Guild Wars 2

skullmount.1758:

DarksunG.9537:

The one part I was most excited for (collections) turned out to be kinda laughable. The rewards are so insanely pathetic. I can’t believe how stingy they’re being with actually rewarding new, good, skins. It’s insane how rarely they are willing to make IN GAME skins, when that’s their main reward goals.

1 backpack for making EVERY Spirit Skin? are you kidding me? It doesn’t even match the weapons.

Yet/But they got no problems making 16 different weapons skins (usually with particle effects) pretty quickly for the gemstore. -_-

Yeah, that’s what kittenes me off. One of the few issues I have with their monetization is that they have moved rewards to the Gem Store. To me that is bad on 2 levels: paying $100s of dollars to get the new skins & removing effort from in-game rewards making gameplay unrewarding.

The one part I was most excited for (collections) turned out to be kinda laughable. The rewards are so insanely pathetic. I can’t believe how stingy they’re being with actually rewarding new, good, skins. It’s insane how rarely they are willing to make IN GAME skins, when that’s their main reward goals.

1 backpack for making EVERY Spirit Skin? are you kidding me? It doesn’t even match the weapons.

TooBz.3065:

In my opinion, it’s ridiculous to get upset about this. The ability to trade gold for gems and buy gems with cash has been in the game since it started.

Also, the fact that people can do this is one of the reasons most people get to play the game for free. As shocking as it is, servers, employees, and bandwidth all cost money and your initial purchase just won’t cover it.

Seriously? I need to quote it again ALREADY?

LIVE.4875:

Its amazing ppl are happy about TP changes.
Ill just leave this here.

GW1: released in April 26, 2005
GW1Canthan: released in April 28 2006
GW1Nightfall:released in October 26, 2006

(by April 2009 6million copies sold)

^^^ all that content, all the skins, gear, levels, setting restrictions for terrain, art and development and so on.

Gw2: released August 28, 2012
Gw2: releases small content and major patches to edit infrastructure over 2 years
Gw2 serious content expansion: still nothing, just conjecture from ppl I’ve never met on these forums

By August 2013 they had sold 3.5million copies of Gw2

& they could still sell things like boosters, gathering tools, etc. & keep most of the armor & weapons for in-game. ya’know.. like something to shoot for? Rewards?

lordkrall.7241:

Why would anyone wait for CONTENT in a FEATURE patch? They made it rather clear that there is a rather big difference between the two, which is also the very reason why they have split them up.

That’s is not the reason they split them up. The reason is mask the break between content releases by holding back “features” they’ve completed for the break.

More importantly people aren’t complaining because they want content & real features in this “feature pack” they are complaining because they want them period. And the massive multi-week, bannered, article extravaganza is disingenuous in it’s scale.

LIVE made the perfect post to explain how many players see this whole thing:

Ill just leave this here.

GW1: released in April 26, 2005
GW1Canthan: released in April 28 2006
GW1Nightfall:released in October 26, 2006

(by April 2009 6million copies sold)

^^^ all that content, all the skins, gear, levels, setting restrictions for terrain, art and development and so on.

Gw2: released August 28, 2012
Gw2: releases small content and major patches to edit infrastructure over 2 years
Gw2 serious content expansion: still nothing, just conjecture from ppl I’ve never met on these forums

By August 2013 they had sold 3.5million copies of Gw2

LIVE.4875:

Its amazing ppl are happy about TP changes.
Ill just leave this here.

GW1: released in April 26, 2005
GW1Canthan: released in April 28 2006
GW1Nightfall:released in October 26, 2006

(by April 2009 6million copies sold)

^^^ all that content, all the skins, gear, levels, setting restrictions for terrain, art and development and so on.

Gw2: released August 28, 2012
Gw2: releases small content and major patches to edit infrastructure over 2 years
Gw2 serious content expansion: still nothing, just conjecture from ppl I’ve never met on these forums

By August 2013 they had sold 3.5million copies of Gw2

I could quote this 100 times & still it won’t be enough.

Vol.7601:

VergilDeZaniah.3295:

AT LAST. But still, it’s what should have been expected in the first place, not 2 years later :-/

Should that matter? Anet is in a lose lose situation with comments like that

They don’t fix something, people will complain that it’s not here

They fix something, people will complain that it should’ve been fixed long ago

Unfortunately what he said is true. These are great changes, but I hardly use the TP that way anymore. Looking for armor was something I did 2 years ago & it was a major pain. Now I’m just selling junk & some rares & buying more of what I already have. The changes are awesome, but it is late. Better late than never I guess. tbh this is, again, more of a new player thing.
And I don’t think it’s “lose lose” as you said. They should look at this & say “maybe we should spend more time fixing things that people ask for rather than making another episode where we try to convince the players that Scarlet is cool”

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

DarksunG.9537:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Nick.6972:

Was this what Arena Net thought would be perfect for veteran players?

It’s just the first post of the week.

