Guild Wars 2

This is absurd. Staff Ele doesn’t need this type of bad addition. Take these type of suggestions against the perm broken stealth mechanic of thieves. Of course anything that is hurting their precious warrior will be arranged in favor of them quick.

For those that enjoy zerging all the time would definitely love this map but those that enjoy solo/small group roaming this map is very lame.

I see both the active and the passive to be strong, depending on the factors the op stated.. It would still never replace my fgs for WvW roaming and pve. Would definitely try it out for the fun of it before judging though.

RedSpectrum.1975:

You said “many thieves roaming with the sword dance evasion-limited access to stealth…”, then “diversity of playstyles”, contradicting yourself. I have no clue what Triggerless uses, but I know a lot are using the SD semi-stealth trickery build with Lyssa runes. But what I’m proud of is the amount of DD thieves Ive been seeing, but Im generally happy to see anything other than DP

I’m not contradicting. I meant to say there’s another build many other theives are roaming lately with and doing very well aside of the perm stealth or condition stacking with perpl runes build. I’m giving praise not finding fault.

For the past couple of days I have seen many thieves roaming (within wvw) with the sword dance evasion-limited access to stealth type of build. Similar to triggerless playstyle/build. It is a good sign to finally face a diversity of playstyles that doesn’t abuse the perm stealth mechanic or the broken perpl runes. I haven’t seen any player that I can consider close as good as triggerless with this build in tier 1 but hopefully I will soon. Keep up the great work!.

It takes months or possibly even over a year to learn how to play with the ele really well. If you are not willing to spend that much time mastering a profession then definitely don’t try, you will only get very frustrated and not be able to cope with it.

That power and crit damage is very low. I would never lose to a d/d ele with those stats no matter how good the player may be. I can go on once again how the build by itself doesn’t determine on how good you play the profession but Ill give you the advise of trying a different weapon set/build/playstyle that might work for you instead.

Egret.9374:

Hi guys, i can’t decide about rune in my sd roaming build. Divinity for more crit damage or traveler for 25% movement? I think i’ll run 0 30 10 0 30 or 0 30 0 10 30.
Any suggestion?

if you are good at kitting melee opponents go for traveler if not then divinity. You already have ways to gain swiftness so the movement speed from traveler is not really needed.

gpassucc.5961:

Just wanted to say, I really appreciate both the ele profession and the ele forum community. I also play a ranger and looking at the ranger forums at all is just god kitten depressing. The ele forums are mostly full of useful and friendly advice. Not to mention, it is sooo fun playing ele =D

You haven’t check the ele forum for long……

Argon.1563:

LightningBlaze.4913:

I have a feeling you are not telling the complete story.

I am not joking, I was in WvW, and I looked at the map to waypoint, and realized, “oh god, my server is doing well in WvW, wonderful.”, so I gone to the chat, and said I was pleased, and my reply was:

“Who the hell are you?”
“Some kind of a kitten excuse for a human”
“Everyone block this kitten”

Obviously that little chat log was really in broken English, rectified so its slightly more eligible.

I see 4 possibilities. 1) There was more likely a debate going on with someone else before you joined WvW and those statements were meant for the individual causing the negative discussion and not you. 2) You probably stated something that sounded like elitist and that alone kittened everyone off. 3) those few people were having a bad day and took out on you. 4) Includes all the above reasons.

I have a feeling you are not telling the complete story.

It is not overpower, it is just a broken mechanic on every mmorpg that implement it. With the exception of aion where it actually had real counters and not made up ones like dodge or l2p nonsense players post in the forum to defend it. With that said, thieves are still easy to defeat with my Ele even if they constantly stealth. The problem lies with Mesmers abusing this mechanic now as well. They are a lot more challenging if the player is good.

LordByron.8369:

Wintel.4873:

Ferocity changes are having NO effect on SPvP. None whatsoever. Zip. Your crit damage will stay exactly the same.

It is largely a PvE and WvW change. It’s especially needed in WvW where some people are pushing 100%+ crit damage and nearly-guaranteed crit chance.

Afaik www issue are conditions and warrior guardian trains that runs sentinel/soldier…..

Only thieves are wearing full zerker…and as Always stealth is the problem
Scepter eles in zerk are easy to kill.

Anyone in full zerk is easy to kill but if the player is good and/or you let your guard down he/she can defeat you just as easily.

