Guild Wars 2

Hey, ya may wanna put the build link in your original post. =P

Also, have ya tried Superior Runes of Rage?

You, my friend, have been immortalized in the Mesmer Handbook. Ty for the work you put into this, it’ll go a long way to teaching hundreds of Mesmers for as long as the game is around.

(Responses From VeeWee)

top 3 rules to pvp hmmm. there’s not really rules but more like guidelines. i’ll list a few off the top of my head

• learn the maps and the secondary objectives. learn when and when not to use them. learn the spots where you can lose an enemy if you’re getting chased. if you have blink and/or phase retreat, learn the blink spots. supcutie has a really good guide on that.

• rotations. pvp is a numbers game. learn when to be somewhere and when not to be somewhere.

• if an enemy goes down, cleave the body. don’t try to stomp unless you know for sure you can get it. if a teammate goes down, learn when to try to res and when not to. generally you’ll want to try to get your teammate up but sometimes it can’t be helped if he’s fragile and/or the enemy team is hardcore cleaving.

• positioning. don’t overextend. if your bunker is on a point there’s no reason for you to be on it too, especially if you’re less than durable. try not to fight off point especially if you’re behind.

• your rotations depend on a number of factors such as where you are currently, where the team is, where the enemy team is, where the enemy thief is, etc. prioritize the points you have over the ones you don’t. know when a fight is lost and when to retreat. don’t over-commit to a point or secondary objectives. a good example is sending too many people to tranquility while all your points get decapped because you have too few people up top. your target should be someone overextending first. then work on classes that don’t have many escapes like necro or ranger. if you have enough firepower you can focus the bunker first because he provides a lot of team support and survivability. it all depends on your comp. for example focusing a thief might not be the best idea because of all the escapes he has, but if you have enough cc then he’s an easy kill.

the biggest mistakes i see new players make i already outlined. fighting off point, over commitment, multiple people stomping when no one is cleaving and the downed guy gets revived, overextending, etc.

(From Backpack)

1. Match Numbers, Regroup if you team wipe, Dont push fights you cant win

2. Numbers…. Always match numbers (scenarios like bad 1v1s (engi v necro) you can rotate and +1 quickly but in general you want to match numbers)

3. Squishiest target, or highest damage target (lich necro etc) Or whoever has low CDS, sometimes a low bunker guard that eats a lot of cleave is a good target

4. Sitting on Home when no one is there

WEAPONSETS
Sword is pretty important for a lockdown build, not only is iLeap an AoE immobilize but sword allows you a variety of offhands to chose from. Offhand Sword, Focus, and Pistol all make for good choices, but Greatsword and Staff also provide a hefty amount of control.

• Offhand Sword: Offhand sword works reeallyyy well in a 6/4/4/ lockdown build because it has the shortest cooldown interrupt (that also happens to be a daze that pierces multiple targets, good for stopping stomps/rezzes) and provides excellent damage. iSwordsman demands enemy attention with it’s rapid heavy hits and even when you’re not using the sword daze, the counter hits like a truck. Out of all the offhands, this is my personal favorite both for the aesthetic of wielding two swords like a total and complete boss, and for the high damaging in-your-face fighting style.

• Offhand Pistol: The pistol… I never use it.
  Not because it’s bad or sub-par in any kind of way, but it simply isn’t my preference. The phantasm, iDuelist, may not deal as much damage as the Swordsman due to being much more easy to evade but it has the advantage of sitting safely out of range while it unloads shots on an enemy, forcing them to either spend a dodge, reposition, or suffer the consequences. The pistol’s ranged 2s stun is niiice, especially combined with Signet of Domination and/or Sigil of Paralyzation. I’d rate this stun above the offhand sword’s daze because of how it cuts enemy movement and reliably bounces to daze a second target, and blind a third, giving a diminishing form of lockdown for each bounce.

• Offhand Focus: This is what I currently use. The Focus is the best lockdown-focused weapon in my opinion because of Temporal Curtain’s multi-purpose field and Warden’s projectile nullifying. Though it’s currently bugged, it’s still the best aoe-oriented lockdown offhand of the bunch.

• Staff Staff is my favorite weapon for many reasons, but it works well in a lockdown build because of Chaos Storm/Armor. Chaos Storm’s lockdown works defensively and offensively. It punishes anyone standing in the field with debilitating conditions, making it very difficult to do damage but also it dissuades people from ever standing within it’s relatively large AoE, which allows you 6 seconds of area denial. Chaos Armor is worth mention here too because of it’s ability to inflict blind/cripple. Blind in particular is the most important here, and is the reason why BLASTing an Ethereal field for AoE Chaos Armor is so valuable as it really hurts enemy AoEs.

• Greatsword Greatsword offers excellent offensive pressure and a fair bit of control. The offensive pressure is worth noting because that in itself is a form of control; used on an enemy that’s not targetting you, they’re forced to either disengage from their target or soak up a huge amount of damage. Mind Spike, iZerker, and iWave all work as control abilities, spike is an AoE boonstrip while zerker AoE cripples and wave is a push/interrupt. While I personally don’t use Greatsword very often it makes for one of the best ranged options in a lockdown build besides Scepter/Pistol.

Ithilwen.1529:

Chaos Archangel speaking in another thread about an interrupt build:

" Make sure you’re running with Debilitating dissipation in Chaos, AoE weakness is nothing to overlook. "

HAHAHA After the pasting that I have taken in the forums for advocating for Clone Death traits. Here is one of the best of the “skilled gameplay” players advocating Clone Death traits in one of those “skilled” builds.

Does this make his build “cancer?” Is he a bad person? a whiner? A bad player? I’ve been called all of that and more.

Maybe the knee jerk reactionaries failed to consider the beam in their eyes when they castigated me for the mote in mine.

