Guild Wars 2

Sir Mad.1092:

How does it change the business model?

By adding an optional VIP subscription.

Alec B.8905:

Swagger.1459:

Alec B.8905:

Swagger.1459:

Alec B.8905:

With these rising gem prices many people are getting upset with them. I personally am not because I am never interested in these purchases. It bugs me that arena net focuses on outfits and gliders than actual in game(not gemstore) armors and weapons. I like some of the outfits, but I want to be able to use some parts of these outfits…not the whole thing. I think many other people would agree with me that anet should focus more on the players ability to make their own look instead of following an outfit that requires you to spend mass amounts of money to get.

Anet needs to make money to fund this game properly.

We can’t keep catering to the free players who do not want to invest in their own game, they get enough free as is.

They do that with the gliders, back items, toys, and mining tools. along with the outfits and other things. I just want to be able to use different sections of outfits that I pay for. Keep the gem store stuff, but dont just lock the outfits where you are stuck with an amazing hood or chest piece and really bad looking boots and pants where you start to dislike the outfit to the point that you stop using it.

This is a company that needs to make money to give players stuff so they can make more money.

The gem store is how they make the bulk of their money, so you are asking them to not make money but keep giving you free stuff.

if you didn’t read what I said, I just wish that outfits could have the six different parts that you can pick and choose from after you PURCHASE them from the store.

You said a lot more than that.

Vayne.8563:

I’m not sure how familiar you are with MMOs, OP, but they’re different from other games. They take a lot of money to run. That money has to come from somewhere.

Games like WoW and FFXIV have subscriptions that keep them afloat. If you have a million people giving you $15 a month, that’s $15 million dollars a month. Games like SWToR have “optional” subscriptions that don’t really let you do anything unless you subscribe. You can play through the story and that’s about it. Same with most games that have optional subs.

Then there are pay to win games that require you to pay to do well or advance.

Anet is none of these. It’s a buy to play game that supports it’s staff of 300 plus employees with sales from the gem store.

Anet isn’t going to stop making gem store items any more than the company you work for is going to cease to try to make a profit and pay their employees.

Exactly what Vayne said.

Alec B.8905:

Swagger.1459:

Alec B.8905:

With these rising gem prices many people are getting upset with them. I personally am not because I am never interested in these purchases. It bugs me that arena net focuses on outfits and gliders than actual in game(not gemstore) armors and weapons. I like some of the outfits, but I want to be able to use some parts of these outfits…not the whole thing. I think many other people would agree with me that anet should focus more on the players ability to make their own look instead of following an outfit that requires you to spend mass amounts of money to get.

Anet needs to make money to fund this game properly.

We can’t keep catering to the free players who do not want to invest in their own game, they get enough free as is.

They do that with the gliders, back items, toys, and mining tools. along with the outfits and other things. I just want to be able to use different sections of outfits that I pay for. Keep the gem store stuff, but dont just lock the outfits where you are stuck with an amazing hood or chest piece and really bad looking boots and pants where you start to dislike the outfit to the point that you stop using it.

This is a company that needs to make money to give players stuff so they can make more money.

The gem store is how they make the bulk of their money, so you are asking them to not make money but keep giving you free stuff.

Alec B.8905:

With these rising gem prices many people are getting upset with them. I personally am not because I am never interested in these purchases. It bugs me that arena net focuses on outfits and gliders than actual in game(not gemstore) armors and weapons. I like some of the outfits, but I want to be able to use some parts of these outfits…not the whole thing. I think many other people would agree with me that anet should focus more on the players ability to make their own look instead of following an outfit that requires you to spend mass amounts of money to get.

Anet needs to make money to fund this game properly.

We can’t keep catering to the free players who do not want to invest in their own game, they get enough free as is.

briggah.7910:

Have to say this game mode has become blob wars 2 and it is boring. I’ve even gotten worse because now all I do is spam skills because that’s all it takes now to kill players. If this was always supposed to be the way wvw was played I wouldn’t have stuck around as long as I have. I’m drifting away from this game because the fun factor is going away. When I first started to play we had more players playing than we do now but it wasn’t like this one bit.

Yup, so we need a real reinvestment into wvw and professions.

@Steelo

Think about this…

There is obviously a group of players who wants less blob style of wvw and the DBL were created for that purpose. The problem is that when the devs dropped in 3 DBL maps they took away 75% of the blob designed maps… So the 83% complained or quit or stood in line for EB…

We all want different playstyles (zerg, havok, roaming, solo) in wvw, but maps and designs need to support that…

I like solo roaming (goofing off out of boredom really), but I’m limited to what I can do realistically. These maps are for larger scale encounters so naturally there is only so much solo or small groups can do in zones with the hungry and drooling blobs looking to gobble stuff up. The blobbers are happy, but we (devs and players) all know there are other roles and styles that are a bit tougher to offer by current map designs.

If you even bothered to read my original comment you would see maps designed to support both blob and small scale play… 8 maps for blobs gobbling up each other and structures, and X amount of maps for small scale stuff with open space objectives, not beating up big doors and walls.

gennyt.3428:

Maybe in GW3. Hopefully that gets a fresh new, highly optimized engine. Blobbing isn’t bad necessarily but it shouldn’t provide a hard coded safety net from skilled players because of engine limitations. It may be difficult to accept but GW2 has an uber casual philosophy running throughout it, WvWvW included. The game will compensate for the player’s lack of effort or competence.

