Guild Wars 2

I finally found the magic unicorn where you can do 10k backstab on in pvp! :O Tried to reproduce this again, but I think I rly just got lucky with all the situations here :P Squishy squishy ele, why do you run?

Strength runes
A few might stacks (can’t be sure how many).
25/30/0/0/15
10k backstab on a squishy elementalist …

I think our dmg is still okay? I don’t think I’ve ever had a 10k backstab before in my entire life.

Sigil of intelligence. 3 guaranteed crits when my crit chances were below 50% is a fun buff. Also since it doesn’t share cooldown anymore, so I can still use my sigil of hydromancy on the same setup.

Tried using 2 of the new GM traits, but didn’t like both (trickery and DA) for PvP. Went back to my pre-patch build but got 3 in trickery instead of acro now. I can swing PW 3 times without the extra initiative costing me anything (cause I get 3 extra initiative, it balances out).

Overall I lose a dodge with this patch. My damage output starts slow but compensates at lower health where I get guaranteed crits on weapon swap (when I change to a real burst attack).

Zepidel, I doubt it, they really really really hate 3rd party programs (a lot of people got banned from GW1 for using small things like that)

With the addition of the Wardrobe system and the removal of the PvP locker, players will receive one Transmutation Charge for every PvP rank they have achieved.

Bugged, r45 and didn’t get anything.

Syde.5961:

You were probably called a noob because….

1. You didn’t let the enemy bleed off point.
2. You took too long winning a 1 v 1 and ended up losing the lead. (Never fight a bunker 1 v 1 unless you can dispatch them quickly)
3. Your team ended up losing a point and getting wiped b/c you didn’t rotate for them.

There’s a lot more reasons you could have been called a noob. Remember tpvp is about being a team, no one cares if you can win a 1 v 1.

Except he was doing sPvP. I’m wondering if he means solo queue or hot join though. If it’s solo queue, your criteria still fit. In hot join, he just got hated for killing someone.

Precast PW and only teleport in with steal when you’re in the evade form. It’ll trigger all necro traps without being hit.

Static.9841:

Liewec.2896:

i always wondered how you hambows, PW thieves and decap engis would attempt to justify ruining the game for everyone else with your low risk/high reward builds.

Heh, I’m not a PW thief, in fact I find those guys absolutely hilarious, not to mention how quickly they drop. PW is the new HS spam and equally as skilless – most of these clowns are just spamming it in the air hoping they hit something.

That said, is it them ruining the game or the game mechanics in place that are ruining it? Usually in other games when there’s some ‘win button’ build, something is quickly done about it, this game, not so much.

I’ve been a pw build since January when everyone would laugh at you using PW for being the weakest skill in the weapon setups. It’s just sad that one small change that’s actually still weaker than the original version, could change the feeling of a worthless attack to a skilless attack.

That being said, swinging in thin air sometimes have purpose. For example if you have 2s left on your healing skill, wasting initiative for a 2s breather can save your life.

But agreed , spamming PW isn’t the way to play S/P. Those people die easily with well timed attacks. More high-end thieves will know when to use pw besides the other 4 skills which all have their purposes.

Aikijin’s comment about intra-class psychology is correct. I think we are one of the most competitive classes in our own class. The class I like to duel most against is a thief, and the fight that gives me most satisfaction for winning, is the thief.

Especially if you both hit low health a few times and manage to survive with kites/blinds/environmental use

Stealth rez and stealth finish can be easily countered by just CC’in their spot. S/P pistolwhips is great since you can repeat it. Just remember where the original downed person is and try to hit his periphere with it after the first CC. Chances are the thief will go to the other side and try to revive there and make you waste your cc on the downed body.

Then again, if you’re a warrior or something with AoE stuns, you can just aim at the location and laugh.

I love using shadow refuge offensively. I once used SR on top of the enemy thief who immediately switched to SB to #2 me. I switch to my dagger mainhand and backstabbed him 1-2 s after casting SR. In the meanwhile he was stuck into SB for 9s because of his reflexes.

Another way I love using SR is to cast it on a running enemy. Shadowstep in it and backstab him immediately.

