Guild Wars 2

i am personally close to quiting this game completely (after the playing this patch for a while), expansion is out of question already…. i think the answer is pretty clear

pvp community is just small part of netire community and forum posters are even smaller number so i don’t think that any of our opinion matters

people who enjoy the game don’t post on forums, they play it

denis.9487:

So if rylock is jumping of the bridge the rest of you lemmings can follow.

i am sure you would if it was Helseth~

1. i don’t think that thieves are really that bad the issue is that other classes are too good atm
2. those suggestions won’t really change anything; what really needs to happen is that weapon sets other than dp have more useful spells than just 1-2

bhagwad.4281:

Can you imagine the outcry if thief got invulnerable frames? . I’m sure thieves would love it though…

and aoe backstab from range… and mutiple ranged stuns dealing 3k dmg that cost 0 initiative… and unavoidable blinds

no, we wouldn’t love it… it would just make pvp totally broken and unenjoyable~

echo.2053:

Cynz.9437:

Vieux P.1238:

FlawlezZ.3178:

thief was nerfed so hard last patch and patch before and is countered so hard by mesmer and ele and guard i play mesmer now, what else am i supposed to do ??!?!?!?

thief is dead ! maybe not in organized pvp, but solo pvp very much
i play mesmer now: solution ! much stealth much good burst damage very good !

No thief was made so you have to use skill’s for now on. & not just mindless zombie skill button mash 1 & 2. Heart seeker…..heart seeker!

1&2 HS spam would work only in low lv pvp; in mid/high tier you would get punished very hard for such gameplay, that was prepatch

thief prepatch was nowehere stupidly easy and forgiving to use as current mesmer

521 521 521 with pistol offhand yeah teef was so deep gameplay. prepatch mesmer was virtually nonexistance since teams had to build around picking mesmer up due to the random guessing game vs other team teef.

now theres potential to open up different comps rather then 2 bunkers going at it for 5 mins

you actually believe it? for real? wow

Vieux P.1238:

FlawlezZ.3178:

thief was nerfed so hard last patch and patch before and is countered so hard by mesmer and ele and guard i play mesmer now, what else am i supposed to do ??!?!?!?

thief is dead ! maybe not in organized pvp, but solo pvp very much
i play mesmer now: solution ! much stealth much good burst damage very good !

No thief was made so you have to use skill’s for now on. & not just mindless zombie skill button mash 1 & 2. Heart seeker…..heart seeker!

1&2 HS spam would work only in low lv pvp; in mid/high tier you would get punished very hard for such gameplay, that was prepatch

thief prepatch was nowehere stupidly easy and forgiving to use as current mesmer

Sallouce.1395:

You are right, I’m not the most experienced player and a lot of the issue could be to spec and skill but am I the only one feeling that thief is considerably weaker after the update?

yeah… basically what happend is:
a dev that has 0 idea about thieves got assigned to the class and tried to balance them;

meanwhile other classes (mes/eles/engis in particular) got devs assigned that know those classes and went for power creep balancing….

thieves basically lost balance war due to crappy dev assignment/balancing politics discripancy and 0 interest for the class from dev side (i work in IT myself, i have to learn hundrets of pages of some pharmaceutical/statistical crap just so we can develop decent software for our customers, meanwhile gw2 dev responsible for thieves can’t learn few traits)~

for all i know, maybe they are underpaid, maybe they are overloaded with other work, bottom line for thief players it is not the best time atm and probably won’t be untill spring next year (that under condition that devs would stop nerfing the class)

FlawlezZ.3178:

Mesmer is perfectly fine. Thief should be nerfed stealth spam is just too strong and no counterplay

0/10

i actually got new account for NA and went to pvp…. then i realized i can’t buy weapons i need for pvp because each is 1 silver something and i had like 20 coppers D8

some nice guy actually gave me 5 silver, i got quite some gold after few matches and paid him back when i was allowed to send mails (new account limitation~)

Those are balancing issues, blind going thought dodges is a bug.

…and fix blinding dissipation ignoring dodges already :|

I don’t understand why this crap is even allowed, i thought devs weren’t allowed to favor any group of players yet we have mesmers rampaging in pvp and abusing bugs and i am sure this will going on untill WTS is over.

oh wait i have better advice: reroll mesmer, enjoy the game… no kidding

Pro tip? don’t 1v1. Not your job nor you can do it effectively as thief. Thieves are decap/+1 pets.

… if you going to afk/troll at spawn anyway. Don’t waste other players time. You are not happy with game? Complain to devs~

It is not players fault that pvp is not enjoyable.

dat barrel roll

RoseofGilead.8907:

Some cutscenes are skippable, and some aren’t. For example: the starting cutscene (where your character is talking about its race and story) can be skipped, but the cut scene describing the history of your chosen Order (around level 50) can’t be skipped. You have to move your cursor on the screen to make the “Skip” button appear in the bottom right corner.

