Guild Wars 2

Wethospu.6437:

Hey, you have to admit that dying randomly without explanation is really annoying.

I admit that dying randomly without explanation on TV or on the Internet can definitely be really annoying.

I mean, what would CSI people do if they didn’t have any blood spatter circles?

Bloomhunger is such an annoying boss to melee… It is REALLY ANNOYING.

Leave Allie alone. She’s just doing her job, and is great at it lately, mind you.

I agree that the patch month ago messed more than it fixed, but things are going in the right direction now. I cannot believe that one can claim that our (necro’s) survivability was hammered this patch. It was improved, by large. There is still a long way ahead, but we’re moving there.

Everyone needs to realise, that the tournament is coming and some kind of status quo needs to be maintained until it concludes. After that, I am sure, new balance patches will come and we will see another set of changes – buffs and nerfs.

Ozzo.7425:

So you only do lvl 48 fracts once a day, and want to play fracts 48 daily with an alt while still getting the 4th tier daily chest?
Do them with your alt, then change to your high levelled toon at maw

So I have to choose between the progression and the reward?

The whole point is to remove the choice and allow players to have both to enjoy the game instead of having to think all the time about the reward and the progression.

Bane.3127:

blahblah

Since when jumping on the OP is constructive? Can you please refrain from directly attacking OP for making a thread that rises a discussion about a perfectly justified issue that is the perception of classes by usually and by large bad heavy armour players?

I also looked at his screenshot, and I agree that it’s not a build that I would run on lvl 79, but where does the OP state that he runs highly organised and optimised fractals. He was in a kitten level 20!

He clearly is a casual player or a beginner and so most probably is his team (especially the guardian writing ‘factual rubbish’).

Your behaviour was inappropriate and you should be ashamed.

@ OP:

Catch me in-game or through PM here, on the forums, so we can talk a little about improving your build.

Shalla.3967:

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As I’ve said before, these are my main thoughts on the issue:

-> Burning wasn’t necessary, our damage was ok-ish before the big patch. Swap it for torment and/or chill and the trait is still worth taking as a cover/control trait, whilst offering a choice to those that don’t want to run with it.

-> Terror should be GM. I don’t believe that any of the current GM traits even hold their weight as such to be fair, when compared to terror.

-> I disagree with those blaming marks. Specially now, I believe marks are in a good place. I was confused at first, but I really like the way this patch went. I’ve been running untraited marks as a trade off for 20 in soul reaping and I think DS is in a good place at the moment (despite being sad that I can’t fall off mountains freely without spectral walk, was a fun perk to have, but that’s irrelevant), even though our ability to disengage is still somewhat lackluster, making us good duelists but, due to the current exaggerated nature of burst, not so good team fight survivors (and I say this not because we can’t survive burst incoming from a group source, which should effectively be an issue for every class, but because we barely have the option to abandon the fight or to reposition ourselves.). I’d be ok with this if damage in general wasn’t so high as it currently is, which leads me to my next point.

This obviously does not only apply to the necromancer, but I still believe damage is just ridiculously high at the moment. Bursting someone down doesn’t even take coordination between 2 people these days. A few classes can kill people in a burst rotation, which I think is really damaging the game. It’s all about the damage at the moment. There’s no room for support, “sniper” type builds (which I’d love to see one for the new ranger longbow, for example), and other clever ways to win games away from sheer damage/number fights. I think toning everything down would also help with the current problem that is profession stacking.

I appreciate this thread. It seems more constructive and down to earth than others. Even so, some people need to stop acting like immature brats about this kind of stuff. It happens with necromancers today, but if there’s another class that gets a bit overly buffed soon, the OPOPOP comments start flowing, the word “meta” gets chuckled around like a bra-less tit and senseless videos of unrealistic scenarios start being posted for no reason other than annoy players whilst trying to act cool.

Ohh, Shalla. You read my mind.

Devs please read it! Torment/chill idea for Dhuumfire, Terror being a GM for me seem to be the best ideas.

Shalla +1000

The only problem I can see is that spirit rangers, S/D thieves, automated response engies and berserker stance warriors especially may kick the necro out of the game if the changes go too far. Sadly, and I say it with full sanity, being a necro player, it still would probably be better than seeing what the game is now at PAX.

