Guild Wars 2

Haiki.9178:

Ayrilana.1396:

Haiki.9178:

Ayrilana.1396:

The paywall was new players having to pay $50 for the expansion and the ~$25 for the core game.

Core game was on sale for 10$ only. Is this paywall you are talking about? Really?

That was for a single weekend. What was the base price outside of those few werkend sales?

Well, I’m not so aware of price changes, just read it costs 10 before going to free bonus. Arena could make those 10-15$ as constant final offer. Don’t see problems here. They lowered price to zero anyway.

For new accounts only if they purchase the expansion which goes for $50. It was only $10 for a single werkend back in March I think. The other promotions have been 50% which is where I think a lot of retailers settled on although i have see some places still charging $40.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

So, does anyone here think that we’ll be fighting Mordremoth in this expansion?

I’d like to know. Especially from the people who did do the pre-purchase.

Most likely and the next living story will probably deal with the aftermath leading up to the next dragon.

Perhaps the OP didn’t read the thread created by the dev stating there’s a difference between test servers and the actual servers.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Things-we-know/first#post5199480

Haiki.9178:

Ayrilana.1396:

The paywall was new players having to pay $50 for the expansion and the ~$25 for the core game.

Core game was on sale for 10$ only. Is this paywall you are talking about? Really?

That was for a single weekend. What was the base price outside of those few werkend sales?

ArmoredVehicle.2849:

Ayrilana.1396:

ArmoredVehicle.2849:

Ayrilana.1396:

ArmoredVehicle.2849:

Ayrilana.1396:

ArmoredVehicle.2849:

Ayrilana.1396:

You can buy the expansion. It’s $50. The core game is a free bonus for new accounts to help new players to the game.

Help new players eh? Exactly how does lvl 80 targeted content help new players?

You’re right there’s so much lack of content in the base game for a new player that he MUST have both.

This is only Anet helping themselves, hell even a blind could see that.

It’s helping new players get into the game without there being a huge paywall for them. Read the blog post that clarifies this.

Oh really? A paywall and concern about new players. Well in case you’ve been living in a cave you’d notice that even the oldest players get to pay the same amount. This is a paywall for everyone not just new players.

Put it this way:

The expansion + “free game” costs 45e as a bundle.

If they offer the base game at 25e and the expansion for 20e separately that’s still 45e to new customers and without screwing your loyal fans. But this is all negated since they want to force 45e price upon everyone for more filthy profit.

Also in case you forgot. There may still be a few retail copies of the core only game on sale, I only feel sorry for the innocent souls falling into this trap. They would be forced to pay an additional 45e for the expansion since they bought it from a retailer. Now THAT is a massive paywall.

The truth lies here, they want to sell the expansion for 45e and no amount of word play will hide that. This is the best for their profits not the new players or old ones for the matter.

And what you don’t realized is that they priced the expansion at $50. Selling it for less causes them to lose money. The paywall was new players having to pay $50 for the expansion and the ~$25 for the core game. They had incentives to provide the core game for free to new players as this would increase the likelihood of new players purchasing GW2 and possibly buying items from the gem store in the future.

Help new players this, help new players that. It’s all a nice coverage to help them sell the expansion at a high price.

It’s a 2 sided problem. The first being the high price and the second is the 2 in 1 bundle new players are getting over the old ones.

Do you truly believe this is an act of generosity on Anet’s behalf, please don’t be so simple. Maybe you forgot they’re a business and maximizing profit is their aim.

I once thought Anet was different, probably it was true until a few years ago. Now its a different company, gone are the days they treat the game with love over profit.

Don’t be so cynical. It was going to be $50 regardless.

I would pay that much without question only if it didnt come with the core game included.

It would only be fair since all old players had to buy the core game before it.

It only comes with the core game if you’re creating a new account. Notice how everyone else who pre-purchased did not get the core game?

scerevisiae.1972:

Ayrilana.1396:

Ever heard of pre-order bonuses? Same concept.

