Guild Wars 2

Zeghart.9841:

mistsim.2748:

the big difference being it’s not plagued by MMO problems and amateur devs.

Oh poor, innocent soul. If you knew Blizzard you’d know how absolutely garbage they are at balancing. Not a single one of their games is saved.

Overwatch is a solid game, but they’ve already shown during alpha and beta that they barely have any clue on how to properly balance out the relative small pool they have at the moment. I honestly lost count of the 180s they did. I expect kitten to really hit the fan as they introduce more characters.
If you’re really looking for a pvp game not plagued by problems and with great devs, you’re looking at Counterstrike or Dota.

Still, apples and oranges.
You couldn’t pick two more different games to compare if you tried.

Atleast blizzard has content tho.

Entangle with sunless rune + spike trap.

or vice versa

of course you have sharpened edges traited. (might be more than 20)

2 Buttons.

Eurantien.4632:

So Signet of the Wild heals you and your pet as long as each is not at full health. However, dolyak signet can proc the heal minor trait in Druid every second as well. If signet of the wild does this too then SotW is slightly better, but dolyak, regen, and natural regen from BM are enough to always have astral force ready in order to go into celestial form off of cool down. Which is why every ranger in pro league at the moment runs them.

Which minor trait?

denis.9487:

StickerHappy.8052:

denis.9487:

You understand those conditions are only applied when you get hit with shatters. You can kill clones dodge pop your own evades. That trait lets Mesmer have more clones in order not to be tied to the dueling line.

Killing clones is not even an option anymore. SoI SoI cough cough*

Even if it was, this is a very hard thing to do in a real match. Very hard..

If this isnt a viable plan then why remove the on death traits?? I mean sure actually targeting a clone might be annoying but plenty of aoe and cleave. And really saying sol has any bearing is grasping at straws. Sure the clones went from 1 ply tissue to 2 ply.

Uhmm because we can trigger on death traits even if they don’t kill our clones?

SoI and Mercernary amy?

Anyway, 1v1 this could be a feasible counter to mesmer, teamfight? Hard.

Burtnik.5218:

Booms.3952:

Burtnik.5218:

Pyriall.1683:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Archon.6480:

Ellie.5913:

Rev doesn’t seem very powerful at all to me, I’ve been soloing then with my warrior using nothing but a long bow.

Ha, ha! I think that’s the point. They fall pretty fast to Sw/T – A/D, but they deserve it for having such broken OP abilities. I can’t begin to tell you how frustrating it is to be pulled out of your well timed evasive skill by some noob who pressed 5 on rev staff at the wrong time. How is it skill when you can’t evade?

Evade into the rev or to the side, not backwards. This is not a hard attack to dodge once you see it coming, and revs often make it VERY obvious.

ESL…top tier players getting burst down by Surge every single match.

ESL doesnt mean a kitten. Most of these guys there are terrible and i have no issue to wrecking them 1v1 (which i did many times during ranked). Just bc they play in esl doesnt mean they are any good. Anyone can form a team and play in esl really.
Basing balance around few players in “top” is just wrong.

classic bad player who thinks he’s good cuz he has a 1v1 based build

I believe you forgot to “dc” during a match, i mean ragequit. Try, it help sometimes! I wont say who is the “bad classic player” here or more like ragequitter/afker/flamer in this case

Pyriall.1683:

Burtnik.5218:

Pyriall.1683:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Archon.6480:

Ellie.5913:

Rev doesn’t seem very powerful at all to me, I’ve been soloing then with my warrior using nothing but a long bow.

Ha, ha! I think that’s the point. They fall pretty fast to Sw/T – A/D, but they deserve it for having such broken OP abilities. I can’t begin to tell you how frustrating it is to be pulled out of your well timed evasive skill by some noob who pressed 5 on rev staff at the wrong time. How is it skill when you can’t evade?

Evade into the rev or to the side, not backwards. This is not a hard attack to dodge once you see it coming, and revs often make it VERY obvious.

ESL…top tier players getting burst down by Surge every single match.

ESL doesnt mean a kitten. Most of these guys there are terrible and i have no issue to wrecking them 1v1 (which i did many times during ranked). Just bc they play in esl doesnt mean they are any good. Anyone can form a team and play in esl really.
Basing balance around few players in “top” is just wrong.

So, let me know of what your team is when you compete during the next season. This way I can cheer you on as you win the tournament.

That all being said, your next statement doesn’t make any sense. If they were so bad, then we wouldn’t be balancing around the top tier players.

Im not interested in this circus on wheels. Also its not like im not focusing on an actual esport game. Revenant takes close to 0 skill in current state For example quickness always came with a negative effect (and the utility had long cd) like taking extra damage, losing endurance – nowdays quickness is spamable with 0 drawbacks not to mention tons of passives.
Btw. this game is not balanced around top in case you didnt know. For example look at recent dh nerfs (wvw) or why they buffed thief autoattack to ridiculous levels (pve).

You cant have pros when the game is braindead button smashing. Invidual skill doesnt matter much anymore.

Corrected it for you.

Btw, game is balanced through top tier 5v5 conquest. You saying its not lost all your credibility on this thread. Sorry.

