Unlike other traited invulns, endure pain will not stop ur health at 20%. If ur at 21% health and get spiked to 0 endure pain won’t do anything. To make matters worse it seams like it still triggers meaning it goes on cd
Warrior isn’t hopeless but anet doesn’t seem to understand that they have made warriors a support class that doesn’t have any way to survive long enough the support anyone
For pvp warriors just need some way to survive. All they have is stances which is only short duration. With the bezerker stance change its even worse cause boon strip removes resistance and then condi eats u alive
Anet has always tied major warrior attributes to trait. Weather that be spreading out traits into places where u can’t get them all or making things that should just be base line a “must have” trait. This particular case is similar to fast hands. You don’t need it but with the short cd on warrior weapons it hurt to not have it. Same with beserker. If you are gonna run a berserker build (and really y wouldnt u) you don’t have to run the trait but it’s gonna hurt ur build
So right now warrior melee is kinda kitten. Ur better off with a range weapon as ur main weapon. Melee weapons r mostly for utility like mobility on gs and sword or stuns with mace and shield
Lb auto being 2 hits is part of it. If you r blind or foe has ageis the 1 arrow will still hit. Plus crit hit can proc with either arrow and and when traited it can apply 2 stacks of burn
Wow the forum ate my huge long post. I’m not retyping that. Anyway, I’ll do the TLDR version.
In PVE warrior is not a low skill cap class anymore. Thats an outdated stereotype. To achieve great DPS a warrior needs to manage berserk, stick and move, and berserkers power while simultaneously having a good DPS rotation and not dying. The gap between a guy who just installed the game 3 weeks ago and copied the meta build and a pro warrior who manages all the conditional buffs is greater than 50%. A good warrior in an organized group with full buffs using the meta build could make 15k dps easily. A bad warrior who doesn’t manage his buffs properly will struggle to make 10k. I’d say that’s a good indication that there is a raised skill cap and there is a big reward for getting there, which is very good for the class.
100% true. Even before the patch when warrior was a lower skill cap people would said warrior was too easy to play didn’t know how to use one. I would ask them what to do and they would say drop banners and use 100b on cd. People think of warrior as nothing more than a suprot class and while it’s does offer a lot of support it also dishes out high dps. Nike say 15k which I can belive with the bezerker buff.
I think warrior has the utility to be good but the problem is we need to use all our utility on survival. People say warrior are the tankiest class class cause they have highest health and armor which is complete bull kitten. People who say that have no clue. In pvp armor means very little. Vitality means a bit but on demand heals mean more (ele/gaurdians ) . Almost every class can out tank a warrior while out classing their dps in a tank spec. People complain about endure pain but u never hear anything about mist form. People complain about gs mobility but never complain about thief or mesmer insta get out of jail free skills. Warrior has 3 blocks total , no one skill giving complete invulnerability , no good spike heal unless ur in a healing spec and no blink, stealth, teleport and only 1 blind
Every meta group will still have a warrior. Nothing can match the combination of might stacking, banners and dps. Some people say rev can but it can’t. To have that level of support you have to camp dragon stance which is a huge dps loss that puts they way behind warrior is dps and still doesn’t match warrior team buffing.
Shin has some points but I think he’s been just too used to Warrior being OP and pines for the old days.
I’d rather see other classes nerfed before Warrior getting buffed into the stratosphere to match all the chronomancers/dragon hunters/eles/heralds/scrappers out there.
Op? When? I can think of one build that I would let u say is op and that is the old shout bow. Even that wasn’t any more op than dd ele so was it really op? Yeah hambow was great but not OP. Eviscerate builds? Op only with if people don’t no how to dodge/blind/block
I gotta side with Nike. While a rev can stack 25 might they have a hard time maintaining it plus it’s a large personal dps loss. Warrior on the other hand has little problem maintaining 25 stacks (with right stuff) while have a much less dramatic drop in personal dps. The main thing u have to remember about warrior might stacking is that with Phalanx Strength the warrior doesn’t have to do a bunch of fancy things ro team stack might. Just attacks on most mobs/bosses while using heal skill ( restorative strength ) and signet of rage as needed. Even in fights where u need to range they still have resorative and signet of rage plus fire field and 4 blast finishers (lb 3, 2 banners and banner 5) add in a sigil of strength on the LB (with a double chance to proc on auto attack) and u can still maintain a healthy amount of might
Warrior has been falling into a bad spot for a while now. Even in pve they r brought more as a need than a want. The banners + ea make them non replaceable at this point epically when u add in might stacking. In pvp they r in a really bad spot. Axe/shield gs is still the best build without elite spec which means everyone else got stronger but warrior stayed the same. Seeing as how they were border line class before the patch this just completely left them on the outside. In wvw they r nothing more than a cc and banner but even there the talk is to just replace them with gaurdians as the mass poison fields make banner less useful. Only place it see warrior really shine is in open world where they inflict so massive burn on large mobs with scorched earth. Now I’m not saying classes haven’t been in these situations before but warrior is getting close to what ranger was for a long time, bad in pvp,wvw and dungeon was frost sprit / spotter or gtfo.