Hey dude,

For one, I saw the lambasting you got in the PvP forums while I was suspended. A big reason I don’t post in those forums much is because of how close-minded and bandwagon-hopping people like to be there, but I don’t think a lot of those comments against you were justified.

And Countless has been a champion of clone-death builds forever. He brings up a good point about how they contradict themselves in removing clone death but buff the stealth of PU. I personally never thought clone death was too passive, but the PU play style of conditions + stealth + clone death is no fun to fight.

Regardless when you make a good build you take what works for that build. Debilitating Dissipation is an excellent trait for any build that can afford it -power or condi- anyone who tries to put that fact down is either a parrot or overcompensating for lack of skill.

Levetty.1279:

I’d say I told you so about Mesmer/Chrono but you know who will burst in and start harrasing me. Instead I will leave him to blindly defend this while arguing with you guys.

What the eff.

I thought we’d made peace and agreed to disagree Levetty?

Dondagora.9645:

Unsure if we’ll be able to go all the way into each spec…

They specifically said we’ll be able to grab 3 Grandmasters. So instead of putting trait points, we choose the traitline we want. Since most mesmer builds only jump into 3 traitlines anyway, this is a potentially a pretty major buff to build variety. (sorry Phantasm builds. =[ )

@Swish: Anything that went 644 or 662 is now going to be a full 666. It isn’t very likely that they’ll remove working, effective traits rather than merge ineffective ones so it’s likely we’ll be in better shape than before. Our pool of traits aren’t being slashed, we’re gaining more Master traits, keeping the same amount of Grandmasters and I believe minors are the same.

UTILITIES

• iDisenchanter/Nullfield/Arcane Thievery These make up your boon/condition manipulation options and usually you’ll only be able to pick one. The safest and most reliable choice is Null Field, offering an ETHEREAL Field (already wrote why chaos armor is a good control ability) in addition to 5 pulses of boon/condition stripping. The drawback here is that the enemy can easily walk out of the field to avoid getting stripped and Null Field isn’t very good when you’re being hit with multiple conditions at once. Disenchanter is my personal favorite, though it can be tricky to use and becomes less reliable the more opponents/allies are in a fight. Every 4 seconds it shoots a bouncing projectile that strips 2 boons and conditions among 5 people, it’s excellent for smaller fights and 1v1s but falls short in big battles. Arcane Thievery is hit-or-miss. It can be excellent to strip boons and can really hurt when you throw conditions back on an enemy, but its rather long cooldown holds it back and sometimes it isn’t ideal spend your condition removal to steal boons. I like Arcane Thievery to use against warriors, engineers, necro/ele (transformations), and guardians.

• Signet of Domination/Mantra of Distraction While Mantra of Distraction is the main interrupt utility, Signet of Domination offers a stronger form of control in a meaty 3-second stun. Combined with Pistol and Sigil of Paralyzation (and if you’re feeling particularly lockdown-y Domination XII- Confounding Sugestions and Runes of the Mesmer) you can keep someone shut out of a fight for well over 6 seconds… and then why the hell not Moa them for ultimate trolling? Mantra of Distraction requires a bit more finesse, it’s best reserved for when you can predict an interrupt opportunity such as when an enemy is going to heal or when an elementalist is going to do … anything.

RUNES/SIGILS

• Runes of the Mesmer Works well with Confounding Suggestions, adding to the daze duration to give nearly 2s dazes, the power/precision it offers is nice as well.

• Runes of Lyssa Still one of the best condi-removal runes and works well with Mass Invis to save yer cheeks in tight condition-heavy situations.

• Runes of the Pack An excellent rune to run with the Focus and 30 Chaos, giving 19 seconds of swiftness, Power/Precision stats, AND Might/Fury/Swiftness!

• Runes of Grenth The big thing here is the Chill-on-Heal. It works instantly with Mantra of Recovery and has a slight delay on the other heals. When you merge this with Runes of Hydromancy, you can start stacking up some major AoE Chill even in a power build. (Chill is a great control ability, putting enemy skills on longer cooldown AND crippling their movement speed worse than.. er, Cripple.)

Ty! =D part two coming today, actually.

Pyroathiest just went in.

QUESTIONS & ANSWERS
Have a question? See it answered! Hopefully that answer will go on to help dozens of others.

VIDEOS
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Videos-Lockdown-Mesmer-in-the-Mists

New vids coming soon!

OTHER LOCKDOWN LINKS

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/The-Lockdown-Mesmer-Thread/first

PVPING WITH MESMER
Supcuties Comprehensive Mesmer sPvP Shatter Guide
Pyroathiest’s Mesmer SoloQ Guide
Sensotix’s PvP Builds and Tutorials Collection
Supcutie’s Mesmer youtube Channel
PvP Phase Retreat Teleport Spots

WVWING WITH MESMER
(Under Construction)
WvW Theorycrafting thread: Veil-bots Unite!
—-
GVG WITH MESMER
Unofficial GvG site
Unofficial GvG Thread
—-

Trigr.6481:

Capricorn XI.4390:

It was nerfed because otherwise bleed stacking with iDuelist would be ridiculously strong with the potential for 3 stacks of bleeding on crit, x8 for each shot from the duelist. As it stands now, you can get up to 16 stacks of bleeding per duelist vs 24. I think that’s fair.

Please refer to my edited top post, which leads to the end of your failed argument.

Countless

Those are the same lines Countless uses to woo the ladies. He’s a classic man.

Thanks guys! The feedback has energized me like a bolt of lightning to the spine; I truly didn’t expect such overwhelmingly positive responses!

Definitely going to be doing another either this week or next, and it will definitely involve Elementalists, likely more than one.

Tossing ideas around for a slightly larger-scaled battle. Maybe a 2v2 or 3v3 team? Ah, but what classes to use?

