Guild Wars 2

Signet of Illusions fits a phantasm build a lot better.
-iDefender combined with Phantasm traits and this signet gives it enormous survivabillity not only to the defender but your other phantasms and yourself as they only take half the damage for the duration of iDefender to the added bonus HP on them already.
-The signet can not only be used offensively, but also defensively. really need that extra CC from diversion or invulnerability from distortion to ensure a stomp for example.
-The point above can be of even greater use if you have for example shattered conditions, more condition removal.
-also the obvious extra busrt potential(this would be a waste though as 15CD is not worth a 90 sec CD)

mini.6018:

Swagg.9236:

It’s like you actually forget that [Healing Signet] is a healing skill that actually grants the player a significant amount of health on use.

Not from your notes though .From what you said active effect should healfor a 170 heatlh per second regen and a 4.5 second protection,and only if i have adrenaline full .You never mentioned any heal coming from activating it whatsoever except regen.

As a note now it heals for 3k lol Significant ?

10/10 for trolling though

This right here is one of the main problems.. That regen is only low because of the Healing power you would have. IF HS actually scaled towards healing power better, then their would not be as much QQ, cause a full zerker can still get 392HPS with no healing power at all. With no Healing Power at all 300-330 HPS would be fine and reaching 400(+/-) HPS at 300 Healing power(30 points in a tree, dont have to invest stat points for it).

That is a very big problem atm granted that it takes no skill at all to use a skill like this.
As well, the passive ness of this heal skill is like no other heal skill in the game, so much so, that the passive almost never goes on Cool Down.. Its is not even counterable besides for LARGE amounts of constant damage.

That is why you see people coming up with some suggestions, albeit some terrible.

glaphen.5230:

Poor zerker mesmer only does 200 dps of the 400 hps Healing Signet with bleeds qqqq. Good thing you have all that power and crit damage doing 9 6 7 2 3 5 9 2 when applying those bleeds. Wait are you saying you afk while clones stack bleeds on crit and are complaining you cant out dps Healing Signet with a zerker build? You could easily out dps it with a condition build with clones too, maybe try to do a condition build and then afk with your clones next time? Should be easily doing over 1,000 dps with the auto attack alone on a zerker build.

Hahaha, troll as much as you like bro! I am not one bit phased..
You obviously dont know how it works, even bursting on a warrior does not get more than 60% hp away and then having to wait till the next burst arises the warriors HP is back up again. That is with optimal conditions. I am not saying i cant beat warriors using heal sig, most of them play like nubz anyway, such braindeadness. much op.

Before you judge a persons playstyle, you may want to view it first. Just saying, you look like someone who knows nothing from that previous post.

GG

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

but no one was complaining about healing signet’s “passive play” previously when the health regenerated was about 200+ per second.

This skill did deserver a buff, but the passive play wasnt a problem because the HS was not viable. Now that it is viable, too viable that the other heal skills are not even considered anymore. The problems of it are now showing it self

There is a whole thread about the passive play, and it may not have the correct suggestions for it, but its a start..
There is currently no other healing skill in game that passively heals for doing absolutely nothing, that you can afk by mobs in PvE as well, and survive for hours on end.. There is currently NO risk vs reward for slotting this skill.

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

Thedenofsin.7340:

My concern with purely passive regeneration is that it has no counter play: there’s nothing you can do to stop it. Poison slows it down, but that also works on normal heals, and normal heals can be interrupted. The signet cannot.

I believe that if you remove the existing counter play with a passive regeneration signet, you need to replace it with a different kind of counter play. It makes the game more interesting.

Additionally, CC such as stuns are rewarding enough in themselves: the idea that while you’ve incapacitated your opponent you are passively healing for 400hp/sec seems downright broken.

However a warrior getting 400hp/sec in regen because he’s doing a great job of sticking on someone and smacking the holy heck out of him/her sounds more balanced. The better the warrior is at staying on target and damaging, the better his healing gets.

This is why I’m partial to the heal-while-dealing-damage signet: teamwork and coordination will help the warrior stay on target, which helps keep the warrior healed. Conversely, dodging and CC can act as good counter play to the signet.

For example, look at the Necromancer’s Blood Fiend. You can CC it, dodge it or kill it to counteract the Necromancer’s passive regen. That’s good counter play. The Healing Signet needs its own counter play outside of just ‘poison’.

Poison slows it down. So does bleeding, burning…in fact any condition that does damage per tick negates Healing signet. Most conditions will apply 120 dmg per tick. So if you can keep 1 bleed, some burning and a average up time on poison you are already on top of healing sig regardless of whatever physical damage you’re doing. The question is now who can do this condition stacking?..necro/thief/warrior/engineer/mesmer/ele….but it is not like they can do it from ranged, because that would be OP unto itself. Range is one of the greatest defense mechanisms one can have..they can’t hit you..they can’t hurt you..oh, my bad..all of these professions can do this at range. Sigil of doom just ensures that poison can be added to the list if you are lacking it.

the problem stated is 400ish healing per second..as a warrior player there is definite windows where healing sign does not tick every second and take s a handful of moments to start rolling again. Look to the abilities you have that counter it. regen is counter by degen. Power is countered by toughness. Knockdown by stability. Boons by boon removal/hate. People are looking for complicated means to counter something that is unto itself very easy to counter. A lot of the problem is players are comfortable with their builds and don’t want to change or try playing a different profession. Tye warrior has been adjusted, their play style vs warriors has not.