Examples are :

• The strong passive abilities, some of which are “Oh kitten”/“Save me” mechanics
• The spammy single button mega damage skills
• The abundance of AoEs while having a 5 man AoE cap – big groups need not worry
• Changes to make condition builds more appealing – just tank up and still melt foes quickly! You’re awesome!
• Run into a room, pull a lever, kill a bunch of people – Don’t even need Keanu Reeves
• Stand around on a wall or door pressing 3 keys for 5 – 45 minutes at a time all week and win!

Etc, etc.

Sure, I completely understand what you are saying and that’s completely rational. Unfortunately, though, current wvw players can’t wait 10 years for a gw3 to (most likely not) happen.

There are RvRvR games in the works, and unless Anet gets on the upgrade gw2 train, it’s gonna hurt wvw.

There are tons of desires for a better wvw experience for different players, so the devs need to take that as serious as they take PvE… Look at ALL the effort that has gone into the PvE side of the game… Now let’s ask ourselves what percentage of dev investment and resources has gone into pvp modes… That number is in the single digits comparatively, but it’s not enough.

So instead of PvE living story, PvE living story, PvE xpac, PvE living story, PvE living story, PvE xpac, more PvE stuff for years to come… Let’s put in a couple of mega PvP updates into the mix and try to cater to players like the op, you, I… Anet is creative and capable enough to make wvw great again.

Steelo.4597:

@Swagger: stop spamming threads about completely different stuff with your EOTM-idea which already has been downvoted into oblivion.

It’s completely relevant… The current wvw map designs are designed for blobs and cater to the 83%… So I provide a solution for the 17% of voters who want less blob gameplay but like the rvr style.

Either players can accept blobs, or get behind a solution and stop complaining about blobs.

Interestingly enough Steelo, my suggestion tackles 3 of 4 of your wants… Also, the op wants smaller scale gameplay and you want to break up/weaken megablobs, so you need various maps to make that happen.

“- population balance / world linking
- redesign skills / combat (general guidelines: less cheese, less damage)
- scoring improvments (coverage)
- break up /weaken map-switching megablobs”

Knob.6835:

Correct me if I’m wrong but I believe most people prefer group fights between 10 – 25 players give or take some. But the 40+ endless blob fest is starting to get old. It usually starts out with multiple tags on the map then enemy brings the blob then we combine into a giant blob then the next team. It’s the same thing every day. Is there a solution to this? Should there be a solution to this or is this really what the majority enjoys?

I was going to post about this today…

You obviously don’t understand what wvw/rvr is.

Players obviously moved around to find “blob” fights.

The majority also voted for linking.

The current designs of wvw are not gvg fight club zones.

You want a solution for all players? Then click the link in my sig and support the idea…

If you don’t want to support the idea, then please stop trying to turn wvw into a glorified gvg/spvp experience.

“PvP Maps

These maps are the “No PvE” zones that remain conducive to quality open space mass pvp.

*1 Eternal Battlegrounds.

*1 Alpine Borderland.

*1 revamped Desert Borderland.

*1 new Arctic Borderland.

*1 Edge of the Mists.

New PvP maps

These would be the EotM factions inspired borderland maps.

*1 expanded Badlands Borderland.

*1 expanded Frostreach Borderland.

*1 expanded Overgrowth Borderland.

Guild Wars inspired PvP/PvE Maps

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/The_Mists
Let’s call these “Hot Zones” (for this discussion) that draw elements from GW lore. Players can play and fight here as normal, and these maps are host to meta events as well. WvW wide alerts can be given to indicate a meta event will occur.
The main goal of these maps is to provide a good place for solo and small groups of players. I would like these maps to be more event and open area capture point based, and less structure capture based.

Homeland PvE maps

I’d like to take npcs and factions from EotM and WvW and expand on them. Let’s give them a purpose for their existence in the Mists, an open world story for players to go through and a compelling reason for players to be fighting the Mist War with them.
These homeland maps would be the entry zones for WvW depending on the color side you are on. From here you can portal to other maps. These homeland maps do not have to be just 1 map for each side, multiple smaller maps could be used as well or added later.

*Enemy players cannot enter opposing sides PvE homelands.

*These maps are treated and played like any Tyria PvE maps.

*Players are not forced into other types of WvW maps, they are only encouraged by rewards.

General “Stuff” for Maps

*I’d like to see underground maps and areas utilized more in the Mists. Homelands and Hot Zones would be great for this.

*Add tunnel systems, like in EotM, to various maps for strategic use and map travel.

*It would be great to have a cohesive story and consistent groups of npcs for each faction across all maps.

Map Copies

Ideally I’m looking to create 1 Mist “world”, but feel the PvE maps would need to use the map copy function.

Maps Recap

8 PvP maps (EB, AB, DB, Arctic B, EotM, BB, FB, OB) with 4 castles in total (EB, BB, FB, OB).

X number of PvP/PvE Hot Zone meta event maps that draw from Guild Wars lore.

3 PvE Homeland maps."

Fluffball.8307:

I meant the root. Many ranger mains preferred the old mechanics. Myself included. But don’t start another kitten argument over how we’re all wrong, it’s over.

I don’t need to make that argument anymore because at least the root is gone.

Fluffball.8307:

Kiba.9743:

I’m probably one of the few who liked the sword the way it was.

