It’s fine in PvP for 1v1’s, but it’s lack of cleave really brings it down fast in team fights. I do think it would probably be a little too OP if it DID cleave as a ranged power weapon tho… So I dunno. It’s fine for what it is I guess—a power option to quickly build life-force from range so you can close to reaper/GS, with some boon removal thrown in.
guilds stil pick Revenant for raids.
I would like for you to run a test… Login to the game on your rev, and put yourself in the Raid LFG channel as “Rev lf any wing 80+li” and see how many people still want to pick Rev for raids.
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Some people seem to forget that most of these skill changes are PvP only and even with some damage reduction Precision Strike will still be good. Its not like these skill changes wont hurt, but Revenant wont be destroyed.
Well last patch already took them out of the Raid Meta, so PvP was about all Rev’s had left for end-game content.
One of the Dev’s involved in the making the balance mains a DH and was badly beaten by a Rev.
I was just saying to my guild earlier that the only explanation is that when the balance team all gets together to play, the only good player amongst them plays Rev… So, like, it seems way over the top awesome.
So, they think rev is OP in team fights, but they nerf the damage of precision strike, an ability that is super hard to land for max damage in team fights… Okay.
Wow, poor revenants… Take away their survivability last patch and now their burst. =(
The new build on metabattle works really well for me
http://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Reaper_-_ProcmancerThis one feels so much more solo friendly compared to previous meta builds. It has easy-to-use and frequent AOE boon corruption and very good sustain as well.
I don’t know if I like this build or not… I admit it has sneaky survivability with the Adventure Runes/Your Soul Is Mine! combo and probably actually out boon corrupts the other builds.
But like, at the end of the game, my damage in it is super weak compared to Signetspite—often with my power damage topping my condi damage by a little…
I blame the millions of guardians in solo queue and the loss of unblockable Staff Marks.
Also, DP thiefs absolutely wreck this build as you don’t have enough life force to survive their hit and runs.
Then again, maybe I just wasn’t using it right… I only rocked it for like six games when it first came out, then got mad and switched back to Signets so I could wreck guardians again.
EDIT: Also, squishy life-force makes it really hard to stomp and no Dhuumfire or Death Perception make it impossible to cleave in this build… So, you have to rely on your team to finish off downed people in team fights, which is SUPER frustrating in solo queue.
(edited by narcx.3570)
I run Agony/Earth with Geomancy on my Warhorn.
Geomancy does more damage against targeting dummies, or fights where you can stay in melee range so long as you swap weapons/flash reaper shroud on cooldown, but I don’t really think that’s realistic in a lot of the t4’s or raid fights, so I just run Earth and swap to WH if I find myself in melee range for the geo proc.
I think power’s fine for 1v1 and solo queue… It’s just that going condition brings so much more pressure to a team fight and 1v1’ing vs classes that use a lot of Aegis/Regen/Vigor/Retaliation (scrapper, guard, ele, drood) as those four boons are corrupted into damaging condi’s.
And for the OP who said they have trouble 1v1’ing against rev’s, always take Rise! as a utility vs them. Each little rat you have out drastically reduces the damage of Precision Strike and Unrelenting Assault (their two biggest go-to-damage sources), as both these attacks split their damage between available targets. Rise! also gives a passive damage reduction and can be handy vs Guardians as you can use it to trigger their traps before you close to melee range in reaper. Basically, if you see their team has 2 or more revs/guards in the comp (which a lot do), take Rise!.
Shiro/Jalis until you unlock Facet of Elements for permanent swiftness.
- Impossible Odds until out of energy (legend swap)
- Inspiring Reinforcement + Staff 4 (you don’t even hafta stop running as IR expands outward)
- Repeat
- Enjoy perma Superspeed to Swiftness uptime.
Mallyx is okay, but Revs are too lacking in condi weapon options to make great use of it
Mallyx sort of acts as an aoe condition weapon though because most rev’s just flash demon stance for the aoe burn proc and then spend all of their energy spamming banish enchantment. But ya, mace is horrible… It’s not realistic to stay on a target with mace’s auto attack and not just get annihilated by a quick focus fire.
I used Shiro/Jalis for getting my hps… But that was mainly just so I could staff 4 blast the Jalis lightning fields for swiftness until I unlocked Facet of the Elements. Then it was Glint/Shiro all the way.
I love having a rev in the group… Swiftness helps the slower classes stay alive in so many fights, perma-fury is great, and Natural Resonance really shines in a 5-person group. Plus, never have to worry about a breakbar with a rev up in the mix. Super useful.