All this being said I don’t believe warrior is beyond repair. The elite spec is a condi spec weather anet likes it or not that’s what the made. Now the need to buff warrior condi to get it close to engi and necro is the want it to be viable. I don’t think it would be hard to do. Perhaps a trait that buffs bleed damage by 50% or or make cripple deal damage or inflict bleed when applied.
Banners last 4o seconds have 30 sec cd and follow you . Add to banner trait : banners give a pulsing buff , Strength give 3 stacks of might , discipline give fury, tatics gives regen , defense give protection, battle standard give 3 stacks might and 2 stacks stability
Fair enough answer I guess but with the all or nothing trait lines it doesn’t matter as much what level things r at so much as what they compete with in their tier
I made my calculations more so to find the increased team dps a class gives out. But I can see how counting vuln for each class can scew thing. I guess might/vuln/fury need to be more of a “what brings these things while still being good personal dps”
My new build guide will be up soon™ but here is a 1 min dps rotation clip. This rotation with Str, Tac, Bers is about 15% better DPS than Str, Arms, Tac.
I’m curious as to how these numbers are figured. Is the dps rotation done assuming max might/vuln. How much does it factor pesonal dps to team dps buff? Does it change depending on team comp?
For warrior it’s easy. Record a rotation, calculate how many coefficients are done in that time frame. Plug the number into the damage formula with whatever buffs you want to assume for might/vuln etc and get a result. Classes with condi damage require a lot more work, but we have tools for that too.
For what its worth, when DnT says a dps number the buffs we assume are: 25 Might, 25 vuln, banners, fury, empowered allies and assassins presence since those are the buffs you would get in a meta group ideally.
I see y my numbers differed. I was adding in vuln from arms line as a "dps increase "
My new build guide will be up soon™ but here is a 1 min dps rotation clip. This rotation with Str, Tac, Bers is about 15% better DPS than Str, Arms, Tac.
I’m curious as to how these numbers are figured. Is the dps rotation done assuming max might/vuln. How much does it factor pesonal dps to team dps buff? Does it change depending on team comp?
I think in open world pve bezerker is fine but the numbers still come out with arms on top. That being said it’s not a huge different with the math I got and in fights where have some disconnect it might pull even with riffle
Are anet now promoting two guilds by name? Having guilds mentioned like this will inadvertently give them a large pool of new players wanting to join, which seems to be a thing that Anet has previously avoided. I don’t even remember if they ever named a guild before in a official message.
I think most people know dnt. Attuned maybe not. I also don’t think a lot of people r gonna rush to join just because. I’m pretty sure both already have their teams set for it
Warrior dps is kinda meh compared to a lot of others but when u can put out mass team dps buff u don’t really need top personal dps
Actually not quite true unless you’re talking about a phalanx strength warrior. If you run a build that actually strives to maximise personal damage, warrior has extremely high burst and very high sustained damage.
Unless I’ve done my math wrong. Strength arms tatics is max dps. PS can be added or removed and have to effect on personal dps. I guess fast hands might b a touch more but I fide it hard to belive it can make up the 7%-8% loss from tatics
Physical skill r unused mostly because warrior need defensive utility skills to survive in pvp. Which means stances and shouts. U can get away with 1 offensive skill with is where builds with frenzy and bulls charge come in
There r so many thing they can add to factal for new levels. They could just add gw1 missions to them if they want an easy way out. Last prophecies mission would be a perfect fit for a fractal. Shiro and abandon would be nice boss fractals.
PLEASE nerf the Gun Flame damage, or limit it to 2 (maybe 3) targets. It is absolutely game-breaking in WvW, in both zerg and organised guild play. The ability to pop off instant 6-15k AOE damage (depending on if you hit train or casters) 3 times in short succession, with no way to avoid it (Signet of Might) aside from psychic dodge is completely broken in a large scale setting. It is already under ban-hammer consideration in accordance with GvG honor rules (sharing the Hall of Shame with things such as Venom Share).
As fun as it is to play, as a long term DPS warrior fan, I will be abandoning ship if this goes live and actively campaigning for its removal (for whatever good that’ll actually do). It is way too strong in its current state.
Wait I thought they removed wvw. Or was they just don’t remember they have it. Serious note. I can see how broke that can be
I’d be surprised if anyone felt warrior was in a bad place right now. It’s probably in the best place it’s been for a long time, though not the top of the heap in terms of pvp or dueling.
If you’re all about pve, then I don’t think anybody claims warrior’s bad. If anything, people from other classes sometimes post here upset that warriors are invited to every dungeon party (well, one, for the sake of Phalanx Strength). But that’s about it.
Non-dungeon pve… well, that’s pretty much faceroll easy for everything, don’t you think? And it’s not like it matters if one class is more powerful than another because, well, the npcs get crushed regardless.
Warrior dps is kinda meh compared to a lot of others but when u can put out mass team dps buff u don’t really need top personal dps
I don’t think warriors complain about being underpowered half as much as other classes complain about us being overpowered. With that being said , I don’t think warrior is in a great sport in pvp but we r still competitive.