Prepurchasers already get beta access,that’s enough of a bonus.

It’s also about fairness.- why should vets who don’t prepurchase get such a worse deal than new players for the same money? Why should vets subsidise new players?

Veterans are not subsidizing new players. The expansion was going to be $50 regardless as to whether the free bonus core game was included for new players or not. There’s nothing wrong with marketing promotions towards a specific segment of customers. Do you get upset when military veterans gets deals that you cannot? Do you get upset when senior citizens get deals that you cannot?

ArmoredVehicle.2849:

Ayrilana.1396:

ArmoredVehicle.2849:

Ayrilana.1396:

ArmoredVehicle.2849:

Ayrilana.1396:

You can buy the expansion. It’s $50. The core game is a free bonus for new accounts to help new players to the game.

Help new players eh? Exactly how does lvl 80 targeted content help new players?

You’re right there’s so much lack of content in the base game for a new player that he MUST have both.

This is only Anet helping themselves, hell even a blind could see that.

It’s helping new players get into the game without there being a huge paywall for them. Read the blog post that clarifies this.

Oh really? A paywall and concern about new players. Well in case you’ve been living in a cave you’d notice that even the oldest players get to pay the same amount. This is a paywall for everyone not just new players.

Put it this way:

The expansion + “free game” costs 45e as a bundle.

If they offer the base game at 25e and the expansion for 20e separately that’s still 45e to new customers and without screwing your loyal fans. But this is all negated since they want to force 45e price upon everyone for more filthy profit.

Also in case you forgot. There may still be a few retail copies of the core only game on sale, I only feel sorry for the innocent souls falling into this trap. They would be forced to pay an additional 45e for the expansion since they bought it from a retailer. Now THAT is a massive paywall.

The truth lies here, they want to sell the expansion for 45e and no amount of word play will hide that. This is the best for their profits not the new players or old ones for the matter.

And what you don’t realized is that they priced the expansion at $50. Selling it for less causes them to lose money. The paywall was new players having to pay $50 for the expansion and the ~$25 for the core game. They had incentives to provide the core game for free to new players as this would increase the likelihood of new players purchasing GW2 and possibly buying items from the gem store in the future.

Help new players this, help new players that. It’s all a nice coverage to help them sell the expansion at a high price.

It’s a 2 sided problem. The first being the high price and the second is the 2 in 1 bundle new players are getting over the old ones.

Do you truly believe this is an act of generosity on Anet’s behalf, please don’t be so simple. Maybe you forgot they’re a business and maximizing profit is their aim.

I once thought Anet was different, probably it was true until a few years ago. Now its a different company, gone are the days they treat the game with love over profit.

Don’t be so cynical. It was going to be $50 regardless.

Hyori.3624:

Ayrilana.1396:

Hyori.3624:

Wrong. If you buy a car from the dealership ,they don’t have to give you a key to the car, because they are only selling you the car. In fact if you check the invoice of a car when signing the contracts, a key is listed $0.00 but dealers if they so choose to can actually charge you for the key since you’re only buying the car. The keys are considered as accessory. (which is why you can order more than one key)

WTH. Umm.. no. The key is part of the car when you buy it. Name one place that sells you the car but not the key. Otherwise, don’t make things up just so they continue to fit with your narrative. And FYI, even if they charge for the key, it’s a fee you have to pay to get the car unless you can haggle them out of it which in most cases you can. This is not the same situation as with HoT.

Fremont Honda, for my 2009 Honda Accord, $55.00 First key. $145.00 2nd key.

Daly City Toyota for my 2007 Toyota Corolla First key $35.00, the second key was $115.60

And you could’ve talked down those charges. The thing is that those are required for the original product and are no different than say paying for the seats. Like I’ve already said, it’s not the same scenario as with HoT.