And you obviously read through the thread and what i wrote, as a zerker mesmer. The ONLY condition i have is bleeds, that tick at 42.5 dps that deals 213 damage over 5 secs. HS heals for (no healing power) 1960 over 5 secs..

even if i managed to keep a constant 9 stacks of bleeding(which is never going to happen), that would still be out healing that damage. This does not stop the warrior from out running the mesmer either. The problem is the way the passive heal is warrated, with no active play granting your heals, just brain dead mechanic of slot and forget.

not going to happen..
This side is almost always the same, i bet the fractal mistlock where mobs and bosses deal more damage from the back will have the same results

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Psych.6527:

Thats how it should be, 392 HPS with no healing power is a joke. Not too mention that HS requires no active game play to actually receive that HPS unlike other heal skill signets

what do think about
360 + healing power x 0.10

at 300 healing power it is (30 points in tactics)
360 + 30 = 390

but, warrior really needs the passive regen from healing signet to be able to, perform like a warrior. and not drop like a paper doll.

That seems like a fair conversion of healing power to HPS. That is not my main concern though, the heal signet still has no real counter which is really bad game mechanics as every other heal within the game has a counter every other heal skill in the game has atleast some counter to it

Shelter
This blocks attacks while healing at the end of the duration, but unblockable attacks can still get through this, as well as a well timed cc as the heal oly occurs at the end

Withdraw
This is the only one i dont know of how to counter besides for cripple(which reduces withdraw range), poison(which makes an already weak heal even worse) and chain CC to prevent the heal from happening as thief is already a squishy class with little HP that can be deadly.

As for Heal signet, classes such as mesmer, very minimal access to poison, with high cooldowns and short durations, it is not viable to say just keep poison on the warrior. Some mechanic to be put in to make the heal come from active game play is needed so that there is a counter for all classes. Obviously depending on the mechanic the conversion from healing power and/or base heal can be adjusted accordingly(high or lower)

Thats how it should be, 392 HPS with no healing power is a joke. Not too mention that HS requires no active game play to actually receive that HPS unlike other heal skill signets

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

once again, warriors are not god like. they can be killed.

they can be hard to kill if you trait gear themselves for it and play accordingly.

if someone cannot defeat a warrior in a 1 versus 1 situation, perhaps he / she was fighting a warrior spec geared defensively with more health and armor etc.

remember, guild wars 2 is a team game, bring friends.

Yep, always go into a fight 5v1 against a warr, that is the only way you can beat him. Team fights OP! go guild wars 2! healing sig perfect heals too little actually! /sarcasm off…

Exactly, i would actuallyu prefer if mesmer stays hard to master please. I dont want mesmer going through what warriors went through now. Besides decoy → iDefender. Sorted.. LoS? sweet. GS#5d → iDefender, Staff #2 while casting iDefender or staff #5 casting iDefender inside chaos storm. Torch #4, signet of dom, daze, mass invis, moa…
Asking to make it easier is ridiculous

bethekey.8314:

The way warriors are designed in this game and many others, is to be a good introductory class. This says nothing about skill ceiling, only skill floor. In their current state, warriors are actually serving this purpose well. New players can enter into the game, equip themselves with strong yet easy-to-use skills like Healing Signet, Berserker’s Stance, Endure Pain etc. and perform well. This creates a problem, however, when such low-skill, high power abilities do not lose effectiveness as the player progresses into areas of the game that require more skill.

Here is a perfect example:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391

but i enjoy playing a warrior, in sPvP (hotjoin 8 vs 8 whee) / PvE / WvW
previously i was playing a mesmer in sPvP, then a thief for a short while. then i reverted back to playing warrior in sPvP. i did not use healing signet though. i used the errr mending which heals for a bit and removes some conditions.
after i learned that healing signet was balanced, i used healing signet for my warrior in sPvP again. i felt so much happier! died less, still die sometimes unlike last time, died a lot. my warrior is able to sustain much better now. he is not god like and will still die. just doing better than last time.

This is a case of an “inexperienced” player who, at first, is doing ok. Nothing special. But then, he builds a certain way or equips a certain skill, performs better, has more fun (plays more as a result) and ultimately attributes his success to an increase in skill because of increased time played. Anyone who says otherwise, according to this player, is having a L2P issue. After all, that’s what he thinks he overcame himself. Either that or he has the insight to see from where his increased ability to perform is derived (Healing Signet) and fears for it being taken away.

If you have not seen it yet, I am essentially reiterating this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6fVHZFjnmA#t=3m02s

Healing Signet, passive immunity builds are the quintessential definition of “FOO” strategies. They need to remain good, but become sub-optimal when players become skilled. When we see every warrior running around with these skills with little consequence at higher levels of play, it is apparent something is wrong. If you cannont recognize that, I’m afraid you are delusional.

From what I understand, top warriors desperately want the opportunity for skilled play. They constantly refer back to the good ol’ days of frenzy greatsword builds (ie. high risk, high reward play). The fact of the matter is, it is not rewarding to play as nor fun to play against an unstoppable force who kills you if it hits you once. Do not even begin to say that warriors become useless and easy kills after their immunities expire. Even at their point of “every skill on cooldown”, they are more mobile, deal more damage, and are more tanky than many classes when in the same situation.

Fixing this is not as simple as “nerf ____ by 20%” or “bring everything else warriors have up to snuff”. Warriors need to be given strong, active use skills that excel when used by a skillful player. It is a tough job and I do not envy those who have to do it, especially after seeing how worked up some people can become about topics like these.

This and so much of this!