But without the stun ppl would just walk away every time since you’re rooted. At least put an immob in but I think ppl hate immob more than stuns since it stacks. (imagine a team of 3 S/P thieves in wvw just spamming pw if it would immob)

In theory, the DA gm would fit my build well. I just took 30 in DA (normally had 25) to test out having less dodge from 15 acro. Takes a bit of adjusting but I think it’ll do fine.. Though panic strike is fun on 30 DA as well so might actually take panic strike over revealed training if I don’t like it after all

As for Bewildering ambush: Would work greatly on S/P thieves. Some S/P thieves used to run x/30/x/x/30 without sleight of hand (cause their pistolwhip already stuns “on” steal). This would buff their steal skill without the “loss” of sleight of hand.

Don’t like CS GM.
SA GM sounds decent but I haven’t played 30 SA for more than a year .. and not likely to turn back to it.
No comments to Acr GM

They basically were tricked by the old flame legion into believing that their titans were really invincible and godlike. This was untrue as ascalonians (GW prophecy heroes: YOU) killed them. Pyre Fierceshot revolted and was sent to prison for this. In eye of the north you found pyre somewhere and saved him. He told you (half threatening the mesmer that he would eat the “mouse”) that he’ll help you as long as you’re against the flame legion and thus a whole story started with you saving his warband.

He started a revolution that ended with Kalla Scorhrazor (statue in black citadel) who restored the society to it’s old ways: Female and male warriors in warbands. This doubled their bodies in battle and caused them to outnumber the flame legion and led to their demise. She was after assassinated by some flame legion imperator.

Rassase.7943:

i was d/d thief for loooong, switching to d/p was so good, d/d is about 25% less effective(spvp) no matter what build you run, they need rework of skill 3 and 4.

Wouldn’t work in my build cause D/ mainhand is my secondary weapon which is only used for 3 hits: Sigil of hydromancy, c&d and backstab. The surprise of the swap when suddenly going into burst is gone if I’d run D/P since I have to either run an utility for the stealth (but lose out on vuln and 2-5k damage on c&d) or waste too many time on BP-stealth (which mostly would cost too much ini anyway as a finisher burst)

1) S/P and D/D
2) 25/30/0/15/0
3) PvP, WvW, PvE

Ghostwolf.9863:

Thieves used to be the same about a year ago, but after all nerfs and minor buffs thrown around, we are now stuck with 10/30/0/x/x, there are other builds out there that are fun to play and personal, but often they are underperforming and doesn’t feel competitive enough, and I don’t have this feeling when trying builds alternate to the meta builds on the classes I mentioned.

I haven’t seen a 10/30/30/0/0 build in quite a while honestly.(N.b. you don’t have to type x since with that setup, you don’t have room for more trait points). Most people run alternatives now since shadow arts is crap in pvp …

People don’t really seem to be answering the question are they? …

I can’t find the source right away but during one of the pre-release interviews they stated that they named the thief THIEF instead of ASSASSIN because assassins were trained in cantha. With the movement of the world cantha was isolated from the rest of the world. Thus no assassins would be seen outside cantha anymore.

Try looking up the youtube interviews about the thief pre-release. It’s said in there somewhere (while they were introducing steal and initiative while spamming unload if i’m not wrong.)

I find it funny how S/P seems to went from crap to “cheesy op” or “low skill tier” in a year time while it didn’t get any substantial buffs (compared to the nerfs that it got)

In general the thief only has 3s to 4s stealth. This means that you have to “survive” in that time period. This also means that in that time period, the thief will run from his last known position (LKP) to your back. If he doesn’t use any shadowsteps, you can count the time he needs to get to you (while you’re kiting with your back away from LKP). Just before he would arrive you, you dodge forward and turn again (debatable).

I dodge forward cause I recon the thief is at my back already, which means that dodging forward creates more space than dodging backwards. But it’s debatable I suppose, some ppl recommend dodging backward cause it’s further away from LKP.

