How about you let others play the way they want to play. Don’t like MF users? Don’t team up with them. I run MF often. I’ll anounce it most of the time. The only people QQing about MF are the stopwatch speed clearing teams that rage kick players just cause they couldnt shave 10 seconds of their record time. I rush all day at work and want to relax and take my time while playing a game.
Why wouldn’t you want to contribute more to the party?
i usually only hear about these kinda bugs when screwing around with skipping stuff and triggering cutscenes most the time or triggering a 2nd cutscene while a player is still watching a previous cutscene. never had any other issues, i love what they have done with the lava field where if he dies he just teleports next to you… so much better than before.
For me, the devourer nest glitch happens right after the 3 flamethrower guys are killed (no skipping of this fight) with no cutscenes initiated.
I encountered the first devourer nest glitch once. If I had to make a guess to what caused it, I would say it is advancing too quickly after killing the 3 flamethrower guys at the start.
Magg across the lava field has always been a little buggy of sorts. That’s the reason sometimes its better to split the party up and have 1 person solo the lava field. If I cross the lava field and still get stuck in combat, I will relog to get out of combat.
There is a thread around here that mentioned that if the NPC is in combat, the party is considered to be in combat mode and can’t wp.
I pretty much gave up on suggesting skills to party members. In my experience, ppl get way too defensive and refuse to try the skills. Even I phrase the suggestion as non-authoritative as I can, it won’t matter.
I do not mean skins purchased from dungeon tokens. There are legendaries you work towards. If legendaries are not your thing, there some other crafted exotics that take a fair bit of effort with skins that you might like.
Come back when you actually look at the legendary weapons. There are really only two I would even think about getting and I am not about to put forth the hours and hours of farming for them. This game shouldn’t just be a time sink, it should be fun as well as rewarding. A legendary just requires money, no skill required.
Im back
I am making twilight. Bought the precursor before the 28th Jan patch using the farming methods within. Also I am 96% into my lodestone requirements in term of lodestones and cores with all of them gotten via TA and FotM.
I AM using the methods i stated within. If you want to use dungeons as a vehicle to progress to your legendary, Im just showing you can for most parts. If you think legendaries are too much of a grind, thats a separate issue I’m afraid
Personally I just wanna provide some perspective, not really to start anything. I will just be on my way thanks
I do not mean skins purchased from dungeon tokens. There are legendaries you work towards. If legendaries are not your thing, there some other crafted exotics that take a fair bit of effort with skins that you might like.
Some of the pointers have not been updated with the new changes but the main idea is still there. And some of which can be recycled for use to craft other Magic Forge exotics.
Well when you guys say “AC Exp MoneyRuns” Doesnt that mean your going for farming AC for the maximum obtainable loot, regardless of difficulty or time? Hence, MF gear would fit into this run imo.
Actually the ac “money” runs I joined mainly kills Kholer, Troll and the champ gavelings that drops 5 silvers. Those runs pretty much means consuming omnom bars for the 40% gold find. Not magic find focused.
Then work on cosmetics and skins that you like. That can be another “long” term alternative.
I am personally not too worried about dungeons and I have been running dungeons actively more or less since launch till now and will be still running dungeons for a good period of time to come. I believe it is in ANet best interest to keep players around for dungeons and other content since they have a cash shop. They need a good volume of players to continue playing for their game.
Just because trash are placed at wherever there are DOESN’T mean you have to kill them. Join parties that specified not skipping trash. Problem solved.
No one in their right mind would wish not to skip trash mobs, that’s just common sense. Take a look at gw2lfg and try to just find one ad that says that. (I bet it’d be a miracle)
The OP might be trying to take the high ground but frankly I doubt he’d really opt to waste a bunch of extra time and effort himself just killing trash mobs with no real gain.
I personally will not be so absolute about it. If a newcomer were to try dungeons, imo they have a reason to fight trash, which is to adds to whole dungeon experience. And clearing trash facilitates wp respawning (when out of combat of course).
People have their own reasons to play dungeons the way they want. I don’t see the reason to corner ppl into following a specific playstyle when the choice of running dungeons via skipping OR clearing trash exists.
