Guild Wars 2

NewTrain.7549:

Nerelith.7360:

Fasalina.6571:

NewTrain.7549:

Anyone who thinks this will cause deflation or even mildly curb inflation has never even studied the most elementary economics.

So then enlighten us oh mighty savior?
And also one question. Did the champ farm contribute to the deflation or to the reduction of inflation (I think not, which means the disappearance of said champ farms isn’t bad either) Or am i wrong?

It’s bad for his wallet.

I don’t, nor have I ever, champ train farmed. It has nothing to do with “my wallet”.

Again, in an economy where money is created at will (each looted item or amount of coin is brand new to the world and therefore wealth is actively created) will never experience anything but inflation when combined with a supply/demand based market. Trying to argue otherwise displays a complete ignorance of the most basic of economics

You forgot the other end of the equation…Gold sinks. If yoiu ciut down on created wealth by nerfing loot bags, and Increase the gold sinks from things Like… Buying Traits .. then you get closer to a balance where Inflation can be reduced.

Blix.8021:

Nerelith.7360:

Blix.8021:

The champ train wasn’t even that profitable. If you want to complain about inflation complain about dungeon paths that give 1-3 gold + champ boxes to 5 people and can be cleared in 10-30 minutes.

That is playing the game as Intended. The Champion Train is not.

I’m pretty sure it was intended, why else did they add champ boxes in the first place? I didn’t do frostgorge because it was the most boring thing ever, but why take it away from the people who liked it? “inflation” is not a good reason because champ boxes don’t even give gold anymore.

Re-spam Champion Train is not Playing the game as intended. That is obvious by the fact that it was nerfed.

if it were playing the game as intended they would have added gold to the Loot bags.

If they make the champions spawn less often. If they increase the interval… if they reduce the gold in the Loot bags…. The Champion Train is not playing the game as the developers intended.

Pandeh.5248:

Fellow players, they also nerfed this.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/FROST-GORGE-TRAIN-RUINED/first#post3901292

I was considering starting to play again with this update, now I’m considering deleting my chars and just move on from this kitten.

Gimme your Gold?

Fasalina.6571:

NewTrain.7549:

Anyone who thinks this will cause deflation or even mildly curb inflation has never even studied the most elementary economics.

So then enlighten us oh mighty savior?
And also one question. Did the champ farm contribute to the deflation or to the reduction of inflation (I think not, which means the disappearance of said champ farms isn’t bad either) Or am i wrong?

It’s bad for his wallet.

Blix.8021:

The champ train wasn’t even that profitable. If you want to complain about inflation complain about dungeon paths that give 1-3 gold + champ boxes to 5 people and can be cleared in 10-30 minutes.

That is playing the game as Intended. The Champion Train is not.

Fiasco.3501:

It’s hardly good to remove a source of income when prices keep rising making it ever more difficult to make higher level items (ascended/legendaries).

You put the cart before the horse. The Inflation was caused By things Like re-spammable champion trains, and spamming dungeons over and ovwer and over.

THIS led to higher prices….

Look up Germany 1923..the government decided to pay it’s debts by printing money.

When you go on a champ train…you are paying your debts…by printing money.

End result..Hyper-inflation

sternenstaub.8763:

ANET also nerved dungeon paths.
Do you see a pattern here?

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

“Play how I want you to play” at it’s finest.

You can still play how you want to play, it’s not like they put your character on a 15 minute cd after every champ.
You can still do all those events. You can still farm mobs in any zone. You can still do dungeons all day long. It’s just not that lucrative anymore.

This will eventualy lead to lower prices in the TP some time in the future btw, increasing the worth of those methods again indirectly. It’s more a method to stop massive inflation and decrease farming at all. Because farming actually increases inflation by a lot for all players. Increasing prices and leads to:

Farming!

Exactly. With high prices everybody needs to run farmruns to be able to buy the most basic items… which actually forces players to do things they do not want while increasing prices even more!

Therefore, bringing down massiv farming leads to a system where players can play the game how they want… and still being able to buy all those shinies.

Quoted For The Win!!!

Lothirieth.3408:

You guys that are exclaiming “Good!” might not be so happy if this makes t6 mats, cores and lodestones increase in price since people won’t be opening near as many boxes. :P

I never cared if people trained around Queensdale killing champions. My issue has always been the toxic atmosphere, that many champ train riders turned Queensdale into.

I have seen people call other people tards for killing a champion out of turn.

I have seen vers of the game tell Newbies, that if they do not join the train they cannot attack the champs, and if they do so Out of turn shut their pie holes about it, because mentioning On map that they did is griefing… and will be reported.

I have seen people that decide to kill a champion just 3 or 4 people to see if they can…out of turn called greedy, and discourteous.

Seems that giving the people On the champion train respect and courtesy, means that you MUST Join the champion train….or Not touch them.

One guy said " I am keeping track of players that Kill them out of turn, if I ever see them in a dungeon not going to help them."

THIS is why I am happy the Champion train was nerfed.

PS. Do we really want a Bunch of players whose two important skills are …following one another, and hitting auto-attack?

Angelica Dream.7103:

Spring is here. Maybe people want to go outside?

What is this Outside you speak of?

D I V A.6018:

Burnfall.9573:

So what… if it look or seem impossible for Arena.net implementing mounts in the game,

what are dreams for?

What is wrong with dreaming?

" Without dreams, life would not exist "

" Without possibility, the impossible would enslave us "

Do people even read their own posts??

Maybe he’s from Colorado? Hit the bong too many times?

