Our undead army is good in dungeons , it will keep u alive as long as possible if u have much vitality and toughness. ( I’m the last man standing in dungeons and I’m a pure MM that focuses on vitality , toughness and healing power ).
This is my build http://tinyurl.com/My-Pure-MM-build
So you are perfectly fine with them sometimes running off and attacking something, or just having them stand around that is up to you but most of are not. Arah boss Lupi is a perfect example of what is wrong with minions since the jagged horror alone has made him many times harder then he should because of a little grub spawned at its location and the boss absorbed it. Heck the flesh golem is a fine example of a bad minion AI right now, he has pulled mobs for me more often then u want to fight and this has lead to groups dying to trash in dungeons since trash in this game just insane amounts of health and hit overall to hard. Now i want them to work, i want to be a minion master from GW1 so much but right now with buggy AI, horrible damage, long reuse cooldowns since its once they die and not spawn, sometimes getting you stuck in combat, and no way to de-spawn them when you want if you just used a skill on 3 of the minions is just horrible design for them.
Also you are lasting longer then most is because you invested into vit, toughness, and healing power. You have more health and can take hits compared to others which does not mean it is a good build it just means other players have invested into actually trying to kill something more then you since you want your minions to do damage for you which is not reliable damage right now.
We are all wrong, your words of wisdom has shown me i am just a horrible player and backstab perma stealth thieves are balanced.
I am a newbie here, tell me how you can be a perma stealth backstab thief. i just rerolled to a thief.
Whenever, i cast CnD and then a backstab, i cannot get a second backstab straight away and after the first backstab i am out of stealth.
I even tried CnD—>backstab—> CnD (does not let me stealth) and thus couldnt backstab. Since i am a noob here, tell me how you do it? I so wanna own them people with that perma stealth backstab thief build i read about in forum.
you cant. its impossible, unless you exploit. Once you backstab you get a debuff for 3/4 seconds (cant recall) that keeps you from stealthing. Thats why there is no eprma-stealth BS thiefs.
OK i worded that wrong i am just so sick and tired of thieves trying to defend backstab.
Ironic considering you are reading the thief forums.
I’d say what you were doing is more akin to attempting to spout political deliberately erroneous rhetoric in the hopes of contributing to the negative air around a problem that doesn’t actually exist. There is no perma-stealth and by claiming there is you bring the validity of your opinion down to the level of someone who uses strawmen in order to provoke a reactionary response.
Of course I know you were just trying to rile people up, that much is obvious.
But it gives the distinct impression that you don’t have a valid reason for finding backstab so indefensible, if you have to resort to such tactics in order to try and put it down, eh?
It’s not even permanent, which I find hilarious… Not to mention it’s applications are minimal at best,Try harder next time.
No matter what i say about backstab and why I believe it should be toned down I will wrong.
Now you are correct it was not permanent and as for the build you can not devote your entire trait setup to just backstab damage but you will still do alot of damage. As to you saying applications are minimal at best I will disagree. It does serve a purpose in wvwvw though until they remove the stealth cap. It can delay the capture of camps and even keeps to give other factions time to defend or take it back however you look at it. Delaying the capture of camps gives time for your faction to retake the camp or if you are the attack faction more time for more players to show up to take it.
We are all wrong, your words of wisdom has shown me i am just a horrible player and backstab perma stealth thieves are balanced.
I am a newbie here, tell me how you can be a perma stealth backstab thief. i just rerolled to a thief.
Whenever, i cast CnD and then a backstab, i cannot get a second backstab straight away and after the first backstab i am out of stealth.
I even tried CnD—>backstab—> CnD (does not let me stealth) and thus couldnt backstab. Since i am a noob here, tell me how you do it? I so wanna own them people with that perma stealth backstab thief build i read about in forum.
you cant. its impossible, unless you exploit. Once you backstab you get a debuff for 3/4 seconds (cant recall) that keeps you from stealthing. Thats why there is no eprma-stealth BS thiefs.
OK i worded that wrong i am just so sick and tired of thieves trying to defend backstab.
Ironic considering you are reading the thief forums.
I’d say what you were doing is more akin to attempting to spout political deliberately erroneous rhetoric in the hopes of contributing to the negative air around a problem that doesn’t actually exist. There is no perma-stealth and by claiming there is you bring the validity of your opinion down to the level of someone who uses strawmen in order to provoke a reactionary response.