PS: Thief needed the buff OR it was rather revs needed a shave, the reason why you don’t see thieves or warriors because revs somewhat do their jobs better (cept for thief mobility to an extent)

Thanks guys, so do they grant you the same amount of astral force? (assuming 0 healing power)

mistsim.2748:

so ive been “testing” LOYF these days. just now i noticed a neat 25 stacks of might as i was stomping a dude after a close fight. wtf? i guess i had MDG on by accident.

using a pretty evasive build with high vigor uptime i guess i took for granted how long i was staying alive below 50% hp. MDG builds up really quick and synergizes with TU, as it doesnt heal you to full instantly. so i look at the 20 stacks of bleeds i have on the guy and theyre ticking for 3.7k >.<

for extra lols, downstate bleed procs with 25 stacks of might arent too shabby either.

#mdgnewmeta

Post us a build, I’m curious.

I for one believe the MDG needs a high Vit build to work so you have more room to work with regarding the threshold.

Sartharina.3542:

UnitedChaos.8364:

Sartharina.3542:

UnitedChaos.8364:

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

UnitedChaos.8364:

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

if the reformed hidden barbs and Choking gas sounds like a very nice Addition but its simply a way to get a AoE poison effect and it Sacrifices the trappers expertise (which vipers nest causes a lot of Aoe poison anyway)

…

we kind of need more in depth traits not more Combo/complex traits which are required for other traits to even be viable just like our current steady focus.

Umm.. Thanks?

Steady focus requires near perma Vigour upkeep and evades so the enduance bar can be topped up its very Restrictive to many weapon sets and trait lines.

Seeking Arrows : 8seconds of unblockable attack is overkill most of the rangers burst damage comes from high spike or Rapid Multipul hits of which we can do both in a reasonable time , could you imagin a RF+Seeking Arrows chained after with unblockable pbs > pet f2 leap and then ancient seeds .

this trait would be the unwanted toppings that we simply don’t need .

I, for one, only use Steady focus when standing at range with my bow. Which means I always have 100% endurance and it guarantees a permanent +10% damage. Where as my suggestion was you only gain +5% damage and your attacks are unblockable when and only when an attack is blocked. So, there is a gate on this trait that an attack has to be blocked before you gain any benefit from this trait. Yes, an unblockable rapid fire sounds powerful, but it’s only negating blocks, not reflects, dodges, los, etc.

In general, for most of these traits, I feel that a “+5% damage and your attacks are unblockable” is more flavourful trait than a permanent “+10% damage.” If you’re playing WvW, for example, and you like standing on walls sniping players, if you’re not running a permanent +10% damage, you’re essentially limiting your dps. Whereas a trait that allows use outside of rangers standing at max distance pew pewing, is more useful.

Not “More flavorful”… it’s “Ludicrously overpowered”. As pointed out above, it turns defensive options such as Warrior Shield and Guardian Shelter into “murder me while I’m helpless”. Now, “Next Attack is unblockable” could be useful, but 8 seconds of shredding through defenses (On an ICD only slightly longer than those defenses it shreds) is obscene.

Signet of might and “Nothing can save you” I guess if other classes have it, rangers shouldn’t be allowed something equally as powerful…on a longer cd…

And require a utility slot (Of which you only have 3 at any time, instead of the 9 major traits you have), active activation (instead of reactive activation), shorter durations, and, in the case of the Warrior, an obvious tell, and in the necromancer, a cast time.

Exactly the point of the changes Chi made.

Almost all of the unblockable stuff in the game needs you to build around them, (necro+staff+trait marks, warrior+signet+Trait)

With the absurd amount of blocks we have in the game,, we need more counterplay to them.

Meta rev has 2-3 blocks already. Mesmer has 2. Not counting aegis. So the best class for this job is necro just because coincidentally their staff is meta, what if its not?

As a ranger the only counterplay you have is traps, which they NEED to sit through. And we all know that ranger traps fail in comparison with DH. There is also too much projectile hate in the game, don’t you guys want ranger to have more diversity other than staff?

denis.9487:

You understand those conditions are only applied when you get hit with shatters. You can kill clones dodge pop your own evades. That trait lets Mesmer have more clones in order not to be tied to the dueling line.

Killing clones is not even an option anymore. SoI SoI cough cough*

Even if it was, this is a very hard thing to do in a real match. Very hard..

Saturn.6591:

Not gonna bother responding to the actual topic (cause I think I already did and it won’t make a difference anyway… OP will happily ignore all the facts and claim to be omniscient and infallible/inerrant despite being proven wrong again and again).

But I really wanna ask who this Frostball person is, since everyone here seems to know… and I’ve never (at least not that I would remember) heard or read that name before it appeared in this thread, lol.

Frostball is quite possibly the best mesmer/proleague in the game right now. I mentioned proleague because there are monster mesmers in WvW as well (Kyra)

Kinda embarrassing that Frostball is the one explaining.
I bet half of the people here do not even know who he is. :/

Does the #6 effect build up Astral Force Reliably like SotW?

If yes, then I think its a very good alternative in freeing up a utility slot

Yes the vine surge speed is super slow, but increasing the velocity would only improve it a little bit imo. The problem here is that it such a one dimensional attack that strafing will let you evade the entire thing.