You have lower stats when downscaled or at least in the few dungeons I checked. I found that was below the stat cap even with full ascended. I think for Twilight Story I was under the cap by like 200 but I wasn’t pay too much to the actual value difference but rather is there was one. Ascended may be worth it now in downscaled dungeons as you’re not “wasting” stats. Ascended weapons even do more damage than exotics now which wasn’t the case before the update.

These are the stats caps that someone found months ago. Feel free to see for yourselves.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1DBgIaO4OW_HHi_nEgtfH35kxEl7GaE7MbLKVVlVkKmM/edit#gid=0

You likely will not ever see something like this because once you’re level 80, everything is unlocked. I suggest going to do a few hero challenges to get the number of hero points that you need.

Hyori.3624:

And Quite frankly I don’t see how this “expansion” would be worth $49.99
It’s just Guild Wars 2 re-branded, new logo slapped onto it, added 1 extra class + new maps.

You haven’t seen everything and Anet isn’t going to spoil everything for players. When they did season 2, they didn’t list many spoilers. They left it up to the players to find these themselves. There very well could be five zones in the expansion. You’re making rash judgements based off a single zone.

Hyori.3624:

SWTOR does the same thing with level cap, story line, etc. but their “expansion” is $19.99 and they switched to a Free to play Model where you don’t even need to buy the core game anymore.

This isn’t SWTOR through and look at the many other games that charge more. Simply cherry picking the first MMO that you find that has a cheaper expansion isn’t going to win your case. Oh, and by the way, the Shadow of Revan expansion gave the Rise of the Hutt Cartel expansion free to new players. Now which game is doing something similar? Hmmm…….

Another thing that I should bring up is that a quick search shows some people complaining that the latest expansion is small. I looked and we got more in a living story season. The expansion before that was worse.

Hyori.3624:

So explain to me how exactly is HoT worth the $49.99?

Is there another years worth of content?

As far as I can see 2 months is the maximum i’d rate it so far.

Is the new class that “Special” that it has an outrageous price tag?

Did Arena Net hire some new animators and developers and this new price tag offset the costs?

Nothing was ever announced.

If this expansion pack is worth $49.99 i’m not see it.

Many people feel that it’s well worth the price of $50. There’s still many more blog posts for them to reveal details before the expansion is released. If you feel it’s not worth the $50 at the moment then simply wait. If it’s still not worth it to you the day before it’s released then wait until it goes on sale or get’s packed with the next expansion so you feel like you got your money’s worth.

Hyori.3624:

Wrong. If you buy a car from the dealership ,they don’t have to give you a key to the car, because they are only selling you the car. In fact if you check the invoice of a car when signing the contracts, a key is listed $0.00 but dealers if they so choose to can actually charge you for the key since you’re only buying the car. The keys are considered as accessory. (which is why you can order more than one key)

WTH. Umm.. no. The key is part of the car when you buy it. Name one place that sells you the car but not the key. Otherwise, don’t make things up just so they continue to fit with your narrative. And FYI, even if they charge for the key, it’s a fee you have to pay to get the car unless you can haggle them out of it which in most cases you can. This is not the same situation as with HoT.

Hyori.3624:

Just like HoT Arena Net CAN sell you just the expansion but if they did that new players would see that core game = $24.99 and then see price of expansion is “so called” $50 and then ditch the game. which is why they threw it in there making the total cost of Core + Expansion to be $49.99, but then is a slap to the face to every Veteran because now we have to shell out $49.99 for JUST the expansion because we do not gain any benefit of having the core Guild Wars 2 key again. Arena Net wants to treat us like we’re worthless because New Players > Old Players in terms of importance.

The $74.99 would be a cost barrier for new players and Anet wanted to help them out. The $50 was going to be the cost of the expansion all along and unlike new players, you’ve had much more time than they to play the game. Were you upset when the price of the game went down to $10 when you had paid $60? Did you accuse Anet of slapping veterans in the face then for doing so and not refunding players? Veterans have gotten so many things that new players haven’t and it’s a bit selfish to get upset one of the few times Anet cuts new players some slack.

