Oh man. Sometimes I leave WvW and maybe try running a dungeon, Sometimes I think I might even finish my personal story. Then I run into this. Do you know how hard it is to find 4 people willing to accept someone who is very forthright about not already knowing the dungeons in this game? It doesn’t matter that I can play the game well, and throughly understand its mechanics. If you’re going to be asking for pointers on every boss, you’re useless. It’s kind of funny how toxicly competitive the part of the game designed to be the least competitive is. Yeah, I wanna run in my PVT gear, and yeah, I wanna try something new once in a while. So I guess, yeah, by the PvE community’s rigorous standards, I am greedy. Sorry!
I do know how hard it is.
It isn’t hard at all. I constnatly see people clueless about dungeons getting into PUGs, 99% of the PUGs I am in are with inexperienced players and almost none of the ones I am in involve Zerkers.
It sounds to me that you’re complaining more about hypotheticals than actual experiences, or you’re just absurdly unlucky. Ask your guild, ask the maps, ask the people milling around the dungeons. There’s even plenty of lfgs on that one lfg site that you can get into with Zerks or prior knowledge.
Put up your own lfg. You’ll get hits in no time, even if you put that you’re inexperienced.
I do dungeons constantly, I simply and adamantly do not believe this is a problem.
Why should I be forced to do any dungeon for the tokens? I like the way Arah armor looks but don’t like Arah at all. Why should I be forced to do any of the paths?
I hope you see what I’m getting at regarding your logic.
I think Magic Find on gear was absolutely a problem.
You basically had to miss out on an entire stat for a very marginal increase to your chance to obtain rarer gear.
It was a non-choice and was basically telling you that you had to be less effective at the game if you wanted to turn your .01% chance into a .03% chance.
Guardians are bad and need buffs and by the Six Anet pls make us heal for more and do more damage. And more mobility and CC too please, like cripples. Thx.
I cannot, for the life of me, understand why you think guardians are bad.
We’re useful in every venue of the game.
Are we the best in any section? Probably not, no, but we’re still useful. We don’t have glaring issues like necromancers and engineers, certainly.
He was joking =).
It was very late when I wrote that response. Rereading his post now, I can’t imagine for the life of me why I thought he was serious.
Honestly, it’s absolutely not hard to find a non-zerker dungeon group. You’re complaining about being looked down upon by Zerkers but that’s, what? On the forums? In the occasional PUG?
I think the concern is with the growing mentality in the game that non-zerker is not acceptable. And it is becoming more prevelent. Soon this issue is going to be just like UWSC. Either you conform, or you simply dont do it.
… Except I used to do UWSC all the time in GW1 without conforming to the meta for it.
So what you’re saying is that it’s going to become an issue in the sense that people are going to continue to complain about what -might- happen, but is easily avoided.
…. so that I have more options for how I want to play each day.
Nope, wrong. With the latest update, you will soon find out that having more alts gives you fewer options to play in dungeon groups, as they will demand very specific classes/builds to maximize rewards versus time.
I play CoF1 very often, never as part of Zerker groups. So if this behavior didn’t prevent me from playing CoF1, I’m sure it’s not going to magically explode into proliferation now.
Absolutely nothing is stopping you from playing the game you want. It is absurdly easy to find groups that will run with you despite your gear choices.
There is a community of players that want to play the game one way, have fun playing it their way, and believe their way is the best.
Absolutely nothing obliges you to play with them and not playing with them doesn’t suddenly mean you can’t play the game.
I don’t avoid Zerkers, but neither are most of my very very frequent dungeon runs with Zerkers.
You’re angry because they’re saying their way is the best and you don’t believe it. So… can’t you just let them believe what they want and go on your way?
Honestly, it’s absolutely not hard to find a non-zerker dungeon group. You’re complaining about being looked down upon by Zerkers but that’s, what? On the forums? In the occasional PUG?
Solution.. Remove zerker gear from the game. And Im serious too. You’ll start to see every other build flourish, more diversity, no more elitism, groups accepting everyone, and more group harmony.
This will make a lot of people angry and drive them to quit the game possibly, but Im dead serious.
