Guild Wars 2

XxSaudiDragonxX.3072:

It will be nice if Warriors can dual wield a greatsword + sword

Good Idea, if Thiefs can use the Shortbow + sword together or better dual wield a shortbow + a shortbow

vincecontix.1264:

Black Teagan.9215:

Sry, but this is the first patch since the release, where I see not one nerf.

We get a higher ini reg, for long fights, and the problem with the permastealth seems to be finally fixed.

Dude do you even play any s/x thief builds the added cast time is gonna almost destroy thiefs swords build. Also the reduction in vigor is going to greatly affect thiefs ability to stay in fights and keep up there sustain dmg.

Due to the the prevalence of aoe dmg and cc the ability to dodge in team fights is more useful than stealth. The baseline increase in initiative is nice but it didn’t come without its costs. Overall this upcoming patch will decrease the survivability and dmg output of a lot thief builds when it comes to group play.

S/P is my mainset, and I have so much evades that I cant count them.

sorudo.9054:

and how do you type your messages quickly enough?

Maybe over the keyboard, that he connect on the Xbox One or PS4.

Zerbo.5381:

Black Teagan.9215:

Sry, but this is the first patch since the release, where I see not one nerf.

Is this a joke- “Not one nerf”? If not, I think you should go back and read the notes a little more carefully.

Give me an example for “a nerf”

Sry, but this is the first patch since the release, where I see not one nerf.

We get a higher ini reg, for long fights, and the problem with the permastealth seems to be finally fixed.

I wont tell you what you must do, but yes thieves are to weak for endgame pve.

To spam BS+ Stealth with an fullzerker build and gear is the only way to do more dmg as GS-warriors (on one target!), but you will die as fast as a rabbit.

muscarine.5136:

Thief
REGARDING INITIATIVE

I personnaly totally disagree with these changes andfeel these are actually a nerf rather than a buff, especially toward active gameplay (player is engaged and fighting).

I did some simple math to prove my point, calculated from my non stealth S/D build

Current initiative management on 10 seconds
0.75 × 10 (base recovery) + 2 × 2 (signets) + 10 × 0.3 (opportunist) + 2 (quick recovery)
= 16.5

Upcoming initiative management on 10 seconds
1 × 10 (base recovery) + 2 × 1 (signets) + 2 × 0.5 (opportunist) + 1 (quick recovery)
= 14

This is 2.5 less initiative every 10 seconds, over a 30 seconds fight against a particularly resistant build, it’s even more, due to the huge nerf to opportunist.

On a side note you’re also definitely killing p/p builds essentialy relying on opportunist to manage the huge unload cost.

Please reconsider your math regarding the initiative changes, you’re going to hurt active and revealed gameplay while rewarding perma stealth / passive wait for regen even more

You can use the signets every 10secs?

When you want to calculate it, then use the time of the skill with the highest CD

Jikuim.1349:

DO NOT change :

Shadow Arts V – Infusion of Shadow – This trait functionality has been changed to “Gain initiative when you enter stealth.” 2 init.

This is a horrendous idea. I don’t even main thief, but you’re going to nerf numerous builds into the ground. Thieves will go from being alright to being completely garbage tier with this change.

Honestly, take it or leave it, but it’s a bad idea.

I dont know what you mean, this change was necessary, and is very good to stop the abuse the stealth mechanic, (=Permastealth).

The bigger problem is, that thieves have furthermore no acceptable condition remove underwater and only 50% of his skills + that condition thieves, lose around 90% their effectivity there.

Areyou sure the PS4 or the XBox One have enough power for GW2 and the Controller enough keys?

Sanduskel.1850:

Hmmm. Well someone is playing thieves. Still see plenty of them in wvw, so they can’t be all that terrible.

Believe me, they most of them are terrible.
But the many thieves in WvW dont mean, that they are good (playable) in PvP or PvE.

I always love charrs, also in GW1.

I can’t and I wont play another race anymore, so are 7 of my 8 characters charrs

JETWING.2759:

I see why warriors are so easi to kill…

… :Bad playing players with predictable build?