As a thief myself, I’d use the same tactic, only go offensive when he reaches close to me. Pistol whip for example has an inbuild evade which if lucky, also does some damage to him while I outlast his stealth. Mesmers can use blurred frenzy. Warriors, ele’s, necro’s (and maybe even others, Idk) can use PbAoE CC. Like someone said earlier, you have #5 on hammer and #5 on shield though I personally don’t like using #5 hammer because if you miss it, it has a high cooldown. On my thief, I have initiative so I just have to adjust slightly for missing my pistol whip and go more defensive. But the cooldown for the guard’s knockback is too much for a gamble imo. And like said before as well, shield knockback is held for shadow refuge.

You guys should also remember that dagger has poison on the third hit. So if your dummy would heal himself now and then, the dagger will kill him faster with only AA.

Menzies The Heretic.3415:

Removing the blind and slightly increasing the range would be 10x more usefull.
Why the hell would you IA into someone?

The arrow is shot from about half the height of the player. So if you are firing it over a bump or a low obstacle, the arrow gets stuck and you only shadowstep for a few inch. Wasting precious initiative. While teleports will not get stuck in the line of sight.

Before blind put you into combat, the blindness was actually useful while fleeing. Imagine you’re running away from person A in a narrow way, and suddenly person B is on the other side. You’re still ooc so you can just use IA on person B (or A for that matter) which blinded them so they couldn’t hit you with the first swing, immediately follow up with a second IA or shadowstep. You’re still OOC but no longer surrounded

Blindness now, however, put you into combat. So it’s less useful.

Fake or not: Poor guardians getting a spirit weapon .. At second thought yay even more zoo’s in pvp -_- ! Cause they’ll buff spirits if this was true.

Even when you use 1 random tree in the entire field to block line of sight it’s called “unfair” anyway. So why bother?

In real life those would be the walls position yes. Always use your environment when creating defenses. Natural defenses are usually the easiest to defend. The old Romans always used natural defenses in their strongholds one way or another.

Buttercup.5871:

For the record, I think John is referring to an actual risen chicken in the game. You meet it during the mission “estate of decay” in the personal story line. You can’t kill the chicken until the conversation between Galina and Snarl has ended (Galina Edgecrusher: “That’s the most resilient chicken ever. Whoa – it’s coming right at us!”). If you do try to engage the chicken, it can kill you but you can’t kill it.

There’s also a chicken in ebonhawke that is immortal.

frans.8092:

Viking Jorun.5413:

Please, make it a boon so I can switch to Sword/Dagger and steal stealth from a thief who’s just popped Shadow Refuge.

I’ll steal it right back, you rascal you!

Shadow refuge: 10s stealth
2 S/D thieves facing each other
FS/LS spam

Who’ll be the last one in stealth?! Bets are on!

maddoctor.2738:

From the wiki:
While in Lich Form, the caster will be granted stability for the duration.
Plague also grants stability for the duration.

From what I understand, while using these 2 skills you are supposed to be immune to CC (stability) but what happens if someone strips that stability? Is it reapplied or not?

If not, shouldn’t this be fixed by making Stability last only 1 second but reapply itself every second so you have perma stability while using these 2 skills?

It’s like tornado or dagger storm. They have stability with a duration equal long to the skill’s duration. The stability isn’t tied to the skill, it’s just granted on skill activation. Stripping stability from those elite skills is a counter-ability.

^That’s rough yeah … Always read the small letters Burnfall. Contracts are evil!

Burnfall.9573:

We had no say whatsoever in our design, in our creation…so why no one accepts us?

Not sure where you’re from. But most people get to choose their own race/profession and their looks in this game… Maybe try and talk to your provider why you aren’t allowed to.

Isn’t this much like the old S/D evade spam before #2 nerf? Didn’t that build a lot but from what I can see, it looks like it has a lot in common..

SoLeciTO.3490:

As a thief i can say it hits like a truck . . . once it just kitten d me with 2 or 3 hits. . .

But i do not really think is OP because of the cool down.

Problem is that like some necroes here already said. They can trait for a DS with 10s cd that hits just as hard… 5k dmg per shot while we as thief are in close combat can be devastating

That perma stealth for only appears for 1 sec to hit you for 6-12k and go stealth again and if you are about to lose reset the fight. … perma vigor and perma dodges.

