Guild Wars 2

Maybe, we could get a pet of a completely different family and model? Snake pets that spit at enemies?
One of the pets could be a Cobra, and its F2 spits several shots of blinding poison at foes.
Another could be an Anaconda that only attacks at close range, But Its F2 skill could be called Constrict, and it wraps around an enemy, fully immobilizing them until the enemy or player either uses a control effect to get the snake off, or they kill it?

Yoh.8469:

• As to the modes, they are exactly the same as they are now just plus one more: Defensive mode. Which is basically your pet won’t attack unless you either tell it to or your attack yourself, so your pet doesn’t go rouge all the time.
  And, it acts like and auto-return when your pet takes too much damage, so that it won’t stand in the bloody fire.
  Thou having Guard would also allow you to manually get it out of AOEs.

I still don’t understand why you are suggesting to add more programming to the pet when you are the same person who keeps saying its broken?

Yoh.8469:

• The Shouts we have now are pretty pathetic really, as they have none of the support capacity of other shouts, plus very long cooldowns for most of them.
  The command functions are the only decent part of them. An extra bit of damage or run speed isn’t worth it taking up one of your utilities slots, esp when the Ranger has much better options to choose from.

I think they would be better served as just straight commands rather then being something they are not, shouts. Imagine if Mesmers had Signets, except without the passive effect….. then they wouldn’t really be signets now would they?

Except that every class uses skills differently. A Thief Trapper and a Ranger Trapper are not using their trap skills in the same way. Why should a Ranger use their shouts the same way that Warriors and Guardians do? Like I said before, that only serves to cheapen the class. That does not make rangers stronger, that just makes them warriors with pets.

Yoh.8469:

• The fact is, without either good AI or full control over your pet, as it is your core mechanic as a Ranger, it makes the entire profession less effective the every other profession by virtue of the fact they can all control their mechanics, where as you cannot here.

From what I’ve seen you don’t have a better solution to this problem.

Except that I haven;t attempted to think of a good solution tot he problem, because wthout completely changing the fundamental way the Ranger works, There is no good Solution, they all degenerate to work arounds and short cuts, which, like I said before, do not fix the root of the problem.

Yoh.8469:

• You also suggest that Anet should just wave their magic wand and fix the AI.
  That is not going to happen. If they could, they would have already.
  Which is why the crux of my argument is the avoid the problem with AI almost entirely and just give us the commands directly.

You seem to be arguing for the status quo, buggered if I knew why.

No, I’m not suggesting that Anet wave a magic wand, atleast not yet in any of my previous posts. However, the work behind the scenes that Anet has been doing to optimize pet AI and fix server lag has helped quite a bit for the pet problem sice the game was released.

If you haven’t played that long…back in August of 2012, pets were very unresponsive no matter the command you gave them, the AI did wierd things sometimes with their skill patterns, healing when they didn’t need it, etc, and aside from the fact that pets did more damage than they do now, they were pretty terrible to use.

The main reason why I don’t want to see the pet mechanic change as much as you are suggesting is because Anet has slowly, but surely made pets better all around compared to how they were a year ago, and while Shouts do some wierd things sometimes (Sic ‘Em sometimes won’t apply the buff on pets when they are using skills. That I tested a few minutes ago and confirmed still exists), overall the experience of playing as a Ranger is BETTER.

I would rather see them (as long as it takes) fix the pet’s AI, responsiveness, etc, but until then, a work around is just a work around, its a bandaid that doesn’t fix the root of the problem, that all indication so far has shown, even Anet is willing to admit that.

Fast foward to January, 2014! Pets actually a hell of alot more responsive than it was in 2012, and their AI is a little smarter, the skill lag is a little better.

Yoh.8469:

• Now as to why I am giving up on the F2 and F4 abilities, which is a perfectly fine question, is because the F1-F4 keys are valuable real estate that added a lot of function to any given profession.
  I argue that they are better off spent on commands to control your pet, which we currently have very little control over, which is half the problem, rather then two abilities of very debatable usage.

Actually, compared to last year, you have alot of control over your pets. Try using F1 and F3 a little, your pet will actually run to and from the target all day if your press those buttons. Putting the pet into passive will cause it to stop attacking, and putting the pet into agressive will cause it to attack. These are basic commands that have slowly improved over the last year. There are still hiccups (pet will pause for a second or two sometimes while the server figures out what to do), but still, nowhere near as bad as they were.

Yoh.8469:

• I can understand why they are there, in a perfect world if the AI was actually functional then more options and variety is a great thing…. but that’s not the world we live in. The AI is shoddy at best, almost certainly never to be fixed, so fat lot of good the extra options do us when we can’t even get the pet to do something relatively simple, like not stand in the fire and eat damage.

read the above quotes. Stating that the AI will never be fixed when that is the complete opposite of the case is a total lie that Rangers need to stop spreading around.

Yoh.8469:

• Sure, some F2 abilities are useful, and some gain something from being cast at specific times, but most are not. Most pet skills are no different then normal pet skills, you gain nothing from casting them yourself.

But if I had the option between a variable utility skill of debatable usage, and a command that I can direct my pet to stand where I want it to and break it out of whatever it was doing, I’d take the command hands down, no contest.
It’s not like the pet can’t still have the skill and use it itself.

Yeah, I’d rather tell my Moa to give me fury, then switch to a stalker to give me 5 stacks of might, and do it on demand, instead of at random. I would still rather have that instead of more commands over our pet when they aren’t really needed.

Yoh.8469:

• First, no I wasn’t referring to you, but rather people in the threads you linked, who complain about pets being unresponsive which turns out to be a problem with the animation cycle. A problem that is very unlikely to be fixed, but a work around is abilities like shouts that cause them to drop what they are doing, for the most part.
  You seem to think this is a problem. But you seem to see everything as a problem, so who’s counting at this point.

Well, actually, Anet never said they won’t fix pet AI, and they have yet to say that it is very unlikely to be fixed. Here are the two specific quotes from John Peters from a few months ago:::

Summoned creature AI is a different can of worms that we aren’t opening for the same reason. Pets that delay F2 use isn’t some wait script we put into their skills it has to do with core AI behavior shared by all pets and creatures and how they decide tasks. Rewriting that has the risks of breaking millions of unknown things so we have up until now band aided the solution. It is something that needs addressing but won’t be addressed until we can kitten how and when we will test it.

JonPeters.5630:

Since you asked so nicely. The underwater skill is an instant skill which doesn’t not require the AI to change it’s think state, as it can fire off during other actions. The land skill plumbs into our animation system which requires the drake to change it think state and execute a new order to the animation system. Both AI think state and animation can’t be running 100% of the time on every creature on the server for obvious reasons (it would create massive CPU usage and generate tons of skill lag) Animations are masked by client side blending, but the AI stuff has no way to be masked. We can make special cases for Ranger Pet F2, but doing so requires time and testing.

the important parts are in bold print. And,….I don’t get why so many people think that the statement he made automatically means that they can’t fix pets, and they won’t fix pets. They haven’t even said that its very unlikely to be fixed. And I would also like to refer all of you to this post::: Official State of Skill lag and Server Optimization

That post is actually pretty important, because it tells us that for months they have been optimizing skill lag (including what I am assuming are skill lag problems with pets as well)

yeah….I’m a rebel. I don’t use bows at all. I don’t even use swords. I use Axe/Torch and Axe/Warhorn, and in my most recent build, I use traps and rampager gear w. Elementalist runes. Tell me how many people use that setup?

