet management part.

Razor.9872:

There you go again, assuming things. Why would you think I am speaking solely from a PvE perspective? Actually, I’m inclined to feel like I’m speaking from a PvX perspective.

You spoke about mobs, aggro and the so-called uselessness of stealth. So yes, it’s a PVE point of vue.

Razor.9872:

Perhaps. Think a 25 second base is sufficient?

Lol ?

1) Were we ever discussing rhetoric?
2) How am I failing to understand the utility of guard and pet management? You state so, but with no support.
3)I was just using an example. The same things can easily be said in PvP or WvW as well (Although this wouldn’t do much in zergs, would mainly be a small party roaming thing).
4) I’m glad I made you laugh, hopefully lightened up this debate a bit. But could you explain why it did so?

Just trying to understand you’re mindset. As it is right now, I don’t feel like we’re on the same page.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Remove the Search part from it… I want to be able to target it.

“Rescue”
Your pet will revive your targeted downed ally.
Your pet gains 3s of Stability every 3s for 15s.
Your pet gains Super Speed for 5s.

Then just make the revive at least 66% speed because currently its at 33% of the regular revive speed and make the pet continue to attempt revival even if it is CCd, until the person either dies, they are revived or you call the pet back.

Also, make the skill affected by shout recharge reduction and reduce the CD to 120s in sPvP as it is 180 seconds. Necro’s Signet of Undeath revives 3 people with that CD and doesn’t take their class mechanic away to do it for a period of time.

Then, it would actually be quite good.

I like this. I can see this working. +1

naphack.9346:

Guard will not keep its low cool down if a disable is rolled into it. Simple as that.

Perhaps. Think a 25 second base is sufficient?

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Negativity.5801:

…SoS is superior to Protect me in every conceivable way. Protect me is fundamentally poorly designed and worse than that, it’s completely counter-intuitive with the new ranger traits. Ranger traits practically scream “swap your pet everytime it’s off cd” because with just marksmanship and beast mastery lines you can get 4 stacks of might, fury, swiftness, and quickness on a 16s cd while the fury might and swiftness last 15s.

Risking killing your pet and tripling the cooldown of pet swap is never going to be worth it. Especially not when PM and SoS have the same cd except SoS keeps you AND your pet alive, and gives you 3 more stacks of might and a guaranteed crit + 10 stacks of vuln from your OS and your pet’s OS….

You are right, it is better. But all the other skills are better than the other two signets you will have on your bar and have much more synergy as a build. If there was a signet heal and signet elite, then signets would be superior.

You are wrong that “Protect Me” is counter-intuitive with the new traits, it rewards you for swapping, which is exactly how you should be using it. You swap pets before it dies and get the buff. You are forgetting that Beastmasters Bond has a 30s CD and “PM” also recharges 16s faster than SoS when both are traited. “PM” is also a stun break. PM doesn’t have the passive +180 Toughness either, but it is still an invulnerability skill and it fits in with the other skills on the bar, you just have to play it a bit different.

It also protects against condition damage applied after its activation. Just as a side note.

borya.2964:

Razor.9872:

The reason you "have to explain why [you] love guard while [I don’t] even explain why it’s a “poor” skill" is simply because I asked you to explain, while no one asked me. But I will take your implied snobbishness as the question."

Of course no one asked you. You made a statement in your opening tread…

Exactly why I didn’t have to explain. You seem to understand. Don’t know why you were acting demeaning for me not doing so.

borya.2964:

…that you’re not really assuming, saying that everybody agree that Guard is a “poor” skill as if it were self-evident.

I’m sorry for not mentioning. Actually, before I made this thread, I wondered around taking a poll from many rangers (82, according to my notes), asking them their opinion of Guard and my proposed change. The vast majority of them agreed (74), the rest either ran out of time to debate or didn’t wish to comment further, so I can’t add their side, unfortunately.

borya.2964:

So you don’t have to explain why and you can directly propose a change. This is a fact, not an offense. Same to the fact that you want to change a skill you never use.

You’re throwing around all these “facts” so lightly. Was that really an offense? By definition, that means you are offended. If so, I’m sorry for offending you in any way. Please take time to grow less easily offended.