I think the better suggestion is reduce the range and widen the radius to an arc, kinda like poison volley or ricochet. This will make its AoE portion more useful than a line.

I would even add a little condition on it like poison or torment or bleed.

AtomsOrSystems.9420:

StickerHappy.8052:

AtomsOrSystems.9420:

StickerHappy.8052:

Hate to burst the bubble but Azukas is mostly on point with his stuff.

I kind of feel like I need to deny this just on principle. For a more nuanced take on what Azukas is really, really not on point, the replies in this thread (and others) do a better job than I could in this post.

StickerHappy.8052:

Mesmers are the best 1v1 class in the game atm. This is coming from me who dueled countless mesmers, mesmer is my hardest matchup even on my ranger. Mesmers are not mainly gotten for Moa and port, its part of it but 1v1 ability is more of the deal breaker here.

Bull. But I do think you’ve hit on an important, maybe the important, point here. Mesmers are good at 1v1. They always have been; they were designed to be. We have an entire traitline called “Dueling,” for chrissake. People don’t like losing 1v1s; so when they do, they rage, they call the class that beat them OP. It’s happened to warriors. It’s happened to thieves. And it’s happened, over and over again, to Mesmers.

However, sPvP (and WvW, for that matter) isn’t based around 1v1 duels. You can sit on home or far the whole match, win every 1v1, and still lose the match because you can’t/don’t contribute jack to the teamfight. Team contribution is wildly more important; Mesmers aren’t bought because they can win 1v1, they’re brought because they can portal their team, and they can unbalance teamfights with Moa.

Saying Mesmer is OP because it can win 1v1s is like the people who said Mesmer was OP because they couldn’t kill it in WvW roaming; it betrays a frightening lack of knowledge of what wins (or loses) the game overall.

1v1s happen alllll the time in a competitive match.

Moa Port? yes these two are factors, but what about the metas that we didnt have mesmers?

Moa and Port existed since the launch of the game.

If you read what I wrote, I said they are also picked for Moa and Portal.

For the record when did say mesmer is OP?

1v1s happen all the time, but they also don’t decide the match. Moa has been substantially strengthened by the addition of CS; whether it’s OP (or it’s not), that increased use of it has correspondingly increased all the whining on the forums about it. Before, it was just a huge-CD elite that people took because they preferred it to MI, and what the hell else were they going to take?

And yes, portal has always been in the game. And it’s always been the one skill that gave Mesmers any use in PvP, even when everything else about the profession stunk to high heaven. Then, as now, mesmers were on teams almost entirely for portal; now, we just have a build beyond that one skill that doesn’t feel like banging our heads against concrete.

My apologies if you didn’t mean to say mesmers were OP; I thought that was pretty well implied by your agreement with Azukas.

Do you remember the mantra mesmer meta? only a few mesmers ran portal and moa.

No apologies needed, I just agreed with some his points, and I do not know if he is in fact saying mesmers are OP.

But in the pro league scene stuff he is right.

mistsim.2748:

StickerHappy.8052:

mistsim.2748:

you wont be able to land concussive shot reliably in a team fight without piercing arrows. not when there are 4-7 character models in a small area (counting mesmer clones, pets, and such). but i wouldnt pick LOYF just for this reason though. it just has too many other good perks imo.

What perks? Imo the other effects are mediocre at best for a GM trait.

read.

whether or not it’s GM-worthy is debatable.

That was a rhetorical question.

10% damage and 10% condi duration for 4 seconds? this is hardly a GM worthy trait. and you need to burn a dodge for it?

If this procced on evade I would agree with you. but this is such a terrible trait apart from the SB cds and pierce.

Cataca.3867:

StickerHappy.8052:

snip

Yes, mesmers are good 1vs1, but the issue here is that they are good because people are completely unwilling to learn what makes a mesmer good in those situations, and how to prevent it.

People spam buttons. Most of the players i face, thought it is an awesome idea to simply spam more buttons when the insanely obvious block bubble pops up. Do you know why its most likely the most obvious skill in the game? Because that skill is the linchpin of most of the mesmers damage and sustain. Its two phantoms, that turn into 1×2 clones to shatter and 1×3 clones for a second shatter.

Thats heals, condi clears damage and mitigation. If you have an unblockable skill on your class and some interrupt you can completely rip the mesmers damage and sustain apart. If you just dont attack the bubble, you still make the mesmer weapon switch at least and force him to have a much higher ramp up time.

Do people do that? No.

When i play my warrior and face mesmers though, i eat them. Why? Because i know how their skills work, and i dont roll my face on the keyboard to win fights.

I mained mesmer, played 2500 games with it, 2500 games with my ranger. I dueled most mesmers (a LOT of times) you know and I can tell you this is a very hard matchup. Yes some people need to l2p against mesmers, but again this is easily a very hard matchup nowadays. Before It was okay, now its a different story.

mistsim.2748:

you wont be able to land concussive shot reliably in a team fight without piercing arrows. not when there are 4-7 character models in a small area (counting mesmer clones, pets, and such). but i wouldnt pick LOYF just for this reason though. it just has too many other good perks imo.

What perks? Imo the other effects are mediocre at best for a GM trait.

AtomsOrSystems.9420:

StickerHappy.8052:

Hate to burst the bubble but Azukas is mostly on point with his stuff.

