Guild Wars 2

I got the vibe and thus said imply because of the surrounding candles, especially present in the precursor. Maybe in the new elite spec we set down 5 candles around a target to apply 1 burn stack or smthn ????

The new legendary seems to confirm that we will get torch with the elite spec, with its necromancy vibe. But does anyone else thing it looks like kitten? Or will you guys make it

One of the most difficult match ups, condi war has more usually more than 3 stuns in a short time period, meaning you will get at least one probably…power war is too much damage which we can’t avoid easily

Solutions: positioning is key to kite them, once they blow out their CDs they’re not that dangerous. For power ones you need wurm and good dodges, for condi at least one successful transfer and one stunbreak to heal unpredictably, since our heals are mostly well telegraphed. In my experience usually I avoid these 1v1s cause good ones will eat you alive (same for some daredevils), but a strategy that has worked for me is to throw all the burst in the beginning so they panic and waste dodges/CDs and then play with careful kiting. Sigil of doom is nice, so are unblockable marks and well of corruption.

But better avoid the fights with high risk of losing, try to rotate points if you see one coming and you’re low on LF/cooldowns. GL

Just want to bring to the attention of the fellow necs that Well of Blood is a nice choice now for group content, since blasting it removes conditions and the reduced cooldown is just perfect, it’s always ready when I need it

No need to complain in this thread, feel free to give suggestions for further improvement / synergy
For example dagger 5 as blast finisher

I dont get why axe is so hated, damage is pretty good now especially for skill 2 and the fact that its not projectile works good since there is too much proj hate in the game. axe is not a weapon which you camp for dps, its used with focus to build life force fast from range. My only suggestion would be to add a block/proj destroy to the skill 3, which would synergize wonderfully with the spite trait

Focus is nice in my opinion, but it could use some love, making #5 aoe (affecting targets in 360 range of enemy hit for example) and #4 giving might or fury or vigor instead of regen.

That is a great idea

Read changes, started laughing out loud Thank you Geezus :d

at least the guy killed you so you respawned. I would have left you inside :P

has happened to me also

Focus 4 Dagger 3 Well of Suffering RS2

rip most things

OP our siphons work in shroud, i find this pretty important, if an ele that sustains can at the same time take a 10k hit, its all for nothing.
Also Life from Death scales really well with Healing Power if you give up Vamp Aura.

OMNIBUS.2913:

Axe is still very bad. Just try running power necro vs a dragonhunter or longbow ranger when they start spamming 1 and 2 from their max range( or any ranged spec really). By the time u get in range for axe u will have taken many hits or used dodges, with the axe barely tickling them compared to their damage. The weapon clearly gives me a huge disadvantage in pvp, it’s pretty disheartening…

Except DH and Ranger are useless if you have projectile defense, something axe ignores completely

It is really effective against reapers, heralds, dragonhunters, and shines in teamfights

I’m posting a power build ive been having fun with in pvp lately. It is made to have fun and tuned to personal preference I consider it pretty good all around, perma weakness, condi transfers, boon corruption, ranged and melee burst. Hopefully some of you will have some fun with it

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQRAnd4Yjc0QzN2SD+1A/NOwFKaX0GfBsNDgDIu157HA-TZRGABAcCAgZ/hnLDg2TAggDCAA

I’ve also observed that when i corrupt the high stability stacks the bar disappears instantly, so its probably 1 stack stab=1 fear. Im not even sure if that much stability translates to long fears, since the bar breaks immediately. It’s not how corrupt works in pvp though

Really good video like always

Forum search is broken since forever
Most people hate on the axe in this forum. The problem is that Life Blasts deal more damage and apply vulnerability, and the axe2 is not a dps increase. Since RS doesnt have Life Blasts i think its the better choice to compliment reaper with a ranged option. It’s not a weak weapon like stated in the guide, it has its place, it ignores projectile defense and combined with focus #4 it provides a ranged fast burst. Also it isnt medium ranged like it says in the guide, it got 900 range. And lastly it has a skill that creates big numbers, always fun to see crit 20k:D

Arantheal.7396:

Nemesis.8593:

I knew that if i am ever going to continue making guides to builds that actually work without icebow, and advertise real DPS numbers in them… without people going “pffff… so small… sinister engineer does 20K”… i must first break the false “berserker meta”.

