Guild Wars 2

Well dailies at the very least give us somthing to do. I mean its not much heck its really little. But I’d be even more annoyed without them.

We need a proper endgame. Fotm is not endgame in a way since not everyone has the time to do it.

So I’m getting met now by the crowd that enjoys ascended gear and the grind. Full moon is out I think.

I don’t want a flame war gezz because I forgot my flame armor so I’d die and I don’t want to die.

My points are valid, the video is really misleading. How can you feel like a hero? In what part of the game do you feel like one?

I agree leveling to 80 was great, not fantastic. It was at 80 that I saw the game for what it is.

Lebannen.8325:

AcidicVision.5498:

Well, 40 laurels by just playing the game, and 50 ectos from TP or salvaging rares you get by playing the game.

The only grind I see is the one you put on yourself. You can get your ecto from pent/shelt runs and Plinx over and over again. Ill get mine from fractals, the rehauled AC, and another dungeon or two.

Your way is grind. My way is fun and lends progress to multiple goals. Perception vs. reality is a kitten.

If you do pve. I dont, I only have done 1 fractal and 1 dungeon and I hated both of them. So, it is not possible for me to get a legendary outside of buying gems and converting to gold.

You have grind if you want it. Thats Anet’s brand new End of Augest manifesto.

If you actually believed their manifesto (check link bellow).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=davb_vgQ0BQ
Clearly you were tricked, like the rest of us. Sadly you gota either tolerate it or stop trying for it. Too bad the game is so much different then the game we all read about for years.

Yeah we do. Why? Because we do. Why? because we all like chess? Why because chess is fun. Why? leave me alone!

Honestly they made the game so much easily then Gw1. I remember having as a dervish to keep certian conditions up to tank properly, now it doesn’t really matter.

We do feel like we were ignored and brushed aside to attract the WoW crowd.

Craywulf.5793:

Dr Ritter.1327:

Sorry we don’t all enjoy siting in LA for 4 hours getting message suppressed trying to spam LFG

If you’re standing around spamming the chatbox, then you’re obviously failing miserably at socializing.

What many here don’t seem to understand is that socializing is two way street, you need to actually show others your worthwhile to play with if you have any hopes of gaining a playmate. The best way to socialize in this game is actually go out and assist someone in PvE, WvW, or even in a random sPvP match. When another player sees you help them, they generally respond in kind. The rest is up to you in how you convince them to play with you.

Otherwise standing around in LA screaming (spamming) " Look at me! Play with me! fill the role I’ve designated for you or leave me alone!" Of course I’m exaggerating here, but point is there’s no social aspect here. You either fill someone’s role or they want no part of you. That’s like going to store and just plucking the ripe grapes off the whole stems and discarding the rest.

Socializing is really not that hard, but it’s certainly possible in GW2. You actually have to be nice to someone. Heaven forbid you should actually play the game and meet someone on equal terms. Nobody like to be discarded or treated as anything less than human. Many players seriously underestimate how discriminatory and soulless the LFG tool is.

Don’t bash him illogically! Do it logically next time okay?

If I log in right now, no one is on I want to meet with someone Now not wait a few hours to find someone.

I think that most of us really hoped that at least 60-70% of what they were saying were true. But its not.

One of my favourite claims are that they are against mobs respawning 10 minutes later to be killed. Oh I understand so 1 hour is better right? Well it is 6x more. This contridicts what they said about that. And yes no one cares if we killed it and yes thousands are doing the same thing. How do I know? IN MY OWN SERVER I get put into overflow server because so many are doing the SAME event.

Well it is, because what is said in that trailer simply is not the game.

I don’t hate the game, I just don’t being told I’m getting a banana cream pie to be suddently given a hershy’s kiss instead.

Does this video represent what you think of Guild Wars 2?

stof.9341:

I’m not sure how you can say that 80 days worth of dailies and 3 monthlies is such a “small” grind. At the rate of one hour per daily that’s quite some grind here. You still need to find 100 ectos and two ring through fractal too. It’s not as if running a daily level 10 fractal gives you much in the way of the regular daily completion either.

I never thought of it as a collective time but you have a point. 80 hours is insane.

I can’t edit my post for some reason but part 1 is broken.

darkace.8925:

Revolution.6301:

darkace.8925:

Revolution.6301:

And people why is everyone ignoring my Skins should be what we grind for argument?

Because it’s an opinion. I can’t argue against your opinion. I can, however, present to you the facts. The facts are that we can, but are not required to, grind for stats. Content is not gated behind a series of gear checks only passable by those with BiS gear. Until this changes, the “this game is a grind” argument is a baseless one.

Its not mine opinion. Area Net said this.

Read my post before commenting.

So you keep saying. Prove it. Provide one link to a blog or interview in which ArenaNet says what you claim they say. Just. One. Link.