I kind of feel like I need to deny this just on principle. For a more nuanced take on what Azukas is really, really not on point, the replies in this thread (and others) do a better job than I could in this post.

StickerHappy.8052:

Mesmers are the best 1v1 class in the game atm. This is coming from me who dueled countless mesmers, mesmer is my hardest matchup even on my ranger. Mesmers are not mainly gotten for Moa and port, its part of it but 1v1 ability is more of the deal breaker here.

Bull. But I do think you’ve hit on an important, maybe the important, point here. Mesmers are good at 1v1. They always have been; they were designed to be. We have an entire traitline called “Dueling,” for chrissake. People don’t like losing 1v1s; so when they do, they rage, they call the class that beat them OP. It’s happened to warriors. It’s happened to thieves. And it’s happened, over and over again, to Mesmers.

However, sPvP (and WvW, for that matter) isn’t based around 1v1 duels. You can sit on home or far the whole match, win every 1v1, and still lose the match because you can’t/don’t contribute jack to the teamfight. Team contribution is wildly more important; Mesmers aren’t bought because they can win 1v1, they’re brought because they can portal their team, and they can unbalance teamfights with Moa.

Saying Mesmer is OP because it can win 1v1s is like the people who said Mesmer was OP because they couldn’t kill it in WvW roaming; it betrays a frightening lack of knowledge of what wins (or loses) the game overall.

1v1s happen alllll the time in a competitive match.

Moa Port? yes these two are factors, but what about the metas that we didnt have mesmers?

Moa and Port existed since the launch of the game.

If you read what I wrote, I said they are also picked for Moa and Portal.

For the record when did say mesmer is OP?

mistsim.2748:

StickerHappy.8052:

I did multiple testing on LOYF, Quickdraw is a much superior trait hands down.

if youre using the SB as your main weapon, then it really isnt. it might be better if you go staff/SB or something to that effect. LOYF is superior for SB using for the reasons in its description: flat CD reduction on ALL abilities (not just the one you immediately use upon switching), piercing allows concussive shot to land every time in team fights (this is huge), and the small perk of the extra condi damage.

Quickdraw is better if youre using axe or torch in your build, to repeat the nukes back to back. if youre relying on SB, LOYF is the better choice hands down. if a/d s/t builds were still a thing (which they are not, not by a long shot since cele and settler were removed), Quickdraw would be the better choice. with the removal of cele and settler, it was a nail in the coffin for the niche condi bunker ranger builds, which werent even that good.

Piercing is super situational tho for a CC like concussion shot, the target must be in a line for it to be effective.

also that 900 range…

nish.2360:

mistsim.2748:

nish.2360:

mistsim.2748:

themillwater.5846:

mistsim.2748:

try this

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQJAVWn0rCFsiVsCOsAUtgFDBjJAM6KdwZ1waa1519CmdlMtDA-TZRAQB7rMAAOCAMc/hOcBAowjAAA

Thank you very much, I will most definitely be giving this a shot.

alternatively, if u wanna go core ranger, and have unlimited condi cleansing in current meta:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQNAV8YjEqQLLWyCmrAVLGcEK/z71RnDgJvy7vNW7gSUZaA-TZxBwAXuIAfLDcb/BHPAAAHBAA

ive had better results with this. still trying to decide SoS vs. QZ. it’s really tanky and the CC + poison/bleed pressure eats druids for breakfast. for some reason, this build also crushes power revs and does fine against necros too.

you can also forego NM tree and go druid instead, without staff.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQNAV8YjEqQLLWyCmrAVLWcEMmAwkry18tiVdA4k6UNrWiKTD-TZxBwA32fwxDA4yFB4bZAAHBAA

celestial is up often, and ancient seeds are constantly proccing. has a bit less survivability due to no Protective Ward and the extra vigor.

correct me if im wrong, but im finding glyphs to be ineffective currently, due to the delay in the condi cleanse. condi pressure is insane now.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQNAV8fjEqQLL2wCmrAVLWcEsmv1FoDwEAmcVO4k6UNrWi0rA-TpRAQBW4BA8hDCQELDAgLAAIOCA9Y/BA

This is a modification to an older build i used to run.

I love using druid and Ancient seeds, with Concussive shot and Spike Trap, the synergy on that feels really good.

I had to go with Signet of Stone, there’s too much bursty damage out there to not have this, especially when using Toll Unguent (in my opinion).

Overall, pretty good condi cleansing, between celestial form and survival skills (running 3 total).

Wolf for a little aoe fear, smokescale for some damage and blind.

I also went with Mercenary’s Amulet, a little more defensive than rabid, and the crit on Rabid is not as necessary when not using Sharpened Edges.

Other than that, I could use some help on runes for the shortbow. No crit means Sigil of Air/Fire are not worth (?).

Let me know what you guys think, thanks!

oooh i love this. i debated running torch instead of dagger. will give it a shot.

ive had some probs with the skirm/wilderness/druid spec due to lack of protection from Protective Ward. makes things hella hard at times.

I guess Signet of Stone is my replacement for Protective Ward. Protective Ward does have a 15sec ICD, so I don’t think its that great. I guess technically you could drop Skirmishing for NM, but Light on your Feet is too useful for me, not to mention trap CDR.