Of course I know you were just trying to rile people up, that much is obvious.
But it gives the distinct impression that you don’t have a valid reason for finding backstab so indefensible, if you have to resort to such tactics in order to try and put it down, eh?
We are all wrong, your words of wisdom has shown me i am just a horrible player and backstab perma stealth thieves are balanced.
You know this is Guild Wars 2 forum? You must have got accidentaly here, permastealth is in another game, you know?
If you mean the rendering bug, that´s not the classes fault, so please wait for fix and leave arguments like this for that games´ forum…..
The stealth comes from Black Powder + Heartseeker (a Smoke Field + Leap Finisher combo). Given that the Heartseekers do not hit anything, it is possible to maintain the stealth for a nice amount of time (albeit, the AOE circle for Black Powder is still visible…but it is quite faint). Now you can build a decent backstab build and have traits to restore initiative to keep this going. If you want more proof ill provide it.
We are all wrong, your words of wisdom has shown me i am just a horrible player and backstab perma stealth thieves are balanced.
I am a newbie here, tell me how you can be a perma stealth backstab thief. i just rerolled to a thief.
Whenever, i cast CnD and then a backstab, i cannot get a second backstab straight away and after the first backstab i am out of stealth.
I even tried CnD—>backstab—> CnD (does not let me stealth) and thus couldnt backstab. Since i am a noob here, tell me how you do it? I so wanna own them people with that perma stealth backstab thief build i read about in forum.
you cant. its impossible, unless you exploit. Once you backstab you get a debuff for 3/4 seconds (cant recall) that keeps you from stealthing. Thats why there is no eprma-stealth BS thiefs.
OK i worded that wrong i am just so sick and tired of thieves trying to defend backstab.
It needs to not just scale with +healing better but just heal for more as a base. Life siphon is a joke of a skill. Its easily interrupted by others or the caster. The 206 hp a tick is nothing compared to my 21k health. Even if you got every rune and sigil to help with draining life or restoring life you are devoting every resource to a very weak build over all since almost everyone other will be able to out damage your heal returns.
This was happening on HoD all last night. We tried stacking, random Aoe’s heck just spacing out and hoping he would hit one of us. I hate perma stealth in this game because it allows 1 player to hold off against 5+ with no problem of taking a camp.
I gave up caring that thieves have the high burst, mobility and ill never be able to keep one fighting me on my necro to kill them. Heck ive stopped even trying out armor sets and weapon stats and just resigned myself to Toughness, vit and power on armor since it allows me to take the backstab and combos when i dont have a stun breaker or i miss a dodge. Just make it so I can at least see this player for more then a split second because for now it gives thieves extremely high burst, ability to engage and dis engage combat when they think they might lose. The most annoying class in the game because its low risk and high reward for them.
Vitality will increase your HP and Death Shroud HP (20% of your max Health and then +0.76% per 1 Soul Reaping point of that sub total)
Toughness will transfer over as 5% for condition damage for using Superior Runes of the Undead and/ or 5% to power for traiting 25 points in Death Magic.
Are you sure soul reaping increase’s DS hp. I know we had a tread about it and i believe they stated they could not prove it increased the DS hp at all.
Ranger has an AOE stun with 1~k dmg + they can rez themselves with a pet – in my opinion it is not pointless, it is up there with one of the better ones.
For example necromancer – 1 second fear on 1 target + a poison aoe as a 3 that does not do any dmg (mesmers #3 ability hits for 6k~ on some targets).
Wars down state is almost as weak as necros – if 2 people start finishing you, there is no way to survive, since stun is also a single target. The rally is only good if you are both downed, and no allies nearby at all so after 8 seconds he can walk up and stab you, but in tpvp I have never seen a warrior get to do that – its simply far too easy to finish them.
That 1 second fear can fear people off ledges and cliffs or move them towards another target. That 1 second stun which does only 1k of damage. Something I can heal back with my passive healing in about 2 seconds. You know how many times I have rezed myself with my pet in pvp? Never.
I have never saved my own life as a necro with my down state fear. 1 second on one target is nothing when they just come right back and finish you off. They barely move away from you in one second. I mean how often do you die next to a cliff for them to fall off. fear them into another target….they dont forget what they are doing, nor do they just think O im going to go attack that random mob or player who is no danger to me yet.
