Guild Wars 2

Well.. it is and it isn’t.

If you down a Mesmer, he may say that you’re “burn cheese” and he’s the one with the perma stealth spikes. It took a bit of ingenuity for the Guard to know when to block, evade, and burst when the Mesmer isn’t invulnerable.

To a Thief, all you really have to do is JI, PF and Block.
ALL of your damages are done via blocks and utilities so yea, that would be easy cheese mode there.
(Extremely good Thieves can counter all of these to win but that’s besides the point)

For the most part though, Guardians are cheesy in lower tier pvp (solo pvp) but they can be more difficult to manage in higher tier comps with Ele/Necro/Bunker cleansing classes. (or just classes who know how to kite and cleanse)

Choose Spirit Hammer over the Signet.

Considering you’re a “cc build”, you don’t need to specialize for any retaliation. No point in having that much retal uptime if you’re not getting hit the majority of the time.

Could go rune of the nightmare.
It’s a condi rune but I recommend a power amulet.

Hydromancy sigs on at least hammer.
Air/fire sigs on rest i guess.

Mufasa.8415:

I run my mesmer with about 25k health. I walked into a fight to add some support; the second i got into the fight / guards on opposing team. I was hit immediately with 16 stacks of burning. with 25k health I didnt even have the time to pop my heal with the 2second or 1 1/2 second casting time even though I popped it the moment it happened. Burning is by far the only condition I EVER worry about. It’s the only one that does real damage.

The only way a guardian can “instantly” apply 16 stacks of burning is if he used Whirling Wrath on you, your clones, or anyone else who was near you. Even then, it would have taken 3s for this to happen. It’s definitely l2p on your part lol.

A power Guardian with hammer, smite condition, glacials heart (optional) and hydromancy would have, literally, instantly kill your clones and brought you to 30% health.

Should have rotated to far the moment the Guardian dropped at 8:00. Your thief was dead so you needed to rotate immediately instead of staying in mid.

In one scenario you were trying to apply aoe damages while your downed ally was being rezed. You had full health and you’re cele… you should have expedited the rez process by helping instead of trying to apply aoe damages. Your alliez woupdn’t have received so much damages. If you had half health and you were zerks then yea, I would have done aoe damages too but you’re not.

Those were the obvious errors. If you posted the vids where you got downed I could help you further.

Just becareful when you engage with Flame Thrower or any other 300 radius attack. You’re not going to out damage a Guardian, Warrior or out burst a Mesmer. So don’t enter a heavily aoe damaging fight thinking you’re going to do just that.

That said, you kited well for the most part.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Amante.8109:

Is the fix to this bug going to be immediate or will we have to wait a while?

Next release will have the updates.

So i’d imagine it’ll be the next patch update o_o

Thanks for the responses Evan I appreciate it!

Class compositions can make a difference but that’s not the meat of the issue.

A scenario in terms of how MMR should work
Lets say we have a 4 man team that are going through matchmaking, picking up a pug to fill that +1 slot. They finally find Player A and they win. They go through several more games with that player and they win a couple games but lose every so often.

The same 4 man team drops Player A and picks up Player B. They’re winning a bit more and lose only occationally… BUT, the enemy’s team score is a bit higher when they won. As a matter of fact, when they lose a game, they lost with a lower end score than when they lost with Player A.
But thanks to the 50% win/lose and the RNG effect, the 4 man team won a bit more games than they did with Player A, so they stick with Player B a bit longer… unknowing that Player B is actually worse than player A because of the points they’re finishing with.

That’s typically the problem with the current MMR. Matchmaking isn’t giving enough credit to Player A because MMR is mainly based on the Glicko system – a system based on wins and losses. Player A is actually reducing the score gap but Glicko doesn’t look at that.

Glicko doesn’t calculate the enemy’s team’s points when you win a match.
Glicko doesn’t calculate how many points you fall short of 500 when you lose a match.
It doesn’t average out all of these game’s end score deviations to further calculate MMR
These Win end score deviation and Loss end score deviations (including the enemy team) should govern a player’s True MMR.

The “Odds of winning a match” is govern by MMR that isn’t well calculated.
To top it off, the rank points given is based on a 100 – 200 – 300 – 400 point scaling rather than a more detailed 100 – 105 – 110 – 115 rank point scaling. This should make for a more defining point system.

That’s the issue with MMR

style.6173:

Saiyan.1704:

I also like to add that most people tend to blow their condi cleanses because they all of a sudden see 5 unique conditions on them.. when it’s nothing life threatening.

The conditions you need to prevent are the most damaging ones.
Purging Flames – Judge’s Intervention – Whirling Wrath – Zealot’s Fire
And/or Shelter Focus#5 burn on block effects.