And I apologize as well for implying I have never used this skill. I tried various shout ranger builds for a few weeks, but all the while I felt hindered by Guard (and S&R). Sic’em and Protect Me were the only 2 shouts that felt useful. That is why I am proposing these changes. Because I, and the various people I asked, said they liked it. So I thought I would present it to a larger audience.

borya.2964:

The thing you missed is that i actually like ALL the things i explained in the SAME time. You can’t basically answer with a point-by-point basis.

Is that so? Well, that’s already starting to fall apart, isn’kitten“it”, (text checker thinking I’m trying to say something else)? With the shout trait going out of the Nature Magic line and all. But for the heck of it, lets do a full recap, shall we?

borya.2964:

Well, Guard offers a great synergy combined with the actual Nature’s Voice (but not the incoming Resounding Timbre since you won’t be able to share the boons with your pets, it’s already a nerf). I like the pet being invisible, gaining protection, swiftness and regen, it’s great for pet management when you know how to use it. I like the swiftness (and regen in more condi regen oriented build) it provides to me, enough to gain a slot without to take SOTH or any runes with + X % movement speed. I like the fact that you can use it when your pet is stowed and i like the way it buffs your party in a short CD. All in a single skill. Nothing more that Guard users already know.

Everything here, is saying you like guard for its low cooldown, protection application, stealth application, area movement command, synergy with Fortifying Bond and the ability to activate despite pet stowage. The reason I broke down your speel is because the only 2 differences from what you like of the current guard in comparison to my proposed one, are stealth application and area movement command (the later of which can still be done — I will explain in a moment). Everything from the protection application, to the party regen and swiftness, can still be done with the taunt-guard. That is why I broke down what you said — to isolate the sole differences.

borya.2964:

As an aside, i don’t know how you can already send your pet in an area if you have no target (that’s what you can do with Guard).

When one uses Guard, they are generally sending the pet in the direction of the enemy, no? This same task can be accomplished easily be selecting the enemy and pressing F1 (That’s what you can do with our profession mechanic).

borya.2964:

And since you clearly speak from a PVE perspective only, we won’t agree for sure.

There you go again, assuming things. Why would you think I am speaking solely from a PvE perspective? Actually, I’m inclined to feel like I’m speaking from a PvX perspective.

naphack.9346:

Not everyone runs bearbow. Drawing the aggro away from the pet is not always a bad thing. And for bearbow, there’s that new trait, which gives the f2 ability taunt.

The big upside of the current guard is the surprise factor. The opponents don’t see the invisible pet coming in and get nailed out of nowhere.

Actually, out of this thread, I really like the idea to change “protect me!” to cause taunt.

I didn’t write this threat with the idea of bearbow in mind (I try to forget that is actually a thing, really).

While I can understand the surprise factor being strong, and the fact there is already a taunt applying option, I feel like the surprise factor is minimal in comparison to further application of taunt.

Just to ask, can you explain why drawing aggro away from the pet isn’t always a bad thing? Even in melee, I prefer to have my enemy facing the pet so I can take advantage of Hunter’s Tactics.

We’ve been discussing Guard a bunch, but how do you guys feel about S&R?

naphack.9346:

Razor.9872:

naphack.9346:

Sadly guard doesn’t have 3000 range anymore. Still, with resounding timbre, I really don’t want guard changed. You can just have your pet sneak up on someone and mess him up good. Also, it’s a low cd shout, so it’s useful with rune of the soldier.
Also, having an invisible drakehound sneak up on someone and pin him down with immobilize opens up nicely for a longbow burst.

If disabling your opponent to set up for a burst is what you’re ultimately after, wouldn’t taunt do the same thing? And I didn’t say the low cd would change.

inb4 mandatory utility skill regardless of traits.
Taunt on a 15 second cd utility. You heard it here first, guys.

Actually, I’m pretty sure this suggestion has been proposed in the past, but it wasn’t in the official forums. Really, this skill would be more class-defining. It would give Rangers an even clearer roll in content groups.

borya.2964:

Razor.9872:

borya.2964:

Don’t even kitten think to change Guard . They already had taunt and i think its’ a good where it is. Don’t propose changes to skills you never use please.