Kudos, OP.

I enjoyed reading your fantastic elaboration on the “meta-game”

The request I read two days ago on these very forums from a top player, who should be an example of professionalism, was to make a special forum available only to the top 2% of PvP players who would provide feedback regarding balance. His opinion was that currently PvE players skew the feedback given their obvious lack of knowledge about the game and hence have no right to do this, which is write their opinions.

How simple-minded and unsophisticated level of understanding of everyone’s place (especially theirs) this and some other ‘top’ players are showing is just beyond me.

In my view, they don’t deserve to be ‘the top’, and reading similar posts I highly doubt they understand half what they think they do.

Also this,

nakoda.4213:

P.S. and go to school, eff eff ess.

And this.

Is there a way to save a webpage so that when I’m old I can sit down and read this marvelous OP?

Malafide, I’m a sworn supporter of the OP as long as it relates only to how people perceive some professions aside from the build and gameplay one of such individuals may present.

This WoW-like perception of professions and their roles in GW2 always makes me laugh in a hilarious way for 5 minutes. Then I turn into offense and forcefully make those guys change their attitude or kick them from my party.

Especially since an average scholar or adventurer is better than an average soldier, given the fact they aren’t so in-your-face-I-can-take-a-hit-and-/care-becuuuz-im-a-kitten-warrior and they usually had to learn much more to be as optimal and effective as a warrior or guardian which have rather simplistic mechanics (not bashing anyone, just describing the average). I delight in making those bad players accept how wrong their are and then kicking them out of the dungeon to the filth if they don’t comply.

ALSO
The part ‘That doesn’t matter, what matters is that we all support Evon’…
is genius! Ohh it made my morning, I <3 you.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Those achievements are actually based on personal score, not rank points.

He actually answered!

Thank you for the answer. If I may, are there any plans to change it in the future? Would it be something you would consider when working on the improvements of the PvP reward system?

Allie Murdock.8152:

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Ok, here’s the deal. I’m hearing different things from everyone I talk to.

1. Necro DS is too much and should be brought down
2. Necro damage is too much and should be brought down
3. Necro survivability is bad

Which is it? At this point, I want to see streams and videos of matches. If you have examples of the following, please share (STREAM SHOULD BE AFTER THE PATCH):

1. Team w/ 1 necro vs team w/o necro
2. Team w/ 1-2 necros vs team w/ 1-2 spirit rangers
3. Team w/ 1 necro vs team w/o neco but w/ berserker stance warrior (with heavy CC build – maybe mace/shield + hammer)
4. Team w/ 1 necro vs team w/o necro but w/ 1-2 spirit rangers
5. Team w/ 2 necros vs team w/ 1 necro & 1-2 spirit rangers
6. Team w/ 2 necros vs team w/ 2 berserker stance warriors (with heavy CC build)
7. Team w/ 2 necros vs team w/1-2 spirit rangers & 1 berserk stance warrior (with heavy CC build)
8. Team w/ necro vs team w/ Engi (w/ 30 pts in Alchemy)
9. Team w/ necro vs team w/o necro, but with any combination of the following: spirit ranger, berserker stance warrior (with heavy CC build), Engi w/ 30 in Alchemy, guardian w/ contemplation of purity/stand your ground.

Any other examples are welcome, but I want to SEE that what you are saying is in fact true. The sooner the better.

Thanks for the feedback everyone!

Well, that escalated rather quickly, but I’m in total agreement with Allie.

A well played berserker stance warrior is a horror vs meta necro in a teamfight. Still has problems, but really, people should try running comps Allie mentioned.

Also, don’t forget to eat your lunch this time! =)

Is the bonus 200 rank points for winning a rated match not counting towards the PvP title progression an intended thing or is it a bug?

I should normally get my Marauder title on rank 49+, but I won’t be even be half-way through when I’m there. Seems rather bothering. It’s been so since the release.

I’m just very curious if it’s intended, curious since the release.

As for the title, I was kind of reluctant and careful not to break the Code of Conduct, so in case anyone’s disturbed by it, I’ll change it.

Cheers!

