Guild Wars 2

I still want healing in shroud to compensate for a shroud-centric defense, esp if that is our only defense. Just a percentage of healing in shroud would be good

Better start playing power all the time

I am one of the few who actually hates staff but uses it because as a condi user I have no other option. It’s bad at stacking bleeds, it’s slow as hell as an auto and easily avoided, and unless traited has really bad cooldowns. i so hope this greatsword uses both condi and pwr.

If, and it’s a big hopeless if, the elite supports a condi build to then I will give up dm, if not, and I am forced to go pwr, I’ll give up curses. All in all, this spec will likely just be a greatsword and some cruddy shouts or boring vanilla stances. I am so uninsired ankitten ot hopeful. Base class still has huge issues and the spec will just be a shiny cover over a rotting corpse.

Sagat.3285:

Gryph.8237:

Sagat.3285:

BlackBeard.2873:

I actually think this is a very good idea. As it is currently, necro is one of the easiest targets to focus, but also one of the most important. If you let a necro get full life-force, it is basically game over. On the flip side, a necro with no life-force is a sitting duck. If you reduced the high-end value while allowing LF to even-out outside of combat, this would strike an excellent balance.

Thank you for ignoring the issue. From 0 to 100 your cast times are still the slowest,your siphon is still trash,your active defense is still trash,your sucky traits still are still doing what a signet’s passive do etc. Hell of a good balance eh? I’m not going to deny how many times I had to dodge while casting…if most of us are delusional about necro we strongly encourage the devs especially Jon to give us a PvP 101 about necro it will also help attract new players. There should no issue with that right?

There is no way a anet Dev is a better necro than most of the pvp-oriented necro players, and we know how to freakin use DS. The limitations don’t even become apparent until you pvp (or roam in wvw) a lot. If youre talking about pve, this game is faceroll easy unless you are discussing dungeons, then you need a decent group, in which the necro has no place.

0 lifeforce is like taking away all blocks, stealth, mobility, invulnerability, aegis, etc, from other players and making them depend on just TWO dodges for at least the first 60 seconds of a game, and even then if we are focused and shut down before we can even generate LF, its worse.

I’m not sure what side you are taking. I see it as necro shouldn’t be weak(er) at 0 LF instead of necro need to start with some LF even if we do the issues are still there. We need less HP argument about DS less of it’s dominance so again it’s necro shouldn’t be weak(er) with 0 LF instead of necro start with some LF which is a just a laughable bandage.

Sorry sagat I totally support what you’re saying, and I wanted to add that the devs not only fail to understand our class and it’s obvious limitations, but could not even approach the skill level of some of our necro players. Thus, they could not school is in how to improve our play as we are bottle capped at upper echelons of play.

guardians did not have a lot of range, and access to a lot of conditions outside of burn, and now do have access to both giving them increased damage with conditions, more mobility, and increased range. thus why would they continue to plague us with a lack of mobility and defense outside of godkitten ds. I’m tired of the devs limiting our class while continuing to advance and improve the rest

Trahearne always seemed sad to me, maybe because he was a necro and so underpowered compared to all the commanders he had to deal with. So keep him alive so we are reminded of what necros were like when they were part of the game.

Too emo? Hahahhahahahaha

sorudo.9054:

Inimicus.7162:

High concept name right here:

The Thing.

if we’re going all marvel on necro’s, why not call it enchantress/ter…

Sure, if I get Mesmer clones (spirits) and I can shatter them into condi bombs while mesmerizing 5 people, then yeah, call me an enchanter.

Bhawb.7408:

End the scrubbery, fast-casting for everyone!

+ 100000

Decrease our cast times and bring back shade!!!!!!!!!!

Shouts in necro is so vanilla. Warrior mechanic is blah. Was hoping we maybe get spirits that are like Mesmer clones with some group buffs but explode with condis

^ agree. Need to have the weapon work both with condi and power builds, as half of our builds depend on condis

Lol. Hahahah hilarious

But seriously, how much of a dream would blink and invis/stealth be on a necro, considering the skill at which we play now without either mechanic, and without defense outside of shroud.

Sagat.3285:

Lich…I’m getting an insect,carnivorous plant,possessed vibe I’m still with a mix with either thief or warrior I would prefer thief war is too close to us in design already. So yep necro style venoms but I am more worried about base necro.