Players are .. What? No way.

Players are getting more options?! Terrible, truly.

Lets see the most stylish Mesmers this form has to offer!

- Insert more thread filler here! -

I look forward to it.

Right now shield looks like it competes mostly with the focus in the way the sword competes with the pistol; offering boons and defensive utility in a pretty strange and interesting way.

What has my attention is the fact that the shield phantasm can be casted twice per skill use thanks to Deja Vu. If the alacrity one shield phantasm grants is meaningful (especially since phantasms tend to only get one or two attacks off, then being able to summon two (both of which would reduce each others or other phantasms cooldowns) should provide something worth taking. Add in Chronophantasma for a third shield phantasm and hopefully shield will be a strong source of alacrity.

Combined with wells (which are ethereal fields), chaotic dampening, persistence of memory.. Can’t say for sure yet of course but I’m seeing a few reasons to look forward to it.

Mass Invisibility – Deception
Moa Morph – Transformation
Time Warp – Arcane

/thread

Hehe nah, I’m thinking two manipulations and a glamour here.

Mesmer

• Power Cleanse: Removed the range fact as it was unnecessary.
• Mind Spike: Fixed a bug where this skill was checking for a boon on the mesmer instead of on the target. The extra damage will now be correctly applied when the player’s target has no active boons.
• Moa Morph/Tuna Morph: Fixed a bug that caused this skill to appear unselectable while underwater.
• All Phantasms: The ghostly effect on phantasms should no longer fail to show up in low graphics settings.
• The Prestige: Fixed an issue that caused the blast finisher to occur at the point where the skill is cast, rather than on the mesmer.

Stealth Fix: Clones now wield offhand weapons. ( https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/August-20th-Patch-Thank-you-so-much/first#post2668225)

Um. Xy, Im gonna assume you mean Eles Lava Font (Fire 2) and thats really untrue. Chaos Storm hits for 3-4k in a power build. Each of the six pulses hits for around 600.

As for defense, no other Mesmer skill save for Blurred Frenzy comes anywhere close to Chaos Storm+Armor’s damage mitigation. The combination of weakness, blind,daze,aegis, protection and swiftness will protect you from ungodly amounts of pain, be it PvE or PvP. Whenever you drop Chaos Storm you should always be able to gain chaos armor while inside the storm.

I think people are underestimating Master of Frag.

If you look at the Illusions line, we already gain Confusion on shatters. While the change to Mind Wrack is meh.. Master of frag grants

• 10% MindWrack Crit
• Cripple on Cry of Frustration
• AoE Diversion
• Reflective Distortion.

Combined with some other traits you can take (Domination/ Dueling / Illusions for example) on each shatter burst you can easily inflict..

• Boonstrip
• Cripple
• Vulnerability
• Blind
• Confusion

in an AoE! And thats not even looking at the beauty of Confounding Suggestions + Mental Anguish

INTERRUPTS AND LOCKDOWN
- Full Article Here -
The Mesmer is a master of controlling opponents. We’re the only class that has traits that reward successfully interrupting your opponent, Confusion is almost exclusive to Mesmer, two of our 4 shatters [F2/F3] are control abilities, and we can reflect projectiles better than any other… And that’s just scratching the surface.

WHAT IS LOCKDOWN?
When you break combat down to its simplest terms, you find that almost everything can be mitigated in some way.

Movement – Cripple/Chill/Torment
Cooldowns – Chill/Interrupt
Projectiles – Reflect
Skill Use – Daze/Stun/Confusion/Blind
Healing – Poison
Damage – Weakness
AoE – Retaliation
Boons/Conditions – Removal

Mesmer have enough tools that we can quite easily shutdown any (and even all) of the above in a single build without having to sacrifice damage. Though a boss may be immune to daze/stun, Weakness, Vulnerability, & Chill (Debilitating dissipation, Hydromancy Sigils) still cuts their damage by 50%, increases skill cooldowns, and more vulnerable to damage.

CONTROL, MESMER-STYLE

Mesmer have 3 main ways to control opponents.

Boon Removal
Null Field, iDisenchanter, Arcane Thievery, Sword 1, Greatsword 2, Shattered Concentration (Domination VII)
Mesmer have wonderful AoE boon removal. Shattered Conditions combined with Null Field can make you a boon-nullifying nightmare on the battlefield. This is especially good against enemies that like to stack Might, Fury, Vigor or Stability. A sneaky combo is Arcane Thievery + Signet of Inspiration to steal long-lasting boons (Example: Signet of Rage is a very common elite among Warriors that grants 30 seconds of Might, Fury, and Swiftness… Did a sinister grin tug at your lips yet?).

Reflects
Feedback, Mimic, Medic’s Feedback (Inspiration I), Warden’s Feedback (Inspiration VIII)
Linger out of melee-range and what happens? Most likely, the enemy will try to shoot you. Projectiles are a very common form of attack, and skills like Feedback turn that damage right back on the enemy. Reflects are not affected by power, but are affected by critical chance and critical damage. A reflected projectile will count as YOUR attack, and thus proc any corresponding sigils. An excellent write-up with examples is depicted in Ansau’s Reflection Guide.

Confusion and Conditions
Cry of Frustration [F4], Scepter 3, Torch 5, Illusionary Retribution (Illusions 5), Confusing Enchantments (Domination VIII), Blinding Befuddlement(Illusions IX), Confusing Combatants (Dueling 25)
Confusion is a stacking condition that does damage to the opponent for every skill they use. It does half as much damage in PvP/WvW as it does in PvE, but can still be a very strong source of damage and highly discourages players from attacking. As long as we conveniently ignore Superior Runes of Perplexity (/shakefist @ Thieves with these runes) then we can say that Confusion is a nearly Mesmer-exclusive condition, sort of like Fear for Necromancers. Torment is another punishing condition that deals double damage to moving enemies. Our Scepter’s counterattack can inflict large amounts of Torment that can do several thousand damage to enemies. In addition to this, Mesmer can easily inflict AoE Cripple (-50% movement)/ Weakness (50% damage) / 3xVulnerability (1% more damage per stack) / 3xBleeds simply by spitting out clones and allowing them to be killed via Debilitating Dissipation and Crippling Dissipation (Domination V/ Chaos V).