Ignore any other F1 procs (assuming it’s a 1v1 and you’re not in a group where permeating wrath takes effect)

You should kill any guardian 1v1 (except me :>)
You should hard cc/cleanse/kite any burn gerd in team fights (except me :>)

See? A perfect example of my point from earlier. Instead of admitting burn stacking is OP, people always say “cleanse the burn”.

A few notes for you:
1. This is not a 1v1 game. I don’t care if you have only one condi. Your burn stacking plus the other condis that cover it are the problem.
2. Guardian is good at 1v1. Not sure why you think it is hard.

Condi clears really need to clear the highest damage condi FIRST. Remove the condi RNG and promote active skill play.

I wasn’t referring to just a 1v1 standpoint. Not at all. I was talking about team fights / Skirmish fights and suggested key 1v1 elements as well. No need to take notes here,
it’s more of a l2p issue than a condi cleanse one. People are eating up burn guardian’s skills and utilities that I listed. Don’t let a Guardian Whirl Wrath 3 or more people at once.

Never said I needed help in 1v1 but a lot of other burn guardians struggle against sig necro, ele, mesmer, and engineers.

I agree 100% that condi intensity should be a bigger factor on cleanse priority. It may mean that burn stacks of 9 (or what ever threshold they set it to) will be cleansed first over the 13 other conditions a player may rather cleanse (can’t imagine why) but, it’s probably what’s needed. As it stands, it doesn’t make sense to cleanse a lucky proc of 1 Bleeds right after receiving a burst of 10 stacks of burns.

robertul.3679:

kdaddy.5431:

robertul.3679:

Burning should have never been made stackable in the first place.

why? It never made sense you can stack confusion/bleeds but not psn and burns. Also only 1 class is really crushing the burning and its d/d ele. Burn guardians have be shown over and over getting countered. Ive literally seen matches where necros run in the fire of guardians and send it back and the guardian cant do anything.

Plus burn guardians give something up to be burst condi, d/d eles do not which is why burns for them is op as oppose to burns themself being op.

Well it does make sense now doesn’t it?!

Just because necros can counter burn guards just a bit it doesn’t mean the mechanic isn’t broken. I mean really, you see the signet of plague and you know the necro has staff cuz everybody runs staff and you just yolo with the burns?

Do you think having a DoT thing that by definition is, you know, over time, ticks for 6k per second is fine? How is that normal? Don’t compare it to backstab cuz thieves can’t just backstab every other second.

tl;dr Condi guard isn’t overpowered by any means. This doesn’t mean burning shouldn’t be toned down/reverted to original form.

6k dmg per second is around 15 stacks of burns… that’s a l2p issue for people who consistently receive that much burn stack damages my goodness…

I would have to waste Purging Flames, Judge’s Intervention and Whirling Wrath all at once. If I deal 0 damage because of a single condi cleanse then i’m basically a sitting duck considering 2 of my utility skills are wasted.

We’re not Cele D/D Ele – We don’t get “soft countered” by just 1 class… we get “soft countered” by numerous classes actually.

Signet Necro,
Mesmers
Engi’s
Guardians (power/bunker) with Absolute Resolution
Elementalists

This is 1v1 AND Team Fights.
If we avoid getting hard cc’d and bursted down, we can out put 2x or 3x more damages than any one of these classes. But if they’re spread out (mid’s Legacy of the Foefire) then we will do significantly less damages… and have to rely on burn on block, purging flames, and judge’s intervention. All of which have incredibly high cds.

It’s very, very easy to out play a burn guardian who is 100% specialized in condi damages. Burn Guardians with Absolute Resolution are even easier to beat… mind their Zealot’s Flame, Judge’s Intervention, Purging Flames and you win.

League System Inquiries

Winning a match guarantees you a pip, and in some cases you won’t need to win

I don’t mind it being a grind fest between Division One and Division 4. Go ahead and implement this for players who can play 24/7. No issues with this at all, assuming this will stop abruptly pass Division 5.

The player base past Division 5 will virtually have the same win rate. If everyone has virtually the same chance of winning, then climbing the tier will be based on the rng Gods rather then the actual player.

If you constantly lost a match with an end score of 480 points, you should have a higher ranking score than players who consistently lose at 420 points.

If a player A wins more games than player B but Player A consistently loses with an end score of 250 over Player B who consistently loses with 350 points, Player B should be ranked higher than player A.

I would think this is how player’s points should be calculated – Winning shouldn’t matter as much as consistently finishing a game with a high point count. This is due in fact that a single player cannot carry a team. However, through statistics (numerous games played) it can show that if he’s on a team, he’s likely to increase that team’s points considerably vs another player.

I think the MMR algorithm needs to be reevaluated.

Pseudo Code Questions

Can “Rank Points Earned” be modified to the following?