Astralporing.1957:

Conncept.7638:

Astralporing.1957:

What Nerelith wanted to say is that people that are satisfied with the status quo do not need to supply any reason beyond “we like things as they are” because they are not trying to convince anyone. People that want change however do need to supply reason for it. And if there is a large part of community that doesn’t want that change, the reason must be really good. No such reason has been supplied so far.

If my argument is flawed yours is as well, in the exact same way in fact. The developers are working on something, and will be doing so continually until the day the GW2 servers shut down. You could just as easily say that because something is being worked on, “we’d like that work the be spent on this”, and be just as justified in that desire for action as anyone be in their desire for any other action, ambiguity does not make one thing more valid that another, less if it has any affect at all.

You’d be right only if the developers actually worked on mounts, or already planned to work on mounts. Otherwise my reasoning still stands.

Any new introduction to the game needs to be weighted in terms of necessity (does the game needs it?), desirability (do the people want it? are the people against it?) and difficulty (how hard it is to implement). For something to be done, the first two need to outweight the third. In the case of mounts, you failed to supply any valid reason for first, and are losing on second (more people seem to be against it than for it). The difficulty is also definitely not zero.

Deciding to introduce something new and not introducing it are not equal options as far as supplying reason for either is concerned . The second will always be easier.

In other words the burden is on those wishing mounts to give reasons that are compelling.

“I want it, I think it would be cool.” isn’t.

Conncept.7638:

Nerelith.7360:

And you Misquote me. I doin’t care How easy or hard it is. I don’t want it, because it would clutter up My screen.

Seriously? And people have claimed that just saying you want it because you want it or it would be fun is a stupid reason?

And I didn’t misquote you, I took your completely inapplicable analogy out because it was based on your claim that I had stated ‘difficulty’ was a reason a person shouldn’t bring up technical applications they don’t know about, which anybody with a pair of eyes and a grade school reading level could see I did not.

Nerelith.7360:

As to not Knowing developer intent. That is easy. First they said they had no intention of including mounts at this time.

‘At this time’ three years ago, that’s a funny view of chronlogy…

Nerelith.7360:

Then they developed the game including a way point system that makes mounts 100 % completely unnecessary.

Waypoints also make the gate system which spans the entire game unecessary. Ascended makes exotics unecessary, as do exotics to rares, and rares to masterwork items. This next patch will make the PvP lobby unnecessary, yet it’s staying. Necessity is a standard only a fool would set the design of a game by. It’s all unnecessary.

Nerelith.7360:

Then they released the game with out mounts. Only added a witch’s brrom and a drill i believe. which are 100 % totally cosmetic with zero speed boost, I believe.

Then for a year and change….. there include not a single speed boost mount.

Then in their Blogs they say nothing about even reconsidering the idea.

We can determine a lot about developer Intent by how they designed the game. One of the things which is exceeding clear is….

" no mounts that give a speed boost..maybe a cosmetic one for a Holiday… Cupid’s wings on valentine’s day… reindeer and sleigh for Christmas…" but a speed or flying mount ??

… really? So they shouldn’t add anything to the game that it didn’t launch with? That’s an interesting thought, and by interesting I mean completely ridiculous.

Nerelith.7360:

I guess nothing wrong with wanting things…. people can want things.

Apparently not without being lambasted by you and the people you are defending.

Nerelith.7360:

PS My comment about how it woiuld be best use of resources to leave it as is, is because there are better things they can be doing with their time and energy…Like More attention to class balance. Making engineers and rangers etc more In balance with other classes comes before mounts…

Mounts is actually very low in the list of Priorities… and the community is very divided. I think he devs will get less blow back from leaving things as they are, especially since they went out of their way to make Mounts totally superfluous.

More New things to the game? sure after they balance the old things. Mounts? No. Just…. no.

Oh look! More BS coming from someone ignorant of how game design even works. No, they can’t, because for the billionth time CONTENT and BALANCE couldn’t be handled by the same teams even if their VERY LIVES depended on it! They require two completely different skill sets, even two completely different ways of thinking about the game.

Astralporing.1957:

What Nerelith wanted to say is that people that are satisfied with the status quo do not need to supply any reason beyond “we like things as they are” because they are not trying to convince anyone. People that want change however do need to supply reason for it. And if there is a large part of community that doesn’t want that change, the reason must be really good. No such reason has been supplied so far.

If my argument is flawed yours is as well, in the exact same way in fact. The developers are working on something, and will be doing so continually until the day the GW2 servers shut down. You could just as easily say that because something is being worked on, “we’d like that work the be spent on this”, and be just as justified in that desire for action as anyone be in their desire for any other action, ambiguity does not make one thing more valid that another, less if it has any affect at all. Plus there is the hurdle of hundreds of forumites blindly fighting something because its popular, when in fact they have no idea how it would work, whether it would be an ‘eyesore’, or whether it would be fun.

“No Mounts, don’t want them”

Conncept.7638:

Plus there is the hurdle of hundreds of forumites blindly fighting something because its popular, when in fact they have no idea how it would work, whether it would be an ‘eyesore’, or whether it would be fun.

We don’t care. Since our desires are aligned with the developers, we do not need any reason other than …." we don’t care."

we do not need to know the technical difficulties. We do not need to know whether it is easy or hard. And you pose a false equality.

US saying " we do Not want it" doesn’t equal you saying " we do."

We want the status quo. I know you do not like it, but since we want the status quo, the ONLY reason we need is.." we are happy without mounts, we would be unhappy with mounts. No mounts."