Many that get killed in wvw by me think that my ele is full zerk because my damage is as insane as a glass cannon yet with over 3100 armor and 18k hp along with many defensive skills and utilities I am very bunker. That’s how op ele can be. Will be interesting how less op after patch my ele would be but i have to admit the damage has to be turned down a bit.

I reported it as someone hacking into the system!

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

LightningBlaze.4913:

I think it goes towards what aspect you find yourself having more issues. For me condition based players are a lot easier to deal with now that I switched to focus yet melee very bunker types are a bit harder. My preference towards these 2 stats has changed during the past week. I used to like 16-17k of hp minimum and 2500-2600 of armor. Now I focus a lot more on armor and less on hp. Currently running my very high burst damage dealer spec where my hp is 15.1k fully buffed with WvW bonuses it reaches over 18k and my armor with rock barrier is 31.6k.

You have 31.6k armor with Rock Barrier? O.o

That came out wrong. 3.1k. Where did I get the 6 lol

Arcturus.8109:

Phi Is Sly.1857:

Why do we have to wait so long to be balanced :S Mesmer got ninja patched cos they changed some clones depawn when someone hides.

We been waiting a year almost, time to jump ship? i cannot stand other classes too little effort!

What makes you think that current state of ele isn’t intended? You are waiting for some kind wizard that will come and fix it all? Meanwhile “positive ele thread” was closed by moderator. I find it quite symbolic.

You mean the thread that Nex made? No wonder I don’t see it around today. I was looking for a pic that relates to the lightnig auto attack from scepter to post haha

I think it goes towards what aspect you find yourself having more issues. For me condition based players are a lot easier to deal with now that I switched to focus yet melee very bunker types are a bit harder. My preference towards these 2 stats has changed during the past week. I used to like 16-17k of hp minimum and 2500-2600 of armor. Now I focus a lot more on armor and less on hp. Currently running my very high burst damage dealer spec where my hp is 15.1k fully buffed with WvW bonuses it reaches over 18k and my armor with rock barrier is 31.6k.

Nikkinella.8254:

LightningBlaze.4913:

The Ele from gw2 does not meet fully the traditional standard for Mage/caster type of class. Have you ever seen a Mage wielding a dagger and being melee type on other mmorpg? I haven’t and I still find it extremely weird. The Ele does have very powerful aeo and single target damage and excellent tools to survive long. It is just hard to play the profession really well as a starter.

Yeah it is kind of weird for a mage type to be wielding something other than a staff and blowing things up from range, but its fun. It was something different that they tried that ended up being pretty fun to use, sort of like the gun-mage from final fantasy. How often do you see magic users using guns? It worked out though and gun-mage was an awesome class. I’m actually hoping at some point ele gets dual pistols so i can have a gun-mage here too.

Yea indeed it is a fun new style. The dual pistols or a greatsword magic effects would be so great with the Ele.

The Ele from gw2 does not meet fully the traditional standard for Mage/caster type of class. Have you ever seen a Mage wielding a dagger and being melee type on other mmorpg? I haven’t and I still find it extremely weird. The Ele does have very powerful aeo and single target damage and excellent tools to survive long. It is just hard to play the profession really well as a starter.

We will have to see how ferocity and the sigil upgrade contribute to damage. Power and damage modifier are not being touched so I suspect the difference won’t be significant. I still see my Ele bursting down very bunker players in WvW after patch without being glass cannon.

Fuzzion.2504:

LightningBlaze.4913:

Fuzzion.2504:

You mean people actually use dragon tooth still?

Of course, I use it all the time with my Ele and it is very effective.

Against mobs and immobolised targets or players that havent discovered the dodge roll

Against all type of targets. Players can’t dodge DT if it is followed after gale. They are forced to use a utility. Even without gale, dt is very effective at keeping the pressure off from melee opponents. I completely agree dt does not need a ground target addition. It is perfectly fine the way it is atm. The only skill that needs a buff from scepter is Shatterstone.

It will always be a zergfest. A horrible map for anything else.

Fuzzion.2504:

You mean people actually use dragon tooth still?

Of course, I use it all the time with my Ele and it is very effective.

It is the most broken mechanic in gw2. Honestly though Mesmers are a lot more annoying with this mechanic than the actual thief.

Ptolomy.6984:

Well on paper it looks good but still we’re in a tight spot. What most classes get out of their weap skills and class mechanic we have to get out of our utility and traits

We get many of the defensive methods mentioned above from our weapon skills too.

