Guild Wars 2

Increased Base HP were really nice, especially for PvE, but there is one thing, why the can’t do it. Stealth.

Doggie.3184:

yolo swaggins.2570:

Zero Day.2594:

Supposedly they all play all the classes… We’ve even seen some footage of that thief gameplay from one of the devs…

Once

I remember seeing one playing a P/P build in a new dungeon and dying a lot.

No wonder.

There are two possibilities how someone can play the thief:

1) You spam and abuse stealth (with D/X) or evades (with S/D) and give your enemy no chance to hit or kill you.
Then is the thief strong enough for PvE and too strong in PvP.

or

2) You don’t spam stealth or evades.
Then are you nearly useless in PvE and an easy target for your enemies in PvP, but you play fair.

Preface: Stealth is no thief mechanic, only a mechanic that thieves can use much.

The main problem with the stealth mechanic is that it can be used too many times consecutively. This give others too less time to attack the thief (or mesmer) and make it nearly impossible for them to use their deffense skills or deal enough dmg before they stealth again.

That problem exist since 3 years now and also if stealth (and the classes) were originally and mainly designed for PvE, it doesn’t work for every other aspect of the game and I see it as neccessary that the time of Revealed must be set higher to fix that.
(At least by 5 secs. and at best also of stealth to compensate it)

But not only other classes have problems with stealth, I think it’s also the reason why thieves becoming weaker and weaker.
Stealth is overpowered since the beta and if a class like the thief or the mesmer have so much access to it, then it doesn’t wonder me why the people think these classes are OP, and, because Anet seems to think that too, they get no real development.

I dont understand why so many thieves here want a 1200r weapon.
I mean 900r are more than enough for a melee class with so much mobility and shadowsteps.

I would love more a chain scythe weapon like a Kusarigama for the thieves and no boring rifle.

Anton.1769:

OMG how OP thieves were before, fortunately they are repared

By far not

You also forget:

Nine-Tailed Strike and Shadow Assault (increase cost of both by two ini)

What is a support thief?

A thief who use support skills to support his team?

No really, if you want support your team then take another class, their support skills (especially Venomshare) aren’t worth it or better use stealth and dmg skills.

S/P is my main weaponset and it isn’t useless, also not in PvP, but it’s very self denying because the skills are very slow, it has no access to stealth and to mobility (unlike S/D).

This make the wewapon not useless but very weak and the only deffense that you can use with S/P is acrobatic and BP. Acrobatic was never good and BP is nearly useless and too expensive since the last patch.

vincecontix.1264:

glock.6590:

No offense but you shouldnt be wasting your skills on a acro thief or anything with perma vigor.

Yes you can random dodge alot with acro but its also your fault for not landing your skills at the right time.

Its like saying D/P has too much blind when in reality its the person that fights the D/P thief that dosent use his skills correctly.

This^^ thief survivability is not op there is no need to Nerf it. Its also one of the classes that require more skill to be successful no need to make things harder. Fg is one of the main reasons to go into trickery we should be advocating for more options not reducing them.

I think FG is the only reason to go into trickery

30% aren’t so much and beside of that are evades (and stealth) the only way for thieves to avoid damage and they have nothing else to do that unlike to the other classes who have access to many (different) deffense skills.

Cygnus.6903:

Silv.9207:

Then, use that F*** skills and don’t say that 100B is a bad skill in spvp.

It is awful in PvP.

Only if your whole build and playstyle is around that one skill, apart from that it’s very powerful and dangerous.

The GS is a mobility weapon and no dmg weapon. If you need dmg than use an axe

Stop Nerfing, stop Buffing, start balancing
_______________________

Solstace.2514:

Most ppl want their favorite class buffed and every other class nerfed.

It’s a sad truth

Mark Katzbach.9084:

joshc.3129:

How many times now has Anet said they have no plans to bring GW2 to consoles?

Let’s add one more to the tally.

We currently have no plans to port Guild Wars 2 to console.

And for mobile phone’s? :=)

Warriors shall be weak vs all other classes?

Hard to believe if I see so many warriors who can easily dominate 3 players at once.

Zero Day.2594:

I think they want us all to play venom-share…
That or trappers.

:D No nerfs announced yet either… yaya.

If they nerf him further, then we aren’t far away from this.

yolo swaggins.2570:

What was the reasoning behind that?

I think because noone use them and this update will change nothing.

Venom cd’s are still too high and as long as they are designed around VA, they have no future.

fumcheg.1936:

I think they have to increase BP ini to 20! And remove smoke field from it! And blind as well!