YOU on the other hand…want a drastic change to the game. You need VALID reasons.

" I want it, and I think it would be cool." is not a valid enough reason, when MANY players do not want it.

I know you don’t like hearing it. I for one do Not care :

1. How it would work.
2. Whether it would be an eyesore.
3. Whether some think it might be fun.

We do not want mounts.

If you persist on raising this issue, do not be shocked how many rise up, to keep saying:

“No Mounts, don’t want them”

YOU need to give a valid reason, taking into account How many players LIKE gw2 without mounts, would hate gw2 with mounts, and…after 3 years…..the devs have only included 2 cosmetic mounts.

That should tell you something. After three years, if it were their intent to include mounts they would have included mounts.

Mounts are not what the devs want for this game.,…accept it, be at peace with it.

Conncept.7638:

Nerelith.7360:

Since the devs have stated that it is NOT their intent to include ground mounts at this time, and since a LOT of the player base agrees with the devs. All we have to prove is… and PLEASE Pay attention:

" ADDING MOUNTS TO THE GAME IS HARDER THAN …NOT ADDING MOUNTS TO THE GAME."

No duh Sherlock. Adding anything to the game is more work than not adding anything. So by your argument they just shouldn’t add anything at all, ever? No. It’s not a matter of doing work or not, it’s a matter of doing work the players will enjoy or doing work which they will not. So it comes down to how they would do it. Do you know how? Does anybody else in this thread know how? I didn’t think so.

ANet is always working on something, and you don’t know what or how any of it would be implemented or how many players would enjoy it. You are claiming that because of the value of X you know the value of Y, when in reality you don’t even know what Y’s formula is, it’s value, its relation to X, or whether there is any relation at all. All you know is X’s value. At the same time Anet could be working project W and Z, which you also know nothing about, and yet also claim must be a better option of pursuit than Y, because of X’s value, in spite of it unknown relation to all of the above.

Nerelith.7360:

This is a Ludicrous argument. Saying that " Unless you can state exactly what work is necessary to have mounts added to the game you cannot say how hard it would be to do." " adding mounts would be hard." But… adding mounts doesn’t have to be hard.

I didn’t say that, I said unless he can state exactly what work is required there is no point in his arguing that point, in fact I didn’t mention difficulty at all. If you actually paid attention to the conversation you would note that I stated several pages ago to this exact person (which he ignored or missed while nitpicking vocabulary) that stating you don’t think it would be worth the work, or just don’t like it, is a perfectly valid point. But BSing through ambiguous technical garble about that work just proves you don’t know what you are talking about, don’t have the ability to stand up for it, and are likely only taking this stance to follow the crowd.

If you don’t like the idea as a player, just say so. We have more than enough pages of BS at this point when in reality it comes down to two arguments:

“I do not think adding mounts would be a fun addition to the game”

“I do think adding mounts would be a fun addition to the game.”

There ya’ go. Pretty much everything in this entire thread beyond those two arguments rides on completely baseless assumptions about how ANet would implement mounts, whether players would enjoy that implementation, and what their technical structure would be. All of which you don’t know, and he doesn’t know, and nobody else in this thread knows.

And you Misquote me. I doin’t care How easy or hard it is. I don’t want it, because it would clutter up My screen.

As to not Knowing developer intent. That is easy. First they said they had no intention of including mounts at this time.

Then they developed the game including a way point system that makes mounts 100 % completely unnecessary.

Then they released the game with out mounts. Only added a witch’s brrom and a drill i believe. which are 100 % totally cosmetic with zero speed boost, I believe.

Then for a year and change….. there include not a single speed boost mount.

Then in their Blogs they say nothing about even reconsidering the idea.

We can determine a lot about developer Intent by how they designed the game. One of the things which is exceeding clear is….

" no mounts that give a speed boost..maybe a cosmetic one for a Holiday… Cupid’s wings on valentine’s day… reindeer and sleigh for Christmas…" but a speed or flying mount ??

I guess nothing wrong with wanting things…. people can want things.

PS My comment about how it woiuld be best use of resources to leave it as is, is because there are better things they can be doing with their time and energy…Like More attention to class balance. Making engineers and rangers etc more In balance with other classes comes before mounts…

Mounts is actually very low in the list of Priorities… and the community is very divided. I think he devs will get less blow back from leaving things as they are, especially since they went out of their way to make Mounts totally superfluous.

More New things to the game? sure after they balance the old things. Mounts? No. Just…. no.

Hickeroar.9734:

GW2’s maps are far too small for mounts. You can run all the way across any zone in the game in a couple minutes. Even the largest WvW maps are still only about 4-5 minutes wide/tall. Mounts would be complete overkill.

Why get on a mount anyway when you can just open your map and waypoint within a couple hundred yards of just about anything instantly.

Their replies Boil down to :

1. Because it would be cool.
2. because I need to look at Bling.
3. because I want others to see my Bling, and Nothing is more visible bling than a Mount.
4. because I want a permanent speed boost …
5. because I want to fly
6. because I want it.

Tyragon.2496:

I would say yes, in the far future.

Something GW2 is rich of is a great combat system, very dynamic. It would be perfect for mount combat compared to other games that’s tried it.

But, the negative part is that mounts usually means increased speed. In order for mounts to work in GW2 they’d have to be just as slow as running, perhaps be able to give a temporary movement speed buff like the abilities we have to give Swiftness.

