Guild Wars 2

I think only the tooltip was modified. The tooltip was erroneous, so we can’t complain.

Alphard.6529:

Burning retreat moves you 900 units WITH swiftness (and out of combat).

Flame leap has a range of 550, but before and after the cast you stop moving for a part of a second, so after using it you’re probably not 550 units ahead of someone who was running right beside you. Needs to be tested.

The spell in itself has an animation time, so you should deduct the length that you would be able to walk during this time in order to find the actual boost in speed.

:)

I really don’t mean to interrupt the course of this discussion, I think this thread is being very constructive, full of objective remarks and truthful opinions. I have nothing to add, or maybe just that I am not so fond of the Vizunah Squarian community myself (to be read with Canadian rules of politeness in mind)!

Well the thing is that sigils can be relevant too: a weapon set made of two one-handed weapons can have two sigils, so let’s say night and slaying (two 10% modifiers) while a two-handed weapon set only has one sigil; however two-handed weapon sets have 10% more weapon damage in general (greatsword) which compensates for the lack of second sigil. If we took all sigils out then two-handed weapon sets would have an advantage.

Not sure if verified as well, but are conditions applied first before calculating damage taken?

Tested for vulnerability-applying skills and the condition is applied first, therefore increasing the damage on the spell on hit.

As for your final question, it is hard to know. I think it depends on the traits involved. I think that a general rule for this is that any flat stat buff that is not permanent in combat is not taken into account (example). Testing is required.

I think I used the active spell on a signet once then never dared doing this again.

Of course you did! Congratulations!

I will update the thread as soon as you give me a challenge. Hey don’t make it too hard

Also I wish I could see your reaction when in world of warcraft my guild could do Ragnaros (40 man raid) with 12 people and 28 slots sold. Good times.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

I have no idea what you’re talking about Zelyhn, I’m pretty sure my numbers have been right from the start. Yours are the ones that are screwy, I still have no idea where this 18k number for LH is coming from.

There are many pages of posts with our discussions, several PMs, and you changed your numbers on a daily basis, wrong every time. Have some dignity.

Yes actually Sabull noticed the same thing recently.
He sent me a private video to show this so I would have to wait for his permission to transmit it to you.

Basically what he is saying is that the lava font cast responsiveness and cd maybe affected by whether or not you were casting something before casting lava font.

Adastra.9821:

The lava font duration appears correct with the 6 ticks. Are your cast and aftercast numbers correct?

These numbers were data mined by DEKeyzToChaos.7381. He is using a method that I thoroughly approve for frame counting.

Also these are the numbers stated in the patchnotes some time ago.

But actually that’s kind of strange, because it should be more than permanent!

Lava font cd with trait = 6 * 0.8 = 4.8
Lava font cast = 0.2
Lava font aftercast = 0.2
So effective cd with trait = 4.8 + 0.2 + 0.2 = 5.2
Lava font duration with persisting flames = 4 + 2 = 6

But when I tried it myself I would find a little interruption in the lava font uptime in between casts.
Can someone test this again?

Adastra.9821:

Now take pyromancer’s alacrity along with persisting flames. Hello permanent lava font.

It’s not exactly permanent

supergica.8652:

I’m thinking of creating a group dedicated to kicking arah sellers from dungeons. So many scammers that kick people before the end boss to sell the spots, it’s becoming risky to even try it outside your guild. It just creates a toxic environment and people rarely do it legitimately (skiping Lupi is the default method) thus exploiting this dungeon is rampant. Just check the lfg for this dungeon, nothing but exploiters advertising, rarely you can get a legitimate group.

If there is a demand, then there will be a supply for as long as it is not deemed illegal.

Joining groups to kick players is an abuse that has been deemed illegal and is a bannable offence.

Update:

The patch did not change much to the accuracy of tooltips.
Luckily DEKeyzToChaos.7381 has been doing some very good frame counting.
I have updated staff’s skills according to his findings.
More will come soon!

Shadowfax.7562:

Nope. Yesterday I tested it. I have 20 seconds fury per stack.
I did more than 1 minute of fury.
Did you test it today?

Nope, I haven’t tested anything, just trust the patch notes. But I would be far from surprised if the patchnotes were inaccurate or if there was stealth change.

Did you have points in arcana for this test? Did you proc fury from swapping attunements?

No, five stacks. So if one stack of your buff last 10s like it is by default than you can stack it up to 50s in total.

He is also mine. Bloody hell Haviz simply has too much power!