Edit: And I’m still waiting for you to provide factual evidence of what the “majority” want.

Are you kidding me? Okay fine I’ll find you many links with Anet saying that. I’m shocked that your telling me to find somthing so well known but fine.
So if I find a few links what then? Will I be right and will you be wrong?

darkace.8925:

Revolution.6301:

And people why is everyone ignoring my Skins should be what we grind for argument?

Because it’s an opinion. I can’t argue against your opinion. I can, however, present to you the facts. The facts are that we can, but are not required to, grind for stats. Content is not gated behind a series of gear checks only passable by those with BiS gear. Until this changes, the “this game is a grind” argument is a baseless one.

Its not mine opinion. Area Net said this.

Read my post before commenting.

darkace.8925:

Revolution.6301:

Lets be clear. Stats are not optional. Skins are!

Stats are not optional, but Best in Slot stats are. Before you try to ineffectively argue otherwise, name one thing I can’t do in this game unless I’ve got BiS stats. One thing. That’s it. Name one thing and we’ll talk. If you just pull your usual “talk circles around the issue at hand”, you might as well not even bother.

Revolution.6301:

And on the side note your in the minority right now. Keep that in mind too.

Do you have data proving which side is in the minority? No? Then upon what grounds can you make this statement? We have a phrase for baseless statements presented as facts; but seeing as it might be considered rude, I’ll refrain from repeating it here.

November. Remember that month? The month where there was an uproar against ascended gear? I have never read any threads that say they love it no, its always how they want it gone. Oh and in November people had so many issues against ascended gear Colin even commented on it.
Oh and btw IGN did an article this month where Colin commented again on the issue.

This is solid fact. How am I wrong? If I’m wrong break it apart piece by piece. Don’t ignore any part of my argument or I’ll call your argument unsound.

And people why is everyone ignoring my Skins should be what we grind for argument? Anet said stats would Not be what we grind for skins are. Anet said that if you going to grind for 1000s of hours it should be for an awsome skin not so you can keep up stat wise.

@Darkace and Tobias Trueflight

You both argue against me which is fine but why do you always ignore this argument? Both of you have never commented on that argument.
Is it maybe because this is what came out of Anets mouth for 4 years?

darkace.8925:

Guild Wars 2 is a vast improvement over Guild Wars. Why? It fixes so many things Guild Wars did wrong; such as stagnant gear progression and a lack of end-game.

Revolution.6301:

You can’t call Gw2 an improvment over the original Guild Wars

Too late…I just did.

Guild Wars had a fantastic endgame.

If it didn’t why weren’t people complaining about it? Why wasn’t there a Guild Wars 2 November drama about it? Why did people actually thank Anet for such a wonderful endgame?

Don’t bash Guild Wars if you didn’t play it. And if you did well it did quite well for an mmo that pratically stopped updatating (as in expansions) back in 09. If it was THAT bad why was it so profitable?

Sinoran.9140:

Nurse.1085:

Sinoran.9140:

critickitten.1498:

darkace.8925:

Not because I have to. Because I want to. Because I enjoy doing so. The moment…the exact millisecond gearing my characters ceases to be fun is the exact millisecond I’ll stop bothering.

Okay, fair enough.

Now consider that, like you, there are others out there who want to obtain the best gear they can.

Would you like to explain why they should have to submit themselves to a boring grind for it? Why the pursuit of the best gear can’t be both challenging and enjoyable?

People begged and pleaded for a gear grind in this game. Ascended is for those people.

Exotics are there for the people who don’t want to grind for their gear.

If you want Ascended then you’ll just have to grind for it like everyone else who wants it.

Would you prefer paying $15 a month to have one attempt a week at a boss that may not even drop your desired gear piece, which you still have to win the /roll against other players in the group? Or, play freely with a guarantee based on time, on when you get your BiS gear without the influence of RNG?

If those kinds of gates weren’t there, we would be back at square one, people complaining that BiS gear is too easy to get (exotics). That’s just the way it is.

I don’t think it’s as black and white as you’re making it sound. It doesn’t have to be “dailies or $15/mo for raids” – It can be so much more creative and innovative than that.

When people asked for gear progression, I don’t think those people ever intended it to be the way it is now. I’m sure those same people are crying “What were you thinking Anet!?” – Maybe it was bad communication between the community and Anet.

Also, as far as I know and if my memory serves me correctly, Anet said they always intended to add Ascended gear. Thus, it probably has nothing to do with people “wanting” gear progression to begin with.

It just feels like overall poor implementation. I wouldn’t mind if Ascended could be crafted or earned through other means in addition to what we have now. If Ascended stays off the Trading Post, it will never be as common as Exotics.

Right now, it’s nearly impossible to gear more than one character in Ascended. For someone like me with various 80s, you can understand how that can be frustrating.

=\ I just hope in the future they’ll be more creative.