The main problem with healing signet and if you compare it to the other heal skill signets. It is the ONLY signet heal skill that does not require active play to gain health, such as malic, ele signet where if they dont use their abilities, if they are stun locked, if they are running away(for the most part) they are not gaining any HPS what so ever.

The fact that warriors are saying oh just use poison… -_- I dont even have access to poison on the weapon set or traits i am running, and the only weapon set there is poison on my class has one ability that grants poison on very low RNG, with a 25-30 sec CD and a very clear tell of get out of there.. not to mention the low duration, 3(?) secs…

Warriors have the most sustain in game coupled with the already very LARGE HP pool as well as high toughness. It is not the hammer that needs a nerf(although i do agree on the 1200 odd range fire AoE is ridiculous on a point fight), because if the warr actually hits the target with hammer, they should be rewarded. the problem comes, in how easily the warrior can sustain the fight being full zerker, my damage rotation on both weapon sets on a full zerker, can not bring a warriors HP to lower the 30-40 % and before i can do this again, they are back to 80% even trying to wear them down slowly waiting for your burst is extremely hard…

Blurred frenzy(sword #2) is an evade, not an immunity. You could compare it to the Warriors whirlwind which is also an evade.
That is for shatter specs which is completely not viable atm and a rare sight. Not to mentions that the trait that recharges shatter skills is on a 90 secs cool down and you actually put your self at a disadvantage by taking, unless you seriously want to troll and not kill anyone which is fair, High damage = high risk, high survivability= no kills

GS Warriors are that much easier to get? It wont have the deceptiveness of a mesmer in escaping, but there is no doubt that a gs warrior will out run anything unless there is a extremely skilled player chasing him.

mini.6018:

Forsaker.9213:

AR and zerk stance should not completly reduce condis , they should have some amout of% condi reduction but not 100%

I agree completely.But the cooldown should be 30 seconds not 60Engiea are completely immune from25% below and they dont need to use a utility slot or wait for a cooldown..Also necros should not permaburn people just with autoattacks, backstabs should bring thieves out of stealth when blocked and mesmers should not have complete immunity from everything on such a low cooldown.I can go on for at least 10 pages of this stuff.

That is part of the mesmers frikken core mechanic, For 1-3 secs of immunity on a 60 second CD? yea so OP.. I agree, on the thief and necro though.. As well as how warriors adrenaline still stays full after someone SKILLFULLY dodges a burst skills.

So when is this happening again?! My guild has somewhat stopped joining me on PvP with the living worlds and WvW season -_-

It is actually both of the skills, sword MH #2 and #3

Serpants Strike These skills in theory cause the player to evade through movement, if they are immobilized there is no movement..

This video shows exactly how it works, It is an evade via movement. If you are immobilized, that little roll wont do anything to stop attacks hitting you in theory of course.. This is not matrix where you can dodge everything slow mo whilst standing still.

So much QQ -_-

Okay, if you were paying attention, it was not the rooted evades that were the problem and or causing these questions such as Blurred Frenzy and Pistol Whip. It is the movement evades that still grant evades whilst being immobilized Serpants Strike and Flanking Strike, These skills in theory cause the player to evade through movement, if they are immobilized there is no movement..

Also, thief and ranger are no where close to the bottom of condition clearing for classes, so they should not be complaining about that. It is not about nerfing classes with evades, it is about having the mechanics work properly. Not like this change is going to happen.. so there is no reason to complain about a question made by the OP, still no suggestions were made.

Class specific things, just basic..
Warrs: They can still use their stun around them, blind target, immobilize target, condition immunity,..counters are not of few if you actually think about it.
Engi: Drop supply crate = AoE stun(no need to worry about immobilize), go invuln, blindm, invis.
Thief: Shadow step, daze,daze,daze,blind,infiltrators strike→shadow return, Shadow refuge, hide in shadows→ shadow step, invis………..
Ranger: stealth, knock backs, AoE fear, not too sure bout rangers(havent played much)
Ele: Invuln, lightning flash, AoE knock down, blind
Guard: Sanct bubble, AoE knock back, blinds, impenetrable wall and circle, lotsa of blocks, immune.
Necro: DS#3, Protection with mass marks, fears, knockdowns, fleshworm tele, blinds, condion control.
Mesmer: Blurred frenzy, distortion, blink, invis

Smiley.5376:

Are you serious ? Now that immob meta is here you are suggesting to remove the ability to evade damage(through any skill or w/e) while immobilized haha… you must be a troll.

There were no suggestions of such made in this thread.. As i said before it is just tricky with the rangers evade being a leap ability(movement ability) and immobilize is meant to nullify movement abilities, which it does. The ranger does not move anywhere, it is just tricky becuase the evade is still given even though he didnt move..

As said above as well, in the case of mesmer/thief, their abilities already root them, well the mesmers does, psitol whip does on the thief, but others such as flanking strike, withdraw(evading heal) and D/D #3 also grant evade frames whilst they are immobilized and those are also movement abilities..

Mesmers can do it with Sword MH #2, blurred frenzy, it is an evade, but the debuff is called blurr..
I can not say if it was intended or not, immobilize does not prevent skills from being used, just prevents dodging from being cast and movement abilities from moving you. The thiefs evade, whilst he can spam is similar to the mesmer, if you are talking about the sword and can also be similar to the warriors hundred blade. which is a skill that can also be legitely used on getting out of entangling roots.

Just from that example there, i think it is not really something that they can prevent from happening, the only difference is maybe the rangers, which uses a movement ability as an evade during being immobilized, whilst the thief and mesmer are rooted already just by using those skills..

