Guild Wars 2

The frog scepter is already in the game.

-41, I was 1900 something mmr and got queued into a game with a duo of 1230s on my team.

Pie Flavor.1647:

Condi Rangers are currently the top choice for dps in raids, not because they have the highest dps numbers (power ele scepter/warhorn or dagger/warhorn can beat those numbers easily) but because of the ease at which you can reach optimal DPS rotation with this build.

Compared to other classes, condi ranger is nothing special, condi warrior could easily beat condi ranger in terms of raw dps, and be on par with it if using a condi PS build, condi necros and reapers can easily outdps any other condition damage builds, all of this were it not because of this single skill:

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bonfire

Set a fire around you, damaging and burning foes.

Damage (9x): 297 (0.9)
9 Burning (3s): 3537 Damage

I do believe this single skill is what breaks condi ranger completely, you can reduce the cooldown by 20% by using the ambidexterity trait which reduces torch and dagger skills cooldowns, and even further by using the quickdraw trait which reduces the next used skill cooldown by 66%

Basically you can apply 9 stacks of burning after 5 seconds every 6.6 seconds (roughly), with a full viper set with nightmare runes you get 15k damage on that skill alone, which is a whooping 3k increase of dps by using it, and thus completely outshine every other condi build currently in the game, especially necros.

The problem is that it doesn’t make sense for rangers to have such a powerful skill in a single weapon, there isn’t a single trait or gear piece that boosts burning damage, yet this skill could possibly be the main source of DPS for the build.

All in all it feels like a vestige from the days before condition damage was relevant.

I’m pretty sure Engi Blowtorch is around 19k dmg on a 12 second cooldown, no?

The Not so Evil Overlord.6305:

Cynz.9437:

Dear OP, tell me what class/build can deal with warrior without external help and without losing point. According to you it is a l2p issue so teach us, noobs, how to deal with war.

So, from statements you’ve made, I’m guessing you’ve made a few assumptions about the sort of warrior that you’re up against. Aka, likely the metabattles GS Mace/shield build. So, I’ll make my response from that sort of perspective.

You are asking, what class can spend 8 seconds, able to deal no damage, standing right next to a high damage dealing class, and still win in the end. When you think about that, you’re more or less asking what class can play stupidly against a warrior and still win.

The simple fact is that some classes have abilities which can force people off of point. Invulnerabilities with good DPS, and high AoE DPS are two of those. DHs for example, are more than capable of forcing entire teams off of point, until the traps are done.
Yes, warriors have long cooldowns which enable them to stand in these… But what forces people off has half the cooldown as the warrior’s abilities to stand in those points.
So, yes. You’re up against the standard meta warrior, and he can almost certainly force you off point, and can decap. But you can force him to burn most, if not all of his long cooldowns. And you’ll be able to engage again, when he doesn’t have those skills available.

In short… If you play like an idiot, the warrior will kill you. So, don’t play like an idiot. When people burn their cooldowns to make it so you can’t stand on point, you don’t stand on point. Especially in the case of the warrior, who’s running all melee. He needs to choose between remaining on the point, and decapping, or leaving point without decapping, to kill you while taking advantage of his invulnerabilities.

EDIT:
But I’ll also list off some of the better counters to warriors. Blind spams, chain CC (that’s only one stack of stability from Eternal Champion. So just double CC.), and evades. Thieves and Mesmers are two classes which are harder for warriors to fight.

The thing about warrior in its current state is that its way too forgiving.
Unlike any of the other classes, you cant get 100-0d. Meaning Moa bursts doesnt work since you will always be able to double EP (being a stance and all).
If you compare this to the DH defenses, which you brought up earlier. DH’s main defense is F3, this is on a 60~ish second cd and being a frontal block for 4 seconds. This is 1 second longer than warriors shield block.
Warriors shield block, in addition to being up ~3 times as often, reflects, blocks in a 360 degree meaning you can disengage while using it. (I know traited DH f3 is a stunbreak + prot.)

Currently (on high rated EU) Condi war is much more prominent than power. So from now on I’ll only talk DH vs Condi War.

Theres no way either class should be able to kill the other. The issue is that during the 8 seconds of zerk mode, you can’t afford to get hit by mace f1’s as the DH. This is because you need to save Smite Condition for Krait procs + Pindown.
Due to the EP proc, you cant really +1 it quickly either.