But yeah, torch is definitely the way to go. Spike trap > Ancient Seed proc, bonfire, root them in fire. Plus Hydromancy on swap to chill just in case. I think it’s a good combo.

But this kinda build is risky imo, gotta evade well to not die fast lol. But at least if you’re getting overwhelmed, signet of stone, and git the fudge out.

I did multiple testing on LOYF, Quickdraw is a much superior trait hands down.

AtomsOrSystems.9420:

Azukas.1426:

Condi mesmer has always been OP. You just weren’t tournament viable with the build. Now anet has made it viable competitively.

I don’t know anything about your history with the game or this profession, aside from what I’ve seen in this thread and the PvP sub. But wow, does this statement smack of “hasn’t been playing Mesmer for long.”

Anyone who thinks Condi Mes was always OP is… well, it betrays a lack of knowledge, both with how to play mesmer and how to play against mesmer. Frankly, I’ve found most people who’ve felt that way in the past were thieves, who didn’t avoid confusion application, didn’t cleanse, and then pressed all of the buttons before raging as they died.

Condi mesmer is strong yea, but you gotta remember we didn’t have mercenary amulet before, now condi mesmer can also do direct damage while getting the survivability of a rabid amulet.

We also didn’t have the changes before, MtD, chrono, etc

Hate to burst the bubble but Azukas is mostly on point with his stuff.

Mesmers are the best 1v1 class in the game atm. This is coming from me who dueled countless mesmers, mesmer is my hardest matchup even on my ranger. Mesmers are not mainly gotten for Moa and port, its part of it but 1v1 ability is more of the deal breaker here.

Moa is not the problem.

Signet of Illusions and somewhat CS are.

Signet of illusions boosts the mesmer survivability and damage by a lot.

Wondrouswall.7169:

I dislike RNG traits. Why not follow a more active approach from Robert Gee’s line of thinking so there’s some predictability and chance to actively apply the daze?

“Gain a charge when you or your pet deal a critical strike. After 10 charges, your next strike dazes a foe for ¼s.”

It would scale better in group scenarios with cleave/aoe skills, and be flexible with low precision builds since they can use a high precision pet to gain charges.

The daze, from how I read it, only affects a single, so that limitation there works well enough so this trait isn’t too wild.

You should do a revamp thread, very curious to see your ideas.

shadowpass.4236:

Disrupting Accuracy: Critical hits have a 10% chance to daze your target for .25 seconds.

ICD?

Wondrouswall.7169:

StickerHappy.8052:

Your refined toxins idea is very good. It’s good to have an ICD, it will condition bombing galore if there is no ICD present to keep it in check.

No. ICDs are killing the game. There are ways to prevent condition bombing like I suggested before. Ever try the new Deathly Chill? Rangers have a lot of Poison applications, but that limitation of 1 stack per application (aka ignores stacks of poison applied and applies only 1 stack from the trait) makes it, dare I say, balanced and overall, not hindered by an ICD.

Also, pet poison on F2 on affected foes works much better than just covering your conditions. If they changed it to function like Wilting Strikes, Hawks & Eagles can become fairly strong in 1v1 confrontations while other higher cooldown pets with an AOE can have their F2s become more potent.

There is very little problem with that rework. Not to mention, all pets have a condition damage stat. Sure, only some have a higher one, but poison a 2-for-1 condition. Bring it for both the damage and debuff and choose the pet accordingly. Why do I even have to mention this at this point is beyond me.

I completely forgot that they fixed the condition damage stat for pets, my friend just mentioned it to me right now in game. Sorry about that.

UnitedChaos.8364:

StickerHappy.8052

The possibilities are endless for choking gas, any build can use them if you use atleast one of the above I mentioned.

Sinister builds for pve will also benefit from this, perma AoE poison plus poison master is super good.

I totally forgot about spiders. Their aoe poison blob would be awesome with this skill because it would also generate a field for projeciles.

StickerHappy.8052

2.) Can you please explain barbed arrows and hidden barbs .

Sure.
First, I just renamed sharpened edges to “barbed arrows”.
Second, I moved it from adept to master to be parallel with the other “preparation” traits I made.
Third, I moved Hidden Barbs from master to adept to accommodate #2 and gave it a buff to synergizes well with Choking Gas.

One major problem that I see, moving it to adept major still makes it compete with the trap trait like sharpened edges compete with it now.

I think adept minor is better.

UnitedChaos.8364:

Mr Pin.6728:

I can’t say I liked any of these changes. I understand that they are most likely geared with a very pvp mentality in mind but the steady focus change alone is a straight 10% dps reduction on a class that isn’t exactly a dps powerhouse. Hurts pve unless you add that back in baseline to weapons. I’d rather we have a change in a utility to avoid projectile hate. Or projectile hate on other classes is balanced down as a whole. The rest seem very situational. I mean choking gas could be alright but rangers only have two weapon sets (dagger/ shortbow am I missing any?) to apply poison. Wouldn’t that narrow build/gear diversity? Barbed arrows is confusing, no change in functionality? Why make it compete with spotter? You are losing trait synergy with that move. Also hidden barbs would be a tad over balanced for an adept.