Can you explain why you think guard is good the way it is currently? They did not already have taunt, that is something that is coming. But having more than one source of it would be ideal. The face that I never use this skill and my reasoning for proposing a change to it are only partially related.

I have to explain why i love guard while youd’ont even explain why it’s a “poor” skill, a fact that would be “largely agreed” ?

Well, Guard offers a great synergy combined with the actual Nature’s Voice (but not the incoming Resounding Timbre since you won’t be able to share the boons with your pets, it’s already a nerf). I like the pet being invisible, gaining protection, swiftness and regen, it’s great for pet management when you know how to use it. I like the swiftness (and regen in more condi regen oriented build) it provides to me, enough to gain a slot without to take SOTH or any runes with + X % movement speed. I like the fact that you can use it when your pet is stowed and i like the way it buffs your party in a short CD. All in a single skill. Nothing more that Guard users already know.

Thank you for explaining.
I will now go through your reasons on a point-by-point basis.

“Guard offers a great synergy combined with the actual Nature’s Voice”
-my proposed guard would also offer great synergy with Resounding Timbre, I would argue greater, actually, since the pet would not lose aggo — but rather gain it — it would allow for greater capitalizing on the traits swiftness and regen.

“(but not the incoming Resounding Timbre since you won’t be able to share the boons with your pets, it’s already a nerf)”
-Why are you not wanting guard changed if it will no longer be as strong as it is now?

“I like the pet being invisible, gaining protection, swiftness and regen, it’s great for pet management when you know how to use it.”
-Are you referring to keeping the pet alive? Define “management.”’

“I like the swiftness (and regen in more condi regen oriented build) it provides to me, enough to gain a slot without to take SOTH or any runes with + X % movement speed.

-My proposed change would do nothing to change what you like about this. Therefore, I don’t feel like this is worth mentioning.

“I like the fact that you can use it when your pet is stowed and i like the way it buffs your party in a short CD.”
-My proposed change would not stop the skill from being used while the pet is stowed, or the CD. Therefore, the party buffs would still take effect from the trait, but the party would further benefit from aggo’d mobs.

The reason you "have to explain why [you] love guard while [I don’t] even explain why it’s a “poor” skill" is simply because I asked you to explain, while no one asked me. But I will take your implied snobbishness as the question."

As it stands, the sole purpose of guard is to give your pet protection, and send it to a target unseen. The added protection is nice, but that’s where the skill’s usefulness really ends.. Stealthing the pet is rarely to be desired, as it draws aggro away from the pet and towards the ranger. While pets can be replaced, rangers cannot. Finally, moving the pet to an area is really something rangers can do already. The pet still targets and follows enemies the same, it just does so with the intent to return after the target is slain (unnecessary).

naphack.9346:

Sadly guard doesn’t have 3000 range anymore. Still, with resounding timbre, I really don’t want guard changed. You can just have your pet sneak up on someone and mess him up good. Also, it’s a low cd shout, so it’s useful with rune of the soldier.
Also, having an invisible drakehound sneak up on someone and pin him down with immobilize opens up nicely for a longbow burst.

If disabling your opponent to set up for a burst is what you’re ultimately after, wouldn’t taunt do the same thing? And I didn’t say the low cd would change.

ProtoMarcus.7649:

Crap ahahah just started a similar thread…

I suggested Taunt too, but to ‘protect me’; the pet stops attacking so loses function, and although the skill is a damage cancelling skill, we already have one through Signet of Stone, so I suggested damage reduction instead (to something like 50%) but also applicable to condition damage.

It could be interesting to guard, but guard has a very low CD and it’s effect is already unique and opens for interesting dynamic in fights. You basically transform your pet into a turret.

I can see protect me applying taunt as well. The reason I chose Guard was because, the way I see it, a Ranger’s pet is essentially already a moving turret. Guard only really applies protection to the pet, stealth’s it, and tells it to move to an area.

