So I was surprised not to see you guys use lich form, blood is power, spite, etc, if the purpose of this was a speed run? (You had time warp after all).
Is dagger auto attack DPS higher than lich form auto attack?
And why was anyone using axe? Could you not just leverage off the vulnerability of WOS and the lich mark?
My pie in the sky expectation for a 4 necro 1 mesmer was that the fights would be: Spite signet for 180+ power, 10% crit 100 precision food.
Use blood is power, drop WOS, go into lich form right as the TW starts, spam 1 and have one person drop the vuln mark to hit 25 vuln, and then burn it.
This video, pardon me if I am missing what is going on, just seemed like 1 really experienced mesmer, and 4 zerker necros doing their own thing.
The COF 1 run really has forced delays built in, so any run is going to have a maximum speed it can be run. I havent parsed it, but I think the metric to think about here is not just overall speed, but speed of each boss kill.
Anyhow just my thoughts.
Yep. I was the only one i noticed using BiP and locust swarm. I didnt use lich because when i came in to help with the last 2 runs i was told dagger does same damage as lich. I dont know how true that is, ive never tested it. Doesnt seem right to me but wasnt gonna argue. Problem was flesh golem was just as useless as i suspected, they got killed instantly in every fight. And to say the mesmer was really experienced is a bit of a overstatement. He new the basics that a lot mesmers fail to use, but there were a few things I would of done differently to help 4 necro’s maximize their potential. It was all a bit of a mess.
Im tempted to post up some builds for the team comp and exact tactics, but I still wouldnt trust casual necro players to do it properly. It would be best to get 5 experienced speedrunners to do the run. The problem is most have given up on their necro’s if they have them and have no interest in doing this sort of pointless run.
I can’t understand why most gw2 players stick to one character to be their “main”.
I have to get all my shinies on my main first! My main is my necro but I only use her for guild missions and open world pve these days. Still want weapon skins and kitten on her before i get them on my alts.
I was just wondering about it, 30/25/0/0/15 can be a good build, you have the 25 in Curses and the 15 in SR for the spectral armor
This is the build I have been playing recently and it’s great. Good mix of a high crit chance plus some extra survivability from 15 in soul reaping
This is also a good choice. But the weakness helps with more dps. In a standard group of warriors, mesmer, guardian and a necro you get burning, bleed, vuln, cripple and weakness. Which is 10% bonus damage. You can also increase that with blinds and chill. Crit damage is really good but 90% crit damage compared to 110% actually doesnt make much of a difference. When your crit damage is that high you get more benefit out of target the weak than strength of undeath.
Also for our cof run, if we dont run 30/30/0/0/10 then we should atleast run 30/15/0/0/25 for fury. With one person on 30 in SR for stability so they can do the gate controller. But with 4 necro’s on the 30/30 build you can get perma vuln, cripple, weakness and bleed easy for a 8% boost.
Has no one noticed the death shroud 5 is neither named the same as said or does what they say it will?
If the patch notes are correct they are most likely an early draft which would mean some things wont appear on the actual notes because they were scrapped or postponed, some other things not mentioned might appear and some things might be changed or redesigned. Also that could be the underwater version of DS #5.
Our cof speed run was awful btw. Ghastly claws doesnt do enough damage to be worth while when your forced to axe auto attack or lifeblast until you switch back to dagger. This trait change might make the burst on axe ok when the target is under 50% hp but it will probably still be less dps than dagger + locust swarm.
I may be wrong, but assuming 14 second cooldown on reaper’s touch on focus (traited), and it hitting the foe three times, makes it much more desireable for dps purposes than mildly hitting locust swarm. Yes it hits 10 times, but one reaper’s touch will do more damage in addition to vulnerability than locust swarm does in its whole duration. It would, however, decent option for swiftness even though it constantly puts you in combat just by being close to enemies.