Still, a lot of people do like it. It is something we have asked and asked for.

There are only 3 posts this week. & by the looks of the titles they aren’t major features. I love this change, but seriously.. it’s a tiny “feature”.

I wonder how many ‘tiny’ features actually require an extensive amount of work on the back end. If it’s anything like my last project, some of it might surprise people.

Still, I think most of the things are tiny by themselves. If you take all of them into account though, there’s a significant amount of work there.

If it actually took the gap between feature packs to do this then the game would have never been completed in the time it took.

I would be cool to have a Conan the Barbarian/Red Sonja look though.

but we definitely need real Norn female armor:

some that stand alone and some that are deeply tied to the Living World.

gdi

I love that they are adding more achievements & collections, but I have a feeling it’s going to be anemic & the rewards sparse & uninteresting. They really need to go back & make at least 20 achievements per zone. Otherwise this isn’t going to last past a month.

They had better not add achievements to collecting Gem Store items. Adding Mini achievements was bad enough. They might as well have a new Gem Store item: “Achievement Points”.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Nick.6972:

Was this what Arena Net thought would be perfect for veteran players?

It’s just the first post of the week.

Still, a lot of people do like it. It is something we have asked and asked for.

There are only 3 posts this week. & by the looks of the titles they aren’t major features. I love this change, but seriously.. it’s a tiny “feature”.

Behellagh.1468:

I’ve seen numerous posts in PHP board where newcomers from other MMOs have no idea what to do because they aren’t pushed from one traditional quest giver to another. Also seen new players confused doing the personal story because it contains level gaps and they have no idea what to do to level.

It’s too bad these changes don’t address that at all. In fact, you could argue it makes it worse, because if they use the Chinese model, you won’t get any story until level 10. As for gaps.. How the heck does this fix any gaps? all it does is move the gaps to different places.
You’ll get a chunk of story, then once you complete that, you’ll have to level till you get to the next chunk. There are still gaps… they are actually bigger, but more spread out. And it certainly doesn’t address what you said about “what to do”. In fact you’ll start with 10 levels of no story. The only thing it does for sure(if it follows the China model) is kill key farming.

I’ve always disliked the gaps in the Personal Story, and have poked fun at it here on the forums more than once, so naturally I think fixing those gaps is not a bad thing. The only problem I have with it is, that’s one less thing for me to poke fun at. I’ll get over it, though. Eventually.

Since it doesn’t actually remove gaps, i’m not sure what you’re talking about. What do you mean?

BrotherBelial.3094:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

HHR LostProphet.4801:

As I already said, skins are the main goal in this game.

HHR LostProphet.4801:

Having fun is the goal of every game ever created…

Let me know when you decide which argument you want to make. Is GW2 supposed to be fun or about skins.

I was thinking that my self.

I suspect you know exactly what he’s saying & that he’s right, but it sounds nice to nitpick on semantics & pretended it makes sense.

You two act like: collecting skins cannot be considered fun. This is not only obviously wrong but counter to what Anet itself has said repeatedly about the endgame goals in this game. To somehow take any notion of “I collect skins as my endgame” as a departure from fun (an amorphous concept that you seem to be able to quantify only as “nothing to do with skins”) is just stabbing at a strawman to try to invalidate any criticism of Anet’s conflicting actions & statements regarding skins & endgame. They want the endgame goals to be cosmetic, but at the same time make the vast majority of the skins added to the game gamble & pay only.

This is one of the reasons many people liked the expansion model. You payed to unlock the experience then earn everything in that experience. You didn’t get mediocre tiny chunks of story then have almost every decent reward put into a store.

Nokaru.7831:

Businesses exist to provide a good or service to us.

No. (I’m saying this because your tone suggests they exist primarily for someone else benefit.) Business exists so that they can gain something of value to them by providing something of value to someone else. They get money by providing games. it has nothing to do with the good of society in any other way than looking after their own needs through a voluntary system. That’s the beauty of the monetary system. It allows everyone to look after their own needs through a voluntary system as long as they produce something of value to someone else. Your assessment that They should only be making money to fuel the action of making games really is a fallacy. It not only ignores any of their needs but it again assumes they should exist primarily for your benefit.

The problem for us is when whales make it worth Anet’s time to make weapons that the average person can’t realistically afford. That’s why I always prefer to buy the game not the rewards. GW1 was fantastic for that.

Nokaru.7831:

Their objective is not (or rather should not) to fleece their customers as much as possible while doing as little as possible. That is considered a parasite to society.

You’re saying that getting money is the same as “fleecing” someone. That’s just a not true. Now, we should not be buying keys to show them that they aren’t worth the price, but whales & people with no money sense keep doing it, so Anet keeps making gamble-boxes.

Yeah, this “feature” patch is extremely anemic & confusing. This change.. I can’t really agree with the “blocking them into chunks makes it more rewarding!”. Seems to me that the way they’ve been blocking things makes most levels actually have nothing happen. Rather than appear to have little happening. Just so that certain levels feel more rewarding. It’s odd & I have to wonder why they’re making any of these changes.