I have done that…

Except you didn’t.
The meta started experimenting sinister builds & condi-dmg in general as soon as a-net lifted the stack cap & introduced sinister stats.
That was way before you even released your first clip in your trilogy.
And now that they’ve revamped condi-duration into a numeric value, while introducing Viper stats, builds are in a revamp process once again.

You did not cause any of this, if anything you’re being part of that motion, once you actually release builds that are not meant for PvP. Until then you just repeat what we already have known before you came along.
Welp, apart from using a dps calculation model that shows nothing but what you – you alone – will do with a given build.

So, I want you to consider the following points, and tell me if you agree with them, and if you not, tell me why you disagree with them:
-disclaimer, none of these questions care about critical damage at this point. This comes later, to the end.
1.) The game’s engine uses [on the wiki] documented formulas to calculate power & condition damage ingame for each skill / ticking conditions. True or not?
2.) If the toughness values of any given creature are inserted into the power-dmg-formula, it will give out the accurate dmg-range (since weapon-strength is partly RNG) of any given skill, BEFORE applying buffs. True or not?
3.) If that dmg-range is altered by -33%, it accurately reflects the influence of protection on a mob. True or not?
4.) If that dmg-range is altered by +25% it accurately reflects the influence of vulnerability on a mob. True or not?
5.) If the dmg-range of a skill is divided by its full animation duration (pre-cast & aftercast included), added with the full condition-damage (duration x stack.amount), you can determine its Burst dps. True or not?
6.) If its determined burst dps is higher than the dps of your AA, you will prefer to use the burst over the AA. True or not?
7.) If you add the cd of a skill to its pre & aftercast duration, you can determine its full cycle-duration. True or not?
8.) If you know the burst-dps, the full cycle duration & the full animation duration of each skill a class offers, you can engineer a chained segment of burst-skills, while filling the gaps with your hardest hitting, available AA. True or not?

If you do not disagree up until this point, we agree that rotations can be engineered entirely theoretically within a spreadsheet.

9.) It is possible to estimate a boss’ toughness value by hitting him 100 times (or more), calculating the average hit-dmg, and then resolving the – in the wiki documented – dmg formula to give out toughness, while inserting the previously calculated average hit-dmg, the power value of the build used, and the weapon-strength of the used item. Further present toughness can be compensated by increasing the claculated average hit dmg by 33% before inserting it in the resolved dmg-formula. True or not?
10.) If the calculated toughness value gets applicate to the dmg-calculation of any given skill, it will accurately return the true hit-dmg-range of that skill on the same boss ingame (in case of irremovable perma protection, after reducing it by 33%). True or not?

If you agree with me up until here, we agree on raw dps being determinable for each boss specifically, just by a spreadsheet.

11.) All bosses have skills with specific cd’s. True or not?
12.) A dodge takes 0.75 seconds. True or not?
13.) If you identify the skill of a boss that apply greater dmg than you can outheal them, then their overall cd (actual cd + precast + aftercast), determines the time-interval in which you loose 0.75s dps. True or not?
14.) You can calculate the percentile dps loss if you know how often you have to doge within your own rotation. True or not?
15.) Invulnerability-phases of bosses follow a determinable pattern, be it by a given skill-rotation, a HP-trigger, or simply by the cd of the invulnerability-spending skill. True or not?
16.) Group-stuns, like given from the colossus fractal’s final boss can be treated as “invulnerability-phase”. True or not?
17.) The existence of said pattern allows for developing boss-specific formulas that give out the rough percentile vulnerability-time to dmg, which can be used as further, dmg-reducing percentile factor (F.E. determined dmg-uptime is ~50%, so power-dps gets reduced by ~50%). True or not?
18.) The kind of invulnerability is important to note, because some just become completely invulnerable/evade, and others still take hits with zero dmg, allowing for condi-application. True or not?
19.) Because of this behavior, condition dmg & power dmg uptime always must be calculated separately per skill. True or not?
20.) The combined dps loss from dodging & boss invulnerability phases can be utilized to determine your boss-specific dps-uptime. True or not?
21.) Calculating the final dps up until this point with crit-chance, crit-dmg, dmg-modifiers, and crit-related procs allows for accurate, boss-specific results. True or not?

If you agree with me up until this point, we both agree on builds being able to be compared in theoretical, boss-specific scenarios within boss-specific spreadsheets, coming up with dps conclusions that are very close, but still slightly above reality.