So since last patch thieves are able to perma stealth, hit for (mean) 9k damage, have perma vigor and can perma dodge? I didn’t know 25/30/30/30/0 build was so strong!

^awww, a moa in his natural environment with all those “trees”! :P
Anyway, in that case the spirits should die and again I plead for recharge on all utilities/skills once Moa is over with a slight healing (not too much). This punishes people for using such a strong utility without following up with the kill. In most cases you were supposed to die anyway as a Moa.

ronpierce.2760:

Well I agree, in a perfect world. But at this point i’m to compromise. Its odd that they say its a transformation but that causes them to die but it doesn’t do it to other pet users… How does that work?

Does it destroy ranger spirits too? (genuinely a question)
I know it destroys guardian spirits (not that they exist in pvp anymore)

Ranger’s pet doesn’t get destroyed because it isn’t summoned with a skill. Same goes for creatures spawning with runes because those aren’t skills.

Another way is to C&D him while he’s stealthed. His location is very easy to deduce when he BP+HS. Since you used your’s later, you’ll be in stealth longer or he has to use BP again. This gives you more initiative than him.

I usually use backstab right after C&D to pressure his health. Even if he backstabs me now I’ll have acces to stealth earlier than him. (Though this way is risky without my first part of the fight, which doesn’t use D/D but S/P)

S/P work good if you’re able to dodge the blind on BP-cast. When he leaps, use pistolwhip. It’ll stun him before he hits you and thus prevents the stealth (while still using up his initiative). Follow with 1 or 2 swings from autoattack and then get distance again to dodge BP and stun HS again.
D/D is my second set because it does more damage, once my opponent is below 50% I’d cast basilisk venom and switch to D/D (sigil of hydromancy chills him and petrifies him, works very nice in shadowrefuge because the blast is the range of SR) and c&d/backstab him. (You can deduce his location due if basilisk hit him on the location he was during the cast. Otherwise you’ll notice it, this means you’ll have to decide, risk finding his location (difficult) or move out and prepare a second skirmish)

Swimfan.8014:

LOl? Sb works just as it should in PVE but in PVP it’s a joke. Whoever gets killed by a sb should leave PVP right on the spot!

What if both were down to 100 health and one switched to shortbow and wins the fight? :o Do they have to leave PvP? :o
(I agree that dying from 100% by SB is ridiculous, but SB is capable of killing if used right during combat)

ronpierce.2760:

It lasts 10 sec but puts ALL of a minion masters minions on full cooldown… (Each ranging from 16 to 60 seconds)… Also 240 second cool down isn’t long when it is literally an “I win button” against 1 spec. And if this was changed it wouldn’t break it against everyone else, so why are you defending it from being fixed? If it never gets used then it doesn’t affect you, so go away…?

Make it so that Moa’ing has a downpart too. Like if they are capable to survive the moa form, all cooldowns are recharged or they gain x health back.
Right now being moa’d (in team battles if you’re caught off guard it’s wrecking) has absolutely no downpart for not killing them on time.

I personally don’t really mind Moa that much, but I think the first suggestion of mine will help your necromancer problem?

I thought the projectile cleansed a condi from any ally it hits on it’s path (towards the enemy)? Nonetheless it’s very clunky to use an ally-based projectile.

Because they are rare, doesn’t mean they aren’t viable. I roam and zerg with my S/P setup.

Sir vincent:
“…disproving the notion that you can capitalise on sub-25 Vulnerability with Mug and somehow get more damage than using SS.”
“If the group gets 25 stacks without you, don’t take SS and use Mug to capitalise on the maximised stacks.”

The first sentence means that mug will never be stronger than SS when the monster does NOT has 25 stacks of vulnerability. This is because even 1 stack of vulnerability (+1% incoming damage) will outdamage mug.

The second sentence says: If the monster DOES have 25 stacks, SS will be useless because it can’t add an extra stack. In this case mug is better.

And since only 1% extra damage already outdamages mug, just AA the enemy will be able to maintain one stack. Heck it’s even easy to maintain 4 stacks with my high evade build.