Not few, many (most?) ranger mains preferred the old animation. The new animation is clearly better for ranger newbies, which are a massively bigger demographic, though. Spilled milk and all, though…

Animations were ok, just the root wasn’t fine.

Loosmaster.8263:

A 4 week or longer tournament is bad. An incentive during a normal match week isn’t!!!

Just wondering, do you realize that wvw populations are still a complete mess?

As someone with basic proficiency with a sword, all the #1 skills are not practical looking. 1 and 3 of the combo look like the character is swinging a baseball bat and 2 is just out of place in the combo… It all really looks bad and there is zero synergy or flow to the combo from beginning to end.

Loosmaster.8263:

McKenna Berdrow.2759:

I’ll quote Tyler for this thread:

Tyler Bearce.3427:

The Tier 1 Weapons will be made available in an upcoming Reward Track, much like the armor already is.

We haven’t fully decided how to distribute the T2 Weapons and Armor yet. Though, we are currently leaning towards players purchasing them with a currency that they’d earn as a match reward. We may also set rank requirements for the various pieces, so you’d need to be a relatively high rank(1-2k) to purchase a full set.

My opinion stays as before “These should remain as a Tournament prize”. Burn out or not, the Tournament is all we have as a WvW special event. They should remain until something is created to replace it.

Where we are at with the current state of WvW, tossing in a random week long tournament will spice more things up in the game mode. It just has to be implemented correctly. I’ll repeat my suggestion again:

1: No prior notification of when the tournament is to happen but should start on Reset night and the “Notification” only appears then. This is to help any attempts at server stacking.

2: PPK will be the score for the winning server placement.

3: Lock out server transfer during the match or if transfers are allowed, then lock out access to WvW during the match and EotM is only available.

4: Placement, i.e. 1st, 2nd or 3rd and the amount of associated tickets will be up to Anet.

By going with PPK, it shouldn’t have to much affect on sever scoring and Glicko ratings.

We are not getting tournaments right now, or even back for a long time… Maybe never because permanent losses to participating happened after each tournament.

Those weapon skins have been unobtainable for a year and a half, players don’t need to wait longer for these. It’s embarrassing that they have been locked out from purchase this long.

Let’s do the “maths” people….

We have had server vs server vs server for 3 years, but not enough players to fill server maps.

They are trying alliance vs alliance vs alliance… Still not enough players to fill these maps.

But let’s add more servers?

We need to start thinking logically people… Can’t keep doing the same old and expect different outcomes, it’s not rational.

There are reasons why 3 factions, and stuff like megaserver, works in the long run. Players get over changes fast and it’s time to start making the right decisions.

RvRvR is not suppose to be like glorified spvp matches with an over amount of rules and limitations and restrictions, it’s supposed to be a war. It’s supposed to be more “sandboxy” and epic and filled with players blowing up pixels for fun, not excessive handholding and pandering to players who want the RvRvR experience but complain about “blobs” and “zergs”…

Edit- Here are the other problems too… When the devs created GW2 they went in full steam thinking that there would be millions and millions and millions of players filling up every map across the game… That’s what all game companies hope for, but the reality is that most games dwindle in populations. Despite having an easy way into playing the game because of not having monthly fees, they still had to consolidate populations. “Play for Free” comes along and the estimates were that the monthly concurrency rates doubled to like 3, 000,000 players… Despite all this, WvW struggled and continues to struggle to fill up wvw server maps…

Something big has to happen to revitilize wvw, and the logical step is to pool as many players as possible into one space. Unless that stuff happens, say goodbye to wvw when some RvRvR focused games come along. Thankfully Anet has time to make wvw great again, but it needs to happen, and we need them to focus on the right things.

Kungsmurfen.2861:

I think this is a good idea. I want to play with a lower population than now and if a free lower pop server were to show up I’d rather go there than stay with the blobs.

If you don’t like to encounter or play around “blobs” then wvw is not for you.

The whole point of this hypothetical topic is to even out all population and link all these even servers so the blobs are more even.

It’s kind of silly that we don’t have a 3 faction design…. Every other part of the game is all mixed up with players from all over. Guilds have players from all over. Yet, we are trying to sort those players back out for wvw…

GW2 US and EU both need to go 3 realm across the board for wvw so we can cut out this mess as much as possible. Players can completely play together despite language barriers, it happens all the time.

Invest in making a 3 faction war, and give yourselves and players less headaches for the long run.

GW2 WvW won’t survive when CU comes out. Between nostalgia from the godfathers of RvRvR that brought DAoC, and the fact that top streamers are salivating for the game to come out, GW2 WvW hold up unless things change drastically in the mists AND with professions.

Magical Things.8465:

I appreciate the creative thinking……but as others have mentioned we already have several low pop servers open. Adding additional worlds wouldn’t really solve anything in my mind.

Yup.

Taxidriver.2043:

Time for Faction vs Faction. Server vs Server dont work b/c some servers are heavy SEA time some are heavy NA time the score is close but its misleading since most of the time ppl just pvd.

Yup.

WvW will not survive if we can’t compete against this…

“Three Realms in one persistent, massive, open-world sandbox environment, with towns and cities built almost entirely by the players. Do battle over scarce resources, take and hold Places of Power, burn down your enemies’ homes, and seek to conquer The Depths™, a TriRealm dungeon like none other in gaming. This might be a sandbox game, but you aren’t building sandcastles: You are building and defending your homes!”