Yes, I’m pretty play PvP and wvw exclusively.
For the posion, fields would also apply poison even if not directly from you. Necromancers inflict heavy poison stacks which would also play well with this trait.

1. Seeking arrows would overcome heavy guardian and warrior blocks.
2. I moved barbed arrows to make it a master trait to be in line with the other traits.
3. I feel Choking Gas is much more powerful than the current and would work in all game modes.
4. Read the wind keeps the current functionality idea (vigor to allies) but is in line with preparations as well as a boon removal. This would be terrible in pve.
5. Disrupting accuracy allows you to control the heals on your pet. For example, you can cc a foe then use bristleback’s F3 for a big heal.

1.) 25 second CD atleast, the amount of blocks in the game right now is terrible, only a handful unblockable stuff in the game exist (assuming you build around them)

2.) Can you please explain barbed arrows and hidden barbs change?

3.) Choking gas is very good, now with the stability change, poison for ressing is much needed because stability isn’t that easy to strip anymore.

4.) This is highly situational, might as well make it 2-3 random boons, 20 second ICD. What if the enemy does not have vigor? Also 1 specific boon is pretty weak for a master trait, it might be better as an adept.

5.) Do not limit it to hard CC, make it usable with soft CCs like cripple, chill, slow, immob too (perfect synergy with Predator’s Onslaught). I would add additonal 5% damage when pet is above 90% hp so that you have an incentive to keep them above 90%.

Mr Pin.6728:

I can’t say I liked any of these changes. I understand that they are most likely geared with a very pvp mentality in mind but the steady focus change alone is a straight 10% dps reduction on a class that isn’t exactly a dps powerhouse. Hurts pve unless you add that back in baseline to weapons. I’d rather we have a change in a utility to avoid projectile hate. Or projectile hate on other classes is balanced down as a whole. The rest seem very situational. I mean choking gas could be alright but rangers only have two weapon sets (dagger/ shortbow am I missing any?) to apply poison. Wouldn’t that narrow build/gear diversity? Barbed arrows is confusing, no change in functionality? Why make it compete with spotter? You are losing trait synergy with that move. Also hidden barbs would be a tad over balanced for an adept.

Why limit yourself to weapon sets?

Some pets by default have poison application: Marsh Drake, Spiders, Venom Sac via forage, etc.

Poison master makes every pet and you poison applicators.

Viper nest, Serpent sting also deal poison.

Every weapon can also be a poison applicator via:

Sigil of doom, Sigil of Blight (AOE)

Runes:

Afflicted, Rata Sum, Orr, Thorns, etc.

The possibilities are endless for choking gas, any build can use them if you use atleast one of the above I mentioned.

Sinister builds for pve will also benefit from this, perma AoE poison plus poison master is super good.

I have never had any problem with Moa since the launch of the game using any class.

As many people have mentioned you can LOS,Block,Dodge,Blind, etc it.

If you are ever get hit, you can use 5, I will emphasize this point Most people I see when Moa’ed hit 5 Immediately, 5 is an EVADE, you have to time to use it when the CC or burst comes, not just mindlessly use it because of a panic attack.

Another thing, when someone or you get Moa’ed, your team has to peel for you via, heals, another mes can port you out, timing rebound, share distortion, sanctuary, etc. This is the big difference in solo q as no one will help you out.

I would also say yes CS is very strong but moa is FINE its been here since the start of the game, and people still can’t think of better ways to deal with it?

Wow.

Ghotistyx.6942:

StickerHappy.8052:

SB will never work in a competitive AG or ESL match.

Not with that attitude

Oh, isn’t it general consensus that SB is super underwhelming for top tier?

Fixy Fixy

/15chars

lighter.2708:

surprised me how no one interpreted the “double blink” as in blink and staff2

I would say the same thing.

Although technically they are different because PR is only a pseudo stun breaker.

But misty, we all have to agree these are solo q builds right?

SB will never work in a competitive AG or ESL match.

Wondrouswall.7169:

I’d rather have Poison Master just have the pet poison be applied on foes affected by their F2 skills, no ICD.

Refined Toxins changed to applying 1 stack of another damaging condition per application of poison, like the revamped Deathly Chill (Reaper). Either Torment or Bleed would be fine, and above all, no ICD.

Pet poison is okay on paper again but here is the problem, only specific pets have a condition damage stat. It won’t make any sense to use Poison master just for a cover condition, it is a GM investment after all.

Your refined toxins idea is very good. It’s good to have an ICD, it will condition bombing galore if there is no ICD present to keep it in check.

Justine.6351:

Refined toxins works as both a cover and a healing reduction. You don’t need your health to always be above 90% so long as occasionally your health bumps above 90%. Same deal with your pet and there is ofcoarse pet swap.

Poison master is non-sensicle for ranger as there really isn’t a good build that can stack enough poison in it without being complete tryhard. The trait brings poison to pet swap which is ok but it should also attempt to either alter what poison can bring to play or bring poison into play through an idea like sharpened edges does so it’s not reliant on assembling mediocre skills/sigils/runes into a mediocre mashup mess like this sentence you just read.

Refined toxins is okay on paper, what breaks it is the double condition required to proc it.