NinjaEd.3946:

Truthfully I dislike PW and think it isn’t thief fitting at all. If we are supposed to be nimble fighters how is a channeled root skill fit into that? Even if it has an evade in it still it seems silly imo. I say nimble to shorten up the description of thief from the wiki.

Swashbuckling pirates steal stuff too and are thieves too. S/P is more a pirate than an assassin

I can only see 1 use for it atm:
When you missed the first part, you won’t have to waste your time being rooted there while eating damage by certain skills that bypass the evade

Big Tower.5423:

Rahar.9872:

Reckless.6325:

@Rahar – Lol you don’t do much pvp or any sort either then i assume?

…

Rahar.9872:

Rahar.9872:

…

Perhaps you could try a different spec or weaponset? I’m not really too sure what the 10% thing you’re talking about is.

We got no other viable weaponsets or specs.

S/P and D/P are both viable, at least from an sPvP standpoint. If you need 30 Shadow Arts to play, you need more practice.

Spvp is not wvwvw. In wvwvw only D/D, p/D and D/P D/P and d/D is becoming useless. and i never play condi. so i suppose we’re wrecked :P

You attacked him for not playing PvP, which he responded to.
As for WvW: Sword thieves are also viable in WvW, and shortbow is good weapon too. D/D isn’t becoming useless with a minor 10% damage nerf. It’ll be harder but not useless.

Arkantos.7460:

Gwalchgwn.1659:

…

they would deal with it, if permastealth at the end gets killed

Sad part is that they’ll probably just move on to the next topic on thieves to cry about. Do you know that “perma-dodge” is a term starting to grow on forums now?

Only thing that I can imagine ppl crying about with this change is:
Blind/stealth stomp. Normally we have can either blind stomp, stealth stomp or ShS stomp. But this just combines two of our safeguard nets at once. Even if they did clear blind on time to use their downed CC, you’d be in stealth.

But other than that it sounds great for me

yski.7642:

Bazzoong.7145:

“cough”

I was refering to the combination of blind and stealth, not stealth alone. It can be pretty tricky landing anything on a good d/p, though I do admit there are some d/d sustain builds as well. I just find them a lot easier to deal with simply because CnD is pretty easy to dodge.

Also, to go totally off topic: I don’t actually have a gaming mouse or macros. Muscle memory ftw

Gwalchgwn.1659:

Yski, can’t you upload a video of you’re 4 signet backstabs unedited? Showing how often you have to run for your life or die before you get those clean kills? People here really think that a youtube video is 100% accurate and those players in there never die cause it doesn’t show them dying.

I could, but it’s mostly just me running around in hopes of actually finding someone.

…

Deal. ~2 hour raw roaming clip coming right up :P

You could skip the parts where you’re just running around, not encountering anyone. :P

I mean a fair fight as in, going for the kill and not randomly going out of combat because you were losing.
Shadow refuge in WvW is a good utility when playing in group yes, but if you’re alone it’s just a panic button to escape afterwards most of the time. As for slow thieves dead thieves, unlikely. The speed buff in combat is hardly anything worth writing home. If you don’t use the active part of it, it’s just a waste of slot in combat (though I’ve seen some thieves cleverly use the active blinding part, so I’m not saying the utility itself is useless).

I’m just saying that those utilities aren’t a “must” in every thief build out there.
(In case this seemed off-topic discussion: This discussion means that there IS place for traps in our utility bar, IF they weren’t so crap at least)

As for shadow trap being a “get out of jail card”. In small fights I preferred using it offensively or for baiting. Only when I see a big fight incoming, I would use it to break free and escape. This second part got nerfed and trying to activate the untriggered part takes too long.

yski.7642:

…*

Yski, can’t you upload a video of you’re 4 signet backstabs unedited? Showing how often you have to run for your life or die before you get those clean kills? People here really think that a youtube video is 100% accurate and those players in there never die cause it doesn’t show them dying.

^Why do you NEED shadow refuge and SoS?
I run infiltrator’s signet, RFI and ShS which works perfectly fine. Makes it harder to escape a fight sure, but doesn’t make it unviable in a fair fight.

Pre-shadow trap nerf I used shadow trap instead of RFI. But I don’t like how clunky it is now when not triggered..