Why do you have to gear up multiple alts in ascended? Are exotics not enough? Unless you’re running high level fractals on them all.

I have multiple 80s as well (all decked out in exotics), but when exotics get the job done (the game was designed with exotics being BiS), I don’t feel the need to get better gear when it isn’t required.

You want innovative implementation, but say ascended should be able to be crafted and sold on the TP. How is that innovative?

Current Methods of obtaining Ascended:
FotM Ring drops/pristine relics
Guild Mission rewards
Laurels
Mystic Forge.

Methods not in use:
RNG drops off Dungeon Bosses/World Bosses
Straight up buy them with gold
Crafting
Earnable through Special Achievements
Dungeon Token rewards
Dungeon Chests
JP chests
WvW Honor Badge rewards
RNG drop off of normal, vet, and champ mobs

They could add in all of these methods, but these have all been done in other MMOs, so they’re not new.

If my memory serves me correctly, A.net has said they will be adding more methods to obtain ascended gear. Perhaps you should wait for those updates.

My point still stands that Ascended is optional.

If you feel you HAVE to get ascended gear, that is your problem, not A.nets.

Lets be clear. Stats are not optional. Skins are!

Yeah they’ve said they’ll add new ways but when? In the novemeber release which was a disastor on so many levels they still haven’t fixed it much. Dailies are great but seriously 2 months for 2 items. Really? I thought you’re suppose to spend 1000s of hours on skins! not Stats!!!

I can appreciate you like grindy content. I do but Guild Wars 2 was marketed towards people that don’t. That want a change. That want somthing different.

Please keep that in mind before bashing someone’s post.

And on the side note your in the minority right now. Keep that in mind too.

Jrunyon.3012:

They have already said they are going to be adding new ways to obtain them.

How about you just be patient, and maybe even realize that ascended stuff isn’t the end game, its an optional path to take in gearing up your character.

Stop it with this argument!

Getting stats isn’t opotional skins are!

This is illogical, unvalid and unsound.

@op

You’ve actually made a post that is calm, clear and focused.
I agree with you 100% and yes this is what my problem is too. You can’t call Gw2 an improvment over the original Guild Wars why? Since it breaks so many things Guild Wars did right. Such as: Gear grind, skins, cosmemtics in general, challenging content.

Orion the Cursed.1206:

35 = rings,

READ THE TOOLTIP!

Also take note you cant equip multiple ascended with the same name on the same avatar

so this basically forces me to do Fotm + this right?

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

it only costs about 30 laurels to redeem an ascended amulet.
not that hard.

I’m confused I see ones for 30 and ones for 35. I’m assuming the ones for 35 are better right?

Which one would you choose if you’re going for a knight’s build?

Since I know I’ll never be able to have ascended stats what item is the best to buy to make money off of?

VidGhost.3215:

If you look at the FOTM weapon skins people ARE spending 1000s of hours grinding for skins ! and NOT better tire stuff

You happened to miss the whole ascended stat thing right?

morrolan.9608:

Amun Ra.6435:

What do you people want? You want the BEST gear in the game for a legion of alts in a matter of weeks? Please explain how that makes sense?

Well its what their manifesto stated, something that attracted a large number of people to the game, and in most mmos you can get it quickly if you’re prepared to grind for it. As some have said recently anet have done the whole vertical progression thing really badly.

They said that stats wouldn’t be what you spend 1000s of hours grinding for skins are!!!!!!!!! Why is everyone forgetting this?

runeblade.7514:

What is your definition of grind?

November 16th, 2012

lol

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Arale.4207:

I agree. People who are playing this game have it so good compared to the games of the past and, yes, even games still being played right now. I feel really blessed to play this game. Sure, it’s not perfect, but there’s seriously MUCH worse out there. I think back to the days of WoW where I’m fighting with people via /roll to get that one item that dropped on my 40th run.

Sure glad that’s over.

i only played world of warcraft for a bit. did not experience 40 players raid yet.

those 40 players raid also use a 1 – 100 roll to determine who gets a single loot at the end of a long raid?

Minion of Vey.4398:

The goal of a game should not be to suck less than the competition.

if we get max stats too easily people complain there is nothing left to do.

remember what happened shortly after launch?

Ever play this game called Guild Wars?

In it, it was so easy to get max stats. Anyone and everyone had it. What we cared about was:

Cool looking minis
Weapons skins
Armor skins
Special cosmetic items such as the destoyer glove, chaos glove
Titles
Create and try out new builds.

We had lots to do even with our ‘max stats’.

What bothers me is how Anet said they were going to the North Pole from 09 to 12 then suddently at release tell us we’re going to Italy.

Somthing is a grind when you feel like you’ve done the task a million times and you want to quickly get it out of the way to do somthing else.

DigitalKirin.9714:

Yes, it’s in the history.

Thats good, thanks for letting me know.