It’s as simple as why the pseudo code tallies score points in 100 increments instead of 5 increments, considering almost every factor is in “5” and not “100”.
105, 110, 115 all the way to 495
instead of 100, 200, 300, 400, 500
If you have 1000 players each with an end team score of 400 points… they all shouldn’t get the same +3 rank point score. Should it not be in increments of 5 so they each have a more defining rank point score?

displacedTitan.6897:

ITT: People who have never played a MOBA long enough to realize that MMR systems are inherently “streaky”.

The matchmaker tries to force your overall win/loss to 50% over time. So in some games, yes, you have less than a 50% chance to win on purpose. HOWEVER, if you do win them then your MMR increases at a greater rate than it would for a 50+% chance to win match. This is how your MMR will increase over time until you hit a wall of skill and stay at 50%.

The real problem is that people blame “premades” and “unfair matches” rather than their own failures or misplays.

Just take a look at the person posting their stats on this thread, they have an 80% winrate in custom arenas, i.e. not matchmaking games that they clearly stack with friends against hotjoiners. This same person has less than 50% win in unranked/ranked, meaning that they think their losses are to “premades” but more likely the losses result from bad habits picked up playing EZ custom games.

This game’s skill level is not that of a moba, first person shooter or any other game where 1 person can literally carry the whole team to victory. It’s far from it.

A very skilled player might get his team to 250 points at best… Winning is so dependent on every single player that a Veteran can’t possibly carry the team. The best he can do is carry some weight from a single player who is lagging behind.

The only way 1 person can actually carry a team to 500 points is if he’s the only veteran player there, playing against 9 newbie players who just reached rank 10. I got this match up the other day… downing an entire team on burn guardian because they had 0 experience in that area.

This is why the MMR scoring is the way it is. A person who constantly loses with an end score of 300 points will have a lower MMR than a person who constantly loses at 400 points. Win % doesn’t matter as much as people think it does.

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

Needs more insta-casts.

That skill is from a class that is already hard to out play (nearly impossible to out smart). The only reason it’s not OP and hurting for a nerf (it’s 1v1 capabilities are insane) is because it 1) Stays off points alot and 2) Is more difficult to manage in skirmish fights.

We don’t need instant cast skills. We need more Skill Shot skills like Deflecting Shot

That’s too funny.

To the people who don’t get it, there’s no such thing (shouldn’t be) as a Meta2 tier class. The irony is, Cele D/D Ele performs so well in Conquest that it’s in another league of it’s own.

Two stacked Cele D/D Ele classes is a better comp than any two combinations of: Guard/Engi/Mes/Necro/War/Ranger/Thief

You can literally incorporate any other two classes + 2xCele D/D Ele + Thief and be competitive.

Harbinger.8637:

Evan Lesh.3295:

Matchmaking is always trying to make 50/50 matches. There is no active streak-prevention built into matchmaking other than the fact that your MMR adjusts each game. Since you’ve been playing so much, your MMR is ‘certain’ and changes slowly. It has certainly adjusted over the course of the weekend, though.

I suggest watching your game history via a site like http://gw2efficiency.com/account/pvp that uses our new PvP API. This way you know exactly what streaks you’re on.

Edit: Both your streaks were when you played Engineer, which has a lower profession MMR than your account and other professions. Looks like you win more often on Thief

That’s an interesting website, hopefully there’s a better supported and official one in the future. Anyways I decided to check it out and what I got was fairly typical. I guess it’s my fault for soloq 95% of the time. Sure some of the losses are close, so I guess the system is working as intended, however that doesn’t make it any less frustrating at times.

Monday I only lost two games. Yesterday was worse but not too bad. I mainly soloQ but win the majority of my games ^.^

Hexalot.8194:

Nike.2631:

Isarii.2804:

It’s baffling. Between Longbow and having to kite people into traps, it makes absolutely no sense that Dragonhunter doesn’t have access to a 25% movement speed increase.

It’s less baffling when you keep in mind all the cripple the DH is doing.
x1 speed vs x.5 beats x1.25 speed vs. x1.

Sorry but that explanation doesn’t hold water. Necros have plenty of access to BOTH chill and cripple yet Anet still gives them access to running speed both as a trait and utility skill. Lack of improved running speed or reliable swiftness in general is the number one reason I retired my Guardian. I guess I just got tired of being tethered to travellers runes just to improve my quality of life.

“I can’t catch anyone, give me more speed!”

“You will not be faster, everyone else will be 50% slower.” – Anet

I think it’s both hilarious and absolutely genius.

Agreed.
It needs MMR, Number of Points gained or lost and the odds of winning.

I assume future League won’t include the above but.. we just need this.

Pimsley.3681:

Found it, I took the screenie around the time F2P became available and lost 12-14 games in a row.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/High-MMR-is-punished-for-solo-que/

Haha, I remember that thread well – my below post

(….) I haven’t received an answer.