I love this idea. I really do. I know we don’t always see eye to eye, but not this time.
Honestly, this probably is the better solution. You remove the most optimum solution from the game, but you force things to open up some. However, you’re likely to see a lot of people shift to, again, one stat set.
Like, we might just all start complaining about Knight’s or Soldier’s or Rampager’s.
I still don’t get how moving Magic Find off of gear is screwing the majority of the playerbase as per the OP’s opening post.
… You’re being given other ways to get Magic Find. You’re being given an extra slot of stats AND being given your Magic Find.
… Where do you lose out?
.
Actually he’s complaining that he can’t work twice as hard and gear up 2 characters (twice the effort) in the same amount of time that someone with one character gears up his (same duration). Which is a different.
I’ll concede to this point, but it sounds more like he wants to be able to use two alts to gear up one in shorter time, which is an option that people without alts simply don’t have. If tokens were soulbound, that’d be a different issue… but it’d create its own mess of issues all the same.
At the end of the day, I think the change to alt-tokens is an unintended side effect of the token wallet implementation and, if I’m right, we’ll see the change reverted.
No, in my opinion at least, the problem lies in the games inherent design.
- No healer
- No tank
- Focus on DPS
- Little control mechanics
- Little support mechanics
- Long cool downs on anything non-DPS related
- Defiant
- Unshakable
- Product of Crit + Prec + Pow is higher than Product of Tough + Vit, or Cond + Cond durationExactly.
If roles were required in this game, people would pick different gear stats for each different role.
That is absolutely the problem with the game, but I’m sure that somewhere down the road, they’ll have changed mechanics or fights around enough to mitigate this to an extent. The only question is whether they’ll do it soon enough.
Also, they’re moving Magic Find into non-armor bound locations. Like onto your account. So essentially Magic Finders are being given room to have more stats that actually contribute to the overall progress of the party.
I’m sorry, but it is demonstrably selfish to demand that you be allowed to take a stat that does nothing to support the party’s progress, whether by allowing you to deal more damage or allowing you to stay on your feet longer so nobody else has to pick you up, just so you get a marginally better chance of getting yellows or exotics.
That is a benefit solely for you that is taking something else away from the overall party build.
Sometimes the effect is only an extra three minutes on the run time and that can be fine for some dungeon groups. (certainly would be fine in mine), but the point remains that you’ve chosen something that only benefits you over something that improves overall efficiency. There is no way to spin that that isn’t selfish. It is a choice for the self over the whole. Everybody that points that out gets greeted solely with ad hominem attacks and no actual attempt to explain why that isn’t.
You should be able to play how you want. Sure. When you aren’t part of a team. When you’re part of a team, you should be willing to make non-selfish choices, or at least willing to switch off of MF gear if someone asks you. Otherwise, you’re making the selfish choice to demand to do whatever you want at the expense of others.
Individuality is great and all, but the culture that it is somehow sacrosanct and gives you carte blanche to be a problem for others is… tiresome.
I play my alts because they are fun, not because I could reap extra rewards from them.
You realize these “extra rewards” are mandatory to fully gear a character right?
Yeah, how dare I expect to get best in slot gear on my characters. Time gating/account gating blows.
You don’t get those “extra rewards” any slower on alts than you do on a single character.
If I run p1 on a dungeon and get 60 tokens, and then run p3 with an alt for 60 tokens, I have still gotten 120 tokens for p1 and p3. Just because you could get it done in 2 days doesn’t mean that was intended or that it’s absolutely your god-given right to be able to do it that fast.
Once you’re done kitting one character out, you now just have to wait an equivalent amount of time on your next character. You’re essentially just complaining that your alts don’t have an advantage over running a single character.
Every other game has you work just as kitten your alt as you would on your main to get the same level of progression. I play alts, myself, and I haven’t had a problem with the majority of the things you’re complaining about. (I’ll admit, laurels are a bit of a pain)
It sounds like you want a whole lot of handholding. Myself, it gives me something to do and goals to set when working on a new alt, should I feel up to that. It also allows me time to get more familiar and accustomed to the new class.
