Guild Wars 2

Nokaru.7831:

Vayne.8563:

In some ways, the old way was more artificial than the new way because it was always split up, but before it was by levels.

You weren’t paying attention at all to how Queensdale and the human personal story flowed together if you think that. I don’t know how you can call the new way less artificial when they lumped them together into arbitrary chapters, when they were originally designed to be done as the player was progressing through Queensdale.

There’s an awful lot of backtracking with the new way now. For example: A level 10 player will have already finished with the Bandithaunt Cavers, (level 5 area) but the Personal Story will take the player back there at around level 11. Before, you’d just go there at (surprise, surprise) level 5 when it was level appropriate. But hey, that was more artificial!

I was paying tons of attention since I’ve done the story more than a dozen times. Put it this way.

Spoilers below.

First there are bandits who are being aided by someone on the council. We foil their plans, then investigate them. In the past, this ended at chapter 10.

Then, we got a message from Logan to begin the second part of our story which was, survey says, completely unrelated. That is to say, we were told that they found some information about my parents…or my sister…or some other thing, that had nothing at all to do with the first ten levels.

I know this because the first ten levels is based on one choice you make during character creation…that’s the story that ended at level 10 and the second ten levels, the story that ended at level 20, was the story based on a second choice you make during character creation.

Logically since there are three choices for each, they can’t be directly linked.

But by then there’s a third story which has nothing to do with EITHER story. It’s the story introducing you to the orders, which ended at level 30 when you chose one of them.

Maybe you weren’t paying as much attention as you thought.

In some ways, the old way was more artificial than the new way because it was always split up, but before it was by levels.

So in the old way I could finish a story and find myself 2-3 levels below the next story. So I have this important thing to do, but I have to stop in the middle and go help farmer Joe do something completely unrelated in order to level to get to that story instance. It completely took you out of the story.

Because the story was basically written in chapters, and because the second chapter doesn’t follow directly on the first chapter, there’s no reason why a pause can’t happen.

It’s like this. I was doing some stuff and finished it and a couple of weeks later, something else came up. That’s how it is now.

Before it was I was doing some stuff, I was in the middle of it and then, for no reason at all, I had to stop and level.

Me, I like this way better.

Titles aren’t put in the game not because it’s hard to make them. It’s because if you saturate the game with them they lose all meaning, much like achievements do.

People complain you get an achievement for everything. Titles are something you get periodically. They’re added fairly frequently. I’ve gotten at least a couple of new titles in the last month.

Anet could add 100 titles tomorrow.

But I think that would be a mistake.

Why do you have to wait in heart of the mists, can’t you queue from any zone?

I play a ton. I’m on the forums during breaks or after the guild goes to bed.

wasted.6817:

Meanwhile, that other game sporting 3.3mil sales on it’s latest expansion, hitting 10mil mark in subscription, which happened for the first time since …. i dunno, 4-5 years? If memory serves me right. What good expansion can do. I’am sure their cash shop sales doing MORE than great. xP

That other game follows a set of rules that no longer exist. You can’t go back in time and capture the bulk of the market share now. You had to be there at the time. You need the money from several other successful games also, to plunk into advertising.

Compared WoW to any other MMO simply doesn’t work.

Now if WoW had come out last year, it might be a different story.

A toggle would be a good option. And probably wouldn’t take much to program.

I want more too.

Edit: Got called away before I finished the thought. I don’t think an optional sub is the best way to go about getting it though.

Astralporing.1957:

Vayne.8563:

You need to be more specific dlonie. Don’t say will we ever see the content we need to play updated or expanded. Because no one is going to know what you need to play.

Doesn’t matter. I know what i want to play. What i am asking is for Anet to supply me with enough info so i can answer the question dlonie posted. Yes, of course i would like Anet to know what i want, and to supply it, but knowing if they supply it is equally important. Just as knowing, that anet has a consistent vision of the game, and that they have a plan and design for the future at all. Because at the moment i don’t even know that.

Nor do I, nor does anyone. You’ll never hear me say that Anet is providing enough information. I started a thread saying they need to communicate more and better.

My response was simply to clarify the question, because if Anet did answer it the way it was phrased it had loopholes the size of Montana.

Simzani.4318:

Vayne.8563:

You need to be more specific dlonie. Don’t say will we ever see the content we need to play updated or expanded. Because no one is going to know what you need to play.

People keep talking about significant updates. I think the updates, at least recently, have been significant. They’re significant to me. The updates you want to play probably wouldn’t be.

So in your request, instead of bolding a line with no detail, add the detail in the line.

Then again, ever is a very long time, so maybe you want to also put it in terms of six months or a year. I mean suppose you will see that content in five years. Anet could say yes, and they’d be within their rights to.

You need to be very specific. Which doesn’t mean you’ll get an answer.

No. Stop trying to derail the thread. We want to know what we can expect in the next 3 months / 6 months or next year, what they are working on that went for the concept phase, passed it and went to dev. Not what we want them to work for, there are millions threads about this.

My thread was perfectly on topic. This response is far more off topic than my response was.

In fact, I was asking for the request to have clarity so that any answer that came might be meaningful. By trying to correct that you’re actually derailing the thread.

That’s why you can redo it. The first time or two you fight it to learn the fight. Then you can attempt the achievement. There’s no reason for you to have to know it beforehand.

If you absolutely hate figuring it out for yourself, wait till it’s up on Dulfy and read what you have to do.

It’s working as intended.

Also you don’t have to do achievements alone. My guild usually does this stuff together and it’s much easier.

Those who insist on soloing are making a choice to accept the downsides of soloing.

You need to be more specific dlonie. Don’t say will we ever see the content we need to play updated or expanded. Because no one is going to know what you need to play.

People keep talking about significant updates. I think the updates, at least recently, have been significant. They’re significant to me. The updates you want to play probably wouldn’t be.

So in your request, instead of bolding a line with no detail, add the detail in the line.

Then again, ever is a very long time, so maybe you want to also put it in terms of six months or a year. I mean suppose you will see that content in five years. Anet could say yes, and they’d be within their rights to.

You need to be very specific. Which doesn’t mean you’ll get an answer.

Bran.7425:

Vayne.8563:

Bran.7425:

I would like to see real numbers on the PvE/PvP’s they talk about being a larger group than we think. Not just the ones they bribed with the rewards.

You don’t think dungeons bribe with rewards?

Perhaps, but they never tried to link increased dungeons rewards to state that increase in dungeon participation justifies further dungeon development.

They increased dungeon rewards significantly twice. Once with champ bags and once with adding the gold for each dungeon.

But also if you go to any thread that talks about getting gold, dungeons are one of the most recommended ways to get gold fast.

Increasing the reward isn’t really the issue.