KarlaGrey.5903:

B-But….your suggestion to make terror GM would kill my 0 20 20 0 30 terror build (sacced lingering curses, because blockable marks are, with all due respect, nothing short of terrible). I like to consider my build well-rounded (apart from lack of raw damage), because I just can’t imagine running some glass necro without lf generation on marks and lower recharge on DS skills, which I consider one of the most important necro traits, utility-wise :‘(. It was never OP before dhuumfire, so why setups that aren’t even connected with dhuumfire to start with.
Just rework dhuumfire and let other things alone.

Yeah… it’s a hard call when I look at it like that. I guess Dhuumfire rework would work as well

I haven’t read the whole topic so I don’t know if anyone already suggested what I’m going to write.

I realise people will be angry with me for this idea, but here it is – just make Terror a GM trait to limit the number of builds you can run it with. Switch it with the scepter or weakness trait so that you forgo defense to go full <30/30/w.e /w.e/w.e> offense (THIS OR kill Dhuumfire without changing the Terror)

• This way, you can’t have Soul Marks and Last Gasp in one build with Dhuumfire and Terror.
• You also can’t have unblockable marks in the same build so that you have to make choices.
• Corruption, warhorn and the the swapped trait all become viable again. They help the necro offensively as well, but in a different manner.

Some things during the Terror trait swap would have to be figured out, like if the traits are good enough for their tiers after the swap, but that’s the easy part I guess.

The aim of the change is to bring back the old-school 0/30/w.e/w.e/w.e condi necro, maintain the ultimate damage hybrid as a possible and a high risk/high reward build, force build diversity and drive away the fotm players from the necro

Coming from an exclusively-and-constantly-since-beta necro.

Please don’t hate me too much, just trying to help.

• Yet-another-edit:

To potential people concerned about the change having a negative impact on PvE/WvE – it doesn’t.

I am glad there are players who took their time to reply in a very constructive manner. Thanks, everyone.

It took me long time to sort it all out, a lot of thought and many very long discussions with other players, some of whom posted already in this very topic.

I realize the changes we’re talking about would shake things like nothing before. I would say that while I’m unsure of the effect of those changes in WvW, I feel these changes could definitely help PvE. I don’t think that this particular offensive AoE which we’re trying to fix sees that much of an exposure in PvE. Conditions neither and I also think that the condi fix proposed early actually helps PvE players.

I, for one, would love to have a vulnerability well on my necro to debuff a whole group so that a warrior can HB them until only dust remains. Having mostly a utility-focused AoE would just push people towards more cooperation, like picking and spiking targets one after another, would work in PvE the same as in PvP. Of course some tunings to dungeon themselves and the density of opponents would have to be implemented alongside to keep it fun and balanced. We already know that original dungeon reworks are coming.

The risk is, PvE players could be annoyed by those changes, if they just happened one day. It is up to the devs to start a discussion about it with the Community. The sooner, the better.

Also,

Ps. this is what happens when you ask for transparency. Allie writes an essay during her lunch hour xD

Brutal Arts.6307:

B-but my Infiltrators getoutofjailfreeIcanbeasbadasIwantandyoucan’tpunishme Strike and my Larcenous ThosesureEVADEaresomeniceEVADEboonsyouhavethereEVADEitwouldbeashameifEVADEanythinghappenedtothem Strike.

Those things gave me a long hysterical laughter.

spoj.9672:

Doesnt change that we are useless in other dungeons.

I wouldn’t go that far. I surely agree that the original dungeon design punishes some professions in comparison to others, because those dungeons are extremely one-sided.
Professions that fit this design are just better,

Other professions may still have their own niches like condi spreading for necros or unique party support (Spring, Spotter/Frost Spirit) for rangers, but those niches aren’t usually approached favourably.

My brain is shutting down already so I’ll just leave it here. I’ll try to think about all my dungeon experiences and write more about necros in dungeons. I just need to solobrainstorm and some rest.

Cogbyrn.7283:

And I bet you’re 100% surprised at the sort of argumentative mess I’ve injected myself into on account of my desire to challenge people’s declarations. I haven’t been on the forums in quite some time, mostly because they drive me to drink and scotch is expensive. I thought I recognized your name, and the call-out helped me remember. Those were good days, as I was able to learn a lot more about GW1 PvP, thanks to folks like you. Cheers.