Rangers actually have the best damage when supplied with a Lightning Hammer since their goes up to – more or less – the standard auto-attack damage (with full zerker that’s 1.5-2k, 1.5-2k, 4-5k on third hit), ON TOP of the damage the pet’s doing.
My warrior hits harder than that with a lightning hammer >.>
My mesmer hits harder than that with a lightning hammer >.>
My dog hits harder than that with a lightning hammer >.>
DOG OP…..NERF DOG!!! it has the ability to consume garbage and hit you for over 9000 with vomit attack!
Way to go ANET! Dog is so OP that no other class is even viable anymore!
Why should I play my Guardian when dog can vomit for 9000 with its vomit attack?! It’s obvious that the devs only play Dog and want us all to roll Dogs, too.
I’m done with this game until Anet learns to balance their kitten Dog class.
I just feel bad for new players. Don’t MMOs typically make older gear EASIER and FASTER to obtain as the game ages?
Certainly not in GW1.
Guys… this is probably an unintended side effect of the token wallet, if you really think about it. Applying the reward to the wallet probably makes the game think it’s coming from the same alt or something.
… Or it’s an entirely intended side-effect. We’ll see.
Poor analogy. You’re assuming that taking longer in a dungeon is inherently un-fun. You’re too goal oriented; something the OP and others have pointed out is the problem. Instead, you should be enjoying the ride.
I don’t believe the “Zerker is the only way to win” thing… but telling people the “correct” way to have fun doesn’t seem to be very helpful. You can’t tell Zerk’s that they’re bad for not letting you play the way you want… and then tell people they aren’t having fun the right way.
I’m sorry. I never kick people for their gear or skill choices, but I have to agree that taking Magic Find on your gear is inherently a selfish gesture. Absolutely nothing about that choice contributes, in any fashion, anything to the party. Whether by your reduced damage or reduced ability to keep yourself on your feet, or et cetera, you are taking a dent out of the party for something that only benefits the loot that you get. You and nobody else.
Now, I do not subscribe to the idea that non-Zerker gear is selfish. People don’t take SOldier’s gear with the idea that it’s ineffective. They take it because they feel it’s better for their build and, for all I know, they might be right. I play a pretty mean Guardian, but I know next to nothing about, say, Elementalists and have seen that the forums tend to know next to nothing about the things they bray on about and are incredibly reactionary people.
But… yeah, Magic Find is totally selfish and is absolutely the reason why they’re removing the stat from gear, because it’s the only stat that, in no way shape or form, contributes to a party’s overall success.
Guardians are bad and need buffs and by the Six Anet pls make us heal for more and do more damage. And more mobility and CC too please, like cripples. Thx.
I cannot, for the life of me, understand why you think guardians are bad.
We’re useful in every venue of the game.
Are we the best in any section? Probably not, no, but we’re still useful. We don’t have glaring issues like necromancers and engineers, certainly.
A simple solution would be just to have a toggle that would remove the ability to see buffs on yourself. Everyone else can still see them on you, you can still see them on everyone else. Does it fix the issue of other people seeing your ugly aegis? No. However, without reworking the appearance of aegis, it’s a pretty good middle ground.
https://soundcloud.com/that_shaman/evon-gnashblade
Yeah. Absolutely pre-scripted.
I thought the Abaddon fractal was going to be the surefire winner for the election. A lot of people equate gods with being epic and/or deep.
No, I have to agree that the metaphor is both clumsy and, as stated, irrelevant. I get the point you’re going for, only because you made it both before and after the metaphor, but the metaphor you use has absolutely nothing to do with your argument.
This is coming from someone who voted for Kiel and Thaumanova and thus cannot be dismissed under the pretense that I’m “just hurting that Abaddon didn’t win.”
Don’t be so inflammatory, guy.
Didn’t a Dev say he was more excited about the reactor fractal? I dunno… I’ll take his opinion over what you think will be good or bad.
abaddon, because you know.. the most important character in the lore.
After Nightfall retconned him as being behind the entirety of Prophecies and Factions, yes.
People were crying about the election being rigged for Evon before the polls were ever shown. It’s just that now Kiel supporters have no ground to claim that anymore, so now Evon supporters can spout it as much as they wish.