Mounts would be fun, if we look at the cosmetic part of it and the possibility for mount combat and forget the part about “increased movement speed for travel”. Though as I mentioned, mounts as slow as running seems ridiculous and this is where the whole mount idea starts to fall apart.

The whole issue about Mounts is… the speed boost. And to be honest the game designers made this game so that mounts are not needed. The Waypoins were set up so many, and so packed together, so that we do not need speed boost mounts.

Now the problem is…Mounts that do something extra…whether speed boost or toughness messes with balance..and Mounts that are cosmetic only have NO benefits aside from Visual Bling…. and a LOT of negatives.

Most players do not want Mounts, it’s fine as it is.

mtpelion.4562:

If the boss dies, then why does it matter?

It’s about some people wanting to Know How their damage is coming up with their build…. but there are some that will Just use it to stroke their ego.

Astralporing.1957:

Devata.6589:

Astralporing.1957:

Devata.6589:

Also when introducing them for new maps they can decrease waypoints so they would make the world feel bigger.

That’s an argument against introducing mounts. I like waypoints.
Also, i have noticed that you silently assumed that mounts would grant some sort of movement/speed bonus. This is bad, because it means they would become obligatory – also for the people that do not want them.
Which is why i don’t want mounts in the game – i would have no problem with them being only cosmetic, but talk long enough and all the people that want them eventually admit that they are after something more.

There are already many speed-boost elements in the game. Mounts would only make the permanent (for as long as your are on them).

Either these speed boosts would be better in some way (in which case they would be obligatory), or they wouldn’t be better (in which case all the travel-based reasons go out the window, and only cosmetic ones remain. Notice, that a permanent speed boost that doesn’t require you to sacrifice a trait, utility slot or rune set is better.

Devata.6589:

And reducing way-points in new maps is not the same as removing all way-points.

I don’t want waypoint reduction either. As i said before, i like them.

Devata.6589:

Way-points don’t fit the lore and make the world-size trivial.

If that is your main problem, then you should be against mounts (as anything that makes you travel faster diminishes the size of the world)

They want the Waypoints gone, because it would make the game bigger. Then they can suggest the mounts, to make it more convenient to travel.

As I see it, the issue is,…Players that want mounts don’t wanna be nickled and dimed, they rather pay for a Mount ..Once.

Players also want a permanent speed boost as long as they are mounted. I even heard people saying " 150% speed boost" others say " flying Mounts."

The game is fine with waypoints. The developers put waypoints in so we do not need mounts, therefore it is clear to most of us..that they do not want or need mounts. We don’t need a dev to come on and say it, the entire design of the game is saying it.

Those that don’t get it are being willfully obtuse. Willfully blind. The devs are not going to remove Waypoints and they are not going to rebalance the game by allowing you to sacrifice an ability to gain a permanent mount.

People need to Just accept, this game will not have mounts.

If mounts are so important…there are many games that already provide mounts.

Might be better if you play those games when you need a Mount itch scratched.

LostSQ.4967:

After reading through all of the replies there seems to be a couple of issues that I would like to point out.

1. There is no confirmation message. After you type in the number and click “Send” it is gone. You don’t know how much you sent and can’t ever find out without contacting support. For this I simply would like a confirmation box to pop up after clicking “Send” saying something like “Are you sure you want to send xxxx Gold?” or even only have this confirmation box when sending gold, and not silver/copper.

You already get a request for confirmation BEFORE you send the Gold. If you Just click " accept" it is your fault. We do not need triple and quadruple redundancy to deal with the fact that players do not observe, and are careless.

This is a player issue. Not A company issue. next time be more careful.

2. I’m not trying to get my gold back. I know/understand that there is nothing I can do to get my gold back at this point. Had I known who I sent it to I could have asked but I don’t and have no way to find out. It is disheartening to lose half of your savings (was saving for a twilight sword.. but dang that Dusk costs a ton!!) but life will go on.

The issue as I see it is, you are not accepting the lesson this teaches you. Life is different from school…Life gives the test first, then teaches te lesson.

The problem is you have not learned the lesson.

3. A ton of people seem to think that this game is bug prove and if it was a bug why hasn’t more people found it. I can only say that game bugs don’t always occur and sometimes might need a set of certain requirements to be met. I honestly think/recall that I put the number in the silver box and clicked send, but I could be wrong. However to assume that Anets system is perfect and it can’t be a bug is ignorant to how the game works. Bug happen, and depending on how difficult it is to repro them and their severity they get fixed. New patches cause more bugs to be created and fixes others.

The issue here is, that you are asking the entire playerbase to accpet that your memory is more reliable than Anet’s computers and log….

…

Thanks for all of your responses, some people make awesome points and others input helpful ways of preventing issues like this from even happening. I hope that a dev reads this thread and understands that this is something that would benefit the game.

This is something that would slow the game needlessly. The game offers one confirmation prompt. It is enough. I have never had an issue where I thought I was sensing one amount, and when i saw the confirmation prompt saw that I was sending the incorrect amount, and failed to change i before I confirmed it.

People seem to think that Anet needs to spend time coding and re-coding the game to make up for their carelessness. They don’t.

If you wish to remain careless, do not complain when stuff happens.

Life tested you, then tried to teach you a lesson. You learned the wrong lesson.

pulseunit.8296:

DigitalKirin.9714:

The universe can always build a better fool.

Thread justified merely for this. I’m going to quote the kitten out of this forever and ever. Thank you

OP: Ouch, well you got a Bad Beat story out of it. I think we are all in agreement that you should take the hit like a boss and move on with your life.