From what I gathered, ANet intentionally do not want GW2 to be a gear treadmill. BiS items can be obtained with reasonable ease (don’t know how well ascended items fit in the original intentions though). Cosmetics and skins are obviously still subjected to a treadmill of sorts.
Just because trash are placed at wherever there are DOESN’T mean you have to kill them. Join parties that specified not skipping trash. Problem solved.
Another thing is that within stat combinations, there are major and minor stats. Take a lvl80 exotics GS for example. A Berserker GS has 179pow/128prec/9%c.dmg (power is the major stat) and an Explorer GS has 128pow/128prec/3%mf (mf is the major stat). The Explorer GS will lose out the primary stat of 9%c.dmg as well as 51 power – together will lead to significant loss in dmg.
So basically one will be leveraging party effectiveness with better chance to get good loot for oneself.
Kill rocket turrets. Kill Golems when they spawn (You can skip the last one or even skip killing more of them if you like).
Stay away from his freeze blast. Avoid hitting him when his ice shield is up if you can. I don’t see why anyone would want to intentionally tank his ice attacks.
A dungeon, that has decent drop from trash, maybe chance at t6 mats, small chance at rares maybe etc…but does not really reward you at the end EXCEPT the chance at a pre-cursor or a super rare item like Volcanus.
It would be easy to medium difficulty to promote running it.
i think most people skip because its actually harder to fight the trash, then it is to run through it.
Example: TA First Set Of Nightmare Hounds. Many teams have at least 1-2 players go down if fought, however, running past and dodgeing once, you will only take 1 hit.
Actually, for me its the other way round. If the party is weak, I will suggest fight more of those trash mobs. Cause chances is some of the team mates will need to respawn and run back to rejoin the party.
The hounds for TA does knockdown and if the person skipping cant dodge or got no stability or stunbreakers, might as well get the party to kill those trash.
Worst part is – they could already have the intention to kick on the first fractual due to whatever reason and proceed to troll you by kicking at Jade Maw.
1. Twilight
2. No completed Gifts
3. I have the precursor, more than 90 Oynx Lodestones, 77 clovers and about 1/3 of the t6 mats. Really taking it easy after I got my precursor. Going to get more badges after I am done with the lodestones.
I’m Designer Hrouda, and this is my favorite thread on the forum.
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That being said, we are always looking at our reward tables. I agree with you that a blue is very unsatisfying of a reward for GL and other instances. Part of our Dungeon work coming down the line is going to involve changing reward tables and whatnot, so please be patient as we work through things as fast as we can.
Thanks Robert. Great job thus far and looking forward to the updates.
There’s a very real chance that you’ll use up all your money and have nothing, then you’ll want to quit the game.
Almost happened to me. Foolish for me to think just because another guy got it, that I could.
300g later, nada. Thanks for recognizing my skills and dedication arenanet, oh wait getting a legendary takes none.
If your current gold pool isn’t “easy” to come by, then you should just avoid gambling the MF. Beside the possibility of beating out the price hike to eventually buy one, if ANet decides to do something that will bring down precursor prices (eg another Karka event), you will need a good amount to take advantage of these situations.
In the meantime, use other means to dabble in the MF eg Dungeon weapons.
Would this solve the problem? If you have 3 guildies and two pick-ups the abuse will continue. 4 votes, well today I joined a group with 4 people form the same guild. They could have kick trolled me if they wanted to. But there is another side to this, 3 to 4 votes and it becomes difficult to kick a bad player if they have a friend and/or you just have a person who doesn’t like kicking people.
I think maybe a better option would be a cumulative vote. I.e. if you kick someone before or shortly after the first boss (or first fractal), you just need two votes. Second boss or second fractal, you need three votes. Any point after that you need all four people to agree. This way you prevent the end chest trolls but also have a good safety net to kick disagreeable players.
I think a 3 vote kick is hardly foolproof but it does make it slightly harder for a group of individuals to grief or troll in this manner. Your suggestion is not a bad idea too.
However, if a group of individuals intend to grief/troll by majority vote kicking (even to the extent of 4 of them grouping together to make LF1M requests specifically to grief/troll) they are likely to succeed. Sad but true.