I’m setting up a guild and I’m wondering if you can see who has made withdrawl and deposites in the Guild Bank. Since I want to reward those doing a good job (higher rank etc.) and make sure though that they didn’t take everything in there.

Thanks.

Well coming from a Gw1 player I miss the skill combinations. I find it a joke we are stuck with the same skills forever and ever and always.

Gw1 had combat deaph some would say more so then this but what would happen if you simply added the dodge and jump mechanics? This game would look silly in comparrison.

Robbyx.1284:

maddoctor.2738:

Robbyx.1284:

Teulius.8752:

Guild wars 2 a mediocre stereotypical mmorpg? What the hell are you talking about?
I’ve been playing tons of different mmrogps for the past 8 years of my life (wow, tera, gw1 warhammer online, aion just to name a few), some of them pay2play and some of them free2play. There must be at least a hundred mmrogps that I’ve tried and let me tell you one thing, Guild wars 2 might not be THE best mmorpg out there but without a freaking doubt it is the most original and revolutionary mmorpg out there.

Please tell me what is original and revolutionary about GW2….im not being smart, im genuinely interested in what you see in GW2 that you think hasnt been done before.

Dynamic Event system, far superior (and different) to anything Rift or Warhammer Online ever did.

Active Combat, ok there have been RPGs with more emphasis in combat, but never a real blend between types like in Guild Wars 2

No trinity, no “roles” in combat. OK maybe there are some roles but not as strictly defined as in other games, nor the same. In this feature I must add the “no threat”, there is no threat management/generation skills/abilities (Thank goodness)

Weapon system/Skill system, it is funny how it is now being copied by the MMORPGs of the future. Limited Skillbars, Weapon-specific skills.

The World and Exploration. Vistas/POIs/Skill challenges, it’s the only MMORPG that is actually rewarding true exploration.

Just to name a few features

LOTRO has open world events, so does DDO in its “wilderness” areas.

DDO has a very similar combat system, only replacing dodge with block.

No “trinity” was clever PR spin, nothing more….in GW2 everyone is now DPS.

The weapon skill bar is something i hear discussed a lot…it is extremely limiting and gets old very quickly, you can have it maxed out all available skills open at level 10.

True exploration ? try LOTRO, it kicks GW2’s butt is that respect, and truly rewards exploration…if exploring is your “thing”, i would suggest you try LOTRO, no other game even comes close.

GW2 is a fun game no doubt, but nothing here is “new”…it is a new (and not always good) spin on current game mechanics.
Some are even archaic game mechanics that most MMO’s have already given up….take GW2 bosses for example, just the same old lame million hit point piñatas that even older games are moving away from.

You put it quite nicely “spin on current game mechanics.”, I’ve always thought of it as a renovation but that works quite well too.

World Boss Battles are so brainless its laughable. Why doesn’t the boss actually get godly hard when there are over 200 people attacking it? Now that would be so great

For example, the random creation of Ascended Gear or that Karka island ~why is it there?~

Note: This is not a grind thread no, its actually on topic Is Anet being too vauge?

Imo Anet is being so vauge with what they want to do. I mean you can’t tell and its iratating at times to know what’s going to happen to this game.

pixieish.9627:

Oh please, why would ANet include LFG? It makes too much sense!

O.O I think your right!

Minos.5168:

Since they’ve announced GW2 will not have expansions this year, I’m kind of expecting the game to die.

I mean, the consistent complaint is that there’s not enough content and the counter to that was that the GW1 that most people remember had 2 expansions.

Without an expansion, they’re not really resolving the “lack of content” issue.

They still haven’t provided an adequate reason for people to continue playing after reaching level 80. There’s no new armor art or weapon skins to grind for.

Just Ascended gear which will only appease people that like grinding for more stats without visual reward.

GW2 is increasingly seeming like a churn-and-burn game where they get people to throw money at the gemstore, and then quickly abandon the game.

They keep introducing new currencies (because people have kept accumulating the existing ones).

Nothing’s really being resolved.

Without an expansion, I expect more content like Southsun Cove which really has no current reason to visit.

It’s nice to see that they’re planning on FIXING that content release in the coming months… But if it takes them months to fix something that should have been worthwhile to begin with? That shows a lack of quality control.

They have no idea what they’re doing and it’s showing.

At least Blizzard has a clear vision on what they want to do.

What you’ve said is quite harsh but very true. The lack of expanisions is worrysome. And that people 7 months into the game are still complaining of lack of content is also also worrysome.

Heck even the gem store is laughable because there is NOTHING really cool to buy. Other then maybe around 300 gems worth there is nothing.

I mean if they didn’t delay the game then we wouldn’t have the right to complaine as much as we do.

killcannon.2576:

I find this post amusing in that he references grind, but in another of his posts mentioning rewards from GW1 available in GW2 he states that if you’re not willing to grind close to a thousand hours to get the pets you shouldn’t complain. Sounds a bit dodgy to me lol.