EDIT: And don’t listen to Nerelith, she’s in a bad mood.

hahahaha… I woke up early, My cat needed his Litter box changed, ya… bad mood, don’t mind me. :P

Astral Projections.7320:

LostSQ.4967:

I agree with you Talonblaze. Mistakes do happen and even with a confirmation box it will still happen. Like I said I would own up if it was my mistake and humbly ask if I could get it back, if not mistakes happen and it would be my own fault. Just wish I could check cause I still think I sent silver and not gold.

The problem is, how can support get it back? There is only one of two ways.

One is to take it away from the other player. They can’t do that. For one he may no longer have it. For another, they can’t just go into accounts and take items or gold away from them based on something that another player claims to have happened. That player would be outraged if they did that and who could blame them. Their policy is that anything sent through the mail is a gift and is not refundable.

The second way is for them to make up gold out of thin air and send it to you. For one, support may not have the tools to do that. Even if they could, it’s a bad idea for support to be making up gold just because a player says he made a mistake.

Example: new exploit.
I “accidentally” mail out 1000 gold to a friend. Friend buys 1000 gold worth of whatever. Then I contact support. Oops, I made a mistake. I meant to send out 10 silver. Please send me my gold. Support says, “sure, no problem”. Makes up 1000 gold out of thin air. Sends it to me.

His issue is Not with Anet, it is with the guy he gave the Gold to. He simply has to say " dude, I meant to send you x silver, I accidentally sent you x Gold…can you send me My gold back?"

And hope the Guy is a decent person.

As I see it there are 2 issues.

1. he cannot find the guy.
Not Anet’s problem.

2. The guy is found but decides to keep the gold.

Not Anet’s problem.

Fyrebrand.4859:

Lil Puppy.5216:

Considering the fact that most confirmation windows and all other windows in the game look exactly the same (this is a design fail) it wouldn’t do any good as most players would just click whatever button made the transaction go through without care.

Hmm, I don’t know. It’s easy to think of all the countless times we didn’t make any mistakes and just mindlessly click “Okay,” and nothing bad happened. For most people, maybe they don’t send that much money through the mail, or if they do make a mistake it’s to a friend or guildie. They get it sent back, so it’s not a problem, and thus not memorable.
Even if you did screw up and put in the wrong amount, if the system is doing its job in second-guessing your intentions then you can easily correct the error. Nothing significant comes of it, and it may not even leave a lasting memory.
People think of Spell Check as useless, because it doesn’t catch everything — but it catches some things, and does so thanklessly.

Lil Puppy.5216:

The other fail is the triple currency issue of this and other MMO’s (pennies-copper, dollars-silver, and in this case 100 dollars-gold). I’ve never seen an online store have 3 separate entry boxes for when your purchase exceeds 99 dollars…
I would much rather put 1500 silver in the box and have it convert it to 15 gold for me than make a mistake with a 3rd unconventional box for currency. And for that matter, why is there a copper box on the email form anyway, who is sending copper?

This is an excellent point. Honestly, I’ve never even thought about why basically all MMORPGs use this ridiculous system for currency. I’m willing to bet most people have no idea how many copper makes up a gold. I’ll admit, I struggled with this for a while.

It would be way better for a game to say I had 10,000 “dollars” (or whatever fictional currency they want to use) than to say I had 1 “gold.” Most people would probably have a stronger grasp of how much wealth they actually had, and what it meant when they earned more.

I suspect there are two main reasons why the “Copper, Silver, Gold” model still persists in MMORPGs:

1) It’s tradition. This is how people understand money in MMOs, so they do it.

2) It’s intentionally confusing. Players essentially don’t understand the value of the coins they pick up. They see that an item sells for X amount of copper, or silver, and can’t easily translate that into an amount of gold. Thus, less efficient use of their resources, and more time sunk into the game.

That second hypothesis sounds pretty sinister — but to be honest, MMORPG devs can be some of the most deviously sinister people around. How else do you get so many players to spend 10 minutes of their play time waiting around for a boat or zeppelin to arrive, and feel like “Yes, this is quality gameplay that’s happening, right now. Please let me pay you $15 this month.”

ArenaNet has been pretty amazing with pioneering new ideas in this genre, so far. Maybe they could be the first to get rid of this “Copper, Silver, Gold” nonsense, in the interest of clarity?

This sounds Like paranoia. “Oh I can’t do maths…it’s Anet’s fault.” Ummm no…

the Copper/Silver/Gold/Platinum system of Monetary units are part o the flavor of playing In an alternate universe with different Currency systems. While Only gil may work for other games, that wasn’t the direction the devs decided to take this game.

If a Player cannot figure out How many copper are in one Gold..maybe they need to get better at math.

100 copper = 1 silver.
100 silver = 1 gold.

100 × 100 = 10,000

10,000 copper = 1 Gold.

it’s not that hard, Just takes a couple seconds…and some finger counting ( I am female…. sometimes carrying over a zero… TMI)

Just means we need to do some basic maths to figure it out.

PS as to the whole." It’s harder to keep track of what is more expensive, and mentally inefficient."

It is Not hard to figure out that 99 silver 76 copper is less than 2 gold 34 silver 16 copper. I totally fail to understand your argument here. Triple currency systems are no harder to understand than double, or single.

If you Put in the effort.

Lil Puppy.5216:

Considering the fact that most confirmation windows and all other windows in the game look exactly the same (this is a design fail) it wouldn’t do any good as most players would just click whatever button made the transaction go through without care.