Either way, I’m always happy to see people out there making it work. Keep on fighting the good fight.

The forums are usually fun. There is also much to learn about humans just from reading them. I absolutely agree that sometimes a drink is necessary to… ensure mental and emotional stability.

Andele.1306:

The rez exploit is, 2 people die, get rezzed to just above 90%, then the people alive finish the rez half way trough agony, before as a necro you could plain do the encounter by jumping into DS after the second agony tick (or third if you were bored enough to grind up infusion mats).

I’m quite sure it doesn’t work anymore. Can’t say for sure though. These things tent do be very bizarre.

As for the DS being used as only offensive tool. Of course it’s not like I never used it defensively and it saved my life a couple of times, but I don’t usually have to jump into DS to survive, because I rarely am in danger of dying. Let’s cut this here, we won’t probably come into an agreement and frankly, I don’t want to talk about how the things are now until I try it out in at least few runs.

Cheers!

Andele.1306:

leman.7682:

I’m at fractal personal level 62, I ran 77 just two days ago. I rarely use DS as a defensive mechanism. I rarely die. I think the change was a buff and even if it wasn’t (unlikely) I don’t care about it, because I don’t need it.

If I can do it, anyone can. That is all. Please adapt.

Also – Cogbyrn – I never thought I would see you once again on the forums. I remember you arguing with me about PvP just after the game started. So nice to see some release players still hanging around. ;D

A) You cannot legaly go above fractal level 59 because agony from maw instakills you
B) If you are using the rez exploit sure fine go to ranks like 81 or 103 (what some people i know for some reason went to), but other encounters cannot be done by a necro in that way anymore since with no reflects and blocks that stop about 3/5 of damage done in most fractals and ofc special attacks will kill you (and thats a matter of luck, dodge and encounter ai).
C) You probably got carried around 30 fractal levels by your guardian/mesmer allies if you rarely used DS as a defensive mechanism.

1. You only do odd numbers so you don’t face the Maw.
2. There is no rez exploit at 81, because there is now Maw at odd levels, not sure what you’re talking about.
3. I pugged my first couple of hundred fractals up to level 50, then I started playing with a team. I never felt carried too much And btw I played with Sandy, who is the best mesmer I ever saw in PvE. Did he carry me? I don’t know. Would we succeed without him? Probably yes. Would I change him for anyone else? Never. You can say the same thing about anyone…

And just to make sure you read my post correctly.
It is not intended as a show-off. I’m trying, kind of as Nemesis always strives, to show that you can, if instead of jumping into quick conclusions a day after a patch, people would take time to settle with what they have. The point is, there are people like me, that after the patch play just as they played before before without noticing any difference.

Just give it a week or two. We’ll see if people can adapt and if there’s a problem, I will be the first to raise it.

Do you realise how much utility wells can help in high level fractals?
Do you realise how grosely powerful an optimised hybrid-condi comp with epidemic necro is?

Trust me, I’m not tossing those things out of my hat.

Sometimes I wish a dev came with a spreadsheet showing possible DPS. Maybe then people would believe.

To close any argument before it may rise – IMPORTANT, please READ
A necro is a profession that is designed with numerous drawbacks. It is a profession with the least diversity when it comes to combat/skill systems (from blocks, mobility, etc. to combo capabilities). It is so BY DESIGN. It isn’t going to change.

What is the outcome of this situation? A necromancer needs a team that is well composed around him. It’s also is relatively inefficient to stack necromancers because they don’t have the mentioned utility variation that would allow them to create viable comps of stacked necros.

It is probably going to stay, so don’t expect to be ever able to play 4 necros as 4 warriors, that’s not the point.

What may happen, though, ArenaNet gives us real dungeons (not zerker-hp-sponge dungeon-set aka all original explorable dungeons) where you CANNOT just tear through the trash and melee boss without moving. Where things like conditions, epidemic, condition management and transfers, blinds, boonhate are not only viable, but necessary.

This is what necros need. Not cleave, no mobility, etc (although I would welcome them with true love). I just realised these things are not happening but better dungeons are.

spoj.9672:

Im curious. What build do you run on your necro when doing fractals. Also was the necro a choice you guys made or you just werent fussed. If you guys did choose to take a necro, why? For blind and weakness?

