Guild Wars 2

Thanks for posting your opinion. Sorry the game didnt meet your expectations, but I have a little news for you – the game will not change to meet what you want, save your time

I thought this was a joke!

this is a joke right..?

Welcome to the madness

Ironangel is probably right, number of kills would probably be the trigger.
I have gone back over my chart and looked at patterns for ‘No Drop’.

From kills 1 to 76, the longest run of ‘No Dropss’ was 4 (which appears 4 times)
From kill 77, the longest run is 7

Up until kill 70, the chart doesnt look too bad with the rate of No Drops.

There is a good chance somewhere around 70 is the magic number. Factor in that during DE’s you get a lot of kills really quickly, this could be why we see reports of 30 minutes then the anti farm kicking in

Of course from the very limited sample you cant get a precise figure, it could be 10% off the mark, it could be 30% of the mark. But there are the numbers from the first sample.

If anyone wants to repeat the experiment then we will have 2 sets of data and a better picture.
I said it before in my last post, I play on Aurora Glade server, anyone is welcome to hit me up and we will work together

In other words, if we look at it as %, every kill either scoring for ‘No Drop’ or for ‘Drop’

The chart would look like this
70/30 – ‘No drop’ is more than double the ‘drop’. Maybe it gave me a valuable item?
53/47 – The rate is balancing out
40/60 – Now ‘drop’ is higher than ‘no drop’. I am finding more items, more times
37/63 – Almost the same as last
33/67 – Again not much change
79/21 – The ‘BAM’, ‘No Drop’ more than doubles from previous results
64/36 – ‘No Drop’ remains higher than ‘Drop’

When looked at it from this angle you should be able to see that it appears a threshold was reached and anti farming kicking in, considering each section is 10 minutes of game time (or average 15 kills), thats 20 minutes or 30 kills where No Drops vastly out wieghed the items I recieved.

@Jester
Apologies for confusion, but its in how you read the numbers. The rate of No Drop compared to the rest of the drops changed considerably.

If we look at the sections that contain the two ’6’s.

The first time 6 No Drops scores, the rest of the items (Junk+Trophy+Item+Craft) add up to 9. For the second 6, the rest of the drops score 10. When 5 No Drops score, the rest of the drops add up to 10.

Then there is a huge spike in No Drops – 11, and the rest of the drops only score 3.
The spike continues with 9 No Drops and the rest combined only scoring 5.

The start of the chart looks a little odd at first with 9 and 8 No Drops, but its not that alarming when we compare that number to the other items that drop 4 items and 7 items.

One aspect I didnt take into account was ITEM VALUE in terms of selling to a vendor. That may have effected the drop rates and distorted the start (or even the rest of the results), either way we can see a threshold was reached.

Hey folks, further to my last thread on Anti Farming/Diminishing Returns, I have more facts and figures to share with you all.

Before I post the numbers, please bare in mind that these results can only be applied to my character (level 60 Human Guardian) and in the zone I played, but should stand true for other areas as its likely the mechanic is global.

THE IDEA
Farm one type of enemy, as quick as possible, in one area and monitor all drops. To get a good result I decided to do this for 70minutes, or 100 kills, whichever came sooner. The idea for 70 minutes was in case the cut of came into effect after 60.

THE PRACTICCE
I killed Trolls, lots of them (103 to be exact), the same 6 trolls one after the other, in a circle sweep as they spawned.

THE DATA
First by TIME, in segments of 10 Minutes

No Drop 9/8/6/6/5/11/9
Junk 2/1/2/1/5/2/0
Trophy 0/1/3/1/0/1/3
Item 1/3/3/3/1/0/0
Crafting Mat 1/2/1/5/4/0/2

Now by KILLS, in segments of 10 kills

No Drop 7/7/6/3/4/4/3/7/6/7
Junk 2/0/1/2/0/2/4/2/1/0
Trophy 0/0/1/2/0/1/0/0/3/1
Item 1/2/0/3/2/2/1/0/0/0
Crafting Mat 1/1/2/0/3/2/3/1/0/2

THE RESULTS
As we can there are clear patterns, and a point at which it becomes clear something has changed (the anti farming comes into effect).

By ‘No Drop’ – After 50 minutes, or 70 kills, the rate of No Drop almost doubled
By Junk – After 50 minutes, or 70 kills, the rate of Junk dropping died off to nothing
By Trophy – The rate of Trophy dropping was more or less constant
By Item – After 50 minutes, or 70 kills, items stopped dropping
By Crafting Materials – The rate of materials dropping remained constant.

