Dear Minon master whose point I decapped your point and held while close to death for 5 minutes,
A decap engi is not a hack. It also requires lots of skill where I have to make sure I don’t heal above 25%. I have to stagger my mini heals. Otherwise I will get condi bombed by you. Obviously this is a dangerous game since I’m always a misstep away from death.
Decap engis are not all spam this spam that you know.
I don’t like the way people casually say “I’ll go close”…and then forget about it once it’s capped. I think it’s a delusion where people think that once close is capped, it can never get decapped again.
This is wrong.
Now it doesn’t necessarily mean you go afk the whole match. As a close point defender, you need to judge exactly how far you can leave close so that you can get back to it before any enemy attacker. This will vary from map to map. On Foefire for example, a minion mancer can leave a wurm at close and spam marks from the ledge. They have to constantly look from side to side and keep track of who’s died and how long they take to run.
Are there thieves? Can they steal close?
Paranoid. Be paranoid. Help in any other way you can….but never at the cost of potentially losing close. If there are more inc than you can handle, you have to call for help before you die or the point gets decapped.
Going close is a responsibility. A sacred sacrament. A holy bond between you and that patch of land. Don’t take it casually.
lol @ who holds close. Dude, in this game you can’t afford to have 1 person afk on close. So clueless
“Holding” or “defending” close does not mean going AFK. It means taking responsibility for close and watching out for it, asking for help if there’s something you can’t handle. In other words, the close holder is responsible if close is lost and there’s no cry for help or anything.
have a build that lets you ATLEAST hold off 2 people for abit
There are classes like the decap engi solely meant to prevent you from capping the point. They’re not out to kill you. To counter this, you need one other person.
you should be able to have gotten the reinforcements you need.
This is hilarious in soloq. Without prior discussion, everyone assumes that someone else will go help. And therefore nobody comes to help. It’s the diffusion of responsibility that’s also responsible for phenomena like a woman being molested in broad daylight without anyone intervening. Everyone’s waiting for someone else to take action.
There’s a reason why teamspeak is far more efficient for coordination instead of just relying on “body language” etc. We want to maximize our chances of winning and have as few barriers as possible. For that verbal communication goes a long way.
Look at all the people feeling morally superior saying “Play for fun!” or “You shouldn’t want a reward!” or “Look at xyz game” (usually mobas).
What they don’t realize is that GW2 is an MMO which from the time the genre was created has come to be almost synonymous with one thing – PROGRESSION. And not progression of skills, but progression of characters. Better skills, cooler weapons or armor, just getting richer, titles etc.
Saying “Play for fun” is not enough because for most people, getting rewards is the fun part! Otherwise you’re just wasting time because you put in all that effort for nothing.
The only reason I PvP is because I liked the rank system allowing me to get higher and higher ranks that were difficult to achieve. Progression. Improvement of characters. That is the motivation for playing.
People need to get off their high horse and realize that they can play for “pure fun” if they want. No one is stopping them. The rest of us need a nice juicy fat carrot to put in the effort.
I would have fun if there was true form of diversity and balance in pvp
You honestly believe playing agaisnt the same hambow warriors, MM necros, decap engis and spirit rangers over and over again is fun?
There hasn’t even been a new game mode SINCE RELEASE, you call playing the same game mode for that long FUN? That shows me one thing – anet doesn’t care about pvp. Right now, Gw1 is head and shoulders better than gw2 in pvp and its not even debatable
Look, I love the combat , no doubt its enjoyable and fluid, but its completely stale and leaves a bad taste in my mouth after a short period of time.
I see no diversity, I see no different game modes, I see no balance. That is not fun, you must have some other definition of fun compared to majority of the other players.
Look at all the people feeling morally superior saying “Play for fun!” or “You shouldn’t want a reward!” or “Look at xyz game” (usually mobas).
What they don’t realize is that GW2 is an MMO which from the time the genre was created has come to be almost synonymous with one thing – PROGRESSION. And not progression of skills, but progression of characters. Better skills, cooler weapons or armor, just getting richer, titles etc.