This is at least my personal experience.

evilapprentice.6379:

Black Teagan.9215:

My suggestion for S/D is:

Flanking Strike: Cost: 3 Ini

Larcenous Strike: Cost: 5 Ini ; Steal 3 boons [or Steal 2 boons with the full duration]

Your suggestion is silly. This would turn a fight against an S/D thief into “Dodge LS to win”, or from the thief’s perspective “Save your initiative for skills that aren’t horribly overcosted”

LS was working as intended as far as a soft counter (not a hard counter, mind you) to boon bunkers – it should just be reverted back to how it was, or just shaved a little bit rather than having it’s utility nerfed into the ground.

Another suggestion, Give FS 1 boon steal/strip, and LS 1 boon steal.

Do you (really) think my suggestion is worse, than the abuse of permaevades from Sword #3 how it currently is? The thief is a class, which should have skills to counter bunker or boonspammer, but thieves dont have it, and FS is actually to weak to counter these builds and 8 inis aren’t to expensive.

Another possibility is, to give FS 1 boon steal instead of LS and give FS an ability for +10% (?) dmg for every left boon on the enemy?

My suggestion for S/D is:

Flanking Strike: Cost: 3 Ini

Larcenous Strike: Cost: 5 Ini ; Steal 3 boons [or Steal 2 boons with the full duration]

Scryed.9423:

MarkedOne.1309:

I would like to report Warrior for being the most effective class with the least amount of skill required in every aspect of the game.

In all fairness when this class sucked for the first 6 months of the game, we didn’t drop into other class sub forums and talk mad kitten. We instead worked together and offered fixes after fixes in hopes anet would help us out.

You should probably try that, since it worked better than what you just did there.

After my experience with the warrior in pvp and the many many people, who I follow about the Spectate Mode, I can say: It was/are more the players, than the class.

Fletch.3572:

When did the whirling axe steal get bugged again? It USED to (many many moons ago)act like the thief elite, unless something has changed recently, it does not reflect anymore

All skills with a reflect effects which thieves have are bugged. Whirling axt, like Daggerstorm doesn’t reflect all projectiles, especially if it are many projectiles.

“Noob! Spamming stealth all the time”

How can this be? I always play with S/P

Einlanzer.1627:

The culprit is mostly Venomous Aura, which is easily an overpowered trait when considering what the baseline is and how it affects it. What they need to do is balance Venoms around not having Venomous Aura, then have Venomous Aura weaken them in some way while spreading them to the party.

I would advocate something like increasing the number of attacks the Venom is active by 1 on each Venom, then having Venomous Aura reduce them by 1 when spread to other folks.

However, all durations stacking has been a bit of an indirect buff to Venoms, so that should help some.

Why is VA OP?

The effect of the venoms are really weak, also if 5 people use them together.

My suggestion:

[General]
Reduce CD’s of Venoms to 35 Secs, except BV.
Poison duration of Spider Venom: 5 secs per hit. 5 Attacks.
+
[Improved Venoms]
Venom skills recharge 20% faster and (poison) have a higher duration of 25%.

^Potent Poison and Quick Venoms are combinate into one T2-Trait.

[Basilisk Venom] CD 50-60 Sec; Effect can’t stack
Your next attack turns your foe to stone and remove all buffs for 1,5 secs.

Ups, my mistake.
I thought it were those thread

What is with the P/P venom-condition build, it very popular at the moment

Harper.4173:

Healing signet is easily defeated by poison and spikes. It does not spike heal. It is a trade off.

Poison works against every heal not only by the healing signet, and spikes that can kill a warrior, without that he can use skills or other skills that reduce the dmg, exist only in WvW. Endure Pain and blocks are enough to overlife every spike.

Jabberwock.9014:

I think healing sig is better than healing surge in almost all cases because there is no opportunity cost since there is no cast time. You can’t be interrupted, and you’re healing for the same amount over time even while attacking and running away. And you can even use the active if you are about to die to a burn or bleed, and gs away to fully heal ooc. Not to mention you don’t have to worry about having to have full adrenaline before healing… if I need a heal now, I hardly have time to wait for my adrenaline to fill. The actual adrenaline fill from healing surge at no adrenaline is negligible since I’ll almost always have full adrenaline by the time eviscerate is off cd anyways.

Then again I’ve never actually tried healing surge. Like I said, I am a war noob.

Healing signet isnt just better than healing surge, the signet is better than everything else.
In 20 secs it heals 7840 points, nothing can reach this and the signet cant interrupt.

EoNxBoNx.9213:

JonathanSharp.7094:

Just wanted to jump in and say thanks for keeping things constructive!