And they must add a activation time of 5 secs plus 50% of their HP and a seperate cd of 90 secs.

I choose the race with that I can most identify myself and choose the class with that I had the most fun.

I hate no professions

ghaleon.2861:

Cam Ron.4170:

ghaleon.2861:

Cam Ron.4170:

Cynz.9437:

ghaleon.2861:

Kolly.9872:

ghaleon.2861:

But back on topic, The only zerker spec that shuts down a thief is “Medi Guard”.

Then NERF “Meditation Guardian” cos thief has no chance against that build. As you said every zerker spec should have a chance to equally fight vs other zerker specs right?

but ppl don’t use dps guard in tpvp , a serious team doesn’t…

but but but srs teams run only celestial bunker now not thieves

bingo… and we all know how thieves (anybody really) fair against celestial bunkers

Only NA nabs run bunker comps, EU is all about that roamer burst comp.

only nabs cry about thieves, probably the weakest class in all of spvp right now.

lol weakest class nice joke, I kill ppl on thief while eating a sandwich. And we both know who the nab between us is “YOU” before calling other ppl nabs, look at yourself in the mirror first. Lol turret engi player

Weakest =!= Weak

Arikyali.5804:

That can’t be it – the stolen item converts to an underwater equivalent.

It’s probably related to the steal bug.

Not every item have a underwater equivalent.

If you have the wrong item, then Steal will be blocked until you use it on land.

I would give thieves the ability to steal gold from players and increase the range of every aoe to 60k units.

uboot.8715:

oh OK this makes sense now. Will this trait affect Basilisk Venom?

BV is a venomskill, so yes it does.

CobOfCorn.6352:

I think the problem with thieves after patch is now every other class can do what thief can do, but better. Elementalists have high mobility, and can spike just as fast as a thief can (faster most of the time) and have access to more defensive skills. Rangers, Engineers, Necros, DPS Guard and good Warriors hard counter us on any build we decide to play. Especially with the shift towards AI builds from Anet (buffing spirit weapons, leaving turrets (almost) and minion master as is, mesmer PU) excelling as a thief in pvp will only get harder from here on out. But aside from the qq, give it a month or so and someone will find a strong build again. (Personally, I am starting to use the old EU panic strike meta, 60206, which now seems to be coming back into play on NA)

Also: If Anet could realize that useless traits are useless and buffing them slightly won’t cause thieves to run them, that would be great.

This happen not first with the last patch, but since release.

Further things:
Landspeed=Warrior
Control= Warrior, Nekro, Engi
Booncounter=Mesmer, Nekro
Support=Every class
Use of stealth=Mesmer

This guide need a little update, but it’s well written.

@NinjaEd

4 (or 6) secs are a little too short I think.
I find a base time of 5 secs + 3 secs with Meld with Shadows fits better.
+3 secs with Meld with Shadows for the simple reason that thieves should be a little more special.

But reveal should run between 8 and 10 secs, after stealth.
As compensation stealth could then changed to a profession mechanic.

I see the problem more in the generally time of stealth and reveal.

Stealth is just too short to make it more than a simple spamskill and reveal is too short for the others to give them enough time to attack them, before they are stealth again. (The same for Mesmer)
Inclusive that their whole design around this mechanic make them really weak without it.

Stealth should be more an utility and not replace their whole deffense.

Jayden Ennok.3687:

Black Teagan.9215:

@Atalas

Which buffs?
Thieves get only nerfs and every buff caused in a stronger nerf after a few days.

Perhaps he meant buffs to Ripper and Deadly Strike cos you know, underwater combat is sooooooooooo important.

I know that he mean this, but two little buffs can never compensate all these nerfs in the last two years.

@Atalas

Which buffs?
Thieves get only nerfs and every buff caused in a stronger nerf after a few days.

The thief make much fun with the ini system, but it’s by far the worst and most constrained class.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

On the bright side… you’re revealed.

On the dark side…Anet doesn’t seem to care about their design mistakes.

Artaz.3819:

It was broken OP before …

In PvE you could use black powder spam and facetank/autoattack melee mobs of elite or below (or ranged mobs standing right next to them).

In stomping, it was a guaranteed stomp as long as you weren’t range interrupted.

It’s not like ANet took out stealth stomps though (which are arguably worse from a balance perspective).

It’s good that they fix that, but that is not the problem.

The problem is that they nerfed shaved down BP by 50-67% without any compensation.
No bigger field, no reduced ini costs, just nerfed shaved down.
The same crap that they do everytime.