This change in particular is actually really bad for old players since we (most likely) can’t key farm now.

It’s good to update the game for new players but this part of the “feature” patch was more about moving China updates to the rest of us under the guise of “features” & kill key farming in 1 go.
I guess I’d be ok with killing key farming if the weapon prices were remotely sane.

Fenar.4025:

Ohoni.6057:

Hopefully they will just remove Black Lion Keys from the game entirely. It’s a horrible gambling system that is corrosive to the game they’ve made. Just sell Black Lion weapons on the TP for a fair price and don’t force people to gamble for them.

I’m surprised there haven’t been class action lawsuits against gaming companies for some of the RNG stuff they put in cash shops. Why? Because it is essentially gambling that somehow escapes from any local, state, or national laws that would normally regulate that sort of thing. Maybe they need to move their servers to Indian Lands or put them on boats in international waters or something.

[edit]

Here is how I would revamp the current system and improve sales in the gem shop:

1. Remove BL Keys and Chests from the game. Seriously.
2. Sell BL Tickets directly in the gem store for some reasonable price.
3. Add a chance for BL ticket scraps and tickets to drop in game
4. Revamp pricing of all the boosters and other stuff you normally get from the chests. This stuff is not worthwhile to buy at current prices.

I personally hate when gamers talk about lawsuits, because it’s just so silly, but I do have to admit the whole lockbox phenomenon is absolutely gambling. The idea that “you always get something” is silly. No one plays the lottery to win $3. The primary driving factor of lockboxes is to get something rare. & the fact is you usually get something almost worthless.

On top of the rarity of ticket scraps, they force you to get 10 just to make 1. Its a system obviously designed to make chunks of money off whales. It leaves the average player unable to get almost anything of value. It certainly doesn’t reflect the launch values of “we want to earn our money” but it does work. I dunno. I felt like Anet’s business practice was so good in GW1, I bought things just to show appreciation for the product & honesty. But now I feel like trying to focus on buying less & less to try to make the opposite point.

LS being free is nice, but if it means I have to gamble for my rewards & never get expansions, I’d rather pay a sub & buy an expansion.

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

The intent of the Renown Heart system was originally to help players find event content. They also provide a decent method for us to give the player some context and awareness of what’s going on in the area. There are probably a few issues in that design which we could discuss. We could also let it suffice to say that hearts do not make the best repeatable content the game has to offer.

On the topic of keeping players engaged with open world content, I think this goal may be for more approachable from a different angle. Consider Dry Top, which has no hearts. Players on that map are participating in events all the time, largely on the premise that each event contributes to both map-level and personal-level goals. This gives me the notion that with a little help at the system level, events can and should be the bulk of repeatable open world content in Tyria.

I’d be very interested in hearing your thoughts on that.

I think that the fact that DryTop is new is a huge factor in the play. But I totally agree that each zone should have a large meta reward & personal rewards. If there were full unique weapons & armor & back sets to craft/unlock in the zones that would be epic. But they will have to be significant. You can’t have 1 backpack or a pair of shoulders & gloves in a zone & expect people to go gaga over it. I’d love to play in the old zones with big over-arching push/pull type mechanics to get unique rewards.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

DarksunG.9537:

More like “it’s as ambiguous as I need for my argument”. Just like how " supposed to be there at launch" conveniently meant “always meant to be in the game”.

Isn’t that what “at launch” means? Is there some other reality in which “at launch” doesn’t mean “in the game”?

“at launch” is the time the content was planned for. “always meant to be” is statement of intent. And you made it a very definitive one, like they set it in stone. I don’t even know what your point was in the first place. You just wanted to argue about official quotes that talk about when & if the Tengu were worked on & to what extent?

My point was, again, Anet making the Tengu is not some little tidbit that do to be nice or gracious it’s a significant piece of content that & features that they are going to have to make some kind of money with. Whereas this patch has (so far) been just minor QoL tweaks. Again, I think they’re just bundling stuff they’ve been doing to hide the LS breaks. It seems like it has little to do with “focusing” work on features.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

It is ambiguous. For me, a nicety is giving someone a lift if I know them and am going their direction. I can tell you that’s usually more than ‘nothing special’ some of the time. A nicety for a friend of mine was giving his bag of McDonalds to some homeless person under a bridge. And someone once put a rare penny worth $1500 into circulation just to do so in case it found its way into another coin-collector’s hands.

Point is, there’s a broad range of “nicety” vs “significant contribution” and it’s entirely subjective. Pretty much as subjective as “is Job-o-Tron annoyingly distracting to the story or is he the best character evar”.

And we’re not ‘finding another sentient race’. We already know the tengu are there. (Some people during the Battle of Lion’s Arch discovered they are very much there and have some really awesome bow damage ratings.)