…Although I do agree. Both the bows need some work so they have a clearly defined role in combat, instead of being all over the place.

WAYS TO IMPROVE PETS, AND MAKING THEM MORE THREATENING THAN A MEAT BAG, Part 1
None of these are very specific, nor is this a combined suggestion.

(1) Shout Improvements (aside from programming improvements)
Shouts are like Commands, because you are telling your pet to do something. Unfortunately your poor animal companion will have a tendency to ignore you when its getting itself feared, dazed, stunned, etc, making some of those shouts useless for a short time after you activate them. It is made worse by the fact that you can’t see conditions on your pet unless you have it selected. So, aside from making the millionth suggestion asking for our pet’s conditions to be displayed all the time…..Wouldn’t it make sense for a Shout, a command from the Master, to snap a pet out of its fear or confusion, and keep on attacking? So, here is what I am suggesting::: Add a Trait to Beastmastery or Nature Magic (the two traitlines with a shout trait each) call it Master’s Voice, It breaks stuns on your pet, and removes a condition whenever you use a Shout skill. This would also allow shout builds to get overall more useful.

Yoh.8469:

First, build a bridge and get over yourself.
Why would I care about referencing you of all people. Esp when you seem utterly incapable of making a coherent augment, or at least understanding mine.
(because I don’t understand how for the life of me you contorted these problems out of my suggestion)

You mean, you didn’t say this after quoting my post?

Yoh.8469:

I don’t see how ‘drop what your doing and do as I say’ is a bad thing for pets.
People complain that they are not responsive enough, now they’re too responsive?

It’s kind the bloody point. You want your pet to do what you want it to, instead of relying on it own, clearly inept AI.

And also, let me go on ahead and first admit that I have terrible spelling. And let me also bring up every single issue I have with your proposal:::

• You said that we only have 2 pet commands, when that isn’t the case. We have the following :::: ((1)F1 – Attack my Target, (2)F2 – Pet Special Attack, (3)F3 – Return to me, (4)unassigned – Passive/Agressive behavior), I’m not including F4 pet swap or the Stow/Activate pet option since those aren;t really commands, but I will include up to three of these ::: (Sic ’Em, Guard, Protect Me, Search and Rescue). The minimum number of pet commands you have is 4 at any time, with the potential to have as many as 7 if you use your utility skills for that. (pet command being something you tell your pet to do or how you tel your pet to act. Thats my definition of it that I’m using)

• Why get rid of the Pet’s F2 skill? The one pet skill we have control over? I would rather like to have control over when my wolf uses its fear attack. I would also rather have control over when my Fern hound gives me that crucial healing when I need it. Allowing the pet to cast those on their own means they are casting it at random, which means that they might not be casted at the best moment, they could be casted at the worst, or even wasted opportunities.

• While I agree that pets could use more skills if done right, why get rid of two pets, and bring it down to 1? Isn’t that limiting the options Rangers have, even if you give that one pet more skills to work with?

• I misunderstood your earlier post about just simply moving the shouts to the Rangers pet bar, because you said you were just rolling the shouts into pet commands. But, why get rid of those 4 shouts all together as ‘shout’ skills? Sic ‘Em for example gives a 10 second buff that increases a pet’s movement and attack speed by 40%. Guard gives a pet 10 seconds of stealth and protection. While the AI makes doesn’t exactly make those skills optimal, they are still very useful skills. Why get rid of those for new skills that just apply buffs to you and allies and conforms to what Warriors and Guardians already do? That would just serve to cheapen the class.

• as far as Passive, Agressive, Defensive……Passive is already a little conditional because you can order your pet to attack out of that state. So would it act with a Defensive AI or an Agressive AI? Or are you suggestiong that we get rid of the ability to pick what target our pet attacks also? You are also suggesting to add new AI routines to the pet (defensive state), which we all know the pet AI, isn’t exactly in the best way it could be right now. Why not instead expand the pet’s current AI so it tries to do a little Self preservation in addition to its current skill pattern (like what the new enemies in the Living world do right now?)(and you even say that the pet has clearly Inept AI)

• (“The shouts themselves could be reworked entirely into your ordinary shouts that give boons to allies, like the Warrior and Guardian shouts do.”) I had no idea what you originally meant by that, until your later post clarified that you wanted to add new shouts. But, what’s wrong with the 4 we have now? They are a little lessened in their effect because ofhow the AI works in this game, but like I asked earlier, how is adding shouts that work exactly the same as the Warrior and Guardian going to not cheapen the Ranger profession into just being “A warrior with a pet”?

• the one thing I do agree with , is that pet skills should be expanded on a little, not to give pets more uncontrollable options, but to give the AI more options. Making the pet smarter like how the recent enemy additons from the living world are smarter will make our animal companions all around more dangerous and harder to kill, which would actually force players to decide between killing the pet first, or going straight to the ranger.

I’m going to leave it at that for now.

VERTICAL PROGRESSION AND PETS
(For these examples, I am assuming that pets are scaled with Exotic gear)
(I will also be using my Fern Hound Leafey, as my pet example)

This suggestion is to introduce a way that we can slightly increase our pet’s stats through a leveling and growth point system, so that way, their stats increase slightly to signify that they are now equal with ascended stats, and it also lets us customize out pet’s stats a little more.

For the Leveling System:::

• Pets have 5 Growth Levels
• Experience to level up is equal to what a level 80 character needs to level up. This makes it easier for level 80 characters to grow their pets faster for WvW and dungeons. It also makes pets stay a particular level for lower level characters longer so they learn how the pet works instead of all of them being tanks, meatshields, and dps gods at the same time.
• Pet Stats scale to the Ranger’s Level, But, you can spend a Growth Point to increase the stats of your pet slightly (which the next system describes)

Growth Point System:::

• Pets Start out with 1 Growth Point.
• Pets gain one Growth Point as they level up, for a maximum of 5.
• You can invest these growth points into any Pet Stat (Power, Precision, Toughness, Vitality, Critical Damage, Healing Power, Condition Damage, Boon Duration, Condition Duration, Agony Resistance)
• 1 Growth Point could Raise Power, Precision, Toughness, Vitality, Healing Power, Condition Damage by 50 Points, for a Maximum of 250 points.
• 1 Growth Point could Raise Critical Damage, Condition Duration, Boon Duration, by 5%. Also Agony Resistance by 5 points. Maximum is 25.
• It seems like a tiny, almost meaningless stat increase, but, it could be the equal of Ascended Stats, assuming that pets are scaled to Exotic gear.
• These Values idealy should be saved to the 4 individual pets that you have with you. You should also be able to reset Growth Points as long as you are out of combat, either by investing 1 of your own skill points, or for the longer way by buying a reset from a profession trainer, making them more like trait points for your pet.

Example a Juvenile Fern Hound at Level 80, and a Growth of 5 has these stats:::

• Power : 1718
• Precision : 1374
• Toughness : 2061
• Vitality : 2061
• Healing Power : 250 (invested 5 Growth Point)
• All other values are 0.

Example Lets make it with 30 points in Beastmastery, 25 stacks of Master’s Bond, and Compassion Training (for the healing power)(maximum possible stats)

• Power : 2218
• Precision : 1874
• Toughness : 2561
• Vitality : 2561
• Healing Power : 600 (invested 5 Growth Point + 350 healing power from trait)
• All other values are 0.