@Grumpy

I believe you don’t know that every other class have equivalent zerkerbuilds, but with a much better deffense.

Yeah this skill is very weak.
The costs are too high now (or the field is too small) and no one, except beginners, stay in this field because the most players moving all the time and dont fight like rooted to the spot.

The same with mobs. Many attack faster than BP can apply blind.

Beside a combo to apply stealth I see no sense in the use of BP anymore.
When I have to decide between BP and PW, I would ever preference PW.

Who cares!?

yolo swaggins.2570:

vincecontix.1264:

Sanduskel.1850:

Stealth is very poorly designed in this game, making this class laughably easy. I encourage you to send respectful and persistent feedback to anet and NCSoft. Perhaps they will change stealth so that the thief class can get other fixes it dearly needs. Right now, the player base will revolt if thieves get buffed.

Hey guys b4 replying to this person please check his post history, he likes to troll a lot.

The guy hasn’t posted in 4 months. He is probably banned lol.

Whatever happened, he have right.

The most people think/say, their own class is “UP” or “Fine”, while the every other classes are “OP” or “Broken”.

Flumek.9043:

[…]
Nerf broken part of thief

Why a nerf and no fix?

…because noone use traps.

Kicast.1459:

In the other hand…what are thiefs weak against ?

Damagespikes, Conditionspikes, Every kind of CC, Any attacks if their ini pool is low/empty, groups, Immo, Daze, Stuns, Ice(semi),…

Wolfield.9812:

Eviscerate hits harder than Backstab.

Increase Backstab damage.

That argument doesn’t hold.

Backstab is already much stronger.
More expensive but more often useable, faster and harder to dodge.

Daggerstorm. It’s just a dream

(Secound one: Stomp)

Rightclick on Item—>Destroy→ Click Yes.
Problem solved.

If they nerf the burst, then it’s no burst anymore, that’s why is called burst.

They shall finally split the gamemodes and mechanics, then we hadn’t these problems.

The reason for the most thief nerfs – at least for the most “Thief is OP” Threads – is the stealth mechanic, which is overpowered but not the thief.
Stealth is also the reason why PU Mesmer are nearly unkillable.

But only because they have the most/best access to stealth, the people think the thief is the problem, but that’s just wrong. (class=!=gamemechanic)

But why is stealth so strong?
Well, I think that comes from two things.

First, that all classes was created and balanced for the PvE part of this game.

And second, that they balance now over PvP, a different game mode, with different requirements, and don’t split, between PvE and PvP (sPvP/WvW).

Except for stealth is nearly every other trait or skill underpowered.

How BrunoBRS already wrote, seems the balanceteam to be blind.
They don’t know what they do, because they can’t or wont see the real problems, which the classes have.

Have they no notion of balance, have they no notion of the classes, or is them user friendliness more important than a generally gamebalance?

I don’t know it and I don’t care a pap for it, but we and all the other classes must life with that for two years now.

Lord Hammer Hand.4815:

if you guys didnt know or dont know who this vee wee is and why he keep saying hes first rank 80, before every rank 55+ got bump to rank 80 vee wee is only rank 40+ but in the guild Fight Club he already keep saying hes rank 80 when hes actually not.

That’s no secret.
Everybody here know that Vee Wee need help from a doctor.

Skyhammer is fine, but I endorse the OP.

Dont change the cannon, but add walls to the plattform and lower/shrink the breakable shields.
But I would place two destructible reactors on the map, instead of two consols.

These two (repairable) reactors provide the cannon with energy.
If one reactor is destroyed, the cannon do half dmg with a half radius.
If both are destroyed, the skyhammer is deactivated.

Also I think a good change could be a reduce in the base damage and give skyhammer new weaponskills, which create e.g. a fire-, poison-, or icefield.

The question, which I always ask myself is:
Why is LS so good to stealing boons, while BT is crap and vigor the only reason for that trait? And this for two years.

It’s really necessary that they rework BT and make it so strong, that is dangerous enough against builds that use many boons and simultaneous to a good trait, that support your teammembers. ( And not these 5 secs, which you and they can ignore.)
Without to destroy builds, that use only a few, how it LS does before they nerf it last june.

Indeed need LS a changed too.
No boonsteal, but maybe more in the direction of a weapon, that do more damage, the more boons the others have. Inclusive a lower base damage.

Sagat.3285:

Removing downed state from pvp would make a lot of traits and a rune useless: there are people out there build to revive.

…and destroy further the teamwork.

Yeah the devs listen.
Too bad that they always listen to the wrong guys.