Its quite a tough predicament..

There have been suggestions like this before, i am not sure if it may be OP in the way you suggested it.

Stealth should at the very minimum be able to contest a point. By the i mean, whilst in stealth you can not cap or have your point tick towards being capped when there is no enemy on it, as well as your enemy can not cap the point being ticked towards them capping whilst you are in stealth and on the point.

Currently for classes such as thiefs and mesmer were given defensive mechanics such as stealth, they have to make a decision of letting the point cap in their enemies favour or dying due to being constantly targeted.

The most balanced way to make this would be:
- Not being able to cap (or neutralize?) whilst stealthed.
- The enemy can not cap (or neutralize?) whilst you are stealthed on it. (Keeping the point contested)
- Capping past a neutralized point can only be done unstealthed.
- Stealth stops contesting a point after 5 seconds
- You can not contest a point for 4-8 secs after coming out of stealth(or similar ICD on it to prevent trolling stealth)

This way, classes with heavy reliance on stealth as a defensive mechanic can still put in as much on a conquest mode map as other classes, right now they are at a disadvantage when fighting on a node.

ViRiD.2784:

Major:

• Retaliatory Shield(Dueling III) – We don’t have very high access to block, and Mesmers don’t do well taking damage to trigger the effect.

You just thinking of sword and sceptre, all the Aegis you can proc counts towards this as well, Mimic can be an exceptional source to stack a high up time of retaliation and with the correct build as Allisah explained can be your main source of damage.(Retaliation scales of power).

ViRiD.2784:

Major:

• Furious Interruption(Dueling XII) – Short duration quickness, long cooldown, and difficult activation condition.

Situational trait for PvP and WvW, i like using it in dungeons as you can keep it on cooldown the whole time just by using sword #4 daze on bosses and mobs as they are easy victims to interrupts. Nice Dps increase.

Azathoth.2098:

Skills:

• Confusing Images -> Chained-Junction:
  A Chaos-Chain links the Mesmer to an opponent for 6 seconds. During this time the opponent suffers x damage per second.
  In addition to that the opponent‘s speed is reduced by 60%, and the Mesmers speed is improved by 30%.
  Every enemy touching the Chaos-Chain also receives damage and gets their speed reduced by 60% for 3 seconds.
  Chained-Junction can not be removed.

• Mass-Sleep:
  Manipulation
  Nearby Enemies fall into deep-sleep for 5 seconds.
  The effect also breakes after the enemy suffers damage, equal to 7,5% of his maximum health.

• Chaos-Orb:
  Manipulation
  Summon a Choas-Orb, that shoots up to 10 Chaos-Beams onto enemies within a range of 900. There can be up to 3 Chaos-Orbs at the same time.
  Lasts up to 12 seconds.

• Chaos-Touch:
  Manipulation
  Applies Chaos-Touch for 10 seconds to an enemy, suffering x damage over 10 seconds.
  Furthermore, Choas-Flashes, like the ones from a Tesla inductor, jump onto opponents within a range of 450, causing damage as well.
  Chaos-Touch can not be removed.

Traits:

• Phantasmal Healing:
  When using GS for example, you will not receive Regeneration, as your Phantasms mostly are to far away from you. So why not change it to this:
  You and your allies are healed by x% of the damage done by your Phantasms.
  Critical hits of your Phantasms grants you and your allies Regeneration for 5 seconds.
  Range 1200

Some very interesting changes, Sounds rather Shadow priest inspired.. Especially like the phantasmal healing, but it would be a great change if they could adjust the healing not to be too OP.

The application of a DOT that is not a condition also sounds extremely appealing, similar to the Guard greatsword pull, that is a DOT as well

Qaelyn.7612:

So there’s a lot of great info here but being new I don’t understand some of the lingo.. if someone’s willing to help me out with these…?

“dummy a stomp”?

“stoming behind a clone”?

Someone said mesmers are hard to kill when downed but I haven’t found that I am all that hot when downed, am I missing something important?

Thanks.

For the most part Eldenbri is correct.. When i said dummy a stomp, as explained above, you press f to start the stomp animation and cancel when you think the mesmer is going to use their downed #2 ability, it has a animation and cast time so just watch out for that. Quickly push f again after canceling and if the mesmer doesnt go out of range with their downed #2 then they will reappear from stealth before you finish your stomp and you will be able to stomp them almost as quickly as other classes.

Stomping behind a clone usually works best for projectile based downed #2 interrupt skills, such as warriors or engineers. If you stomp with a clone inbetween you and your downed foe, the projectile interrupt will hit your clone and not you.
You can also use traited Temperal curtain(focus #4) and untraited phantasmal warden(focus #5) against these two classes for stomping as well.

Mesmers are generally squishy, so hard to kill no.. There is not really anything you can do when you are just being DPS’d when in downed state.. but they can stop people from stomping them(especially if they know how to counter the stomper trying to counter mes downed #2 and this can give your allies enough time to rez you or it could give you enough time to down your foe.

Qaelyn.7612:

“condition has a dangerous torment block”?

This was Allisah explaining the dangerous-ness of targets. A condition mesmer will usually run sceptre/x with staff.. Sceptre #3 has a block that when hits applies 5 stacks of torment which can take a large portion HP(equivalent of more than eating a full blurred frenzy).