Since there aren’t many videos of Lockdown Mesmer out, I tried to upload a few to hopefully help out people who may be having a hard time learning the playstyle. I use a variety of builds in these different clips, some using CS (6/6/0/2/0) and some using CI (4/4/6/0/0)

I’ll try to keep this thread updated for long as I can.

Chaotic Interruption build link – 4/4/6/0/0

Confounding Suggestions build link – 6/6/0/2/0

MISC

• CS Chainstun Demo (I’ll have more samples coming soon)
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MT7tsfRSSDw

• Chainstun Demo 2 Another CS chain-lockdown demonstration
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gB5TXJFsVLU

• Those interrupts tho! Was dueling with a friend and ended up landing an almost perfect series of interrupts.
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBFXj9TCOBk

• Training with Warlord of Chaos (Rylock helped me learn the GS while we tested some lockdown builds. I get stomped out like a scrub 90% of the time, despite getting better and better each fight. x.x I don’t think that woulda changed even if I was sober that weekend. =[)
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xc9YefWH66M

• The Awesome Power of iWarlock Pow! Right in the kisser. This is a quick demo of my favorite staff-interrupt combo. The Mesmer I pulled it on is actually really good and beat me more often than not, I just happened to pull through in this match.
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNaPmlfizAQ

TPVP

• Was It My Fault!? I.. I coulda sworn I was wrecking kids! What could I have done differently to pull the win? Interesting Fights with a Necro and Engineer here
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8phx-jSxqxM

• Mesmer Murder Duo A nice demonstration of how to face a Condition War 1v1 shows up here
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rvmR0GxKhM

• Arrogance Ruins Dreams This was ours. Wtf!
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTcKpoiJYKM

• 4/4/6 Chaotic Interruption in TeamQ 2 We kinda stomped these guys.. Now with notes!
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_-Q2wxluUk&feature=youtu.be

DUELS

• Vs Mesmer Some of the most epic duels I’ve ever had. Not only was it awesome and fun, but Dilettante used a very unorthodox Support-Shatter build. 4/4/0/6/0
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jR4UdvbaCs

• Vs Guardian Not 20 minutes earlier I was talking about how I almost never lose to Guardians… Well this is what I get for my hubris. Dat Ring of Warding tho! Caught me with my pants down. =/
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXJntZVEzp4

• Vs Thief.. Again Fighting another, slightly better thief.
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L520oCr3Vlw

• Vs Thief (Set) I didn’t win ALL our matches.. I just happened to not be recording when he was beating me earlier on. I know that barely sounds believable but.. Really!
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjmI5R7nHks

• VS S/D Ele Ugh. Made quite a few mistakes here but was an excellent, fun fight nonetheless. Ele actually had beaten me a couple times after.. Rage!
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RRydGW5eek

Was I the only one hype for this when I read the article?

First thing that came to mind when I read the article was “staff ele meteor shower fire tornado tornado elite bahahahaha!” (Uh we’re still doing the dramatics thing.. Right?)

I don’t know if I’m in the minority, but I saw an interesting, cool spec. You have a choice to look at the ways it could be bad or list what the other specs can do better, or start figuring out new ideas and ways to make an effective build that you’ll love.

Seriously, thank you so much!

You just considerably brightened up this dreary work Friday.

This should put the pickles in your sauce..

Josh Davis.6015:

The release has been out for 4 hours. It’s a little early to tell.

Yet. Maimed gets knee-jerk nerfed so hard that they didn’t even bother to consider if that was the right change to make. Could’ve (and likely should’ve) lowered duration instead.

I swear I keep trying to give constructive advice but… I just can’t get over…

“We all know most Mesmer abuse the macro in their gaming mouse to pull off the chain burst.”

.. What? Is this really what people tell themselves? Dude most people don’t even have a gaming mouse. The burst really doesn’t even come close to demanding one.

Alright.. So lets try this; Ima assume you’re referring to standard shatter because PU condition mesmer melt to decent eles.

* Carry a stunbreak. Once you avoid the initial greatsword burst you’ve got time to pressure the mesmer.

* Avoid melee. The closer the mesmer is the more damage they will do via shatters.

* Pressure. Use conditions and small bursts to keep the Mes on the defensive, most Mesmer aren’t very good and have lousy defenses. Even more have a hard time mixing offense with defense.

* Kill the greatsword phantasm as soon as possible. With aoe preferably.

* Let them waste their blink and dodges before going in for a burst. It only takes one or two decent bursts to down a mes.

I woulda taken delayed reactions, but the key focus of the build is the wells and what they provide. It’s actually possible well support could be a thing in pvp, so I was more interested in exploring the possibilities there. This build is actually very similar to the chrono-lock build with only slight adjustments to traits/utilities.

Chaos storm is the only random interrupt in this build. CS is almost always procced by stagger-shattered Diversion (sending 3 clones at different distance to shatter one after another for a series of dazes) and with Alacrity + Chaotic Dampening, Chaos Storm returns nearly every other weaponswap.

The main reason for interrupting, though, is Chaotic Interrupt, which was a big help with trapping people within wells. In one of the duels with the minion Reaped (which will be notated soon) I managed to chain-intrrupt someone and trap them inside of all three wells for their full duration. Insta-kill!