“Bored with typical MMORPG combat? In our game, you can build your own powerful ability combinations and unleash them on other players and structures. Even better, these abilities can interact with other abilities! Thus, a fireball hits a waterball to create a steam cloud, which you can then push over an enemy for some par-boiled TriRealm™ fun!”

“features a custom built game engine created in-house with the specific needs of solid performance in massive open world battles in mind.”

I’m not saying we need home and structure building, but Anet really needs to upgrade wvw and professions and engine capabilities if they want RvRvR minded players to stick around.

keenedge.9675:

I had messed around in Alpine maps a bit during the nearly 3 yrs before the Desert maps. Then when the Desert maps came out I decided to explore and learn the maps while doing dailies.

I’m kinda sad that no one bothered to learn or run the Desert maps. True it was harder to find the opposition, but it also required deeper strategy. Going back to the Alpine maps seems like a jump back into easy mode for the borderlands. Frankly, it’s a bit boring now. No hunting or planning . . . just Zerg vs Zerg.

Oh well, the mobs want easy mode (but want it challenging too)

- sigh -

Players tried it, most didn’t like it.

The core of RvR is zerg gameplay… These aren’t supposed to be 10v10v10 wars. Maybe you should try spvp.

The desert maps will get revamps to be more conducive to zerg gameplay and be rotated back eventually.

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Fairly regularly, I see posts that say something to the effect of:

“The world that most of our guild is on is Full, so we’ve been having our new/returning guild members transfer to the Guest world, but what will happen if the Guest world gets relinked? Will we have to pay to transfer all those members again?”

This solution would give guilds like that an opportunity to freely reform on a world with plenty of space for their entire guild.

Now of course it’s still entirely possible that guilds won’t actually be willing to transfer off their current worlds, even for the opportunity to get all of their members onto the same world. However, that’s exactly why I made this post, just to confirm either case.

I feel this hypothetical situation will cause more headaches long term due to the human factor.

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Since it’s seeming increasingly likely that World Linking is going to win the community vote and become a permanent Gw2 feature, the team has been discussing ways to improve the system, especially around further improving population balance, while still allowing players to reliably play with their friends and guildmates.

Hypothetically speaking, if we were to open some additional worlds (and at this point I still don’t know how much work, or how safe a change like that would be), but if we did, would there be player interest in transferring to these new worlds? The new worlds would have lowered population caps and be free to transfer to for a period of time.

The ultimate goal of this hypothetical plan would be two-fold:
1) Give players/guilds that are too big for their ‘Full’ status world an opportunity to move to new worlds, enabling them to grow more easily again.
2) Achieve a larger number of smaller worlds that we can link together to achieve more balanced numbers for each team.

Again, this isn’t something we necessarily can or will do. The purpose of this post is just to quickly feel out community interest, to see if it was worth spending the time it would take to seriously investigate this option.

More segregation would be unhealthy long term. It’s best to pool more players into one space.

Take a look at this…

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Suggestion-Living-WvW-updated/first

Edit- Linking and rewards were a good start to boost population, but a much stronger reinvestment into wvw should be made.

In addition to the long term health of wvw for GW2 players, I’m also concerned with a couple new RvRvR focused games coming out… One I’m not too familiar with, but one will be completely designed around RvRvR. With that in mind, I’m hard pressed to think that the previous, current and hypothetical “more segregation” wvw designs will be interesting enough to hold players. As I said, linking and rewards were a good start, but GW2 RvRvR needs some major TLC if you wish to retain players long term and grow this portion of the game.

Would also be great to bring us major profession improvements to improve the combat experience.

Just throwing this really basic idea on themed factions…

Green

Maps- Nature themed.

Protagonist faction-

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Menzies

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Shadow_Army

Allied Faction-

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Balthazar

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Eternal

Why Balthazar on green?

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Forest_of_the_Wailing_Lord

“The forest is governed by the Wailing Lord, who allows both the Eternal army and the Shadow army to harvest the forest to fuel their war efforts.”

Red

Maps- Desert themed.

Protagonist faction-

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Abaddon

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Margonite

Allied Faction-

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Kormir

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Order_of_the_Sunspears

“Abaddon, with the help of Dhuum and Menzies, was almost successful, but was stopped by the Order of the Sunspears and the Order of Whispers, who entered the Realm of Torment to defeat him. In his final moments, Abaddon’s power threatened to run out of control and destroy Tyria, but it was absorbed by Spearmarshal Kormir, who became the Goddess of Truth using a power that had been granted to her by the Five Gods.”

Blue

Maps- Winter themed.

Protagonist faction-

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Dhuum

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Lords_of_Anguish

Allied Faction-

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Grenth

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/King_Frozenwind

Why the factions are fighting

I’m still figuring out a good tie-in for these factions to be at war. I was thinking perhaps going with like a “Battle of Champions” type thing, but with the bad gods thrown into the mix.

Maybe the players are trying to win control over the…

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Scepter_of_Orr

Or

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Staff_of_the_Mists

To control and destroy…

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Titan

And

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Demon

For some extra special “winners” reward at the end of each weekly match up and “campaign”.

Points for boldness, but we would all love the chance to do that.

You should post your thoughts here Sheiun.

Diku.2546:

Swagger.1459:

Diku.2546:

Reminding folks that we should be ready for a Long & Never Ending bumpy ride when the Majority approves World Linking to be a permanent feature for WvW…imho

Diku

Bolded part…

Yup, and that’s why it will probably be a natural progression to a 3 sided faction war like my idea…

Maybe when that happens you and I can roam together on those PvP/PvE maps?