Hyori.3624:

If they had the package as 49.99 for Core Guild Wars 2 “KEY” AND HoT “KEY”(notice I said Key twice) Then both side would benefit because Veterans could give the 2nd Core game key to their family/friends/whatever and have access to HoT. But I’m sure some sheep will tell me it’s not benefiting Arena Net when they’re getting more player base at the cost of somebody else expense…

They could have given players an additional key except they had intended the free bonus key for the core game to be for new players. Not everything has to revolve around veterans as if they’re special and should be treated as such all the time. One of the few times they did something for new players and now you’re upset. Geez…

ArmoredVehicle.2849:

Ayrilana.1396:

ArmoredVehicle.2849:

Ayrilana.1396:

You can buy the expansion. It’s $50. The core game is a free bonus for new accounts to help new players to the game.

Help new players eh? Exactly how does lvl 80 targeted content help new players?

You’re right there’s so much lack of content in the base game for a new player that he MUST have both.

This is only Anet helping themselves, hell even a blind could see that.

It’s helping new players get into the game without there being a huge paywall for them. Read the blog post that clarifies this.

Oh really? A paywall and concern about new players. Well in case you’ve been living in a cave you’d notice that even the oldest players get to pay the same amount. This is a paywall for everyone not just new players.

Put it this way:

The expansion + “free game” costs 45e as a bundle.

If they offer the base game at 25e and the expansion for 20e separately that’s still 45e to new customers and without screwing your loyal fans. But this is all negated since they want to force 45e price upon everyone for more filthy profit.

Also in case you forgot. There may still be a few retail copies of the core only game on sale, I only feel sorry for the innocent souls falling into this trap. They would be forced to pay an additional 45e for the expansion since they bought it from a retailer. Now THAT is a massive paywall.

The truth lies here, they want to sell the expansion for 45e and no amount of word play will hide that. This is the best for their profits not the new players or old ones for the matter.

And what you don’t realized is that they priced the expansion at $50. Selling it for less causes them to lose money. The paywall was new players having to pay $50 for the expansion and the ~$25 for the core game. They had incentives to provide the core game for free to new players as this would increase the likelihood of new players purchasing GW2 and possibly buying items from the gem store in the future.

Directions how are listed in the patch notes.

ArmoredVehicle.2849:

Ayrilana.1396:

You can buy the expansion. It’s $50. The core game is a free bonus for new accounts to help new players to the game.

Help new players eh? Exactly how does lvl 80 targeted content help new players?

You’re right there’s so much lack of content in the base game for a new player that he MUST have both.

This is only Anet helping themselves, hell even a blind could see that.

It’s helping new players get into the game without there being a huge paywall for them. Read the blog post that clarifies this.

All tier get 1. The tiers that already provide 1 will do so giving you two additional slots.

Loaf.8079:

Angel.6085:

misterman.1530:

Frankly, only people with more money than brains pre-purchase anything. I have never done that…not for software, not for hardware (reserve your iPhone bullkitten is ridiculous). Essentially you are getting, except for the Gems and the slot, some Barbie-dressup stuff to pretty up your cartoon.

People pre order games, and systems, so they have it at the earliest possible moment. This doesn’t mean we’re stupid, it means we can afford kitten and want kitten now. These are not always good purchases (See god of war 3, final fantasy 13-1, etc) however it is the cost of being a gamer that likes things now. If you want to be more frugal with your money and wait until others have played things that is up to you, but we all don’t want to be the second guy through the game – we want to be the first. ;P

The problem is that by pre-ordering, you take away incentive for companies to make good, complete, optimised games. Instead we get lousy stuff like Assassin’s Creed: Unity and other bug-ridden titles, not to mention Early Access and how it’s used as an excuse to sell betas at full price and then abandon them.

Face it. That game was going to be terrible whether you could preorder it not. They try to release a new addition every year so the games always feel rushed.