@Romek: Well there is a trait to add 600 touhness when ya charge a mantra. anf to make them AoE heal for about 2600.. plus chaos storm (especially w/ chaos armor while standing in the storm) blink phase retreat decoy distortion ect. are a few examples of the many ways to be able to securely charge a mantra.

@Mail: It is spammable though. You could use both charges for 4 secs of AoE stab on a 25 sec CD.. depending in the traits that could be boosted to 9secs of stab on a 20sec cooldown

For me, it depends on the weapon I’m currently wielding. I always save one skill for defense in addition to Diversion/Distortion (F3/F4).

Staff – Chaos Storm’s chance to proc Daze, Aegis, and Weakness makes it a great defense in addition to comboing into Chaos Armor for the blinds it can apply to the enemy and protection it can give me. Of course, Phase Retreat not only gets you out of harms way, but gives you a clone to shatter for a Daze/Distortion.

Sword – Blurred Frenzy can be a life-saver. iLeap/Swap’s immobilize can get you some breathing room. Offhand sword’s block can absorb a hit to allow you to defensively shatter. Scepter’s block is similar and a bit quicker.

Focus- Dat pull. ’Nuff said. (and of course, the cripple from the curtain is pretty helpful)

Also, some good suggestions in this thread.. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/vs-glass-thief-spvp

Whatever you do, just don’t let a thief catch you without a stunbreak/Phase Retreat/Distortion

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/external?l=http%3A%2F%2Fbit.ly%2Fzeromisbunker

Zeromis has a pretty cool bunker spec.

Fay.2357:

Chaos Archangel.5071:

And unless I’m doing something wrong on Ele, they don’t come close to our Fury stacking. It isn’t uncommon for us to hold on to 45+ seconds of fury just from normal play.

And I think I have one of our testing vids recorded where rylock managed over a minute of protection. Though the protection amounts I’m less certain of since I can barely bang out 30s, I’ve no idea how he pulled that.

Well, I got it pretty easily up to 58s of protection. I just traited glamours, took feedback, null field, sw/sw+ staff, traited sword, traited, staff, and took runes of the grove for protection uptime.

…but that means I’m taking an insane amount of stuff just to stack protection, when an ele could just spam down their bar to apply auras and protection to everything with no effort needed.

Yeah, but you didn’t (or don’t) have to do that in the first place. Sharing 20s of protection every 15 or so seconds is enough. If the Mesmer can manage Perma protection on their team through regular rotations then all the extra prot isn’t needed.

Now this is from a PvP perspective, and I haven’t yet tested the average numbers a regular boonshare rotation will provide, but with that much fury and protection while sharing nearly twice the amount of boons build/absorbed (including boons Mesmer have better access to like aegis/retaliation .. though retal barely counts.) what is the ele providing that Mesmer couldn’t? Mostly just might.

Ele provides Might, Fury, Protection, and Swiftness. Mesmer provides all of the above along with Aegis. Swiftness is easily stackable with Sigil of Speed and shared way beyond what Ele could ( I’ve been able to share two minutes per signet. Around 50-60 seconds is more common)

Imo where Tempest takes it is in the fact that they still provide ridic boon output in addition to everything else they do.

Manimarco Devil.1790:

Ok instead of spouting random nonsense please explain how what necro’s got is so much better than what we got?

Guardians asked for long range weapons we got them
Necros asked for blast finishers and support skills. They got whirl finishers and a slow hard hitting spec.

For pve
Guardians are already top tier and have a variety of useful skills from reflects to shouts.
Necros are near/are trash tier and their best skills are probably just wells.

The guardian spec provides even more traits that can be used to get large amounts of vunerability/burn to proc with our traits. We got atleast one decent trap that can apply a full 25 stacks instantly.

The necro spec just attempts to give him more damage and is slow as hell. The shouts might be useful for them but most seem to be bad and the entire spec relies on chill which is terrible unless they take the chill does damage trait (which may just pigeonhole them)

For wvw
Guardians and necros are both viable and useful in different ways. Nonetheless guardians got a useful weapon to augment ranged playstyles while necro got a slow gs which cannot be used in zergs and is questionable atm for roaming.

For pvp
Medi guard builds that use bow will undoubtedly pop up and having a better ranged option than scepter is only a plus. Furthermore, guardians got slightly reduced virtue group support but can do more interesting things individually with the immob on resolve and knockback when near X units traits. Traps may or may not prove viable but thats ok because guardians are already an extremely balanced class and its not like you have to run a full trap build to make use of some of the effects.

Necros are also very good in pvp atm. They have very strong ranged damage and are decently durable. They lack mobility which they still didn’t really get from their spec and their spec makes them have to be melee range. Furthermore non supportive shouts sound terrible in pvp since they scale based on the number of people you are fighting and small fights/1v1s is what Spvp is all about. Even if their new spec does a lot of damage, it still needs to make up for the fact it will be melee with low mobility.

Everyone in this forum needs to just stop being shocked and awed by fancy effects and actually look at what the skills do. If you are impressed by just looking like a knock off dervish then by all means go play necro but so far what guardians got is what we needed and that is all that should matter. This is not a ****-measuring contest.

+1. This is the most glorious post I’ve read all day. (Albeit woefully incorrect on the pvp aspect of necro)

4) BOUNTIFUL INTERRUPTION IS AWESOME
If you happen to have some spare points in the Chaos line, PLEASE give Bountiful Interruption a shot.

Of all the interrupt-traits, Bountiful is the most beneficial to any build as long as you have the proper weapon: Focus or Greatsword. In group fights, this trait all-too-easily can net you 15 stacks of might (and 3 random boons) in one swoop, which benefits both power AND condition builds, as well as support builds if you tend to go that route.