The rest-discrepancy to reality is caused by individual player-skill & therefore require mechanical perfection from a player wanting to achieve these numbers. Still the above described methods allow for coming up with builds that not only reflect very realistic numbers, but can be used to analyze a wide range of boss-encounters, without ever recording your dmg ingame (beyond probing the values for this build-process).

So if you (and others) think that this would be a valuable tool for theory-crafting, how about we stop dps-recording builds (and smash our head against each other about who has the best muscle-memory), but start recording boss-behavior to feed this more accurate (and more complex) kind of spreadsheets.

Keep in mind that the presence of healers (or passive healing within a build) influence which boss-attacks might need dodges or not anymore, while cc-caused breakbar stuns increase the dmg uptime directly, due to less dodges per rotation being required.
So when looking away from the individual build, but into the group comp, cc & healing become a lot more valuable as well.

So if you want to be constructive, start working on these spreadsheets, especially since raids will highly profit from a more in-depth analysis (once we know their boss-mechanics ofc).

Well combining the time you needed to write this post+creating a spreadsheet with all that info probably will take longer to do than actually killing bloomy/other bosses 100 times and adding up the combat log xD

Sigfodr.9576:

Pelopidas.2140:

Actually i use epidemic in fractals quite a lot, sometimes even as power build if the other guys are condi. I can give examples if you want, and its certainly not 1% of the fractals. And zudet you dont have to spread 25burns to be devastating, 25 bleeds + soft cc is pretty good. I could solo lich in labyrinth thanks to epidemic and im not even that good in soloing.

Still not sure if you read my post :/
– Bloomhunger – no adds
– Mossman – wolves, so usefull abit atleast
– Uncategorized Fractal – 4 bosses that you kill 1 at a time, so no add’s (you kill all 4 at end, so a little usefull.. very little
– Urban Battleground Fractal – 1 boss with 1 add, abit usefull but worth a whole slot?
– Molten Furnace Fractal – 1 boss = useless
– Snowblind Fractal – 1 boss = useless
– Cliffside Fractal – 1 boss = useless
– Underground Facility Fractal, Dredge boss – 1 boss = useless
– Underground Facility Fractal, Iceelemental boss – Add’s YES usefull

Do I need to list more of them?
Now, do read my original post again. In open world epidemic is clearly usefull. Its alot of “free” dmg, but for single target? nope, sry

Well you clarified that you were talking about the bosses, so my mistake. Of course epidemic isnt useful on single targets/most endbosses in fractals, it is an AoE based skill that is potentially better than anything other classes can produce (potentially makes it overrated for some people). You forgot to mention some things though, like the ettin-flame shaman fight in uncategorized, the jellyfish in water and the grawl shaman.

Sigfodr.9576:

Pelopidas.2140:

spoj.9672:

Epidemic is severely overrated. Its useless on bosses and on trash you barely have time to actually get a decent epidemic off.

Plus you dont even need to be a condi necro to use epidemic. :P

So spoj you think that necro is weak and epidemic is overrated…i guess you’ve been playing that 20k dps engi build lately and got disappointed by poor necro

I simply think you and spoj are talking about 2 different scenarios, he is talking about fractal/raid bosses (mainly) and you are talking about (I think) open PvE.

When there is 1 boss (no adds) like in 99% of the fractals/and the only raid we have seen so far then Epidemic is fairly useless and Necro (and reapers) apprication of conditions is slow compared to other classes (engi/ranger). if you read spoj’s post again you will see this is what he is talking about.

In open PvE where there 99% of the time is plenty of add’s around the elite/champ/legendary however, Epidemic is amasing, plain and simple.

I to, have been attempting to make a condi reaper build, I am not sure, sadly I feel mainly like dropping the reaper form and go full scepter and only pop into reaper for nr. 4 (poison) or to use nr. 3 (fear). And not use gs untill below 50% for gravedigger spam and then make sure I am standing in a firefield for the burn procs.. this also intale dropping soulreaper trait line since why have it when I barely use reaper form and then take.. blood I guess or something..

all in all I am having a hard time making a reaper condi build that work for single target. For open PvE, np, just use epidemic and you are sett.

Actually i use epidemic in fractals quite a lot, sometimes even as power build if the other guys are condi. I can give examples if you want, and its certainly not 1% of the fractals. And zudet you dont have to spread 25burns to be devastating, 25 bleeds + soft cc is pretty good. I could solo lich in labyrinth thanks to epidemic and im not even that good in soloing.

spoj.9672:

Epidemic is severely overrated. Its useless on bosses and on trash you barely have time to actually get a decent epidemic off.