Hyori.3624:

Chicho Gosho.6507:

ANet deemed that no new player should face the barrier of buying previous expansions(as is the case with every MMO ever, but i know that for many people GW2 is their first MMO and they are not familiar with this concept) so they decided to give the core game for as a gift for the good of the game.

Except the core game isn’t a gift because nothing is ever free..

You can’t play the expansion without core game..

Looking at a veteran’s point of view we see it as $24.99 = core Guild Wars 2, 25$ expansion pack. because this is exactly what it is, a Marketing scheme.

It’s the same if I were to sell you a Car, MSRP at $20,000 but to make it a better deal, I’d tell you, Oh if you purchase the car i’ll give you the keys to the car for free.

You can’t drive a car without the keys to the car.

If it was , oh when you purchase HoT you get 2 keys.

1 key for the Core game and 1 key for the expansion, that I could understand because even if veterans owns the game already they could always give the core key to somebody else.

Same thing with the car.. I own the key to the car yet I don’t have the car.. dealer sells me the car with an extra key.. I can use my own key and give the 2nd key to my husband.

But then again common sense might as well be thrown out the window..

Bad analogy. Cars, just like the core game, come with a “key” automatically which is required for the product to function. GW2 core games doesn’t need HoT to function.

Tobias.2693:

Tachenon.5270:

Oh, heh, I thought it was a good parallel. Way too much for an expansion, way too much for a docking station. :-D

Ah- I misunderstood your subtle sarcasm

And as for…

Ayrilana.1396:

No.

After reviewing your post history, I believe you are either an employee for ArenaNet or a sheep.

Baaaaaaaaaa?

You still don’t understand sales/promotions and are under some misguided assumption that sales/promotions all have a cost which are passed down to the customer. You also do not realize the types of promotions that are commonly done which closely resemble what Anet did. There’s also the matter that prices are not static and they tend to fall over time. All of which I have mentioned numerous times in the posts of mine you supposedly reviewed.

Compared to what before though.

Anyone want to update this spreadsheet that some made months ago?

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1DBgIaO4OW_HHi_nEgtfH35kxEl7GaE7MbLKVVlVkKmM/htmlview?pli=1

Tobias.2693:

If you will, follow me on a mythical adventure using the business model set forth here-

My name is Johnny B. Isness and I am the owner of Best Buy. Today, I am going to offer anyone who purchases ‘Laptop A’ the low price of $500 for said laptop, and nothing else. A year from now, I’m going to offer NEW customers the same ‘Laptop A’ WITH a docking station for the low price of $500. One of my customers from the first promotion wants the docking station? “That’ll be $500 please and thanks!”

…

Let’s say you’re in the first group of people… are you not mad at me for giving away the laptop that you paid $500 for to new people just because, ‘oh they need it to enjoy the docking station’?

No.

Strach.1572:

Ayrilana.1396:

You can buy the expansion. It’s $50. The core game is a free bonus for new accounts to help new players to the game.

There is no such things as “free” unless Ur a kid that thinks, a fat guy dressed in red brings U presents on x-mas

Sorry that you don’t know how sales/promotions work.

You can buy the expansion. It’s $50. The core game is a free bonus for new accounts to help new players to the game.

ScorpioSting.5917:

Blockhead Magee.3092:

Its simply about value for the money. New players will get more value (five toon slots, bank tab etc.) than existing players who upgrade for the same $50. Anet has staked out a position that this is somehow a good thing.

The real question for you and the rest of us, is the expansions content worth their asking price? If you like the class you currently play, mainly WvW or PvP – it sure doesn’t look like it. It might be better to wait until they discount the expansion and jump in then.

Tell me this: what if ANET instead of this insane marketing politic offered the possibility to us old players to just purchase HoT at, let’s say mmmmh, 19,99? (and I personally think HoT value is even lower than this, but this is another story..)

You look like this solution is such a gift from the gods… something waaaay too generous from ANET… How can you accept the joke that they are offering you like that?? You look like: “I don’t care how much money you want from me, just take my money and let me play”.