After playing a lockdown build for a bit.. you’ll come to find Bountiful as valuable as traits like Mender’s Purity, weapon cooldown traits, and I’d dare go so far as to say nearly on Deceptive Evasion’s level of value.[

3) AN ENTIRELY DIFFERENT PLAYSTYLE
Shatter Mesmer, Phantasm Mesmer, Condition Mesmer… These are the current main types of Mesmer.

Sure there’s different vatiants: Phantasmal Boons and the Chaos Maestro are support builds, but they still fight with a Phantasm playstyle. Once you grab Deceptive Evasion, you’re all set for a shatter build.. These playstyles, while varied, all follow similar rules the same as any other fighting style would. Shatter Mesmers often take sword to set up their shatters. Phantasm Mesmers often grab greatsword and pistol for high-damage phantasms.. If you play a phantasm build, you pretty much know the ropes of any other phantasm build you play, and the same goes for shattering.

But Lockdown builds tow the line between shatter and phantasm. They tend to use both for damage, but also can make excellent use of Halting Strike for a third additional damage source. Either way, the focus isn’t on shattering or on maintaining phantasms: its on keeping the opponent(s) unable to fight back while you shatter, while phantasms abuse, and while your opponents capitalize. In this capacity, Lockdown Mesmer make good “leader-type” builds in small groups: You call a target, and keep them shut down while everyone wails on them.

But this IS a different playstyle, and thus it requires building new rotations and new reflexes to be effective. You have to have an understanding of your opponent’s abilities and be able to time interrupts to be effective. It hurts at first, its different and unfamiliar and hard, but it becomes so worthwhile.

2) THEY NEVER RARELY SEE IT COMING
Oh the sweet glorious rage… It’s delectable.

Offhand sword(and/or Pistol) and Mantra of Distraction come together in a sinister marriage that make classes like Necromancers wet themselves with frustration. Most people expect CC to come from Warriors, or even Thieves, but Mesmer lockdown is subtle and unexpected. The preconceived notion of Mesmers being only “PU, Shatter, or Phantasm” works in a lockdown Mesmer’s favor as the enemy often doesn’t know what exactly is going on when their heals are instantly interrupted without any animations or warning.

Even before the Confounding Suggestions bug, CS could produce some awesome results. Dropping Chaos Storm on a point usually meant opponents were going to have a hard time either attacking or defending themselves, and staggering a 3-clone diversion Shatter is both rewarding and effective. People often tend to think that they got CC’d by an entire team when a lockdown Mesmer turns their sights on them.

All is vain? If you’re my opponent, hell yeah!

1) INCREASES YOUR OVERALL SKILL AS A MESMER
The best, and most important thing about lockdown builds.

Of all the current Mesmer builds, lockdown has the highest skill cap and is the most difficult to play effectively. The rewards can be substantial: AoE boonstripping, keeping opponents out the fight, moderate-to-high burst damage.. but only if played properly. A poorly played lockdown Mesmer can’t rely on an easy build, stealth, or phantasms to save the day; it requires aggression, positioning, and strategic timing… but it pays off.

Play a lockdown Mesmer for a month. If it’s difficult and hard, don’t give up. Stick with it and even if you don’t enjoy the style no matter what build you go back to you’ll go back as a stronger, more technical, and overall better player.

• StunWay ( posted by: theCOREYCOLAK One of the first Mesmer lockdown build sposted on these forums & still one of the best)

• Chillruption (posted by: skcamow Chill-focused AoE-oriented lockdown taking advantage of Imbued Diversion and Chaotic Interruption)

• Shatterlock (posted by: Chaos Archangel Winner of the December “Build of the Month” Contest)

OK OK.. no mas. Last reserve. x_x

You know what.. thats a good question. Usually when Moa’d I just bail around the nearest corner and use my dodges… but this gives me an idea, we should use the OMFG custom arena and do some moa testing

Gotcha.

Ugh.. I’m kinda throwing up in my mouth at all the work Ima have to do on this guide this weekend. Will try to update before the patch drops, then will edit for bugs and such.

.. Lord, the bugs.

( Again continuing where I left off. If anyone read the “Mesmer vs Elementalist” piece I wrote, this is the full story from where that scene was taken from. That fight scene is edited a bit here, and is weaved directly into the story. As always thanks for the encouragement! Reading the comments brings such a huge smile to my face and a sense of proudness… which is not a real word until now. )
• Part 1
• Part 3

The soft grass always felt nice against his bare skin. The leafy blades against his face, so similar to his own epidermis, made him feel as if Mother was always just a whisper away.

“You WHAT?”
“Karayan and I came to a slight altercation”

Warm rays of light, gifts of the sun, spilled over his body. He didn’t realize, but the rows of crimson leaves that made up the “hair” on his head was slowly starting to bend and twist ever-so-slightly, presenting a wider surface area to drink the light and feeding nutrients into Karayan’s body.

“Altercation!? If I hadn’t opened that portal beneath Kar his head would’ve been split open.”
“Perhaps, but…”
“Perhaps? Aeoldyn he would’ve been killed!”
“Perhaps, but…”
“Aeoldyn!”
“O.K. fine…”

Karayan Dedria’s consciousness returned to him slowly, recounting the battle before he had fainted. He had been meditating, then met Aeoldyn, then the bar, then …

“So, I may have miscalculated slightly.”
“Slightly?”
“I … “
“Admit it, you made a mistake.”
“Erm, I would not call it exactly that. More like I overestimated the sprout.”
“Overestimating is the same as making a mistake Aeol.”
“But it sounds so much better.”
“Don’t joke! Karayan almost died because of this ‘miscalculation’ of yours. Why would you attack him like that anyway? Surely he couldn’t have said anything that agitated someone as composed as yourself into attacking him.”
“…”

Kar could hear the voices, and both of them were familiar. Aeoldyn was nearby, and that thought alone was enough to anger the younger Sylvari, but he kept his frustration in check. The other voice, the melodic tone –Vinesta’s voice- that always carried his thoughts to safe, happy place, was there reprimanding Aeoldyn. If he got to angry, Aeol would hear his thoughts and know he was awake so Karayan kept his eyes closed and listened intently, eager to hear what they had to say.

