a cardgame like magic … involves balance
MBUAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Oh good god, this one is good! Pure gold!
Toughness should do something else, imo.
Good.
1 – Remove Condition Damage from game.
2 – Makes damage via condition scale with power (due might actually affects power and condition damage).
3 – Replace the status Condition Damage for a new status focused in speed (it’s lacking in this game). The new status could be Agility, its a bônus like Critical Damage, Boon Duraction and Condítion Duraction, that affects actions and movement speed.
4 – Makes Toughness affect damage via condítions. If Power affects damage dealt via condítion, Toughness affects damage received via condítions.Are a huge change, but provides more fun and options for players.
Great ideas! This would completely destroy the role of condition damage, and kitten build diversity!
The only reason staff skills aren’t used tactically, but rather in a chain, is because staff autoattack sucks, and the skills are on fairly long cooldown, so all you’re left with is the Mark of Blood every few seconds before you can finally escape the horror and grab a decent weapon again.
Can’t say I’ve seen any, and it’s been a long while since I’ve tried power necros in PvP. Too few escape/defensive options. That’s also why I mentioned sigil of energy, helps with the lack of vigor and other stamina regen methods.
Two accuracy sigils together won’t work, I’d replace one with energy or something.
I’ve no idea, honestly. I don’t try to fit my ele into pvp, and most eles I see melt. There may be a burst build for eles that works, theoretically, but thieves do it better. No idea about the mesmer.
Quick rundown of the two popular condition build counters:
For the dhuum/terror necromancer, two types of builds work well – burst (one with a stun breaker and a single multi-condition cleanse; thief works fine) and bruiser (CC and high damage, such as the mace warrior).
For the spirit ranger, these are effective – burst (one with a single reliable CC), area damage (one multi-condition cleanse required), bruiser (exploit the fact that the build has no/one stun breaker).
Going full glass doesn’t work, and trying to outlast a condition spec doesn’t work; outkill before conditions do you in or outCC and destroy. Naturally, one skill that you need to develop is when to cleanse, as popping it too soon will doom you.
This is a pretty well-aimed nerf at the Necromancer…
No, because that was the entire point: to counter builds that were designed to outlast the damage through mitigation. The fact that they outpace healing, regeneration, and ignore mitigation, enables conditions to do precisely that. Any three fixes commonly suggested by certain members of the community (reduction in frequency of application, lowering the damage of conditions, adding mitigation boons or stats) would completely destroy their place as they would no longer be able to outdo the healing and cleanses that a bunker build carries.
The only outliers at the moment are the burning on the necro, which flat out doesn’t belong and should have been torment all along (to help the necromancer mobility issue), and the spirit ranger which, while counterable, it isn’t reliably so, as the spirit cooldowns do not function in the same way similar skills do. SPECIFIC problems require SPECIFIC solutions, not the broad-handed nerf to the entire concept of condition damage, as desired by those that actively refuse to adapt, in spite of dozens and dozens of posts filled with advice on how to find a place in the meta.
I intentionally chose an inaccurate metaphor to outline the failure of the original post.
If you’re talking about the marks, you can dodge into them to trigger them and avoid ANY damage. If you’re talking about Grasping Dead or Enfeebling Blood, those have a recognizable casting animation, and you can often avoid them by simply changing course, as the necro will almost always aim those in front of the target.
Also, the survivability of the necro is pure facetank and a fear. If you force him to use the DS or staff fear defensively, you have most likely won, as he no longer has the option of chain-fear. Two extremes currently counter a necro: the S/D thief drops him FAST, and the M/S+GS Warrior stuns him silly and kills him while eating up the conditions and laughing at them.
You’re never supposed to be able to outright avoid all the damage of any offensive build.
Silv, on top of being wrong and your argument debunked dozens of times before, the entire statement is like saying “Bicycles are faster than motorbikes because you only need Foot Power to reach the top speed, whereas motorcycles need quality gas, a high-power engine, and an aerodynamic shape to reach top speed”.