In a battle of attrition warriors will always win. Doesnt matter which class you play. Condi warrior will 100% win every single matchup (Except for stalemating vs condi chrono) in the long run.

I don’t know how long you’ve been around, but playing vs condi warrior is like playing cele D/D ele vs the old S/D Thief. When they hit that f1, you lose.

Two people standing close on node with me being 1v2 far and ele being 1v3 in close. This depicts 3 people defending the node vs no one.

My eyes literally bleed after watching about 1.5 minutes of this game. I thought Platinum was bad.

Only Even.6193:

Actually, Warrior is the most dangerous and unforgiving encounter, you rarely even can expect a second chance, if you are unlucky or make a stupid mistake,(shits happen) you are already lying on the ground.

It’s like soloing a smarter pve champ lol, you can’t one-two-three shoot it, war is tough enough to perma pressuring you to the death if you don’t manage to stay away from it.. And I won’t even talk about how a “surprise” +1 warrior can .. well, literally kitten you.

BUT ! Actual warrior is not OP “Over Powered”, people have to understand that War is f* not OP, they are just, balanced, and that is what make such a difference.

The real problem is that it’s not the case for any other class !

If they nerf warrior, they will be pretty useless again, don’t push a balanced class too much or it will fall apart..
And don’t get me wrong, I hate warriors myself, but I can’t stand when people permanently call for the nerf hammer every single time, when they loose too much fights.
Warriors are fine, other class need to be balanced, and then, everything will be okay.
Be patient and don’t fight for pointless nerfs.

The more a balanced class will be nerfed, lesser the chances to see another class be balanced, be patient and let every class get to the same level, and stop the freaking nerfs calls… Look at the warrior as an example.. My two cents.

Btw, I’m a Rev main and I cringe everyday.. Lo/ just be patient guys !

(Sorry for my french.. ahah)

We want to avoid more power creep in the game. So I’d rather want to see warrior being brought in line rather than seeing every other class becoming the god-mode that is current state warriors.

/15chars

So, I’m sitting at a 200/10 dual fibre line. I ~20-60 ping depending on the server but for some reason, whenever I enter PvP games (Not the lobby) it spikes to somewhere between 400-4000 which obviously makes it completly unplayable.

Is anyone experiencing a similar issue? I have a hard time seeing this is something on my part considering its only Guildwars.

Menyus.4610:

Loop.8106:

This forces dh’s to rotate, which is horrible since they don’t have any mobility.

I lost it this guy said dh dont have mobility my favourite argument gonna make my compialtion about dhs getting from mid to close before thief could even decap cos community cant deny facts after i posted it, no mobility jeez best joke so far in this thread and people were even saying dh is weak u sir topped it

I assume you’re counting F2 Sword 2 and Judge’s Intervention. If you blow F2 and JI to stay on a target, there’s absolutly no way you’ll ever win the fight since you’re losing your only viable stunbreak, fury uptime, aswell as gap maker, heal and condi clear just to stay with a target. You also need a target in order for Sword 2 and JI to actually work. Same as with Shiro’s Phase Traversal and Infiltrators Signet.
Do not mistake this for mobility. Guards thrive on maps such as Khylo and Foefire to to the open nature of the map. If you however take this to Forest and Temple you’ll not be successful due to losing vision easily.
On open maps such as Skyhammer, this doesnt really work either due to the plethora of “No valid path to target”.

But by all means, if you want to embarres yourself by quoting me. Go right ahead.

I’d seriously just nerf AD radius to 300, remove the blind on Skull Grinder and increase Defy Pain cd to 90 to be on par with the other professions safety nets.

Draco.9480:

Amicable Pugs.4503:

https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/237256/gw287.jpg
If you’re gonna post made up dps numbers in screenshots then get logs or vids to prove it.
More Alacrity wouldn’t of made enough difference to make it seem any less kitten and the player actually spent some time on Necro before, this run was aimed at him specifically trying Nec in all wings and resulted in Nec being useless literally everywhere.

Stop comparing benchmarks and spreadsheets to reality. Necro can do more than ele in certain bosses. Stop with the delusional elitism. Or do ya need Nemesis to debunk zis kitten?

Ya’ll never do a dps of benchmark golem in a raid, Never.