Locust swarm crits for 600 up to 1200 damage and provides low radius aoe. Makes it very good dps because it adds dps while you are doing the dagger auto attack chain. Also means you should trait for warhorn skill cooldowns. You can have both though. Take dagger and warhorn and then put a focus in the second weapon set. When you swap weapons it wont interupt the auto attack on the dagger. Same principle was used on the axe/mace axe/axe warrior build when that was popular.
I haven’t experienced anything over ~600 damage crits under normal circumstances, though that may be I haven’t used it extensively with might stacks. Just going by tooltip damage, in full ascended berserker build with ruby orbs, it should be around ~158, times 10, meaning 1580. For reapers touch, the numbers are 595, times 3, meaning 1785, plus vulnerability. We should also take into account that locust swarm has long casting time, which could be used to use dagger 1. Whether this is worth it or not… depends on locust swarms true casting time with aftercast and if low enough to make it worth it to cast (<1s+0,41s) and whether the target will survive it’s whole duration. To make a comparison: with same amount of power, my whole dagger chain does 2465 tooltip damage over 2,2 seconds.
Also to note: To attain the highest possible damage with dagger 1 in solo situation: Don’t ever interrupt dagger 1 chain, only cast something else after completing it.
Try to time your vulnerability spikes with DS fury flashing and possible wells/BiP to gain multiplicative benefit of all at the same time.
Flashing in DS for fury and enfeebling blood does NOT interrupt dagger 1 chain.
E: Corrected firstly incorrect numbers due to annoying equipment bug.
Yep some good advice about not interrupting the auto attack chain. I personally never pay much attention to tooltips as they are usually wrong/bugged or just not accurate. In cof p1 i was getting about 400 crits on locust swarm but that was when scaled down to lvl 75 and not having full might and banners to help boost dps. This was also when i was still using 30/10/0/0/30 so I wasnt maximising my damage potential. Traited warhorn gives 14seconds of locust swarm. The 1 second cast time is a pain I will admit, but if you only cast it at the end of your dagger chain then it is definately worth it.
Ive switched back to 30/30/0/0/10 and it does do noticeably more dps. Having condition damage in curses is not an arguement to avoid it. The highest dps warrior builds use atleast 25 pts in arms which is precision and condition damage, just like the necro lines. The traits + minor traits and precision are too important to give up.
The traits in spite can be swapped around a bit. I like chill of death for the damage and utility it provides. Spiteful spirit is good for when you need to aoe combo, which is also why i take reduced cooldown on DS skills. But that can be swapped for spectral cooldown if you are going to use a spectral skill. Lifeblast isnt as much dps as a dagger but if you need to pierce i guess you could take unyielding blast. You could take spiteful talisman instead of spiteful spirit, which is what id do if my group doesnt stack enough vuln or i dont need aoe as much.
For curses banshees wail and withering precision are must have for dps. Cripple and weakness helps boost damage from target the weak. Weakening shroud actually does alright damage in a power build and applies bleed and weakness which help target the weak. Plus you will most likely be flashing DS for fury if your group doesnt have perma fury uptime, so weakening shroud will be adding some dps when you do flash. You can take reapers precision instead of weakening shroud if you want. But I dont feel the lifeforce is needed. especially with the rumored boost in lifeforce generation coming our way.
Our cof speed run was awful btw. Ghastly claws doesnt do enough damage to be worth while when your forced to axe auto attack or lifeblast until you switch back to dagger. This trait change might make the burst on axe ok when the target is under 50% hp but it will probably still be less dps than dagger + locust swarm.
I may be wrong, but assuming 14 second cooldown on reaper’s touch on focus (traited), and it hitting the foe three times, makes it much more desireable for dps purposes than mildly hitting locust swarm. Yes it hits 10 times, but one reaper’s touch will do more damage in addition to vulnerability than locust swarm does in its whole duration. It would, however, decent option for swiftness even though it constantly puts you in combat just by being close to enemies.