THE CONCLUSION
There is a clear mechanic in effect, the result of which is to increase the rate of no loot dropping, while reducing the rate of items dropping.
The rate of Trophy and Crafting Materials dropping doesn’t seem to change.
We can see this cut off seems to come into effect around the 50minute mark, or around the 70 kills mark, which one it is I do not know. I have read other articles that claim to reach this mark around 30minutes, which may be true assuming that their kills have reached 70?

Interested to hear other views on this, but please lets try to keep to facts not gut feelings.

I dont want to drag this on any longer, but I find a few comments ammusing, especially those regarding times.

I did 13 events, the same events over again. I have the clock showing in my photos.
The first event ended at 1915 and the last event I did ended at 2014.

The rewards for the first event are equal to the rewards from the last event.
Thats 13 DE in an hour, no cap, no diminishing returns. Photos as proof.

The concept artists deserve double pay, as do the people who took that art and made it into a game.

I play a Guardian, and in a support/holding roll. Mace/Shield
We have some good abilities to protect and cover allies, and an area heal that has a fast cooldown. I can also hold my own in combat, but more like tank than a dps.
Works well with party members that have ranged attacks, and equally with warriors.
Change the weapon and off hand and it plays very differently though.

As for Dungeons I find most classes can work together, but I play pick up groups and not so much organised efficiency

I could write a lot on this thread! But I will stick to this -

I tend to play one character, I’m not a big fan of alts.
GW2 allows me, through down levelling to explore and play in areas that normally I wouldnt see, or would walk through one-hitting everything.

Thanks for checking th thread and the feedback folks.
I have the screenshots saved for all the events.

@ Dosvidaniya, you are right, but that is regarding Dungeons and speed clearing them

Like I mention I didnt check drops very closely. This was mainly to address a screenshot I saw on a different thread (the guy got like 1 karma or something for doing the event). The idea was to see if EXP, Karma, coin diminished at all based on speed and repeating.

If I get the time tommorrow I will kill something like 250 of creature ‘X’ and see what the drops look like.

Please dont just read some doom and gloom threads and worry too much guys. Most people who post them tend to over react a fair bit

As anyone reading these forums will know, the hot topic is diminishing returns and the negative impact it is supposedly having on the game.

I was not convinced, having not witnessed any of it for myself in game, so I decided to do a little experiment.

Before I begin, I want to point out two things, I DO have photos/screenshots of every event, but this is not the best place to upload them. Once I find somewhere, if anyone is interested in viewing them for validation please let me know and I will link you (somehow )

The other part I should mention is this test, and the results, can only stand for my level (Human Guardian, lvl 59), and only in the one area I played.

THE IDEA

Run the same dynamic events again and again, with three challenges,

firstly the number of different events has to be kept to a minimum, so that I would be doing the same ones again and again
secondly, speed – I have to do these events as fast as possible and move onto the next event as soon as possible.
Third, the variation of enemies must be kept to a minimum, that is so I could keep killing the same type over and over to see if it effected drops.

THE PRACTICE

I managed to run 13 events in just over 1 hour. Of these 13, six where unique, the other seven runs where duplicates. I managed to run 3 events, 3 times each, and one event I managed to run it 4 times.

THE DATA (with Rewards)

Defend the Southern Beach 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Hold Swampwatch (silver) 4511 xp 233 k 1s 15c
Defend Shorewatch 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Kill the Risen Shark 5033 xp 270 k 1s 30c
Reclaim the Southern Beach 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Hold Swampwatch (2nd) 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Defend Shorewatch (2nd) 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Sink the Ash Horizon 5033 xp 270 k 1s 33c
Defend the Southern Beach (2nd) 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Hold Swampwatch (3rd) 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Defend Shorewatch (3rd) 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Defend the Southern Beach (3rd) 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c
Defend Shorwatch (4th) 5306 xp 274 k 1s 35c

THE RESULTS

Events – as we can see, even though I duplicated these events and ran them in just over one hour. The reward in terms of EXP, KARMA, and COIN, where identical each time I ran it.

Drops – I killed predominantly Risen (several variations of). I did NOT monitor drops 100% (ie didn’t write them down), but I didn’t notice much change. In fact the very LAST combat I took part in, the Risen I killed dropped a Green item.

CONCLUSION

While this test only covers one area, repeated, in just over one hour of gameplay, we can see that there are no negative penalties applied to running the same event up to 4 times.
I cant prove it, but I will say that what stands true here probably stands true in every other zone.
And what stands true for my level (59) probably stands true for level 58 and level 60.

I am willing to take that a step further and say it probably stands true for all areas and levels 1-79, and maybe level 80’s are different.