The way I see it, the first effect is good, and would hopefully remain with my proposed change. The added protection would help the pet survive against taunted targets. Stealthing the pet is rarely to be desired, however, as it draws aggro away from the pet and towards the ranger. While pets can be replaced, rangers cannot. Finally, moving the pet to an area is really something rangers can do already. The pet still targets and follows enemies the same, it just does so with the intent to return after the target is slain (unnecessary). I don’t see a problem with the low cooldown remaining. All-in-all, I believe it would really make pets shine for once.

borya.2964:

Don’t even kitten think to change Guard . They already had taunt and i think its’ a good where it is. Don’t propose changes to skills you never use please.

Can you explain why you think guard is good the way it is currently? They did not already have taunt, that is something that is coming. But having more than one source of it would be ideal. The face that I never use this skill and my reasoning for proposing a change to it are only partially related.

With the addition of Heal as One and Rampage as One becoming shouts, it is clear A-net wants to push shout builds to be more viable. However, it is largely agreed upon that Guard and Search & Rescue are very poor skills.

What I suggest is this: make Guard AoE Taunt foes in the target area. And have Taunted foes be taunted towards the pet (in much the same way that the upcoming Beastly Warden trait works). The mechanic and skill name make sense together for one.

As for S&R, I think the idea is fine enough, but the numbers are just too low in comparison to other profession res assists. If this skill is going to work, the pet needs to gain some sort of invulnerability for a short time(stone signet active + resistance?) but still be CCable. Finally, the pet needs to rez much faster — I’m talking Elixir R rez speed or greater.

These are my proposed changes. How do you think these two skills could be improved?

borya.2964:

naphack.9346:

So I slept over it and came up with this:

Rending Attacks
Each attack of your pet causes bleeding. If the target has three or more stacks of bleeding, the attack will remove a boon on hit (5 seconds cooldown).
Bleeding (6 seconds)
Bleed threshold: 3

Very bad idea.

Boon removal need to be an active skill, can you imagine saying to your mates on TS : Ok, am gonna remove his boons, well, wait for the pet to attacks guys, wel, hum, wait i need 3 stacks of bleed on the target ! You promote horrible passive play.

And if you really want boon removal, first go take a sigil or ( boon duration will be nerfed) it need to be in Nature Magic, cuz this line is pretty bad with the changes, something more like “steal” boons rather than “remove” boon since NM is the boon duration line.

Stilling boons is more of the thief’s “thing.” I still like my idea.

Ehecatl.9172:

Razor.9872:

Keep in mind that having HS be a trap provides the opportunity to heal twice in a very short time period if you set up before the fight starts.

That would be pretty great. It’d give trapper rangers twice the condi clear just with their heal to compensate for not having survival skills to make use of the new Survival of the Fittest trait or Signet of Renewal. It’d be harder to use correctly but have a way better pay off when mastered.

Yeah, in my opinion, skills which capitalize on skill are always welcome.

I agree with this completely. If Rangers can’t go into melee then we will go right back to being shunned for staying ranged the whole fight. Either that or forced back into condi builds.

Keep in mind that having HS be a trap provides the opportunity to heal twice in a very short time period if you set up before the fight starts.

Razor.9872:

I don’t know about Boon removal, but I have an idea for boon punishment.

What if there was a grandmaster trait (lets call it fungal spores or something) that would, when the Ranger is equipped with shortbow, dagger, or torch, create field of effect around the Ranger where each boon on an enemy pulses a corrisponding condition every few seconds? The boons wouldn’t be removed, but it would still be a unique way for Rangers to pressure boons.

Just to add examples, Might would pulse Bleed, Fury would pulse Burn, Regen would pulse Poison, Swiftness would pulse Cripple, Protection would pulse Vulnerability, Aegis would pulse Blind, Retaliation would pulse Confusion, Stability would pulse Fear, Vigor would pulse Weakness, and Quickness would pulse Slow.

I don’t know about Boon removal, but I have an idea for boon punishment.

What if there was a grandmaster trait (lets call it fungal spores or something) that would, when the Ranger is equipped with shortbow, dagger, or torch, create field of effect around the Ranger where each boon on an enemy pulses a corrisponding condition every few seconds? The boons wouldn’t be removed, but it would still be a unique way for Rangers to pressure boons.