Then you’ll be all “Wow Swagger, this was a great idea!”… And I’ll be like “Yup, it’s pretty amazing Diku!”…

Hahaha…

I’ll pass on supporting your solution & you’ll probably pass on supporting my solution.

We do share a common theme though.

We both feel very passionately that we have a good solution to fixing the WvW Game Mode’s Long Term health & viability.

Let’s both keep trying to convince ANet.

Yours truly,
Diku

---

Possible Full Solution – Google Search – Reboot Base Map Mechanic

But it’s soooo much more fun on my faction side! You’ll see.

Yup, we are both passionate about our ideas… Now imagine if you and I combined that passion to smash all those “blob” newbies with our mighty powers! WE could ascend to the hall of faction greatness together!

And when that time comes Diku, they will give us their Ascended rings freely! In place of all the xXxDark_LordxXx noob commanders they will make us Mist War GODS! And we shall not be dark, but beautiful and terrible as the Morning and the Night! Awesome as the Sea and the Sun and the Snow upon the Mountain! Dreadful as the Storm and the Lightning! Stronger than the foundations of Tyria! All shall love us and despair!

Going to be 1 year soon since the original hint of legendary armor, and 7 months since raids were introduced… So any notes and pics and stuff on this topic?

XTR.9604:

Up to 77% for yes.

Sweet!

We are one step closer to my 3 super sided faction war! It’s going to be glorious!

Diku.2546:

Silberfederling.9302:

This However is being monitored by anet and i trust that the will intervene if things get out of Hand.

Sorry to hear about the pain & goodness you went through your 1st World Link, but be prepared for the next change in Pairing later down the Road…where we might not have any say in the matter.

If you disagree with what I’m saying…that’s fine. Let’s disagree & not attack each other.

I hope your trust is proven correct & ANet does intervene if things get out of hand.

(I’m sure they will)

My post does assume, but do you really disagree that:

To be “Efficient”…ANet has to be given free reign to Manipulate both Population & Score.

Balanced & Fair Match-Ups will be an illusion based on ANet’s skill & speed at Manipulating these variables.

Just hope folks don’t just Vote Yes…and Not Realize that things will magically be ok…

Reminding folks that we should be ready for a Long & Never Ending bumpy ride when the Majority approves World Linking to be a permanent feature for WvW…imho

My opinion is just my own…not trying to insult you, but hopefully make you realize something about what Voting Yes will “probably” entail in the future…imho

Respect that our opinions are different…and your Vote is just as precious.

Yours truly,
Diku

Bolded part…

Yup, and that’s why it will probably be a natural progression to a 3 sided faction war like my idea…

Maybe when that happens you and I can roam together on those PvP/PvE maps?

Then you’ll be all “Wow Swagger, this was a great idea!”… And I’ll be like “Yup, it’s pretty amazing Diku!”…

Heather.4823:

I wish there was a 3rd option for improving the current linking. Our link is horrible!

There will eventually have to be a long term solution. At least in the meantime participation has been improved so it gives them a bit of hope to move forward. It will be messy for a little bit, but the long run might work out well if the devs really invest back into wvw.

Jordyy.3219:

+1 for who made this post, they are looking to double kill the wvw community.

Yeah! How dare the devs, and most players, want to consolidate more people to make an epic pvp war designed for hundreds of players! The nerve of some people trying to make sure RvRvR survives! Awful!

If some of you don’t like RvRvR with lots of players running around, then RvRvR is not for you… Make sense?

joneirikb.7506:

After reading through the entire thread I think I clicked “+1” on every or almost every post Sich wrote. Agree with him in just about everything he has said in this thread.

On the general idea of this thread, I like it quite a bit, and think it would be very interesting. But I too worry that it will simply be so much work that ANet will not consider it (or instead consider it for an Exp-pack or a new game entirely).

Do really love the ideas of having “grades” of maps to go to, that support each others, and functions as gateways to other maps:

Full PvP: EBG, ABL, EOTM, etc. No PVE at all, for the pure PVP entusiasts.

Hybrid PvPvE: the middle maps that work more like Open World PvP maps.

Safe Home PvE: Sort of like a server homeland, with citadels, and some pve events and enemies, to learn about Wvw objectives, claiming, upgrading, defending etc. While being a good way for players that doesn’t like PvP to get a taste.

These would really open up the game for more people (yes, also some trolls and gankers obviously), but I’d love to see it. Pity I probably won’t

PS: Swagger what you’re describing is the Alliance system (for servers etc), not actually MegaServer. Though they share some points and similarities.

Sich has some good comments and this discussion has been pretty healthy so far.

Thanks, I like the “grades” too the more I think about it. It helps to keep wvw churning and offers different playstyles. The more the merrier.

Yup, there are a few terms we could use, but it’s basically the same. Just looking to put servers together to form a 3 sided faction.

Let’s keep hoping the devs decide to make some strong investments into wvw.