Also, I don’t think you’d have a problem staying alive if you’ve played thief. Kind of the same—don’t stand infront of the boss, rotate your blocks/evades, etc… Only, you also get Facet of Light so you can pretty much reset your health in any PvE scenario if ya mess up and take a big hit.
The Model Zephyr Sanctum needed for this achievement needs to be added to either All tiers of the vender or their Tools tab, because as is, it’s almost impossible to buy…
Dry Top goes from Tier 1 to Tier 2 in about 30 seconds after the zone resets, giving you such a small window to get this done.
Previous comments all ring true… So well tuned.
And so much more enjoyable than raids since I can actually bring my revenant.
Isn’t jalis and glint the norm for pve?
From what I understand for power builds is running glint and jalis. Who are you using with glint?
Per fractals, if there was a chrono in your party it was Glint/Jalis, if not then Glint/Shiro.
For raids it was usually Glint/Mallyx so you could be on the boon removal team.
However, since the last patch it’s “just play warrior” since nobody will take your rev to raids.
Hmm, for what game type?
In pve, the main reason people want a rev is for the buffs. So I’d say no.
In PvP, I dunno… Not even factoring in the group buffing, Glint still has a lot of useful skills (invulnerability, reveal, weakness, ranged vulnerability stacking, and an instacast condition to boon clear if you’re using Leadership Runes). So you’d be trading all that for Jalis’ super expensive slow/taunt, wierd stability lightning field that you can blast for group swiftness I guess, a group protection that’s really only good if you take retribution to make it work on condis, a decent heal, and hammers—which can actually get you killed vs anyone who reflects ranged damage on their blocks.
For WvW. Maybe… Although with the amount of running around vs actual fighting, I’d probably kill myself without lazy perma-swiftness.
(edited by narcx.3570)
People have already touched a bit on the survivability aspect, but this is really the main reason why Viper necro is used so much in fractal and why many groups are t4 viper necro only (with the exception of an optional ranger).
Viper necro has parasitic trait and has better heal-over-time than warrior heal sig. With multiple enemies, the trait alone can make a necro heal so much that they are practically immune to damage. Add to that, 50% damage reduction from “Rise”, shroud when focused by a boss, and stability/escape with low CD.
All this while doing acceptable damage for a class on full dps gear, and exceptional dps when coordinating epidemic, and you got a very pug friendly class where the priority is to finish a fractal in decent time with minimum fuss. It also work well with the fractal tonics which provides endurance and speed buffs which necro commonly lacks. the defense tonic work well with the high health pool that necro got (and in shroud), and the offensive tonic combos with the parasitic trait.
I don’t see the point in running parasitic and rise, you give up so much for it. What do pugs drop for rise, anyway? It’s even more weird when you see those people still die frequently…
While I would never take Parasitic, because the DPS loss is too great, you don’t lose too much by taking Rise!… In a pug, epidemic is barely even worth taking—and if you really have faith in your puggers/really want to do epidemic—you can always drop Poison Cloud, since your minions will die and leave poison fields for you to combo in anyways. Sure, you can’t aim them so to speak, but they’ll always be dying right on the boss, so it’s usually not an issue.
I also wouldn’t underestimate the dps Rise! will give you when facing the Afflicted Instability. The extra condition transfers they provide let you use Plague Signet’s passive to soak condi’s for your team without having to interrupt your normal dps rotation.
Quick Tips vs DH’s (as you can imagine it’s mostly all about traps):
If you get caught by Maw, you can utilize the slow effect for extra long blocks—just remember to not do this if their F1 is off cooldown, as it’s unblockable.
You can purposely trigger their traps to proc extra big Infused Light heals if you’re falling behind.
When you see them lay down new traps, they are definitely probably going to try to use F1 to pull you into them. Use your Gaze of Darkness and Staff 3 blinds and put some distance between yourself and the guardian to allow more space/time to react with an evade.
Always make sure when you’re going for your burst that you are either in Glint with your legend swap off CD or, if you’re stuck in Shiro, make sure that you don’t dip below 35 energy so you can pop Phase Traversal to finish them off through their Focus 5/F3.
Most will be using Marauder’s, but pay attention to the damage their burning is doing… If they are in a condi-burn-hybrid-build type thing, you’ll need to play a lot more aggressively (and can as they probably won’t have as many traps or as much defensive stats) and stay on top of your cleanses.