Saying “Play for fun” is not enough because for most people, getting rewards is the fun part! Otherwise you’re just wasting time because you put in all that effort for nothing.
The only reason I PvP is because I liked the rank system allowing me to get higher and higher ranks that were difficult to achieve. Progression. Improvement of characters. That is the motivation for playing.
People need to get off their high horse and realize that they can play for “pure fun” if they want. No one is stopping them. The rest of us need a nice juicy fat carrot to put in the effort.
I also never understood this lack of communication – there is probably a 20% chance that 1 person talks at start, never had 4 or 5 people in team that actually all talk about what they are going to do, what is happening in their field of view.
I’ve had everyone actively participate in the matchsetup countless of times but I think it boils down to afew things:
The “Solo mid” or “I Carry” who immediatly upon joining announce that ‘I am doing this and hence expect you to obide to my plan, else you are by default a horrible player while I am without blame.’
Most PvPers know their build pretty well, they know what role it plays in the match and where it will be moderately useful so they intend to put it to use in that position immediatly rather than talk about it.
You then have the people who is trying to follow the horrendous PvP guides on these forums and use these as a beacon, it is pretty much written exactly what is expected of them and they intend to do exactly that and nothing else.
And ofcourse: The prematch ragers, either your team or the opposing teams composition is in his mind, de facto much better. This leads to the match already being lost and you’re likely to find him being either being VERY vocal throughout the match, raging about anything that does not go his way. Alternatively he will be the silent rager, in which case hes just going to go bunker down on a point and tab out or go afk.
But overall, theres only 1 gamemode and from what I’ve observed in my own matches is that we can communicate just fine without any talking at the start.
It’s not enough to know what role you intend to play. Unless you broadcast your intentions, it’s entirely possible for someone else to also try and fulfill the same role thereby leading to a waste of teammates if that role only requires one person to do it. This is particularly true if there are two people of the same class in the team (which is almost always).
Like someone above mentioned, you often waste seconds running up to the treb only to find a mesmer or a thief already there when they never talked about their intentions pre match. There are a whole lot of other similar issues.
Or if as a close holder, I want someone to come with me to close on Foefire at the start to ensure the cap. How is one to know all this without prior communication? Telepathy?
Coordinated teams are better than un coordinated ones. This is hardly rocket science.
So I’ve been thinking each map has unique features that might suit one class or the other. Here are my thoughts:
1. Temple Storm: Decap engi (?) since the circles have no barriers and any push is one that will leave you alone on the point.
2. Kyhlo: Mesmer for treb running
3. Foefire: Close necro holder who can also spam marks from the ledge to help at mid and use flesh wurm to teleport back to close in case of inc. This map is good for such a strategy because it’s easy to see people coming if you’re on the ledge unlike other maps (unless the enemy goes all the way around from the back)
4. Spirit Watch: Some good orb runner with condi removal: Shout guardian maybe?
5. Skyhammer: Decap engi for pushing off cliffs perhaps
6. Forest: Decap engi again. Circles have no barriers and the far point is a very short run from the base
I disagree about not focusing on rewards. Rewards are the incentive and more difficult rewards are statements of time invested, hard work, and skill.
So without rewards, 90% of people will stop playing. It doesn’t matter what the carrot is as long as it’s difficult to achieve, offers progression, and is publicly visible.
Decap engi is definitely up there. I’d say a good bunker guardian on mid-point will net a lot of wins in SoloQ, as well.
I think the value of a bunker guardian increases dramatically if the teams is good with support and communication. The best builds for solo q IMHO are ones that don’t require the cooperation of others.
How about a good close holder like a Minion Master who leaves a worm at close and helps out at mid and can return if close is contested? Nice value?
In soloq, you have to ask yourself not “what is the best team composition”, but “how can I contribute the most as a single player” to give my team the best chance of winning.
As far as I can see, that build is a decap engi all things being equal and on an average. Do you agree?
If not, what in your opinion is the best build for solo q to maximize the chances of winning?