No, this specific cutscene i was talking about is skippable, it happens right after you create a character.

Is it me or it is not possible to turn off cutscenes anymore? I just made new character and it won’t let me cancel the cinematics :/

abc.5790:

Cynz.9437:

abc.5790:

Cynz.9437:

Tao.1234:

I can understand stopping pvp due to power and burn, but mesmers?

Really?

Because you get owned by Mesmer?

i am forced into sa/vamp literary because of mesmers only… i just hate it~

good mes (see tourney teams) will burst you before you even know what happend…. bad mesmers are extremely annoying to fight because even if they miss every single shatter and stun they are still hard to bring down~

There’s like 30 fotm mesmer for every good mesmer. And 200 fotm mesmer for every tourney tiered mesmer.

The game mode affects your overall enjoyment as well. If you hate yourself, you could go against a zerg of fotm mesmers in hotjoin. Ranked is also teeming with fotm mesmers but they are easily identified by their poor positioning.

there is thing like mmr…. :|
besides hj are not enjoyable as it is always 2v5

that phantom mmr only does its job during peak hours before taking a 20 hour break.
you lure ppl you don’t like to hojo

oh sry i just happend to have a job and can only play during peak hours~

MrForz.1953:

Cynz.9437:

my main thieves are salads~

Alright. You better make use of that cultural armor though. That salad stuff is clearly underrated.

i missmatch gem store armor sets with cultural, does it count ? :P

abc.5790:

Cynz.9437:

Tao.1234:

I can understand stopping pvp due to power and burn, but mesmers?

Really?

Because you get owned by Mesmer?

i am forced into sa/vamp literary because of mesmers only… i just hate it~

good mes (see tourney teams) will burst you before you even know what happend…. bad mesmers are extremely annoying to fight because even if they miss every single shatter and stun they are still hard to bring down~

There’s like 30 fotm mesmer for every good mesmer. And 200 fotm mesmer for every tourney tiered mesmer.

The game mode affects your overall enjoyment as well. If you hate yourself, you could go against a zerg of fotm mesmers in hotjoin. Ranked is also teeming with fotm mesmers but they are easily identified by their poor positioning.

there is thing like mmr…. :|
besides hj are not enjoyable as it is always 2v5

MrForz.1953:

Cynz.9437:

no offense, but i will never understand why people roll charr thief…. every time i end up in urban fractal and my thief turns into charr, i feel like landwhale while using dd

I’ll never understand what’s so attractive about GW2 humans.

my main thieves are salads~

you forgot dd before that :P

1st

+ 15 raging charrs

Tao.1234:

I can understand stopping pvp due to power and burn, but mesmers?

Really?

Because you get owned by Mesmer?

i am forced into sa/vamp literary because of mesmers only… i just hate it~

good mes (see tourney teams) will burst you before you even know what happend…. bad mesmers are extremely annoying to fight because even if they miss every single shatter and stun they are still hard to bring down~

Let’s put it this way: i been doing lv 50 fractal every day for 1.5? year trying to get fractal dagger. Meanwhile i made 3 legendaries, got 9 precursors, tequatl ascended chest and what not, still no dagger from fractals.

Reward tracks are too easy. What could be possibly done is that if you finish reward track you get a chest. That chest has miniscule tiny chance to give random weapon fractal skin.

Uh bigger issue is that venom share build has no stun breakers…. besides you can get condi removal via SA or acro

i log in only to do daily gathering in home instance, team practice once a week and maybe tourney (if we signed up for it)…. do not enjoy the fact that i have to rely on my enemy to be complete idiot to be able to fight them

i used to pvp a lot, not anymore…. this patch actually forced me into SA/vamp runes and play like decapping/stealth pet…. i do not enjoy it but it is necessary evil, it doesn’t make this game any fun for me atm tho~

1. every single weapon set from thieves got nerfed multiple times leaving dp only weapon set that still has all 5 spells somehow usefull thus making it only viable choice

2. definitely…. playing same weapon set while having only 1 and only 1 role you can ever play gets pretty dull pretty fast