Example Lets use the Jungle Stalker now. Growth Level 5, maximum possible stats through Beastmastery and Master’s Bond, and Pet’s Prowess.

• Power : 1,874
• Precision : 2,561
• Toughness : 1,874
• Vitality : 2,561
• Critical Damage : 55% (25 from growth point, 30 from Pet’s Prowess)

This way, your pet that heals now heals better than it did before, making it’s role a little more defined. The pet that is DPS focused will be more DPS focused than it was before. Anyone have an idea or sugestion for this? It is the only way I could think of for having a Vertical progression system work for pets without making them too powerful.

Yoh.8469:

Chrispy.5641:

Shouts themselves have issues of their own related to AI, that need to be worked out before the major overhaul you suggested. The problem is that all 4 of them cancel whatever action the pet is doing at the time, and it does the conditions of the Shout. It kind of gives the pet a different AI routine for a short time.

• For example, “Sick ’em” will pull your pet out of Guard, pull your pet out of Protect me, pull your pet out of Search and Rescue, and pull it out of the Passive State. That’s actually a good thing because you want your pet to be doing what you are telling it what to do.
• The problem is that “Sick ’em” also pulls your pet out of its current attacking pattern. It will sometimes kick the pet out of using its F2 skill, or any skill it was using currently. The only time it doesn’t seem to cancel what a pet is doing is when its not doing anything at all, and every other time except for this, it makes the pet stand there, looking like an idiot for a second or two, while the server thinks about the commands you gave, then does whatever it was going to do with the Pet’s AI.
• The command also ends prematurely under way too many conditions. Its obvious that it should be the case if another shout is used, you switch pets, or the pet dies, but why if the Target becomes invisible(stealth)?, or when you kill a specific enemy (Was the shout being used on the pet, or your target?)

That’s just with Sick ’em, the other three shouts also have some issues of their own, but nowhere near as bad, and I want to take a wild guess that the problem is because of how the AI and the Server works in this game.

I don’t see how ‘drop what your doing and do as I say’ is a bad thing for pets.
People complain that they are not responsive enough, now they’re too responsive?

It’s kind the bloody point. You want your pet to do what you want it to, instead of relying on it own, clearly inept AI.
By integrating the shouts into the command themselves, we’d have a heck of a lot more control over our pets which would largely rectify the problems with them.
It doesn’t have to be perfect, just functional.

And this would also free up the shouts to be redesigned into support utility skills that are actually useful/practical to use.

I see nothing but win in this.

I see nothing but Lose in an idea that only moves broken skills from one place to another without addressing the problems and limitations that they have. And I am assuming that when you said Some people you were refering to me? I know I wrote that its a good thing that shouts will force a pet into a new attack pattern, did you not read that?

I did do some testing on Sick ‘Em because I haven’t used it much since the last time they updated the skill, and many of the things I described no longer exist. Anet actually did fix the AI loopholes in that skill, but it still ends way too early under many conditions, all related to when the pet loses its target (enemy stealths, it attacks someone else, enemy gains too much distance, enemy dies, etc.), So, you could be addressing those instead of accusing me of wanting ‘less’ control over my pet, which is totally not the case at all.

If we’re done with that, I want to say that moving all our shouts to the Pet bar, and introducing even more Shouts as you suggested is going to make things way too complex. You can’t stack Ranger Shouts because all of them are basically pet commands, so, having 3 and being a shout ranger is manageable, but, having access to 6 at a time? It makes sens for those new shouts to affect your pet, since you are a pet class, and It gives much more options for commanding your pet, but at the same time, it limits you. There’s also the condition removal from Soldier’s Runes to consider as well for giving Rangers access to 6 shouts at a time.

Your proposal is sound, but there are issues like that, that should be brought up and workes on until your proposal is air tight, but for now, its not and I am just giving you suggestions to build on your proposal until it reaches a level where there is no question about it being too OP, not powerful enough, not addressing obvious issues it would have, etc.

Sube Dai.8496:

Exactly. Brown bear F2 for example, if it was an on demand shout, who cares if it cancels what the bear is currently doing? You want it for the on-demand condition removal.

Also who cares about interrupting the pet skills we have no control over anyway, its not like we know when they are using them!

Actually, no, the part that I put in bold is 100% wrong. You should know what your pet is doing, and which of its attacks it is using at any given time. There is an issue or two with some pets, because they attack too fast (cats and dogs) and some of their animations are similar (dogs and birds), but you should still be able to distinguish which pet attack is which.

For example, the Wolf::::

• When you use its F2, it will get in range of an enemy, then Howl
• For its Autoattack, it simply bites.
• For its Crippling Leap, it Leaps at the target to cripple them, from a short range(130)
• For its Brutal Charge, it Leaps at the target to knock them down, from a medium range (350). Brutal Charge also has a short activation, while Crippling leap is nearly instant.

And the thing about the wolf is that you want to time its 2 leap attacks for combo finishers. You can very easily give it Fire/Frost armor, or extra healing. The healing is the important part. The difference in timing and animation is also important so enemy players can time their dodges to get away from a control effect (such as Brutal Leap’s knockdown)

You can also break down how the drake works, and you should be able to very easily tell when its about to do its blast finisher to time heals, might, and other effects.

Durzlla.6295:

Only flaw with it being on the ranger and falling off when you go down is it loses a HUGE advantage, and that’s a fully buffed pet mauling your enemys face while you’re in downed state… keep in mind you have 5pts in BM so it’ll also have quickness…

I’d say if it is tied to the ranger make it so that it ONLY drops off if the pet is the one to die, not the ranger.

I agree with that. The language in my earlier post wasn’t very clear, so I changed it a little bit, so it will read ’when your pet dies or you are defeated, not downed, the stacks get removed.

Yoh.8469:

The F4 will change to reflect whatever mode the pet is in.

• Aggressive: Sic em This commands your pet to run faster and catch a target, using any knock downs or snares it might have. For some pets this might include skills that Reveal the enemy. (namely, pets have a skill that this command activates, one for each mode)
• Defensive: Protect Me, commands the pet to use whatever defensive/support abilities it has.
• Passive: Search and Rescue, commands the pet to revive any nearby allies, or if should you go down, to immediately begin reviving you.

Naturally this command has it’s own cooldown to prevent spamming.
The shouts themselves could be reworked entirely into your ordinary shouts that give boons to allies, like the Warrior and Guardian shouts do.

-
With this, the Ranger would have much more direct control over their pet, supplementing for what it’s AI lacks.

Shouts themselves have issues of their own related to AI, that need to be worked out before the major overhaul you suggested. The problem is that all 4 of them cancel whatever action the pet is doing at the time, and it does the conditions of the Shout. It kind of gives the pet a different AI routine for a short time.

• For example, “Sick ’em” will pull your pet out of Guard, pull your pet out of Protect me, pull your pet out of Search and Rescue, and pull it out of the Passive State. That’s actually a good thing because you want your pet to be doing what you are telling it what to do.
• The problem is that “Sick ’em” also pulls your pet out of its current attacking pattern. It will sometimes kick the pet out of using its F2 skill, or any skill it was using currently. The only time it doesn’t seem to cancel what a pet is doing is when its not doing anything at all, and every other time except for this, it makes the pet stand there, looking like an idiot for a second or two, while the server thinks about the commands you gave, then does whatever it was going to do with the Pet’s AI.
• The command also ends prematurely under way too many conditions. Its obvious that it should be the case if another shout is used, you switch pets, or the pet dies, but why if the Target becomes invisible(stealth)?, or when you kill a specific enemy (Was the shout being used on the pet, or your target?)