The idea right now is to see how the current changes impact the meta, and then do another set of balance in an upcoming patch.

The trait facts were a lot of work, but the clarity they give you guys is VERY good for you. So we wanted to see if that would shake up trait builds at all in order to see how you guys adjusted. Once THAT settles, we want to make balance changes based off the meta at that time. We didn’t want to change all the trait facts and also add in a lot of balance changes on top of it.

We still did a lot of balance stuff, but we were careful not to go overboard with this patch. Just like we learned w/ the Warrior a few updates back, sometimes the meta can undergo drastic changes even if we do VERY little to impact the balance.

We’re planning on doing another round of updates to traits for every class (either changing #‘s, shifting tiers around to make more builds viable, or doing trait reworks), and we also have our eye on a few “apex” builds. But, again we don’t want to shave those too much.

Thanks again for the thoughts and feedback!

Chap + the balance tam

I only really have one point to make and its about thieves. The changes you guys made to LS hardly does anything. I am not saying there won’t be future changes, but 30 points into Acrobatics a thief can still spam dodge rolls, still have initiative for days, and still be able to poke and prod other classes like mesmers, eles etc while having endless amounts of disengage.

Personally, I am looking at S/P being a replacement since it has the opportunity to put out just as much, if not more, pressure as S/D and has basically the same; disengage, mobility, initiative regeneration (not the same initiative management), and nearly the same amount of dodges.

Yes, thiefs can spam evade and stealth, but have they other possibilities to reduce dmg? No.

No buffed venoms/conditions?
I thought they should come with this patch

Karolis.4261:

Hmm but that internal cooldown of 10 s seems not to work, i still remove condis every stealth, pretty sure every 3s

Nope, its works correctly.

How the discription say, do you remove 1 condition every 10 sec in stealth.
It dont said that you can remove only one condition in 10 sec.

Xillllix.3485:

STRanger.5120:

Avatara.1042:

tigirius.9014:

Mathias.9657:

Soooo the stream was completely underwhelming as expected, I understand their time is limited so I’m still looking forward to the patch notes, not getting excited though.

Watched it as well and what I found most disturbing was all of the time spent on Ele and Warriors like the other classes A: didn’t have more pressing problems that have needed to be fixed since launch and B: don’t deserve the same amount of care that these two favored classes have had since beta.

Seriously I would hope that in the interest of fairness that next patch they focus mainly on Engineer and Ranger the most. Then the next patch they focus on Thief and Mesmer the most etc so that it’s a balanced approach to them all.

Better be trolling.

Elementalist is a favored class? Maybe in the terms of nerfing, I would agree with that….

Yeah we lost AoE early on, now we are losing even more AoE damage with the new rules. RTL recharge increased from 16 sec to 40, mist form now prevent heal and condition removal, our healing was nerfed (now it seems they are realizing this was a huge mistake)… I mean the Ele got the nerf hard. Our class has been literally destroyed over the course of the year. Apparently they want to put it back together with a cheap version of Guard’s line of warding… Meanwhile they give the thief immobilize duration stacks.

And I have a lv 80 thief, but this is just stupid. A thief already destroy players in 1 vs 1. Now they can have them stunned and stuck in one place for 6-7 seconds once their stunbreakers are used. News for you Anet: it only take 3 seconds for a good Thief to destroy an ele, 5-6 seconds if they use mist form an try to jump off a cliff.

I think there is nothing wrong with this.
RTL was really a little to good, and mistform was the only skill that makes you full invulnerable while you can use skills or stomp another people. No other class could do this.
And I’m sure the healing nerf, was a result to the bunkerbuilds.

One thing that I’m missing is an acceptable condition remove underwater and outside of stealth.

Oh and Venoms that are strong enough to work alone.

Sanduskel.1850:

Zacchary.6183:

Tarinis.6054:

Taking damage brought one out of stealth, unless vanish was just used. Here, we got thieves stealthing, then stealthing right after their first stealth runs out. I guess we all have to spend money to beat a class…

Thieves are squishy and have zero mitigation. Stealth does not make them invulnerable or immortal because they still take damage in stealth. If they didn’t have stealth, the class wouldn’t be able to survive and the profession would be completely useless.

If you think thieves have zero mitigation then you are doing something wrong.

Give us an example.