A mesmer can almost certainly guarantee a stomp on any profession besides elemenatlist using either F4, blink and/or stealth. So if you have stealth available, you can stomp a warr, engi, ranger and necro. For guards you will need distortion(F4). Thiefs you will need blink and mesmers you just dummy a stomp and bait out their downed 2 ability . You can also use F4 to protect yourself from focus fire whilst stomping and other players interrupting as well as F3 to interrupt another player rezzing your downed target. So take advantage of your ability to stomp.
(Edit—>) You can also use your clones as a meat shield for warr and engi downed 2 abillity if you are stomping behind a clone, it will affect the clone and not you. As well, Rangers interrupt is AoE like guardians, although it is not a push back, but Shatter illusions before you stomp Ranger and go into stealth for the safest stomp against them.

For rezzing you can be a monster, Mass invisibility can let you rez your allie most of the way and F4 can protect you from focus fire. F3 can also be used to interrupt stomps. Shatters do not interrupt your own actions of stomping or rezzing, as well as blinks, mantra’s, ect(all instant cast abilities).

In the 2 above cases, focusing on downed players (allie/foe) mesmers excel in. If those abilities are on CD or you will need to use them defensively and know that stomping will be a death sentance then go for damage, either on downed target or if the other foe is low on health then dps him down, try leaving atleast one phant on downed foe to wear them down. For warrs you can let them vengance as long as you know you can avoid their burst, but rangers can self rez easily and will need to be taken down asap

My first target usually is trying to find the most glassy build, as they have the ability to put you down very quickly, but so do you. Gain a vantage point, possibly from stealth. throw a quick combo and they should be down, use points provided on stomping.

In fights, pay attention to which and how many illusions you have up, your partners status if you are not solo roaming, possibly high grounds to blink to, how many enemies you have (find the most threatening and avoid as much damage from the as possible) and possible incoming zergs or roamers.

Its not really the same, but this is a suggestion i made 2 months ago, will quote for easy reference

Not that i have high hopes of any of this being implemented or that the devs will see this and may spark an awesome idea from their side, but, working together MAYBE figure out a possible solution IF the desire is there. anyways liked most suggestions so far, it is interesting to say the least.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Giving-mesmers-more-control-of-their-phatasms/first#post2574172

Psych.6527:

Hi, I have been thinking of this idea for quite some time now and i personally would really like this/something similar to be implemented(even though my hopes are not high :/ ).

The problem is, well i do not know programming, my idea is only a partial idea. This is why i am typing here to ask for help and possibilities

My idea involves giving mesmers the abilities to control the attack cycles of their summoned phantasms, with the ICD of each attack cycle having an obvious effect of not being able to spam it I was thinking more along the lines of having the skills change like they do with Necro’s, the flaw here though is how would you summon another phant and if the summoning CD is off how do you choose between summoning a new phant or making the existing one attack?
The other possibility could be adding something similar to rangers.. being able to switch in and out your shatter skills to add attacking skills for phantasms.. of course this second suggestion is bound to get an enormous amount of QQ…I think it might be the better route? Then changing the way phantasm act, by if they do not attack 2-3 secs after their normal cycle, they would then attack..(increased attack cycle by 2-3 secs if not ordered, keep current attack cycle CD for ordered attacks) maybe add an extra “F” key function and the ability to swap out shatters for phantasm.. e.g. F1 MW, F2 Zerker attack, F3 Unchanged, F4 unchanged, F5 Warden attack. Each F key having an arrow, out of combat, with which you may customize you F buttons with shatter/Phat attacks. Each Phant will have their own ICD so you would also have to press the attack cycle for each individual one, time when you want them to attack, plan it more carefully..

I would really love this profession to be more interactive than what it is now, right now, this type of build is more noob friendly, but it has an exceptionally high Ceiling cap as well. A lot of people think that you beat them because you can are running a particular build(Phant mes) and that its only viable 1v1, untill you show them that you can even 2v1 winning a lot of fights, that there can be much skilled involved if you play it properly.

anyways, just a suggestion,
Initiate QQ, troll wars..

Psych out

This is not a bug, the revealed debuff can also be procced from bouncing attacks.

Winds of Chaos and Mirror Blade are big culprits because of their distance and speed of the projectiles(i know WoC is not technically a projectile), even going stealth after the initial hit, if the “projectiles” hit again onto a enemy of a bounce the revealed debuff will proc.

No this has not happened to me on Sword/x(i dont run pistol, rather not derail by stating why), it could be possible that there was still a WoC bolt flying whilst you change to sword/x.

Suggestions, be aware of your projectiles and abilities used before going stealth,

I would highly suggest getting to level 40 so that you can buy your Master trait tree. This unlocks a whole set of new traits which you can use and specialize in.

For example, if you like using phantasm:
In domination first 20 points there is
-Phantasm inflict 15% more damage
-GS(Adds power) and Torch(becomes condition cleansing) CD reduction which means more uptime on Phantasms.
-Even shatter skills and vulnerability stacking traits

Dueling:
-Phantasms have fury
-Pistol(inscreases range) and Sword(Adds Precision(which also has Blurred Frenzy <3)) CD reductions
-Deceptive evasion which helps for shatter
-Illusion bleed (5s) on crit
-Constant Vigor(dodging)

Chaos:
-Minus 3% damage for each illusion
-Bountiful interruption(5 stacks of might on interrupt
- Staff(Adds toughness) CD reduction

Inspiration:
-Phantasms have retaliation
-Phantasm grant regeneration
-phantasms Have 20% more HP (could also combine with signet of illusions and iDefender for monster tankiness :P )
-Focus(becomes a reflectable surface for all projectiles(more damage) and Sceptre(adds condition damage) CD reductions
-A condition removal trait
-10% faster movement speed for each active illusion(usually only available in combat)

Illusions: Shatter tree mostly
-3% more damage for each active illusion(only affects the mesmer and not the phantasm damage)
-Bouncing attacks have 1 additional bounce(GS #4, Staff #1, Pistol #5, I think torch phantasm skill as well as iDisenchanter)
-20% faster attack cycles on phantasms

wads.5730:

so basically exactly the same thing i said, but you waste time by autoattacking once, giving the downed person to knock you back.