People complained the content wasn’t repeatable. Could you imagine how it would be for people if everything was left in. The battle for Lion’s Arch, escape from Lion’s Arch the Nightmare Tower, the Marionette, the Scarlet Invasions…no one would know what was going on. Those sort of set pieces were possible because you could put them in and remove them…and it worked. Now it’s what people asked for. Repeatable content.

Which brings us to the new zones, which accompany the story and like Orr they’re locked in time.

You can’t really have it both ways. Anet listened to their fan base. I’d have preferred it the old way too.

Bran.7425:

I would like to see real numbers on the PvE/PvP’s they talk about being a larger group than we think. Not just the ones they bribed with the rewards.

You don’t think dungeons bribe with rewards?

Xillllix.3485:

Vayne.8563:

People can only say the living world isn’t content if they’re dismissing new zones as well. And new enemies with new mechanics. And new dynamic events.

A few months ago, everyone was saying new zones, new skills, new weapons, new classes, new races.

We’ve gotten two new zones, but everyone says the Living Story is a couple of hours.

If that’s all the play you can get from a new zone, no MMO is the world is going to be able to provide enough content.

I don’t think anybody here is questioning the quality of the new Silverwaste and Dry Top zones, these are quite outstanding. The issue has to do with implementation and re-playability. As I mentioned earlier, it is sad to have so much beautiful work going to the design of instances people will only play once through, while instead they could have been designed as replayable dungeons, and the living story as story modes for these dungeons. It wouldn’t diminish the quality of the living story at all, but we would also get permanent dungeon content.

Same with WvW, why not make a version of Silverwaste competitive? Anet has already shown us that you can support PvP in the open world.

The general feeling is that there is content made only for a specific type of player and not for the rest of the competitive/hardcore-PvE community.

How many people do you think only play through dungeons once? There are people who replay dungeons over and over again and consider them replayable. I’ve replayed dungeons over and over again too, but not because I enjoy them, or find them fun or engaging.

There are people who play through the open world over and over again, because they like it and find that replayable and dungeons not replayable.

I’m not sure that it’s a less numerous group. Dungeon runners (and in other game raiders) always think they’re so great in number, but I’ve seen no real evidence to support that.

Jerus.4350:

Vayne.8563:

People can only say the living world isn’t content if they’re dismissing new zones as well. And new enemies with new mechanics. And new dynamic events.

A few months ago, everyone was saying new zones, new skills, new weapons, new classes, new races.

We’ve gotten two new zones, but everyone says the Living Story is a couple of hours.

If that’s all the play you can get from a new zone, no MMO is the world is going to be able to provide enough content.

Not everyone plays for open world event stuff.

There are multiple parts of the game, focusing on only one and abandoning the rest is why many people are frustrated (btw, not using everybody/community)

I don’t want those things you said people were asking for, I just want more dungeons and maybe something in WvW as I’m primarily a dungeoneer and secondary being WvW. Open world stuff is where I go when I have nothing better to do and want to soak up some rewards for little to no effort.

So again, the question and point of this thread is to try and get ANet to let us know if we should give up, or should we hold out hope?

Nothing to do with what I said mate. I’ve seen again and again the words the living story content, as in the new updates are two hours of content.

If Anet introduced a new dungeon, even though I don’t prefer dungeons to other content, I wouldn’t say no content has been released, nor would I say an update has two hours of content if I did the dungeon once in two hours and never did it again.

It’s disingenuous, it’s unfair and it’s ignoring a lot of hard work and effort. Particularly seeing as how well the new update has been received.

I get that different people want different things. It’s no reason to dismiss what’s there because you don’t play it though.

There are plenty of children out in the world doing things. Children in caves preparing to have adventures. Charr cubs looking to prove their mettle by sneaking into haunted places. Even schools where saplings are taught in the Grove.

Gwen is far more important in your mind than she was in Prophecies, considering she only appeared in Pre and Prophecies is a long long game.

There were no main children characters in Factions, Nightfall or Eye of the North.

People can only say the living world isn’t content if they’re dismissing new zones as well. And new enemies with new mechanics. And new dynamic events.

A few months ago, everyone was saying new zones, new skills, new weapons, new classes, new races.

We’ve gotten two new zones, but everyone says the Living Story is a couple of hours.

If that’s all the play you can get from a new zone, no MMO is the world is going to be able to provide enough content.

Malkavian.4516:

Vayne.8563:

It’s really not a fast fix. I know why they wouldn’t want to revert it. It was changed for a reason.

It was a bad change because the way it was changed left you with all sorts of things out of context. It was a good change because of the situation in Orr.

Spoilers below:

The story of Orr is really two stories. It’s the story of Trahearne’s Wild Hunt to heal Orr and the story of your battle with Zhaitan.

In the old telling you did a bunch of stuff against Zhaitan and then there was a whole hiatus from your story while you ran off to do Trahearne’s story before getting back to your story.

This new way gets Trahearne’s story out of the way first. So your weakening of Zhaitan by cutting off his food supply, partially blinding him, crippling his ability to make undead directly precedes you’re encounter with him. It removes some of the bitter sting of Trahearne’s prevalence in your story while at the same time showing that the last fight with Zhaitan isn’t just a boss fight. You’ve been in fact fighting him for the last five or six missions and finally get to finish him off.

The Zhaitan fight is going to be anticlimatic no matter how you slice it. This way it’s less anticlimactic.

The problem with that is from the way it’s currently arranged, it’s very poorly and cheaply done. It’s like switching 2 chapters in a book where after you read Chapter 6, Chapter 7 is replaced by Chapter 8. It would take serious editing on Anet’s part to make the connection more seamless. Plus let’s not forget the missing instances related to the Greatest Fear.

Yes, I know this…I agree completely. I just think the serious editing would be worth it.

phys.7689:

Vayne.8563:

It’s really not a fast fix. I know why they wouldn’t want to revert it. It was changed for a reason.

It was a bad change because the way it was changed left you with all sorts of things out of context. It was a good change because of the situation in Orr.

Spoilers below:

The story of Orr is really two stories. It’s the story of Trahearne’s Wild Hunt to heal Orr and the story of your battle with Zhaitan.

In the old telling you did a bunch of stuff against Zhaitan and then there was a whole hiatus from your story while you ran off to do Trahearne’s story before getting back to your story.

This new way gets Trahearne’s story out of the way first. So your weakening of Zhaitan by cutting off his food supply, partially blinding him, crippling his ability to make undead directly precedes you’re encounter with him. It removes some of the bitter sting of Trahearne’s prevalence in your story while at the same time showing that the last fight with Zhaitan isn’t just a boss fight. You’ve been in fact fighting him for the last five or six missions and finally get to finish him off.

The Zhaitan fight is going to be anticlimatic no matter how you slice it. This way it’s less anticlimactic.

continuity errors tend to be more jarring than a story which moves around. Regardless the solution presented was pretty bad.