Mistress Collisto.1546:

Swagger.1459:

Actually you don’t unfortunately, anymore than you understand what the design purpose of wvw is…

“I’m fine on a fairly “dead” server and I will have fun"…

Dead servers are not good for RvRvR, but ya know, lets keep empty maps running for you and a few of your buddies lol… But seriously, if y’all don’t like running into zergs there is always spvp and guild hall fight clubs…

The quote on a dead server is nothing more then a generalized statement that many, probably even yourself, have used to describe any server lower then yours. The low tier servers where far from dead, only reason someone would have described them that way was those people do not play your way and you think you have a better use for them by forcing them to merge with you. Your other statement, your right, if you don’t want to RvRvR and do all those things that come with it, but instead want to fight blobs all day, you can go to EotM, I heard there is a large blob out there. Your not going to win me over, and all your doing is painting my picture for me. This will cause more losses to the game then any good coming from it. I stand with my other sub T4 servers on this. Merge the lower servers, I dont think many of us would mind to much as long as we are not blobbing all day.

I looked at your post history and you have issues with “blobs”… Sorry, but wvw was designed to host “blobs” so you don’t get to have 4 wvw maps to host you and 20 of your buddies. If you can’t handle “blobs” then wvw is not for you…

You also want PvE zones free of megaserver… This kills off maps and players will struggle to accomplish meta events…

You want emptier maps across game modes, but this is an mmo, not a multiplayer PlayStation game for a few of your buddies…

Some comments here show some of you only care about yourselves, not the wvw community as a whole… Y’all also want the devs to keep the light on for struggling wvw maps…. Those are both pretty selfish.

Mistress Collisto.1546:

Swagger.1459:

I’d suggest you go back and read the conversation so you know what you’re commenting on.

I know what I am commenting about, do you? Forcing people to play the way you wish they would play will only lead to the inevitable collapse of your way. I choose to stay on a server as we collapsed from T1 all the way to T7. WvW is and has always been more then blobbing, however in kitten the community, the players have changed in so many ways that only encourage “If you are not with us you are a waste to our server” Blobbing has destroyed so many of the game mechanics, including WvW. Easy loot, easy high, no risk, all reward, all about numbers… I would rather play a facebook game then roll around with what your proposing. That is why I choose NO and I hope many more agree with me on that. I am fine on a fairly “dead” server and I will have fun, if you want to just be another number, move to a higher tier. At least without server linking we have a choice.

Actually you don’t unfortunately, anymore than you understand what the design purpose of wvw is…

“I’m fine on a fairly “dead” server and I will have fun"…

Dead servers are not good for RvRvR, but ya know, lets keep empty maps running for you and a few of your buddies lol… But seriously, if y’all don’t like running into zergs there is always spvp and guild hall fight clubs…

Mistress Collisto.1546:

Swagger.1459:

Watch the video…

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dnOhMeYxhRM

Some of you have me worried here that you don’t even know what wvw was designed for…

Did you even watch it? Objectives? Control? Small group behind enemy lines?…. or are you only hearing Blobbing? This video supports both game play styles we have both been debating. Difference is, I am not promoting Anet force you to play the same way I want to play.

I’d suggest you go back and read the conversation so you know what you’re commenting on.

Watch the video…

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dnOhMeYxhRM

Some of you have me worried here that you don’t even know what wvw was designed for…

Mistress Collisto.1546:

Swagger.1459:

Bolded…

Funghetto votes no because (s)he doesn’t like casual players and zergs…

So the person who doesn’t like casual players and zergs in wvw is going to help decide the future of pvp zones designed for zergs primarily?

That is a selfish vote for those reasons provided.

That no vote is akin to players voting for spvp to be for 1v1 because they like spvp, but they don’t like 5v5… And these votes count, they are not just “opinions” anymore.

Edit- wvw isn’t designed for me and my 10 friends vs you and your 10 friend vs someone else and their 10 friends… It’s designed to hosts hundreds of players… These are not private pvp server maps, they are mass pvp community maps…

WvW was less about massive zergs and massive PvP then it was a command and control game. It was designed in much the same image as RvR in much older games. Large scale fights are a desired side effect however it was not supposed to be a scaled up PvP much. When you start exceeding a party group for size it becomes less and less about skill and more of just a numbers game. So someone voting NO and sticking with original intent is not a bad thing, its just a difference of opinion. Unfortunately going for the last few years with no real focus on WvW has allowed this illusion that it is all about massive zergs and nothing should matter other then bags and fights. Original idea was you and your group of 10, along with a few other groups of 10 could spread out and try to take a map, coming together for a few random large fights and going about there own way on the map when they where done. Unfortunately there are no groups of 10 anymore.

Umm the original intent was to create a space for hundreds of players to do mass pvp…

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/World_versus_World

“World versus World (also known as WvW) is a Player versus Player game mode where players from three different servers, or worlds, battle in the Mists. It features open-world combat on five large maps with up to several hundreds of players per map.”

Is this a real debate?

I’m pretty worried that the future of wvw is going to be decided by players who do not even know their own game…

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dnOhMeYxhRM

Liston.9708:

Swagger.1459:

Liston.9708:

@swagger – who are you to tell others their vote is wrong? some like 10 man blob versus 10 man blob instead of 30 v 30. The old way (non-linked) offered both options…..

And who are the players voting no because they don’t like to see mass pvp happen in a zone primarily designed for mass pvp?

So the future of mass pvp is going to be decided by players who don’t like mass pvp, but want to run in mass pvp zones without mass pvp?

That is YOUR idea what wvw is. Others may think it is something else. Difference is, I am not telling you that you are wrong. People can vote based on their own vision of what it should be and let the chips fall where they fall.

I will just leave you this – pretty rude telling others they are wrong though because their opinion is different than yours.