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

LightningBlaze.4913:

. All full zerk profession will easily get defeated if they make a mistake even warriors.

In my opinion that is wrong. Look at everything warrior have to escape and to block or immunity damage and conditions. They also get insane passive regen. Same goes for Thieves sure they MIGHT get killed by making a mistake every now and then but that doesnt mean it happens all the time.

You also forget that so many of these classes have FAR better defensive skills than ele all the while having more health and more armor so they don’t need to even think about defensive stats most of the time.

What do we have for defense:
Block – Check
Invulnerability to both physical damage and conditions – Check
Many condition removals – Check
Projectile reflection and absorption – Check
Various heal skills- Check
Defensive boons – Check
Mobility – Check
Knockdowns, daze and other great cc – CHECK!
Clones – n/a
Broken stealth mechanic n/a

Not to mention massive, instant cast, ranged skills that can also be a great defensive tool.

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

LightningBlaze.4913:

If you have seen plenty of good ele players in s/tpvp then you can only imagine how much better they are in wvw. In wvw is where good ele players excel the most specially at 1v1 scenarios.

You are forgetting that in WvW pretty much everyone is Condi when roaming. You are also forgetting that unless you spec for at least some defense you will die A LOT thanks to the low Health and Armor.

In Zerker, you make a single mistake, a skill gets dodged or immune and you are pretty much screwed.

You are forgetting that as ele we have plenty of condition removals and not all the conditions need to be cleansed. We can also avoid many conditions just by dodging and prevent even more by bursting your opponent. The low hp and armor is only an excuse many players make to backup their ineffective play with this profession. Sure the hp can be a little bit more but the armor is aligned correctly to a profession that wears LIGHT armor. All full zerk profession will easily get defeated if they make a mistake even warriors.

Ahh the excuses of low hp and armor to perform poorly with this profession never stops.

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

killahmayne.9518:

I guess you haven’t seen a good ele 1v1 then. Because they are just as competitive 1v1 as most of these classes.

I have seen plenty of good Eles, they could maybe compete in S/TPvP but in WvW? Not a chance. It would take more than an Evasion on one skill to make a class with the lowest health, lowest armor, longest defensive cool downs and no stealth to be a “king” of 1Vs1. I am talking Mesmer, Condi build, Warrior kind of “Kings” not the kind that manages to kill up levels.

If you have seen plenty of good ele players in s/tpvp then you can only imagine how much better they are in wvw. In wvw is where good ele players excel the most specially at 1v1 scenarios.

OrinX.1962:

Why wont people stack by the regulator in warden 5?

Because they are first timers that panic at anything that is a little bit of challenge and don’t see map chat.

The difference is staff users did need those buffs. Dagger skills are already strong on both main and offhand. There was no need to improve this weapon when there is clearly a need for the other ones. The way it would help all eles is by adjusting traits and utilities and not buffing dagger that is already balanced. I don’t give a kitten about what anyone think about me or against anyone that complaints about these changes directed to dagger users. When you criticize someone you haven’t even met in person you only are criticizing yourself..

Valtarius.8671:

I agree, but we still have not gotten the full update patch notes, so im expecting more to come since everything they said at the livestream is not all of it.

However I would like a change on flame wall (focus) it 3/4 the cast time does constant burning if target doesn’t move and 20sec cooldown compared to ring of fire which is an aoe 1/4 cast time does a lot more burning than flamewall hits 5 enemies causes direct damage and 15 sec cd and easier to fire combo field for might. Well focus fire 4 5 just suck so…I would like something to happen to it. Needs small tweaks

I’m sure this is everything ele is getting with this patch. When the devs say this is not all of it, they only mean on future patches there will more changes across all the professions of course.

Don’t waste more than just 10 points in the arcane tree if you are not building for bunker spec with s/f. Definitely increase your hp pool and power a bit. You don’t need that much armor; 2500-2600 is more than enough specially with scepter earth 2 skill granting you even more. focus skills and your cantrips utilties provide all the necessary sustain you would need for solo raoming. I was a big fan of arcane blast too but i found other utilities to be more useful.. you might as well if you keep playing around with them too even the conjure ones.

Proof.3047:

LightningBlaze.4913:

Don’t let any of those 1vx videos misguide you. Against 2 or more good players by yourself it is impossible to win no matter what build you use.

No.

Elementalists are in a decent state right now. Not the best roamers, but definitely not the worst. I’ve gone 1v2/1v3 and have been victorious. And with the next major patch, I am quite excited.