I already changed and accept i just need to run without toughness, vitality or both of those stats on my armor. Not happy about it but now i take the hits and i can survive many times longer from conditions. I just want to be able to see you as soon as stealth breaks and ill shut up. Not seeing a target and having to random jump around and place marks, use wells, and DS skill 4 to hurt you while I wait for my screen to render you is a pain. ill also accept my roots, chills, pull, immobilize, and my one port skill is a joke so as long as i can see you more often during the fight.
All I want is to see a thief after stealth breaks. Not 2 seconds after i try to avoid rest of the spike damage by dodging is complete and not sure where to place a aoe or root, or something on my necro after i get away from that first hit, I know its a combo of skills but i can still try to dodge. Not seeing them is killing me. Ill live with ill never be able to stop you from running since grasp never hits anything that moves, same with dark path. My root is a joke, and my axe skill to immobilize you is never equipped because axe skills are a joke besides 3. I have already stopped trying to be anything but a bunker build from insane spikes of damage.
I just want to see you as soon as stealth is broken from damage or it runs out, not 2-3 seconds just barely enough time for you to re-stealth.
If we had 1 vs 1 the mists or could possibly meet in wvwvw we could test this out. We would need todo a number of tries with multiple class’s to rule it out completely.
I fought players in wvwvw before they went down, horror came up, it died and they popped back up so I always assumed it was the horror causing it. Now this didnt happen every time but I also assumed it was a damage thing like if you do not hit the mob for enough you dont get credit for this kill.
Dude, I play Necromancer, don’t say to me how’s the feel when none wants you.
I know how it feels to be underpowered and weak and, since I alt as Thief, trust me, Thieves are far from underpowered.
I think that a nerf on the base damage of backstab doesn’t hit the Thief effectiveness at all but it instead will give Thieves more balance among their possible builds.
Again, I don’t know on which basis you say that they won’t split skills in PvP and in PvE as they have already done back in Guild Wars 1 and they are still doing in Guild Wars 2. If the nerf is also in PvE, means that probably ArenaNet thinks that this nerf is needed also in PvE. They know their job.
My brother runs in FULL magic find gear and spams his marks on staff and facerolls 90% of pve I watch him all the time, sure which my thief could do that bro… necro’s have it easy. You even get minions to top it all off.
ANet needs to split pvp and pve skills because they’re already mucking stuff up because of all the QQ coming from WvW heroes.
umm any thief with a shortbow can do the same exact thing. Circle strafe while using cluster bomb and viola! dead mobs. You also have no clue about necro’s. Those marks due really low damage due to how messed up their class is and unbalanced condition damage is compared to burst damage. Even in maxed out condition damage spec the 2nd mark isn’t doing more than 3.5k damage from the bleed. My thief can do 4k easy with his clusterbomb every other second while the necro is waiting for that bleed to tick and the cooldown to be up. Minions you say? I kitten near wet myself laughing. Minions are the worst and buggiest things in the game by a wide margin. They take up utility/elite slots BTW and I’d rather have a useful utility skill than the current minions any day of the week, it isn’t even a contest.
I have 4 80’s so far; Thief, Necro, Warrior, and Engineer. You have no idea how good the thief class has it. What’s worse is you think Necro’s have it better, yet they are by far the most UP class, terrible trait designs, and with more bugs than a few of the other classes combined. The thief damage is OP along with a few other classes/builds and it needs brought back into line. Personally I’d start with nerfing crit/crit damage rates but either way it needs fixed sooner rather than later. There is a reason that pug SPvP consists of mostly the thief class and it isn’t because they are perfectly balanced.
As I play necro as a main I can say without a doubt minons are horrible, i wont go into details since they are bad at everything. The staff is by far our best weapon we have for any build whether its power, condition, or bunker builds. Most of the other weapons are not as useful as the staff is. Not saying they are all bad just not as useful as the staff is since it can fit all builds for the most part.
Now our power and condition builds can made to very useful in pve and wvwvw setups just we have to devote everything we have to it, trying to be a hybrid build on power and condition for the most part hurts the necro. I am not saying its not done o some players cant do it, heck i am sure some can but its harder to do. For tpvp i just cant make a good condition build since the conditions are cleared far to often for me to justify sticking with it, power and bunker builds all the way.
I still like to play my necro even if he is the most boring and broken class to play since i like attrition base style. I have a necro, thief, guardian, engineer, and working on mesmer now .
My 2 silver is to much for how often I move from points to points. Sure 2 silver doesnt sound like alot but every bloody silver helps. Just like saving every bloody dollar helps in real life, same applies in this game.