The design of wvw was the DEVS idea of creating a space for mass amounts of players…

Spvp is the space for small amounts of players…

funghetto.1584:

thoughts from a player LOW tier server (Fissure Of Woe):

INTERESTING those 3-4 weeks in the linking – with Gunnars Hold -

good things:
have people to do something at any time.

not so good things:
more casuals that do wvw
more zergs vs zergs
(that on tier 8-9 never happened – by the way ZERG is generally 40-50++ people)

i happily say no.
it wont balance population and wont solve this issue.

Anet posted that there was an increase of people playing Wvw?
i say mainly for the reward track….

(was more active on Fow doing stuff than in this linking)

regards.

Bolded…

Funghetto votes no because (s)he doesn’t like casual players and zergs…

So the person who doesn’t like casual players and zergs in wvw is going to help decide the future of pvp zones designed for zergs primarily?

That is a selfish vote for those reasons provided.

That no vote is akin to players voting for spvp to be for 1v1 because they like spvp, but they don’t like 5v5… And these votes count, they are not just “opinions” anymore.

Edit- wvw isn’t designed for me and my 10 friends vs you and your 10 friend vs someone else and their 10 friends… It’s designed to hosts hundreds of players… These are not private pvp server maps, they are mass pvp community maps…

Liston.9708:

@swagger – who are you to tell others their vote is wrong? some like 10 man blob versus 10 man blob instead of 30 v 30. The old way (non-linked) offered both options…..

And who are the players voting no because they don’t like to see mass pvp happen in a zone primarily designed for mass pvp?

So the future of mass pvp is going to be decided by players who don’t like mass pvp, but want to run in mass pvp zones without mass pvp?

funghetto.1584:

swaggler, which part of this sentence isnt clear?

interesting isnt LIKE IT. neither LOVE IT.

“its INTERESTING this linking. AS fow player, never saw fights 30+ vs 30+. cute, interesting, but i dont like them, ok?”

then, read well what Depraved Ambience.7942 said and i agree on what he said.

“So, this is what is wrong with democracy.
The majority should never, ever be allowed to decide what happens to a minority! Do I really need to bring up historical examples of why this is bad?
I know it’s just a silly game, but this is honestly the worst thing that has happened to WvW ever and is totally ruining my enjoyment of the mode, and tier 8 players are quitting in droves because of linking – our guilds are dying. ANet, your solution to “fix” the population is to make people leave and to ruin friendships and communities?! Do better!”

but HEY! all Gw2 community is voting. so means that 90% of ppl voting are pvers.

the gw2 community can say yes – no. depends on how much time or interest they find in a game mode, right?

im part of the Wvw community of Gw2 (a minority community) and i say NO.

wont change my mind.

“Your vote was a selfish vote and hurts the mass pvp community.”

and ppl voting that they never do wvw??? LOOOOOOOOOL

WvW is for mass pvp.

You don’t like mass pvp.

“its INTERESTING this linking. AS fow player, never saw fights 30+ vs 30+. cute, interesting, but i dont like them, ok?”

You don’t like mass pvp in a mass pvp zone so you vote no…

I’ll let you think about that…

Edit- Go support this idea if you want a wvw that also has maps designed for solo and small scale stuff…

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Suggestion-Living-WvW-updated/first

funghetto.1584:

Swagger.1459, i will try explaining things again.

that post is MY opinion, not majority.

as i said in other threads of merging-linking- call it however u like. im from FOW.
then Anet can decide to put me in Piken – gandara – rof or wherever. and I can decide if to play more or not- correct until here?

its INTERESTING this linking. AS fow player, never saw fights 30+ vs 30+. cute, interesting, but i dont like them, ok?

so, seeing i dont like them much, i say no to linking.

and as i said before, linking-merging 2-3-4-5 servers together WONT FIX THE BALANCE POPULATION ISSUE.

Your opinion now counts for voting… You want to run around a huge map designed for MASS warfare but you don’t want mass warfare… That’s what spvp is for… Makes ZERO sense at all.

Linking is better than what we had before.

Honestly, if some of you like roaming or solo or small scale stuff and can’t handle players in mass playing on a map designed for mass gameplay… Please go to spvp and fill your small scale needs.

Your vote was a selfish vote and hurts the mass pvp community.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/World_versus_World

“World versus World (also known as WvW) is a Player versus Player game mode where players from three different servers, or worlds, battle in the Mists. It features open-world combat on five large maps with up to several hundreds of players per map.”

funghetto.1584:

thoughts from a player LOW tier server (Fissure Of Woe):

INTERESTING those 3-4 weeks in the linking – with Gunnars Hold -

good things:
have people to do something at any time.

not so good things:
more casuals that do wvw
more zergs vs zergs
(that on tier 8-9 never happened – by the way ZERG is generally 40-50++ people)

i happily say no.
it wont balance population and wont solve this issue.

Anet posted that there was an increase of people playing Wvw?
i say mainly for the reward track….

(was more active on Fow doing stuff than in this linking)

regards.

So correct me if I’m wrong…

You like world vs world vs world and are happy there are people playing, but you are unhappy that casuals play and there is mass warfare going on so you voted no?

If your answer is yes, then you should go to spvp because it’s not sensible to think these huge maps should be about a handful of players playing. Honestly, go find a team and 5v5…

I’m not trying to be disrespectful, but this type of mentality makes zero sense. These zones were created for mass warfare and some like you are voting no because more players are playing and zergs are present in a maps designed for zergs first and foremost…

Again, hang out in spvp because that’s designed for small scale fights.