It’s as simple as why the pseudo code takes score points of 100 increments instead of 5 increments, considering almost every factor in the game is in “5” and not “100”.
105, 110, 115 all the way to 495
instead of 100, 200, 300, 400, 500

If you have 1000 players each with an end team score between 400 and 450 points… they all shouldn’t get the same +3 rank point score. Should it not be in increments of 5 so they each have a more defining rank point score?

I truly hope that the Pseudo code algorithm has changed instead of placing a beautiful GUI over an engine that never improved.

+1
[x] Team Deathmatch
[x] Conquest
[x] Stronghold

TDM can be a big hit if it was done right.

• Courtyard – same game mode that can be voted on.
• Courtyard – best out of 3 mini rounds – 5 minute time limit – lowest health loses
• 2v2 if duo queued – Implement rounds and a 5m time limit – lowest health loses

The way 2v2 can works is, matchmaking will take 10 players inside the queue as usual. If 2v2 game mode is voted/picked then it will split the 10 players into individual 2v2, 2v2, 2v2, on their own separate maps.
If Anet wants to take this a step further, it could be Red vs Blue vs Green (team vs team vs team) on the same map and they all have to stomp to get points.
/takemymoney

I also like to add that most people tend to blow their condi cleanses because they all of a sudden see 5 unique conditions on them.. when it’s nothing life threatening.

The conditions you need to prevent are the most damaging ones.
Purging Flames – Judge’s Intervention – Whirling Wrath – Zealot’s Fire
And/or Shelter Focus#5 burn on block effects.

Ignore any other F1 procs (assuming it’s a 1v1 and you’re not in a group where permeating wrath takes effect)

You should kill any guardian 1v1 (except me :>)
You should hard cc/cleanse/kite any burn gerd in team fights (except me :>)

Burn Guardians are incredibly susceptible to CC, other conditions and condi cleanses effects because we usually run Supreme Justice and Amplified Wrath.

We’re 100% damage dealing builds. Our builds are based on 1 Condition. The time we deal 3x more damage than power guard builds is if we hit multiple targets in a group.
We usually take advantage of Minions and people who Rez.

Don’t stand near your teamates.
Bring condi cleanses.
Bring CC.
Bring other conditions like immob/stun/knockback etc.

I meant that the Torch is a selfish weapon by definition. Anything that helps the Guardian via boons, blocks, negating damage, heals, etc – isn’t what the Torch is.

I agree that Torch#5 could do a better job of cleansing conditions. I have no idea how it cleanses actually…

A cleanse per pulse until 9 conditions total are cleansed?
Do all 3 allies get a condi cleanse per pulse?

It’s not specified but judging from personal experience, it’s the first one.

Just like the above. Map awareness and rotation can literally snowball the game for your team throughout the entire game, giving you the win. If the other points are taken, it can be difficult to push and capture those nodes.

For the record, it must have taken me until PvP level 30-40 to really understand not just basic map rotations but understanding class mechanics as well.

Just starting out, don’t enter Ranked PvP and face a team of Veteran Players. Start off in Hot Joins. Once that gets easy (easier) then do Unranked PvP. Once you get used to the competitive scene you can start doing Ranked PvP as well as dabble in Pug Quest Tournaments (newbie player safe!)

Roquen.5406:

Cyninja.2954:

Roquen.5406:

Friggarn.9451:

After all that time, you didn’t wiki search it and find that out? 400-500G is a lot to spend without researching the item first!

I looked at pictures and Youtube videos of the items being used and for whatever reason it didn’t register to check and see if it did work in sPvP. Seeing as it’s a vanity item I didn’t think they would stop you from using it.

No one buys it for the stats as you have to downgrade your gear to use it (can’t slot into ascended). It’s used for the unique color/glow it brings about.

Imagine if you could only use your legendary skin in PvE only, you wouldn’t be upset? There is no good reason why they can’t be used in sPvP. Thus, I am asking for it to be visible while pvping.

Actually there is.

Refractors make animations harder to read (especially the black one). This would give players with refractors an advantage, especially on asura where the animations are already hard to read.

I wouldn’t expect them to change this.

By your logic:

Legendaries should not be usable as their particle effects in some cases block the player’s view and cause an unfair advantage.
The wing backpieces should not be usable as they are very large and skew the player’s view.

I can’t think of an item that’s as ‘hard to read’ like the Refractor. In fact, no Legendary item makes animations hard to read…

Roquen.5406:

Players should all have to be the same style/race/gender as that would cause an unfair advantage.
Legendary armor should not be visible in spvp (assuming legendary armor will have shiny pieces to it).