More like “it’s as ambiguous as I need for my argument”. Just like how " supposed to be there at launch" conveniently meant “always meant to be in the game”.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Your point is noted, but it still doesn’t matter since it’s content they decided not to pursue before it hit Beta. Which, for our purposes discussing the game, means they weren’t planning on it being in the game anymore when they were getting it (moderately) ready for release.

It just means that it’s a significant enough feature to be considered for launch. “Nicety” works for the Feature Pack, not for an entire race, you’re making the word more ambiguous than it is. Like finding another sentient race on earth is more than a nicety. I don’t care for PvP, but I can tell that having more game modes is more than a “nicety” for PvP players.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

. . . there’s stuff in there about them being major candidates before the game was finalized? And that means they were always meant to be in the game?

No, It means that it was at a time intended to be part of the release as opposed to something planned later that would be “nice”. I should not have said “they were well into making the Tengu, they were supposed to be there at launch” because that sounds like we know exactly what they did (other than what we see in the game). My point was that making an entire race with a starting zone & Personal Story is not a “nicety”, it’s a massive amount of content & a huge feature.

Vayne.8563:

They never said it would be in the game after that, and assuming it would isn’t necessarily a good thing to do.

I did assume we had more information about it, but I can’t find any right now, so that could be totally wrong.

Vayne.8563:

I don’t believe I’ve ever seen a statement from Anet saying Tengu were supposed to be at launch. I’ve seen fans say it but I’ve not ever seen anyone be able to back it up with a quote.

Well there is no big announcement. There is Stuff in my making of GW2 about how they were major candidates for the playable race & the other thing I heard I believe was an interview. Can’t remember if WP talked about it. But yeah, they definitely were thinking about having Tengu from the start, not like some “made for add-on” type thing.
I may be wrong in that they were “well on their way” (thought there is evidence that’s true, I might be confusing that with the Cantha district) but it’s a major feature, not some “nicety”.

CETheLucid.3964:

DarksunG.9537:

CETheLucid.3964:

How do you even interpret this blog post as hype? Seriously? This is hype?

“Hey how are you doing? I’m Isaiah Cartwright and here are a few things that you can expect to see in the feature pack.”

Act like they made an action trailer about how this is going to be rolled out. Then in other posts some of you turn around and say “not enough communication!”

Lack communication?
Hype?
Wasn’t worth the post?

Lol…

You’ve got to be kidding. Making an event out of a handful of minor changes is not hype? They have banners a whole section to the site, announced several times over many weeks, metered it out over 3 weeks & every time it’s brought up they talk about it like it’s massive sweeping changes.. Yes, this is embarrassing.
If they had a post with no preamble & advertizing showing everything from the past week & a half it would have been a normal “hey we’re keeping up on features” but the whole “feature pack” “changes galore” giant banners “Big Changes are Coming”. Sorry, don’t see any evidence of them treating this like what it is: minor QoL improvements. Most of these are ninja patch things.

Mmhm.

Excuse me, I can’t find the part where I said “not enough communication!”. Can you point that out for me? Oooh I see.. it’s in that straw man’s chest over there.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Flytrap.8075:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Tada, and we see yet again just why the devs won’t (can’t) talk to us.

Good job guys! Keep it up!

Someone has to counterbalance the white knights.

A term to inaccurately describe those that don’t agree with you, nothing more. Gotta love the way people label others ….

You mean like how people who praise everything Anet does call people that disagree with them “haters” & “QQers”? Ok.

Nobody cares about feature packs. They want more content.

I’d rather have Features than LS.

They didn’t, they promised a living world.

Gonna have to call BS on this one, hard. From even before launch they talked about content in terms of “expansions” a term loaded with history. People knew what that was. They only started getting married to the LS months after it first got a label. Around F&F. (which they ridiculously called “an expansion’s worth of content”) & that article that was linked said " Our goal is to make it so you get more from Gw2 for free than you get from a game you pay a subscription for." It’s certainly released more FREE content than most MMOs, that’s great. But the lie that White Knights keep propagating that it’s even close to a full expansion is laughable. Even if you compare it to GW1 which wasn’t even a full MMO, the amount of content & major features is about 1/3-1/2. Just from Prophecies to Factions the # of in-game weapons skins more than doubled. & that doesn’t include Sorrow’s Furnace. Stop perpetuating the bogus.

wwwes.1398:

In fact, I think they have said all along they don’t really want to add more races or classes, so if that comes along, it’s just a nicety.

BS again. They’ve said multiple times they were well into making the Tengu, they were supposed to be there at launch, but they ran out of time. It being a “nicety” is ridiculous. You don’t make an entire race with a full leveling progression & story as a “nicety”. You’re trying to play down things to make them sound benevolent.

I love GW2. I can admit have major, major issues with it. far more than I had with GW1. But it is true that the Feature Packs feel way more anemic than the LS, yet the hype is greater. For many of us who want traditional amounts of Expansion-like content, we’d rather pay for it than rave about how great it is that the meager amount of ok content we get is free.