I think you guys shouldn’t have the reverse argument of the legit/not-legit GL kill. Mesmer thingy is glitch, FGS is borderline grey area, so what is the current record time for undeniably legit kill? I saw a 21s Kr kill, has anyone done it faster yet?

So first of all, let me just say that saying this after a patch that buffed staff dps is quite dishonest. But I can live with this. I mean, I could. I could live with this if it was not after three weeks of you making enormous claims and me proving you wrong every single time from the start.

Let’s take a look at history.

On the 17th of september I wrote:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Staff-s-greatly-underestimated-damage-9-17/first#post2852919

then four days later you posted your guide on guru
http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/85568-lh-is-the-new-bearbow-the-real-staff-dps-build-for-manly-men/

I must admit I was astonished the first time I saw your guide, not by the outrageous dps claims you said it can produce but more by your huge misconceptions on the class

Switch to Earth Attune when you aren’t in combat. You can lead with Eruption then switch to Fire and cast Lava Font in the same place for a furyblast. This works even if you cancel the Eruption with the attunement switch; you will still get the spell effect, including the blast finisher.

Emphasis is mine
then when asked “Why Zephyr’s Focus? Does Lava Font count as a channeling skill?” you reply

Fireball and Meteor Shower do.

Emphasis is mine

So I was puzzled … what could I have missed? I mean it’s not like Sabull and I actually tried staff’s dps in game and recorded it with frame counting.
Therefore I asked you a few questions. Apparently at that time you were claiming that staff could output 17k dps with just a combination of fireball and lava font. You kept this claim despite my numerous indications that meteor shower is worth casting too. Fine.
Since your dps figures were obviously wrong for both staff and LH, I asked you to let me know how you calculate your dps rotations.

That’s when you gave me your spreadsheet. Oh boy.
I am not going to start on how many mistakes I found, or how you were using a staff build to calculate LH’s dps. No, what is most interesting is how wrong your rotation calculation was, not just the formula but also the figures for cooldowns, cast times, etc. Well ok, I just showed you this and you sort of took it into account.

Then you finally understood that meteor shower should be included in the rotation. Of course you computed its added damage with mistakes, but I can give you credits for trying.

Then I used your own (corrected) spreadsheet to show you that your LH dps figure was erroneous. This made LH come on top of staff for a speedkill situation.

Then Dub told us about a LH build that would deal even more damage than what we had in mind, so the conclusion couldn’t be clearer.

The patch happened.

You failed to see that lava font was buffed with one more tick despite me writing about this on the elem forum within 10 minutes of the patch release.

And now you come here and say, Zelyhn was/is wrong, staff has the highest possible dps in the game?

After all this history of mistakes and inaccuracies you have the arrogance to come here and say this?

Seriously?

Facts for you:
maximum possible dps of staff in a speedkill situation after the patch: 17k1
maximum possible dps of LH in a speedkill situation: 18k
Do I have to take your own spreadsheet again to show you this?
Thank you for having the honesty to recognise your mistakes, stop bragging with your erroneous claims and be a bit humble after all this, because you have been proven wrong every single day from day one.

Now for those who wonder, what are the implications of LH having superior dps compared to staff in a speedkill situation? None. These are just calculations for max dps. In a realistic situation neither of those two builds are actually that good.
Staff is stronger now, so people should use it, and Guang’s build is quite good for this purpose. LH is still boring as hell but it works quite fine for its duration, and my love rests with with D/F.

KazNaka.4718:

Shadowfax.7562:

So you can easily stack 10 minutes of fury and it takes ~ 5 minutes Then switch Lava Axe for another skill and fight the boss. Imho it’s the worst thing Arena Net could introduce in the patch. Infinity….

lolwut? Doesn’t fury duration cap at 2 mins?

Even before that since fury buffs stack to a max of 5

Ok Guang, ok. I didn’t want to make this a “me versus you” kind of debate but if you are going down that road I’ll follow you.

I had hoped you would have noticed the most important change GK: lava font ticks 2 times more with PF now instead of one, so staff’s dps is increased
Meter shower is not twice as big, radius is 90→120 like I said on the elem forum

Shadowfax.7562:

Guys it works correctly! Only after this patch I’ve totally understand this trait!

You can see a small icon that is blinking under your boons icons when you switch the attunements! And yes it is 5 seconds! This means that we get +10% bonuses from one attunement being in another!