Locust swarm crits for 600 up to 1200 damage and provides low radius aoe. Makes it very good dps because it adds dps while you are doing the dagger auto attack chain. Also means you should trait for warhorn skill cooldowns. You can have both though. Take dagger and warhorn and then put a focus in the second weapon set. When you swap weapons it wont interupt the auto attack on the dagger. Same principle was used on the axe/mace axe/axe warrior build when that was popular.
Looking back on it im really dissapointed in our time. Its only just as a good as a group of mixed classes who know the dungeon reasonably well. Also looking at the footage. I was the only one using BiP and locust swarm to dps. I have now also changed my opinion on signet of spite. I will be running it instead of WoC unless i need extra aoe/tagging.
I dont know how many of you guys read the thread in the dungeon section. We basically got mocked because of the time, which i completely understand. Also Nike from DnT posted a recording of him using his dps necro in coe. The auto attack chain on the dagger achieved a 9.3k crit at one point (Obviously under optimum conditions with 25 might + banners and fury and loads of conditions for target the weak).
Soul reaping is a good trait line for power builds because of the crit damage but its actual traits are more utility and situational. I ran 30 in SR for stability in arah and dungeons where i need it but not because of its dps. Ive switched back to 30/30/0/0/10 and it does do noticeably more dps. Having condition damage in curses is not an arguement to avoid it. The highest dps warrior builds use atleast 25 pts in arms which is precision and condition damage, just like the necro lines. The traits + minor traits and precision are too important to give up.
Our cof speed run was awful btw. Ghastly claws doesnt do enough damage to be worth while when your forced to axe auto attack or lifeblast until you switch back to dagger. This trait change might make the burst on axe ok when the target is under 50% hp but it will probably still be less dps than dagger + locust swarm.
Am i the only one who dislikes the possible spectral wall change? I dont want another fear. I liked the instant 10 stacks of vuln, it was good for pve and every class has some skills which arent that suited for pvp. People are still just gonna avoid the wall so its not going to get much better in pvp, but now its completely useless in pve.
Wouldn’t call that much. I still don’t see weakness appearing as a major thing in every team’s ‘must have’.
If I’m going to try and avoid a Thief’s burst, like hell am I going to bring CPC when I could just use a Well of Darkness and hide in a Spectral Wall far more effectively, and still be more versatile.
Also, I’m assuming that by the fact that the Devs haven’t denied these notes, they are probably correct.
Devs will usually never confirm or deny leaked notes. We can speculate either way.
I personally like these changes. Warriors are getting some small nerfs to their current dps build and rotation which will change things slightly. Mesmers having a delay on temportal curtain is going to have a pretty big impact on pvp but it will also make positioning trash in dungeons more frustrating.
Temporal curtain is being changed. 1 second recharge before you can cast into the void. Will make positioning groups slightly slower. This will effect the first mobs on cof p1, potentially slowing the start of the path down by a tad.
I expect the warrior build will shift to 30/25/0/0/15 but we shall see. Im also going to looking at some new build options for necro in high level fractals.
Actually if you can pull the champ giant into a place where you can make the grubs los to you. You can melee it fine in beserker gear. Warriors have cleave which is just a lower radius aoe which hits 2 less targets. Its merely strategy, just like it is in dungeons. It can all be done.
The reason I suggested the Giant in Orr, is because its a large HP sack of meat, which is great for damage testing, one I use frequently. It also, unlike Lupicus, doesn’t require any level of personal ability to effectively kill. Ergo it makes for a good comparable damage test. Since you can solo lupicus, it should be a breeze for you. Also it doesn’t require any pre-work to access.
Feel free to post the video and time. You vs. Giant. I will work on mine later today. It would be a good support for your argument if you kill it significantly faster than me.
Better to test it on the vet giants. They still have a large amount of hp and provide a good dps test.
my warrior in full knights gear does more dps than my full zerk necro. though necro is soo mucch more fun to play imo.