CETheLucid.3964:

How do you even interpret this blog post as hype? Seriously? This is hype?

“Hey how are you doing? I’m Isaiah Cartwright and here are a few things that you can expect to see in the feature pack.”

Act like they made an action trailer about how this is going to be rolled out. Then in other posts some of you turn around and say “not enough communication!”

Lack communication?
Hype?
Wasn’t worth the post?

Lol…

You’ve got to be kidding. Making an event out of a handful of minor changes is not hype? They have banners a whole section to the site, announced several times over many weeks, metered it out over 3 weeks & every time it’s brought up they talk about it like it’s massive sweeping changes.. Yes, this is embarrassing.
If they had a post with no preamble & advertizing showing everything from the past week & a half it would have been a normal “hey we’re keeping up on features” but the whole “feature pack” “changes galore” giant banners “Big Changes are Coming”. Sorry, don’t see any evidence of them treating this like what it is: minor QoL improvements. Most of these are ninja patch things.

Tman.6349:

*"Our guild has active members galore!"
*"Our Guild Leader has charisma galore!"

Umm.. both of those uses are quantitative. That’s cuz the word only has that usage.

_ga·lore
g??lôr/
adjective
adjective: galore

in abundance.
“there were prizes galore for everything”_

So no, 3 is not “in abundance”

At any rate, you people who keep trying to defend this stuff are ignoring the aggregate. People are sick of Anet making something huge out of something tiny. These “feature packs” are nothing more than a way to hide the breaks in the LS. All this stuff could have been released while the LS was happening, but they wait & pack it together to fool people into thinking they are getting the same amount of stuff.
They still have a week or so to show something amazing, but I gave up on hoping a year ago.

Romek.4201:

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

I thought today’s features were really good. People have long commented on the problems with Instance owners leaving. And, I find the new crafting feature very helpful.

Who doesn’t want improved performance? Well, I suppose some have great performance now…lol. But, I will look forward to possible improved performance on my machine! =)

rly?
my only thought was why the hell this even need a blogpost? months ago this would just be patched in a normal livingstory patch and now?
they hold back this lil features forever to make the presentation like a patch
they made a break from livingsotry just to can present this blogposts – feels pathetic

pretty much everything announced for the next “feature” pack has been this way. It’s more like a “minor tweaks & tournaments” pack. Unless they pull out something amazing (which they’ve never done) it’s more like a bug patch.

Mike O Brien.4613:

snip
See you in-game,
Mike O’Brien

Thanks Mike. I think it’s important to know that many of us know exactly why you don’t respond. Do I know why you’re not planning SAB & such? Yeah. Am I disappointed? Yeah.

Shriketalon.1937:

Greetings and Salutations!…..
Ready? Here we go!

You nailed a bunch of points… My favorites were:

I have no reason to like these people. (though I do disagree that they are witty & interesting. I find the writer’s “wit” annoying as balls.)

These guys represent NOTHING about the lore. tbh, Guild Wars 2 represents little of the old lore at all. I think that’s one of the reasons I feel like these character’s are pet characters that satisfy the writers compulsions, & do no service to the Guild Wars universe.

lack of mix & match kills it for me. It’s nice they are account wide & don’t need transmutation. But tbh, all the Armor you PAY for should not require you to pay AGAIN when you want to use it.

Ugh.. yeah too late. Collar is idiotic. Outfit rather than Armor skin is the 2nd deal breaker. No thanks.

The choices are absolutely about money, & analytics are a huge way for them to figure out how to get that profit. But analytics just show where people gravitate in what you have it’s not that great at showing where to go. Do people gravitate towards LS more than SAB, well dur.. of course they do. it’s the only IN GAME content they add that also has rewards. Doesn’t mean we don’t want full expansions with new classes, races weapons & dungeons way more.
Also I thought SAB was made by basically 1 guy. or just a very tiny team. Shouldn’t that make 0 impact on the LS team?

Please, in then name of all that is holy, shrink the collar on the Ceremonial Plated Outfit! Make it close & high, not big & wide. He looks like he’s wearing a dog cone!

I would totally buy this without the clown collar, but right now, it’s a deal breaker. I doubt the silly huge fan is going to be a big draw to players. Just make it extend from the neck by just a few inches or so. It’s just silly.

Yeah, they seriously could not have made less sense with the response.. I don’t know why they keep harping on how “successful” they think the Living Story is. If they are talking about metric that show how many people play it, that’s ridiculous. Of course people are going to play NEW content that has encounters & rewards. That has to be the dumbest way to determine how “great” the LS is. The characters & writing are constantly getting hammered by players about how irritating & dumb they are but the content is new & it’s the only non-pay method by which we can get new rewards. If every LS update was just another Dungeon path with a new rewards, achievements & no story, you’d have the same # of people playing that. It doesn’t mean that people love sitting through cringe-worthy dialog. And forcing people to replay it for achievements it only going to further reinforce the delusion that the Living Story is the best way to release content.