Agree 100%. Warrior mechanics on the necro would be so vanilla, whereas thief mechanics would change our play style a lot. It would be interesting to say the least esp if we got stealth hahah. In addition, I am greatly concerned they will simply do nothing to change our base class which needs a lot of help

We do need a condi and power focused elite that is not a transform. Plague and lich are good but situational, and let’s face it the goldm sucks kitten .

nonmetamancer
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Bhawb.7408:

My guess is they will be really excited by how much fun counterplay there is for everything we have, like they were super excited about the gigantic SoV signal.

LOL @ SOV, the heal no one uses. I have 2 necros and don’t have it unlocked on my second because its utter trash.

I think Devs need to step away from fighting combat dummies, and play the necro in real Spvp and Wvw to see how they actually perform 90% of the time. the word shutdown comes to mind, as I see them getting shutdown over and over at mid- to high levels of pvp.

Sagat.3285:

BlackBeard.2873:

I actually think this is a very good idea. As it is currently, necro is one of the easiest targets to focus, but also one of the most important. If you let a necro get full life-force, it is basically game over. On the flip side, a necro with no life-force is a sitting duck. If you reduced the high-end value while allowing LF to even-out outside of combat, this would strike an excellent balance.

Thank you for ignoring the issue. From 0 to 100 your cast times are still the slowest,your siphon is still trash,your active defense is still trash,your sucky traits still are still doing what a signet’s passive do etc. Hell of a good balance eh? I’m not going to deny how many times I had to dodge while casting…if most of us are delusional about necro we strongly encourage the devs especially Jon to give us a PvP 101 about necro it will also help attract new players. There should no issue with that right?

There is no way a anet Dev is a better necro than most of the pvp-oriented necro players, and we know how to freakin use DS. The limitations don’t even become apparent until you pvp (or roam in wvw) a lot. If youre talking about pve, this game is faceroll easy unless you are discussing dungeons, then you need a decent group, in which the necro has no place.

0 lifeforce is like taking away all blocks, stealth, mobility, invulnerability, aegis, etc, from other players and making them depend on just TWO dodges for at least the first 60 seconds of a game, and even then if we are focused and shut down before we can even generate LF, its worse.

I hope that the GS has utilities for both condi and power builds. I mean, half our builds are condi, and if we get switched to full power, half my gear is useless for the spec, and I personally dislike the staff, its slow, clunky, has crap damage, but some utility and as a condi user I am forced to take it.

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Achrisos.1360:

Knighthonor.4061:

Reaper-
F1-F4 are transformations into different creatures to fit different roles.

I can see this as a Necro / Engi hybrid where Necs get elixirs as utilities and the secondary (toolbelt) versions of the skills give transformations.

Gross and useless. I’m hoping it has some imagination

How are stances any good? What, another mechanism that is blocked when we go intomdeathshroud? So you blow a stance and go into ds only to find your stance is cancelled or ineffective in ds.

Bhawb.7408:

Colin seemed pretty excited in the interview with Angry Joe, there might have been some stuff elsewhere as well.

I’m not getting my hopes up much. There is a chance we get something cool, but frankly I’m not sure it will really matter to me as long as the core issues are still around.

Agree. Smoke and mirrors. If they don’t address our issues this will be just flowers sprinkled on poop. Yeah, there are some flowers, but at the end of the day it’s still poop

Hey guys, one thing that troubled me (among the several things said during the ready up) was the fact that Necro’s want to be hit. That got me thinking. What mechanisms do we have that supports the idea that we want to be hit?

We have one trait, that gives us retaliation when we go into DS, though it is not very damaging, and we have a cruddy vamp signet that heals us when we get hit, though it is near useless and not used practically at all.

So here are some ideas that would further support the Dev’s idea that the necro wants to be hit.

1. Retaliation: Give us more relatiation power, in that when we have retal up, we truly want to be hit. In fact, give us a trait, or add it to the existing that that when we get hit under the effects of retal, we regen Life force.