I’m looking to incorporate “Foot in the Grave” and “Near to Death” into my build with good boon durations so I can just “dip into” death shroud over and over to get massive stability uptime. The reason? I’m tired of being (literally) pushed around.
So I’m thinking these are the salient features:
1. Keep going in and out of death shroud. I need 30 in soul reaping for this.
2. I get lots of critical damage.
3. Clearly this has to incorporate power to make use of the crit damage
4. To make use of the critical damage, I need some precision in curses
5. With furious demise and weakening shroud in curses, I can take advantage of the “dipping” in and out constantly
6. I want lots of extra boon duration to maximize stability.
I’m not very experienced with a necro (I main a mesmer, but it has limited value in tPvP these days), so this is mostly theory crafting. I would love someone with more experience to tell me if any of this can be synergized.
Losing the first fight is not a justification for just going afk and raging at your teammates. Respawn, take a deep breath, dust yourself off, form a strategy and try and get those points back!
solo Q is dead (difference in rewards to thank for that),
everyone just joins team Q solo now,
and when your rank rises you keep getting premades.
it kills your soul to repeatedly play against teams of clones with the exact same build and team composition as the last shameful idiots you played against.
1 decap engi cone,
2 hambow clones,
1 PW spamming clone,
and one extra of any of the above.
seriously, anyone who plays this is skill-less, shameful and straight up ruins the game.
it is also shameful for Anet, who have left these builds like this for longer than i can remember, at this point it feels like this vile filth meta has always been here…
OK anet we get your lovely little teases about some magical feature build in the distant future, but COME ON.
don’t make us wait until then, you’re losing players by the day due to this insanity.
It would be nicer if at least we got better rewards for more difficult rank matches. But no….everyone gets the same. What’s the point of being more skillful then since everyone has the same 50% win ratio….
you forgot that thieves have basically 0 survival outside of stealth or evades (depending on build); they also don’t have access to excessive CCs like certain classes do
I was thinking mobility not in terms of within the fight circle itself, but between points.
if you nerf thief moblity outside of points nobody will take one for pvp…. that is sole reason they are taken in tpvp instead of another condi tank or warrior
My point is that without mobility between points, people will also start taking mesmers and eles instead of just thief.
Seriously. Unless you can hold out for a long while against a decap engi, you cannot call yourself a bunker. You need massive stability uptimes or CC to prevent a decap. So no rangers or stealthing mesmers please. Unless you’re a guardian or warrior with lots of stability uptime, you’re not a bunker. Go help mid instead.
At what percentage point do you enter the leaderboards? If there are 1000 positions and we enter the leaderboards at 96%, then 1000 people make up 4% of the population. Hence total PvP population ~ 25,000.
So I guess the question is…how high a percentage rank have you ever seen in your geographic region? The higher percentage you see, the greater the PvP population. I’ve not seen more than 97% I think….
you forgot that thieves have basically 0 survival outside of stealth or evades (depending on build); they also don’t have access to excessive CCs like certain classes do
I was thinking mobility not in terms of within the fight circle itself, but between points.
In the higher team arenas I note an almost complete lack of mesmers and elementalists. Rather, the standard seems to be one thief (not more) for DPS on demand. It’s not that mesmers or eles don’t have huge DPS – they do. Lots.
But there’s nothing to beat a thief for sheer mobility. If close point is under attack, a thief can rotate back very quickly to turn a 1v1 into a 2v1 and burst down a weakened target in seconds and then run back to where they were before. This makes them pretty useful and it’s no surprise that I don’t see any other pure DPS classes.
How about a tradeoff between damage and mobility? If you want huge DPS, then you have to be slow and lumbering. If you want to move quickly from place to place, then you can’t bring huge damage with you.
How does this feel as a balancing idea?
P.S. Just thought – perhaps a new “mobility” stat…if you take it you don’t get the precision/critical damage stats etc. Just throwing the idea around.
Personally I think decap engis are totally in line with the conquest mode of PvP as we have today. The game revolves around taking and holding points. The decap engi is the distillation of this philosophy. There’s no way around it other than to introduce new game modes.