Plus you dont even need to be a condi necro to use epidemic. :P

So spoj you think that necro is weak and epidemic is overrated…i guess you’ve been playing that 20k dps engi build lately and got disappointed by poor necro

bump
/fifteenchars

spoj.9672:

Yeah it needs a green bubble effect like the toxic krait have.

Or the Lupicus bubble

Bhawb.7408:

Pelopidas.2140:

WvW we are good.

Only in zergs do we have a true unique role, and specifically because we very uniquely had ranged AoE direct damage, a role that very quickly could be taken away from us. Roaming we have a much smaller margin of error, but it isn’t a big deal since anyone can 1v3 underlevels or bad players. The only special thing we have is good 1v1ing, but a lot of professions have just as good 1v1 while being much safer.

Pelopidas.2140:

In PVE utility could be buffed, we already got projectile defense we were lacking, we got sustain we were lacking+vampiric aura and the ressing-role from transfusion/general survivability is a good enough niche for me, i have carried alot parties in fractals.

Show me any optimized groups setting records that are using Necros and I’ll concede my point. The gap was closed, but res-duty isn’t a unique niche, and we get out healed by plenty at this point. Vampiric Aura also doesn’t compare to what others give. The issue isn’t as bad as before, but we still get out DPSed by DPS builds (at least to my knowledge there hasn’t been proof that Reaper is better), and out supported by support builds.

Pelopidas.2140:

Gimme specifics about weapon/traits that are mediocre, i think everything works atm, except very little stuff(terror-fear duration trait merge, dhuumfire improvement).

Works != not mediocre. Axe works, but it is still a mediocre weapon. So is focus, I’d personally argue staff, and offhand dagger as well. In fact, the only weapon without obvious weaknesses is warhorn. Traits is too many to list, literally every single trait line has traits that need work. Spite/Soul Reaping are the only that are largely solid, and those still have glaring issues.

Pelopidas.2140:

And we can’t facetank?

Non-face tank defenses is what I said. 100% of our defense is based on taking every single hit thrown at us (outside base dodges), and doing some combination of making those hits hurt less (weakness, % reduction, protection), using Shroud/LF to absorb the damage without hitting our HP bar directly, or dealing with the effects afterwards like healing or condition removal. But this doesn’t always work.

Pelopidas.2140:

So you say build play is what matters but we are skilled enough to escape the fact that we have subpar builds due to low/bad competition… ? That doesnt make sense to me.

In roaming yes. You can’t argue that roaming in WvW gives you a high level of competition when you can’t even guarantee the people you fight are even level 80. So by and large you can “get by” because those players are, the overwhelming majority of the time, worse than you. In PvP build is secondary, important but the difference in power between builds of similar types across different professions isn’t nearly big enough to make up for how important team play is. Basically, a great PvPer who understands team and map play will beat a player with superior mechanics but no game sense.

We can be pretty good at roaming, zerging, we can do skirmishing…im not a hardcore wvw player but these are the primary 3 things. Things dont get taken away if another class can do them similarly…it’s good we get diversity in roles for everyone. Also i doubt many classes are much safer than necro in 1v1s with full lf…

Actually now that ice bow is gone maybe the two eles aren’t really necessary for ’’elite’’ runs. And since lich can outdps almost anything for short fights we could be parts of speedruns, our initial burst with wells isnt that bad either…and we will see how raids/reaper will go soon enough.
Its my belief we don’t get buffed too much and remain a selfish class because of our tankiness, if we can do superior damage/offer superior support while being that tanky everyone will run just necros….(inb4 PS war) Also for pugs/casual runs that niche we fill is quite useful…that can’t be doubted in my eyes…
To the weapons/traits lets just agree to disagree, i like every single weapon and i welcome all buffs.
And for the last point, so you say that wvw roaming is so unbalanced we shouldnt care, and in pvp its more about the traits, the skill and the teamplay. Yeah that’s true, but if i understood right your opinion is that our builds are subpar and we need skill to ‘’get away’’ like Nos does. I disagree..

Bhawb.7408:

Pelopidas.2140:

Honestly even at higher levels of play (I think you mean more pve here) I prefer a necro who knows what he’s doing over an ele. Also stop these threads people we aren’t bad at all!