Waypoints are officially recognized by the lore… and I also think Jaymack’s answer is probably the right one.
Odd that I missed it until just now.
I do run fractals. I voted Kiel.
Also, better the tyranny of the majority when it comes to seeing what content the majority wants then being dictated solely by the elitism of the minority, wouldn’t you think?
Just because you feel it’s objectively better doesn’t, in itself, make it objectively better.
I do agree that it’s terrible that they’re only doing one. As stated in another thread, I don’t prefer Abaddon’s fractal, but would have been interested in seeing it -as well- as the Thaumanova fractal.
I dont care about cheap keys or waypoint costs or the fractals. But I hate Evons capitalistic views and fraudulent behaviours.
You didn’t vote for him because he was a charr I get ya. You have to look at the benefits and not the story of this game.
Benefit: I get to play in Thaumanova.
Benefit: I don’t have to deal with more Abaddon.
Would you have called for this if Abaddon was voted for the winning fractal and we missed on Thaumanova?
My mistake. Meant to say P3 in AC.
P2 is terrible.P2 isn’t terrible, people are just completely incompetent at the last fight which is by the way one of the best boss fights in the game.
He’s a very hard to PUG boss, it would seem. He never seems to take that much damage during the window when he IS vulnerable to damage.
Yet I distinctly remember beating him twice pretty easily after he was changed to the Ghostbusters fight.
So sometimes I remember him being easy, sometimes I remember him being aggravating.
Also the mechanics of the final fight against Zhaitan have nothing to do with the writing.
Plot is separate from gameplay.
Some people like the steampunk. Should the people who like it not get to enjoy it? It’s only been since July.
So for a whole month, you were forced to endure steampunk.
At the bottom line, though: It’s done. The results are in. Stop giving yourselves a bad name with all the vitriol and sense of entitlement.
You…
You’ve been to these forums before, right?
You must have missed a great amount of text in GW1 if you feel that GW2 is sillier. I feel that if GW1 was fully voice-acted as GW2 is, that it would feel sillier. There was a LOT of silly dialog in GW1, but very few of it was in the cutscenes.
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Bleached_Bones
Show me something similarly dark and beautifully made in GW2.
One instance of superb writing does not invalidate my claim that, as a whole, GW1 still had a great amount of silly moments.
That’s true, but it’s painfully obvious that aside from the map and a few of the returning character professions, this game has hardly anything to do with GW1 and that’s unfortunate. I’d like to see that change.
I initially felt the same way, but if you actually pay attention to a lot of things that you find throughout the world, the ties become much stronger. I suggest haunting the Lore forum to see some of the ties spelled out quite a bit more clearly.
I agree that the game feels a lot different from GW1 in more than one way, and I really think that voice-acting actually has a lot to do with that, as I tend to think voice-acted sequels of non-voice acted games feel completely different.
Still, if they strengthen ties to Lore, I’d rather it be more subtle and clever and less… Abaddon.
Or maybe just more stuff like the Arah explorables.
You must have missed a great amount of text in GW1 if you feel that GW2 is sillier. I feel that if GW1 was fully voice-acted as GW2 is, that it would feel sillier. There was a LOT of silly dialog in GW1, but very few of it was in the cutscenes.
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Bleached_Bones
Show me something similarly dark and beautifully made in GW2.
One instance of superb writing does not invalidate my claim that, as a whole, GW1 still had a great amount of silly moments.
You must have missed a great amount of text in GW1 if you feel that GW2 is sillier. I feel that if GW1 was fully voice-acted as GW2 is, that it would feel sillier. There was a LOT of silly dialog in GW1, but very few of it was in the cutscenes.
All I can say regarding this thread is that I was a bit disappointed in Konig, whose posts are usually quite a delight to read.
So you don’t want another content vote because you lost? How would you feel if Evon had won, and Kiel supporters wrote the same message?
Overall the Kiel supporters tend to be less shouty/annoying/loud and a bit more mature.
I disagree. Considering the reactions of some Kiel supporters, I find them just to be just as shouty/annoying/loud as some Evon supporters. In fact, the casual racism of most Kiel supporters I’ve seen has convinced me that they’re the opposite of mature.