Options menu > General Options > Standard Enemy Models > Enable
“Enemy players will appear as standard characters in the following formats:

• Custom Arena
• Ranked Arena

I realize I should have made more reserve slots for my burn guide. I had to cut a couple things out because of spacing. May remove the settler’s bunk section for the sake of priorities.

Added Rune of the Guardian in the Burn Guide.

I’ve never gave the amulet much of a test ride but I’ve been using it for a couple weeks and it’s been very effective thus far.

The build i’m currently using in TPvP.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQNAR7dlsAhmhY5QwbIwPEHBE1dbjgMwGAPwbmXwGcCB-TJhAwAW3fgzTAYcZAAXEAA

Happy BBQ!

Sorry for your misfortune but yea, a full premade group vs solos can happen from time to time. (assuming everyone on your team were solos)

I highly recommend playing in Hot Joins instead of Unranked PvP, for the time being.

Unranked PvP is not meant for players who are just starting out. Start playing in Hot Joins until you learn rotations, your build and more importantly, other player’s build.
Start Dueling to understand your class mechanic as well as others.

I also highly recommend finding a Mentor for your class. You can join almost any Dueling Server and ask around to see if people there can help you play better; proper conquest rotations, meta builds, etc. Most will be nice enough to show you the ropes!

Good Luck!

To add to that, we got a full roster of 64 players in the recent 1v1 Tournament. Thanks to Storms for hosting it, looking forward to the next one. Point being, I remember 1v1 tournaments were only a handful of 5-10 people. Wowzers

PvP scene has definitely grown.

Soryuju.8164:

How about for #5, we increase the base cooldown to 30-35 seconds, shorten the channel duration to 3 seconds while keeping the damage and number of hits the same, and have it grant 1 second of Resistance each second while you’re channeling it?

Reasoning: A single condition cleanse at the beginning or end of the channel still isn’t that appealing when you’re leaving yourself locked in a channel for 4.25 seconds, particularly when the effect of that channel only applies to a narrow cone in front of you and is a DPS loss compared to autoattacking with most 1h weapons. Resistance at least offers us protection aganst condition burst while channeling (which is important, since if you want to cleanse for allies using this skill, your team probably just got condi-bombed), and it negates movement-imparing conditions that would hinder us from getting in range of allies and enemies. It also gives burn builds a brief window for counterplay against condition transfers in PvP scenarios. The cooldown increase could be even higher if this is too much utility, and I honestly wouldn’t mind. Currently, the main uses for this skill are when there are downed allies/enemies nearby and when you’re chasing someone down. I use it maybe 1-2 times per match in PvP (if that) and in PvE/WvW, it’s even more situational, so you could put a 45-second cooldown on it and I’d still be using it more often than I do now.

1. Torch isn’t meant to be that type of selfish weapon.
2. Guardian’s are not hurting for additional condi defenses. We’re already getting another specialization tree that’s selfish in this way – Hunter’s Fortification (it needed it so bad, thx karl!)

If the Torch of all weapons is going to get a make over then I can think of a million other ways to alter GS/Focus/Scepter/Mace/Sword as well. Torch already got a buff through Radiant Fire.

Torch is fine, now turn your heads to Shield – the most underutilized weapon.

I like Courtyard. A lot actually. What we need is build templates for us to switch between TDM/Conquest/Stronghold

The map I absolutely cannot stand is Skyhammer… omg it’s beyond frustrating.

ronpierce.2760:

I found this post to be rather passive aggressive.

Avit.3165:

Killyox.3950:

Guard is still amazing.

Only until Revenants arrives, then i’m not so sure.

Still not sure how Rev will replace Guards.. or any class for that matter.

They basically got a 1/3rd of Wars, Necros, Guards and smashed them together. The Rev will not replace any of these classes (well, maybe war).

I’ll be impressed with the Rev when I start seeing Revs actually perform well. Didn’t see any last BWE. That said, the class improved a lot.

You’re talking about post validity.. it doesn’t work based on leaderboard positioning or X amount of games played.

This is one of those,
I don’t take vitamin/protein shake advice from a person who weighs 100lbs but has a Master’s degree in the area. So I rather take advice from a body builder.

Or taking financial advice from a person who’s read a billion financial books but only has 4k to his name, so I choose to take advice from a multi millionaire instead.

A smart person would listen to both… not pick one over the other because of “validity”.

Leaderboards is a terrible measurement tool for in-game knowledge… listen to a multiclass 24/7 duelist or that top player on the leaderboard who only plays 1 class on that 1 team? In truth, i’d listen to both players and make my own judgement for myself instead of shutting one of these players out due to “validity”.

About 23s on burn guard meta.

If it was 3 of these Golems together, I would have downed them in about 10 seconds.
If it was 5 of these Golems together, I would have downed them in about 7 seconds or less.