Reverence.6915:

The thing with those builds is that they don’t do damage and have very little chasing power. It’s really easy to walk away from them.

Still annoying and still shouldn’t be possible though.

Of course they do damage… and can kill opponents.

Stealth on Thief and Mez is too much. We need to get away from stealth in general, limit it to long cool down emergency use slot skills or elites, and make profession improvements.

hobotnicax.7918:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjCBJ40Gwko

Yet other classes keep getting nerfed… good stuff Anet.

I like the devs, I like GW2, but the decision makers DO NOT CARE to make profession and combat development a priority. AT ALL. Our characters and the combat experience are SUPPOSED to be THE most important aspects, but they are given the least amount of effort… GW2 COULD be the most kick butt fantasy combat game out there, but that potential is being completely wasted.

4 years it takes to even touch ranger sword and it wasn’t an improvement… Sad.

Thousands of threads from players begging for stealth changes and condition changes and class balance and more build diversity and GOOD roles and not clunky support designs and to fix pets and TONS of stuff, yet NOTHING.

I like you devs, but being able to cast on the move and having good targeting are not enough… Half of the profession skill comes from fiddling with the combat bar and completely different controls per profession… Nobody wants prefabricated profession difficulty scaling, players want base level designs and uniqueness through skills, not funky mechanics… Players want to play various roles… Players don’t want a forced spvp meta, they want the devs to give the players the tools to play and have fun… Players want to have a smooth “twitch” combat experience, but with all the reticle skills in place of targeted aoe skills and swaps and having 75% of skills on 25s – 1 min ++ cool downs and all the movement imparing conditions raining down… It’s just not good.

You should post this on Reddit and send it to the Wooden Potato guy so we can finally start a dialog about profession and combat development.

McKenna Berdrow.2759:

A message from the WvW Team,
The next WvW Poll is up!
https://feedback.guildwars2.com
Please share your thoughts and feedback on the poll in this thread!

Dear McKenna and Tyler,

I have a message to share that answers all our wvw needs!

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Suggestion-Living-WvW-updated/first

Please share your thoughts and feedback in that thread!

You’re welcome!

This is too easy to exploit, it’s a no go.

tym.3791:

As a mesmer, never had a problem with them. They try to gank me, I simply drop radiation field right on top of me, and throw the conditions right back at em, and I have thrown moa at em, thats fun to do. So I never worry about em, and if all else fails, I simply stealth out myself, and poof im gone.

This is kind of funny to read

15 second duration aoe that damages and breaks stealth… Unbreakable Moa for 6 seconds that prevent further stealth… Access to stealth to escape if all else fails…

Easy peazy

On a serious note, the continuous mid combat stealth design is not good. It is also the Achilles heel for thief, and to a lesser degree Mesmer, when broken.

I think we need to start moving away from stealth in general, and limit access to emergency use slot skills only. This would allow for profession improvements in other ways.

For PvE if you want to do some damage and heal- Make a condition/heal build.

Tell your party to stand still and heal them. If they are not in your heal zone and die say “I’m sorry, but you have to be in my heal radius.”. If you don’t have heals ready because of the gated CA and players die just say “I’m sorry, my heals are gated and couldn’t heal you at the time because I didn’t have access to CA.”.

Enjoy Druid!

Here is a handy dandy video that explains the awesomeness of healing on a Druid…

Budman.2934:

Swagger.1459:

Sich.7103:

I agree with you that it could be good to have change in WvW..
But what to do ?
The 3 factions way have 1 big issue : there is no diplomacy at all.
I mean you can’t choose your ally or ennemy. This issue is on other mmo like TESO.

This issue mean that you can’t do anything against troll or spy. And this remove a lot of the game… Like alliance, or relation between guild / players to be neutral / ally or ennemy…

And yes we are stuck on the same map, every day… The “living” wvw can at least bring more map, and inter connected map… Then you have more the feeling to “conquer” ennemy territory or defend your home. But to be really interesting you need a lot of map. And probably system when the map is not connected to ally map then you can’t use WP, you loose some bonus…
If you go in ennemy territory you should have penality to not push to far…

I have no idea how to resolve all those issue with the GW2 engine.

But for sure, “living www world” is not mega server like eotm… EOTM is random linking every week. We need to be able to see the same people on our side to learn to play together. Random linking is not good for that.

I think if the devs come up with a good story we could make this happen. Guild Wars lore is pretty rich so they can take many things from it. The Mists also prove a place of possibilities without breaking any lore either.

For me personally, I don’t see anything wrong with rotating factions or players choosing factions to represent either depending on how it’s done. But story first.

I agree with some but not all of your suggestion adding a little bit of story and Lore to wvw would be great it would atleast break some of the mundane fighting and add a little bit of Diversity to the game but I would not like to add PVE content to the game I hope you understand that it would need to be strictly PVP related content

Thanks for the reply.

This wvw model caters to different players and play styles so that’s a great feature. For this suggestion there are 8 PvP maps that have the tradition feel and are designed for mass pvp gameplay. The PvE/PvP maps cater to players that like the “PvP server” style, and my thought was to have maps that are designed for solo and small group play. PvE maps are a good draw to get players into the mists and are designed to support scoring as well.

I feel that getting more players involved and giving more play options is a good thing.