Of course, the counter to the decap engi is the perma stability guardian who has plenty of options to remain exactly where they are. This is another build that is the natural consequence of conquest mode.
I’m not a guardian expert, so I’m not sure I can give the best advice, but a decap engineer will commonly take a rifle to use overcharged shot and combo it with net shot. Since both of these are projectiles, any projectile screen or reflection wall will simply nullify the ability, even at point blank range.
However, this won’t affect accelerant packed turrets, the air blast from the flame thrower, the magnetic inversion from the shield, or the personal battering ram (though the last one is very uncommon). It also won’t prevent the magnet, but that one is much easier to read (unless they’re doing stealth combos onto the pads in skyhammer).
So one thing you could possibly try is getting reduced consecration cooldowns and using wall of reflection and hallowed ground, and then maybe the shield of the avenger for an absorption bubble. That way, wall of reflection would be up for 12 seconds, shield of the avenger up for 20 (assuming without traits), and then wall of reflection would be back up when the shield disappears, which would provide a total of 44 seconds of protection from the overcharged shot and net shot.
Of course, this does mean you have to basically keep the wall between you (or just try standing in it), and they can always push you out with other stuff if you don’t have stability or other blocks up. And then you’d also have to take the shield, which means not taking a different useful utility.
You can do a similar thing with sanctuary too, although it still won’t counter the stuff that wall of reflection doesn’t counter (and the cooldown is very long).
You can also possibly reverse decap the engineer with a scepter shield loadout, although that might not be as useful in other contexts.
Anyways, that’s all I’ve got.
Thanks. Overcharged shot is on a 15 sec CD so I’m a bit wary of reflection skills + as you mentioned, the blast from the flamethrower will go right through it. It’ll go through sanctuary as well! I know because…ahem…I play a decap engi myself (looks sheepish).
For an engineer I like the Sorrow’s Embrace set, or the crafted one that’s just called leather armor’. But the Ascalonian or temple armors could work well too.
There’s plenty of what you’re looking for when it comes to medium armor. I don’t see your point.
My main beef is with high tier cultural armor. I want to buy it, but I can’t get any options as to the looks. And even with medium armor, it’s not as if there are too many “non sexy” choices.
My female engineer Hagrida Blane is a battle hardened kitten. She’d laugh at the female norn upper tier armor with its pansy bras and stockings and what not.
I want to buy her some cultural armor, but all of them look so….eeewww….sexy! I mean, what of the rugged, battered, beer drinking, scarred, one-eyed veterans that many women warriors will obviously be?
I can’t bring myself to clothe Hagrida in such flimsy pathetic outfits. I’ve managed to find her a solid coat as shown in the attached picture, but I badly want some more “non sexy” female norn/human armor.
I think you owe it to your team to not hold them back. Yes reflects are awesome and so we have a mesmer (or guardian). Yes, stability and tasty boons really help, so we can have a guardian as well. But otherwise, there’s little doubt that three warriors can mow down a boss really fast.
It’s not just about “what you want to play”. It’s just bad manners to play a build that is sub optimal knowing full well that you can play something else. After all, why do we run a dungeon? For the loot. Why do we want a certain setup? To get the maximum amount of loot in the minimum amount of time.
That’s the meaning of “fun” – efficiency is fun. Build that are not efficient in a given set up are disrespectful to everyone else don’t you think?
Don’t take the blind spam suggestion. As someone in the top 500 for TeamQ (on my Engie) I run a full bar of turrets and APT. One thing I’ve found is that turrets cannot be blinded, so while I personally may be under the affects of blind, my turrets are still able to launch/Knockback/stun you off the point. Personally I don’t play Condispam, but since it’s an issue I can’t see how you wouldn’t run Soldier’s Runes, Stand your Ground, Hallowed Ground (on-point stability dump ftw), and either another shout or Purging Flames. Your heal is up to you, but be aware when crafting your build that decap Engie isn’t the only thing you’ll be fighting. Hallowed Ground is fantastic against boon rip builds (which are far and few as it already stands, unless facing a thief) due to the pulsing stability rather than one long duration of it. One fault decap engies typically have is a lack of stability. I’d suggest Hammer or Staff for the line/ring of warding and you’ll need plenty of DPS to take a decap Engie down. If you bring staff, try to burn him down off-point and be sure to avoid his Magnet and LoS him if you can. The staff excels at this since it ignores terrain and hits literally everything on point, while being safe from ranged launches and knockbacks, as well as Magnet. Your biggest worry should be grenades, but if you have Signet of Mercy as well as the Purity trait and Soldier’s Runes, the Condi shouldn’t be an issue in the slightest.