2. Death’s mirror/Mirror of Death: Give us a Death Magic grandmaster trait that has two effects (hence the mirror name) – Instead of reflecting damage back, convert a certain (significant but not overwhelming) percent of the damage the necromancer traits into LIFEFORCE when not in death shroud, or into health regen when in DS. That way, we actually want to get hit in certain circumstances, because getting hit actually helps us stay alive to a certain degree (at least in some circumstances). In a 1 v 1, make the percentage not huge, but noticeable, but in a focus fire, perhaps it could scale up at the rate at which we take damage, we regen LF/health faster. More damage, faster rate of LF/Health regen in those circumstance.

3. Another possible idea is that when we get hit by CC out of death shroud a random boon is generated. When hit by CC in LF, an existing condition is cleared.

There are several ideas that could be implemented in order to support the Dev statement that we “want to be hit.”

Right now, I am not seeing it as we don’t get health, life-force, or any added benefit from “being hit.”

Seriously if its AI dependent, or if its immobile spirits that only work in a certain area after you throw them down, I will freakin fold up my tent and go permanently to a diff class.

Im serious, we have raised some serious issues with our class over the past few weeks, most of which is a re-hash of what we have posted over the past 2 years. Is anet going to adress these issues with our core class or are they just going to gloss over it, slap down our spec as a smoke screen and run away in the confusion, never again to address these issues.

I mean, 3 articles (perhaps more), numerous posts with avid discussion (most of which highlights necessary changes that would not be OP), and a community crying out for changes, should ellicit some type of communication from the DEVS. I mean the dev’s bent over backwards to have a discussion about Tomes, and the new name of the guardian spec after a dozen posts, when we have posted 1000s of posts about these issues, and they cannot at least interact with us?

Really worried they will release the spec and that will be that, until 6 months after HOT releases.

PLEASE don’t let it be AI depedent. Anet’s AI = crap.

If it’s AI dependent, I will, without a doubt, shelve this class and play rev.

In addition, spirits, etc, are immobile? WTF? So we are going to get immobile spirits? come on, how will that help us at all, except with stacking in one area for boss fights. YAY, nothing useful for pvp/wvw.

Have the Dev’s even seen our suggestions, or are they going to give us the spec, in hopes it will shut us up and then they will just casually forget about the problems to our class?

I can just see them giving us the spec, and then forgetting that our base class has so many issues.

Lewis Burnell.2493:

Shiki.7148:

Lewis Burnell.2493:

Bhawb.7408:

Starting at max would be way too strong. There are a lot of changes they could make, including better LF gains, but that isn’t one.

Why would it be too strong? I keep hearing people say this, but I’ve never heard a good argument as to why.

You still have no range, no real mobility and no way to reliably retain Life Force when in Death Shroud. The mechanic is pretty self balancing – full or not.

Do you feel overpowered when it’s full now? No. So you really wouldn’t if it started full.

Actually with full Necro would be extremely strong in 1v1’s and some 1v2 scenarios. Starting at half would be enough imho.

Is full Life Force “extremely” strong in 1 v 1’s now? It’s good – but so is Signet Of Stone, or Berzerker Stance. I really fail to see why we shouldn’t have it.

agree. w/o lifeforce against rangers at 1200 we get chewed apart and die in a burst

For example, if you cast staff #2 and then try to cast staff #3, i usually try to dodge before i get 3 off, or do a weapon switch after #3 has started to cast and it does not go off because of the long kitten cast times. So kittenes me off. Also, scepter #2, and dagger 4/5 are so freakin slow. It makes me so kittened off, because all of those skills are already easily dodged.

Great immobile spirits for a kittenty immobile class hahahah. Would end us

Posion in wvw, just always appears weak, as I see it get cleansed so often and the damage is simply not that huge to be worried about it?

Best designed class – Guardian as it has undergone the fewest changes, and yet still is needed in almost every aspect of the game (pvp, pve, wvw)

Worst – Necro. On paper, the necro look so good. In practice, it is not that good. It is good enough to get you over the hump, surive some difficult situations in pve, etc but it pvp or wvw, it is nothing special, as you can be shut down so easily. Spam some cc, necro gets stun locked and its bye bye. Necro’s mechanic, DS, also blocks an entire trait line, and does not interact well with necro skills, abilities, etc. We literally are blocked out of a lot of our skills emplying our only defensive mechanic, DS.