As for fighting them 2v1… I mean, yeah, you shouldn’t really be excepting to win or trying to roll through 2v1 situations in sPvP. Rev’s really excel in +1’ing people around the map and boon sharing in team fights; that should more be your focus.
Additionally Rev disengage is pretty poor unless you are fortunate to find some mobs in the direction you need to go. Even then the disengage is no where near the level of stealth heavy builds. So while you can still roam on Rev it is best to duo with something that can help you cover your weaknesses such as an auramancer.
Gaze of Darkness really needs a bigger range and lower cooldown… Stealth builds in WvW are getting big time out of control.
Wait, what’s the trick to solo’ing the heat room?
Edit: Never mind, I thought you meant the triple switch room in underground… Was gonna say 0.o
I’ve seen a good amount of people in t4’s that switched to GS Dagger/X (Spite, Blood, Reaper) after the Jagged Horror nerf…
While the new toughness scaling in high tiers make it a realistic choice damage-wise, IMO the last thing your group needs is some squish pants necro up in melee range adding to the Social Awkwardness ticks and needing to be rezzed all the time since he has no blocks.
If you can somehow stay alive up there and not agony bomb your group’s warrior/rev/thief with Social Awkwardness, I guess go for it… But Condi is still a more reliable source of constant damage and much easier to stay alive—at least for me.
I’d like them to add mystic clovers to the dungeon reward tracks.
I think you need the damage trait as without the damage.. good players of other classes will outlast you as you don’t have enough damage so all of their defense skills will be ready again as you don’t have the damage to kill them and they will kill you sooner or later.
The thing is, all of his other traits and weapon choices point to this being a flash shroud build… Taking a trait that only increases your damage in shroud would be counter-productive to the rest of the choices he made.
Warrior is fun to play when I’m too drunk to play Rev.
Warrior players will rush to defend themselves as not being OP, yet I then see them launch themselves into the center of ten enemy players without a second guess because they know they can drop a couple of them and not die… Don’t see a lot of other professions doing that.
- Its damage is still tied to the weapon you’re using, this means you can get some high crits with this with a staff /GS due to higher base weapon damage. It can lead to some very good shroud burst from SS+SH+CN+CoD ( depending on what you have traited, can lead to some nasty damage)
I think your use of Spiteful Spirit is pretty interesting… I’ve never really seen anyone use it before. Ever. But now that I think about it, it’s not a bad way to stack some extra boon removal into a Spite build if you don’t want to use Signets. Especially if you pop shroud right after normal Unholy Feast—4 boons corrupted in AoE form is pretty good. Although, with chilling victory, I feel like there are very few scenario’s that you’re going to chill 5 targets with your Sigil of Hydromancy… That thing’s range is pretty meh.
But anyways, only vanilla shroud scales with your weapon, Reaper form’s skills are calculated using Hammer damage… For some reason.
(edited by narcx.3570)
Mesmer’s are prolly the worst of the lot, even if they’re power.
Necros are rough too (even power necros can be a very downhill fight if they’re using Rise! to negate your Precision Strike/UA.
Thiefs give me a lot of trouble 1v1 since the Enchanted Dagger nerf… Warriors are sort of in the same boat here too, but not as bad.
Eles, Scrappers, Druids, and Dragonhunters are fine.
And of course, you should always try force a fight with the other team’s Revenant if they have one, as you’ll both have the most fun that way.
The problem is always the same: condi or power, we don’t have any build able to win a real 1vs1 against any other class (maybe against an ele or a bad engi).
I dunno, I know this is a power-build thread, but you mentioned condi not standing a chance, and really it’s still quite strong in a lot of matchups. Fighting Revenants (especially if you’re using Rise! as your utility) is almost unfair to the point of being gross. Eles, droods, engineers, and dh’s all shouldn’t be giving you too much of a problem either as all of your boon corruption blankets your damage from cleanses and puts them on the defensive almost from the start.
I think the real problem is, 90% of the people you’ll be fighting in a 1v1 scenario in PvP are warriors and thiefs, and those are some of the most broken matchups in the game. =(
(edited by narcx.3570)
In what way is the axe excellent for might generation? The only thing I think you could mean is via Chilling Victory, as axe 2 can land a lot of hits really quick? But then again, if your using the axe, you should really be using Decimate Defenses, as one of the only things the axe does well is build stacks of vulnerability.
double post. =(
You can absolutely still raid with a rev if your guild/friends all want to specifically gear around running with a rev… Which, I guess some people will? But, in reality, once the top guilds decide to gear a certain way and run with a certain composition, your chances of getting into a PUG group as anything outside of that meta is very slim…
This is especially true for revenants/natural resonance as it was easier/more efficient for the top guilds to just make their rev switch to chrono than to have a bunch of people re-gear for 17% boon duration.