If any level 80 wants to try a similar experiment and post their results then please do. Either way I intend to do this experiment again once I am level 80 and post my own results.

I think tommorow, when I do my dailies, I will spend the time doing DE’s like I normally do and take a few screenshots. I will make sure to have the clock displayed in game to monitor time taken.

So far I am pretty sure, at level 58, that I havent/dont suffer from these penalties. Maybe is someone level 80 wants to do the same thing, we can compared actual drop off rates in terms of %

I posted a similar thread early… I was playing in the same area for 3hrs, doing the same DE’s (all be it, several of them) and suffered ZERO penalties

I posted something similar over in General Discussion.
I played for 3hrs doing DE’s in one area and suffered ZERO penalties.

Not sure it its area/level based as I havent been effected by it yet (lvl58)

Tradewind.6913:

You lost me at the “mostly commonly shared by the community,” like you have some sort of survey of the entire game. Stop acting like you people speak for the rest of us. Especially when your opinions mostly comprise of uneducated bull kitten to begin with.

This

I agree.
I wish they would have a seperate section ‘Rants and Raves’, and keep General Discussion for discussing the game. I am really not interested in some kids opinion because he doesnt like blah blah.

You bought the game half a year before release? You were in the beta? Or am I reading this wrong.
If its beta, then at the end of most games all the beta stuff is wiped for release. I’ve been in a fair few betas, but wasnt in GW2 beta. Sorry I cant be more helpful

Hey! Just for a laugh I created my own one man guild – The Legend of Xericor!
I really enjoy dynamic events, so have got a fair whack of influence from them, but the best I have found is PvP. You get 5 points for every win.

I’ve been reading a lot of this ‘Diminishing Returns’ and anti farming thing, and I am not denying it exists, it makes sense that it does, but I am having trouble seeing how it triggers or to see how/why people are complaining its ruining the game.

I played for around 3 hours this morning, in the same zone, doing dynamic and meta events mainly (as well as other stuff for my dailies).

When I play I tend to be kept real busy with events, often moving from one to another, and it seems on my server (Aurora Glade) that we are a real friendly bunch and often call in chat where events are. In fact if anyone was there between, 9.30am and just after 12, in Bloodtide Coast, you could testify. Jumping from Taidha Covington meta event, to the Champion Jungle Troll, to protecting Lion Guard, and several other events in between. Culminating with me falling off the pipe while fighting with the Giant Blood Ooze.

All in all, I must have done over 10 events easy, and never seemed to drop karma.

I also made approx 40 silver, and have 5 yellow items to drop on the Trading Post (when its up, as its been down all day).

Bloodtide Coast is a large map, maybe that has something to do with it, but I really cant see, from my experience, how anti farming is ruining the game. What’s more if anyone cares to claim otherwise, hop over to Aurora Glade, we can play to together, I will show you my little route and we take some screen shots of rewards.

Xericor…
Been using it for years, in every game I play. Cant really remember how I came up with it, probably an off shot from Xerxes (not 300, long before then. My other hobby is historical wargaming)

Everytime I move to a new area I spend some time checking out the events, which I love, so much so I tend to replay some of them over and over. Not for the reward, but simply because the event is so good.

Examples include the Assault on the Centaur base, the whole charge and counter charge, taking camps, holding camps, charging the main base, defending the counter assault.
Or the Pirate one, knocking out the towers, neutralising the cannons, getting support from the Galleon, fighting the Pirates through to the Chief, taking the island, only later for it to be invaded by Risen.

Its these moments that make the game for me. Am I alone here or are there other players who love to replay the same event just because its real cool?

I’ve seen an Ettin and bear have a fight, watched Gort lose his cave, but nothing beats what I saw today…

There I was rambling my way through a forest, avoiding all manner of nasties, when from behind a tree, came running a Risen Brute zombie creature. Expecting an attack I was very amused to find it wasn’t going for me, but instead it decided to boot a poor little rabbit to death…

Zombie v’s Rabbit. It was over to fast for me to get a screen shot, but its kept me amused all morning.

Anyone else had any similar chuckles?

Some have genuine issues that they want to discuss, these posts when you find them often have good thought out arguements, but you are spot on – most of the complaints are personal opinion and utter tripe, its always the same on official forums.

Best MMO is subject to opinion, what suits one person may not suit the next, but that aside, I agree – I have played many many games and none has grabbed me as much as this. The Dynamic Events are excellent, and world pvp is fantastic, and the art in the game is truely amazing.