And SAB “doesn’t easily fit into the narrative structure of Living World”? Are you kidding me? Did it ever fit into the “narrative structure” of anything? I’m sorry, but the “narrative structure” is the worst part of the LS! The maps & art are great, the mechanics are cool, but the story & characters are the weakest point! The last thing Anet should be doing is making sure that the only new content that is made “easily fits into” the worst aspect of the game.

Anet, no, your new characters aren’t “awesome”. I can stand Rox & Brahm on my team, but the rest are like nails on a chalkboard. I sit through the content because I get rewards & achievements.. but this “Story” is not even close to what many ppl enjoyed about GW. & focusing more on the LS than on things like Tengu & SAB & dungeons is not, I think, what a majority of people wanted to see. To think that SAB had by far the best reaction to any content you’re released & that Scarlet has had by far the worst reaction, and that you concluded “yeah, lets stick with Scarlett”… i don’t know. Either this decision is based totally on monetary stats, personal bias or the fact that you’re confusing players going after rewards with players loving the story. But I can’t believe it’s what you think people really want.

Cynz.9437:

at least it is not your common a hero guy went to slay bad dragon and became a king or something, the end

umm.. so? They could make a story about a blob that is really the universe trying to find a way to redefine physics so that spheres can be cubes. It would be the most unique story ever. It would also suck. Different =/= better. Its not all that “different” either. Its, like I said, a pretty basic fantasy story whose defining factor is bias & indiscretion resulting in a fan-fic flavor.

while i admit there IS certain bias showing in the writing, it is more refreshing than majority of other mmorpg stories that are “if you saw one you saw them all”

Its more like a little kid that likes MLP then writes a story about The Black Stallion & the horses just happen to have similar names, attitudes & elements from MLP. Of course its going to appeal to ppl who love MLP, but there are very legitimate reasons for Black Stallion fans to say its garbage. GW2 does not feel like a gw story. Its more like a fan-fic where the writer seems more interested in themselves than the gw universe. Its not refreshing, its iritating.

Cynz.9437:

besides what’s wrong with sylvari? they are new race, tehy are on rise, ofc there will be a lot stuff going on about them… i am pretty sure we will have enough to do with humans norns and charr once story moves to jormag karkatorrik and co.

I think id be more ok with them if restraint was shown in their creation. They are the best crafters, as strong as Norn, magically gifted, their mother is a Demigod & the center of the world if not universe, they can now claim the most brilliant mortal of all time while the race has no reason to be & they are the writer’s moral compass for the universe. Scarlett is the penultimate example of the writer’s lack restraint: the ultimate mortal (& this is said to be natural) she’s a master of everything, she’s comprehend the eternal alchemy without her head exploding (which they tried to back pedal with player doing similar) she’s got an attitude & dialog that is 100% contradictory to her actions just so she can be hip & cool & sassy on top of everything else. (Harley Quinn is not going to negotiate an alliance with the Syrians & Israel. But look out, Scarlett is just so awesome she can do it!) She even sodomizes lord farren & its supposed to be a funny joke. & after all the murder & sodomy, they are trying to bill her as “misunderstood”

In the light of this stuff any naivete they could made the race interesting with is meaningless. It can only be used to make ambient sylvari dialog “cute” & “charming”, another thing we keep being beat over the head with. “Witty” dialogue. I actually kinda like the Malyck story, but frick, most of the Sylvari stuff is annoying.

The Sylvari feel more like an exercise in bias & lack of restraint. Whereas the Norn (the writer’s least favorite race) are no longer the best craftsmen, no longer the strongest, are essentially dumb, have little story impact (regardless the fact that the single greatest feat 1 person has made against a dragon is to knock out a tooth, they made sure the only thing they say about it is to have two women mock the event & talk about how their grandmother was more impressive). & all this even though the 2nd most chosen race is Norn & the 2nd least chosen is Sylvari.

No I think there are plenty of very legit reasons to find fault with the Sylvari & the writing. Especially the LS.

CureForLiving.5360:

DarksunG.9537:

Pretty much this.. The LS is a plot framework slathered with the writer’s personal biases set in what’s left of the Guild Wars universe..

What am I saying? Whoever thinks not having a bias is even possible or that having one is in some way bad, is a very silly person. The only problem occurs when one enters a state of self delusion in order to reinforce present biases when confronted with contradictory information.

Oh for crying out loud. For someone who is making passive aggressive jabs at me for not understanding “human thinking in general” you have trouble understanding implication. You then go on to say that the only case where personal bias is bad is one where “self delusion in order to reinforce present biases when confronted with contradictory information”. Which is hilarious because if there is a standard by which one can refute anther’s bias’, in this case contradictory data, that means you subscribe to a form of positivism, or at the very least are using data to determine the validity of ones bias. I understand you don’t subscribe to a form of positivism because I understand what you are getting in general, but it just shows to what extent you’re trying to drum up ways to try to label my criticism “silly”.