No, if you had taken the time to read through to topic you would have understood why.
From placing the portal exuent there is a 0.5-1 sec delay before you are actually eligible to use the portal, this is again true for when you have used the portal to get back. Now starting the stomp and placing the portal down immediately after will not give you enough time to get back and finish the stomp in time.

Iavra.8510:

Not quite right. You have to place the 2nd portal about 0.5-1s before starting the stomp to be able to start the stomp and take the portal at the same time. Otherwise, and you won’t get to use it again in time.

Perfectly executed, you will take the portal and visible start the stomping animation on the other side and take the port back the moment before your char hits the ground.

/edit: A tip: Ranger downed #2 does not need LoS and seems to have infinite range so you can still be interrupted during a portal stomp.

Quoted for evidence.

The portal exuent has to be placed before the stomp, the stomp has to be timed just before the portal becomes available, use portal asap and keep for as long as possible before returning.

wads.5730:

so basically exactly the same thing i said, but you waste time by autoattacking once, giving the downed person to knock you back.

So no, nothing like what you had explained at all.

wads.5730:

Justin.5231:

In videos, I’ve seen like Lavra said, where they place the portal, and then they Start hte stomp and port AT the SAME time… I’ve been able to do it SOME now, but not like that..

I’ve had to place the portal, start the stomp about a sec later, then take the portal. I can’t get it to do both actions with just pressing F once… Idk what I am doing wrong.

press action key to start stomping,

press portal key to lay down portal,

press action key to portal, then again when stomp is about to finish.

i dont understand what you think is hard about it.

Actually no…

Down enemy with portal in range some distance away from the target ready to use.

Place portal followed by 1 auto attack

Start stomp

Take portal

Wait for stomp animation to continue some

Take portal again..

There is a delay between when the portal is placed and when it is useable.

@ Justin, If you are on EU send me a in game mail and i can show you.

okay so i have done some very quick and not thorough testing, halting strike was giving some variation to a small degree and with the steady weapons it was difficult to see exactly if the variation was the result of the damage or the damage modifiers.
so step 1 gave more or less average 169
step 2 180ish
step 3 180ish – 190
so as the very quick and inaccurate test. it seems as if wastrel’s punishment does after all affect haltin strike..
edit: i want to emphasize the quickness, non thoroughness and inaccurateness this test may be based off…

Staff phantasm can hit hard, and you dont need a necro to help you get those conditions.
It is a lot less offensive though, and if you are going for a zerker phantasm mesmer, that is not really what you are looking for, Iswordsmans has been taking the cake for me lately, along with that block. Also with MH sword you can time your burst nicely with your phantasms

In PvP, Mesmer is an extremely fun class to play and have crazy burst potential in regards to shatter, Phantasm and conditions(specialising in one of the 3). Melting players is definitely a possibility with mesmer, and if you are skilled enough on any class, it wont matter what build you have, you will be able to hold your own and even kill a few players.

Leveling is probably the hardest part of a mesmer, as for more or less the irst 40 levels you go through hell, from there on it gets easier.. Mesmers are also very viable in PvE and dungeons as they provide exceptional group utility, the damage is nothing of a warrior, but it is nothing to be ashamed about.

WvW mesmers will be most fun as a roaming role, Zergs tend to, “wham, bam thank you mes” with our null field, veil, portal, feedback and timewarp(the group utility i mentioned earlier) and then leave us to die….

Not sure exactly what else you are looking for in terms of info

To test it, do a baseline test.
Step 1: Test with the pvp steady weapons and only use 10 in domination to gain the halting strike trait, pick the sigil of bloodlust and gain 3 stacks which would equal to a total of 15 out of the max 25 that you can get. This is to add the same amount of power you would gain from going 25 into the domination trait line which is equivalent to 150 power. Do a numerous amount of interrupts to find your average, although they should be consistent.

Produce you desired results
Step 2: Follow step 1 but with the sigil of force so that you can figure out what your damage should be with the +5% damage bonus. Do a numerous amount of interrupts to find your average, although they should be consistent.

Test the traits:
Step 3: Remove your bloodlust stacks as well as any other added sigil, Go 25 into domination Taking only Halting strike and wastrel’s punishment. Do a numerous amount of interrupts to find your average, although they should be consistent.

Step 4: Post results and feel awesome

@ Shtos vant.

The minor trait in inspiration that grants +15% Phantasm damage is in the 25 slot not 20.
The build you suggested wont work out, cause you are explaining about a build that uses 75 trait points and not the norm of 70.

DuckDuckBoom had some good suggestions, especially with 0/20/0/25/0. It would be ideal to use sword pistol there, or even scepter pistol. You will have great conditions going on your enemies from Dueling 15 pt minor trait as well as combining pistol phantasm(preferably with 2 up) and a etheral field for some awesome confusion stacking as well.. Another possibility is to go 25 into chaos for extra survivability as well as picking up a staff as your defensive weapon set.