It’s not like when they say, nerfed necro’s dps… Because they can still come as a condi dps and it doesn’t affect the rest of the raid at a dynamic or core level—just its max dps.
I mean, I guess you don’t NEED 100% quickness for these fights, but you’ll never convince a PUG group of that. So sadly, if you don’t have a core group of friends that are willing to play with you and your rev, you’re going to have to swap his gear over to a warrior or DH. =(
The real sad part of this is that, even if a.net completely reversed the natural resonance/SoI nerf (which they won’t), I feel like the meta would just be too lazy to switch back and rev’s will still be left standing out in the cold until something changed that made everybody drastically rethink the core composition of raids again.
How do you guys beat a druid with any of these builds? OR a thief? OR a warrior?
Thief nor druid should be able to kill you with traited CC plus correct positioning. For warrs swap spectral armor for Boon Corrupt and if you kite properly you should end by killing him(or at least have a fair chance)
So you cab kill druids and thiefs no problem? might add you aswell to see that.
Sure, you can survive a thief’s onslaught pretty easily as a necro, but the problem is that it’s literally impossible to kill a good thief as a necro. Even if you chain together some cc, a good thief will escape and then it’s stealth and reset. Stealth and rest, stealth and reset, stealth and reset until either you get lucky with your AoE marks to pull him out of stealth or he eventually wears down your life force. Not the most fun.
As for warriors, I think we actually have the advantage condi vs condi, but it’s going to be a real long fight… But if they’re power, no chance.
Druids are whatever… It’s a pretty fair fight, probably slanted in our favor as boon corruptions absolutely destroy their chance of doing serious damage to you. You can usually just go HAM at them, force them to use their celestial form as a cleanse, and then repeat because they won’t have their cooldowns back before you do.
Oh, this is all from a condition necro PoV tho… I’m sure power necros might have it a little easier vs warriors—only have to wait out two pain suppressions (8 secs) instead of two suppressions and 24 seconds of resistance.
I know it wouldn’t make sense, because it’s direct target, but letting axe 1 cleave would go a long, long, long, loooooooong way towards making it viable.
I honestly can’t really give you any one Condi Reaper build because not only are there many marginally different flavors of it, but I also personally play some of the stranger ones well, which I wouldn’t really go out of my way to share with people. I guess when in doubt, this one is always fine for 1v1s:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNBmWD7kGRoyGszGw2GgeTsgLYUph2wXA6qFAWAxXxu4YE-TZhHwACuIAHLDA4IAUe/hAPAAA
I think for condi-dueling you’re better off going with Corruptionmancer than Signetspite. Signetspite is definitely a lot more powerful, but you’re kind of locked into using your signets and trying to burst them down in that limited window where their boons are corrupted and your might stacks are still up.
Corruptionmancer allows for a lot more flexibility in your utility skill choices as it’s strength comes more from trait combinations. And being able to swap to the right utilities is what dueling is all about.
I dunno tho, I think if you really want to get into dueling you should stick with a power build… One vs. One, condi is pretty easily countered (unless you’re fighting a rev) and even if you do win, the other person will just laugh you off with “condi is cheese.” And let’s be honest, dueling is all about the e-kitten—you don’t want to give them any outs.
if you dont have stab vs a thief you will be cc to death, ret is better than invo, no point breaking a stun just to be stunned again, normally power revs use both invo+retribution, while condi rev uses retribution+resistant boon, but with the nerf to retribution both classes have taken a hit.
As a power rev, I can say that I don’t think I could play without Devastation… 0.o
The Viper Horror build still works, however you’d run blood magic mid-bot-bot instead. Death Magic is dead. Also take the berserker rune variant over thorns, except you plan on raiding with your necro and don’t want to dish out for two sets of gear.
If I’m with another necro in the group I absolutely take Blood/Epidemic, but since the nerf, I’m always like the only necro in my t4 groups and have found better success with Death/Rise since there’s nobody to play Epidemic-Pong with. Just a different sort of success, as you’re mainly using taking Death here for all the extra poison fields instead of the bleed stacks like before. (Also fueling Thorns.)