When supply is really low the price can fluctuate easily because when one is bought, it will go to the next like regular items. But unlike regular items, there isn’t really the 1c undercut here so there’s a good difference in price. This means you can have listings like 900g, 800g, 600g. If the 600g is bought, then the price goes up 33% to 800g. The high listing fee on these items also means people won’t be taking them down to relisting them at a lower price for undercutting either.
^just posted this to explain how it can move up in price so quickly in two days.
And of course anything too low in price will be bought quickly by flipping merchants or people who want to keep the value up.
What you mentioned in the first part not likely. I bought my dusk just before the 28th Jan Patch. When I bought it, there was a supply of about 11 and the most expensive Dusk did not exceed 700g.
If you went on gw2spidy at the time of this post using the 1 day history, you can see there is a step function where the sell order line is raised from ~650g to 990g in the span of 2hrs.
I CANT SEE HIS STUPID CHARGE UP ABILITY or whatever you guys call it. Ive heard “Dodge when he raises his sword” – Except when hes fighting, he raises his sword 100 times becuase, thats how you hit people. So he raises sword every second.
So how can you dodge reliabily if you cant see him? Id try to melee, but his whirl will own me and i cant heal while poison and have enough health left.
Same people who tell me l2 kholer etc end up dying too – thats the funny part! its a downed party but some people clearly think theres a way to do kholer without ever dying..
Well for me, I will look out for the animation of his right arm slowly leveling to horizontal level. (slowly as in the span of 1-2secs). The charging sparks to me is unreliable as there might be alot of effects surrounding him that might mask the sparks.
And knowing how the charging attack looks like doesn’t mean that someone is immune to the attack. All it takes is a moment of distraction and you will get hit by the pull.
In both situations you have people trying to cheat their way out of dealing with whatever the dungeon throws at them. Enemies that can be skipped are a design issue just as much as WP-rushing is. So if one gets the attention of the designer, so should the other one.
By describing skipping as “cheating”, you have indirectly classified skipping as a form of exploit. Skipping (as in running thru mobs and breaking leash) is not an exploit.
It is an exploit if it is done in a dungeon. You can and should be allowed to do that in the open world.
Claiming that “breaking leash” in an instanced map is “acceptable behavior” is admitting a design issue. Or maybe there is a new trend now amongst the game designers to create content that is required to be ignored.
I skip mobs in the open world by breaking leash when I am doing other objectives like farming nodes. Why should it be any different in dungeons?
If it bothers you so much. post for groups that specifies “absolutely no skipping allowed”. You have your group of like-minded individuals. And ppl like me stay far away.
If you are already performing well and not dying before the patch, this feature will not make much of a difference.
Makes me wonder about those that turn up dead during boss encounters though. If I am still fighting bosses, rezzing the dead (not downed) will take a long time and I might not be that motivated to do so. Especially if it might make me more vulnerable to attacks, since I cant be mobile during that time.
Yea… seems like someone bought the remaining 5 or so dusk that were priced 600+g. Its pretty bad.. Even though i bought mine earlier on, 990g is way too much….
In both situations you have people trying to cheat their way out of dealing with whatever the dungeon throws at them. Enemies that can be skipped are a design issue just as much as WP-rushing is. So if one gets the attention of the designer, so should the other one.
By describing skipping as “cheating”, you have indirectly classified skipping as a form of exploit. Skipping (as in running thru mobs and breaking leash) is not an exploit.
I am personally neutral to the changes involving wp respawning as it doesn’t really affect me much (besides the obvious strategy changes in some dungeons parts like Magg Bomb Room). I think ppl need more time to get used to this feature.
However I feel that it is a system that penalizes newcomers to a greater extent than before. If a member is killed in combat at a boss encounter, they can’t re-enter the encounter and lose out on the loot. Newcomers who are unfamiliar to boss attacks will tend to get killed easier and since they have to stay dead until they get rezzed (if the team even bother to rez), they have less chances to learn from these boss encounters.
Dead members can’t really depend on others to rez as rezzing the dead (not downed) takes a lot of time. To add to that, many (especially in PuGs) do not know how to rez properly. Eg when someone has aggro of the boss, he should lead the fight away from the dead so that they can be rezzed properly. Most of time, PuGs would flock to the dead team mate and bring the aggro along with them.
It doesn’t take any skill to skip enemies. Simple as that.