Nope

Of course not! That would be working as described

Damage radius of the meteors in meteor shower has been increased from 90 to 120 according to the tooltip

Lava font does tick 6 times

Staff got a buff in damage from persisting flames adding 2 seconds to lava font instead of one. Need testing to confirm though

I think you may want to fix the tooltip before I die from laughter

I think I have made it pretty clear how to dps with D/F in the later posts of my guide

With my elem I intentionally enter groups with LFG saying “only warriors/guardians” because I’m a bad bad kitten

Updated:

• Added more sigils, food, upgrade
• Removed out of combat stats for clarity
• Corrected minor bugs

Note that the weapon damage used by default has been adjusted to ascended level (1000 weapon damage on average). You can now have two sigils and bloodlust/perception stacks at the same time, check the numbers in orange for this.

The rotation tab looks like the computer screens in the matrix, it’s ok don’t worry just trust me. I have adjusted some rotations to the best of my knowledge. I need more data to be more accurate, if you are willing to do some data mining for a class please let me know.

Remember to hit me with any kind of feedback, this is still an alpha version and I am still uncertain about how to achieve what I want in the end, so all remarks are gladly accepted!

Prove what exactly? The formulas?

As far as I know NASA didn’t send people on the moon before checking if they could send people on the moon They had formulas, they applied them and it worked.

I doubt you deal more damage than my D/F zerker scholar 30/30/10/0/0 though

STRanger.5120:

Zelyhn.8069:

STRanger.5120:

shockwave.1764:

evasive arcana is one of the most fun traits in the game

Sorry dude, Evasive arcana WAS the most fun trait ingame, before it was nerfed to the 15 trait point level…..

Wait wait that’s lingering element’s level … nothing can ever that low !!!

Ok, maybe 20 point-trait level, but certainly not grandmaster level….

You know what warriors get for 15 point traits? a 50% reduction in weapon swap recharge time.
With 30 points in arcana the best we get is a ( ( 16 – 10 ) / 16 ) = 37.5% reduction in our weapon swap’s recharge time
Ha .. haha .. haha … ha.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Super_Speed

And for your information 0 * ( 1 + 100% ) = 0

STRanger.5120:

shockwave.1764:

evasive arcana is one of the most fun traits in the game

Sorry dude, Evasive arcana WAS the most fun trait ingame, before it was nerfed to the 15 trait point level…..

Wait wait that’s lingering element’s level … nothing can ever that low !!!

There is a distinction between a leap skill and a skill with a leap finisher

I will release an update of the alpha version of the Zalculator tomorrow after the patch.

One thing I have notice while watching the stream is that tooltips are still as inaccurate as they are now. This means that we are going to need a lot of data mining before I can make a proper rotation calculator. DEKeyzToChaos.7381 is doing an awesome job at frame-counting at the moment, for the elementalist. Are there people here willing to help with data mining for other classes?

Yay super nice! This way burning speed’s trail can be even more buggy! Woohoo!

I can’t recheck the video right now but I think they pointed our that the radius of skills affected by blasting staff will have a different color in the tooltip, and I am pretty sure I saw that in meteor shower’s tooltip.

ImProVocateur.5189:

Zelyhn.8069,
Are you sure about that? I run d/d ele always on the Shaman. Sometimes I see random single digit damage. Usually I see zeroes. Twice I have found a spot the allowed partial damage through. One step to the left or right and it would be zeroes again. I have not paid attention to whether vulnerability stacked during the bubble. I zone-out and let water #1 auto the Shaman to death while enjoying watching the antics of the other four team members scurrying about for survival.

You know that weapons generate a random number in their damage range for every attack, don’t you?

The meteors’radius was increased by blasting staff

You should stop ForumWars2, your addiction is starting to have an effect on one of your personalities

Well this thread is not just about PvE. It is only just easier to see the implications of what we find here in PvE. But in PvP we use the same skills, so if we find here that our skills are less potent then there is a conclusion to be drawn for PvP. Even more so since in PvE elems can be squishy but not in PvP.

Stone splinters is the most uninteresting of all traits. It’s basically saying: “here have 10% flat more damage across the board because we can’t buff you skills properly to be on the level of that of other classes, and also if you could try to take more traits in earth that would be cool because we want to promote diversity you know”

what is this new ground targeting?

Seriously …. ???

Wethospu.6437:

Totally unrelated question but if a weapon skill does vulnerability. Is it applied before or after the hit?
Just wondering because I’m 27.65% confident that my first Greatsword AA did damage on Champion Shaman’s bubble (only damage from Vulnerability goes through).

Vulnerability is applied before the hit

Yeah but then the highest dps achievable on warrior is with axe auto chain?