90% is okay but reduce the ICD. The ICD is too much for 1 stack of poison.

or vice versa

The threshold is okay but increase the stacks to 2-3.

90% is very hard to maintain in an active teamfight.

Fluffball.8307:

Potent Poison made more sense (ignoring our condi removal) when rangers were among the best at poison application. Poison was insanely powerful to the point many PvP builds used a doom sigil just to get access to it. Since the condi change, no one cares about small stacks of poison application every now and then.

That trait is a relic, basically.

Agreed. Especially that we have chill now too. But lets not forget our best poison applicator is a trap, therefore can’t be used on a downed body (which is super useful in pvp) unless someone is close or ressing them.

So i think buffing poison master makes sense.

Trevor Boyer.6524:

Stop asking for things to be removed and start asking for things to be balanced.

This +1000

Why is our Poison Master only 25%?

While we have this?

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Potent_Poison

SUGGESTION Make the damage increase 33% and give it an increased duration of 20%

Refined toxins is such a bad trait, it’s so hard to keep above 90% health and it has a freaking 10 sec cd?

It only gives 1 stack of Poison too.

SUGGESTION Hitting poisoned targets spread their poison stacks. ICD 3 Seconds. 300 Radius. 1 Stack transferred every 3 seconds.

mistsim.2748:

im just frustrated that the recent updates totally killed any semi-viable condi bunker ranger, with the removal of settler and celestial. trap ranger is ok, but succumbs too quickly to condi spam which is everywhere now. i wanted SB to work, but it just doesnt.

i played the kitten out of druid when HoT came out, and i dont wanna do it again. the fact that core ranger is so bad still is pretty depressing.

Trap ranger is dead when they removed throwable traps

Nighthawk.4687:

ronpierce.2760:

Let’s not keep killing play styles due to improper balance… Vipers do WAY more damage than Mercenaries (which aren’t that tanky, just a bit), the reason hardly anyone runs vipers is because there is so much removal and people get blown up by power damage without some toughness…

In reality there is a relatively healthy mix of build types, removing this Amulet serves no purpose other than trying to remove conditions from PvP because people can’t wrap their heads around them. Sorry, but this is just silly now…

Yes but vipers does only a small percent more damage than Mercenary so why is it fair that mercenary so much tankier and does basically the same DPS? If you get blown away by a power build running a burst condi build, they outplayed you. Why should a power build win against certain burst condi builds by outplaying them?

No precision. That makes a whole lot of difference. Some builds or classes do not have access to perma fury.

phokus.8934:

Keadron.9570:

Ok I’m not arguing for a nerf but I have to ask why people keep saying it’s a long cast? It’s 1 freaking second! Flamestrike fireball are all 1 sec and their autos with other skills being more. If you want to defend the skill that’s fine but please don’t say it has a long cast time when it doesnt

You can’t react to hitting your dodge key when a bluish animation starts within 1 second?

You do not see that in stealth. You can get chained CC too and if you do not have stun breakers you will get Moa’d.

Burtnik.5218:

StickerHappy.8052:

Burtnik.5218:

StickerHappy.8052:

Pyriall.1683:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Pyriall.1683:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Pyriall.1683:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Give us cleanse and I’ll happily give up some damage

No you won’t, because you do. You have two legends that can handle conditions, but you don’t run them because you don’t want to give up the damage that Glint/Shiro provide.

Mallyx is reserved for condi builds which not everyone wants to run. Ventari is straight up useless and suggesting to replace either Shiro or Glint with it makes you look stupid.

No, your response is moronic. You said give up damage for some cleanse. You have that option now, but guess what? You don’t want to give up the damage and utility of the other two legends. Your statement should read, “I want to keep all of the damage and utility of Shiro/Glint AND want cleanses”. Just because you don’t want to play it, don’t say it isn’t available to you.

Why don’t you show us how viable Ventari is?

Hey superstar…did anyone say it was viable? You quite plainly said you would give up some damage for cleanses. You have the option, but you’re not willing to give up the damage for the cleanses.

Rev mains be like:

“We need more cleanses, we will trade our damage for condition removal options!,”

Has options but never want to use them.

#revlogic

Have you tried ventari? Or Jalis? Guess not otherwise you wouldnt come up with this bs

If you wanna bring out the not viable argument, don’t. All the people here are saying, you have cleanses but you don’t wanna use them. The point here is that YOU HAVE THEM.

If i try to use ventari i will be a running freekill to anyone. 0 sustain, 0 stunbreaks on top of the need to micromanage tablet which wont be possible at all in zerker amulet.

The point is unless you give rev possibility of mixing utility skills you cant go out and say they have cleanses. There is difference between wanting to get cleanses and crippling yourself. Atm revs has better chances fighting condi builds with no condi removal as funny as it sound. Picking up Ventari means death to both power and condi builds.

This is just a part of the main problem, thing is the condition spamming in this game is just too braindead and rampant.

Tragic Positive.9356:

StickerHappy.8052:

Menders/Cleric.

I have no idea why there is so much projectile hate now.

Engies reflect projectiles by breathing. And since a single reflect breaks the table upside down (by 200% literally) – that’s something you just cannot ignore if you are holding onto a projectile-based weapon or build.

Do not forget eles with magnetic aura and swirling winds.