No argument here. I said it was bad the moment I tried it. I never said otherwise. I’m simply saying that reverting it isn’t necessarily the right answer, since in a lot of ways it was bad before too. It just takes more of a rework than they were apparently prepared to give it.

KarlaGrey.5903:

GW is a game of substance, of innovation done right, of ingenuity in its finest form, all of which helped create an unprecedented game experience few games can hold a candle to.

GW2, on the other hand, is but a game of fluff – an empty shell pretending to be something, while miserably sinking in the quagmire of superficiality together with the rest of the average, the mediocre, and the bad.

Here’s also one of my past posts which expresses my sentiments a little bit more precisely:

That special feel to the game, the emphasis on team work, competition, drama, game modes that make fun, a sense of belonging, guild halls, observer mode, variety, skills that do something, clear animations, no ugly redunant character races, beautiful character designs, armor/weapons that look great and got style, a pvp and pve that are/were worth while, a concept of pvp so kitten good yet so elusive that it apparently will never be captured again, the simplicity of it all and the depth hidden within, the epic music and pve story …

But ok, fine, the original doesn’t have dodging and stealthing… instead, it has body blocking, protection monks, domination mesmers, actual rangers, prekiting, less spam and more brain, no perma anything (in pvp, but pve should have followed suit) …

Guild Wars 1 was a game of builds which you could look up online and copy. You could have heroes run most of the game for you, even in hard mode, with a few elite content exceptions.

I could literally afk with premade builds, not play at all, and kill almost anything that wasn’t in an elite instance.

There was definitely depth for theory crafters, but you could get by on the tiniest bit of skill.

There was a guy I knew who did almost nothing but farm feathers on Shing Jea Island. He farmed feathers and bought runs through everything he wanted.

Definitely a lot of depth there.

Canakun.8031:

From my memory, you didn’t NEED to “grind out” (subjective) the titles, because they weren’t NEEDED for the content. It was the speed clear groups that wanted them. I remember DoA ursan runs…it was a form of speed clear, it wasn’t how the content was designed.

@ Vayne, just saying you’ve “played longer” than both of us doesn’t do anything for your point.

I said how long I played because the person I was answering said how long he played and for no other reason. I didn’t want anyone to assume I didn’t have the experience to form an opinion.

The only content in this game that requires ascended gear is high level fractals and those fractals were designed specifically for that reason.

And though the game itself didn’t require certain builds, players of the game most certainly did. If you didn’t have the build of the week, good luck finding a party to go into DOA or the Underworld with. As much as people complain about that in Guild Wars 2, this was far more prevalent in Guild Wars 1.

I love how people keep bringing up the Glass Door Reviews as some sort of negative. 72% of the employees would recommend Anet to a friend and 79% approve of the CEO. The reviews are varied. Some say the work is casual and some say that the company has an understanding of personal life vs work.

Yes, programmers do work hard, but there’s nothing to really imply 80 hours a week of labor or anything even close in those statements.

It’s really not a fast fix. I know why they wouldn’t want to revert it. It was changed for a reason.

It was a bad change because the way it was changed left you with all sorts of things out of context. It was a good change because of the situation in Orr.

Spoilers below:

The story of Orr is really two stories. It’s the story of Trahearne’s Wild Hunt to heal Orr and the story of your battle with Zhaitan.

In the old telling you did a bunch of stuff against Zhaitan and then there was a whole hiatus from your story while you ran off to do Trahearne’s story before getting back to your story.

This new way gets Trahearne’s story out of the way first. So your weakening of Zhaitan by cutting off his food supply, partially blinding him, crippling his ability to make undead directly precedes you’re encounter with him. It removes some of the bitter sting of Trahearne’s prevalence in your story while at the same time showing that the last fight with Zhaitan isn’t just a boss fight. You’ve been in fact fighting him for the last five or six missions and finally get to finish him off.

The Zhaitan fight is going to be anticlimatic no matter how you slice it. This way it’s less anticlimactic.

Jana.6831:

Vayne.8563:

The trait revamp wasn’t part of the NPE, which came later.

No, but the trait availability was further delayed with the NPE as far as I remember, at least grandmaster traits are, but I think the lower ones as well.

Ah okay..but getting them is still a royal pain in the kitten, whenever they unlock.

Edit: Actually I don’t think they were further delayed at all.

The trait revamp wasn’t part of the NPE, which came later.

When I look at my wallet, each of the boxes is huge. I’m not sure why they have to be that big. Making each of the boxes smaller, even 25% smaller would free up room to have the wallet take up the same amount of space without taking more.

I’d prefer to see currencies like badges and geodes in the wallet.

The whole reporting system has issues, even for just bug reporting. I report 2-3 bugs a week and almost never is there a subcategory for my complaint.

There needs to be a miscellaneous sub category, or other, for each of the main categories.

Duke Blackrose.4981:

Vayne.8563:

You way game A was better period.

Game B has a superior art direction (and graphics quality), as well as a fantastic dye and character customization system. Game B has a superior and more modern combat system thanks to dodging and a large number of mobile skills. I have acknowledged these (and will always acknowledge these) as improvements of this game, which you have seemed to miss, bringing that “lack of reading comprehension” once again full circle. If I were to truly dig for more minute advantages of the sequel over its predecessor, I could give some weight to its interesting Runes and Sigils, its multiple races (which, unfortunately, have also contributed to the lower number of armor sets and skill animations, thanks to their individualized requirements), and its highly flexible game engine, which has been used for a large number of interesting applications. Arguably, Season 2 of the Living Story has also demonstrated that Guild Wars 2 has the better potential direct storytelling, though I would currently give the edge for background lore to Guild Wars 1.

Where Game A is superior, however, is largely a matter of depth and versatility. A flexible, expansive build system that allowed for great amounts of specialization. Classes (here referring to both base classes and player-invented builds through combined classes) that had actual synergy and team-oriented design. A versatile assortment of PvP modes that covered a wide range of tastes with (usually high-quality) scenarios. It’s larger-scale PvP (here referring to Alliance Battles vs. World vs. World) was much more varied and interesting, thanks in large part to the viability of both split and zerg strategies. It’s high-end PvP scene was far superior. It had a wider range of viable endgame content (the very thing that the OP took the time to point out) because of the existence of Hard Mode, DoA, FoW, DoA, and a plethora of interesting Eye of the North dungeons.

I could keep going on about the advantages of Guild Wars 1, but I won’t. The point is pretty clear. Guild Wars 2’s advantages are largely in style, appearance, modern combat mechanics, and engine potential. Guild Wars 1 was the better game in terms of substance.