Warriors, are solid, Engiers are solid, mesmers, are amaing in 1 v 1, but have problems vs, thieves, and there are eles. I don’ thave a problem with eles, as they can do amazing things and are also needed in every game aspect. They can do everything. I don’ tsee why people are upset about thieves? They are good in all apsects, amazing in roaming, and good in pvp. In wvw, they are less needed in zerg warfare, but who cares, that gets boring anyways, and I would rather roam anyday than follow a zerg/karma train.

out of all our weapons, this weapon is our most solid, as it does what it needs to do, and does it well. I use it on power builds, and sometimes on condi builds. I cannot see it getting any better other than “maybe” giving it a blast on #4 (woudl be useful, along with axe 3).

If you wanted to make things interesting, it would be cool if they allowed warhorn 5, with a trait (maybe the power focused curses trait) allow 5 allies to become covered in a plague as well, granting them regen, while we were granted an additional spike increase in life force regen.

Are you guys really excited about shouts? I mean, shouts seem like the most boring mechanic in the game? Yay, minor group utility buffs….

I don’ tknow, it just seems shouts are so, vanilla. I keep looking at the rev’s mechanics and continue to hope they will apply some of these mechanics to our class, because we are in most need of help.

If nothing changes, and anet goes with what they have shown us, i will, without a freakin doubt, switch to revenant and shelve my necro. I know they will freakin wiff when it comes to fixing this class, and giving us a useful spec. Seriously, rev here I come, it does what I wanted the necro to do anyways, and has an interesting mechanic. I mean, kitten, i don’t have to worry about stab, i can just dodge, and get 1 stack of stability. LOL.

The proposed changes are weak, both in content and in power, and we will be left behind.

with the cool mechanics being shown by the revenant, I will be highly dissappointed if anet slaps some shouts on our class, coupled with a melee greatsword and calls it our spec.

Boring, took no brain power, and about as dull as bowling with gutter ball bumpers.

Malchior.1928:

Gryph.8237:

I think we should boycott these forums, and only post in reddit or other forums. I mean, they don’t care anyways, but it would at least show them that we do. Make these forums a ghost town until they improve our class, signficantly, and no bs about it.

Somehow I don’t think this would work.

neither do i?

I am glad for guardians, as I like the class, and the guardian community in general has been pretty stagnant and unchanged because I consider it the most balanced class. It can do great damage and the expense of defense, and it can do great defense at the expense of damage output. It takes skill to play a guardian well, and they are wanted in all apsect of the game, given their mechanic and usefulness to groups. Thus, I have no problem with them getting what they have been given.

That said, I am jealous that now they will be able to play a condi build better than we can. I am jealous that a guardian can, with a great deal of defense, play a better condition attrition class, while outputting boons and with a great number of condi clears, etc.

We are just loosing our usefulness in this game. I am just kittened that the devs cannot look at our class and boost it up a bit. Why would they make the guardian class a better condi output class than our weaker, light armored class? kittenes me off, though I am glad for the guardian class, and I would be more content if they would suck it up and improve our general class (f the specs).

This game is too fast paced to have to deal with the pre/post cast times on our weapon skills. Come on anet, decrease the times it takes for us to chain skills together and get off a skill on our weapons. You are holding us back so much because of this.

Why do we suffer these inane casting times, especially when all we have for defense is two dodges, and getting a skill off when we have to dodge is a pain in the kitten , and makes it more difficult for us than necessary.

Our class is so clunky because of these stupid cast times.

Hell, I would riot, boycott, protest, and do anything possible to make the dev’s wake up and see our points of view, which I think are more insightful that they conjur up. As it stands now, I think they are so baised against the necro, that they simply don’t care.

I simply don’t think it would do anything, but if the necros got together and truly wanted to boycott, or stop posting in these forums (as in forums go completely silent here) i would do it.

I think we should boycott these forums, and only post in reddit or other forums. I mean, they don’t care anyways, but it would at least show them that we do. Make these forums a ghost town until they improve our class, signficantly, and no bs about it.

come on guys, anet has favored the guardian since this game launched, it is one of the most solid classes in every aspect of this game. At no point in time did anyone say, hey, guardians are weak. Yes, they don’t have amazing range, but they have all the things that are needed to be wanted in pvp, pve, and wvw. Did you expect one of their golden children to go without in a new expansion? no.

Necros? they dont give two kittens.