The magic of a decap engi (screenshot attached) – this was in team q but were were a pug. The opponents were all 40-60. Granted, they didn’t have much damage or I would have surely died (and two mesmers stealthing all the time definitely helped me get the cap), but they wasted so many resources defending their close (our far), that we got the remaining two points the whole game.
Moral of the story. Going far to counter and divert the enemy’s resources is a perfectly valid strategy. Especially if you can be assured of a decap. You don’t need to kill the guy on point, you don’t even need to cap it. Just decapping it for 10 seconds or so and they dying is a good enough value addition to your team to make you worth it.
Yeah, that seems like something I’m looking for. I might take a focus instead of a shield though for the blind and block and also take the “Justice is blind” trait for an additional blind on the engi.
Was he playing the infamous bear-bow build, and/or rank <10? He was probably new and just using an easy class that he got through PvE with to see “what all this pvp stuff is about” and was thoroughly confused about the value of fighting on point. In PvE letting your bear tank while you pew from a safe distance is a good strat to survive and get through content, so how can you expect him to know to change it up when trying out pvp?
He was using a wolf. With knockdowns and the “fear” howl. And spirits. You’re right – I should have looked at his rank. I’m sure I’ll meet another one today.
If he comes on the point you’ll start throwing him around like a sack of potatoes. So I guess he’s standing away just waiting for a teammate to help him to kill you.
If you are using two melee weapons, it’s pretty much game over before it even starts. Just being honest. You might be able to kill them if you are using a scepter (maybe). However they have way more cc than you have ways to avoid it.
I wasn’t thinking about killing them. Just out stabilizing/aegis/blind/blocking them. If I take hallowed ground, stand your ground, shelter, the trait that gives stability on virtue activation, shield block, the blind skills and natural aegis skills, I should be able to neutralize them without getting knocked off point no?
There has to be a marriage between skill/reward. You should get higher rewards only if you have higher skill. Since rewards are the primary reason for playing, fun is the second reason. Zerker warriors make everything boring. But I have to play them otherwise I’m wasting my time with other classes.
What’s the best build to not get knocked off by a decap engi? I’m presuming one with lots of stability, aegis, blinds, and blocks. Combined with evades and Shelter, I’m thinking we should be able to neutralize any decap engi for a long period of time with correctly timed skills.
Yeah, it was a spirit ranger alright. I just used the word “pets” to refer to sundry AI that people carry around these days. Should have realized it has special meaning for a ranger!
Recently I’ve been teamed against strange ranger builds that seem to do nothing but stand outside the circle and autoattack. Considering that I play a decap engi, I feel my skills are wasted. Why knock someone off point when they’re already off point?
Not just that, they seem to do nothing but autoattack. Needless to say this doesn’t bother me one bit. I can pop my healing turrent and almost mitigate the damage with regeneration alone. They also have a lot of “pets”.
So what’s the deal? In all honesty it’s not the damage (non existent) that bothers me. It’s the constant noise. Pew, pew, pew, pew. For what. At least stand on the point!
So, I’ve been seeing a lot of these lately, and I’m not so much frustrated, I mean, it’s a good troll build, something engi’s are good at. What I want to know is what’s best to counter them? I play my Bunker Guard, so I’m not expecting to kill anything, and I have no problems surviving it, but even with all the stability, and the might i give my team, it still takes 2-3 of us to kill one engi.
As a bunker guard, you should have enough stability/blocks and evades to avoid a decap. You’re not supposed to kill the decap engi. Just waste his/her time.