Truly, to make the best game of all time would be to combine these advantages. The depth and flexibility of Guild Wars 1’s build system and attributes with GW2 style runes and sigils – and trait trees that aren’t connected to a wretched, limiting stat system. Guild Wars 1’s approach to tier-free gear with Guild Wars 2’s incredible dye system. Guild Wars 2’s flexible engine with Guild Wars 1’s well-designed endgame content. Guild Wars 2’s combat system with the fantastic PvP modes of Guild Wars 1.

Unfortunately, that’s never going to happen. Because Arenanet can’t seem to acknowledge the glory of their previous creation, nor take its most valuable mechanics to improve their new game.

One man’s substance is another man’s trash.

You liked what was on offer there more than what is on offer here. You think that offering was more substantial.

But when I walked out into a zone in Guild Wars 1 I always knew exactly what I was going to face…where every drop down/pop up was. Every group of every creature. That to me is less depth…or a different kind of depth.

There are situations that occur in Guild Wars 2 that didn’t and couldn’t occur in Guild Wars 1. Yes, they’re different games.

And different people will like different things about each. The very things that made Guild Wars 1 a strong game were in my mind its biggest weaknesses.

Linken.6345:

Vayne.8563:

Linken.6345:

Annette.6278:

Dear Anet, wanna say thank you very much guys that you have fixed down camera!! It really helps me (and others) in fight. Keep on doing right things!
And thanks for amazing and very atmospheric Halloween event!

You mean the same halloween event we had 2013?
Im mean I dont dress up as the same thing every year so I expected the event to change aswell tbh

Real life isn’t a game. We had, in my family, almost the same exact Thanksgiving Day celebration every year. There might be some very minor changes (and there were some significant changes to rewards this year), but over all, it’s the same thing. It’s a tradition.

In Guild Wars 1, many holiday events were the same year after year, with maybe the exception of a certain reward).

The one thing in real life you don’t have to do every single Halloween is program stuff for a day. You buy or make another outfit. For some people that means an hour.

And that has nothing to do with the OP anyway. The OP is happy with the game and expressing thanks.

Guess i got spoiled from the changes from 2012 to 2013 and expected the same 2014 silly me

I understand having expectations. But judging a game on a single holiday instance, or even a couple just looks a bit disingenuous and certainly has nothing to do with the OP.

By the same token, there WERE changes this year, even if they weren’t changes to story, because this year the Labyrinth was far more profitable. The number of people farming it this year was a lot higher.

It was the same, sure, but it felt completely different. They also changes the maximum number of people in each labyrinth instance making it harder to have the same sized zerg.

munkiman.3068:

Vayne.8563:

Duke Blackrose.4981:

lordkrall.7241:

Ah the good old rose-tinted glasses seems to sell well these days.

People tend to complain about how much you need to grind in Guild Wars 2, and yet they complete disregard the massive amounts of grind needed for quite some stuff in Guild Wars 1.
Such as almost everything on this list.

Obsidian Armor is probably one of the most grindy things to get in any western game. DoA (Domain of Anguish) also required not only completion of the story mode, but also spending time grinding titles in order to get more or less required skills and a required title which protected against the enemies there.

As for the whole “huge chunk of added content every 6 months” that only ever happened ONCE during the time of the game. Between Faction and Nightfall. Between Prophecies and Factions it was almost exactly a year.
Between Nightfall and Eye of the North was little less than a year.

Grind is only worthy of criticism when it provides advantage.

Ascended Gear, for example, provides a statistical advantage on par with receiving a free 5% damage trait, a free 5% armor trait, and a free 5% boost to all of your attributes, as well as infusion slots that can also provide some stat boosts. It’s not enormous, but it is best-in-stat, and there is an undeniable large grind to receive some form of statistical advantage.

Obsidian armor, like all guild wars 1 armor sets, was purely aesthetic. There was no mandatory grind to it. It simply had a look (which any given player may or may not care for) and a connotation of prestige, no different from that of Legendary Weapons in Guild Wars 2.

When it comes to certain titles, you would have a somewhat more valid point. Performance boosting titles (like Lightbringer), did leave a somewhat bitter taste in mouth when they were introduced, as they represented small steps away from what Guild Wars was supposed to represent.

And there are no rose-tinted glasses here. I speak as someone who has put roughly 3k hours into each game. Guild Wars 1 was the better game with better skill and content design. Guild Wars 2’s improvements have largely been in the aesthetic and combat (dodging and mobile skills) departments, but even the value of the improved combat has been diminished by the game’s usage of one of the genre’s weakest skill systems.

You’re right. I don’t remember grinding Luxon or Kurzick points to make those skills more powerful. Or sunspear or light bringer skills. And no one ever spammed looking for Ursan rank 8. I don’t remember that at all.

Rose colored glasses are rose colored.

Yes, the games are very different. I’ve put more hours than you in both of them. One is better in some ways and one is better in other ways.

I did all the things in the original because they were fun and challenging, for the better part of 7 years. Not saying i didn’t get tired of doing the same stuff, i did. But the grind didn’t really feel like grind, since i enjoyed playing the content (sorrow furnace was a blast!). I’m not a big fan of how generic GW2 feels. The biggest improvement to GW2 IMO is the combat is more action like, the rest feels pretty generic (tries to cater to too many people) now though, stagnant almost. If it stays this way, i don’t see me playing 7 years down the road.

I understand what you’re saying. By the same token there are people who didn’t like Guild Wars 1 at all who really like Guild Wars 2. It’s a matter of what you enjoy.

The same sorts of things I enjoyed in Guild Wars 1 (for the most part) I enjoy in Guild Wars 2. That doesn’t mean everyone will feel like that.

But there are also things I could never go back to like not having a marketplace to sell things on. Like no jumping puzzles, which I love. Like having an open world where I can run into people instead of instances. Like swimming and going under water (which I also enjoy).

Both games have strengths and weaknesses and not everything will appeal to any one person.

Duke Blackrose.4981:

Vayne.8563:

Duke Blackrose.4981:

lordkrall.7241:

Ah the good old rose-tinted glasses seems to sell well these days.

People tend to complain about how much you need to grind in Guild Wars 2, and yet they complete disregard the massive amounts of grind needed for quite some stuff in Guild Wars 1.
Such as almost everything on this list.

Obsidian Armor is probably one of the most grindy things to get in any western game. DoA (Domain of Anguish) also required not only completion of the story mode, but also spending time grinding titles in order to get more or less required skills and a required title which protected against the enemies there.

As for the whole “huge chunk of added content every 6 months” that only ever happened ONCE during the time of the game. Between Faction and Nightfall. Between Prophecies and Factions it was almost exactly a year.
Between Nightfall and Eye of the North was little less than a year.

Grind is only worthy of criticism when it provides advantage.

Ascended Gear, for example, provides a statistical advantage on par with receiving a free 5% damage trait, a free 5% armor trait, and a free 5% boost to all of your attributes, as well as infusion slots that can also provide some stat boosts. It’s not enormous, but it is best-in-stat, and there is an undeniable large grind to receive some form of statistical advantage.