Naah, I’m just sick with my exclusively-since-beta necro. /joke

1. They told me, that it goes easier with me than with a guardian. Joke or not, I don’t care.
2. We tested Underground Fractal with a HGH engie and a hybrid necro with Epidemic once. The effect was tremendous, things melt. Well/Axe#3 boonhate is also useful I guess.
3. My necro rotation of S/D bleed, weapon switch, BiP, Reaper’s Touch, DSin, DSout Axe#2 with a well or two has decent DPS that never stops… all from 500+ range. 500 is so safe that you will always DPS, you are invincible. Warrior’s may have higher DPS, but they die more often, there is no discussion, they just do die more often if they want to maintain the damage output.
4. Well of Power and Well of Darkness are amazing in Cliffside Fractal.
5. I use Spectral Walk to eliminate one orb from the equation in Swamp Fractal and to smash last set of seals in Cliffside.
6. Spectral Grasp lets us pull Chanters on the second seal in Cliffside one by one, without anyone dying (lvl 70+) as well as pull Kittens-Mittens in Uncategorized Fractal so that they don’t aggro the kiting guy.
7. Lich Form the Dredge boss <trololo>
8. Epidemic on the Legendary Grawl Shaman with 15 stacks of bleeding and some other conditions just after the shield phase kicks in.

The utility is there. At least it is for me. I could go on and on, but I don’t feel there’s a point.

What I want you to understand, that things like a well used Spectral Grasp will save you a lot of time (less killing at once, no wipes, no additional spawns). I didn’t play all professions, but I know that in high level fractals where utility actually means something – a necro is really really good.

I’m at fractal personal level 62, I ran 77 just two days ago. I rarely use DS as a defensive mechanism. I rarely die. I think the change was a buff and even if it wasn’t (unlikely) I don’t care about it, because I don’t need it.

If I can do it, anyone can. That is all. Please adapt.

Also – Cogbyrn – I never thought I would see you once again on the forums. I remember you arguing with me about PvP just after the game started. So nice to see some release players still hanging around. ;D

Afya.5842:

Who goes to fractal without any guardian……..

I do. We casually ran 77 two days ago with a warrior, a mesmer, two eles and a necro.

Went smooth, no wipes, grawl shaman especially; it’s my favourite fractal, because I can basically faceroll it with my necro.

Yet, but that’s just me, and you are you.

I’m all in for buffs but you guys demonizing the necro as it was some kind of useless abomination is really depressing.

And to be fair, it’s all in the design of dungeons. I’m eagerly waiting for a condition heavy dungeon or fractal where necros will shine even more due to their utilities.

Edit:
Ohh and before you bash me that my comparison is skewed because I play with bads… I played with [SOLO] players that day and they have probably the best PvE squad on EU-side. Hell, they have the almighty Wethospu (probably the best PvE warrior on the planet Earth) and Haviz.

SkyChef.5432:

It seems you & I are talking past each other.
(…)
Play char 2 at any level from 43 & above will upgrade it to level 43. Playing at any level below 43 before reaching 43, will only upgrade to that level. No time gate, no weekly gate, no nothing. Would it be a better idea?

Yes, sorry SkyChef, I wrote it late at night and wasn’t completely thorough.

Of course what you propose would be better, for me and for you. As I stated, I just thought such system falls nicely into what needs to be maintained, like a feel of progression, a need to do have someone do low Fractals with beginners outside of dailies, and so on.

Wethospu.6437:

I think the point is to be a time gate because Anet loves that design.

Cleverrrr boy.

SkyChef.5432:

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I read it otherwise (and I did reread it just in case). His example clearly indicates that a person level 25 has to go though a time gate of 1 tier per week, util reaching the max personal level which one of his character has. So basically, instead of 48 time gates (use 48 as an example) w/ no restriction on time, we get 4 time gates of one successive tier per week. We just replace a time gate w/ another time gate even though it goes against all the reasons he has stated why a time gate is no longer necessary for experienced players.
If it’s not his intention, then I think an edit need to make to clear it.

The example is quite clear, at least for my standards.

It leaves everything as it is, you can progress any character through the normal means by playing incremental levels one after another.