I solo roam with the Ele so I know they are way above than just decent within this area. Of course you can even 1v5 and still be victorious but those opponents were just terrible to have gotten defeated when they have the advantage. Most solo roamers in WvW are bad players . My point once again is if you encounter 2 good players, you just won’t win against them because only one of them will give you a lot of trouble……doubling that and will result in your easy defeat.

Don’t let any of those 1vx videos misguide you. Against 2 or more good players by yourself it is impossible to win no matter what build you use.

On tier 1 against sor and jq when i roam is as following: perm stealth or perplexity runes condition thieves, the op 1v1 condition constant stealth build most mesmers are running, more mesmers with the same build and condition burst necros.

The best survival method is to dodge at the right time. Even as full glass cannon you can survive a lot in pve.

honovi.7893:

LightningBlaze.4913:

honovi.7893:

LightningBlaze.4913:

Mbelch.9028:

I have not much to add here. I can’t tell if I’m biased or not…

D/D is my weapon set of choice, as everybody knows. The weapon set isn’t as well rounded as some may think. This buff will be a good one, and I think every ele should b happy for the change.

My opinion is every attune should have defensive and offensive skills. Until now, I hardly could have said burning speed was defensive. I’m sorry but too many classes can easily catch us in combat, and burning speed puts you into combat more often than not; your fire tail is unfortunate.

I can say now fire will have a defensive skill, and water will have a new use offensively and defensively with its blast finisher.

There’s no doubt that these are good buffs, but why do people keep calling them overpowered? They aren’t even here yet. The evade frame isn’t going to be that long, and it will protect you more when attacking, just so you can land your attack for once. Yes, I’ve figured out how to land BS on more than one good opponent, but it hits infrequently enough that a buff was merited.

I’ll also say.. This skill just looks like it should have an evade on it. That it didn’t baffled me. When I was learning the class, I thought it did.

So yes, perhaps I’m a little biased, which is why you can take my opinion with a grain of salt, but I just don’t think eles as a whole should ever complain about the paradigm shift from nerfing to some buffs.

We are supposed to work together, and it’s unfortunate to see some of my favorite eles on the forum bickering.

Nex sorry i missed your posts in all this bickering like you said. Just like I told ozi, even if we are biased, there is nothing wrong with that in a game. It is perfectly understandable that dagger users feel glad to get this buff and I’m glad ele are getting buffed overall instead of more nerf. I just would prefer the buffs to start with traits/utilities and specially to the weapon skills that are weak instead of improving the ones that are already stable/powerful.

Is scepter really all that weak though? Most eles see in tpvp use s/d or s/f. The fresh air burst build seems to have been, and remained, the “go-to” ele build for pvp. I prefer s/d or s/f myself but that’s just anecdotal.

I think the real problem with the elementalist is traitlines/utilities. The only eles i see are ones that run all cantrips or run arcane burst gimmick builds.

Honovi, i have been using scepter with 30 points in air waaaaaay before fresh air was even introduced. The majority of this Ele forum community didn’t even know back then that Ele can actually massive burst without being glass cannon and I was called troll for stating this fact in here. With that said I perfectly know scepter is not weak but some of its skills need adjustments like shatterstone, dragon tooth and even air 3 (blinding something.. I’m bad with names) that only offers blind. Ele god mode d/d build was nerf really hard in spvp because of its stage of abusement by the majority of Ele players. Now you see s/d because if you can’t bunker as well as before in spvp/tpvp might as well go for the other role of being a damage, burst dealer. S/d provides that with the great defense to keep yourself at range or go in and out like a boxing match.

So how is scepter or focus not a strong weapon set if so many people are choosing it over d/d? Now, keep in mind i have no real stats to back this up, but most dueling arenas i go into with eles have:
A. Fresh air s/f or s/d burst ele.
B. high pressure cantrip d/f ele.

I’m just not seeing why you think scepter and focus are so weak. Do they have skills that suck? absolutely. But they also have a few AMAZING skills that beat similar skills from other professions by a longshot.

And yes, i’ve been playing this game since release. I know the history of eles and how much qq there was about scepter being bad. It doesn’t matter if you were the first person that thought scepter was good 6 months ago or the last. Right now, i believe scepter mainhand is a better option than dagger though. But once again, that’s just me.

Any other eles think that scepter is now a BETTER option than dagger? I know these weaponsets excel at two completely different things but bunker ele is just sad now. We get ripped apart in seconds.