The other fail is the triple currency issue of this and other MMO’s (pennies-copper, dollars-silver, and in this case 100 dollars-gold). I’ve never seen an online store have 3 separate entry boxes for when your purchase exceeds 99 dollars. The real world only has 2 types of currency at any given time – coins and bills, these are separated on entry forms.
This is most likely where you made the costly mistake, putting the 4 in the first entry box instead of the second.

I don’t mind trading in 1500 dollars for a gold bar (or whatever the price is…) but I’m not going down to my local 7-11 and getting a slushie with it either.
I would much rather put 1500 silver in the box and have it convert it to 15 gold for me than make a mistake with a 3rd unconventional box for currency. And for that matter, why is there a copper box on the email form anyway, who is sending copper?

Everquest 1, had 5. Copper, silver, Gold, Platinum, and I believe Electrum.

100 copper = 1 silver
100 silver = 1 Gold
100 Gold = 1 Platinum
100 Platinum = 1 Electrum.

People need to be more careful. if a player just " clicks any button to make the transaction go through" without reading the box…. how is that Anet’s fault?

Someone didn’t look, rushed the transaction along, did not bother looking at what they were actually sending. Now they say " Anet needs to fix it , " “add a confirmation window.” Big news, they already HAVE a confirmation window when you wish to send someone Gold.

It just shows they rushed happilly along, and didn’t read the confirmation window, and Confirmed In their mind, because they don’t even remember the confirmation window. They are asking for what the game already gives them… a confirmation window.

Anet doesn’t have to provide a neon green flashing glow in the dark confirmation window. Know why?

Players that ignore the confirmation window as it is Now, to hurry the transaction through…Just as you described… would just click " accept" to rush the transaction through.

Learn to accept responsibility.

LostSQ.4967:

tolunart.2095:

There is absolutely no reason for customer support to lie to you about what happened. Assuming your account wasn’t hacked and the gold stolen by someone without your knowledge, you made a mistake and sent gold instead of silver. It happens, but at this point there’s nothing you can do about it.

I can agree with you that there is no reason for customer support to lie to me, but what they see on their side might not be accurate. To assume their system is perfect and can’t be flawed is a huge mistake.

Right now I fully understand that I won’t be getting any of my gold back whither I did or did not send the gold and I accept that.

The purpose of this thread is to try and convince their team and the community that a confirmation message for sending coin is necessary and when sending any mail there should be an outbox informing the user of who they sent their message to, and what items/coins were included.

I just don’t want to see any fellow players experience losing half of their gold and being told it was their fault without any prove on their side. I can only hope a dev sees this thread and decides to take action in favor of the players.

Am I wrong or doesn’t the mail automatically check and see if you really wish to send… bla bla bla Gold already?

Last time I sent My spouce Gold, it asked me " are you sure you wish to mail… bla bla bla gold..bla bla silver and bla bla copper?"

I think what may have happened was you sent him Gold, the confirmation thing asked are you gonna send him gold…and you clicked yes.

How many times Must the server ask us if we are certain we wish to send money before it allows us to send money? Well in my opinion. Once. it asks once.

I don’t think it is the servers job to keep asking " are you really sure?" " yes" " are you really really sure?" " yes." " are you really really really really sure?" " yes." " Money sent."

No matter How many times it ask to confirm… there will always be people that accidentally send the cash and then ask for One More confirmation message…. if it were up to these people it would take a whole game day to send anyone anything.

The facts are people make mistakes, One conformation is enough, if even with one confirmation you still accidentally sent money… I think the fault was yours… not Anets… Next time, be more careful.

Devata.6589:

Dusty Moon.4382:

Devata.6589:

Zacchary.6183:

So that we don’t have multiple posts saying the same things with different wording I am going to issue multiple choice for both sides based on the general issues they bring up.

1.) I want mounts because:

a.) Immersion.
b.) Reasons.
c.) Mount haters don’t have legitimate reasons.
d.) so easy to do!
e.) THEY have mounts. (points to other MMOs)

2.) I don’t want mounts because:

a.) waypoints already exist, so no point in having mounts.
b.) extra screen clutter.
c.) possibility of griefing with mounts.
e.) this isn’t every other MMO
f.) unfair advantage with speed boost.

Choose your poison.

Well you forget a lot of element for having mounts. Like possible adding a whole new PvE element to the game (collecting them in the world.) I don’t think Anet would implement them in a good way looking at there track record but still it’s an option.

Also when introducing them for new maps they can decrease waypoints so they would make the world feel bigger.

They could also bee seen as an extra form of skin just like legendaries and this whole game pretty much is about skins so it would make sense from that viewpoint.

Lastly many people simply think it’s fun to have them.

About the negative. Screen-clutter would only be a possible problem inside city’s and it would be possible to let people dismount there.

What new PvE element? None – you can get anywhere faster by portals than a mount. The world is big enough – mounts make worlds seem smaller not bigger.

As was said, it is more than ‘clicking add mount’ in their game engine. Too many things have to be looked at, balanced, AND MODELED. It is NOT A TRIVIAL THING YOU ARE ASKING FOR.

I just feel there are many things that can be more useful in the game like an out house……

“What new PvE element? " Lol I did answer that with one example already but if you need me to copy paste it no problem. “collecting them in the world.”

“mounts make worlds seem smaller not bigger.” VS no fast travel so only walking they might seem to make it smaller yes, however vs way-points they would make it much bigger.