The expansion itself is valued at $50 so no.

Astralporing.1957:

Ayrilana.1396:

The core game is a bonus for new players and is not factored into the price.

Of course it is factored in the price. They oviously thought, that the expansion was too pricey for new players, if they had to buy the core separately. If the core wasn’t included, they’d have to set a lower price to get the same result. How much lower? Hard to say, but the fact it was a bundle was definitely factored in.

No, it is not included.

The core game is a bonus for new players and is not factored into the price.

Atherakhia.4086:

Ayrilana.1396:

Ever heard of pre-order bonuses? Same concept.

It’s really not. If you introduce a new class, you should provide a character slot so your existing playerbase that has no available slots isn’t inconvenienced by buying your new product.

Pre-order bonuses are great. Making the bonus something the average player expects regardless is silly.

That’s your opinion and not a fact.

Zhaneel.9208:

What should concern fans is the fact that they refuse to sell future expansions separately from the core game at a lower price than the combined version. There wouldn’t have been nearly as much anger from the community if they had just done that to begin with.

Except the previous expansion and core game will have no bearing on the newer expansion’s price.

Ever heard of pre-order bonuses? Same concept.

weskay.9217:

I’m still not impressed by the price and value of the product. I still feel like in the long-term, veterans will be the ones consistently getting shafted. Lets say there are 4 expansions in GW2’s lifetime. If you are someone that played from the get-go, you’ll have spent $50 on the base game, now $50 on this expansion, $150 on the future expansions. That’s $250. Someone brand new coming into the game at the fourth expansion only pays $50 for all of the games/expansions? It’s a fantastic deal for new players, but veteran players will continuously get shafted. I feel strongly that the base game + expansion should differ from the expansion alone.

You do realize that this has been frequently done with games and their expansions, right? It’s a rather high pay wall to expect a new player to have to maybe $100 just to play this game or to pay $150 after the next expansion. Veterans players are not getting shafted here either before the announcement today or after. Were you upset when the game went to $10 and thus “devaluing” the your game as you paid much more than that?

Your game has not been devalued as you have gotten to enjoy it for so much longer than new players. If you feel that prices should remain static for all time then you’re going to be very disappointed in this game and out in the real world.

No. Players were able to complete other episodes out of order. Based on the beta, you only need access to SW which everyone has.

Closer towards the end of the year.

1) No free slot after launch.
2) It will eventually go on sale. It won’t increase either.
3) See #2

Orimidu.9604:

It’s still a mess. I replied to that thread twice and since I believe I have a better business model I want it to get more exposure by having its own thread.

And I forgot about the conversion. That would drastically destroy the economy. They can still offer it digitally in the gem store but force it to cost real money instead of gems.

They’ve already stated that you cannot buy it for gems as they do not want players buying it with gold.

Orimidu.9604:

Newcomers to Guild Wars 2
Purchase the Heart of Thorns complete package for $50, which includes the base game. Enjoy everything that veterans have

Owners of Guild Wars 2
Prepurchase a Heart of Thorns expansion upgrade for 3000 gems. Character slot included when you prepurchase digitally. Once the game is released the character slot will not be included.

Easy fix for a huge mess.

No. They will not make it being able to be purchased with gold.

Astralporing.1957:

Ayrilana.1396:

Astralporing.1957:

Ayrilana.1396:

Then you don’t have an understanding of what a bonus or sale is. I guess you assume that the costs from a buy one gent one free sale gets passed onto the customer. I guess you assume that anything that gives you 33% more gets passed onto the customer.

Of course it gets passed on the customer. The sole reason beyond this is after all to increase income for the seller.

No. It does not. Sorry.

Ah, yeah, so Anet did it not because they thought they will get more money that way, but from the goodness of their hearts. Good to hear that.

The cost does not get passed onto the customer.

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Expecting more from a product you haven’t bought yet and therefore not buying it isn’t entitlement. It’s being a critical, discerning customer.