I agree with that it should be made impossible to skip , I mean if they think “WP-rushing” is bad how can skipping be allowed?
On a side note, I make sure I let people know at the beginning of a dungeon that there will be no skipping: some might leave, but most agree and stay.
WP-Rushing is different from skipping.
As for skipping takes no skill. Well, it still does take some knowledge of what mob you are skipping in order to skip effectively. (eg. equip stability skills for mob with knockdown skills).
I run full clears with my mesmer almost everyday (forward/forward | forward/up | up). If I have time, I will do another full clear with my guardian. Except for blossoms, the other aspects of the dungeons is pretty standard and all 3 paths can be done in good time.
This is a much better sounding post than before. Thank you.
Within Robert’s quote I gave with regards to skipping, he gave some insight on some reservations he considered when increasing incentives to mob kills. I know making improvements based on feedback isn’t about oppressing me. I never said it did. More specifically I have the same reservations as what Robert mentioned which is incentivizing with better loot. If it is not implemented well, it could do more harm than good.
If you wanna take things at face value, go right on ahead. Why can’t I think about the motivations bout why ppl dislike/like so much about skipping?
I don’t get the 2nd part of your comment. Because I personally run dungeons for my reasons. At the same time, I fully respect why others want to run the dungeons their own ways. I do not intend to impose my playstyle onto others so I am selective when joining groups. So I would appreciate if you don’t make it sound like it is all about me because it isn’t.
Well, you may be talking off the top of your head,
but you basically said what’s on the table anyway. So yeah, I sure hope we agree. :p
Magic Find is kind of it’s own big barrel of problem that needs it’s own clever solution. I’m not saying making trash mobs have a better risk/reward ratio wouldn’t be affected by it, but I am saying it’s not like Magic Find couldn’t stand to be altered anyway. And really, that’s a crummy reason to force content to remain stagnant when so many people are asking for an improvement.
The way I see it most of these cries for changes are the one who had bad experiences by bad parties with unhelpful team mates. Bag gamers with bad attitudes. No amount of game mechanics can change how these group of ppl react. And the most obvious solution has already been given which is partying with like-minded ppl. Many ppl ask for changes and there are also many voices on the contrary.
As of now, there are a different variety of ppl running dungeons for different reasons. And currently you can CHOOSE to run dungeons the way you way you want provided some effort is made at the group forming stage. Choice.
It’s one of those human things to do something with the path of least resistance and danger, especially when there is a reward at the end. I could make enemies never drop their aggro on players and force them to fight every single mob, but I don’t see that as a viable solution right now.
I think the better solution is to look at why people are skipping things, and approach from a different angle. Trash mobs have too much HP, and can’t be counted on for lucrative drops from a Risk/Time vs Reward, so people interested in making money (most groups) aren’t incentivized to do it, whereas the end chest/boss are more guaranteed and accountable returns on time and risk. I also think there is something to be said about interesting trash mob mechanics making them more enjoyable of a fight.
I can’t make the rewards from trash mobs so lucrative though that people just farm the first couple trash mobs/boss in a dungeon and then rinse/repeat. We encountered this when people just farmed the first boss in an instance and then restarted it (earlier around launch time), and we had to adjust the content as a result. It’s a fine line you have to walk to encourage players to get to the end, but make the process of getting there rewarding enough as well.
I don’t imagine this next update will resolve all the skipping behavior. The path of least resistance is engrained in people, and even if I do everything I could to incentivize people, there will still be those who skip stuff. I have been fixing exploits that will require players to complete more of the events in dungeons, but I am sure people will still skip what they can to get to their end goal.
For now I would encourage those not looking to skip to find some folks who don’t like skipping and make a guild with them… or maybe look for guilds that are dedicated to not skipping, and tag along with them. I’m in a couple of them (anonymously), and it really is an effective solution to playing the game the way you want to play it: Find other people with similar interests and band together with them.
Giving trash mob better incentives theoretically can make skipping less attractive. But it raises other problems like Magic Find Leechers. There always be ways to optimize the process of gaining rewards from dungeons and there will always some sort of separation between ppl who want to approach dungeons differently. Best way forward is to link up with like-minded ppl to run dungeons together.