Once again Honovi…….I don’t think scepter and focus are weak weapon sets. I even use both s/f together for solo/group roaming and running with the zerg within wvw and I do very well. I only know they both have some weak skills that need adjustments. Just a few skills out of all the ones these weapon sets offer. That is all.

You sure it’s not other conditions placed on you before you mist form?

P Fun Daddy.1208:

LightningBlaze.4913:

honovi.7893:

LightningBlaze.4913:

Mbelch.9028:

I have not much to add here. I can’t tell if I’m biased or not…

D/D is my weapon set of choice, as everybody knows. The weapon set isn’t as well rounded as some may think. This buff will be a good one, and I think every ele should b happy for the change.

My opinion is every attune should have defensive and offensive skills. Until now, I hardly could have said burning speed was defensive. I’m sorry but too many classes can easily catch us in combat, and burning speed puts you into combat more often than not; your fire tail is unfortunate.

I can say now fire will have a defensive skill, and water will have a new use offensively and defensively with its blast finisher.

There’s no doubt that these are good buffs, but why do people keep calling them overpowered? They aren’t even here yet. The evade frame isn’t going to be that long, and it will protect you more when attacking, just so you can land your attack for once. Yes, I’ve figured out how to land BS on more than one good opponent, but it hits infrequently enough that a buff was merited.

I’ll also say.. This skill just looks like it should have an evade on it. That it didn’t baffled me. When I was learning the class, I thought it did.

So yes, perhaps I’m a little biased, which is why you can take my opinion with a grain of salt, but I just don’t think eles as a whole should ever complain about the paradigm shift from nerfing to some buffs.

We are supposed to work together, and it’s unfortunate to see some of my favorite eles on the forum bickering.

Nex sorry i missed your posts in all this bickering like you said. Just like I told ozi, even if we are biased, there is nothing wrong with that in a game. It is perfectly understandable that dagger users feel glad to get this buff and I’m glad ele are getting buffed overall instead of more nerf. I just would prefer the buffs to start with traits/utilities and specially to the weapon skills that are weak instead of improving the ones that are already stable/powerful.

Is scepter really all that weak though? Most eles see in tpvp use s/d or s/f. The fresh air burst build seems to have been, and remained, the “go-to” ele build for pvp. I prefer s/d or s/f myself but that’s just anecdotal.

I think the real problem with the elementalist is traitlines/utilities. The only eles i see are ones that run all cantrips or run arcane burst gimmick builds.

Honovi, i have been using scepter with 30 points in air waaaaaay before fresh air was even introduced. The majority of this Ele forum community didn’t even know back then that Ele can actually massive burst without being glass cannon and I was called troll for stating this fact in here. With that said I perfectly know scepter is not weak but some of its skills need adjustments like shatterstone, dragon tooth and even air 3 (blinding something.. I’m bad with names) that only offers blind. Ele god mode d/d build was nerf really hard in spvp because of its stage of abusement by the majority of Ele players. Now you see s/d because if you can’t bunker as well as before in spvp/tpvp might as well go for the other role of being a damage, burst dealer. S/d provides that with the great defense to keep yourself at range or go in and out like a boxing match.

meh, I like air 3. short cd ranged, instant cast, unavoidable blind is really nice.

I like it too but I still find it lackluster with providing 0 damage and just blind that can be taken off with auto attack

honovi.7893:

LightningBlaze.4913:

Mbelch.9028:

I have not much to add here. I can’t tell if I’m biased or not…

D/D is my weapon set of choice, as everybody knows. The weapon set isn’t as well rounded as some may think. This buff will be a good one, and I think every ele should b happy for the change.

My opinion is every attune should have defensive and offensive skills. Until now, I hardly could have said burning speed was defensive. I’m sorry but too many classes can easily catch us in combat, and burning speed puts you into combat more often than not; your fire tail is unfortunate.

I can say now fire will have a defensive skill, and water will have a new use offensively and defensively with its blast finisher.

There’s no doubt that these are good buffs, but why do people keep calling them overpowered? They aren’t even here yet. The evade frame isn’t going to be that long, and it will protect you more when attacking, just so you can land your attack for once. Yes, I’ve figured out how to land BS on more than one good opponent, but it hits infrequently enough that a buff was merited.

I’ll also say.. This skill just looks like it should have an evade on it. That it didn’t baffled me. When I was learning the class, I thought it did.