Not really actually. My point those previous posts were that titles like ‘A god walking amongst mortals’ should only be given to people who are willing to put in the time.

Keep in mind that the title system in this game is laughable and imo its confusing to see who has what title. They don’t get emotes or anything to signify they have the title. And by putting in those 1000s of hours you do derserve somthing only a few hundered will have.

On Topic: What I find annoying is post 80 there really feels like a void of not a whole like to do there.

Scumbag Mawile.6384:

They said they aren’t releasing any expansions this year. Of course there’ll be expansions later, just not in 2013.

And that is very good news.

The game does indeed feel unfinished. Not much to work towards in the endgame, and what there is, is often generally aimless and/or can be achieved in a fraction of the time spent somewhere else (PvP rewards, anyone?). UI issues, balance issues, etc. also hint heavily at forced release.

However, they’re working on it, likely denying expansions this year so they can finish vanilla GW2. They’re adding to WvW this month. They’re adding to PvE. I’ll quit the game if they don’t cough up fixes to broken classes and better rewards where it’s seriously lacking like in PvP, but then, I’m quite certain those issues will be fixed long before then.

You aren’t being forced to pay for the game. If you’re so disgusted, wait a few months and come back. Things should only get better.

EDIT: Also, as someone who put thousands of hours into WoW through its first three expansions, I can tell you it started feeling off during its second and went to complete crap in its third. I wouldn’t play it if it was subscription-free as it is. You should know better than to think Blizzard doesn’t pocket the extra 180$ (that’s three GW2s) a year that they make off every customer.

I agree somewhat with you. Though people need to stop using the argument that they were forced to release it early why?

It was delayed 3 times. It was suppose to release in 2009, then 2010, then 2011 then it finally released in 2012.
They had an extra 3 years to work on their game, how then are there so many issues? If they released the game back in 09 then I wouldn’t make this comment but they didn’t.

Gelltor.3015:

I don’t understand why people get so worked up about this,the lfg site is perfectly functional,so I don’t see why the devs should devote resources to making something that can already be gotten…..
And besides,if they do make one and it’s not as good as the lfg site,then it will actually hurt the dungeon finding as people will just be usin that one.

Its because its such as common feature in any mmo now-a-days. Idk why Anet would not include such as logical feature that would not be hard to implement. This just shows a lack of polish.

TheBlackLeech.9360:

Vayne.8563:

I’d have been bored with Prophecies 7 months after it released, until Factions came out. Just the way it is. No one can offer you infinite content, because content takes time to make.

While this is true, this is not an excuse that I like to see people using.

Lots of games are released with more content than their predecessors (expansions included).

Also, they took several steps backwards from things that were established as good in Guild Wars 1.

The biggest example of a change from Gw1 to Gw2 that is complete garbage is the targeting system. Why on earth are we still stuck (today march 2013) with a targeting system that is based on your field of view? What was wrong with the targeting system in Gw1? Why are enemies not targetable at a certain distance? Why do you lose a target if you rotate your camera in the opposite direction?

In my honest opinion, Guild Wars 2 was an unfinished project when it was released.

It was lacking in so many areas.

Sure, some of these areas have been improved upon…. but the game itself still has a lot of flaws.

It is really upsetting that game companies can get away with releasing games as unfinished products…. but by the same token…. I’d rather be playing the game as it is now, unfinished, than still be waiting for it (and still playing gw1)

This game is amazing…. but I still shake my head in disbelief at how much better it should have been.

While I agree with what you said about GuildWars 2’s fault I disagee with it being okay with it being released as an unfinished product. Honestly, I would be fine if it was held back until this September if that gave Anet more time to improve on it, heck even next year. But imo Anet clearly did not have honest people testing it. They were probably fanboys/fangirls who thought the game was gold no matter what. I still don’t get how the voice acting was acceptable when they had AMAZING voice actors voice the characters. The lack of cutscenes is just downright annoying. I enjoy my CGI cutsceans (I’d expect this in 2013) What was with the wall? seperating the people when they’re talking.

Anet these forums are constantly negative, even Nexon’s forums (and this is saying alot) are less negative. This is clearly a sign that it is time the players should be listened to.

sacredninja.5236:

As a true GW fan I am greatly disappointed. I have played GW1 from the start and had never played a game that has been much fun as that before.
For years and years I played Prophecies, Factions, Nightfall and Eye of the North. I met a girl in GW1 and we have now been together for over 4 years, are engaged and have two beautiful kids together, I have also met my two best friends in GW1. And for these great things I thank you.
I have waited for GW2 in anticipation for over 5 years. I even bought a new PC last September because my old one would not run the game.
When I started playing it at first I was not sure I was going to like it, but because GW1 was so great, the 2 novels such a pleasure to read and due to all the great things I was reading prior to launch about all the great new things it would add to the world of MMORP I kept playing it.
Eventually I was starting to understand all the new systems and let go of my old GW1 play style and really started to enjoy this fresh new game. But I have to say that after getting most of my characters to lvl 80 with exotic gear, that I am greatly disappointed, it feels like most RPG’s even though you said it would not be like others.
I find it is getting boring, dull and overrated with too much of the same things day in day out. The same events, the same few maps and the same dungeons. The Daily’s where a nice surprise when launched at first, but that’s wearing off now.
I also heard there will be no Add-ons or Expansions like in GW1 (factions NF and EotN). Why not? Are you going to give us more updates instead? I hope not because your updates are destroying the game. With every update you implement something new, something new that adds very little to an already mediocre MMORPG, and to top it off, these updates break more then they fix!
I am strongly considering removing GW2 from my machine and purchasing a different game. I did not play WoW much because I did not agree with paying subscriptions for a game that I already purchased at a retailer. But seeing how this game is going I am reconsidering. When you pay a subscription for a game it means developers and/or publishers will have more funds for maintaining the Servers the games run on, and more funds for updates, fixes, and perhaps add-ons or expansions
I would even consider paying a subscription to you Arenanet, if you were able to promise to me that would you make the game better, and fix your patches and updates before your push them on to us and not just for us to find out what you broke this time
Consider this a letter from a very displeased Fan/customer/Consumer

Adriaan.

I agree with you 100%.

Anet is doing it wrong, they promised a revolution for the mmo industry and really we got more of a mmo renovation (poorly one done at that) then a revolution. All the pr for the game was extermly misleading and as a Gw1 player myself I’m getting bored of your game.

Personally I have a level 80 (I don’t have the time to level up other one) and here is what I’m doing:

1. Grinding for gold to buy some flashy armor + weapons
2. Map completion.

I would include jp but jp are simply not worth the time or effort.

Honestly for a game delayed 4 times, there is a clear lack of polish.
For example that wall seperating people when talking -didn’t people tell you that they didn’t like it? Or what about the clear lack of an endgame to which you replied to tell us to replay old content. This fine IF there is a REASON to play it. The daily is nice but other then that there is little reason to.
And Ascended gear~ oh ascended gear. Anet claimed that they planned to release it with exotic which logically cannot be true. If it was, then how come the way it was implemented is so poor? You can’t even buy Ascended Gear off the tp.

One a side note I am irratated to have been kicked out of my own server and put onto overflow because so many people were guesting on my server to farm the dragon. Really? Did no-one think about how poor of a choice this was?

Note: This is my opinion, my view on this however the point of this is to look at issues facing the community regardless of beliefs on the issues presented.

http://ca.ign.com/articles/2013/03/07/how-guild-wars-2-plans-to-survive

An interview was done with Colin Johanson, and he explains how GuildWars 2 will survive and prosper as an MMORPG.

GuildWars 2 is truly a fantastic MMO that is wonderful potential to become the best there is. However there are some issues that are crippling it:

1. Split Community – The majority of the community was a game with reasonable grind while the other half wants a game completly focued on grind.
2. Grind: How is Anet going to deal with this? The grand issue with this is that they promised a game where you wouldn’t grind to infinity and beyond yet they’re delivering on the opposite of that promise. Yes there are arguments that everything is optional however why should any part of this game be ‘restricted’ to a certian audience?
3. Post 80: After level 80 there isn’t alot to do. Generally most will grind out for the flashiest of items, finish their hearts, complete dungeons or do FOTM. The very problem with this is it sections off the community again, restricting content. A suggestion from me personally is to increase the rewards of jumping puzzles, make them worth doing like how world events have now become worth completing.
4. Make all areas equal in rewards, in the sense that grinding in Tunnel will offer the same rewards as grinding in Kexxes Hill areas.

These are areas that I personally think need to be addressed.

Thank you for reading this.

Transistor.8746:

Really? I was looking through all my pets after having all the zones explored to see which ones I’m missing so I could go back and find them. Then I discover that I need HoM points for the 4 that I’m missing?

I understand that they have the same abilities that other pets already have and are just skins, but still really? I was ok with the entire tab of achievs devoted to HoM points, completely understand the “god amongst mere mortals” title, and I’m ok with the fiery greatsword skin being exclusive to HoM as well. But when I see 4 “grayed out pets” in my action bar that I need to devote several hours into another game to unlock, that’s when it starts to get frustrating for me. Why can’t I unlock rewards in the game that I’m actually playing? I mean, that makes sense right? Just frustrated, I’m a completionist and I was hoping the pets I was missing were rare spawns/hidden in JPs or something interesting but it’s disappointing to find out that if I want them I’m playing the wrong game.

As a side note, it does kind of bug me to see the mist fire elite skill grayed out on all my chars too, but that I can understand because at least even if you do have to pay for it, it’s unlocked within this game.