Geesh, you people need to move on.
Get. Over. It

I’m getting real tired of seeing this forum descend into another ‘I hate the game so I will post in the forum that I hate the game’

So, for every negative thread I see, I will put the universe back in balance and say
I am loving the game
edited by moderator : caps

Aha! Just found this thread and it explains all my worries. Thanks!

As a Guardian who tends to focus a lot on support/shielding/healing and being the nice guy who goes to res folks I was wondering why I didnt seem to get much loot compared to some people. Looking forward to a solution.

My suggestion would be to count healing (other players) similar to dps, and some core for giving others perks, removing curses. Not sure about points for res as that could b easily abused

Its true, the forums attract outspoken people who DO NOT reflect even 5% of the player base.
These folks think they are 100% correct, and everyone else is 100% wrong.
A small fraction raise genuine concerns that should be adressed, most however think the universe revolves around them and some cosmic force owes them. It doesnt.

Everyone is right here…
The challenge should be the reward, and it is for many, myself included. But this genre of game – the progression, the search for better gear – encourages a negative reaction when it doesnt live upto expectation.
Trouble is often people expect (or think they deserve) way to much

I plan on doing dynamic events just for the sheer fun. Im not really the type of player who makes many alts, so I plan on going through all the other levels and zones I havent been to and participating in the events.
The down level feature is fantastic in my opinion.

The fee increases per level? Ah hadnt really noticed that, I am only level 50.
But my loot sells for higher and my rewards are higher, so surely that balances out?

I honestly really do wonder if we are playing the same game sometimes…
My game goes like this…
Call in chat, event close to X waypoint – great, I’ll jump to there, 67 copper.. well I will make that back and then some in the event.
Friend says he is playing in X location – great, I’ll jump to there, 80 copper.. well I will make that back in maybe 5 minutes killing stuff, its only an average blue or selling a couple of loot bags on the Trading post
Need to jump locations – great, I’ll jump to there, 1 silver 30 copper, hmm… maybe I will walk a little closer to the edge of the map, great saved myself 60 copper for 2 minutes walk….

I have just over 2g
But I do have upgraded bank and inventory.
Money, as a number on a screen is useless, its the purchased item that counts.
Nobody ever beat me at pvp because they had 100g more than me

Yeah plz, any news on this would be great.
Having just bought a new suit of armour that looks horrid I would appreciate a chance to preview all future purchases!

Spot on.
Do stuff – earn exp – level up
Thats the base of any game like this. If there is a different way it hasnt been invented.
Now often the player doesnt have a choice of stuff to do to earn exp, and then it becomes a grind. GW2 gives exp for anything and everything, in that way it avoids as much grind as is possible in a game like this.
But you cant change the base idea of the game!

If you explain something in depth you give all the infomation needed to reverse engineer it. They will not explain the exact mechanics behind the anti farm, so as not to give info to the enemy looking to exploit it or find a way around it.

Love the logic here…
I am against farming bots
I support manual farming
huh?

Official forums are legendary for their ability to attract players who want to vent that something is op/upsets them/they dont like it/its breaking the game/etc etc
9 times out of 10, its just their opinion backed up by zero fact. Personally I wish they would add a ‘Rant’ section and leave that stuff out of ‘General Discussion’

I dont know what game you guys are playing (or more where in the game you are playing) but I find event after event after event. So much so, that often I can game for 3hrs and get nothing done but events!

+1
I like the fact we are free to choose what to do, but some variety in achievements would be nice

Trinity? No. Horrid system. It had its benefits, but they were simply to dictate a playstyle, 1x Tank, 1x Healer, 2x DPS – do this or dont play. Cant get a good tank? Dont play.

As for ‘chaos and random’, I would partially agree with you at the start of the game when players were still getting to grips with the characters and their abilities. Now people are becoming experienced, the skill is coming through more. I now look at a players class, and what weapon they are wielding, and know a little better what they are capable of and how their skills will play out, so we can better work as a team.

Nope.
Just the thought of ‘collecting a quest’ from an NPC who just stands there, complete the quest, return and watch the NPC stand there to give the same quest to the next level 10 warrior to pass by, is actually painful to think about now!
Dynamic events are the future

I have played many many games and love GW2. You have set the new bench mark by which future games will aspire.

I would like to see GW2 play to its strengths – the dynamic events and the especially the meta events, where areas change hands, is excellent. I think we are way off getting new areas, but when we do I hope they make an extended meta event that effects an entire zone.

Coming from SWTOR with its mirror classes, I for one am happy to see the variation. I dont know if something is OP just because its different. OP for me would be a clear cut case, like instant res, different is just different