I do plenty of dmg on my power necro, but I feel much more effective as a condition necro. I feel I deal more dmg overall using conditions
I feel my beserker necro does more damage than conditions and hybrid. Still nothing compared to my warrior or my guardian when running beserker gear.
if our burst (outside of wells) wasnt single target I would agree, but as I can stack high bleeds and other conditions and epidemic every 12s I feel the AoE outweighs the single target dps. this is of course situational and my opinion.
I guess what I’m trying to say is we’re better at conditions than raw DPS
Id agree we are better at applying conditions than doing raw damage. But even so i feel its still more damage just going beserker. Infact if you use a scepter on a beserker build, your bleeds still hit for around 70 which is actually not that bad compared to a full condition spec. Condition damage scales very poorly and i personally feel its not worth investing in at all for pve.
And the comments about 100b is just for cof p1. Please stop being so clueless. You can glass cannon melee everything in this game including 40+ fractals. But if you do it with subpar dps then you risk wiping because you cant kill things fast enough. Hence why the meta in pve is 2-4 warriors, 0-1 mesmers, 0-2 guardians.
I play all these classes in these situations except for war and mesmer in fractals due to my guild needing me to run dps guardian alongside our anchor guardian in high level fractals. I stopped taking my necro into fractals when the downed hp bug became too much of a problem and I could be more effective support wise as a guardian with reflects and aegis.
Necromancer and Ranger are currently enormously overpowered in underwater combat.
Necromancers are? How? And rangers are only strong because their downed state is hard to take out.
Necro’s have incredibly powerful underwater weapons. Go beserker and you do damage similar to a warrior but with more aoe and better cc along with control conditions. Using a condition build also works due to the cc and the tridents condition applications. The weapons synergise amazingly, necros actually have mobility, combo finishers and the lot on their underwater weapons (the only perfectly designed weapons they have). Also underwater DS is very strong except for the #4 which is more of a support skill but it can be used to make plague blast more effective.
This was the first online esports tournament ive been in that I had very poor communication from the organisers and had no clue what was going on. We were just thrown into games without really knowing how it was going to happen, who we were supposed to be talking to and when we were playing. Also the lack of coaches and people signed up to various teams was an organisation failure. We had no distinct leader to sort out each team properly. We all just signed up to play, not to organise.
Despite the problems it was fun and i think we learnt exactly what not to do in a profession tourny. Looking forward to a future tourny once necro’s are a bit more balanced. And hopefully you guys learned a few lessons about running an online tournament.
ps. One suggestion i have for a future event is make sure each team has a leader that can manage the team and create a lineup themselves. They have to be motivated to bring a team together and sort everything out. Just asking 5 pugs to randomly form a team only works if one of those members is happy to fill that role. Its unfair on the teams that dont get a player like that as you cant guarantee any real organisational leadership.
I have been playing Necro sense launch and not only is it not bad its kitten… Just to be clear i have a war and i lvled it (and a mez) just for speed runs, if your looking to run CoF path 1 over and over… well roll a war guardian or mes (tyvm devs for not fixing this yet…) The idea that this game runs best with pure glass cannon builds is just wrong.
My necro tts out really nice DPS not DPA like war but overall its stronger, i run PVT gear and have over 3500 atk my Axe #2 (yes i run Axe sometimes) hits for around 10k and its on a 6s cooldown switch to dagger for dagger #2 and #1 and i have a nice burst combo (not including wells) Plus i have 28k hp and 3k def
bottom line i will fight you, i will win lol =P
…and i dont care about speed runs so if thats your think then, yeah…
How are you hitting 10k with PVT gear?
the “P” in PVT stands for Powrer lol, jk jk. I was surprised as well but trust me with 3500 atk your pretty beast! Crit + Crit dmg ie zerker gear is better but i like PVT play style. ill have to find it but i recently watched a video of a necro doing around 30k with Axe #2 (it was obviously set up perfectly but still impressive) so its easy to see how thats possible and i should prolly clarify that it ranges from 8k – 10k depending on the mob.
Really i just want people especially new players to necro to understand thakittens a wicked powerful class and if its your style its a lot of fun but its really hard to master.