So yes, perhaps I’m a little biased, which is why you can take my opinion with a grain of salt, but I just don’t think eles as a whole should ever complain about the paradigm shift from nerfing to some buffs.

We are supposed to work together, and it’s unfortunate to see some of my favorite eles on the forum bickering.

Nex sorry i missed your posts in all this bickering like you said. Just like I told ozi, even if we are biased, there is nothing wrong with that in a game. It is perfectly understandable that dagger users feel glad to get this buff and I’m glad ele are getting buffed overall instead of more nerf. I just would prefer the buffs to start with traits/utilities and specially to the weapon skills that are weak instead of improving the ones that are already stable/powerful.

Is scepter really all that weak though? Most eles see in tpvp use s/d or s/f. The fresh air burst build seems to have been, and remained, the “go-to” ele build for pvp. I prefer s/d or s/f myself but that’s just anecdotal.

I think the real problem with the elementalist is traitlines/utilities. The only eles i see are ones that run all cantrips or run arcane burst gimmick builds.

Honovi, i have been using scepter with 30 points in air waaaaaay before fresh air was even introduced. The majority of this Ele forum community didn’t even know back then that Ele can actually massive burst without being glass cannon and I was called troll for stating this fact in here. With that said I perfectly know scepter is not weak but some of its skills need adjustments like shatterstone, dragon tooth and even air 3 (blinding something.. I’m bad with names) that only offers blind. Ele god mode d/d build was nerf really hard in spvp because of its stage of abusement by the majority of Ele players. Now you see s/d because if you can’t bunker as well as before in spvp/tpvp might as well go for the other role of being a damage, burst dealer. S/d provides that with the great defense to keep yourself at range or go in and out like a boxing match.

Mbelch.9028:

I have not much to add here. I can’t tell if I’m biased or not…

D/D is my weapon set of choice, as everybody knows. The weapon set isn’t as well rounded as some may think. This buff will be a good one, and I think every ele should b happy for the change.

My opinion is every attune should have defensive and offensive skills. Until now, I hardly could have said burning speed was defensive. I’m sorry but too many classes can easily catch us in combat, and burning speed puts you into combat more often than not; your fire tail is unfortunate.

I can say now fire will have a defensive skill, and water will have a new use offensively and defensively with its blast finisher.

There’s no doubt that these are good buffs, but why do people keep calling them overpowered? They aren’t even here yet. The evade frame isn’t going to be that long, and it will protect you more when attacking, just so you can land your attack for once. Yes, I’ve figured out how to land BS on more than one good opponent, but it hits infrequently enough that a buff was merited.

I’ll also say.. This skill just looks like it should have an evade on it. That it didn’t baffled me. When I was learning the class, I thought it did.

So yes, perhaps I’m a little biased, which is why you can take my opinion with a grain of salt, but I just don’t think eles as a whole should ever complain about the paradigm shift from nerfing to some buffs.

We are supposed to work together, and it’s unfortunate to see some of my favorite eles on the forum bickering.

Nex sorry i missed your posts in all this bickering like you said. Just like I told ozi, even if we are biased, there is nothing wrong with that in a game. It is perfectly understandable that dagger users feel glad to get this buff and I’m glad ele are getting buffed overall instead of more nerf. I just would prefer the buffs to start with traits/utilities and specially to the weapon skills that are weak instead of improving the ones that are already stable/powerful.

oZii.2864:

I’ll just leave this alone with I love D/D playstyle I’ve said it, but I don’t think this buff is OP or makes D/D some god.

Maybe I misinterpreted your position but the only one I can think of is dueling. That is the only place I can remotely see anyone calling this OP. Zergs and 5 mans aren’t going to complain about Ele’s blowing them up with burning speed. They will see the attunement of the Ele and dodge it followed by teamspeak chatter of “What was he thinking?” followed by chuckles and then “I don’t know”. Thats what we always say when some Ele comes in Rambo and that won’t change with this buff.

The fight flow against Ele doesn’t change because it has a evade on burning speed it just means the Ele has a way to get in without eating damage. Now you can’t interrupt the Ele doing burning speed he still on his way rotating to Earth after he presses burning speed. Gotta get that might!

If we to talk to any non ele and ask them what woud bring D/X ele back into the meta and put them up there with the top classes an evade on burning speed would not be the suggestion that comes up.

The discussion would more likely direct itself into adjusting traits, utilities and weak weapon skills and not buffing already strong ones like burning speed.

honovi.7893:

LightningBlaze.4913:

Those telegraph skills are a lot easier to land on higher scale battles.