Obsidian armor, like all guild wars 1 armor sets, was purely aesthetic. There was no mandatory grind to it. It simply had a look (which any given player may or may not care for) and a connotation of prestige, no different from that of Legendary Weapons in Guild Wars 2.

When it comes to certain titles, you would have a somewhat more valid point. Performance boosting titles (like Lightbringer), did leave a somewhat bitter taste in mouth when they were introduced, as they represented small steps away from what Guild Wars was supposed to represent.

And there are no rose-tinted glasses here. I speak as someone who has put roughly 3k hours into each game. Guild Wars 1 was the better game with better skill and content design. Guild Wars 2’s improvements have largely been in the aesthetic and combat (dodging and mobile skills) departments, but even the value of the improved combat has been diminished by the game’s usage of one of the genre’s weakest skill systems.

You’re right. I don’t remember grinding Luxon or Kurzick points to make those skills more powerful. Or sunspear or light bringer skills. And no one ever spammed looking for Ursan rank 8. I don’t remember that at all.

Rose colored glasses are rose colored.

Yes, the games are very different. I’ve put more hours than you in both of them. One is better in some ways and one is better in other ways.

Again, the titles that I very clearly mentioned in my fourth paragraph. The singular design criticism I have for the first game. Dear lord, the blindness and lack of reading comprehension on these forums is astounding.

And, as I brought up in my next post, there was no Kurzick/Luxon skill grind until Nightfall came out and retroactively applied PvE skills to these titles. Actually, if memory serves, PvE skills may have come somewhat after the Nightfall release, not with it. Regardless, this was not a starting feature of Factions (which had been a beautiful campaign on its own), and it was a terrible update on par with Guild Wars 2’s own November 2012 Ascended update.

You can blame me for wearing rose-tinted glasses if you will. It’s better than the blind fanboyism you tend to show. At least there is an actual balance to the praises and criticisms that I tend to level against these games.

I said both games have strengths and weaknesses. Both games have things better about them. You way game A was better period.

Using the word fan boy to try to discredit a reasonable response doesn’t make your case any stronger.

Or is this one of those reading comprehension things you’re talking about.

Duke Blackrose.4981:

lordkrall.7241:

Ah the good old rose-tinted glasses seems to sell well these days.

People tend to complain about how much you need to grind in Guild Wars 2, and yet they complete disregard the massive amounts of grind needed for quite some stuff in Guild Wars 1.
Such as almost everything on this list.

Obsidian Armor is probably one of the most grindy things to get in any western game. DoA (Domain of Anguish) also required not only completion of the story mode, but also spending time grinding titles in order to get more or less required skills and a required title which protected against the enemies there.

As for the whole “huge chunk of added content every 6 months” that only ever happened ONCE during the time of the game. Between Faction and Nightfall. Between Prophecies and Factions it was almost exactly a year.
Between Nightfall and Eye of the North was little less than a year.

Grind is only worthy of criticism when it provides advantage.

Ascended Gear, for example, provides a statistical advantage on par with receiving a free 5% damage trait, a free 5% armor trait, and a free 5% boost to all of your attributes, as well as infusion slots that can also provide some stat boosts. It’s not enormous, but it is best-in-stat, and there is an undeniable large grind to receive some form of statistical advantage.

Obsidian armor, like all guild wars 1 armor sets, was purely aesthetic. There was no mandatory grind to it. It simply had a look (which any given player may or may not care for) and a connotation of prestige, no different from that of Legendary Weapons in Guild Wars 2.

When it comes to certain titles, you would have a somewhat more valid point. Performance boosting titles (like Lightbringer), did leave a somewhat bitter taste in mouth when they were introduced, as they represented small steps away from what Guild Wars was supposed to represent.

And there are no rose-tinted glasses here. I speak as someone who has put roughly 3k hours into each game. Guild Wars 1 was the better game with better skill and content design. Guild Wars 2’s improvements have largely been in the aesthetic and combat (dodging and mobile skills) departments, but even the value of the improved combat has been diminished by the game’s usage of one of the genre’s weakest skill systems.

You’re right. I don’t remember grinding Luxon or Kurzick points to make those skills more powerful. Or sunspear or light bringer skills. And no one ever spammed looking for Ursan rank 8. I don’t remember that at all.

Rose colored glasses are rose colored.

Yes, the games are very different. I’ve put more hours than you in both of them. One is better in some ways and one is better in other ways.

Xillllix.3485:

Devildoc.6721:

the real economy in GW2 is in the insider trading, people who know what’s going to be the hot items the week before the patch hits and buys up everything so they can control the prices. They know because they’re privileged testers, or friends of anet employees. It’s “acceptable” because it’s just a game, but if the TP were a real stock market? Everyone participating would be in jail, as insider trading is illegal.

So.. I hate GW2’s economy.

Look at the price of T6 right now, it’s 4 times what it used to be because of all the nerfs they did to the Orr region. It was nice before to go there to farm t6 for your legendary, now I haven’t gone there in almost a year.

You may be right, but the new zones drop T6 better than Orr ever did. The price going up has a lot more factors than just the availability of T6 mats. For example, the amount of items that require T6 mats and general inflation.

I understand what the OP is saying. I played Guild Wars 1 for well over five years and I did the “end game” instances maybe once or twice each.

A lot of people PvPed only and never entered PvE at all. A lot of people just hung out in the world and did missions.

I enjoyed vanquishing and achievements.

End game made Guild Wars 1 great for a percentage of the playerbase, but only Anet knows what percentage of the playerbase that was…however, I strongly suspect that if most people were running DOA or the Underworld, then we would have gotten more of that in Guild Wars 2. I can’t prove it, but it makes sense to me.

HHR LostProphet.4801:

Vayne.8563:

Kveldulf.7605:

Vayne.8563:

People keep using words like what the player base wants. Some people think the “player base” wants new dungeons. I’m sure that’s true for a percentage of the playerbase, but I’m not so sure it’s true for the player base as a whole.

People talk about people logging in or not logging in. They may not be logging in but plenty of people seem to be.

The living story is hit and miss. On a well liked chapter, people log in more. The recent chapter has seen a lot of activity in my guild and on maps as well.

I think people should talk for themselves instead of “the community”. Because I don’t think this community speaks with one voice.

sigh

No offense Vayne but I often see those posts from you in threads that I like.
Not the first time I saw you claiming that some people are using the word “community” when talking about things that they want to see, either.

Let me try to explain this to you as easy as I can:

x = the community of this game
y = Individuals (some claiming to be the “community” some not)
f = factor (In this case the amount of people)

=> x = f* y

so…even if we pretend that there are only 20 ppl here (in this particular thread) that are claiming that they know what the community wants, and (not even close) 10 ppl that share your opinion, => f = 20-10

Don’t you see?
We ARE the community! All of us! Some don’t care about where this game is going. Most people do care and want to know.