Sanduskel.1850:

Imagi.4561:

Sanduskel.1850:

DanH.5879:

so, while the other classes get super bonuses, thief gets nerfed more

well… thief hate at it’s finest….

lol thieves aren’t getting nerfed. scrub permastealthers ruin the game for everyone, especially decent thieves.

We get it. You don’t like stealth.

I’m a thief who hates what permastealth has done to my class.

On the one hand you have right, on the other hand I agree with you
Its very stupid and annoying

They could change then Steal into an stunbreaker.

Yeah I see this since the beta and wrote 3 tickets about this mistake, but as yet nothing has been done.

Kilandros.2098:

Black Teagan.9215:

Yeah, make it infinite and you give the players a freeticket to exploit the game.
I cant wait to read the first sentence with: “LFM only Instant Trait Reset item users”

lol, is this post for real? For starters, I don’t think you fully grasp what an exploit is. Second, there’s nothing stopping people from retraiting pretty much on the fly anyway beyond the WP cost.

Yes it is.

And this would destroy the complete game and the thought behind the traitssystem, if everybody can change their Traits how they will, especially before you meet a boss or enter a part of the map, where enemies use special tactics/builds.

If they really sell an infinite version, then not for less than 8000gems.

Yeah, make it infinite and you give the players a freeticket to exploit the game.
I cant wait to read the first sentence with: “LFM only Instant Trait Reset item users”

Adrenalin: Warriors lose their adrenalin, if the burst skill miss. (Generally)

Earthshaker: Change the stun into a daze or generally into 0-80 range = stun; 81-160 range = daze; 161-240 range = blind for 5 secs.

Blocks/Endure Pain : Reduce dmg by 80 (or 90)%, instead of negate it.
Healing signet can then stay like it is.

Healers will destroy the game

inb4: “Thief is OP”

btw. where is Burnfall?

Shemsu.8721:

Daendur.2357:

Thieves should have a trait to make traps ground target.

Traps need a massive overall, even ground target wouldnt make em useful right now

The whole thief mechanics and skills need an overhaul

Use skill #6 and the traits, then have you your healing class

I love Burnfall, the best example, if you want to know, who have no notion of thiefs

My favourite example:

Vigil Armor

In the theory 7, but actually 2

Now stability and what comes next? Stealth, aoeblind, clones/minions/pets?

What warriors have is enough. Every class has his own role, with his own advantages and disadvantages, if you want a shout that gives you stability, then play a guardian.

Seriously, stop copy my build ^^

My evade/control build for PvP/WvW

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fYAQNAsaVlYmKPHdy9E/5Eh3DyOWzqpgm2sTBXlPA-T0Ag0CnIKSVkrITRyisFNsY9xhhJEvIA

Skill 7 is free to change

ANets warrior balancepolitic

Skill A is weaker than Skill B, and C, so lets buff us it.
After buff:
Now its Skill C weaker than Skill A and B so let us buff it.
Oh noes Skill B is weaker than Skill A and C so let us buff it.

Wait no is Skill A weaker, then Skill B and C, lets buff us it again.
What, now its Skill C weaker, than Skill A and B!? So let us buff it.
OMG, skill B is weaker again, than Skill A and C, its need a buff.

Wait, now is Skill D stronger then skill A, B and C
(They buffing Skill A,B and C (and dont nerf Skill D))

Now its Skill D to weak, it needs a buff…

Sanduskel.1850:

My thief fully heals while stealthed…

…and your heal stay even so under the heal from the warriorsignet, and stealth is not permanent

Preparedness is a great trait and I will never play without it.
But I think he is good how he is, also the ini reg, so:

No, I dont think its need a rework.

Nuka Cola.8520:

Of all the classes in this game, thief would be the #1 choice to go full zerker if you decide to play a zerker class… just don’t be stupid enough to zerg in groups, duh

Thats not true. The #1 classes for Fullzerker are Mesmer and Warrior.
Thiefs play zerker, because nothing else is effective. They cant Tank, cant good heal or support other people, conditions have a low effective, and deff scale generally to bad, so that this would make no different, if we use points for that.

Dontcare Aboutnames.9284:

Screen Shot says it all….

http://i.imgur.com/Ocl4xxE.jpg

Nice try, but next time you should wear an armor, before you tell us how “OP” a class is

I agree with the OP.

The thief has nothing to do with his name or his description, otherwise would we dont get one nerf after another, despite the fact that he is the weakest class in pve.