3. if they trait for it, yes they can get small dmg bonus with revealed debuff however most thieves won’t use it(there are better options). Reason why thieves use stealth a lot is because
- they can’t mitigate dmg normally (they don’t have blocks, invuls, immunities, amazing multiple heals or protection), they can only avoid it (via evades, teleports, stealth, blinds, depending on build)
- most commonly used weapon set dp has only 1 hard hitting attack which is backstab which can be only executed from stealth (and requires to be behind the target for high dmg, stealth is kind of crucial here to be able to get the right position)
- if thief traits for shadow arts (defensive tree), stealth gives them condi removal, some regen and slight dmg reduction while in stealth
- stealth helps to roam which is only role thieves have in pvp
- thieves can survive maybe 2 sec in focus fire

4. atm? not really….
- i barely log in gw2 atm, mostly because of ele/mesmer crap, bugged spells, never implemented changes to thieves (getting lied by devs constantly) and way too severe multiple nerfs to the class while close to no complains (that been out there for years) from thieves were adressed
- from technical point, being absolutely terrible vs any class (maybe not rangers) atm and only being taken because of moblity is quite dicouraging
- being forced to be exceptionally good to perform well vs crappy players because of class imbalance is even more discouraging (atm i have to rely on my enemies to be stupid)

Generally i would say class is fine, with some tweaks and balancing to other classes it could be quite enjoyable again. Thieves were always good in good hands but had high skillcap and high risk, i like classes like that. That is just me though. I can see however that some thief players wish they could do something else than be decapping/stealth pet we are atm

P.S. my feedback is based on games vs good/top players, i am not talking about hj fun park where you can faceroll on PP vs keyboard turners

are you sure it wasn’t transform of some kind or invul?

sinetic.6184:

D/P? It’s our best set, but keep it in perspective of the game as a whole – it’s definitely not OP considering mesmers, guards, etc…far from it

D/D hasn’t been viable in competitive sPVP for years now. And you rarely see S/D or anything else these days.

he basically wants d/p to be as bad as other weapon sets instead of suggesting how to make other weapon sets viable

sd needed some nerfs during their glorious days but i think anet overdid it lol
i don’t understand acro changes given that vigor got nerfed across all classes already
i also think the meta changes do have their impact on weither sd is played or not

General anwer is simple: reward vs risk, effort vs effect. You know the class is broken when it requires too little effort to have huge impact on match.

I wouldn’t say mesmers itself are OP, some traits are just too good. They make bad gameplay very forgiving and bring good players close to god mode atm. I think alone adjustements to CS and BD would already make difference.

I am sorry i can’t write you full list of what you can do, i would have to list every spell of every class and describe certain situations to do it, which would be probably enough for little book.

I know Caed was writing very good guide with most important things to pay attention to and how to react to those situations but i guess he never got to finish it. I saw parts of it and maybe he would be kind enough to post at least what he already has (if you bug him enough :P)

no offense, but i will never understand why people roll charr thief…. every time i end up in urban fractal and my thief turns into charr, i feel like landwhale while using dd

Cs needs icd and work only if you really interrupt something. Maybe even move it to other trait line so it has to compete with other really good traits.

BD shouldn’t go through evades/dodges.

I had mesmers today spamming mantra on me while i had stab on, that is just sad :|

Thieves may need tiny buffs in survival department but imo they don’t need invuls. Mesmers are just too strong right now however it doesn’t mean that every other class should be buffed up. If anything, problematic traits from mes need to be toned down.

Pvp is already being hurt by insane power creep, we don’t need more of that.

DP is very versatile but to use it properly you have to know how other classes work. You have to know what is good to blind, what is good to interrupt, when it is best to stealth up.

There is no just general “rotation” in that sense. Only advice i can give you is make research on other classes, find out what hurts them most as far as interrupts, blinds go. Just few simple examples:
It is possible to counter current mesmer stunlock build if you predict mantra use and blind mesmer before they use it. Obviously trying to stealth up while they have mantra up is pointless as you would just get stun locked while trying to bp+ hs.

Another simple example: interrupting ele in fire attunement hurts their dps a lot, if they are in air try to stealth up or blind them, you can dps while they are in earth, use interrupts and dps them while they are in water.

Last example (from own experience). if you fight engi, if they are in rifle/pistol/tool kit use dp for blinds, if they go grenade kit use sb to kite and keep pressure.