There’s a difference between expecting more from a product and expecting more because you’re a current player or veteran to the game. The latter putting some form of prestige upon themselves assuming that they deserve something more because of it.

And no one is doing that. What’s happening is that people resent being offered a worse deal on buying the expansion for being a veteran.

They added a deal specifically to bring in new players. It’s a little selfish to assume that Anet must compensate veteran players for whatever deals they give to bring in new players.

They don’t have to. On the other side of the equation, veteran players don’t have to buy what they perceive to be a bad deal. And there’s nothing selfish about refusing bad deals. When a deal is obviously looking bad, the problem lies with he who proposed the deal.

Yes, there’s nothing wrong with not buy what they feel is a bad deal. It’s different when they assume their position (e.g. Veteran) should award them with some additional perks above the standard release.

And like I said, that’s not what’s happening.

Perhaps you are not but many other are.

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Expecting more from a product you haven’t bought yet and therefore not buying it isn’t entitlement. It’s being a critical, discerning customer.

There’s a difference between expecting more from a product and expecting more because you’re a current player or veteran to the game. The latter putting some form of prestige upon themselves assuming that they deserve something more because of it.

And no one is doing that. What’s happening is that people resent being offered a worse deal on buying the expansion for being a veteran.

They added a deal specifically to bring in new players. It’s a little selfish to assume that Anet must compensate veteran players for whatever deals they give to bring in new players.

They don’t have to. On the other side of the equation, veteran players don’t have to buy what they perceive to be a bad deal. And there’s nothing selfish about refusing bad deals. When a deal is obviously looking bad, the problem lies with he who proposed the deal.

Yes, there’s nothing wrong with not buy what they feel is a bad deal. It’s different when they assume their position (e.g. Veteran) should award them with some additional perks above the standard release.

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Expecting more from a product you haven’t bought yet and therefore not buying it isn’t entitlement. It’s being a critical, discerning customer.

There’s a difference between expecting more from a product and expecting more because you’re a current player or veteran to the game. The latter putting some form of prestige upon themselves assuming that they deserve something more because of it.

And no one is doing that. What’s happening is that people resent being offered a worse deal on buying the expansion for being a veteran.

They added a deal specifically to bring in new players. It’s a little selfish to assume that Anet must compensate veteran players for whatever deals they give to bring in new players.

Manasa Devi.7958:

Expecting more from a product you haven’t bought yet and therefore not buying it isn’t entitlement. It’s being a critical, discerning customer.

There’s a difference between expecting more from a product and expecting more because you’re a current player or veteran to the game. The latter putting some form of prestige upon themselves assuming that they deserve something more because of it.

Angelica Dream.7103:

Celtic Lady.3729:

Again, it’s a lot about perception. I don’t see it this way. I view it as paying or not paying $50 for HoT. Giving the base game away free to new players doesn’t factor into it for me.

Outside independent sources see it the other way.

Quotes from PC Gamer:

“Guild Wars 2 players rightly upset by Heart of Thorns’ pre-purchase scheme”

“People who don’t yet own Guild Wars 2 are getting an amazing deal. People who do—who have potentially supported the game for three years—are not.”

The PC Gamer article wasn’t independent as I seem to remember the author stating they were a GW2 player. It’d be no different than if you worked for TIME magazine and created an article about the release.

People thinking that they should get more than the base expansion, or other new players, is just entitlement. It’s really no different than when some players made a stink about the newer heroic edition of the game containing items that were not including with the edition that they bought and then demanding those items be given to them.

Manasa Devi.7958:

BOGO or bundled sales on physical items involve considerations that never enter the picture with digital products, like getting rid of badly selling stock, sell-by-dates, etc.

It is absolutely pointless to make comparisons.

Not when used to explain the concept of sales/promotion to someone that doesn’t understand them. It was not meant as a direct comparison of what HoT is.