That’s just with Sick ’em, the other three shouts also have some issues of their own, but nowhere near as bad, and I want to take a wild guess that the problem is because of how the AI and the Server works in this game.

almost USELESS PET TRAIT
I’m starting with this since its kind of easy to address the issues with this….

Specifically MASTER’S BOND
Its a pretty nice trait to take around when you aren’t planning to switch out your pet, because it adds 200 to all it’s primary stats when maxed out. That is Cool! But, There are problems with the Trait…..

• Going into water resets the stacks.
• Switching pets resets the stacks.
• This Trait does not play very well with other Ranger traits, specifically These ::: (Loud Whistle, Vigorous Training, Zephyr’s Speed)

- This trait is very restricting on what you can do for build variety because it requires that you only ever have one pet out, and you also can’t enter the water. This is a problem in WvW because you can’t play very long without having to enter the water.
- There are reasons for that, because the stacks are saved on the pet, and once you switch a pet, it doesn’t maintain anything, so those stacks kind of disapear whenever your pet is switched, deactivated, etc.
- Its a nice Trait in PvP since you gain 5 stacks each time you kill someone, but everywhere else, you have to kill something 25 times, very slowly building your pet back up…because you had to swim across a tiny body of water to get somewhere else.
- It also locks you out of the effective ability to use Zephyr’s speed, and Vigorous Training. It also makes the minor trait Loud Whistle utterly pointless because your build isn’t based on actively switching out your pet.

- How would I fix it, to make it better all around?….

• Have Master’s Bond stack on the Ranger instead of the Pet (without affecting the Ranger in any other way).
• Then have the game check for how many stacks the Ranger has, and it gives the appropriate stat bonus to the pet. (example, You have 5 stacks of Master’s bond, pet gets a 40 point stat boost to all its primary stats) Yes, it means that all four of your pets will share the stat bonus from Master’s bond even when switching your pets out, but here’s where that should differ.
• Whenever a pet dies (or you go into the Defeated state (not Down)), Remove all stacks of Master’s bond.
• If the trait is set up like that, it would remove the problems of the stacks getting removed by having to swim in water, because they are maintained on the Ranger.
• It will also encourage players to take Vigorous Training and Zephyr’s Speed with Master’s Bond, and won’t render Loud Whistle useless if you decide to trait Master’s Bond.
• It will encourage Rangers to actively switch their pets before the pet dies, not only to keep the cooldown low when switching, but to also keep the stacks of Master’s Bond Maintained.

I cannot possibly see how that would make Rangers OP in any way. It might make taking advantage of Beastmastery a little more desirable. And I can only see more options being opened up when traiting down Beastmastery.

That’s it for now. Expect to see a writeup this afternoon/evening on Vertical Progression as it relates to pets, what I like and don’t like, and my suggestions for it. On Thursday I want to address some limitations/bugs with Signets and Shouts and how they could be improved, and on Friday, I want to say a few things about Horizontal Progression with Pets. On Saturday, I am going to throw out some random suggestions on pets.

Also, Post your opinions on pets. Even if Anet doesn’t read this specific thread, I will be posting links and bringing it up every single time a relevant CDI comes up in the General forums. Even if all you want to post is…

I Hate Pets
/15 chars…

go for it!

PART 3 : SUMMARY OF IDEAS PART 2
full length Proposals current to this Thread

• Yoh gave us a Proposal to completely redo the way the pet works, its skills, commands, and our shout skills.
• I have an idea for Vertical Pet Progression.
• I have an idea for making Master’s Bond a more desirable Trait (see below post).
• Making Pets More Threatening than a Meat Bag part 1, part 2

PART 2 : SUMMARY OF IDEAS PART 1
This Post will gather all links to specific Player ideas and observations in this thread and other past threads as it relates to pets (may take time to get the links to other threads, going back to atleast December on this section)

Current Ranger Threads in the Balance Forum as it relates to Pets

• Ranger Balance[PvP][WvW][PvE][PvX]
• [PVE][Ranger Pet]The Handicap
• [PVE]Ranger pet issue solution

This is an Idea thread for Ranger Pets, just to get them all in one place….

CONTENTS (seperated by Post)
(1) Links to Dev posts
(2) Summary of Ideas Part 1
(3) Summary of Ideas Part 2

PART 1 : LINKS TO DEV POSTS
This Post will gather links to all past dev posts from the last three months as it relates to pets, and will also any future posts relating to Pets until I run out of space. This way, everyone can see what the current Anet opinion is on pets.

(1) John Peters (Game Design Lead) explains how Pet AI works, and why it’s difficult to change.
(2) The Developer Livestream : Ready Up on Friday had some info on Ranger Balance. While none of it was pet specific (except for fixing an Empathic Bond bug), they did say that there are “some pretty amazing stuff comming for the ranger, and we’re really looking foward to it, but we can’t say what it is just yet.” (direct quote)

(I searched as far back as October 15th, 2013, and yes, there has been only one post specifically for Ranger Pets. As far as Rangers go, theres been a few posts about how overpowered specific ranger traits were, but not much else. In Anet’s Defense though, that one post does explain rather well why Pet AI works the way it does and why up until now, they have only been applying bandaids.)

I will be updating this post in the future with anything else the devs post that concerns Rangers and their pets

Gulesave.5073:

1. Pets. Pet acquisition is a fitting, (if late), topic for this thread. However, as this CDI is about progression, I recommend that further discussion of any perceived problems with current mechanics or balance would do better in the Ranger subforum.

I’m working on/starting a thread with a focus on Ranger pets, that I will be specifically posting in the Ranger Forum Early Tomorrow Morning. In it so far are details that cover the following:::

• Horizontal Progression (pet aquisition and looks, skill selection among pets)
• Vertical Progression (pet stat scaling with Rare to Exotic and Ascended gear)
• Pet AI stuffs…. (Not my expertise, but its pet related)
• Pet Skills/ Shouts/ Signet/ Trait balance and suggestions (what works, what doesn;t, what could be done in the future, etc.)

If Ranger Players agree with everything, then I will post all the balance related stuff in the subforum that handles it, and the rest of the proposal in a future CDI thread. The problem is that many Rangers have just stopped posting and caring because of the lack of red in the Ranger subforums, so there wont be many replies there unless it a “I hate Anet” Thread (which it won’t be!) . personally, I see that as an utterly Lame excuse to stop caring, and I will be creating that thread tomorrow even if one person replies.

I am posting this here so that way anyone who is interested in Rangers, by even the smallest amount, to go there tomorrow and read that thread. Even if you Hate Rangers and everything they stand for, go read that thread tomorrow anyways!

ZeftheWicked.3076:

Ranger is supposed to be about skilled and challenging gameplay by managing two characters (you and pet), not just one. And pet ward is as simple to activate and deactivate as tapping one button.

Aegis on the other hand might sound simple, but offers far to little protection to be meaningful. It protects only from one single hit! How will that protect your pet against:

• big aoe that rather then hit once, hit few times but too fast to walk out of it on time anyway
• Killer damage 1 hit aoe rings, but with tendency to overlap way too much* unblockable skills, or multihit targetted skills, such as risen illusionist’s mesmer beam

To name a few things where aegis just doesn’t get the job done.