Sounds fun and keen to join.
Rank 40, Main Mesmer.
Builds: Roaming Phantasm Burst(Main build), Lockdown DPS, Condi DPS. The latter 2 are more towards group play, to a lesser extent the lock down build as it can strive in both group and solo.
Server: Aurora Glade, EU.

Lahel.6381:

Alissah.9281:

/Sobs in the corner, also known as the EU while everyone else has fun

That said/sobbed, I think custom arenas are just way too expensive. Its like 90 gold for 1 month O.o i really would buy one if it was like.. 40, 40 sounds reasonable.

I shall sob a long with you

Its only expensive to buy the Custom Arena at 1600 gems. From there maintaining them is not bad as long as you buy the bulk purchase which is 450 gems for 20 days, roughly 30 gold.
That rounds out to be more or less 40-45 gold a month

It also depends on what play style you are going for on a mesmer, Shatter or Phantasm are the best burst specs a mesmer has. Also on what mode?? PvP/WvW/PvE?

Mesmers also have a lot of active defense such as blurred frenzy and teleports for example and stealth more than passive defense, although there is some really good passive defense such as iDefender which tanks damage.

In a sense, use of skills and positioning is what keeps you alive as a GC mesmer

Concerning point 2:
There are more classes able of being able to teleport stomp a thief, another example is the ele.

Mesmer stomping is by mastering how to get you to control the battle and not a mesmer, Bait him/her out, just before the mesmer uses the downed 2 skill cancel and restart the stomp, in most cases he/she will appear from stealth before you finish your stomp and in range, also requires a target to cast so stealth also affects this skill.

The only one truly unstompable(probably not a real word :P ) is the ele i am sure using a similar tactic to the mesmer is possible granted the ele stays in range, but have not gotten good tests on this yet..

As well as evilapprentice making valid points..its all in all i think the stomping is rather balanced.

Somewhat agreed with point 1 to an extent.. The team should be rewarded for team play if they are all down and focus on the one downed target to kill him.. as would be the case if the other team had actually decided to res their downed hence none of the other team would have rallied.. Team play is what should be rewarding.

Fully agreed with point 3, and do not disagree or agree with point 4

The way a mesmer counters CC is by actively using skills to make the cc redundant, evades, teleports, invulnerabilities.. all these require a lot more skill to counter well rather than having a passive boon let you stand there and soak it up.

Diminishing return would actually not be a bad implementation to the game, such as removing a fear or bleed stacks and having it planted on you not even a second later. Having the duration of the second stack of bleed or fear still do the damage but the full duration be decreased by a percentage(10%) would make the game less spammable. Also cure the condition meta somewhat.

all of the above was just an example, so dont focus on certain things and be like, ’’OMG OPOPOPPO!!11!1"

Rigel.3092:

No, hell no, just NO. OMG.

This is the thing i hate about the mesmer community.. Yes, it is not a great idea and i agree that the way it is now is a lot better, but seriously show respect! Uhg..its disgusting to see the way some of you reply..

My mesmer grew up on the slums of Divinity’s Reach, was part of the circus and didnt even know his own father.

He has delved deep into the realms of the mists and has become a savage beast over time. My mesmer is a brute.

The greatsword is nice in the sense of how fast the attacks are, and you could gain some quick dps on the targets as well as in an AoE position. Personally i prefer the focus for the burst capability, the pistol does give nice consistent dps in PvE though.

Things will get a lot better once you hit level 40 as mesmer is extremely trait dependant.

Ronpierce… You talk about, what seems to be mesmer AI and how ridiculous it is where the mm necro and spirit rangers are currently abusing Ai the most at this point of time and How you spend 80% of traits on minions and call it brainless for a mesmer doing the same??

You have just proven your whole argument invalid. You also seem to think that mesmer can spec 30/30/30/30/30?? We can not be boss at shatter and phantasm all at once..You know this right???

A little bit of background… I main mes, play necro and thief.. I must admit, the necro is just cheese atm with coniditions… Now, if i were to play phantasm, i would be expected to trait into phantasm, just as you would be to trait for minions.. Now, phantasm do true damage, have very, very little HP now after nerf and moderately high cool downs.. So how should we spec for them if those are key traits of phantasms? Oh, thats right! Damage increase, HP buff and CD reduction.. Now taking these traits also leave the mesmer with nothing defensive and very squishy, risk vs reward is much higher on this spec than an MM Necro..

A lot of people also seem to think that phantasm are OP because of ONE))) Single annoying phantasm that takes no skill in placing or risk. Now why dont you focus on that ONE)) rather than say NERF NERF NERF OP MES BEAT ME!!!!!

Or how about try play the class?! that certainly helped me with necros, and their OP condition spam for days.. Now i only struggle against highly skilled necros, no more nub scruub necro i see almost in every game.

No changes will be made, even mesmers have been for more interactiveness with their profession.. We have very little access to stealth already so that is not the problem, a buff to toughness or vitality would make it justified that weapon damage gets increased, so that we could actually use them e.g. sword without getting 3 shotted by gs rangers, ect.. Maybe if done corrrectly phantasm damage can be lowered, but you must remember, that in a phantasm spec, this is pretty much all we trait for, so its gotta give some use..

Personally i laugh at every mesmer that runs pistol, mostly for the lack of skill it takes to use it, i have no problems against those mesmers as well, use reflective surfaces, duelist kills themselves, and the mesmer stuns himself and two clones, sorted.. i would personally like to see a increase to the ICD of the duelist.