I am really not offending you! I just have the impression that you can’t see the meaning of the word “community”

Sorry but this isn’t close to true. When people say they’re speaking for the community, there’s an implication that the community as a whole wants something. There have been many pro mount threads, but no one would say the community as a whole wants mounts. It’s POSSIBLE a majority of the community does want them, but saying the community wants it because 10 people or 20 people or 30 people want it is wrong. In the case of mounts it’s particularly wrong because a large percentage of the community is against them? How many? I don’t know.

And that’s the point. I don’t know. So I’m not going to come in here and talk “for the community”. That’s a way of trying to make it look like you have numbers to support you.

When someone says people in the community want more dungeons, well…people in the DUNGEON community probably do. But that doesn’t mean everyone or even most people want it.

So now we have the question. If you’re not speaking for everyone and only your small demographic what does adding the words “the community” add to your argument?

At best, they add nothing to the argument. At worst, they’re misleading.

I’m part of the community too, and people sure as hell aren’t talking for me… most of the time anyway.

Seriously, what do you want?
If you’re ok with the game, if you like the living story, if you enjoy the NPE changes then be happy and let the rest be. I for one am not happy with the current game, in my mind this game has barely evolved since launch. You might disagree but here are dozen of players who feel the same way and you, claiming that we are not the majority of the community, are not helping with making us feel better in any way.

I don’t care if people complain about the game. I care if people try to talk for people that haven’t elected them by using language to exaagerate their positions…words like the community wants….the community isn’t a person. There are indviduals in the community who want.

I complain when I have something to complain about..but I complain about what I want or players like me want. I don’t try to generalize and say the community wants X or the community wants Y.

And if you stop replying it goes no further than this. I think it’s pretty obvious that I want people to stop talking for other people.

Linken.6345:

Annette.6278:

Dear Anet, wanna say thank you very much guys that you have fixed down camera!! It really helps me (and others) in fight. Keep on doing right things!
And thanks for amazing and very atmospheric Halloween event!

You mean the same halloween event we had 2013?
Im mean I dont dress up as the same thing every year so I expected the event to change aswell tbh

Real life isn’t a game. We had, in my family, almost the same exact Thanksgiving Day celebration every year. There might be some very minor changes (and there were some significant changes to rewards this year), but over all, it’s the same thing. It’s a tradition.

In Guild Wars 1, many holiday events were the same year after year, with maybe the exception of a certain reward).

The one thing in real life you don’t have to do every single Halloween is program stuff for a day. You buy or make another outfit. For some people that means an hour.

And that has nothing to do with the OP anyway. The OP is happy with the game and expressing thanks.

Kveldulf.7605:

Vayne.8563:

Kveldulf.7605:

Vayne.8563:

People keep using words like what the player base wants. Some people think the “player base” wants new dungeons. I’m sure that’s true for a percentage of the playerbase, but I’m not so sure it’s true for the player base as a whole.

People talk about people logging in or not logging in. They may not be logging in but plenty of people seem to be.

The living story is hit and miss. On a well liked chapter, people log in more. The recent chapter has seen a lot of activity in my guild and on maps as well.

I think people should talk for themselves instead of “the community”. Because I don’t think this community speaks with one voice.

sigh

No offense Vayne but I often see those posts from you in threads that I like.
Not the first time I saw you claiming that some people are using the word “community” when talking about things that they want to see, either.

Let me try to explain this to you as easy as I can:

x = the community of this game
y = Individuals (some claiming to be the “community” some not)
f = factor (In this case the amount of people)

=> x = f* y

so…even if we pretend that there are only 20 ppl here (in this particular thread) that are claiming that they know what the community wants, and (not even close) 10 ppl that share your opinion, => f = 20-10

Don’t you see?
We ARE the community! All of us! Some don’t care about where this game is going. Most people do care and want to know.

I am really not offending you! I just have the impression that you can’t see the meaning of the word “community”

Sorry but this isn’t close to true. When people say they’re speaking for the community, there’s an implication that the community as a whole wants something. There have been many pro mount threads, but no one would say the community as a whole wants mounts. It’s POSSIBLE a majority of the community does want them, but saying the community wants it because 10 people or 20 people or 30 people want it is wrong. In the case of mounts it’s particularly wrong because a large percentage of the community is against them? How many? I don’t know.

And that’s the point. I don’t know. So I’m not going to come in here and talk “for the community”. That’s a way of trying to make it look like you have numbers to support you.

When someone says people in the community want more dungeons, well…people in the DUNGEON community probably do. But that doesn’t mean everyone or even most people want it.

So now we have the question. If you’re not speaking for everyone and only your small demographic what does adding the words “the community” add to your argument?

At best, they add nothing to the argument. At worst, they’re misleading.

I’m part of the community too, and people sure as hell aren’t talking for me… most of the time anyway.

My last reply to this for the sake of this thread.
x = f* y
that means not “that the community as a whole wants something”
bc; f = (ppl that agree – ppl that disagree)
And it “sure as hell” doesn’t mean we are talking for you…

If you feel like discussing this out feel free to PM me, but please let this thread stay on it’s topic

Sorry but I won’t let this lie or take this to PM just because you say so. And I don’t agree that when someone says the community wants something they mean part of the community. I do believe most people who use it are trying to say the community as a whole. If they’re not trying to say that, then there’s zero point in using the phrase at all.

This thread is about refocusing and clarifying Guild Wars 2’s goal. Now when an Anet employees asks a question about whether or not the Living Story is viable content in and of itself, the only way anyone can honestly answer it is what they, and maybe what their friends like about it.

They can’t really say the community wants something, unless they’ve somehow been elected spokesperson for the community.

Gaile asked a question and everyone has the absolute right to answer that question for themselves. I have the right to tell her what I told her…but I don’t actually have the right to speak for other people….except maybe some of my friends or some of my guild. Or I can use phrases like me and players like me.

You don’t have to agree with my interpretation, but what you’re actually saying here is you know what those people meant and I don’t know what they meant. I’m relatively sure a majority of those people think they what they want/believe is what most people, or the majority or the “community” wants.

Again if they didn’t believe that, there would be no real reason to include the phrase.

Devata.6589:

Guhracie.3419:

Devata.6589:

Cithryth.6741:

A little over a year ago some of my friends started playing GW2. They tried explaining the good things about the game and why my husband and I should start playing with them. “Open world dynamic events,” they said. “Living Story,” they said. While it sounded intriguing I wasn’t convinced enough to put down $50 to try another MMO.

Fast forward to the end of September of this year. Husband and I hear about the free trial week and 50% off price. “Why not?” we say and begin downloading.