“So, that’s two mistakes you made.”
“I was not keeping score.”
“… Aeoldyn.”

Karayan could hear an exasperated sigh coming from Aeoldyn. “Fine, yes. I allowed myself to assume that Karayan Dedria was competent enough to cover his teleports under the cloak of a stealthing spell, or even enact an illusionary decoy to throw off his location. When I chased him, I had assumed it was another fabrication of Karayan I had appeared infront of, so I destroyed it.” Aeoldyn explained, nervously running his hands across his thorny ‘hair.’ “As it turns out, I was … wrong.” Aeol made the word ‘wrong’ sound more like a noise someone made when throwing up. “Karayan is not competent. For a Mesmer whose fighting style is based off of running and hiding, he is a sub-par escapist against any decent opponent.”

Again, that flash of anger reverberated through Karayan. Again, he tried to hide it.

“Aeoldyn. First of all, Karayan is a Whispers agent and espionage is his specialty, not combat. Secondly, did you know that you’re terrible at lying to your friends?”
“Yes. That is why I do not collect any.”
“So just admit that Kar-“

Aeoldyn clapped his hands and smiled, cutting Vinesta off. “Oh, look at that! Our sprout has bloomed from the confines of his shattered consciousness.” Karayan felt a sudden knife-like pain in his head, as if someone suddenly jabbed needles into his ears, throat, and eyes. He shot up into a sitting position with a startled yell. “Gah!”

Uh.. The Mes thread was one guy mentioning that he still has trouble with thieves and asking advice on how to beat them.

But on topic; I love everything so far about daredevil, even the name.

themenaceofseventhdimension.2075:

Plz Plz stop spamming verbal abuse at me.

Yes, please.. Can this all just stop?

This is one of the lamest threads I’ve seen in our forums, and not because of the OP. You guys have made it plenty clear that you doubt/disapprove of the build, but how many of you can honestly say you’ve given it -as in his exact setup and playstyle- a try?

“I don’t have to, I can just look at it and tell it’s bad.”

It does look questionable, sure, and what has Menace been asking this entire time?

themenaceofseventhdimension.2075:

Since i can’t make any videos right now I have asked you to hit me up in game. So plz stop posting comments that says that i have been totally ignorant. IN a sense you guyz are the ones who keep ignoring all of my comments. I beg you to plz cut it out..

And he’s absolutely right.

Honestly Menace, you do have a terrible way with words. Your responses to criticism, from what I’ve seen in the Mes forums, are pretty eccentric. Joonks is right in that you should proof-read your posts and try to picture the person’s response before you start talking out of your neck like how you initially did to Inoence

@Inoence and many others…

But seriously… How dare you? If you don’t like a thread, there’s absolutely no need it bump it with:

“Please, please stop trying so hard making builds! Just go with the meta and make everyone happy!” and then, “Oh gosh, the stupidity is strong in this one /facepalm”

His stupidity is strong for what? Saying that he had no idea about Countless’s build and to give it a shot at least before shooting the build down? And who are you to tell ANYONE to stop making builds, to stop trying to be creative and just be another mindless Mesmer? (Not pointing fingers at you specifically, Inoence, I’m talking in general .. and uh, no offence Meta-Mesmer out there! )

And then Necros jump in to throw more fire to this unnecessary flame-fest, and all the while Menace has just been saying the same kitten thing: To give it a shot, and for someone to meet him in-game.

Not once did he insult anyone, so kitten sure he doesn’t deserve to be bashed like that. No one does.

(@Menace: PM me and we’ll meet in-game to take a look at the build)

Edit: Ninja’d while I was writing that. x.x

Updated 6/22/13

Been a bunch of new support builds popping up since this thread first was announced, figured it was about time for an update.

I really wanna tackle the elephant in the forums right now and ask straight up:

Have the upcoming Mesmer changes altered your opinion of the devs?

I know I’m known for being optimistic, which drives some people nuts, but I can’t help but feel like some of our conversations/discussions have rang through to dev ears.

• Signet of Inspiration granting passive swiftness. Boonsharing heavily buffed (Mesmers have always been good at boon sharing but builds always slightly lacked)

• Lockdown builds buffed exactly how we asked. Confounding Suggestions, Duelist Discipline (recharge phants on interrupt. Thanks pyro!) power block.

• Ip made baseline. We’ve been begging for this (and most didn’t believe it would happen) since launch.

• Protected Mantras made baseline (been asking for a while)

All the other changes are great, but I feel like these particular changes are more than just coincidence. I have an inkling that at least some of our discussions and input have reached the devs.

Am I crazy? A little conceited? Yeah, probably. But this wouldn’t be the first time we’ve managed to get our input to the devs. What say you?

Hehe yes.. Keep complaining about Engis.

We’ll just kindly overlook the rain of glory that showered Mesmers.

The greatsword looks like a lot of fun in this build, stacking slows and cripple like that could be pretty brutal.

One thing I noticed is that you’ve got no condition removal. With that in mind, I don’t think Protected Phantasms gives enough benefit compared to what Restorative Illusions could do for you. Also, Illusionary Inspiration may not be the best grandmaster option since this build doesn’t generate many boons. Mental Defense gives you a phantasm that may one day save your life or at the very least more illusions to shatter for Restorative Illusions or Distortion.