Well obviously, but that’s not a good argument. Any top player should be considered to know what they’re doing on their build. But generally speaking between two players of equal skill on their profession, other professions will out perform Necromancer. In PvE this has been true forever, but in PvP map play is so much more important than build that players like Nos can “get away” with playing a subpar build because his teamplay and map play more than make up for it. On the other side is roaming, where build play is of utmost importance, and the generally low competition means you can “get away” with having a subpar roaming setup so long as you are really good at playing it (plus Necro has a long history of pretty good 1v1ing).

But still, Necromancer is, by anything measurable, bad in the sense that it is worse than other professions, and has no meaningful unique niche. This has been getting significantly better over time, with Necromancer closing the gap, but its still true largely because of really mediocre trait lines, non-face tanking defenses, and a lot of weapon/utility skills that need work to be up to par.

I disagree Bhawb….very general talk and i thought your mindset was different. Necro is by anything measurable worse than other professions? Give me specifics….WvW we are good. In PVE utility could be buffed, we already got projectile defense we were lacking, we got sustain we were lacking+vampiric aura and the ressing-role from transfusion/general survivability is a good enough niche for me, i have carried alot parties in fractals. Gimme specifics about weapon/traits that are mediocre, i think everything works atm, except very little stuff(terror-fear duration trait merge, dhuumfire improvement). And we can’t facetank? In PVE we got huge DS and Plague, AoE protection with wells and incredible sustain (be it DS with spectrals, or health with wells/Blood Fiend). In PVP i learned long ago i should gtfo and not facetank anything.
So you say build play is what matters but we are skilled enough to escape the fact that we have subpar builds due to low/bad competition… ? That doesnt make sense to me.

Bhawb.7408:

People don’t think Necromancers are unfun, but when you try to play at the higher levels of play, the differences in professions become more distinct, and Necromancer tends to lose out.

Honestly even at higher levels of play (I think you mean more pve here) I prefer a necro who knows what he’s doing over an ele. Also stop these threads people we aren’t bad at all!

Anchoku.8142:

Without Dhuumfire, you get Death Perception, if short on precision, or FitG, which is handy with all the hard control effects.

Terror provides small amounts of condition damage in a build that depends upon it.

Both Terror and Dhuumfire add condition damage but neither has enough up-time to rival a scepter build. Deathly Chill seems weak, even with as many ways to chill as possible. Scepter bleeds and poisons outclass everything Reaper can do foe condi damage.

On the brighter side, pretty much everything is better than axe right now. Scepter and corruption skills can help more than axe so if you want to run a condition damage build, it will be better than axe by a wide margin. Even staff feels better dealing with high mobility mobs. Axe offers cripples with Unholy Feast but there are other was to proc cripple and Necromancer’s limited range and mobs’ ability to ignore cripple on mobility skills makes cripple nearly useless!

Axe is a 900 range sustained dps weapon, which ignores projectile defenses and applies lots of vulnerability. Geezus said it doesn’t get more dps because of the non projectile thing, so according to the devs now it’s in a good spot. Also the 3 is an aoe boon conversion, useful against mobs that use swiftness or protection or stability

Condition build, stack up condos on pet and use epidemic :p

Just for the sake of the argument what kind of burning numbers could a build like OP’s keep up?
Theoretically we could hit 7-8 burn stacks under quickness, and have say 3,2k condi power (might and banner and furious stacks and corruption stacks if gear is viper), and an extra 25% added to all that from vulnerability.
That means 784dps per stack, so 784×8=6,275k dps, and if the dps of the auto attacks is ~2-4k, then we get ~8-10k sustained AoE DPS in fully buffed mode, with quickness. (Im not sure the math is accurate, maybe someone more experienced can do a better analysis).

Its true though, when life force ends you’re kittened. Unless you cast epidemic and watch everything melt, then you are satisified for the rest of the day;)
Dhuumfire imo is more of a pvp skill to burst more as condi, and it could really use a slight buff

I’ve heard from WvW guys that for skirmishing it is more than decent. I doubt that its usage in shroud will make us somehow OP, however I’ve seen some stupid good hp regen (Play Mad Kings Labyrinth), I could as a mediocre soloer solo Lich thanks to epidemic and parasitic contagion

Bhawb.7408:

No one is taught to kick necromancers, and almost no groups do. The only ones that kick Necromancers are either the extremely rare “4 war 1 mesmer 5k AP ping gear or kick”, which barely ever happen, or speed groups who are aiming for that top optimization that we just flat out don’t reach.