Have you seen Mursaat Overseer?

Windwalker.7421:

suffish.4150:

…, DH is possibly the weakest class in the game right now even though it is still viable.

Sorry, but I seriously almost spilled coffee all over my keyboard reading that.

Yes, and Earth is flat, barely 5000 years old, and is the center of the universe!

Ahh nothing like the GW2 PvP board…comedy at it’s finest!

Hes actually right. In an optimal scenario for DH’s meaning you dont face Druids / Eles or Scrappers. They can pull off miracles. However, the moment you face these classes. Ele specifically you simply cant teamfight. Your dmg are so cut short with protection, and mainly projectile denial. IE Swirling Winds, Magnetic Aura, Overload Earth and depending on your teamcomp, Aftershock!.

This forces dh’s to rotate, which is horrible since they don’t have any mobility. (Even with rune of the lynx). They have favorable match-ups vs Power Warriors and mesmers. Kinda even vs condi wars.

If you however can’t find these match-ups and are instead put against a Scrapper or a Druid. (Which both can easily outrotate you.) You’re in for a bad-bad match.

So I’ve had the same two mesmers in my team today, they kept afking / idling in the games. I have reported them, blocked them, tried to queue dodge them and a few times, carried them. This game our ele aswell as both mesmers decided to afk instead of actually trying to win the game. This resulting in -17 rating for me which is ~3-4 wins worth of rating.
Can we please for the love of kittening jesus holy christ have 5 queing back. I feel like calling them all out with screenshots on the forums and maybe, just maybe the mods can take some kind of action.

sephiroth.4217:

Loop.8106:

sephiroth.4217:

Be thankful you placed that high, a lot of people with 7-3 or 6-4 like you but placed bottom bronze or silver, seen threads/scores like yours and left the game.

Thats because their rating last season was garbage. Either way, shouldn’t take too long progressing up to atleast plat 1 (which is where you’re starting to face decent players in the first place).

The elo-hell isn’t real. If you can’t carry your weight of of bronze, that’s where you belong.

Do you actually believe that this season? I’m in Gold and I’ve knocked people from Silver back to bronze just because MM couldn’t match me with other Golds…. Same goes with higher players, those platinum kittens have knocked me back into Silver a few times, Naru/Vallun did it to me last season too…..

Yes and no, some games are completly unwinnable. One in particular that comes to mind is Vaanss + Xomi duo together with Thijsken + (insert high rated player here due to memory loss) duo against myself, with similar rating, my duo partner with similar rating a low gold duo queue and some random.

Either way, if you carry your own weight you will win more than you lose.

Djinn.9245:

SlippyCheeze.5483:

Djinn.9245:

If raids are so easy and people are completing with 4 people, why are some raid leaders charging 100g for a boss so people can open this Mastery? If its so easy why not let anyone in your raid?

It’s a free market, and they will charge what the market will pay. Are they filling these raids? Also, are they expecting the people who pay to contribute absolutely nothing, or are they expecting them to participate, understand mechanics, etc?

I suspect you will find that this is paying to be carried through a boss kill as dead weight, no expectations at all on you, for the mastery.

If you want to not pay gold for it, try instead finding a training raid, or a guild that raids, and working with them instead.

And why is “the market” willing to pay 100g? If raiding was so easy, anyone who wanted to raid should be able to do it without paying. People only pay for a completion because they can’t get one any other way or it takes so long that they’re willing to pay for convenience. I don’t think many people are paying 100g for convenience.

Why do you need to find a training guild if raiding is so easy?

As someone part of Flax (the biggest, most active and most experienced raid selling guild on the EU servers. Absolutly no one buys escort, with the exceptions of them buying entire wings. It has no timer on it, the last boss has 721k hp instead of the usual 34 mil. It has zero wipe mechanics apart from pulling Glenna into mines / letting wargs kill her. People generally pay 180 gold per raid boss with the exception of Matthias, Xera and Deimos being more expensive while Gorseval and Bandit Trio being cheaper.

If people are playing on the EU servers, just /w me and I will help you get the raid kills as we are doing lowmans anyway just for the fun of it.
As of forcing people into specific gamemodes. I think open worlders are the most lucky bunch. Reason being, look at the HoT specific legendaries. Journys, map currency farming, world exploration.

sephiroth.4217:

Be thankful you placed that high, a lot of people with 7-3 or 6-4 like you but placed bottom bronze or silver, seen threads/scores like yours and left the game.