I asked because I run full beserker and I cant hit anywhere near 10k with 3500 attack unless I crit. PVT shouldnt be criting so you should be hitting about 4k. That video was a 30k hit on a risen beserker (has frenzy so it takes double damage).
I have been playing Necro sense launch and not only is it not bad its kitten… Just to be clear i have a war and i lvled it (and a mez) just for speed runs, if your looking to run CoF path 1 over and over… well roll a war guardian or mes (tyvm devs for not fixing this yet…) The idea that this game runs best with pure glass cannon builds is just wrong.
My necro tts out really nice DPS not DPA like war but overall its stronger, i run PVT gear and have over 3500 atk my Axe #2 (yes i run Axe sometimes) hits for around 10k and its on a 6s cooldown switch to dagger for dagger #2 and #1 and i have a nice burst combo (not including wells) Plus i have 28k hp and 3k def
bottom line i will fight you, i will win lol =P
…and i dont care about speed runs so if thats your think then, yeah…
Necro will slow down a dungeon group no matter what.
Would i have choosen another class if i knew the state of the necro ? yes but stuff were said about necro giving false hope.
You can hope for the trait patch coming soonish and stick with your necro og go with mesmer if you wanna help your group the best.
Say what now ?… Lol… slow down the group… and i suppose guardians do more AoE damage then a condition necromancer, or mesmers…
Fractals = AoE AoE AoE…
So… a full glass cannon build is crap, and a hybrid build is the real dps for a necromancer ?…
So where does the conditionmancer go then ?… or you think you can do more AoE damage with the hybrid ?…
Hmmm… what gear and weapons do you use in your 30/30/0/0/10… If you say berserker i will leave this thread… never come back…
It is a valid beserker build nemesis. It just lacks the soul reaping utility and crit damage. I prefer to have stability in dungeons but if i didnt id probably go 30 in curses aswell for target the weak and better crit chance. You can argue that the condition damage on curses is wasted but then you can also argue that the soul reaping line is a waste aswell due to its limited choices of decent damage boosting traits.
The problem is the necro has no clear cut maximum dps build. There are several beserker variations which miss out on one thing or the other. You can also run hybrid with beserker gear and the bleeds still tick for about 70 but you hit for a lot harder with auto attacks and wells at the same time.
Beserker necro does good damage. Just not good enough for the lack of useful utility and support they provide in dungeons. They either need to be a full dps class or have more use in dungeons utility wise. They do more damage than mesmers but mesmers are infinitely more useful in dungeons because of utility and team buffing.
Ah good, melee still works. Just a bit kitten for pugs though. I dont really agree on the whole make a boss difficult but countered by reflects and projectile absorption though. It alienates the other classes even further. Would like some mechanics which dont rely on the same thing over and over again which only a few classes have good access to.
If you had read the numbers in my above post, you would have seen that the classes are about equal in base reflects. Mesmer can trait for having a lot more reflects, but it’s just that between a mesmer and a guardian, you can have pretty much enough reflect uptime.
The only class that doesn’t have access to reflect is necro, but they have 2 healthbars and the highest base health in game, so they’re kind of OP in a sense. Their damage is just bad.
With most random party setups you can easily achieve 60-80% reflect uptime, it’s just that people are too dumb or don’t bother chaining it.
I did read your post. Doesnt change that reflects for mechanics is getting stale and stupid. Mesmer and guard have much better access to them than other classes even though they can get some form of it. I want something different. Reflecting damage is stupidly op, yeah its fun seeing those huge numbers but having almost every boss in the game made easier by having reflects is kittened. I want some new mechanics with a bit more creativity.
As for necro’s, the two health bars doesnt really help much in any dungeon viable build as they just get squished so fast its ridiculous. An extra health bar is not as effective as invuln or extra dodges. You cant absorb multiple hit aoes with DS because 1 hit removes all your lifeforce and then the next hit kills you. Only way having that second health bar helps more than other classes damage avoidance abilities, is by using PVT gear which really isnt a good choice for dungeons. Especially when you should be doing damage. DS can be used for absorbing single hit abilities and holding on for a few seconds more while you wait for your pathetic heal skill to come off cooldown. Overall its a class mechanic that doesnt work nearly aswell as it does on paper.