@Castaliea.3156

Glad you see the aegis shortcomings, but your idea also has major hole. Were a trait like that put in there, then there would be no flexability. You’d have rangers who took it, and “pet corpse providers” that did not. Any build without it would be considered “idiot’s choice” without a right to exist.

How is tying it to a trait any different from what Companion’s Defense is now?

Can’t we all just wait until After the thing gets released for people to complain about it?

Chris Whiteside.6102:

By the way moving forward (and we can discuss this in the CDI Process Evolution topic) I would like you guys to nominate someone to build the Proposal on behalf of us all.

Due to the Red Swash on the left it seems some are getting confused with Promise vs. Proposal and I just think it would be healthy to do it this way anyway.

Chris

I Nominate Bezagron if he’s up for it. He’s managed to stay mostly neutral this whole thread when he was writing those summaries. Not only that, but he somehow managed to read every single post in this thread and come up with a 1 sentence summary on almost every single suggestion/proposal in this thread. That’s just crazy and awesome at the same time!

Also, I took screenshots incase a player tries to say that “Kitten Anet broke their promises to add (housing)!!!!”

I don’t see the difference between a patch that is released all at once, and a dozen patches a year that release the exact same thing, but, I guess people will always find something to be angry about.

Chris Whiteside.6102:

….snip….

Cool!!!!! Can’t wait for the next thread to open up!

(And if anyone still doesn’t ‘get the point’ when it comes to subclasses, or role diversification(which was the point), I will be there if/when a CDI based on sub-classes (or role diversification in general) gets opened to show you how it could work!)

I use Axe/Axe and Greatsword in a Trap Build when roaming.

Also, here’s the most noob (and also one of the laziest) of shortbow builds that everyone should know about ::: You should take Rampager or Rabid gear and a Shortbow. Add in Sharpened Edges from Skirmishing, Keen Edge from Marksmanship, and an Earth Sigil. Depending on easily controlled circumstances (and some not controllable at all), your shortbow can have up to 4 bleeds stack each hit on its autoattack before you ever consider utility skills, pets, or your Elite.

(Two hours of reading later to catch up from where I left off last night……this thread is starting to get MASSIVE!!!!!)

As far as Mounts go, what if they were Cosmetic? Like the Enchaned Broom or the Sonic Tunneling Tool you bought in the Gem Store,. Like what was said before, the ability we already have to travel around the game world quickly, just completely trivializes Mounts. (And if your riding on a War steed, don’t kick us into town clothes, but keep us in our armor.)

Also, GW1 had parts of the game where you had to ride a Mount, in this case, a Junundu Wurm so you could get past parts of the map. What if we had areas of Tyria in Guild Wars 2 that were like that?

@ Bezagron.7352
Once again, Good freaking job! I don’t even want to think about how long it took you to summarize 52 pages of this stuff!

…Also, since the talk of subclasses is still going on, I would like to take the opportunity to shamelessly post a link to my subclass idea that I posted earlier last week. Maybe some of you will get an idea or two out of it.

There’s also dialogue where Marjory talks about ‘E’, and that she got a message warning her of bad things to come…..I still think ‘E.’ is Evon.

MRA.4758:

While I agree with your position that no one should argue like she is speaking for everybody else, I’d like to encourage you to not discard the problematic points addressed by Shakkara so lightly. I, for one, am also not thrilled at the thought of a subclass specialization system for GW2.

There are very valid arguments in Shakkara’s post:

• A subclass makes you follow the template provided by a game designer, instead of helping the player to invent original builds for her character.

That depends on the aquisition of said subclass, and whether ot not it forces you to play that percieved template. There have been several proposals out there that reduces subclasses to nothing more than a title that you get for completing all the content and gaining all the new skills/weapons related to a subclass.

MRA.4758:

• Subclass exclusive content in very inefficient to build since, say, 23 out of 3*8=24 players would not benefit from that content. You should recognize this argument, since this was the exact same reason Anet stated for dropping the idea of profession exclusive skill challenges.

Again, this argument has already been addressed multiple times. You can have 80 Skill Challenges that every profession can take on for loot and skill points, but any single profession will only learn a new skill out of 10 of those. No one would be locked out of something like that.

MRA.4758:

The “tasks of acquisition” do bear the risk of being fun for the first or second time, but might end up becoming a chore or grind, eventually.

Unless Anet reworks and reupdates everything every 6 months, everything you do is going to get stale after the 3rd or 4th time through. There is no stopping that in a videogame without investing a massive amount of resources in keeping it fresh.

MRA.4758:

I still haven’t seen a single proposal of a subclass specialization system that actually helps to improve build diversity. From what I have seen it might be far more likely that such a system rather fences you in and forces you to take particular roles. (“hey, bro, if you’re a ranger/druid then you have to make a toughness/healing power build, everything else is just plain stupid!!!1!”)

I’m going to have to call you out on this one, because like I said after the first quote I gave you, there have been a number of porposals that address the issue of Shoehorning, Pigeonholing, and just plain forcing someone into a new build and getting rid of it.

….Then again, the same thing happens every 4 months when a new balance patch gets put out or the rare skill gets put into the game. Therefore, your argument seems more for never changing anything than trying to inroduce more build diversity.

Hence, I would rather like to see a form of horizontal progression that helps to generate more viable spec combinations for all classes, instead of a system that might lock you into a fixed and/or preconceived role.

And like I said above, the very act of introducing a balance patch or introducing one new skill (while it is going to generate more viable spec combinations), it will also force alot of players into new roles and builds they are not comfortable with. In a game, you can’t escape that unless nothing ever gets updated from the start (such as Call of Duty). So how is introducing several skills of the same theme at once going to be any different from a balance patch (other than (Well, kitten! thats not what I thought a Druid was!!!)?

Screw new pets in the same family! I want a new family of pets! I want to wear a Beehive as a back item and use that for a pet! It doesn’t attack for much, but it always provides a constant stream of Torment

Its F2 could be that it throws out a bunch of Honeycombs on the ground, and you can pick them up curing a condition or something.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Chrispy.5641:

Also, While the Blizzard effects in the Misty Mountain were cheap and had a giant fog overlay and just messed up everything, the updated snow effects in Forochel were probably the best I ever saw at the time, and it still equals, if not passes some games today (such as Skyrim)

Been in a blizzard with lots of wind (a native Ohioan though I live elsewhere now) so I could believe a blizzard where visibility was reduced to near zero even standing in shelter if the wind could carry snow anywhere near you.

Also been in rainstorms where it was unsafe to drive because visibility was reduced to less than “Minimum Assured Safe Distance”.

Really not keen on anything close to that mixing into my game unless I have ways of turning off the visual weather effects

Yeah, definitely. I think that if there’s one aspect of a game where the real world should always ‘look’ more realistic, its in the weather effects.

(Also, Ohio? Pfft….Try the NE Florida/SE Georgia area. There is no worse area in the country when it comes to rain.)

Yoh.8469:

Given the Elite Signet some even more though, namely in regards to WvW, I don’t think we should have the idea contorted to fit with WvW honestly broken model.

Here’s what I mean. The core of this idea is about going on a journey to gain new skills.
But in WvW there is no journey, for anything. It’s not designed for that, everything from one point to another is pretty much a straight line on fairly flat terrain, and no real mobs to speak of.

Now if it was more like Edge of the Mists, which actually has decent terrain and effects, throw in a few PvE elements like roaming randomized elite/champion mobs, then this system should work just fine.
The Elite Signet idea shouldn’t be changed to fit in with a badly design game mode, but rather wait until WvW catches up. Until then, tough luck I say.