Thats because their rating last season was garbage. Either way, shouldn’t take too long progressing up to atleast plat 1 (which is where you’re starting to face decent players in the first place).

The elo-hell isn’t real. If you can’t carry your weight of of bronze, that’s where you belong.

beatthedown.2651:

Are “PVE players” really that much of a problem for you guys? If they are bad they get to Bronze. If you constantly face them you should be bad aswell…

Thanks to lower population the chance to get matches with terrible players is even higher now.

When you’re 1850 rating and getting put into teams with a 1470 mmr duo queue. Yes they are an issue.

I have the same, currently rank 50 something on leaderboards.

Were you by chance a thief called Fuube or something?

Can we please get 5 queue back?

I made a post earlier talking about the ever declining population and the fact that I got put into games with people having 200 less mmr than me.

So, I just finished a game where our thief plain out said “Why am I in this game?”
Turns out he was at 1590 mmr. I am at 1810, my duo queue at 1770. Vaanss and Xomi in the opposing team is at 1869 and 1848. Their thief at 1798.

Like either don’t put these people into the high rated games or let us have the option to full queue. This is getting absolutly ridicolous either stomping games 500-100 or getting stomped the other way around. At this point, its basicly a lottery in the higher tiers. There are the same 5 players people are queue dodging like they are the plague.

This would just be a slugfest of sustainy classes such as Warriors Scrappers and Druids. Either that or having like Thief Mesmer + ? and just burst during moa at the start of every fight.

So, judging from this thread. The only viable way of beating a condi warrior is with … Drumroll power warrior.
Sure, I can beat them on DH but it takes too much time to be worth it as they will hold the cap for the entirety of the fight. I guess Ill give them the old Turret engi treatment.

ibThuggin.1758:

Loop.8106:

Lel, Rifle Engi. Those were the times.

You can laugh all you want, but there is actually more builds then just “meta battle” cause the current power hammer one isn’t as good with this balance patch.

There are, most of which are complete garbage. Power Rifle engi included. You’re of course free to run whatever you like, but don’t except to win when you run these kinds of builds.

If you went power hammer with Bulwark Gyro you could’ve single handedly carried that game provided you’re a decent player.

Lel, Rifle Engi. Those were the times.

This is a legit question, not a cry for nerf or w/e.

What beats a condi war? So far I’ve found nothing to win 1v1 and they take too long to 2v1 for it to be worth it. So outside of giving it the old turret engi treatment of letting them have your point for free and play 5v4 on two nodes, what other options are there?

They absolutly shred through Druids and Scrappers. Tried DH, it’s somewhat viable but still feel like it loses pretty hard.

BenjaminMS.6710:

If someone wants a personal DPS meter for themselves to have a look at their own output. Go ahead.

But if it gets used to judge others? kitten. OFF. I’ve seen too much toxic & elitist behaviour in other MMOs (from Star Trek Online, to Rift, to Neverwinter) when combat meters on group level got introduced. Those who say a group-based DPS meter isn’t a bad idea in itself are intentionally ignorant. ANet should build an own DPS meter which can standard measure your own DPS and only if others allow their DPS to be measured, also track others, allow people to buy it in the cash shop to cover the development costs and forbid any of the others. DPS meters are often too toxic in general widespread usage for uncontrolled use.

Only reason people doesn’t want to be monitored is that they know they wont pull their own weight.
I know the dps checks in raids are extremly easy to reach as every single boss has been 5 manned or less at this point. However, in pug enviorments people generally die to mechanics. Not enrage. This is why you want to kill the boss as quickly as possible. This does not work if you’re running a carrion staff ele.

So just grab a proper build and practice rotations for a bit and you shouldn’t mind people monitoring your dps.

This was around 3.30 PM

I feel like the population has declined to alarming levels in PvP. This results in incredibly un-balanced and un-fun matches.
I was rank 21 on the EU leaderboards when I started playing today. (slightly above 1800 rating). I duod with a player that had ~1770 rating. We get put in games with 1320 mmr players.
I added them to friendslist after seeing them running core guard builds and farming bosses on Forests aswell as feeding into unfavorable matchups. (Thief Rev vs Ele Necro).