Oh come on Bhawb, yes the situation is getting better than it used to be, but the past year or so 9/10 times i had to start my own fractal 50 group….everyone wanted/wants ’’meta’’ or 2 eles, which means some classes (not just necro) are excluded. So we dont get kicked, but we dont get to join either. And as if all these groups aim for that top optimization…i played ele in fractals for some time so ive joined alot of ’’meta’’ parties and very rarely the group was good enough to run things smoothly.

Also when metabattle has the necro build so far down compared to the other builds…its natural people think necro is the kittentiest kitten when it isn’t, and toxicity spreads. Nemesis showcased in his video how people who created the meta flat out lied. I don’t think anyone can disagree to that right now…

One more thing for the people here saying nemesis is rude and insulting people: Ive been here a while and i can confirm that nemesis did not start offending anyone, in fact i was surprised of how long he didnt respond to all the trash talking he was getting. And for some other posters here, if you have no idea whats going on or you havent even watched the videos, how can you post, that is ignorant and trolling.

OP it depends if the team was all zerk or maybe 1-2 sinister it should be alright, even lv50. Necro has a lot of weakness, aoe damage, blinds so its effective. We are also fairly tanky.
I’ve been in a full necro team frac50 where 2 guys were celestial and cleric i think, it was terrible.

Good to know, was on mesmer, so that makes sense.

On the TA up path, at the spiders before malrona. I noticed my skills were recharging faster, an effect like alacrity (seconds left were shown green instead of white). I checked the boons bar and i had a boon called Queen’s Frenzy (Skills attack faster and recharge faster). It wasnt a boon really it was like the boons Captain Ashym gets in ascalon fractal. Anyone know how this effect is applied ?

First off Engi condi dps>>necro condi dps.

About the Mossman: Engineer has ground-target AoE that doesnt require a target, necro needs to have a target for scepter 1,3, life blast, dark path, so engi has uptime on its dps compared to necro. Also it’s a very specific scenario you are comparing which is in favor of the engineer. And it is also a completely useless comparison…

Guys remember Robert Geezus mentioned soft CC will be useful in raids. If a boss spawns countless adds who move fast i would really like a necro to do soft cc/ epidemic stuff.
Not everything is DPS, every class has its own utility, why do we have to compare DPS all the time. The devs have tools to measure DPS much much better than the spreadsheets we make and it’s the easiest thing in the world for them to raise it, there are reasons why they don’t do it.

Also @Lily nice summary great post.

Well condi reaper for pve should focus on dhuumfire, so you could do balthazar runes
if you pick terror over Master of corruption you could use nightmare runes for additional condi duration and a terror proc. Mad King Runes are also an option, and scavenger runes (tanky but without additional condi duration).

After so long ranger has reliable high might stacking with good uptime…dont take this away please.

Yeah the perma quickness is too much, maybe it should be toned down….but dont take the might away…..

Yeah it did against vulnerable foes. Now that axe got a 10% buff, life blast with axe+unholy fervor should be doing more damage than life blast with staff. Haven’t tested it though, so.

Silverkey.2078:

Bhawb.7408:

His videos at this point are on par with climate change deniers or creationists releasing “science” to “support” their opinions. His complete refusal to accept what our issues are right now serve only to hold us back by avoiding the actual source of our problems (and therein denying the changes we need) and instead blaming them on the “berserker meta” or people just not following his most recent build.

I do not think he denies our issues. He actually has videos explaining the problem with necromancer’s balance (for example the lack of scaling defenses).

His main problem with the “berserker meta” is not the berserker meta as such but those who blindly follows the metabattle “rules” without understanding the logic behind them or without acknowledging they are not good enough players to adhere to the “meta”.

He knows necro does less DPS than other classes “in ideal conditions” and has less (=almost none) direct support. But he also knows that the lower DPS comes with higher sustain (though with the problem of lack of active/scalable defense) which is why necro is pug-friendly and can out-DPS other classes if not in ideal situation.

Again, I just think he insults so much everyone we could forget what is his message.

This, this is so true, please can we all agree to that.

@Zudet Also, there you go:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/necromancer/Reasons-the-Necromancer-is-bottom-tier/first#post5279012

ZudetGambeous.9573:

All this posturing, kitten measuring and damage showing gets us what exactly?

Even if we are less behind the other classes dps than people think what does this gain us? We have no group utility and our damage is still behind, even if it isn’t REALLY far behind. None of this makes a group want to take a necro.