Using a Signet of Capture in PvE or any game mode doesn’t exactly scream “Journey” to me if all the skills can be aquired in an afternoon. Temporary and Living World stuff should be able to be accomplished that quickly (and mostly, it is). Permanent content should be designed to take significantly longer. I’m not saying an epic 50+ hour investment for one measily skill, but doing a 2-3 hour long task sounds alot cooler than buying a signet of capture, then getting your skill ten minutes later.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

…snip…

We don’t even need Anet if you answer everything for them! (nah, good job. Answering questions that someone knows the answer too leaves Anet time to answer the ones we don’t know.)

1, pt. 1 – Guess I should’ve looked harder for that one, because I remember seeing it somewhere, but, since that is answered, I’m still wondering about Part 2 of that question though… (and together, those two answers will probably ask a dozen more questions than it has answers to….)

3 – Oh Come on! We’ve killed as many of them as we’ve killed undead! They have to be as desperate for their survival as the Krait!….maybe we’ll see Scarlet create the Skritt-Dragoon Alliance in the future! (also that link you gave me is saying “this account has been suspended”, but I haven’t been on that website before…)

4. – Fair enough….I guess I’ll reword the question then….
Why don’t we see Horses in Tyria, Elona, or Cantha?

snow.8097:

can please someone explain me the meaning of the stat combo “Magi”?
I cant find anything about it. Does it mean Magic? Or Mage? Every stat Combo Name is Logical for me but that is…idk…

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Magi is a (Latin, I think) term used to refer to magic users – no different than Mage, Wizard, etc.

Relevant bit from Wikipedia:::

Magi (/?me?d?a?/; Latin plural of magus; Ancient Greek: ????? magos; Old Persian: ???????????????? maguš, Persian: ???? mogh; English singular magian, mage, magus, magusian, magusaean; Kurdish: manji) is a term, used since at least the 6th century BC, to denote followers of Zurvanism or Zoroaster. The earliest known usage of the word Magi is in the trilingual inscription written by Darius the Great, known as the Behistun Inscription.

Starting later, presumably during the Hellenistic period, the word Magi also denotes followers of what the Hellenistic chroniclers incorrectly associated Zoroaster with, which was – in the main – the ability to read the stars, and manipulate the fate that the stars foretold.[citation needed] However, Old Persian texts, pre-dating the Hellenistic period, refer to a Magus as a Zurvanic, and presumably Zoroastrian, priest.

So, yeah, In a fantasy sense, Magic user.

Beldin.5498:

Chrispy.5641:

Beldin.5498:

People wanted weather in EQ2, when they added it mostly it was just depressing rainy weather. Also i played in Lotro while it was raining for over 1 hour and had really headaches after that. And then there was that Snowstorm in Lotro where i couldn’t see my own feet .. of course mobs had mo problem to see and attack me.

All in all these things were always just plain annoying, so i say thanks but no.

So, you get hit with a snow storm, and enemies, who live and grew up in that climate, have no problem seeing you? How is that any different from a Cat being able to see better than you at night?

Its a game .. a game for me should be fun .. and it was NO FUN to run around in a mess like this for me :

Now hold on for a second! I too played LOTRO. For the Time (even though you could time a rainstorm to the time of day), the rain effects were very well done. Because of how collisions were done in that game, Turbine was able to make rain fully volumetric, and it would create a small splash and disapear whenever it hit an object. You could actually take shelter under an overhang under a bridge, a rock, etc, and it wouldn’t be raining there, but would still be raining everywhere else.

That took a huge load of resources on the server to accomplish, but years later, that is still the standard for which I measure weather effects today in any videogame. It was very immersion breaking even in Skyrim when you walk under an overhang or something, and its snowing/raining through the rocks and hitting you still. (Guild Wars 2 probably has internal switches set that tones down the snow/rain/etc before entering a cave, then turns it off completely, which still seems like a workaround, but it atleast doesn’t break the feeling of being in a fictional world.)

Also, While the Blizzard effects in the Misty Mountain were cheap and had a giant fog overlay and just messed up everything, the updated snow effects in Forochel were probably the best I ever saw at the time, and it still equals, if not passes some games today (such as Skyrim)

Back to the Guildwars 2 side, I wasn’t suggesting that Anet makes the weather effects to the point that a Blinding Blizzard actually fully block your view of the screen or anything, because there is already a certain amount of special effect overload in parts of the game as it is. I was more making suggestions that the weather actually affects your (and Enemies) ability to do combat to a small degree.

Beldin.5498:

People wanted weather in EQ2, when they added it mostly it was just depressing rainy weather. Also i played in Lotro while it was raining for over 1 hour and had really headaches after that. And then there was that Snowstorm in Lotro where i couldn’t see my own feet .. of course mobs had mo problem to see and attack me.

All in all these things were always just plain annoying, so i say thanks but no.

So, you get hit with a snow storm, and enemies, who live and grew up in that climate, have no problem seeing you? How is that any different from a Cat being able to see better than you at night?

Question 1, part 1
The lore concerning Grenth is not very clear. In the Wiki, it says that Grenth was the child of Dwayna and a Mortal, but its difficult to find any reference to that specifically in either game. So, Was he a god from birth, or did he start out as a mortal half-god (or just mortal) until he defeated Dhuum and took his place? And was his father a human?

Question 1, part 2
The ways that Grenth and Kormir ascended to Godhood seem different. Kormir absorbed all of Abaddon’s power and became a Goddess that way. Grenth however, seemed like he just kicked Dhuum out, put him in a prison, and moved in to party for eternity with his Seven Reapers. So, Why didn’t Grenth destroy Dhuum and take all his power?

Question 2
We know that a new race is a possibility in the future, Is there any Technical or Lore limitation as far as what race you are willing to work on and add to the game? (such as Centaurs, Hylek, Kodan, Tengu, or Largos)

Question 3
Speaking of Centaurs….Humans are beating them back, we’ve killed every Centaur Champion that tried to get in our way, and with the Charr treaty, they aren’t going to be fighting two wars anymore (that we know aside from Scarlet’s crazyness), and the Outcast Qindova was basically banished for suggesting peace. Are Centaurs just that stubborn and prideful and unable to accept defeat at the hands of someone with two less legs than them? Or is there something happening off-camera that we just don’t quite know about yet?

Question 4
I’m sure this has been asked before, but I couldn’t find any specific developer response…. Why are Horses Extinct in Tyria?

(2) – Weather Related Events for Harder Mega Bosses
- For This example, I will be using Jormag.
- The Fight with Jormag is exactly the same as it always is. No changes actually need to be made
- A New event Chain can be added though Where the Sons of Svanir are Building Icy Spires for their Lord Jormag so it can create a Corrupted Storm that will cover all of Frostgorge Sound.

• This event starts immediately after the Claw of Jormag is defeated, and it ends when it appears again.
• In This event, there are 4 locations across the map, where the Sons of Svanir are Constructing the Towers. Whenever a New Tower is Built, a new event pops up, telling everyone that they need to destroy the tower. They go there, fighting off lots of Dragon minions, and also attempting to destroy the tower using Pact Weaponry, Kodan magic, etc.
• Completing each event awards 5-9 Dragonite Ore once a day, so there is incentive to do the event, but they are group events, and will require a 5 man team atleast to clear.
• Destroying a Tower clears the area of Dragon minions until the next time the Claw of Jormag is defeated.