^That. oRNG wiped in mid but were able to pull themselves together for an unexpected lord rush.

cakeonroof.7385:

Lord needs a major buff. A 150pt reward shouldn’t take 5sec to kill.

Would you rather it take 30s to kill lord? If it takes any longer, there would be no point to go for lord…

I’ve seen the lord get defended by a 5v4. It’s easy to keep the lord up with the right players.

Dahkeus.8243:

I would honestly love to see a karma system that allows us to rate players, similar to what other games have done. Here’s how I imagine it:

At the end of a PvP match, you can right click a player’s name and give them a positive or negative rating. Once a player has been rated enough times for their rating to really matter, they can then be given a publicly viewable rating that averages their score against other players.

Then, hopefully, that score can also be used in matchmaking.

Terrible idea. There are so many trolls in the game, they’ll just give bad karma to everyone. Even towards people with annoying builds. Good karma simply wouldn’t be passed out.. at all.. because people would forget to do so.

My gf works at a call center. She gets credit on her work via serveys. Sometimes people’s own mistakes and self frustrations will give her the worse rating ever but her peers review the recorded line and knows that she did and said everything correctly to the customer. So the company wave that bad servey on her record.

tl;dr
We already have the Report system for something like this. A Karma system would do absolutely nothing. If it’s used in matchmaking… .. you just broke gw2.

zinkz.7045:

(…) growth in itself doesn’t mean much without context, people are complaining about the playerbase in relation to matchmaking, so lets say PvP has grown on average 3% a month, the question is how many of those players are playing hotjoin / rank farm servers, and how many are playing ranked/unranked, it could be that the “queued” PvP is shrinking, but overall PvP has grown because of hotjoin, we don’t know from the answer given.

And the second part about the influx of new F2P players in the last three weeks is not relevant at all, whether the systems effect on the playerbase has been, good, bad or indifferent, those new players were not subject to that and are here because of F2P nothing else.

I would think that PvP Growth is in the context of X amount of players playing PvP on a given day/weekend. It’s irrelevant who or where these players came from because PvP is getting utilized.

I don’t know whether or not this is right or wrong… I just think the specifics as where this population is coming from doesn’t matter. If PvP is getting more players, a few are bound to stick around. Maybe even form a team and play more competitively. Who’s to say they wouldn’t?

ellesee.8297:

morrolan.9608:

But this is elitist nonsense, the game needs to attract a healthy population then guide them into becoming worthwhile contributors, can’t do it without a healthy pop though. The issue is the population not being big enough for the ranking system to work properly so that high ranking players regularly get matched with each other and not against low ranking players.

Attracting PvE players who will never ever ever take PvP seriously isn’t elitist nonsense. I’ve seen people post on these forums who say that they hate PvP and only play it for the reward tracks, AP, and titles. These kinds of people do not contribute to a “healthy pop”. These kinds of people AFK games.

Who are you to say that a PvE player can’t turn into a competitive PvPer? For the record, the people who AFK games are Elitests who disagrees with his team comp, or his team open strategy within the first 20 seconds of the game… so he afks. Newer players will continue to roam and capture nodes regardless if the score is 50 – 200.

ellesee.8297:

…. this “F2P” mode which is really just pay2win.

A potential competitive PvP player sees GW2 as F2P so he installs the game, sees that a large chunk of builds costs $50 to unlock, and the only game mode he can play is conquest. If that were me, I’d pretty much uninstall immediately.

wut…?

Perfect World, Archeage, Lineage II, are examples of pay to win video games.
Planet Side 2 is considered more of a P2W game than GW2.

A trial, reduced version of a full game where players have to buy the game to receive full content, is not a Pay to Win game.

zinkz.7045:

Saiyan.1704:

Thx for the post Colin! So many people are statistically misinformed on so many levels.

Erm he told us nothing of any real meaning in relation to the point he responded to.

I don’t know, below sounds like a near direct answer to the post he was responding too.

ColinJohanson.2394:

TorsoReaper.8530:

The current system is making the player base smaller by the minute.

Nope.

WuGzaGenius.5684:

Saiyan.1704:

WuGzaGenius.5684:

cakeonroof.7385:

Yeah a dueling area sounds good so I can gank abc

what? do you understand the concept of dueling?

He has a point though. If small dueling area was implemented in hotm then we’d have trolls entering and ganking people, just like dueling servers.

It needs to be exclusive for just the two people dueling.

Add a “Right Click – Duel” addition to people’s name icons so the two people can duel each other exclusively.

Isn’t that implied when someone says “dueling” it means between two parties “1v1”

Trolls don’t care.. they’ll gank regardless of what anyone says…

Thx for the post Colin! So many people are statistically misinformed on so many levels.