So there seams to be an issue with endure pain. You can activate the skill but still be vulnerable for up to 1 second. I have had this issue multiple times and have also heard from other people experiencing this same issues.
120 toughness isn’t much. Like 5% reduction (I don’t wanna do the math right now for exact). That means instead of a 7k backstab u only get a 6,650 backstab.
If u r going for a condi build u won’t take strength any ways. If u r going for a dps build ,even disregarding PS then strength, arms tatics is still the max team dps. If u r the second warrior then yes u can drop tatics for beserker
A healing banner would make for some bizarrely interesting play.
Strong heal at onset, pulse healing for self and allies.
…but keep the duration (and probably shorten the cooldown). Basically, mingle banner options plus quasi-signet healing. Have Banner 2 be a slightly more powerful standard heal on a 15 second cooldown. (…that anyone can use. o_O)
PvP would be hilarious for trying to keep people away from the banner. :P But with HoT coming, I would totally use it. Totes.
Banner cd starts as soon as it is cast so only have a 10 second down time
Elite stance: (power stance revised) kao-kien- 6 sec 60 cd – consume all adrenaline. Gain 1 stack of over-charge (+250 to all stats +25% boon duration and condi duration ) 1 sec of 2 stability per second. Gain 1 stack of over charge for each bar or adrenaline consumed
Elite shout: "I will survive " 60 cd. Gain 10 sec of resistance, super speed, 10 stability. Gain 1000 toughness. Stun break
There are a few warrior skills with weird delays. Rush, whirlwind attack even endure pain (which is an instant cast). The answer is probaly a bug but anet hasn’t said or done anything with any of those skill so we don’t really know for sure
So I thought it would be fun to come come up with skills to fill the gaps in warrior skills like elite shout and stance , physical and banner heal skill
Physical heal: Meding- just make it scale with physical trait already in place
Banner heal: Banner of life- small pulsing aoe heal (100 base) every second plus 5k heal on activation. 20 second duration 30 second cd. 2 skill is a 2k heal on 5 second cd (maybe a bit strong but it is replacing a heal skill)
Elite stance: power stance: +300 power, precision, ferocity, vitality, toughness, condi damage, healing power, +30% condi duration and boon duration for 4 seconds. 80 second cd
Elite shout : “I have the power” – +5% damage and condi damage and quickness for 10 seconds. 60 second cd
I think u kinda need to have pre set skills when u have the ability to the change to 5 new skills with the touch of a button. Plus u can have 5 different legends to choose from so there is some diversity
Even without PS if there is only 1 warrior u should take tatics for EA. EA is about a 5%-6% dps increase per person. So pretend everyone is doing the same dps. That means a warrior would have to raise personal dps about 33% to make up for not taking EA. Fator un empower with is gonna be a 3% average dps increase it means beserker would have to increase personal dps by about 36% to be better than tatics. My math put it at about 12%-15% . Arms is actually the closer trait line to be server dps. A warrior can hold about 3-4 stacks of vuln by just having the arms trait line. Using the same logic as we did with EA puts arms about 17% for vuln, 5% from bleeding foes plus maybe another 1% for the other various traits (did not run the math on signet mastery ) so let’s just say 23% is the dps gain. That still puts it ahead of beserker at 15%. For fun let’s do strength. We get 10% for GS trait, 10% from 3rd minor trait , and 20% for GM trait. That’s 40% . So as u can see beserker trait line isn’t worth taking unless u r the second warrior. Then u can drop tatics
PS: if someone else has done the math on this and it doesn’t line up with my calculations please post what u came up with.
1) Almost any condi profession performs better that a condi warrior
2) Almost any power warrior build performs better than a Condi warrior build
Surely, Berserker performs better that the typical S/S LB builds do nowadays but generally I don’t think its performance is the same or at least close to a GS warrior to actually call it “a viable alternative”.
Even though I didn’t spent enough time on a Berserker during BWE#3 (I did so in BWE#2 thought), I believe that the design of the Sword main-hand skills is lacking in terms of damage. This hampers the overall performance of the Sword/Torch combo.
Why? Simply because most other professions can inflict lots of stronger condis (torment, confusion) even with their main-hand weapon skills! The sword instead inflicts the weakest damaging condition (bleeding) for long durations but in a not-so-great quantity, which means its easy to be cleansed and even if you don’t do that immediately the damage it inflicts is relatively lower than any other condi.
Apart from that, a condi warrior has to stand at melee range half of the time to inflict condis while having less defensive means (no evades, no blinds, no protective boons).
Conclusion? The Berserker is an improvement over traditional Condi Warr but is way behind Condi Mesmers and Well behind Power Warriors. Berserker is a fun thing to play for a change but no way it can be an alternative to a power warrior, at least at its current state.
I don’t think it is an upgrade. U either have to sacrifice defense traits like endure pain , dogged march, last stand, cleansing ire, or shield mastery. Arms traits for bonus condi damage (the trait name alude me at this time ) or signet mastery which is there is a solid signet condi build that make it work really well. Or u give up tatics which u lose burning arrow and leg specialist.