But to clarify it even further:

If level 25 is your highest personal level and you have a new character with a lower level, you may want to unlock higher Fractals on that character as well. The system is designed as a catch-up vehicle.

I made a pic with some open source picture editor to try to showcase it better.
The green dots indicate possible personal levels in certain tiers ( 1 – between 1 and 9 ; 2 – between 20 and 25)

Basically:

1. 2 chars, one at personal level 25, the other at level 4 for example.
2. You complete level 4 or 5 or 6 or 7 or 8 or 9 with the new char. Your new personal level on that char is 5.
3. After doing that, you decide to try doing 10 or 15 or 79. Your personal level on that char after completing that isn’t 6, it is now 10!
4. On level 10 you decide to do 2 level 12 dailies. After two days your personal level is 12.
5. You do level 20 or 30 next. Your personal level is now 13 (week hasn’t passed).
6. After few more days you may want to go and try doing lvl 30. You succeed and your personal level gets bumped to 20!
7. Now you’re in the same difficulty tier with both characters.
8. You may decide to progress your main lvl 25 character to 30 through the ordinary means (completing 5 Fractal runs of appropriate difficulties) and then bump the new character by doing 30+ or you may want to progress your new character through the 20’s to 30’s and then bump your main character from 25 to 30.

Is that descriptive enough?

wolfie.7296:

leman.7682:

• Stacked spirit weapons and spirit weapon guardians

You are unbelievable. PLEASE IGNORE OP. THEY HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT.

A question for the op. What profession and build do you play most? What is your favourite?

;)

To make sure we understand each other. I like how those weapons look like, I like that they provide nice utility, but…

They are as guilty of creating unnecessary clutter and AI reliance as are minions and spirits. You just don’t see them that often.
If you’re a spirit weapon guardian and are afraid that I’m advocating the spirit weapon nerf, rest assured. On the contrary – I am all for making spirit weapons even more awesome, more fun and more viable.

And to answer your question, the lion share of my GW2 experience constantly since the beta was taken by the necro and recently by a ranger, both having had and still having problems in different aspects of the game. I also played a little bit of a warrior in PvP. These are my favourite professions.

Everyone stop, the patch isn’t even live yet.

You haven’t yet seen the impact of the mentioned bug that increased the damage taken in the DS. We don’t even know how big of an impact it had.

The internal cd on Spectral effects is surely painful, and I’m a sworn enemy of ICD’s but it is probably a necessary change not to give the necro 10 lives.

I hope that the Greater Marks business will push necromancer players towards some staff-less builds. I know how crazy it may now sound, but it won’t sound crazy when someone finally does that properly showing people that they can.

Lordrosicky.5813:

What about just reducing the size of all aoe to 180 radius from 240 + that is it currently?

What would that solve? People will still spam AoE on CC’d opponents. Warriors will still have to run through whole AoE cluster. The goal is to change the AoE so that it serves a purpose complimentary to the mostly single target damage.

I believe it would make the game more skill-based, coop-oriented and plainly better overall where people actually have the time to play those interesting mind games between each other.

Seriously, I believe that everyone got so used to the AoE that they forgot how in games the area-of-effect spells used to be the minority of available arsenal, not the viable majority.

To picture how things are right now, I played a tourny yesterday and we faced Henry and another necro in one team. At one point I got condi-spiked (good job, guys, btw) and I used my Plague Signet to send the whole load to you, Henry. Do you want this game to be like that? I use my signet and you get downed before you can react to it? Not to sound like bashing Henry, I’ll add that we lost to something like a 150, because I’m terrible. Just making a point.

Mad Rasputin.7809:

I should be able to get 15 level 48 fractal chests a day? Besides, what would keep me from ALT deleting and recycling to get more chests?

Go do Fractals 48 FIFTEEN times in one day. Do it for a week. Then come back and think again of the argument you just used.

I agree with Henry and disagree with Hman. His approach is elitist and completely unprofessional.

Not only your idea of listening only the top 2% of players has no chance of being ever realised, it also is flawed on the most basic level. Because people at the bottom have functioning minds as well (some of them probably a lot brighter than yours or mine). They don’t put as much time as you do into the game, but it doesn’t disqualify them from giving a valuable and valid feedback.

Reading your post, Hman, does exactly the opposite of what you’re advocating. It turns me from you and shows exactly why devs shouldn’t listen the top players only.