I think there’s a lot of things that will give you trouble with this build in sPvP…
As previously mentioned, conditions are going to wreck this hard… Also, I’m not sure how reliable Well of Power is as a stun break since it has a cast time? Seems like a lot of common cc chains would drop you before you had a chance to lay it down.
Also, I get why you picked Blood, but I think with a Power build, you’re going to have a hard time pressuring/downing anyone with a defensive build unless you take Spite. Speaking of Spite, Blighter’s Boon fairs much better with it.
And I dunno, if the whole point of this build is sort of trying to get quickness from your chrono runes, wouldn’t the Greatsword benefit most from that?
For me, if I’m going around solo, Shiro’s pretty much a must have so that I have the disengaging power to be able to pick and choose my fights…
Also, as previously said, Pain Absorption is super weak solo. I get where you’re coming from though, and we’ve all been there after a salty encounter with a condi mes, where you’re left being like, “Kitten this… I’m just gonna use Mallyx and he can’t touch me!” But, the problem is, by yourself, you can only cast Pain Absorption 3 times if that’s all you do (i.e. just auto attack.) So, you get 6 seconds of resistance, but lose all ability to pressure or down anyone, which is really just a stall tactic. Pain Absorption only really works when you have a group around you to a) increase the resistance duration per cast and b) help apply pressure while you’re stuck in Mallyx.
With Enchanted Daggers’ heal/dmg being pretty useless against them now, I just cross my fingers in Glint that they’re squishy enough that sword 3/2 does enough damage that they try to run away, so i can use Glint Reveal/Swap Shiro PT to surprise finish them.
Or I guess if they’re D/D, a back evade + Staff 5 still works to a less effective point.
So, in summary, they hafta be bad.
Edit: I should add that I use Invo not Ret.
(edited by narcx.3570)
Hmmm, thanks guys, I’ll just do nunoch lane RIGHT AFTER errant ends and cross my fingers.
How do you get the great skelk event chain to start in Tangled Depths for this MP? Dulfy/wiki has no real info on it and I’ve tried doing all the lane prep first and going immediately after Gerrant is defeated, yet it seems Lore Seeker Zolin never wants to start the pre-event.
Lich form is now slightly worse than the Syvari racial Take Root, as it’s cooldown is 150s vs 180s. /facepalm
Man, I was just trying to give them the benefit of the doubt, but wow…
While I sort of understand the changes to Enchanted Dagger/Raising the Upkeep of Facet of Light, they came in the most nerftacular, hurtful way possible…
Okay, Enchanted Dagger was a huge damage boost, and sources of burst damage SHOULD be blockable/evadable, we get that… But why not raise the initial heal to compensate on the overall loss of healing here? Nobody would have cried foul if this was done—it would have been a way to nerf the damage of ED (the only part people QQ about), while not forcing the rev to have to play 100% defensive while in their most offensively minded stance. (Not to mention the fact that Shiro is now more of a must-have-legend due to the stability changes.)
As for Facet of Light and the raised upkeep, I guess this was intended for Raid Tanks or people playing hybrid builds, like Hybrid Sage or Power Mender. That’s all I can think of because 99% of revenants don’t have the healing power in their build to make the regeneration even noticeable. The big problem here though, is that most rev’s run passive Fact of Light in combat just to be able to pop Infuse Light while stunned. So now, effectively, we have to sacrifice a much more noticeable amount of energy regeneration to be able to have our invulnerability skill as an insta-cast. I don’t THINK that’s what they were intending to nerf here, but who knows? That’d be like if they added a cast time to Endure Pain, Elixir S, Signet of Stone, etc—or made those abilities drain adrenaline or whatever just for slotting them on your utility bar.
Confused Rev Rant Over.
Out of all the bugs they could have fixed, they fixed the only one that was actually benefiting us—well played…
Signet spec still works in solo queue, but you definitely hafta keep Soul Reaping over Blood.
Sorry guys, this is my fault as I was sick of necro raiding and JUST finished gearing up my rev for raids.
Epidemic doesn’t calculate condition duration. It copies over remaining duration of each stack.
It doesn’t recalculate the remaining duration using your stats tho? That’s weird, I always thought it did since it recalculates the damage based on your active stats.
What I mean is I thought that if, say, a Guardian (with 0 expertise) has Spear of Justice’s Burning on a target with1 second remaining and you have +100% condition duration you’d copy it with 2 seconds remaining because (Spear of Justice: 2 sec duration, 1 sec remain —→ 100% Condition Duration: 4 sec duration, 2 sec remain.)