Within two days I was hooked and we each bought the game. But not because of any of the things my friends had tried to use to convince us to play (though they are pretty good too) – No, I am hooked because of the cosmetics.

Why, oh why, hadn’t my friends ever mentioned the extensive collection of dyes? Or the amazingly detailed and option-rich character creation? Or the wide variety of weapon and armor skins?

Nearly two months later and I am still hooked on this game. My main character is a Sylvari mesmer, all decked out in the Orchid armor set dyed a beautiful deep purple to match her skin, hair, and glow color.

I definitely still have heaps to learn. But I think I am going to be here awhile

Maybe they did not mention it becouse the way to get those is very boring in many cases and you will likely often run into a skin you like only to find out getting it is almost impossible.

That is, if you are not willing to spend a lot of money on the cash-shop to buy all of it.
I personally also care more about cosmetics then stats and it is what I loved to collect in most games. In GW2 however while there is much more of these things collecting them usually ends up in a boring gold grind and so is the least fun way compared to those other games.

That might be a reason they didn’t mention it.

Oh, come on. I’m disgruntled enough right now that I’m getting infractions left and right, and even I can see that there are PLENTY of gorgeous skins that are easy to acquire in-game. You do not have to pay outrageous sums to have fun with the wardrobe/creation tools.

There are skins easy available but many of the best looking aren’t (like any of the black lion ticket skins).
Sure you can do a lot when you take those out of the equation but if you just look at what people have and then decide you want one of those then you are very likely to walk into this problem. And thats how many people who like cosmetic work. They see something what they like and then go to get that yourself. Also all near hearstyles are lock behind a lot of gold.
And mini’s (I see them also as cosmetics) collecting them is also mainly grinding gold because 90% from them you can only buy with gold.

Yeah you can for sure play around with the wardrobe system but if you really want to go for skins you see and like you will very often run into this problem.

The fact that there are also nice skins you can get in other ways does not change that.

Except of course if you like to grind grind grind (gold). Then this is an option and basically the end-game in GW2 (PvE).

I like skins. Skins is my game. However, shiny bright skins aren’t a big deal to me, because that’s not how I wear or look at skins.

Each character has a theme. Something that makes them them. They have clothing or items that “fit” them.

It’s not only one thing. It’s a range of things. There are plenty of items in game for me to get a look I like without going to the cash shop. Not that I haven’t gone to the cash shop occasionally if I like something, but most of the cash shop outfits, as an example, I don’t really like at all.

You can be completely into skins and not even think about the cash shop…except for transmutation stones…which if you PvP isn’t really a problem….or if you world complete on multiple characters.

Kveldulf.7605:

Vayne.8563:

People keep using words like what the player base wants. Some people think the “player base” wants new dungeons. I’m sure that’s true for a percentage of the playerbase, but I’m not so sure it’s true for the player base as a whole.

People talk about people logging in or not logging in. They may not be logging in but plenty of people seem to be.

The living story is hit and miss. On a well liked chapter, people log in more. The recent chapter has seen a lot of activity in my guild and on maps as well.

I think people should talk for themselves instead of “the community”. Because I don’t think this community speaks with one voice.

sigh

No offense Vayne but I often see those posts from you in threads that I like.
Not the first time I saw you claiming that some people are using the word “community” when talking about things that they want to see, either.

Let me try to explain this to you as easy as I can:

x = the community of this game
y = Individuals (some claiming to be the “community” some not)
f = factor (In this case the amount of people)

=> x = f* y

so…even if we pretend that there are only 20 ppl here (in this particular thread) that are claiming that they know what the community wants, and (not even close) 10 ppl that share your opinion, => f = 20-10

Don’t you see?
We ARE the community! All of us! Some don’t care about where this game is going. Most people do care and want to know.

I am really not offending you! I just have the impression that you can’t see the meaning of the word “community”

Sorry but this isn’t close to true. When people say they’re speaking for the community, there’s an implication that the community as a whole wants something. There have been many pro mount threads, but no one would say the community as a whole wants mounts. It’s POSSIBLE a majority of the community does want them, but saying the community wants it because 10 people or 20 people or 30 people want it is wrong. In the case of mounts it’s particularly wrong because a large percentage of the community is against them? How many? I don’t know.

And that’s the point. I don’t know. So I’m not going to come in here and talk “for the community”. That’s a way of trying to make it look like you have numbers to support you.

When someone says people in the community want more dungeons, well…people in the DUNGEON community probably do. But that doesn’t mean everyone or even most people want it.

So now we have the question. If you’re not speaking for everyone and only your small demographic what does adding the words “the community” add to your argument?

At best, they add nothing to the argument. At worst, they’re misleading.

I’m part of the community too, and people sure as hell aren’t talking for me… most of the time anyway.

Cuddy.6247:

DeathMetal.8264:

Cuddy.6247:

Vayne.8563:

The OP mentioned gear. He didn’t mention skills.

So gear can’t have horizontal spread as well? kitten, I must’ve been playing World of Warcraft wrong all this time.

Not discussing about Gw2’s gear features or efficiency of each stat, but I wanted to point out, about what the OP’s view on gear. And I quote him (emphasis is mine):

Humor.5763:

Eventually that came to an end when we found out the weapons/armor, even fractual stuff did next to nothing, and was simply only for “Reskinning purposes”. By this I mean of course, there is no more progression after level 80, you’re the same, but only look different. The difference between gear had halted

OP said, he’s NOT into “horizontal” progression (aka he doesn’t like changes in just skin). And certainly, he doesn’t mean about various stat combination or efficiency of various stat combination, because we have several flavors now after launch (Settler’s, Assasin’s, Celestial, Sentinel, Sisnister, Nomad’s and maybe I’m missing one or two). So from that, since he’s not into skin and ignore the various other stat combinations, he can only mean a gear progression vertically. Because, if he meant Horizontal, then skin is part of Horizontal Progession, as well as effects (the new Lumi thingie), as well new Stat Combinations as well as being able to do L.S, (and how about those Halo/Horn and even the Kiel/Evon “buffs”). The OP never consider those as progression, it’s just a"reskinning" for him.

Where did he say he was against horizontal progression? Just because ANet’s added lousy new stats that are still “meh” doesn’t make them purposeful. The game still lacks the depth and quality of gear refinement that existed in many MMOs prior.

Vayne.8563:

Cuddy.6247:

Vayne.8563:

The OP mentioned gear. He didn’t mention skills.

So gear can’t have horizontal spread as well? kitten, I must’ve been playing World of Warcraft wrong all this time.

Gear most certainly can be different without being a treadmill. It’s why we have Soldier’s gear, Berserker’s gear or Valkyrie’s gear.