100% lingering condition is likely there because anet can’t figure out where to stick condi duration as a stat, and new we would get hosed the most given that 1 of our primary builds depends 100% on conditions. Anet does not know what to do with us in general, and even less when it comes to conditions in their game. Right now they cannot even see that condi cleans in this game can render our entire damage output null. It will likely get changed before release, because necros are not allowed to have skills that make us competitive with their favored classes.

Nekrothaft.6390:

Sorry but, according to Arenanet, Necros are in a good spot right now.

ahahahhahaha anet does not understand its own game. hey anet, try and play the necro, past some of your fall asleep easy pve zones.

No dev response at all, even after the numerous posts, and 2-3 articles blasting the current status of the necro. How can they avoid even discussing this at least, or indicating a “Hey guys, we get it, we will take a look at these things,” or have been taking a look at these things? Still can’t get over the impression that they spent a whole 5-10 minutes going through our traits, merging some crappy ones, and dumping others, whereas they spent days, even weeks on others. Just the old once over for necros…. again.

good for you guardians, now you have everything, range, tankiness, conditions, group utility, blocks, etc, and another class has further impinged upon the necros domain with regard to condition application. Now they should just come out and make necros invulnerable, dress in black and white, do no damage, and stand on the sidelines picking their noses.

and now the necro has been so nerfed that necros are mediocre at best in pvp. These claims are so ridiculous.

Bhawb.7408:

ronpierce.2760:

I think Bhawb has an optimistic problem. He tries real hard to see the good in things, and in a way he’s sort of right in some situations. In other cases, when you really get him to open up, he says a lot of things that sounds less optimistic.

Bhawb, stop being so nice, just accept the fact that we blow! Nerd rage with us, friend!

I tend to be more “optimistic” on the forums because I find it helps me stay more constructive. Plus when you compare me to people constantly thinking all is vain I seem optimistic when I’m really just trying to be realistic. ANet won’t rework us, and if they did, do you really trust them to get it right?

Btw, when I say we don’t need a “rework”, I’m saying that the basic idea of a Necromancer, who builds life force using skills to activate a Death Shroud that replaces your 1-5 skills and gives you life force instead of HP is fine. All of our weapon’s core designs are fine, as our our abilities. I’m not talking balance wise or how they currently work, but just that their core design in most cases is fine.

That isn’t to say there isn’t a heavy amount of work that needs to go into fixing bugs and “features”, adding finishers, changing fields, fixing traits (especially blood magic), adding support, fixing the AI, lowering some cast times/CDs, rebalancing things, and plenty more. But none of those require what I would consider a rework of the profession: a rework to me is essentially deleting everything except the very core theme and rebuilding it from the ground up. We don’t need that, what we need is a pass like Ranger got (but far more heavy-handed), and we need Devs that aren’t scared of upsetting balance for a few weeks (because they’ve NEVER made someone OP for months on end right?) to fix a severely broken profession.

I just disagree with the large number of posts I see that seem to think we need to trash everything we have and rebuild it.

I agree with what you’re saying. A rework of DS? No. Buffs, reworking traits, decreasing cast times on weapons, increased survivability, slight increase in condi output, blood magic being allowed to synergies with DS, and DS needs to be more condi friendly. That would go a long way. We are lackluster in almost all categories of the game.

Bhawb.7408:

Gryph.8237:

So tired of everyone trying to sugar coat the problems by saying, we are so good in x, when x is like 20% of the game

To be fair, we’re really good in downedstate, and when playing a Necro being downed is probably more than 20% of your time.

Ha too true, too true

Flumek.9043:

Its nice that the article showed a clear “NO, necro just plain sux” and didnt apply the sugarcoat PR filter.

Thank god for that. So tired of everyone trying to sugar coat the problems by saying, we are so good in x, when x is like 20% of the game. I don’t buy the line that if they buff necros we could become too strong. No one is asking to make us OP, we are asking to be on par with the other classes, and not be rubbish when it comes to defense/survivability. I mean if we are meant to be slow, non-mobile death machines, than up our defense or at least give us more ways to stop peole from running away, resetting ect. And for god’s sake decrease the cast times on some of our weapon skills. Tired of having to be precognizant to land a skill

I am sorry but it goes beyond just fixing bugs. Necros need a boost in several areas, but im tired of repeating myself and what others have wrote. I find more and more it doesn’t matter, as gw2 is already a moneymaker for these guys, so compassion about the game goes out the window.