My point, which was implicit, was that I don’t like a Guild Wars where the story is: about Sylvari & how important & central they are, tries to do as little with Norn as possible, shows disdain for males, dislikes old lore (especially the gods) & makes pet characters JUST BECAUSE THE WRITER LIKES/DESIRES/HAS A FETISH FOR THIS STUFF. And I don’t think it’s particularly faithful or respectful to the Guild Wars 1 writing. It’s Biased & it’s obvious. Just because you like the bias doesn’t mean it isn’t there, & doesn’t mean it’s a good way to write.

As far as “self delusion in order to reinforce present biases when confronted with contradictory information” I think that explains perfectly the idea that they still try to convince us how “cool” & “intricate” Scarlet was.

RedStar.4218:

At one time, I wanted them to explain Scarlet. To delve into her past, to get her motivations.

Now, I don’t know. Like others have pointed out, the LS2 feels like a checklist. They read the thread, they read the complaints, which is extremely nice, but it is done in a way that feels like “so on the forum they say that we should mention that. Okay, so let’s mention it out of nowhere. Now that this is done, second complaint”.

Explaining her “past” does nothing to make that cheesy overpowered jokester remotely viable. She’s just an exercise in wish-fulfillment. I literally laughed out loud when they tried to insinuate that Scarlet “learned” how to manipulate followers by studding Varesh. It was insulting. Varesh wasn’t a leader because they made her “sassy” & spout joke catch-phrases & insults. You don’t get followers by acting like a kitteny teenager that has melodramatic talks about how “No one can tell me what to do!”. And a Sylvari is the smartest, best crafter, planner, mage, leader, most capable mortal ever? kitten , how much more biased can they get with that race? In the words of Plinkett: “Stop trying to feed me this pig slop!”

Blockhead Magee.3092:

Totally indifferent. While the story so far is off to a better start than the last LS – I’m bored by another Sylvari focus. Nothing about the sylvari is compelling and Anet is jamming them down our throats.

Pretty much this.. The LS is a plot framework slathered with the writer’s personal biases set in what’s left of the Guild Wars universe..

After the last two years you should’ve learned not to trust these “Dungeon Masters.”

Your sig makes a lot of good points. Yeah, it’s gonna take a major tone & character shift to get close to what made GW1 cool. But they are 100% dedicated to this bizarre fanfic. They still try to ram how “awesome” & “misunderstood” & “genius” Scarlet was. So much denial it’s just odd.

Labjax.2465:

I’m gonna be the odd man out here. Maybe it’s because I’ve yet to play a Sylvari, but all I could think is, “Why is this tree half dead because of one dragon attack?” And, “If it’s that easy to take her down, why didn’t Mordy do it a long time ago? Or a thousand other baddies? Does she have some kind of cloaking shield that hides the Grove?”

Agreed.. Not sure why people have “feels” over this. Forgal & Tybalt, sure. I liked those guys.. Fun characters that aren’t over-powered, given artificially puffed-up importance just trying to do their job & make a difference. Pale Tree.. I kinda wish she never existed. Such a non-Guild Wars feeling character creating a non-Guild Wars feeling race, given way WAY too much importance that we have to sit through for 2 years of living story. The Pact leader is Sylvari, Scarlet is an over-powered pet character Sylvari, the Sylvari are automatically given the moral high ground, unlimited skill sets, & recently we’re hinted that the Pale Tree is the center of the universe Or at least Tyria. With a less interesting & flavorful personality than any of the gods.. Which have conveniently been removed & even downplayed in their “true” importance & mucked with their lore. Yeah, no. Not worth “feels” for me, especially considering there is no way the Pale Tree is gonna “die”, unless they want to spend about 6 months of dev time adding an entire phase tot he Sylvari. Which I guess I could see them doing since that is the race they get hot & bothered over. Regardless if it is the 2nd least played race..

would be cool… I want more GW1 stlye, bear-chested Norn gear.

Nude? You’ve got to be kidding. Norn females would be wearing far less then that. honestly the only armor that actually looks “Norn” like for the females in Kekai’s Jora concept art.

The male Norns don’t walk around bear-chested because it adds protection, they do it because they are Norn. Freezing, arctic weather & they don’t wear tops because they love the feel of it!

Rather Trahearne than the Teen-Girl-Squad.

Anmida.4058:

I would enjoy it wholeheartedly if she died. I don’t mind the character. I mind the sole asuran intellect to be put to discover the new, exciting intrigues of Arenanet Plot Points 0.1 is a randomized child, that happens to be a watered down version of Zojja.
Really now. Another asura female with a golem and a sassy attitude.

We can do much better. Bring in the quirky males and the actually brilliant asuran females, not unsupervised children to work as Deus Ex Machina’s for the plot.