This. You just said 1v1’s aren’t important at all and then said that burning speed is too easy to telegraph. In a 5v5, you most likely won’t see it coming unless you are watching the ele carefully, in which case other professions will be just as likely to burst you with a telegraph-able skill.

I’m kinda “meh” about this buff. I would be much happier if they took away evasion on this skill AND the warrior GS 3 skill. Skills that allow you to deal massive damage and run away from your opponent SHOULD be able to be interrupted.

I said 1v1 is not important at all? Was I drunk? You sure it wasn’t ozi? I gotta read that post again when I get a chance.

oZii.2864:

LightningBlaze.4913:

It will be too strong. What is the trade off of this skill when you can land it successfully, deal great amount of damage, help you escape, get closer to someone and all without receiving damage as a setback. The same can be said about focus earth skill 5. It is more powerful than the earlier version of mist form but with focus there are still some skills that need buff. We can’t say that for dagger.

So your whole deal is that you like focus now and don’t want anything else buffed till focus gets buffed? Maybe you sympathize with staff users?

What does dagger main hand getting some love have to do with focus needing love?

I have seen numerous Eles saying and making suggestions about dagger main hands auto attacks. We can dig those up in the December 10 dev thread.

I suggested that dagger main hand get something like rock barrier since it is melee. I suggested this many times dagger main hand isn’t fine! It’s ok it’s in a better shape then focus but it isn’t fine! They aren’t going to raise ele base hp so dagger main hand Eles need something for when they mix it up with melee. When you fight a cc heavy warrior with d/d you run out of cantrips quick and you can’t even get close to do damage because you get stunned.

Hammer was mentioned in stream by Karl so I bet this was specifically done to help d/x warriors against CC heavy warriors with hammer. This helps d/f users also not just /d.

That’s not my “deal” at all. My point is this buff is unnecessary to a weapon set that already have all it’s reliable and useful skills. I have to include focus because this is the weapon set that really cries for some workaround and not dagger. You said auto attacks and not burning speed. There are many suggestions made by players that doesn’t justify to be valid because mostly are based on personal preferences with their playstyle.

LordByron.8369:

LightningBlaze.4913:

It will be too strong. What is the trade off of this skill

1) being locked in short range with no reliable immunity skills (that is: in zergs you melt as the burning speed ends)

2) locked in fire attunement means not available on demand

3) needs positioning; making it telegraphed.

4) deals average damage

5) since rtl nerf a D/D lacks reliable gap closers..

You are stating these for the sake of making things up, but I’ll feed you 1) d/d is mostly about short range. The evasion obtaining from this skill is about the same as having immunity skill while casting it. In Zerg, you’ll only melt if you are built glassy, being focused by many or fail to gain distance to recover. 2) are you kidding? You want this to be available on other attunement a as well? 3) positioning yourself for this skill is easy and not a weakness now if it fails due the evasion. 4) it deals high damage specially on bursty, high dps builds. 5) dd excels at gap closers it has 3 very good weapon skills to get closer to your opponent. Rtl is still awesome specially when cripple and chill still not affecting us while using this skill.

oZii.2864:

It isn’t about the one skill burning speed alone. Look at the entire set up main hand dagger. Yet you say it will be to strong. You stated it would be to strong needing a nerf later.

LightningBlaze.4913:

. For me even if I was still using dagger as main I would still be realistic to see how this skill will be a bit too strong.

This doesn’t match unless you think groups and zergs will start complaining about burning speed Eles.

It will be too strong. What is the trade off of this skill when you can land it successfully, deal great amount of damage, help you escape, get closer to someone and all without receiving damage as a setback. The same can be said about focus earth skill 5. It is more powerful than the earlier version of mist form but with focus there are still some skills that need buff. We can’t say that for dagger.

oZii.2864:

LightningBlaze.4913:

I already explained my reasons on other threads where you posted Ozi. You support this update because well you main dagger. For me even if I was still using dagger as main I would still be realistic to see how this skill will be a bit too strong. I would argue that dueling balance is definitely not meh but I also understand that is a matter of opinion, experience and preference. I might consider something you find great as “meh” too. In summary, a single skill shouldn’t be offering all 4 excellent features which are: mobility, high damage, field and now evasion. The trade off of d/d is the melee range and that comes at the price of receiving more damage at higher scale battles. Burning speed was never in demand for a buff. It was already balanced. The weapon skills that actually do need buffs are completely ignored by Anet.