Edit:

Two main issues that separate the pets from the other HoM rewards.

1). It is skill/action bar related. Even though they share the same skills as other pets, they have a unique spot in the combat interface. It is a profession specific mechanic, not simply a “skin.”

2) The grayed out portraits feel tacky and coercive. I have to look at them every time I change pets. If you must include them as HoM only, don’t toss it in everyone’s UI.

Hope that clears things up and puts less people on the defensive.

You realize that it takes for a casual player quite a long time to get the 30 points needed for both pets right?

You need around 7million ingame gold to get th 30 points.

For grinders thats around 500ish hours.
For investors about 100 hours.

Its still quite long and I would feel insulted in you had the skins I took forever to get.

Distaste.4801:

Heijincks.9267:

Alarox.4590:

Jrunyon.3012:

Alarox.4590:

At the same time, this doesn’t add anything to the game’s enjoyment (which we’ve already concluded is the priority in playing any game).

Wrong. It doesn’t add anything for you

Stop being selfish.

Finally, someone who can tell me how this makes the game so much more fun (I’m serious). Go on.

I can think of several reasons.

1. It gives the hardcore players incentive. They don’t care if there’s vertical progression. They want power. Ascended does that for them.
2. Ascended is still a new thing. Its application hasn’t really developed yet other than for FoTM. This lays out more potential in the future.
3. If implemented correctly, it would give all players a sense of progression which is… really important when it comes to MMORPGs. Anet admits their mistake in the implementation.

The main problem with ascended isn’t the fact it exists. The problem is its implementation. The existence of exotics goes against the manifesto too if you read it in a different light.

1. Gear progression gives an incentive to ALL players. All players want to progress their characters as far as they can go. The problem is when progressing their characters becomes nearly unobtainable, the players feel they’ve advanced as far as they can and quit. So while currently the hardcore players as having a good time chasing ascended, casual players are jumping ship because exotic is the best they can obtain without grinding fractals, laurels, or guild missions. This is a small positive to hardcore players and a GIANT negative to the rest of the players.

2. It has no more potential than rune slots, that’s all the infusion slots are being used for anyway. All they needed to do was introduce offensive, defensive, and utility rune slots, no ascended gear stat hike needed.

3. Again go back to #1, not all players currently have feasible access to ascended. ArenaNet might have admitted only implementing one way to get the gear as wrong, but they STILL haven’t fixed it and have in fact continued with their original bad implementation. Last patch they added amulets with, surprise surprise, only one way to get them. This patch they added accessories with guild missions(only available to those in a big enough guild) as their “main” way of obtaining them. Laurels are a time gated nightmare that put any player actually using them to obtain ascended months behind. Laurels also force you into completing dailies everyday, for months, on top of taking up 30mins-1hr of your desired playstyle. If a players has 1 hr a night to play they are doing their daily and not much else.

Ascended brought NOTHING to the game that couldn’t have been better implemented by using really cool looking skins(something the game severely lacks). Heck they could have added new stats, runes, sigils, or stat combos. ArenaNet needs to learn that too much stick and not enough carrot leads to people leaving and never coming back. Wait until next patch, I’d bet money they add an ascended item to WvW and the PvE crowd goes ape-kitten over it.

Instead they need to just make all ascended gear available through all current means of obtaining gear: crafting, Fractals, karma, WvW, dungeons, guild missions, and laurels. If they do that at a decent price(not 2 million karma per item), everyone will be happy. People won’t be forced into doing things they don’t want to, they won’t be concerned their small guild can’t do guild missions yet, they won’t spend their small amount of playtime doing a daily for laurels, etc. But ArenaNet won’t do that and will continue trying to force players to do certain activities for certain ascended pieces. I well and truly hope that they added ascended weapons to WvW, the outcry will be insane!

What you’ve summed up is generally the problem with them. If they were accessable then they’d be no reason to complain but the fact is it takes 100s of hours to properly equip yourself with all the ascended gear.

darkace.8925:

Alarox.4590:

darkace.8925:

Alarox.4590:

Jrunyon.3012:

Alarox.4590:

At the same time, this doesn’t add anything to the game’s enjoyment (which we’ve already concluded is the priority in playing any game).

Wrong. It doesn’t add anything for you

Stop being selfish.

Finally, someone who can tell me how this makes the game so much more fun (I’m serious). Go on.

He doesn’t need to; I already did. I explained to you that a great many players enjoy chasing carrots. Without carrots, they quickly bore of the game. These carrots, the “maximally efficient but completely optional” carrots, give many players a goal to work towards. And they usually feel a great sense of a satisfaction when they obtain that goal. That you fail to recognize this truth does not make it an untruth.

It really doesn’t make sense to me…

I don’t really understand the point of doing something you don’t enjoy in order to get something… so you can move on in order to do more things you don’t enjoy.