Yeah, well, you know, that’s just like, uh, your opinion, man.
They didn’t nerf the theif by gutting ALL power damage.
I cant prevent the initial parts of the attack from landing initially but I can stop them from delivering the full damage they can deliver through good reactions. This is not the case in conditions as its simply delivers its full guaranteed damage capability at the initial application of the skill
Your argument makes no sense. How do you partially block a skill?
Toughness/Armor should reduce condition damage, problem solved.
Answer:
- Give toughness trait line passive condition defense.
Players with High HP do not feel the damage that much.
Players with Low HP get destroyed in seconds.High HP should not qualify bunker/sustainment, not in any game. Currently, Toughness means just about nothing in PvP.
As I said before, that would kill the entire point of conditions. Why do damage over a long period of time if you can do more damage NOW and kill the enemy NOW?
I am still puzzled by the “by the time you use all your dodges, cleanses, blocks, etc., you are restacked with conditions” argument. What is it you do in the meantime? Just stand there and cleansing conditions? Meditate on your mortality?
I don’t get it.
Why do people still act like conditions aren’t tied to attacks? Are all condition-inflicting skills undodgeable, unblockable, area effect, heat-seeking missiles that pierce invisibility, invincibility, and terrain obstructions?
You make these claims often. Can I ask why you’re against having burning/direct confusion? Is it strictly thematic or do you have mechanical reasons why it’s a bad idea?
Burning is a “burst” condition. We have a lot of ways of deploying condition pressure, laying down a burning on top of it is too much.
Mostly the same for Confusion.
And neither really thematically fit the necro playstyle, as both are signature conditions of other scholar classes.
We don’t need “another epic battle”, we need the first one to actually be epic!
So the point of conditions is to be OP you say???
And also, several people its not you and your condimancers club… sorry but there are other classes that play this game too… too bad for you i guess, we are more.
I never said that, why would you think so? Condition damage has a place, just like power damage has a place. Changing it to a slower variation of power damage will effectively remove it from the game.
And please stop accusing people that disagree with you of being in some sort of “condimancers club”. Accept the fact that you are not always right, and that sometimes in life people will disagree with you.
I can only play the warrior or elementalist here, but I’ll see about finding some people interested in game, try and get them to roll with this. On first glance, I don’t see any major glaring weaknesses, apart from the elementalist. That one shouldn’t be a problem if he’s really never alone, though.
they create solo champions arena with one shot mechanics so you have no time to think about roles everywhere outside there
Actually, the fact that vitality, healing, toughness and protective boons do nothing in these rather goes in favor of zerkers.
MKCT > Liadri in terms of fun, legitimate challenge, etc.
I think necro and ranger have the worst messes of both lines and traits themselves.
I don’t know about thief, mesmer, or guardian, don’t have those characters.
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Area_of_effect
It doesn’t matter if they hide, if you are hitting everywhere.
Movement speed. Roll for initiative.
Really, it’s as if these counters are being proposed by either people that don’t play thief, or by people that do play thief and don’t want to get nerfed.
Solution:
-A stat that reduces condition damage.
-A boon that reduces condition damage
-Adjust condition damage for the new buff:
-Conditions can crit nowNow if you want to do a lot of condition damage you are going to need to go glass like everyone else
Destroys the entire point of conditions. But then again, you already said this before, and you got the same reply from several people, and you still persist, so I’m not holding my breath…
Not really dialogue, but I love it when my character exclaims “Ah, refreshing!” after taking a huge hammer to the face (which triggers regeneration). I bet the mobs fecaliate their pants at that moment. “I… dude… I just smacked her with this huge hammer, sqare in the face, and she said it was refreshing! Bother this nonsense, I quit!”
Nothing can make you more likely to lose a match than the game telling your entire team “good luck, lol, you’re not likely to win this one”
You mean like in the NFL when a team is heavily favored to lose in the current betting line?