As for speedruns causing inflation, I think you got it backwards. Prices of some mats and items on the TP are priced ridiculously high to start with. If you do not wanna play the TP, dungeons is the next viable option to earn gold at a rate that is HIGHER than rate of price increase of such items (eg. precusors, lodes). If I want to afford a pricey precursor on the TP (which I have already recently bought), skipping makes farming the gold needed more efficient.
A long post triggered by bad experiences. When you are LFG, pick the one that suits your playstyle such full clears or skip all trash. You have a higher chance to get what you want. If you join a generic group that doesnt post much details on what they are looking for, you might get ppl with different things in mind playing together.
I agree with CelestialWyrm on time-cost reward. But I disagree on inexperienced parties skipping to make it easier. If im in a group with newcomers, I generally want to clear trash mobs as much as possible. This to faciliate newcomers to run back from a spawn point if needed.
They will just pass over the additional costs back to the buyers.
Only if the buyers are prepared to pay it. Buyer be-dumb-dumb.
What are you commenting on exactly? Currently, precursors are already priced at a point where buyers are willing to pay or rather what the sellers think buyers can pay for. And sellers should automatically know to factor in 15% taxes to get an idea how much they can receive from the sale.
With what OP suggested, sellers will just consider the new tax rates instead the static 15% and adjust accordingly.
@Hamrammur: Most of the bosses agony attacks can be avoided. It might mean a lower margin of error so the ppl in your static group just need to be a little more careful.
For Jade Maw, just depend on your teams to heal/rez you. After all it is only those 2 attacks. Since it is a static group, I don’t think the others will be too mindful of helping of you since they are well aware of your predicament.
I must apologize for the tone of my post- too many bugs in last nights session- ended up on the forums, and so my annoyance showed.
HAVING a legendary DOES show your prowess. . .that youve got 100% map completion, done x dungeon y times for the tokens, and got lots of karma and skill points, and badges.
The mats can be bought so in my eyes are not a signs of prowess ( granted they cost lots/ take time to farm)
BUT i am sure there are people in the game that have EVERYTHING except the precursor, and because of this do not have a legendary, so they cannot show their prowess to the world because they did not have a RANDOM precursor drop.
The only thing that should be random is the clovers
EVEN putting 4 unique weapons in the forge does not guarantee a precursor
HOW DIFFICULT WOULD IT BE TO ADD A FEW RECIPES TO THE FORGE?
4 FIREBRINGERS= 1 ZAP
EDIT: so there’s 20 known precursors so add 20 recipes to the forge- surely its not that difficult/complicated????
You know I’d agree with you if gambling to get a precursor was the only way to get it…OH WAIT
You can buy it off the TP!
It’s your fault you decided to gamble. You lost, stop crying about it and learn that you will lose more often than you will win.
Precursors that wind up on the TP still come from the same source. Either MF or loot. Both which is subjected to super low RNG. TP only serves to provide a means to distribute precursors from certain players to others. It does not actually add value to the system.
Except those gotten from previous exploits of course.
some soulbound runes can’t be reforged in the MF. like the monk and balthazar ones :|
Nope. Major runes that are soulbound can be re-rolled just fine. I run dungeons alot and frequently find dungeon runes (that are soulbound on acquire). I always throw them into the forge to re-roll. Not the superior version of the dungeon runes of course.
I’m pretty sure they can be rerolled (four exotic runes gives one random rune back). The problem is that some runes and sigils doesn’t show up at all in the mystic forge despite not being a “dungeon” rune/sigil, like the superior rune of intelligence.
Nope. Superior sigils cannot be re-rolled. Reason some of the superior sigils can appear in the forge is because they are part of the recipe to create something else like legendaries. (Eg. Twilight needs the superior sigil of blood and so that sigil can be placed into the MF)
Even though I generally run dungeons by skipping most/all trash, I too have nothing against groups that want to kill trash. I started running dungeons about a month after launch and even up to point I completed my 2 characters with dungeon skins, I was still doing full clears.
I believe newcomers should at least give full clear dungeons a chance. At least experience the content in its…. entirety I guess. However, there are also gamers like myself who have basically ran dungeons to the ground. Our priorties changed and we run dungeons with different purposes in mind.
Grouping with like-minded ppl to run dungeons really just makes the experience more enjoyable.