You guys are also calling for nerfs that will harm other builds, mesmer is already in a bad place in PvP atm.. not viable at all, please dont kill us further just because you want to 1v1. allow the class to become viable…

Nuka although blatantly arrogant has brought up some points i was thinking about as well.. Dont mind him though, always thinking he is the best mesmers on the world and does it in the most immature way.

@ kitten s
The 10 points in illusions doesnt really help a phant build all too much, and the major 10 point trait only applies to you and not your phantasms, Have you considered maybe placing 5 these points into inspiration, there is a lot of utility and in 30 for inspiration and some much needed condition removal.

Also, Dazing is good, and the 15 point trait in domination can really increase your dps, but in 1v1 situation, you really only have the sword OH daze as pistol gives you stun on first bounce. If you combined these 5 points with the spare from illusions you could get Phantasmal fury in the dueling line, which helps a tremendous amount, especially for the iSwordsman(This is because the swordsman only has one attack, the similar applies to a thief backstab, if that attack does not crit it is a major dps loss, so having this crit more than it currently does would justify the loss on the 15 point dom line(iDuelist has many hits in his attack, each hit crits independently, which is a lot safer and sustained dps can be expected more here))

Why do you choose OH sword and pistol, just curious. Also, great sword can help a lot in situations when you are in trouble.

Runes: I prefer eagle runes, less power for more crit chance.. 6% increase if i am correct.. You also do not loose the 6th bonus because your health is not 90% anymore, which would be 2k HP loss on my build(not a lot :/)

Please know, i am not trying to put you on the spot or anything.

Psych

I actually do not believe this will be implemented at all.
How do you see this as being OP? honest question..
From my point of view, it requires more skill from the player, that they actually have to interact with the phantasm more instead of an attack cycle running which is highly predictable. Maybe the attack cycle for non commanded attacks would have to be increased by 3-4secs, as well as in the second example you would actually lose 1-2 skills(maybe adding the F5 part was slightly OP :P ) certain shatter skills to gain control of the phatasms so speccing shatter, you would not be wanting these phantasm commands(which they anyways shatter after the initial cycle) and phantasm mesmers would have to think carefully about what they replace. Rather a slight nerf to phantasm and phantasm mesmers for less predictability(delaying 1-2secs for burst combo)..

Hi, I have been thinking of this idea for quite some time now and i personally would really like this/something similar to be implemented(even though my hopes are not high :/ ).

The problem is, well i do not know programming, my idea is only a partial idea. This is why i am typing here to ask for help and possibilities

My idea involves giving mesmers the abilities to control the attack cycles of their summoned phantasms, with the ICD of each attack cycle having an obvious effect of not being able to spam it I was thinking more along the lines of having the skills change like they do with Necro’s, the flaw here though is how would you summon another phant and if the summoning CD is off how do you choose between summoning a new phant or making the existing one attack?
The other possibility could be adding something similar to rangers.. being able to switch in and out your shatter skills to add attacking skills for phantasms.. of course this second suggestion is bound to get an enormous amount of QQ…I think it might be the better route? Then changing the way phantasm act, by if they do not attack 2-3 secs after their normal cycle, they would then attack..(increased attack cycle by 2-3 secs if not ordered, keep current attack cycle CD for ordered attacks) maybe add an extra “F” key function and the ability to swap out shatters for phantasm.. e.g. F1 MW, F2 Zerker attack, F3 Unchanged, F4 unchanged, F5 Warden attack. Each F key having an arrow, out of combat, with which you may customize you F buttons with shatter/Phat attacks. Each Phant will have their own ICD so you would also have to press the attack cycle for each individual one, time when you want them to attack, plan it more carefully..

I would really love this profession to be more interactive than what it is now, right now, this type of build is more noob friendly, but it has an exceptionally high Ceiling cap as well. A lot of people think that you beat them because you can are running a particular build(Phant mes) and thakittens only viable 1v1, untill you show them that you can even 2v1 winning a lot of fights, that there can be much skilled involved if you play it properly.

anyways, just a suggestion,
Initiate QQ, troll wars..

Psych out

As well as the iSwordsman only has 1 hit, that means it will not reliably crit.
The Pistol and Focus have 9 and 12 hit respectively, each hit with a separate chance to crit giving a more reliable burst than the iSwordsman.

Nretep.2564:

New Mesmer Elite/ Utility:
Phantasm. Summon two phantasms with the type of your left hand weapon’s. You become one of them. The only option skill you have is “undo transformation”. While you’re a phantasm you cannot fight/ move on your own, but your character behaves exactly like the phantasm (moves, attacks and deals damage). You have the same health as the phantasm. If your health reaches 0, the transformation is undone and you get your original HP back (like death shroud).
Casttime 1.5s.
Duration 10s.
CD = CD of the phantasm’s summoning skill times three.

Thats not a bad idea, i really dig the idea of having iRogue as the elite and replacing downed phant with something else, and the Rogue goes into stealth after it attacks and comes out 2-3secs before it attacks

Harrier.9380:

Psych.6527:

Its the same with immobilize, Mesmer swords #3 skill iLeap->Swap person evades just after the swap, they get the immobilize but still somehow evade with immobilize?
This is crucial part of a mesmer doing burst damage and this bug completely negates that.

Well all Immobilizes work like this for some reason, wondering what’s the case for it too.

Jip, was just giving an example but i think this issue also needs to be addressed along with the evading when stunned. They both seem to have equal importance

Its the same with immobilize, Mesmer swords #3 skill iLeap→Swap person evades just after the swap, they get the immobilize but still somehow evade with immobilize?
This is crucial part of a mesmer doing burst damage and this bug completely negates that.