Yes, because people playing the PvP in this game are professionally trained athletes, born, bred, and trained to compete and rise to the challenge, with a hilarious paycheck and a large-scale pressure of the clock on their entire livelyhood.
Anyone here quite knowledgeable on ELO? It does know the odds in advance, doesn’t it? Or at least it has the data to calculate them in advance, is that right?
It does, and it does. And it is Elo, not ELO, as it is no abbreviation; the dude who invented it is a physics professor called Arpad Elo.
Nothing can make you more likely to lose a match than the game telling your entire team “good luck, lol, you’re not likely to win this one”
It is also true that poison simply lowers the efficiency of healing and toughness simply lowers the efficiency of damage, and neither can “keep up with the healing/damage”.
Funny how you are content with saying “poison counters healing” and “toughness counters damage”, but feel the need to qualify “condition removal counters conditions” with a special and unique downside.
I definitely notice it on my characters when doing group events, it is definitely a factor. However, being a factor does not mean it is the only factor.
The circle you describe is too simplistic, too few components. But I agree, an “everyone can have a fair shot at anyone else” meta is not realistic.
the problem is that condi builds get defense and offense at the same time, when a guard sacrifices all his damage to run bunker and burst classes sacrifice defense.
That’s just stupid
There is an itemization problem preventing me from proving my point, but the bottom line is this: primary power + precision + any defensive stat, with a ranged weapon, will put out greater up-front damage and have tankiness comparable to a condinecro or a spirit ranger.
Mathemathically, that is. In practice, the necro’s burning (which necros should not have gotten in the first place) and the ranger’s cooldown issue (which works different than most other cooldowns of a similar type) can put these two slightly ahead.
This, however, is not a reflection on condition damage as a whole, but on two concrete examples of very defined condition builds.
Achievement points, not armor…
Totally unbalanced.
However when a guardian and thief go down its totally cool the guardian wins.
Depends on the situation. If it’s a 2v2. Thief wins because it’s harder to stomp a thief than a guard.
Same with the ranger vs guardian situation: in a 2v2, the guardian wins.
All they need is a few options:
View enemy players as Human / Default
View allied players as Human / DefaultLet’s pray for it. Amen.
A simple, elegant solution.
…I would assume the more resource-heavy is the game with the larger playerbase by an order of magnitude…
Mobs prioritize high thoughness builds.
Well, if you want it like that, they’ve also separated their game into FOUR completely different PvP modes and two modes vs AI that they don’t seem to care much about.
They are soulbound because ArenaNet doesn’t know how to send a particular in-game mail only to characters that are above a particular level.
Really? So all the invitations to the dungeons not based on character level?
You must be imagining things, ArenaNet is not a newbie developer; if they know how to do something, they’d remember how to do it.
We should not have direct access to confusion, either.
They are soulbound because ArenaNet doesn’t know how to send a particular in-game mail only to characters that are above a particular level.
The real question is, are a lot of the players worth talking to?
While it would be cool if they listened to some of us, I’d be happy with the “we think this is currently OP/UP/bugged, so we’re working on it” approach. You know, just so we get a glimpse of what sort of gameplay they’re aiming for, instead of trying to recreate it blindly after the patch hits.
I hate comparing devs to devs, but it’s fitting in this situation. Riot does a great job of communicating their intentions and their plans for champions, items and maps weeks, if not months in advance.
We should not have access to burning.
GW1 has had that for a while now, it isn’t like they just started detailing their patches on the sunset of the game…
Sometimes I can’t believe it is the same studio that did both games…
Welcome to Orr.
I also went and tested Force, came to the same conclusion (doesn’t stack). I also tested Agony and Venom (doesn’t stack). My computer is too weak to perform a reliable video test for Paralyzation, and I don’t have the time required to test Accuracy.
I am firmly in the “sigils of the same type do not stack” camp.