• When the First Tower is Built, it applies a Map Wide effect called the:::
• Storm of Corruption – "Jormag’s Minions are hard at work bringing their icy grip over Frostgorge Sound. Dragon Minions take 10% less Damage, and Deal 10% more Damage to you.

• As more Towers are Built, the Storm gets worse, and the effect increases by 10% each time, until all 4 Towers are built and the Effect becomes:::
• Blizzard of Corruption – "Jormag holds an icy grip over Frostgorge Sound. Dragon Minions take 33% less damage, and Deal 33% more damage to you. All Conditions inflicted on you last 33% longer. Jormag’s Champions in the Drakkar Spurs are Unshakeable and immune to crowd control until atleast 1 tower is destroyed. "

• Fighting the Claw of Jormag will become significantly harder if you fail to destroy all the towers before he appears. But, if you allow him to appear. You can get bonus chests for defeating him equal to the number of towers still standing. They wont award extra Dragonite Ore, but they do have a Rare chance at unique skins and ascended equipment (like Tequatl)

• This will also slow down the Champion Farming Train there, atleast while the Tower events are active, but if the zerg continues to ignore the towers, even basic champions will be much harder to defeat solo, or even in a large group.

What do you guys think of those ideas?

I’m going to expand on the Weather ideas I had from earlier, because I think that Anet could use stuff like this to make MegaBoss events harder instead of completely making them nearly impossible to do like Tequatl.

For this to Work,
- We should Have Random Weather Effects. Those Weather Effects affect both you and Enemies.
- We should also tie Weather Effects into the Event System
- Whenever there is a Weather Effect, it will show an icon on your Buff/Debuff bar telling you exactly what it does, and whether the effect is beneficial or not.
(template I am going to use for all Effects are….

• (name of effect) – (Description when you mouse over Icon)

(1) – Random Weather/Enviroment Effects
- These Are randomly generated Effects that have a very small effect on both you and enemies. They are Meant for Immersion, not to Break the game. So if they seem unbalanced, please say something. I want to post this in a CDI thread eventually!
- Examples Include ::::

• RainStorm – “A soothing rain falls overhead. All Healing is increased by 5%”
• ThunderStorm – “Feel the energy in the air! Swiftness duration increases by 5%”
• Ice Storm – “Its starting to get Chilly! Chill duration is increased by 5%”
• Sunny – “The warm Sun hitting your face feels nice.” (no effect)
• Swampgas – “The Stench is Dizzying! Confusion lasts 5% longer”
• Dust Storm – “Take care of your Eyes in this weather! Blind lasts 100% longer”

- In Harder Areas of the Game, Anet could Introduce even more Powerful Weather Effects that make it harder for the player to play through that area. They could press on, and gain a cool bonus, or they could do some underwater/underground content until the storm passes over, or there could even be effects in those areas as well!
- Examples Include :::

• Chaos Storm – "The Effect of the Dragon Brand can have some dire consequences. All Boons and All Conditions are Random when activated, but Magic Find, Gold Find, and Experience is Increased by 20%. Be Careful out there! (that last part is the same for all these effects)

• Blizzard – “Its Cold and its nearly Impossible to see! Chill lasts 10% longer and all Conditions inflicted also inflict Blind for 1 second.”

• Poison Cloud – "The undead lands of Orr are treacherous to travel through when this storm hits! Healing is 10% less effective when Inflicted with Poison, and all Conditions inflicted aldo inflict Poison for 1 second.

• Explosive Gas – "The Dredge may have found a gas pocket…. Burning Now Explodes when its inflicted, dealing damage to all creatures within 1000 range, including yourself.

• Strong Currents – "The Currents in the Water are too Strong to swim through effectively. All movement speed is decreased by 10% and you have a 5% chance of gaining Weakness whenever you take damage.

These aren’t related to Balance.

But, Someone say Mace? I thought of one already many months ago. Its more of a defensive 1h weapon than a CC weapon though. Here’s the Link for that :::
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/ranger/Ranger-Weapon-and-Skill-Building/2565291

(also, I agree that Rangers do need a CC weapon so they don’t have to depend on their Utility skills and pets all the time for it)

And someone say, Spear? I had an idea for that as well in the same thread:::
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/ranger/Ranger-Weapon-and-Skill-Building/2603700

As far as Balance goes, I’ll say what I said before. I don;t think Ranger weapons are in a very badd place, they all have their uses, but some of them could definitely be improved a little (stealth on Longbow #3 for example, since its nearly useless outside PvP and WvW)

@Holland

I think that Immobilize would be the best choice since the Longbow already seems like a Controlling weapon because of Point Blank Shot and Barrage. Unless the cooldown gets increased though, there wont be any more than a 1.5-2 second immobilize so it stays balanced with what other weapons can do (even with no damage, not to mention the stealth it gives pluss the swiftness for your pet). An immobilize would also be another option to prevent players from closing the gap on you too fast, so it would also help out your Long Range Shot in the end by keeping your overall damage higher than if you applied poison or a similar condition.

It’d be neat if expanding the Weather Effects in the game also had an effect on Conditions and other effects in open world PvE. These could be universal effects that affect you and enemies. For Example,

• There’s a Blizzard in Frostgorge Sound? Chill Effects last 5% Longer.
• There’s a Rainstorm in the Jungle? Healing Effects are 5% Stronger.
• Running Through a Poisonous Cloud in Orr? Healing is 5% less effective when inflicted with Poison.
• Running Through a Heat Wave in the Crystal Desert? Burning is 5% Stronger.
• There’s a Chaos Storm in the Blazeridge Steppes? Critical Hits have a 5% Chance to Inflict Confusion.
• Swim really Deep in the water in the Ocean? Movement is 5% slower because of the water pressure.
• Maybe these effects could have differing Intensities, and make those effects even stronger in harder areas of the game. The intensity of the storm would also show graphically on screen (more rain effect, blinding snow, etc.)

I’m not sure how that would affect balance, but it would help with the Immersion a little.

You got to be very specific in that forum for your concerns and suggestions for fixing it (that’s what the red sticky says), because the Devs don’t have time to read walls and walls of text. Posting a general (Ranger weapon)(Ranger Pet)(Ranger Etc.) balance thread there might not be the greatest idea.

thefantasticg.3984:

Many who already had suggestion threads copied then pasted into the CDI thread trying to get their suggestions seen by Anet.

Well, There’s one of your problem. So many people are so big on trying to be seen by red that many don’t even bother. And there are many others who stop caring and just post “Anet Hates Us” threads like that will do any better of a job getting their attention.

Dont forget that one of those SOTG conversations somehow went from asking for Pets being fixed to Warriors dualwielding Greatswords.

thefantasticg.3984:

Admitting there were posts with fantastic suggestions means that the entire CDI thread was not all QQ. in The vast majority of the CDI thread was good discussion about improving the class. Sucks you viewed the entire thread as a QQ-fest.

Fact is, there were just as many “Anet hates Ranger” Comments as there were “Constructive feedback” comments, which doesn’t change anything about what I did or did not ‘admit’ in your eyes. That doesn’t exactly give someone just clicking on the thread for the first time any incentive to post anything of their own if there is a 50/50 chance of it being ignored for people to continue to whine, complain, and gripe. It left people out that didn’t want to get in the middle of it.