And yet the other side displays staggering acts of casual sexism. You can’t pretend one side is the only one bad while the other side is equally deserving of contempt.
It'll also be more realistic than the "People who make profit are evil" Kiel party line. It will at least make her character more interesting.It means WE as a majority selected what we tought would be the most fittest character to that position and thats what voting means, the majority selects a leader.
Actually this election was not based on majority rules.
Anyways, I’ll laugh so hard if Kiel ends up being Scarlet.
It was profit at the expense of other’s lives, to be fair.
Except I have rolled a Charr.
Just because they have Roman influence does not mean they cannot be equated to fantasy Orcs from various other sources. They are still the stereotypical war race, which was the initial point of comparison.
That isn’t a fact, that is an assumption you made.
The assumption I’ve made that you’ve got more of a problem with them being revealed than their disgusting behavior is… bizarre.
Unless there are clear rules against posting in-game chats as examples of poor behavior from the community.
There are.
Then I default back to “shame on you” for breaking the rules.
And still “very shame on them” for their disgusting sexist behavior.
Why not do both? Unless there are clear rules against posting in-game chats as examples of poor behavior from the community. In which case, shame on you, but I’m not immediately aware of any such rule.
I think crude and sexist behavior like that SHOULD be shamed and brought into the public. The fact that you’ve got more of a problem with them being revealed than their disgusting behavior is… bizarre.
In any case, I agree that the kittenstorm over this event is absurd, but I do think this was a terrible idea on Anet’s part, as well. In theory, a voting event should be fun… but this is a community that is often joked about regarding their inability to take even minor changes without whining as loudly as possible about it.
And I do feel sorry that people are going to miss out on the Abaddon fractal. Did I personally find it the more interesting choice? No. And I’ve stated on other threads the reason for that, but I still think it sucks that there were two compelling options and the other is stated to never happen.
There’s a little too much “Be here or this will never happen again” in this game.
Anyways, give it a few weeks, this storm should die down.
This is not funny. There are enough places in the world where legitimately elected leaders really are threatened with things like assassination; let’s not bring it into the video game world, please. Whether the voting was rigged or not, keep it civil.
… Except that’s also commonly used in the plots of even lighthearted videogames like this.
You know, like Caudecus’ Manor?
So really, this is just kinda overly-sanctimonious. You know what else happens in real life? People getting kidnapped. Can we please have less kidnapping in the game? /sarcasm
I played a lot of GW1. I preferred the idea of the Thaumanova Reactor over Abaddon. I never liked Abaddon. I don’t find gods compelling, I think exploring gods ruins their majesty, and I felt that Abaddon was the bad guy version of Kormir/Trahearne/Kiel, by stealing credit for all of the bad guys actions in the Prophecies and Nightfall.
For all I knew, the fractal could have strongly implied Abaddon was behind the Elder Dragons or something stupid like that.
I think the implication that I’m a casual or that I voted because of “shallow WP costs” or something is just really sour grapes. People had different tastes from you. If I wanted to see boring content about boring gods, I’d play WoW or something.
Sure, the Inquest might be a little over-prevalent… but I still prefer exploring the Thaumanova incident over nega-Trahearne.
If that’s the case then they should be focusing more on the Charr in general, not the asura. To most people who are not extremely familiar with GW the Charr have become iconic of this game because they are the most unique race. (and no I’m not talking about Evon) People outside of the GW2 community equate the asura to gnomes because they are small and tech savvy.
Personally, I equate them with orcs. Or any other war-obsessed race that’s generally found in a fantasy setting. I don’t find them to be the most interesting addition to the game.
Sylvari are your stand in sylvan race. A little more unique than elves, but still filling the same role.
Asura are your stand in tech race. A little more unique than gnomes but still filling the same role.
Charr are your stand in war race. A little more unique than orcs but still filling the same role.
Norn are your stand in shamanistic race. A little more unique than… err… trolls? Trolls from WoW, I guess? Still, they’re Norse, and everything has norse stuff.
Lord Faren was from the Human Personal Story and had bits in Secrets of Southsun and Dragon Bash. Granted, he wasn’t a major character, but he has ties to Kasmeer.