Archon.6480:

I think we stay bruiser-support, or bunker-support. I don’t know, I’ve managed to make some high damage Condi builds without Staff, but they just aren’t competitive, outside trolling unranked.

For ranked, Shortbow is still way too weak. The skills are rather lame. There might be some kind of Axe/D, Staff build, but…. I have not found one yet…

The real problem for Druid is the amulet selection. Druid kinda needs some sort of healing component, and there are only a few amulets that have it. I still can’t believe they removed crusader.

This is the part where I kinda disagree, Druid healing heals very well even with 0 healing power, this is why maruader druid works.

Although you are right in a certain degree, We need healing power/condition damage amulets that are not squishy, I have no idea why they removed settler.

If we had that ammy back this would promote condition support builds

runeblade.7514:

Because you need to pay to win.

how?

Tragic Positive.9356:

I was trying out BM/NM/Druid Zerker. With A/A + LB
Getting 25 might is now super easy. Pair it with Quickness from BM and Rapid fire – and you have some nice burst over there.

It’s nothing competitive since it’s hard countered by reflects… But it’s a blast in solo queue.

I think we’ll be staying bunkers for competitive play. That’s my guess.

Menders/Cleric.

I have no idea why there is so much projectile hate now.

Burtnik.5218:

StickerHappy.8052:

Pyriall.1683:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Pyriall.1683:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Pyriall.1683:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Give us cleanse and I’ll happily give up some damage

No you won’t, because you do. You have two legends that can handle conditions, but you don’t run them because you don’t want to give up the damage that Glint/Shiro provide.

Mallyx is reserved for condi builds which not everyone wants to run. Ventari is straight up useless and suggesting to replace either Shiro or Glint with it makes you look stupid.

No, your response is moronic. You said give up damage for some cleanse. You have that option now, but guess what? You don’t want to give up the damage and utility of the other two legends. Your statement should read, “I want to keep all of the damage and utility of Shiro/Glint AND want cleanses”. Just because you don’t want to play it, don’t say it isn’t available to you.

Why don’t you show us how viable Ventari is?

Hey superstar…did anyone say it was viable? You quite plainly said you would give up some damage for cleanses. You have the option, but you’re not willing to give up the damage for the cleanses.

Rev mains be like:

“We need more cleanses, we will trade our damage for condition removal options!,”

Has options but never want to use them.

#revlogic

Have you tried ventari? Or Jalis? Guess not otherwise you wouldnt come up with this bs

If you wanna bring out the not viable argument, don’t. All the people here are saying, you have cleanses but you don’t wanna use them. The point here is that YOU HAVE THEM.

Pyriall.1683:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Pyriall.1683:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Pyriall.1683:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Give us cleanse and I’ll happily give up some damage

No you won’t, because you do. You have two legends that can handle conditions, but you don’t run them because you don’t want to give up the damage that Glint/Shiro provide.

Mallyx is reserved for condi builds which not everyone wants to run. Ventari is straight up useless and suggesting to replace either Shiro or Glint with it makes you look stupid.

No, your response is moronic. You said give up damage for some cleanse. You have that option now, but guess what? You don’t want to give up the damage and utility of the other two legends. Your statement should read, “I want to keep all of the damage and utility of Shiro/Glint AND want cleanses”. Just because you don’t want to play it, don’t say it isn’t available to you.

Why don’t you show us how viable Ventari is?

Hey superstar…did anyone say it was viable? You quite plainly said you would give up some damage for cleanses. You have the option, but you’re not willing to give up the damage for the cleanses.

Rev mains be like:

“We need more cleanses, we will trade our damage for condition removal options!,”

Has options but never want to use them.

#revlogic

UmbraNoctis.1907:

Soldier rune helps keeping the pets alive. Without it, the pets will suffer from high condi pressure.

I thought it was bugged that it never cleansed of allies (since pet is considered an ally)

You can always swap when you see your pet succumbing to conditions.

jcbroe.4329:

anduriell.6280:

StickerHappy.8052:

I do agree that you need cleanses, I heavily disagree that core ranger isn’t viable. Eura got to legendary using only Core Ranger.

you havent seen the review from wooden potatos i assume. anybody could get to leg just playing enough hours. Also premaids help, and obviously your skill against them.

core ranger is not viable because you are locked in survival for the cleanses. the runes of the trooper only cleanse one condition and are for tanky builds.

the day Anet moves the trait emphatic bond to BM will be a day ro rejoice. And if they improve it to cleanse 1 condi every 3 seconds maybe even push the ranger to have a chance.

Eura is only one person, so it isn’t as though he’s your average player, but I’m pretty sure he didn’t even use Survival and he performed very well.

Core ranger also has more cleansing than Revenant, and Rev is top tier, so it isn’t as though the issue is even survival, it’s impact.

Personally, if I was going to run core ranger:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQJATRnUqA1Ci9rAOsActgBMhqX2BIA+boBqY/wXgHvEnnG-TpBFABNcIAY4IAAwDAQ8yAFt/ABXAAA

and if those pets aren’t allowed, swap to double birds and the BM trait to the Taunt.

This looks very strong, but Soldier runes are overkill don’t you think? you have 4 condis per 10 seconds removed plus 1 mass condition removal.