As I stated and sorry about replying to this so late, the siphons just do not restore enough health to cover the life we will loose while being in range to channel the skill in ether pvp or wvwvw setups. Almost all other class’s will hit necros to hard to cover the damage they will recieve. It might and that is a slim chance it will buy you time for DS to finish the 10 second cooldown or maybe a few seconds for our heal but that’s all it does for now. Now even with all the traits to siphon health or restore health traits, armor, weapon sigils, and runes that restore health, we might be a ok vampire build but we are devoting everything to it.
Ill admit i didnt think it would buy to much time in pve instances but open world pve it should be fine since you will not be getting hit for 7-8k from 1 boss AoE every few seconds.
Yup, why i recommended this build on another tread. its just not my play style is all. I did like it just is not feeling the love for the build is all.
Your right but he did say they should not being drawing aggro on its own which has happened with that minion, bone horrors, shadow fiend, and my fleshie the flesh golem many times.
Wait let me find the tread about the ai. Found in “I’d rather have reanimator disabled until a fix is ready.” tread so if this isnt meant to attack random mobs im sure the others are not meant to ether.
JonPeters
Game Designer
Thanks guys, we will take a look at this. It shouldn’t be dying so quickly and it certainly shouldn’t be drawing aggro on its own.
October 31, 2012 20:46
Orbs give more of a reason for players to do wvwvw. Right now on HoD we normally do not have many players on since we lost so many players. People need a reason to do wvwvw and id rather have bonus’s to exp, karma, etc then stat bonus to give a unfair advantage to other worlds.
Well we do have stability but its only when we used lich or plague forms. Also the 30 point one from DS tree but 30 points for 3 second stability is kinda…well kinda limited but 3 seconds every time you hit DS and you can enter DS every 10 seconds isnt so bad if you can keep the Lifeforce coming in.
I don’t think i have actually heard anyone complain about soul walk in a serious manner. Also spectral grasp wont hit anything unless its basically not moving and that skill i will admit is horrible for pulling things to me I want to fight.
Hey you tell me where I need to bring supplies, ill bring them. You want supplies to help repair walls I will bring them as fast as my perma swiftness can make me move from camps to keeps. The issue is we are just out numbered most times of the day and numbers do help alot.
I spent time upgrading camps with guards and such but they dont buy enough time when 15-20 players just run though and stomp the guards when only 5 or 6 of us try to keep the camps to allow our keeps to have supplies they need without more players to defend and attack more places.
Dude i want to say that was a good fight. I wish more thieves would stay around like you did if it looks grim. So many thieves just vanish from combat in 1 vs 1 fights it annoys me to no end when i fight on my necro. I’m built to take the hits and try to fight the long fight.
I would be happy to just have all ranged minions or all just minons of the same type. I want my undead bombers, i want my army or ranged nukers. I want my army of undead to be a army again. Heck a cap of 8 is fine.
This has been posted a couple times which is odd. Do your teams really leave necros to free cast?
As a necro im normally saved for last for whatever reason in groups to die. Unless I use Lich then im turned into a moa or burned down before i even cast 2 attacks.
Orbs should give bonus to not give stats to make them harder to kill but reward players who have them. Like give more karma, gold, influence, things that cannot give huge benefits besides to the side with more of them to give unfair advantages like more damage, health, toughness, etc. Then once they can figure out how to patch or stop players from exploiting to get the orbs easy they can restore them with new things like I first said.
They are still working on balancing them better, give it time so they can do it right and not destroy the class. I personally believe once they fix rendering it will solve many issues with thieves.
Do not be a sore loser and deny players there badge of honor, its rude and just sad to see done. I have been steamed rolled by a group of 5-6 before and i still have time to alt-f4 but I do not. Ive lost in 1 vs 1 and time to log out I do not. It is just rude and you should be above such childish things as quitting before you lose.
Its a second health bar that is slightly easier to heal up so we can absorb hits since we have no form of defense or invincible like other class’s. We have DS to take that hit every 10 seconds. That is a our answer to not having anything to migrate damage and to be honest its not that good of one ether since we lose all of our other skills in that form.
When and if they scale life siphoning to be something useful to the health a necro has I think it will a good build. Right now siphoning is barely moving my health and if its a burst class its not going to help even delay the damage really.
I did have a issue with bad link for that build but coping and pasting to new tab fixed it.