I get that it’s hard maintaining a good matchmaking system when the population probably is at an all time low. However I’d prefer waiting 15 minutes a game for this NOT to happen.

Gretzel.6790:

None of these losses are my fault

Well then. Aint that funny?

Cynz.9437:

Loop.8106:

I went 6-4 in my placements where 2 of the 4 losses were 4v5 games. I ended up at 1654 rating. Just a couple games later I’m sitting at 1758. Placements only count kitten much. Just keep playing and you’ll get to where you’re supposed to be.

Grats, i ended up in 1350 range with similar results (was plat last season). Not that i care much about rating, i can climb out of it. But 100% of matches for me atm are beyond one sided. I can solo druids/DHs and co. or 1v2 as thief at these ratings. It is just waste of time for me and not so fun for players i am facing (e.g. i basically spawn camped some mes yesterday, some people just ragequit).
The guy i kept running into in matches (thankfully on my team) was actually legend last season and he placed in silver. Take a guess how silver/gold players fare vs his engi xD

Then, as i mentioned, there is issue with rating gain decay, by the time i hit plat i will probably gain 5 pts for match. That is surely motivating~

Yeah, idk. I ended last season ~1900 rating. So shouldnt deviate that much. Then again, the placements are a joke as I Queued into Zan aswell as silver players in the same team.

I went 6-4 in my placements where 2 of the 4 losses were 4v5 games. I ended up at 1654 rating. Just a couple games later I’m sitting at 1758. Placements only count kitten much. Just keep playing and you’ll get to where you’re supposed to be.

No, any time of disconnect should result in a loss aswell as dishonor. Having a teammate disconnect even for a minute is basicly match deciding.
Don’t queue if you have a rocky connection.

With your actual rating is how last season worked.

Holy mother of first world problems.

SweetPotato.7456:

no, why should anyone get something they didn’t work for at all?

Because I asked nicely?

Jaina Ashlynn.1043:

As a skill clickin’, loot stickin’ scrub guardian, all I can say is big boy armor…..you should put that on. Seriously though, if you are making that kind of coin selling raids, why even bother with WvW at all?

Read the post below yours

Baldrick.8967:

Can you please transfer off SFR? Use one quarter of a day’s earnings from your selling raids. I’m embarrassed on behalf of my server that people like you are associated with it.

Oh, and tell us your ign so we can all block you and exclude you from any groups.

Edit: Actually, why do you even need a Gift of Battle? You say you make 1000g in an evening selling raids, so you can buy every legendary weapon within a month or so.

What possible use is a Gift of Battle to someone who must have 100000000000 gold on their account by now?

Because there is this “new” thing called account bound legendaries such as. Nevermore, HOPE, Eureka, Shooshadoo(?) HMS Divinity, The Ascension and Ad Infinitum.
I would buy the finished legendary if I could.

It’s not the same. I can afk with squad participation.
I make twice that money in an evening selling raids.

So, basicly. I absolutly detest the WvW gamemode and everything along with it. Everything from the tank core guard meta with momentum runes to the indredibly slow gameplay to the zerg fights to the map layout.

To get to the point. I need Gift of Battle, again. I find this to be a stupid way of aquering it, due to the simple fact that whenever I join wvw, I take up a slot that could contain someone actually wanting to play it aswell as me NOT contributing kitten to our server.

Are commanders actually selling squad participation? Id be willing to pay ~500g for half a reward track on SFR. Hook me up.

Why should people that actually took time to learn the encounters have you breeze through it? You’re not entitled to join any group in which you don’t meet the requirements.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Loop.8106:

How do people not completly drown in ascended by now?

well, me.

as a super casual player i have 0 legendaries 1 pvp back item precursor (bcos its free!) and well around 3.9k gold in my wallet among other tokens etc.

i only gotten 2 pieces of ascended armor boxes from random loot, and 3 pieces of weapon boxes.

no more.

fortunately the previous season allowed me to acquire 4 more armor boxes for my main warrior.

3.9k gold ~ 50 ascended armor pieces =/= 35 weapons.

How do people not completly drown in ascended by now?