I play a lot of PvP, but I don’t consider myself a top player. Even then I’m able to express a well-thought analysis based on my experiences. You may want to take a look at the topic I just opened:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/I-wrote-GW2-Balance-Manifesto
to see how it’s done. I think the changes I proposed inside would help the game.

I believe in the test team that they have inside ArenaNet. Some of the top players may think their understanding of the game is superb, but ArenaNet understands much more than you may imagine.

That is all.

I wanted to write something about how ridiculously badly designed it is.
I wanted to give a suggestion to whoever came up with an idea of allowing AI controlled cluster army in PvP, but…

I looked at the picture again and started laughing hilariously.

I’m still laughing.:D

While I don’ entirely feel like I was laying in a trashbin, it is difficult to disagree with the main point.

Great number of GW1 players were disappointed with what GW2 turned out to be and have a right to feel cheated. Not going into what was the reason of such a poor state of PvP when the game launched, it is quite obvious that it has some grave design mistakes on the ground level that prevent and will prevent this game from being something truly remarkable and special.

Playing GW1 felt like playing chess with the extraordinarily intelligent opponent. Playing GW2 usually feels like playing rugby on a billiard table.

Not having anything better still keeps me playing GW2, but I wouldn’t call that a healthy situation.

Deep inside I hope that there are people at ArenaNet who are courageous enough to admit that Conquest isn’t the pinnacle of PvP design and it may have been a mistake and that the same people are able to come up with something much better (hint, hint, GvG) and are willing to take a bet with it.

Glad to see people discussing the topic.

I’d like to reiterate what I’m thinking:

1. Right now players don’t have the freedom. They have no choice in the matter.
2. Bad players could always and always will leech.
3. The change could possibly only, I emphasize, only, harm the new player experience, but it’s far from guaranteed, especially with the new LFG system incoming.
4. Improving the new player experience at the cost of the experienced (and quite likely the more dedicated) players ISN’T good either. It’s WRONG.

A suggestion that just came to mind having considered all replies in this thread –
Place a system that allows players to jump to a higher tier of Fractals once a week by completing Fractals at the higher tier than the character currently is.

How it works:

1. A player with a personal level 25 makes a new character with personal level 1.
2. He or she decides to play Fractals with this new char.
3. Goes into Fractals, completes them. If the level was equal or higher than 10, the player gets bumped to personal 10.
4. Repeats next week. If the level is higher or equal to 20, the character is bumped to personal level 20.
5. Cannot repeat it third time on the next week to get boosted to level 30 on any of the characters, unless the player reaches level 30 through the normal progression by then.

The outcome:
A small flow of ‘experienced’ players wanting to play lower level Fractals is maintained.
It’s time-gated.
The current system stays the same so there is no reason to worry about daily chests on each character.
There still is a progression, but it is diminished to a level where it is actually fun to progress multiple characters.

I’m adding this suggestion to my original post. Let me know, what you think and feel free to iterate on the idea to improve it or continue to post your own suggestions.

How to fix PvP and make it enjoyable in a few simple steps:

1. Nerf AoE, change it to utility-oriented, instead of damage-oriented.
2. Remove cheese.
3. Make sure you removed all cheese.
4 Don’t add new cheese.

Fixed.

Sabyne.6329:

With this change I can see an increasing number of people leeching from your party for more chance to get a weapon while they may not be experienced enough with their fresh new 80 or even geared properly. If you never pug that may not be a problem for you though.

This is why you ask for experienced people only. This is why you play with your guild, the people you know.

If someone has already reached personal 40’s, there is no reason to force that person to grind all over again.

spoj.9672:

Agreed. But would this mean they would take out being able to repeat dailys on different characters.

The assumption is, you would be able to do Fractals with whatever character you wanted, on whatever level you prefer, with each unique daily run yielding you a daily chest.

dzindzinier.6138:

btw forgot to write it :fear should have cooldown like stealth …..
when u put fear u cant put another fear for 5 secs ,and feared target is immune to fears for 5 secs,so another nekro cant fear him

I disagree, the fear lockdown is the same mechanic as the immobilise lockdown/knocklock. What is different between 2 eles training you with updrafts/kds or an engie immobilising you for an hour than a necro or 2 locking you in fears?