Nebilim.5127:

Lord Kuru.3685:

zinkz.7045:

Also where are these players going, after all matchmaking is not going to be helped by PvE players basically playing PvE in the 9 rankfarms that occupy the top 9 spots in the hotjoin server list (EU) as I write this, do these players count as part of “PvP playerbase”?

This. Remember when they counted the PvE famers in EotM as part of WvW? From past history, they’re doing the same here.

This is the exact same thing i was thinking too. Is Colin referring to PvP in general? Do the people that just go there to farm chests/dailies, counts?

Does it even matter? It’s irrelevant if it’s they’re counting PvE players doing AP farming.

The PvP population is growing and has been since the beginning of the year and it’s definitely a mix of current PvE players and new players trying PvP.

Jiggawattz.2697:

official.7362:

Ok so i can stress how important these will be to a healthy pvp base

Id just like to know EXACTLY how you plan on handling this system..

if you make it a grind (it will fail to do what its trying to accomplish) ie pair like skilled players together.

so how exactly do you plan on separating these different skilled player bases together

what is the algorithm? and how will you handle soloq/team q

Imho you either have to go ALL IN on either Soloq or Teamq u cant have them separated because lets face it there arent enough players to have both in this game and its fair or fun to either player base to have to fight each other

u have to take a stand once and for all Either PROMOTE teams ONLY to play pvp or Dont at all imo

ill go ahead and guess ur ganna save all the juicy info until after you sell copies of the game so u dont kitten people off who wouldnt buy the game if they knew soloq was dead or not

By the way, you are assuming the recent long queue times are because of a “LACK” of population but I think you are misunderstanding. Currently in the pvp zones there are multiple megaservers packed with people all complaining about queue times. Why would this be the case if it was low population. The current reason the queues are slow is because of OVER population. The growth from free to play and the added popularity of pvp has caused the pvp servers to have to struggle to keep up. They have already said they are working on it.

1+
This is backed by the Stronghold weekends where players were seeing incredibly long queue times.

WuGzaGenius.5684:

cakeonroof.7385:

Yeah a dueling area sounds good so I can gank abc

what? do you understand the concept of dueling?

He has a point though. If small dueling area was implemeted in hotm then we’d have trolls entering and ganking people, just like dueling servers.

It needs to be exclusive for just the two people dueling.

Add a “Right Click – Duel” addition to people’s name icons so the two people can duel each other exclusively.

As much as 1v1 may be unbalanced.. I still wish this game got a 1v1, 2v2 or 3v3 small scale combat system. Leagues/Leaderboards would be a huge plus. Hopefully Guild Halls can implement a system like this

I like to complement Storms for hosting this 1v1 tournament. Given the certain unexpected situations, I think he did an excellent job.

Dustin.2793:

Guild Wars 2 isn’t balanced around 1v1, 2v2, or 3v3. It’s built around conquest. So ten times out of ten, custom tournaments aren’t very enjoyable. It leads to certain classes being way overpowered, especially when you ban certain traitlines, amulets or single traits (which obviously you have to do because of how OP certain things are in small scale fights). The 2v2’s for example, you can kite endlessly on courtyard, running 2 support builds. Really how long can people live if they truly want to stall? Unless you sit down and study to create the perfect formula on what to ban, it leads to people finding loopholes or trying to bend the rules. Which then leads to salt, or people trying to out-aids each other. For example, kiting around for 5 minutes, perma stealthing or running close to unkillable builds(even when its restricted to marauder/zerker amulet. Kudos for the effort to these tournaments though.

Short fights like 1v1 and 2v2 can work if it was moderated correctly. There’s nothing wrong with banning certain traits, amulets, and tree lines (sustain trees isn’t needed).

Other games have time limits and rounds implemented, and maps/gamemodes that specifies small scale combat. Small scale combat can work in gw2, we just got to moderate it a little better.

It was a HUGE mistake letting Bear moderate… let alone allow him in the tournament.

The player is just incredibly rude. He offered absolutely nothing in his “comentating” other than “I’m lagging” “That’s Aids” “Are we allowed to sub in? Let me sub in”.

Sisyphus.4237:

HISAKO IS CJ A 14 YO BLACK PIMP NUFF SAID

Yea I like the dude he’s pretty cool. I’ve gamed with him a few times in tpvp with his Mesmer. I had no idea he was good on Ranger too so that was a surprise.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Personal score does not factor into Leagues at all, only team score.

Then what’s the point of personal score… a score that 70% of players tend to go by and it’s not politically correct at all.

Heart of the Mists doesn’t need to be a city…. It’s meant to be a place to train and gain knowledge in regards to PvP. It does a poor job of it imo. My GF (mmo illiterate gf) couldn’t follow the beginning tutorial without me helping her through. It needs to be brain dead simplier, add arrows pointing where to go!