Seera.5916:

Ayrilana.1396:

Astralporing.1957:

Ayrilana.1396:

No. There’s no cost being covered by the players. What part of the concept of a bonus do you not understand?

What part do you don’t understand? The cost of the bonus is always covered by someone – and it’s always the customer, not the seller. The “free if you buy” kind of bonus is never free, it’s just its price has been moved onto something else, to give you an illusion you receive something for free.

Then you don’t have an understanding of what a bonus or sale is. I guess you assume that the costs from a buy one gent one free sale gets passed onto the customer. I guess you assume that anything that gives you 33% more gets passed onto the customer.

The costs do get passed on to customers. Maybe they marked the prices of the shoes up by 33% a few months ago in anticipation of the BOGO (companies set sales well in advance).

Maybe they hope you’ll buy the other overpriced accessories in the store. The socks, the shoe care items.

The cost of the expansion being free for new players is/was passed onto us customers, new and old. Maybe there were so many gem sales prior to this that they can afford to give the base away between those gem sales and predictions that enough new players will also buy plenty of gems.

No. That’s not how it works.

There’s an existing thread already about the price.

Astralporing.1957:

Ayrilana.1396:

Then you don’t have an understanding of what a bonus or sale is. I guess you assume that the costs from a buy one gent one free sale gets passed onto the customer. I guess you assume that anything that gives you 33% more gets passed onto the customer.

Of course it gets passed on the customer. The sole reason beyond this is after all to increase income for the seller.

No. It does not. Sorry.

Astralporing.1957:

Ayrilana.1396:

No. There’s no cost being covered by the players. What part of the concept of a bonus do you not understand?

What part do you don’t understand? The cost of the bonus is always covered by someone – and it’s always the customer, not the seller. The “free if you buy” kind of bonus is never free, it’s just its price has been moved onto something else, to give you an illusion you receive something for free.

Then you don’t have an understanding of what a bonus or sale is. I guess you assume that the costs from a buy one gent one free sale gets passed onto the customer. I guess you assume that anything that gives you 33% more gets passed onto the customer.

Astralporing.1957:

Ayrilana.1396:

How are you sacrificing for new players? With or without the base game bonus, it was going to cost $50 either way.

The price of the packaged core game for new players is being covered by someone – and you can be sure that someone is not Anet.

No. There’s no cost being covered by the players. What part of the concept of a bonus do you not understand? You also don’t realize the types of sales that companies can potentially do and what the benefits are for doing so.

JUN YANG.4328:

for us that core is useless… include or exclude make no different.

so the logic is the same. new player pay Big Mac Meal price included bugger, fries, coke.

we pay Meal price for Coke ONLY simple is that…

you want??

Changeling Dash.4782:

JUN YANG.4328:

so you prefer spend a meal price to buy a coke….???? at Mcdonalds

no, on contrary, I believe that the core-game price IS inside of that 50$ somewhere. I don’t know what that price is for Anet, but it is there.

What you’re not understanding is what a bonus is as you’re under some idea that the core game is part of the price which it isn’t. I suggest looking it up. The free core game is a bonus on top of the $50 expansion for new players.

Changeling Dash.4782:

JUN YANG.4328:

so you prefer spend a meal price to buy a coke….???? at Mcdonalds

no, on contrary, I believe that the core-game price IS inside of that 50$ somewhere. I don’t know what that price is for Anet, but it is there.

Except it’s not.

Celtic Lady.3729:

Ayrilana.1396:

Well the way people see it is that they’re going to buy the expansion anyway. Those that are hesitating because of what appears to be alack of content in their minds, What are you going to do? Not buy the expansion and be left to play the base game until the next expansion? Quit the game entirely?

They’ll probably wait for it to go on sale and pick it up then.

True.

Well the way people see it is that they’re going to buy the expansion anyway. Those that are hesitating because of what appears to be a lack of content in their minds; what are you going to do? Not buy the expansion and be left to play the base game until the next expansion? Quit the game entirely?