And stop trying to shamelessly put words in my mouth. I never said the thread was all, I said::

even all the way to the end of the thread there were still people complaining about the changes instead of wanting to suggest anything to fix it

thefantasticg.3984:

And as you pointed out, the Devs even entertained the suggestions and feedback. They listened. They just didn’t act on ANY of the 7 weeks of suggestions and feedback. Maybe, just maybe, one day we will see patches that reflect the exchange that was had in the CDI, but it hasn’t happened yet thus no reason to believe a player started suggestion thread is going to do what the Anet started suggestion thread could not.

There’s also no reason to believe that a “Anet Hates Us! Ranger Sux Therapy Hour” Thread like this is going to get anything done about it either.

Also, I guess all this is rendered moot because of the new subforum that was opened, but, its still a better and more organized idea to have all ideas in one place instead of scattered across the forums.

bobbles.5940:

Tengu (looking back at the race in GW1 ) can have a variety of feather patterns and colouration so that would work.
The problem I have with Kodan as a playable race is character customisation. A polar bear is after all a polar bear and white , so wouldn’t every Kodan player all be just white furred and hence everyone would pretty much look the same ? Pretty boring imo.
Largos (as far as we have seen them ingame) suffer with the same problem as the Kodan, they all look the same or at least very similar

What? There Can’t be Kodiak Kodan and be Bigger, and Brown in coloration? There can’t be a subrace that has looks and markings more similar to a Sun bear? They can;t have Tiger stripes and different varieties of Snouts, Fangs, Ears, Scars, etc? Just because every single Kodan uses the same 5 lo-poly models (in comparison to player models) doesn’t meant there can’t be more visual variety in the future.

There was no cherry picking about it, because even all the way to the end of the thread there were still people complaining about the changes instead of wanting to suggest anything to fix it Now, yes, while some posts had fantastic suggestions for fixing the class, and the Devs even posted in that one thread to ask about changes to some of our weapons and answer some concerns about pets and the 1h sword, and Nike even made a great post defending Anet’s decision to nerf Natural Vigor, it didn’t stop the trolls.

I’m not really trying to complain so much as Suggest that we say to hell with the Devs and create a set of CDI threads ourselves instead of waiting for the next time we see some red posted in these forums (because, as you all know, that could take awhile). Have the first post as a Summary, and have nothing but constructive discussion, instead of half of it being nothing but QQ troll comments.

thefantasticg.3984:

xXxOrcaxXx.9328:

Since we have a CDI thread where I can spam the suggstion we gather in the thread I’ve posted, I hope we can make a difference. It is still a better idea than just cry about how bad we are. But if you got some older posts related to weapons, you can post a link on the thread, so we got all ideas clumbed together.

All the ideas related to every aspect of the Ranger are clumped together in the CDI thread. It. diD. NOTHING.

But, good luck all the same.

That wasn’t really so much a CDI thread as a “Lets Complain about the Dec. 10th Changes” Thread. A “Let’s Complain/Anet Hates Rangers” Thread (like this one) is a very different thing than a “Suggestion/Feedback” Thread.

Vanthian.9267:

Chrispy.5641:

….I still don’t see the problem with a bought VIP status ……

Then you are part of the “new player base” that have driven this game into a failing state that it is in and will continue to be. By failing I mean, not living up to what was sold/hyped (by Anet themselves).

With a bought status comes a bought power.

“But anet said they would never sell items that grant more power to the player than what can be earned!!”

They also said that the game wouldn’t be grindy and focus on looks rather than repetitive actions. The path you walk knows no bounds and will continue to drain pockets rather than aim to provide the best gaming experience possible.

I’ve actually been playing since Gw1 in 2005. And I’ve played other MMO’s with a ‘VIP’ status….

People suddenly getting a VIP status does not affect me in any way, plus, I’m not paying Anet extra money for whatever VIP gets them (which I assume is limited to GEM store discounts and such like that, not any actual combat advantages). It literally doesn’t affect me in any way since all new released content is free when through the Living story, and I will probably have to pay for an expansion, but so? So will the VIP’s! Also, that extra source of money will help Anet to develop bigger and better content in the future.

So I will say it again….

ME!!!!

“….I still don’t see the problem with a bought VIP status ……”

Bezagron.7352:

Okay taking a break but looking to have 41-46 before tomorrow and could even look at getting up-to-date to 47-51+, as a large part is taken up by the summarises. Thanks all its a pleasure watching all the discussions and reading all the ideas, keep then coming.

Man, You are doing the Gods’ work in place of their unexplained absence. Keep up the good work!

yeah, I bet the next balance patch doesn’t come until the current living story is over and several typos will be ignored in favor of nerfing something to the ground that “is way too OP”

so….maybe we’ll see it in March?

Vanthian.9267:

chemiclord.3978:

horror.

It does and most likely will affect you.

The day the next living story can only be played by Tier 15 VIP members or higher. Much like only people with a pass can get into the Divinities Reach Noble area.

Edit: [The remainder of this message can only be viewed by those who are of Tier 10 or higher within our VIP services.]

Darn, I’m only Tier 9……also, I still don’t see the problem with a bought VIP status as long as it brings no combat bonus, and leaves you just as helpless as the rest of us.

Also, I was on that chinese gw2 site, and there was an interesting piece of asian/canthan looking concept art. I reverse image searched it, and it brought me to a some concept art, then the next page was a bunch of guild wars 2 fan art. The first couple pages were fine, but after that was a deep dark realm of terror from which I was barely able to escape!

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Also….An idea for Rangers using Gauntlets as a Weapon from this thread:::
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/archive/suggestions/NEW-weapon-idea-Gauntlets/2648410

(when I mean Gauntlets, I mean Gloves, Claws, a Cestus, etc, anything you can hold in your hand and punch or strike with, for the visual variety)

RANGER

• Pretty much a Wild Style.

Skill 1 : Autoattack : Chain Attack
Savage Strike
Strike out at your foe
(1/2 second Activation)
-> Twin Strikes
Strike your foe two more times.
(1/2 Second Activation)
->->Brutal Strike
Strike at your foe again, Inflicting Vulnerability.
(1/2 Second Activation)

Skill 2
Throw Dirt
Damage Target Foe and Inflict Blindness to that Foe and all surrounding Foes.
(Blindness Duration is 3 seconds)
(1/2 Second Activation)(8 Second Recharge)
(Needs a name change since there is already a skill called Throw dirt. Suggestions?)

Skill 3
Maiming Strike
Strike out at foes, Crippling each foe you hit.
(1/2 Second activation)(12 second Recharge)

Skill 4
Feral Lunge
Leap Towards Target Foe, Inflicting Bleeding and Weakness. Your Pet’s next attack also inflicts Bleeding and Weakness.
(Bleeding Duration : 15 Seconds)(Weakness Duration : 6 Seconds)
(1 Second Activation)(900 Range)(15 second Recharge)
(Combo : Leap)

Skill 5 (Channel Skill)
Bestial Fury
Gain Stability (3 seconds), and Strike at your Foe multiple times, striking 10% faster each time you hit.
(6 second activation/channel)(35 second Recharge)
(6 Second Channel – 6 Attacks Total – 1 Attack each second)
(Note : If all attacks hit, your 1st attack will take 1 second, 2nd attack will take 0.9 seconds, 3rd attack will take 0.8 seconds, 4th attack will take 0.7 seconds, 5th attack will take 0.6 seconds, 6th attack will take 0.5 seconds, making the total channel time actually 4.5 seconds)
-> Bestial Pounce
End Bestial Fury early and Leap at foe, Knocking them down.
(900 Range)(Combo : Leap)