The best we can hope for is, we aren’t the worst by 100% we are only the worst by 10%, see guys, you should take us!

This doesn’t seem like something we should be celebrating to me.

(Hopefully the damage pressure in raids make us more valuable for needing less healing, keeping up dps pressure, and self buffing in chaotic phases)

It is true though that there are scrub players out there who hate on the class. So i dont find anything wrong showing these people that we dont suck like they think. I really dislike not seeing a meta necro build in metabattle, and im sure the devs have decided against buffing necromancer dps for reasons random whiners in forums don’t know (including me). And this has been discussed to death, its not the damage, its the content that doesnt fit our support options, which are also a bit lacking…(soft cc like chill-cripple, fear blinds, lots of vuln.)

Also @Lily while i agree with most of your points, using focus4 and wells is a pretty good burst i think.

@ZudetGambeous – Inb4ModBan: 80% of your comments are about how useless necro is, how he sucks at everything etc (remember when you were saying condi necro does like 3k dps…). And the funny thing is your trash talk gets corrected everytime yet you keep your kittenposting.

Really good fights! Nice to see someone use spiteful spirit, i take it too for pvp as condi:)
It bothers me alot that terror and path of corruption are on the same level, and the fear duration trait isnt merged with terror…
Regarding the last fight, really good played, i don’t know why people say warrior is soft counter to necro, they can be kited fairly easily.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

I honestly can’t tell if this is a sarcasm post or if you are serious?

If it is sarcasm then well done! if it is serious then I will let someone else explain all the problems, mistakes, and errors in your post.

I’ll just end by saying that 90% of your post either doesn’t apply in HoT, or is done significantly better by other classes. The last 10% may be useful in raids, but we won’t know for sure until the next BWE!

Maybe you explain it, this post is extremely useful and sums up alot. Forgot to mention signet of undeath for mai trin, I get to use it in that encounter more than once. Good job OP.

Maybe nerf Vital Persistence to 25%, then make baseline.

Also improve Fear of Death somehow so that vital persistence isnt as vital, for example merge terror+fear duration, and change fear of death to something different. Thing is, I don’t know if fear duration isnt merged with terror in purpose already.

The curses grandmasters are pretty good to give up, especially weakening shroud.
And I also disagree with the vital persistence baseline, it would make us too tanky. Dhuumfire is in its correct place in my opinion. it could maybe use some kind of improvement, but there was a pretty extensive thread with suggestions about that.

interesting build
why terror over path of corruption? more burst?
and why not life from death (heal on ds exit) over vampiric aura?

Golem in the mists I hit up to 38, was around 25 consistently. Given that the bleed duration there with agony sigils and krait runes is 80 or 85 I don’t remember, 42 is normal pve
I can give the rotation if anyone wants

Foes dont stay in the field: same could be argued about purging flames, yet it is all around in pvp…true but it is pulsing weakness not applying once…and what do you mean its common? it is the offensive type of damage mitigation along with blind.

And check Hollts new vid 5 reapers stack like 52 poison stacks

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Weakness

Reduces endurance regen by 50%, and 50% of all hits do 50% less damage. Overall you could say 25% reduction so protection gives 8% more. But with weakness some hits you might get whole, some others might get mitigated 17% more than protection. It’s more of a gamble, and also reduces endurance regen. So in PvP content at least, yeah i think it is equivalent if not better than a protection field. And thanks for proving my point.

>Corrosive Poison Cloud is a GREAT skill, especially traited. Pulsing AoE weakness is probably better than a protection field. Imagine how happy you guys would be with a 12s field pulsing protection with 20s cooldown. Thats also the reason why it will never get projectile block, it is 12s with 20s cooldown, it would be simply OP.
>Well of Blood, traited is AoE protection-heal-life steal, so not a bad skill at all. Of course I’d also prefer as water field, but now with our whirl finishers we can maybe cleanse some condis on allies.
>1% LF every second is too much! the 2% right now is ok, and the active I find very useful lately pugging high lvl fractals…
>Spectral Grasp could use the speed increase. Otherwise the chill and the LF are great.

Overall these skills aren’t bad at all.

What needs fixing is the cooldown on Well of Darkness, Well of Power pulsing stability to us and allies (which i doubt, necros are supposed to be ping pongs), Blood is Power has ridiculously low might duration and low range, and generally the MoC is too crippling for its benefits at the moment.