Love you people, though.

As awesome as that would be I think we’ve seen that sassy female is pretty much the LS default. And expecting a male? hah! That’s the last thing they want.

Naus the Gobbo.5172:

I hated Forgal, and I think Taimi is better than Tybalt.

Well, lots of people thought Twilight was high-art, so..

Mikal Dynath.6195:

Belinda.

Now I don’t have to listen to the god awful “dialogue” between Marjory and Kasmeer.

I was gonna say neither but you brought up a great point…

Tybalt.

Definitely Tybalt.

They haven’t had a cool character in this game since Tybalt & Forgal..

Farzo.8410:

I want Kasmeer and Marjory gone. I think their characters are uninteresting.

That leaves with Taimi (with Scruffy), Rox (with Frostbite) and Braham. Now throw in Lord Faren instead of Kasmeer and Marjory, and maybe a completely new character, and I’m all good.

that could work. They all kinda suck, but Braham & Rox are the least annoying. They’ve forgotten since Tybalt & Forgal how to make cool, fun characters. Now the template seems to be MLP & ERP Fanfics.

The hilarious melodrama drummed up for Marjory went hand-in-hand with the horrible in-your-face “you’re a shcmoopie!” character herself. Working as intended.

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Human_female_light_armor

Human Female Light Armor “Skimpy” (16 sets)
~Inquest
~Sorcerers
~Embroidered
~Masquerade
~Winged
~Feathered
~Apprentice
~Conjuer
~Primative
~Aurora (only because its sleeveless)
~Diviner
~Tribal
~Profane
~Pheonix
~Flamekissed
~Incarnate

Human Female Light Armor “Well Covered” (29 sets)
~Ascalonian Performer
~Council Ministry
~Nightmare court (90%)
~Forgeman
~Flame Legion
~Armor of Koda (75%) -makes up for what it lacks in covering by heavily plating its pieces
~Armor of the linch (95%)
~Priory Historical
~Whispers Secret (95%)
~Vigils Honor (90%)
~Researchers
~Aristocrats (95%)
~Devout
~Student (90%)
~Drybones (95%)
~Acolyte
~Exalted (95%)
~Illustrious
~Country (95%)
~Magician
~Cabalist
~Seer
~Stately (95%)
~Apostle
~Guild Archmage
~Heritage (95%)
~Aetherblade
~Trickster
~zodiaco

I went ahead and composed a list of “skimpy” and “well covered” human female light armor, to show you guys, that there is far more coverage than you think. Note, that how “reinforced” an armor is, which refers to metal plating, is not a factor, as both male and female armors are ill equipt with plating -as, that is afterall, the point of light armor (for the cloth to be magically infused/woven, and protected by magic rather than steel). Also note that the feminine shape of the armor is likewise not a factor, as armor made for women, obviously must be tailored to their bodies; ie: breast room…

Don’t Bother. The people on this forum don’t like facts.

Varrg.2704:

I can’t stand almost all of them, maybe except Rox. Especially Marjory and Kasmeer, their romance is IMO terribly forced and their conversations are just cringeworthy. It’s straight from a fanfic written by 15 years old girl.

Bingo. Fanfic is the word that describes it best. Doesn’t feel anything like Guild Wars.

Abe Kleine.3568:

We don’t give a kitten about their genders, their goo goo ga ga lovey dovey is screwing with the story and giving us a bad taste in our mouths. It is out of place in the context of the story as it is unfolding. If it was between a man and women I’d STILL be yelling at my screen “NO ONE CARES, SHUT UP! THIS IS SO OUT OF PLACE”

Keep your love OFF that battlefield, there are times to care for one another and there are times to kitten and start fighting.

Interestingly enough, in the case of Logan they constantly brow-beat him because he cares about the Queen & that his feelings will get in the way of Anise’s ill-conceived “protection” But crank the slobber dial to 25 with Marjory & Kasmeer. They don’t know how to do it without going to one extreme or the other.. & both are annoying as frick.

Chase.8415:

Now let’s take the gay element out of this, what is Marjory was a man. Do you think people would complain on the forums about this couple?

I think not.

I think people do not like Marjory and Kasmeer simply because they are lesbians; I do not see ArenaNet pushing out a homosexual agenda.

tbh I think it’s the other way around. I think the only reason ppl like them IS because they are homosexual & it makes ppl feel like hip social justice heroes. If it was a man & a woman most people would be groaning “cheeeeeeese”. But because they are homosexual, the quality of the characters get a free pass by most people because they are afraid to criticize because people like you jump on the “look, homophobe!” bandwagon. I’m sorry you can’t see the obscene level of in-your-face romance novel cheese, but it’s there.

I’d rather they make a homosexual character that is NOT in a relationship or oogling over someone.. It just comes up, yeah, i’m gay, then they just focus on them be a good character.
I’m amazed at how people think gay characters need to focus their entire being around what sex they enjoy. It’s so dumb.