What HOTM Needs
I would like three (or more) small dueling circles where people can enter and duel inside. It can be 800 radius, just big enough to fit two people but the moment you leave the circle, the person goes Green and you can’t target him.

Players can test out a trait, skill or utility with a friend without needing to enter a dueling server to do so. Players can then enter hot joins or dueling servers to try dueling for real.

We need this!

Hm, that’s true. You’re already getting that bonus from the node you capture. That is, if you capture it because killing 1 person doesn’t necessarily mean you’re guaranteed the node.

I suppose if you kill a person off point, it’s considered “on the way” to the node..? It causes the other team to be out rotated because you killed a player.

I would rather have a, if you get hit behind you while “off point” but you kill that attacker, then you receive a higher bonus. Because this would mean that you were on your way some where only to get ganked from behind but you managed to win the gank off point. That would make more sense than “Skirmish +15”

style.6173:

Grimfalcon.3847:

What I don’t understand is why d/d is getting a lot of hate again. I recently started playing this again after being gone for a year+ Has something changed to the d/d kit that makes it overwhelming? Or is it just celestial Amy that gives them the needed hp and healing power to live?

Three reasons…

1. Best at burn stacking which is also really OP right now.
2. Best at condi removal
3. Amazing at self healing

It is by far the strongest spec in the entire game right now.

Definitely the strongest spec in Conquest. The class simply has every needed Conquest aspect.

Your “keeping a node contested” classes and roamers are covered with just 2 Celestial D/D Ele’s and a Thief. Everything else can basically be damage + support fillers to complement said classes.

Grimfalcon.3847:

What I don’t understand is why d/d is getting a lot of hate again. I recently started playing this again after being gone for a year+ Has something changed to the d/d kit that makes it overwhelming? Or is it just celestial Amy that gives them the needed hp and healing power to live?

War, Engi and Ele were strong with Celestial amulet thanks to that April patch last year. We recently received a patch in June that kinda removed that Cele power on War and Engi, but Ele still remains very strong. So you now have 1 strong class instead of three. People are realizing the apparent unbalances.

Supreme.3164:

When somebody praise the spec of another profession he doesn’t personally play..it usually means that this spec is very easy to kill..would this spec be competitive… they’d call it OP..

I don’t mean to sound rude but that sounds like a contradiction…

If somebody praises a spec they don’t normally play, then it’s because the spec is not easily killed.
This is in the competitive scene.

Everyone shares the same experience.
Everyone that does not main the spec, share this experience.
People who main the spec, say the same thing.
.
Non competitive… well.. everyone thinks everything’s op so it doesn’t matter.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Most damage is backwards. It just means you suck at killing.

Best results are Kills to damage ratio. High kill count, low damage score

High damages does not mean the player sucks at killing… What are you implying? That the player cleaves instead of stomps? Both are equally viable depending on situation.

High kill count + low damage score = a zerker/marauder Thief who +1 nodes… .. your score card doesn’t aplly to necro, war, guardian and ranger…

Almost all condi classes will apply higher damages than zerks or cele builds. That doesn’t mean the’ve got most downds.
Condi Guard can get 900,000 dmges. Doesn’t mean he’s mvp. Far from it…

Herm… the only build that enables a Guardian to have his team kill a player, is a bunker Guard. This is because Bunker/Shout Guardians applies cleanse, support, stability and quickness to allies so his allies can make it happen.

All honestly, Dragonhunter will be this “CC guardian” you’re looking for. Considering F1 will apply cripple now, DH will apply this CC effect, that’s on par with Necro’s Chill, that you’re looking for.

Other than that, you have Hammer #5, Scepter #3, Shield #5, and Spirit Hammer utility.
It’s not exactly effective in this current meta but knock yourself out!

official.7362:

So im curious because it seems as though in the expansion win or lose your personal skill will be taking into consideration either through most dmg most healing most decap/caps ex.

But it seems very evident to me that the true skillful players will be the ones who are able to hold 1v2s or setup +1s while your team wins the other points with ease. But when you take the stats/points at the end of the game you most likely will have the least of everyone even though your doing the most for your team in the big picture of things.

im worried anet wont give these players their due/praise in leagues and the system your going to use when finding out who is doing the most for their team.

Can i get a word from anet on how you will be acknowledging these players

It’s hard to awknowledge these players because it’s hard to determine exactly what an effect a 1v2 can offer.

• A person 1v2 players for 15 seconds or more on a contested node (or yours) while your entire team is battling elsewhere can and will help your team out very, very well.

• A person 1v2 players for 10 seconds or less on a node that isn’t yours (or contested) while your team is out rotated (1 member just respawned, 3 other team members on the node are at half health and handicapped) can and will hurt your team very, very badly.

If no one here in the PvP community have a solution (we throw out ideas all the time) then Anet probably doesn’t either….