Sublimatio.6981:

lol, no. it’s buggy as hell.
- phase skipping (no rigom phase)
- phase repeat (respawn rigom and guldhem after you finish them)
- rigom bugs and clunkiness
- holes in terrain making rigom stuck and difficult to retrieve
- cc phase can be entirely skipped if he jumps on the fixated person that at the same time gets downed (maybe not a bug but odd)
- when he runs behind spears, stops when spears clear from map, wasting timer time

- Rigom not making Guldhem vulnurable even though he blew up inside of Samarog
- Not running all the way to the spears at 66% and 33% but rather stops halfway
- Spear mechanic being client side instead of server side making it unreliable to actually dodge them

I really enjoyed cm 4. CM
1 was incredibly simple once you got used to spamming the special action.
2 was meh, we had to alter our dps in a way so that blue and spikes would sync up. All in all, pretty easy.
3 is absolute aids. It’s littered with bugs and has incredibly un-fun mechanics.
4 I really liked Deimos CM, probably more than the actual fight. You had to figure out how to block the attacks, we tried a bunch of different things before we ended up with the same metacomp with double precogs.

My overall impression of the wing is pretty decent. Only issue is that the fights are soooooooo repetetive. Very few actual mechanics outside of maybe Claim / Dispell on boss 2. Boss 1 melts in about 4 seconds to any decent team. Boss 3 is just an hp sponge on normal. No way any team should wipe on it.
Boss 4 is still pretty decent on CM, I wouldve liked CM to be normal though and added a few extra mechanics to the actual Challenge Mote version though.
Wing 1 still best wing though.

Monk
N/Rt Minion Master
Rt/Me Spirits
Me/Rt Spirits
E/Rt Ether Renewal Spirits.

Supreme.3164:

Loop.8106:

Supreme.3164:

I’m so playing a dh if no nerfs coming, I have literally no counters, I can build to kill/stall anything…simply outstanding

I would like to see you outsustaining anything without Renewed Focus on a marauder LB build. Wanna upload a video of a game you’re playing or hook me up ingame? Kinda curious. Kappa.

You try to outsustain others on a marauder build?
When the skill level of a profession get lowered too much, this what happens, the meaning of “marauder build” is lost to the masses

Can build to kill/stall anything. There’s no DH build you can play that will kill a druid, scrapper or ele. Your matchups vs revs are questionable at best. Sure, you can sustain most 1v1s by running a symbolic menders build, but that will grant you a total of zero kills since people will just rotate out of the 1v1 and take over the rest of the map.

Playing the DH symbolic build is like running Scrapper or Druid. The small-scirmishing point contester. It just doesn’t offer enough to take over druid or scrapper. The sheer res power of the other classes is enough to bring DH below their tier. Couple this with the amount of mobility the other classes has compared to DH and you should see why DH’s lack so much.

Only change I would do to PI is not having it proc on auto-attack interupts as that’s just stupid.

Supreme.3164:

Hey..if they don’t nerf dh, the direction taken by anet will be clear..I just start to complete my 3rd main then, I can do things on marauder dh… ..never accomplished that level of dmg so easily…teleport in ToF+DM..and even top 250 players fall flat on their face.

It’s extremely easy, all you need to know is the CD of enemy skills and their positioning…then BAM>>KABOM….teleport in use 2 traps, knockback..so kittening easy.

I’m so playing a dh if no nerfs coming, I have literally no counters, I can build to kill/stall anything…simply outstanding

I would like to see you outsustaining anything without Renewed Focus on a marauder LB build. Wanna upload a video of a game you’re playing or hook me up ingame? Kinda curious. Kappa.

NotASmurf.1725:

DH would be fine if F1 and F3 got nerfed. F1 should either take longer to cast, be on a higher CD, or be blockable. F3 needs a duration decrease, show me one other block in the game that doesn’t need to be channeled and lets you do your full burst while its up.

F3 got its duration decreased already, and let’s be real. Blocks are not what it used to be. Marks, Signet of Might, Smokescale KD, Basi Venom, Gale, Spear of Justice + longbow 3 on guard aswell as post Shiro port on Rev.
These are all “in the meta” except for Rev.
Having the spear blockable is plain stupid, you can already counteract it by popping stability, dodging the actual spear aswell as LoSing it once you’re hit for the pull not to go through.
I know about the bug where someone ports way out of range, DH’s pull and gets the enemies flying into the air. That needs to be fixed.