I never said it was ‘clicking add mount’. It it trivial to you not to many other people. For other people collecting things like mount is there main game-play element. And because GW2 is so heavily skin focused for GW2 it is a very big addition.

Sounds as if you desire the devs to remove the waypoints or to remove MOST waypoints so that having a speed boost mount would make sense.

I only have two things to say about it:

1. Good luck with that.
2. Don’t hold your breath.

PS: for the people for whom collecting mounts is a main play element…all I have to say is…. they bought the wrong game. It happens.

Anet never said mounts would be a part of this game. If collecting mounts is what some people play MMO’s for exclusively… they need to find another game that has mounts, this one doesn’t. And it seems that it never will.

Temperess Midnight.8326:

well all keep dreaming i like to see how this game would do mounts and how they would implument them and it should be are choice to have one or not and it be cool to vote on the subjet to see how me ppl in the game would like to see mount brought in to the world of GW2

The Only vote that counts is that of the developers, and they don’t want mounts. They implement a Waypoint System to NOT have Mounts.,

Personally I have no interest in seeing how they might be implemented. I have less than zero desire to see a mount On gw2.

Im Mudbone.1437:

Gibson.4036:

The whole “because waypoints!” argument rings flat.

There are plenty of games that have both mounts and quick travel. One doesn’t preclude the other.

Of those games I have seen that had both, there are few and far between quick travel points with HUGE maps making the use of mounts feasable, but, in GW2 there are WPs almost every 100 yards(a bit of an exaggeration but valid) with TINY maps making mounts not feasable or needed.

After arriving at a WP…Most places are at most a Minute from the wp. The only place where you may have to run longer is Ruins of Orr.

Even In orr though what’s the big deal? So your target WP is contested. That means you need to run a longer distance… Instead of seeing it as an inconvenience, look at it as i do… More opportunities to kill and loot, more oppurtunities to harvest, mine, and chop trees, more opportunities to find and kill veterans…
In short more opportunities to play the game.

I am not saying all…but there are many players that seem to want the game handed to them on a silver platter. Like it is such an onerous task to … go to an uncontested WP.

Sometimes a challenge is welcome in a game, it makes the game more interesting. Having to walk from the wp, to wherever it is you wanna go…without a speed boost can be fun :-)

Malcolm.9671:

Dusty Moon.4382:

How would it help with immersion? If you read ANY….

I should’ve been more clear. By immersion, I meant being immersed in the game itself from entertaining game play, not being dedicated to the lore which is what you seem to concerned with. And, as mentioned before, a WP is not entertaining and kills the vastness that is Tyria.

For what I suggested, it was merely just that: a suggestion. Although, plenty of games do use momentum, and adding complexity should be a good thing. Of course it being hard to program is a given, hardly a counter-argument though.

Also, players possibly being taken out by a mob gathered by passing players is an actuality with or without mounts.

" it would be cool..I want it." …

Oh, how I hate oversimplification.

Unless you trying to argue that WPs facilitate more entertaining game play than mounts as means of travel, you’re literally not addressing anything I said.

Also, WPs don’t fill the void for mounts like you imply, otherwise players wouldn’t spam speed boons. And like I’ve already said, might as well run around in style.

Using speed boons is Not a void left by the lack of mounts. Using speed boons is a way to Move faster. The fault in your argument is, that simply because you want mounts, you wish to lable that as they ONLY way to derve added speed since that is the ONLY way other games grant speed.

Using speed boons on this game is a way to derive a boost in speed, without using a Mount, or needing a Mount.

if you wish to ride a Mount to derive a speed boost, there are other games that would better meet your need , than spamming these forums requesting something the rest of the player base does Not want, and trhe developers 1. have no desire at the present time to provide… and 2. Have gone out of their way, givingus things to avoid. a. Waypoints, and b. Skills and traits that provide with temporary speed boosts.

If you want speed boons derived by mounts.. there are other games that will provide it. maybe you should try one of those.

PS There is No correlation between style, and a Mount. That is a matter of opinion.

I do not think anyone riding a mount has style…if anything it seems the opposite is true…just someone overcompensating for … short comings elsewhere maybe.

Gibson.4036:

The whole “because waypoints!” argument rings flat.

There are plenty of games that have both mounts and quick travel. One doesn’t preclude the other.

Here they do. The waypoints were put in place…on THIS game, to avoid mounts. The fact is, in all this time, we have never had Mounts. if Anet wished to add Mounts they would have by Now. The fact that they have not done it yet. shows they won’t Now. or In the future.

The people that say " oh waypoints doesn’t mean anything" are engaged In wishful thinking.

Romo.3709:

Carnius Magius.8091:

Romo.3709:

Carnius Magius.8091:

Make waypoints FREE. Problem solved.

How about we leave it as it is and don’t waste time on Mounts?
Problem solved.

Make paying for waypoints optional. Pay if you like.

I will gladly pay for WPs as long as it keeps mounts off this game.

The whole point of waypoints is, to keep mounts off the game. If the devs ever considered mounts they would have to totally revamp the waypoint system… trust me, that is not gonna happen so that a few players can go." oooh Look at my Bling!!!"

This game is Not about mounts ,. this game will never be about mounts.

If the devs had wanted mounts in this game, they would have added them by now. Take a hint..No Mounts now, No mounts in the works…

Those that are all sad now, have to accept they either made a bad purchasing decision buying gw2. Or..let it go, and enjoy the game without the Mounts.