Also, dp doesn’t have as much dmg potential as dd but you have more tools. I found personally that in many cases i am better off with disabling/avoiding/stopping enemy from hitting me and actually killing them with AA than trying to get backstab off that :
- has high chance not to happen because bp+ hs is very easy to interrupt
- hs+ bp is predictable and has huge tell
- a lot of classes have high acess to protection/weakness making bs hit like wet noodle
- by the time you get in right position to execute bs you might actually die

So as i said, it is better off use the set to prevent enemy from killing you and keep pressure via AA.

something thief lacks is viable ranged weapon set ( not talking about sb which is basically second utility bar) or actual team sustain/support team fight build

probably would require massive rework for any of those to happen tho

DHawk.2687:

Smollett.6270:

my burst to PU/Zerk mesmer=>~11-12k =>decoy+blink GG
his burst to me 15-17k=> i’m dead GG
Yes d/p needs nerf….and of course L2P

a friend of mine ( DP thief ) called me recently and wanted me to go OS and watch this bs ( his words)
i enter the sanctum and see him starting a 1v1 with a mesmer, 1 sec later he was instadead, funny thing was, the mesmer felt sorry for him and let him do a backstab to compare, mesmer health after backstab 50%
mesmer goes GS #2 F1
thief dead

but hey, the mesmer all say it’s balanced soooooo

nah mesmers say now they are on same footing with other clsses and deserved this because they were most nerfed class in game~

Necrotize.2974:

Thieves can no longer hard counter mesmers just by taking 20 seconds to focus them anymore, unfortunately a lot of players got used to not having to try when it came to killing average mesmers.

No, it thieves just have to play like top ESL players vs average mesmer that are incapable of dodging or landing any shatter w/o spamming 3 stuns in a row. That is mesmers i am been facing after patch.

I used to have big respect for mesmers, i knew that class used to take skill, if i died to one i knew i got outplayed and should get better. I LOVED to have decent mesmer on team, the pain train with fellow mesmers was always really fun. Now i just look at mesmers, look them getting rewarded for mistakes, bad position and bad use of spells and think: “wow, turret engis second edition~”

Umut.5471:

I completely agree. Also that daze spamming thieves are annoying on PvP.
Needs a nerf and an alternative build to compensate. Mesmers need damage nerf too.

if only headshot did dmg and didn’t cost crap load of initiative~~~~~~~~~~

Here is the problem with all suggestions posted so far: to be able to have same footing with mesmer you have to be some kind of mix of ele warrior necro and thief… or play mesmer.

You can react to ele stuff, there are decent ways to counter ele and deal with them in team fights, they certanly need bit toning down but not extreme. Mesmer on other hand…. i think there was more than enough said on this forums. While it is somehow possible by absolute perfect gameplay and mistakes from mes side to maybe win 1v1 vs mes, in team pvp it is just unrealistic unless you run exactly same thing.

The only way to reliably counter mesmer in tpvp is to run better mesmer.

Saiyan.1704:

Burns and Mesmers are not the reason why teams got in WTS. They are not the reason why Abjured is best team NA.

If this was half true then every team from EU and NA would be running Burn Guard, Ele, and Mesmer comps… burn guards are definitely not as strong in higher tier pvp so that rules out burning being the culprit.

There’s a few class mechanics I absolutely dislike about the Mesmer… for starters it’s a low skill high reward class that can’t be countered as easily as other classes.

idk about NA but EU do run mesmers and eles atm….
2v2 esl was even worse, 99% of the team either had ele or mes or both~

Mogar.9216:

Cynz.9437:

Ok, amuse me: most common mesmer build atm runs confounding suggestion with mantra of distraction. How do you counter that on a class that has no stability while mes is in stealth. I am all ear.

Stun breaker + withdraw pretty much negates any mesmer who burst you from stealth. If you are using shadow step or Roll for init 1 skill does it.

that is the thing it doesn’t

i broke 1st stun countless times and still couldn’t activate withdraw because even though it doesn’t state it, it does have miniscule cast time (hence why you can’t use it while stunned)… with the stun spam, gl getting it off

besides why would i use withdraw if i am still at full HP?

Happicakes.2054:

Cynz.9437:

Ok, amuse me: most common mesmer build atm runs confounding suggestion with mantra of distraction. How do you counter that on a class that has no stability while mes is in stealth. I am all ear.

The stun is a big tell in stealth. When stunned, use a stun break and dodge/channeled invulnerability/channeled block.

Edit: I see Morgar got there first.

stun has big tell in stealth? what?

i don’t have invul nor block~

dodge doesn’t save me from getting blinded and reducing my chances to counter mes

Oh wait i know, it will be fighting gloves that cause huge middle finger flash on your screen constantly so we get reminded what devs think of us.

StickerHappy.8052:

Cynz.9437:

Mesmers won’t get nerfed before WTS because certain anime loving top mes keeps spamming devs with skype messages so mes don’t get nerfed and he can faceroll in WTS.

Worst part, devs actually listen.

Who are those anime loving mesmers? LOL

Oh cmon, there is only one mes that runs anime music 24/7 on stream~

If it makes you happy i was really happy to have good mes on team and was cheering for them, before patch that is.

Grenadier. Their dmg was avoidable, kind of predictable, he had to be pretty much in melee for it and engi is actually easier to kill.