Ah man, you won’t find the most amazing high-level play here but you can easily see how much fun we had with this. Come join us on the weekends (and some weekdays) for our All-Mesmer romps

• Chaos
• Greasy (Cat Mage)
• Necrotize (Amphaser)
• Dark Falcon
• Pepsi (Huge Fat Norn)

What builds were yall runnin? I’m on my standard boonshare. Dueling/Chaos/Inspiration

@chaosmike Have ya tried Runes of the Pack? Glorious with Focus and 30 Chaos.

I think it’s the staff autoattack. While it’s better at close range, it misleads people into thinking that they have to play staff at ranged. Now that I’m thinking about it.. every single attack in the Sw+f / St set is better in melee. Chaos Storm is particularly noteworthy for being excellent against barrage-type attacks like Warrior’s spin or Thief’s unload.

But then there’s the tradeoff of having no form of ranged pressure, that was the reason Warlord and Supcutie had tried to push me towards the greatsword in the first place. We can cut someone down to half or less life almost instantly from 1200r with the GS before they even know we’re there, this swings most fights into our favor pretty quickly and forces the opponent into an uphill climb. If only staff had ONE decently damaging ranged attack (Warlock notwithstanding)…

With the advent of Chronomancer and Heart of Thorns later this month, GW2 will be seeing some massive shifts in the known status quo. An idea that’s been rolling around in my mind is putting together a small team (4 or so people) to gather news on everything Mesmer. The topics would include…

• PvE News (Covering Living Story, Open World, Dungeons/Fractals & Raid Content)

• PvP News (Interviews with top players, builds entering/exiting the meta and upcoming tournaments)

• WvW News (Mesmer-based strategies and commanders. Scheduled WvW runs)

• Bugs/Glitches/Technical Notes

The goal is to keep it simple, with a weekly or bi-weekly (fridays) report on everything related to Mesmer interests. Participants will be given 5g per article. Reports are expected to include.

- The current meta build at the time as well as upcoming potential builds.
- Any changes of note, mostly regarding how a Mesmer should approach said topic.
- New discoveries for said content as well as if a patch has made certain tactics unviable.

POTENTIAL REPORTERS

PvE

PvP
- Chaos Archangel

WvW

Misc

Levetty.1279:

Chaos Archangel.5071:

You don’t want to see any good news here. The changes to traits are excellent for Mesmer.

For example?

Edit: Nevermind, I have seen your thread and its just your obsession with a lockdown build that is always going to be niche and outclassed by hammer warriors.

Owch, getting a bit abrasive there dude. What build do you currently run, and tell me how it’s not getting buffed?

@Nevhie: I’ll use the Chaos Maestro for comparison, since the patch hasn’t hit yet. I’ve been theorycrafting a Mantra Support build that I’ll post when the mantras change.
- HP 20-21k base
- Crit rate 25% (45% with Fury half the time)
- Sword+Focus / Staff
- 3k mantra heal every 3.5 seconds (doesn’t need to blow any other skills/endurance)
-Can share Atleast 10x Might/ Perma Vigor / 50% Fury/ Perma Swiftness / Perma Retaliation / Perma Regeneration / 10+ secs of Protection / Aegis
- Mantra of Pain / Veil / Signet of Inspiration
- 300+ to 350+ Regen (depending on Sigil of Life)
- Sigils Might on Swap (+ altruism runes & Signet for a permanent 10 might stacks)
- Some ungodly defense (Don’t remember the exact number)
- 65% boon duration
- Below average damage (varies based on might/retal)
- CC: Chaos Storm / Temporal Curtain
- Ethereal and Light Fields
- Feedback every 10 seconds when rezzing.
- Group Stealth
- Portals when needed
- Can work with any gear (Even Zerkers.. Without +Healing Power Mantra heals dip to 2.6k and regen becomes pitiful)
The biggest difference between us is that I offer a greater variety of boons and have a higher uptime, while you grant area heals at a faster rate. While Guardians have to blow a lot of different skills to burst heal, Mesmer only has to use Mantra of Pain. At the same time, Mesmer have to be more specialized for our team.
If I’m running in a zerg then I’ll take Medic’s Feedback, but in smaller groups Vigorous Revelation. If my group has a guardian, necro, ele, or engineer then I won’t spec for condition removal. If there’s a guardian, then I won’t need to worry about Stability (with the upcoming patch). If there’s a thief, best believe I’m making sure I’m running Prismatic Understanding. With my trait setup of 0/10/30/30/0 I can swap in/out different utilities (Glamours for example) on the fly and still be able to trait for them. Its all a matter of what we wanna sacrifice for the sake of being really good at the other kinds of support.
As for flexibility, I think its a matter of practice. Guardian is easier (or “smoother” if you will) to support with while Mesmer (less “flexible”) takes more time and effort to learn the right technique. You offer light fields more often, but I also present Ethereal Fields (someone AoE hitting a group with Chaos Armor is in for a baaaad day)
Like I said before, its mostly a matter of preference. Stealths, Portal, different reflects and more boons vs a more sustained healing, condition removal and higher uptime of Stability.

But the two of us together? We’d make magic.

This is cool. You’re essentially trading a utility slot to duplicate one of your own skills every 90 seconds.

If you consider we’ll still likely need a stunbreak (blink/decoy) what other abilities would be worth taking twice?

Portal, Illusion of Life, Signet of Inspiration, Well of Whichever-the-hell-gives-alacrity

Imagine.. F5 Shatter, -mimic- signet of illusions shatter – signet- shatter. f5 & repeat.

But why does there need to be a price at all? Why can’t you create a custom room to play in that closes automatically when the last person leaves?

I know the mechanics aren’t the same, but take a FPS or fighting game or … most other online games for example: You make a custom room, play for a bit, and then leave when you’re done. Instead of kicking everyone right there and then, the room just closes when there’s no one in it anymore.

A simpler system like that would be a lot more fair and easy to manage if it’s possible to implement.