But these are introduced early and the range of effectiveness that some people want (especially people who play trinity MMOs) is kitten poor. It’s not that options aren’t available, it’s just that 90% of the options are pretty crummy and people don’t want to use them. Whereas in virtually every other MMO you could take a warrior, give them a particular weapon, and have about six different ways to build that warrior instead of one, or two depending if you want to drop the Fast Hands trait. Even further from that, all six of those different ways (with different gear specs) were effective.

Guild Wars 2 doesn’t provide that.

Check yourself before you wreck yourself.

I didn’t use the word treadmill. I used the word stats. In this game gear has stats. He was complaining the power didn’t go up. That was the complaint.

Defend the indefensible if you must but I’m done with this.

He didn’t once say his complaint was that the power didn’t go up. His complaint was a lack of progression and, daresay, any real changes.

Personally, I blame the poor gear system on the lack of an energy bar to cast powerful spells – energy is such a huge factor in other MMO games that it really helps define how a player wants to go. But that would certainly just throw melee players under the bus. In a game like WoW it’s absurd how many ways you can go. Hell, even GW1 had more effective choices. People will play GW2 expecting it to be like MMOs they’re used to and then realize that once they do, they’ve just reduced the game’s longevity by half.

I don’t agree with what you think he said. I’m not buying it. The way he worded it, at least to me, made it clear he was talking about stats. Others seem to agree.

People keep using words like what the player base wants. Some people think the “player base” wants new dungeons. I’m sure that’s true for a percentage of the playerbase, but I’m not so sure it’s true for the player base as a whole.

People talk about people logging in or not logging in. They may not be logging in but plenty of people seem to be.

The living story is hit and miss. On a well liked chapter, people log in more. The recent chapter has seen a lot of activity in my guild and on maps as well.

I think people should talk for themselves instead of “the community”. Because I don’t think this community speaks with one voice.

munkiman.3068:

It’s pretty important to note that many of the OPs points are points that continue to be brought to the forefront. GW held my attention far longer than GW2, it had steady updates of content, clearly defined roles and build diversity was a big part of success in a more varied set of combat scenerios. There is such a lack in effective build diversity outside of PvP so the game mechanics become stale. I’m pretty positive that this game was not only marketed, but built around the idea that “everyone” would be catered to, the occasional, the casual and the hard-core. Unfortunately, it just isn’t “sticky” enough to really appeal to all those player types, this especially if you don’t care for PvP. It seems the game really wants the occasional, where most players tend to come around for LS, see what’s new, play for an hour or two, then come back next go around of new LS content. It really feels like, for the harder core players, the only game to play here is forum wars.

I still believe there are more people playing Guild Wars 2 than played Guild Wars 1 though. And I still believe that just because people keep bringing something up over and over again doesn’t make it right or true.

For a long time, most of humanity believes the world was flat. We keep seeing dueling and mount threads over and over and we never had that in Guild Wars 1.

Sure we see a lot of stuff over and over. Doesn’t mean it’s good for the game…even if you’d like it.

Kaiyanwan.8521:

You left one game, tried something new and didn’t like it.

Now you are back to the game you were not satisfied to begin with and praise it?

Sometimes I have a hard time to understand people…

It’s so easy to poke holes in a game. This is the first MMO I’ve actually enjoyed for any length of time though.

So after trying WoW, Lotro, DDO, Perfect World, Rift, Aion, AoC, TSW (which came the closest to something I’d play), I finally found a single MMO that I find worth playing.

I’d say that’s worthy of praise.

Some people think they don’t like the game, so no one should.

Those are the people I don’t understand.

archdemonXIII.7063:

Ykfox.3825:

The delay in getting the weapon skills actually made me appreciate them a little bit more then I otherwise would have.

A famine makes you really appreciate having food. (sorry, not trying to single you out here)

My problem with the NPE is that too much stuff is locked when it could have been hidden. If an adventurous newbie finds a vista at level 2, that is the time to unlock vistas. It’s the difference between helping someone along as opposed to forcing them to go at your pace. You don’t learn to play guitar by having an instructor add one string at a time.

You know what running around with just auto attack and none of the skills/utilities/traits that make the professions unique teaches you? That you could be doing something else that is fun.

Except that vistas aren’t locked and haven’t been. They simply don’t appear on the map. If you run into a Vista you can use it at any level.

Oh hell yeah. This is a great suggestion.

Guhracie.3419:

Yargesh.4965:

People seem to have attachment issues. This is a game, not a personal relationship. You may be a wonderful person, you may be a nutbar, all the same thing since you are a name and in some cases several books worth of postings on forums or whatever. Nothing more.
There is no relationship except business to customer.
They owe you nothing but the game.
If they lose people it is not because they don’t love you.

Your straw man isn’t even very good. I feel sad for you.

If they lose people, they lose money.

This whole conversation is about the business/customer relationship.

That’s not necessarily true. Sometimes it’s about losing the right people. I lost quite a few customers in my shop when I closed the mac section and most of them were very annoyed. But I made more profit not having it.

People talk as if losing people isn’t a normal part of business. No business is going to hold everyone. Sometimes losing people who don’t like your product while keeping and attracting people who do is a sound business strategy.

Gaile, you might know me as someone strongly supportive of Anet and the game, but in this instance, the Living World isn’t enough because people think in terms of the living world being the story instances you get, which not everyone cares about.

If Anet wants the Living World to be more than it is, they need to provide updates to the game that supercede just story lines. Now they’ve done some of that by adding new zones, but you have to understand, there’s very little difference playing most professions now as there was a year ago.

In Guild Wars 1 you had new skills, you had so many choices. Here, you have a lot less options. Even with traits, playing characters isn’t vastly different.

People are looking for ways to expand their play internally as well as externally. It’s not just fighting a new monster, it’s a new way to fight old monsters too. People want to see more weapons, more skills, more traits, more options.

And they want to see new professions and races.

Until the Living Story (or an expansion) provides that, you’re going to continue to see these types of complaints.

Thief.6207:

New player here …
is there ANY place I can find a list of what changes were made to the starter areas, for example, did they really remove all the Juvenile (tameable) animals other than the ravens from Wayfarer Hills, or is my video card just playing a cruel trick on me? I know they should be there because I started just before the NPE and leveled a ranger there up to 8 or so.

Where did they say they were gating pets, for crying out loud?

It’s not that I mind the gating itself that much, but I would like to KNOW what’s gated now (that nobody mentioned), and what’s a bug. I cannot adequately express my frustration at not knowing, and not being able to find out.

With respect,

Sim the Ineluctable

Yes they did remove tamable animals from early in the zones. The idea was to give brand new players less to deal with period. One concept at a time, or as few concepts as at a time as they could manage.

Other changes included removing bundles.

Edit: There are still tamable animals in every city though. And changes were mostly in the 1-5 areas…the 10-15 areas are pretty much unchanged.