Ah good, melee still works. Just a bit kitten for pugs though. I dont really agree on the whole make a boss difficult but countered by reflects and projectile absorption though. It alienates the other classes even further. Would like some mechanics which dont rely on the same thing over and over again which only a few classes have good access to.
It is profitable. Was even more so if you got dust before the patch. I got 39 dust but didnt sell so i missed out on a 12g profit. Even when i didnt get dust i broke even or made a profit with other t6 mats. I have no shortage of skillpoints and going for weapons like anomaly to sell will just take too long and costs too much to make (I cant afford all those ectos). Plus you need all the skillpoints for anomaly on one character which will take a longtime to get. I have 200+ obsidian shards i dont need from orrian jewelry boxes, may aswell use them for something.
Did it last saturday with a group of 2 mesmers, 2 necro and 1 guard, Fight took 25 minutes but we kill it, long with every fecking spider that spawned.. don’t ask how we managed to do it.. we had at times only 1 or 2 people max on tree, and often enough all were on the spiders to get some breathing..
What do you guys think of 10/25/0/10/25 for a dps guard? Can use consecrations or save yourselves + absolute resolution for condi removal, so no need for pure of voice or soldier runes.
They are pushing the air the wrong way. It works on the shatterer because of the angle he is orientated. But on players its as if the wings are pushing you into the floor.
Because american timezones are a bit more awkward to work out when you live on the other side of the world.
And people are unable to use the very name of the timezone posted in the schedule and convert that to their own time?
There are hundreds of sites that can do that.
People are lazy. Dont see why Anet cant put 2 timezones in their releases though. They do do it sometimes.
Over and over for years – since the beginning of GW – I’ve constantly seen people have problems with time and time conversion and complain about it for some reason. Why and how? We all obviously have internet access. It takes just a minute one time to find out what the time difference is between where you are and PDT/PST (or, less time than it takes to write a post about it). Then all you have to do is remember. It’s not very difficult. I’m two hours ahead of Bellevue, Washington. I have been for the past eight years. I automatically convert stated start times of things to my time upon first read without getting all confused.
Because american timezones are a bit more awkward to work out when you live on the other side of the world. I know all the time differences around europe but I dont know them for america.
Tracking DS cooldowns in your head is one of the skills that allows good necros to distinguish themselves from the rest. It’s the same with eles, how most of them fold up if you dodge the initial CC, because all they know how to do is a single burst rotation, then spam defensive skills till they die, whereas good ones are flat out scary to face. I constantly see people asking for skill plays to be removed from the game, it’s quite annoying.
Likewise a couple of your problems seem to stem from plague signet doing what it says it does. If the passive and actives were reversed, it wouldn’t be nearly as good a stunbreak. Right now it’s one of the few stunbreaks that also removes immobilize, extremely relevant when you have 3 guys spiking you. If you’re suggesting that it should transfer conditions from allies to foes every 3s, well, that would be way too strong.
On top of that, I personally love it when I can run my golem into a tree/rock/fence and hit a player on the far side, it’s a complete gamechanger.
A lot of the weaknesses you’re seeing are in fact strengths when used correctly, and I would be extremely disappointed to see them nerfed, which is what you seem to be asking for.
Agreed. I prefer having to time cooldowns in my head then being given everything on a plate. Plague signet is actually one of our best signets, just depends what your building around it and how you want to use it.
They need to fix the animation for the shatterer wings (assuming the preview animation is what it will be like ingame). The other wings i think are fine.
I got one ticket after about 20 coffers on day one. Wouldnt of cared about tickets if i hadnt of got that one. But now that I have it I kind of want another so I can get the axe + mace for my warrior. I feel like i would of been happier if i didnt get any tickets at all. :<