I am not biased because I main D/D at all. I don’t think it is that big of a deal that it gets an evade because it is still a highly telegraphed move. The problem with D/D against competent enemies is that as soon as you swap attunements the opponent that has knowledge of a elementalist has an idea of what is coming.

A main hand dagger swaps to fire you know drakes, burning speed or ring of fire is coming. Fire Grab is coming IF you are on fire. It isn’t about the individual skill of burning speed being buffed which is what I think you are focused on it is the entire skill set. The reason Karl gave in stream is that as a D/D you would do burning speed and get smacked with a hammer which is true if you didn’t have stab up. You see 5+ hammer warriors fighting your group and you don’t have stab up all you can do is burn them with drakes or eat retal damage with lightning whip.

I am not saying dueling is “meh” I duel often, I am saying balancing around dueling is “meh” or to clarify I don’t get hung up on dueling balance it isn’t officially supported by Anet and they don’t balance around duels so why get hung up on the fact that something will make it harder to duel a specific spec.

Dueling is rock, paper, scissors so I don’t really get hung up on dueling I know people do but they really shouldn’t. I have 6 of the 8 classes at 80 and I know there is a build to rock, paper, scissor on all of my 6 classes. I can go get on my thief put on P/D with perp runes and kill just about everything in a duel and anything left I can’t beat get on my Necro and run Terrormancer and if that doesn’t work lame it up with Hambow. Still having my mesmer and PU to come off the bench. Win at all cost duelers do this often so why dwell on duel balance when someone can go get a rock to your scissors. Dueling is fun alot of fun but the game just isn’t balanced around dueling.

Based on the first sentence on each paragraph you go on about dueling. I don’t know where you you got the idea I was referring to only dueling but I’ll give you my opinion and personal experience on this topic. Every single skill even the most telegraphed can land successfully against above average players as long as it isn’t as predictable and it is used at the right time. Those telegraph skills are a lot easier to land on higher scale battles. Every build have other builds that completely counter and there will be players that prove us wrong when we think one class/build can counter one of our Ele builds or for other professions. Anet always make up a reason for every unnecessary buff or nerf they make so that shouldn’t be taken as a defense. I would be ok if indeed d/d needed some love but it didn’t because it already have many useful and powerful skills. I completely doubt any good player ever complaint about burning speed. I just don’t see the need to buff burning speed when you can easily see many Ele players performing this skill on a group/Zerg without getting damaged and without the conjunction of other utilities to prevent receiving damage/interrupt. I said it once and I’ll say it again d/d already is the weapon of choice for all its reliable and useful skills.

oZii.2864:

LightningBlaze.4913:

no nerf. All buffs so far from the stream. Watch it at http://www.twitch.tv/guildwars2/b/496005243 and skip to 25:16 for the elementalist talk. Burning speed will need a nerffffffffffffffff

Im curious as to why you think burning speed will need a nerf because it will get evade frames? It will be stronger in a duel but thats a duel and dueling balance is meh. You still know when the ele went in to fire anyway. You can proc electric discharge from a fresh air build and put out close to as much damage as burning speed over that same amount of time and thats instant non telegraphed 900 range damage. This allows a safe way for a main hand dagger user to do damage when the numbers get large safely.

Right now if there is any kind of hammer train or group fighting of 4-5 people you can’t safely apply any good damage safely. You can drake breath, cone of cold and churning earth the outside of the group but you can’t drop good damage inside the group. Only if you have armor of earth up, arcane shield or mist can you go in do something get smashed to about half health and mist out.

I already explained my reasons on other threads where you posted Ozi. You support this update because well you main dagger. For me even if I was still using dagger as main I would still be realistic to see how this skill will be a bit too strong. I would argue that dueling balance is definitely not meh but I also understand that is a matter of opinion, experience and preference. I might consider something you find great as “meh” too. In summary, a single skill shouldn’t be offering all 4 excellent features which are: mobility, high damage, field and now evasion. The trade off of d/d is the melee range and that comes at the price of receiving more damage at higher scale battles. Burning speed was never in demand for a buff. It was already balanced. The weapon skills that actually do need buffs are completely ignored by Anet.

no nerf. All buffs so far from the stream. Watch it at http://www.twitch.tv/guildwars2/b/496005243 and skip to 25:16 for the elementalist talk. Burning speed will need a nerffffffffffffffff