Regarding the overall of Xeph’s and other players’ posts, I have to agree – the meta is dumb, sorry but that’s what it is. Instead of nerfing AoE to “slow down the game” (Jonathan Sharp in SotG) we were given a power creep update that rose the offensive strength of my beloved necro so I can solo up to 3 people sometimes. It gave us one-shot eles. It gave us S/D thieves.

Is this what we want GW2 to become? A spamfest of AoE and a clutterfest of particles with little to no regard to tactics and timing that is not fun to play and even worse to watch.

A thought experiment: What would a tourny match look like if all AoE was turned off (ignore that some professions are based around AoE, let’s assume they would have a fair access to good builds)?
Would it be more interesting? More difficult? Skillful?

I don’t care about Kiel, I hate her. Supporting Evon all day long.

#KillKiel

I like Evon.

#ColinVotesEvon

DevO.9854:

Idea is great, also I hate people calling it Heroes Ascent, its Hall of Heroes or HoH, you can tell who didn’t play the original from the beginning.

You are wrong.

On topic: Throught the last 10 months many people have suggested bringing back GvG-type game mode with more tactical depth and more immersive setting than capping circles. It’s good to see Jonathan finally show up. I guess better later than never.

#SupportGvG

Can I cede my EU eligibility to Xeph? I will be more than happy to do it ;>

Please stop fighting and spread the love.

I know that the Devs are watching this.

So just a few observations of mine. I may update it in the future when I have more time.

1. Cannon room is a bit small for my taste
2. Glassy ground is considered an object just like boxes in Kyhlo allowing the necro to load life force by swinging dagger or staff or WH#5 just standing next to them. They, unlike Kyhlo boxes, don’t get destroyed giving you an easy full life force.
3. Using necro Dark Path (DS#2) on a target standing behind a glass pad won’t teleport you to the target, bu rather to the edge of the pad.

Despite those technical limitations, which I expect will be reprogrammed one day to work like intended I’m having a lot of fun. The map is growing on me, I’m starting to really really like it.

KarlaGrey.5903:

It’s all Leman’s doing.

The more Adam says I’m OP, the more I believe that and things like this start to happen.

#EverybodyLovesLemmy

In all seriousness, we just camped their spawn with necro AoE. This would happen to most teams. The moment you’re able to seal the opponent in their base, it’s basically a glory farmfest with players just running in and dying.

This would never happen in a rated match. Note: not saying necros (or rather aoe in general) don’t need tuning (they do).

Hint to everyone: evasion thieves are decent vs this necro.

So it seems Leman led his team into a glorious hot-join victory!

Hail, hail, Leman and hail hot-joins!

Iceflame.5024:

Rank doesn’t really show much. There are a lot of r40+ players that are not that good. I downed 2 people alone multiple times with an epidemic pre patch. So if we take this situation, it is extremely likely that they were very bad that time. If you had the 30/30/10 build and 3 people start focusing you, I cannot really imagine how you can get out of that.

Ohh, don’t get me wrong – skill-wise and rank-wise I definitely was above them, but they were an ele and an engie. I cannot see a possibility of these classes losing to a single necro, no matter how well played. I don’t think we’ve ever seen so much offensive potential in a single class in GW2.

Well, I’ve been playing mostly necro since beta tests.

Right now I can sometimes solo 2-3 players (depending on their rank/rating/skill/you-name-it).

You know something is wrong (am I that good, people that bad or unprepared to face new necro with a good player behind it, or is it the power of the profession?) when you down two r45+ players in a battle over the nod as a glass condi necro before going down yourself in a rated match.

Dhuumfire, you’ve served your purpose.

Thank you for showing us how OP things can become if you give too much to a profession at once.
We now know it was a mistake, the Torment would more than suffice, Terror does the job as well.

Necro burning needs to go. The profession needs to be brought back in line with others just like it was (relatively, taking all other profession buffs into account) pre-patch.

It should never, NEVER, be most optimal to spec into an ultra offensive (30,30,10) build like necros do right now. Please replace Dhuumfire with something that incentivizes skilled, timely and tactical gameplay instead of a mindless spamming of unblockable AoE.

Please bump this thread.