Why does it need to be things you don’t enjoy? Why can’t we have a system where your goal is cosmetic or fun things like the unbreakable choir bell? Why does it have to make you X% better?

It seems entirely illogical to me.

In life, you don’t live to work, you work to live. The only exception is if your work is what you want to spend life doing for enjoyment.

However, when it comes to games, people reverse this and play to work.

In real life when I work to get something, it’s because it makes life easier/more enjoyable.

The only logical reason I can find for this mentality is if you literally can’t find anything fun to do, and all you have is trying to get an arbitrary thing.

I’m sorry, but I’m starting to suspect you are indeed trolling. You’re arguing in circles. We’ve already covered all of this. If you don’t get it by now, then you’re not going to.

You break logic all the time such as that Ad-Hodiem (personal attack), how can you even comment on my logical arguments?

Alarox.4590:

Orion the Cursed.1206:

Revolution.6301:

darkace.8925:

You already thoroughly beat this dead horse in this thread:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/In-my-view-gw2-is-geartrademill/first

Do you really need to do it again?

Hello my good sir,

If you have nothing productive to say don’t post.

Your post isn’t productive as well. You didn’t specify why you think GW2 is a grind and if its another i want ascended gear but i’m too lazy to make an effort to get it, no one cares.

He gives you 5 reasons.

But thats none!

SadieDeAtreia.8912:

…the HoM rewards are mediocre at best when you think about how many thousands of hours some loyal GW1 players put into that game. But that’s what we got and people who didn’t play the original didn’t get it. And that is the way it is.

If you really feel so strongly about this, pick up a copy of GW1 and earn your HoM skins, like the rest of us did.

You my friend get a prize!

Alarox.4590:

It’s a legitimate topic of discussion. If you think that discussions about grind should be taboo and require your personal moderation, then you must think most topics are completely pointless and deserve the same response.

I doubt that, however, and I think people argue against even discussing this because they’re overly defensive about GW2…. I like the game too. So does the OP otherwise he wouldn’t even be posting.

That being said, grind is anything you’re somehow obligated to do that is obtained through niche and generally unfun (to the person doing them) activities. Ascended gear is a straight up objective improvement on your character that can only be obtained by doing a limited number of things, most of which the average person would rather not be doing.

In addition, Ascended gear isn’t just something you can go out of your way for a day or two to get. Ascended gear takes a large amount of time and dedication to get, so it’s not just a case of just doing things you don’t want to do. It’s a case of doing things you don’t want to do over a long period of time.

The usual argument against my above statements is that “you can do anything with exotic gear so it’s not a grind!”. Objectively speaking, you can do anything at level 78 with all masterwork items. However, you still will have a much easier time with lv 80 Exotic gear. It’s a case of whether or not you want you game to be entirely skill based or a skill/gear hybrid. I, and I would imagine most players, would prefer their wins and losses to be entirely based on their own skill level rather than part skill level/part gear level. The reason getting Exotic gear is not a grind is because you can play in any way, doing whatever you want to do, and still be able to get full Exotic gear. Events (karma), dungeons, WvW, crafting, trading post (gold), and in a reasonable amount of time.

Thank you for understanding my point

thisolderhead.5127:

Keep it civil mate, you repeating yourself doesn’t provide additonal support for what you are calling a “logical fallacy” – if it is truly a logical fallacy provide me the equation proof mate, all pretty easy stuff when you know your stuff.

Also – what single weak argument do you refer to?

The argument that its a choice. That one, the one that everyone one you is enjoying the grind is using.

I know grind is a direction that Anet is taking. Imo its breaking their manifesto it half, no microscopic bits and piece. Its too bad.
For example:
1. Ascended gear grinding
2. Laundrell grinding
3. Dungeon grinding
4. Gold Grinding
5. World Event grinding

What do you think about the direction?

Old Direction:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZGC2eDwwWg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZMJ3sw_IcY

New Direction:

~blank nothingness~

thisolderhead.5127:

You know what I’m calling a logical fallacy on every person who uses this NON-SENSICAL argument.

We know you love your grind but this is to people who have work and life other then this game. If you want to bash this comment you can but don’t use this same argument.

No its not realisitc and thats his point. If you just want to attack the op just for the sake of it there are other forums to do so.

It doesn’t lack sense – though I give you props for the persistent and devout subscription to this rhetoric and the manner which you present it.

The choice to grind, play, or whatever you do after log in is in fact the players’ to make.
The choice of goal within the game is also the players’ to make, Anet just made some suggestions in the game design.

But we digress – perhaps a thread where the point is evaluated for its own merit, rather than trying to stuff it into every thread possible, ought be raised?

Yeah it is when people such as yourself have only this one argument to use. If you only have one and only one argument at all times I guess your right there is no fallacy but a really weak argument.