Malcolm.9671:

Mounts, in my opinion, would help with the immersion factor of the game. In most fictions, gaining a mount or something similar is always an epic and glorified moment, showing a character’s (usually the main) has progressed, and this includes video games of course. The moment you acquire your first mount is nothing compared to just discovering a new WP. Although very convenient, WPs sort of take you out of the world, making the world feel small while also being a very boring form of travel(imo). Convenience (more helpful most of the time) and immersion(more fun most of the time) are like yin and yang when comes to these sort of things and require balance. With that said, I would advocate the addition of mounts and removal of some WPs.

There’s also the fact most players just spam speed boons and the like while not using WPs, so might as well move faster in style. Also, it doesn’t even have to be mounts exactly. I think it’d be rather bad*** if we got elite skills that grants a permanent speed increase with an animation according to the profession. For example, mesmers would hover and propel themselves, necros could turn into a swarm of insects or summon a death chariot, engineers whip out a motorcycle, eles could ride the earth like a wave similar to earth-benders from avatar, etc. It could allow us to cross over bodies of water as well (the ele would begin to ice skate for example). And instead of starting right at the speed cap, you build up speed as you go along to make it more smooth. I doubt it would happen but something to consider.

" it would be cool..I want it."

to that I say .." Nothing cool about a Mount… and I don’t want it littering my screen."

we have heard this argument 1000 times… and it still doesn’t convince. See there are plenty of games with mounts In them,…THIS game was made In a way where Mounts are irrelevant. They made waypoints so that the game is Not littered with mounts…. why would they add mounts?

Your reason needs to be better than " because I think it would be cool…and I want it."

For me there are two:

Glee’s cover of Can’t stop believing by Journey

and Fat Bottomed Girls by Queen:

Dusty Moon.4382:

I thought games were supposed to be fun?

People who say what is the point are making the game a job not fun. Isn’t that what we all play games for, escapism and fun?

For some reason, MMO’s are treated Like a job…. People discuss…

Productiveness.
Efficiency
Gold/hour
DPS Optimization

Many people forget that while there is nothing wrong with being hardcore, there is nothing wrong with being casual either.

Some people play in PVT armor, others play non-optimal classes…. others Play non-optimal builds that are still fun to play. Forr some reason, the " hard-core" seem to think their playstyle is the Only valid playstyle, and all the others that just " Play-for-fun" are lazy slackers.

Speaking for myself… while I do enjoy seeking a build that allows me to complete content. I play for FUN… for me…FUN means playing a character with cool abilities.

Sometimes Building for OPTIMIZATION and Memorizing Rotations of skills… while deadly, is not cool…. I left WoW, why would I bring that style here?

Travis the Terrible.4739:

I find most people only steal your banners is when you’re in open world and you’re killing random trash mobs and the people who steal them are so few and far between that it’s not even worth bothering. Besides use signets in open world.

Do signets grant you, and your partner a speed boost?

Maximus and Saint have good Points why it should not be " summoner Only". But I still feel that there should be something in case someone just runs with the banner and takes it where it is not in range of the warrior.

This happened to me today. I put the banner down.. I killed what i was gonna kill… there was another warrior also fighting the thing, he literally Picked up my banner, and ran off.

Now I have a Long cooldown… and NO banner. I have zero use of the slot to summon it.

I can understand that there is a defenite benefir to having your group mates or even random Jo Shmo’s pick up your banner, and take it where you are also going.

I know, you can only pick up One banner… but… people will In open world…Pick up my banner…. and run with it.

why is a warrior, needing MY banner…can’t he summon his own?

so as I said… if the banner gets so far out of range where the warrior no longer gets any boost whatsoever…. have it Poof and come back to the warrior. I mean… random Jo Shmo grabs the banner, runs with it to the next place he has to go..Now he has speed boost and dex +, defence +, strength + whatever….. and the warrior doesn’t,….but now has a utility slot on a Long cooldown? and No boost?

I think I can see why a warrior would go with signets… it is very selfish from my perspective. It’s Like a Guardian not using shouts but imagine if someone could take a Guardian’s shout away from the guardian?

I can agree a Little here. I am also playing a low level warrior. I have dropped a banner trying to get it close to where it will benefit as many people around me as Possible… and it can be upsetting to see some Jo Shmo, grab the banner,… and run off with it, because he has personal plans and wants a speed boost to get there as fast as possible.

Asa to elementalist. I used to play a Lightening Hammer elementalist, even with + 10 or whatever charges from a trait, the fact is… you will end up out of charges. Then you look for your other hammer… and some warrior grabs it.

I can see that the summoned weapons are summoned, and have a seperate reality from the summoner… Not Like the guardian sprit weapons… but at the same time….

Warriors that drop banners try to place them where they will benefit them… Not so someone can just grab the banner and run with it.

And it seems to me,…. maybe I am being selfish… but.. who should benefit most from that banner… the warrior that summoned it, and gave up a slot to call it up as needed… or some random by stander that wants a speed boost as he goes from point A ( where the warrior is..) to point B….( where the warrior is not) ?

Suggestion. The warrior that summoned itm, gave up a utility slot for it, and… it has a 2 Minute recharge…. because it is supposed to last a while..what happens when someone grabs the banner and runs off with it? the warrior loses BOTH the use of the banner… and has to wait for a full cool down…

here’s a thought, if someone takes the banner out of range of the warrior, so he or she gains no benefit from it… 5 seconds later it poofs. and returns so it is again within range of the warrior. After all… why should someone else benefit more than the warrior for a banner that cost the warrior a slot to summon, and Now has NO banner, and 2 minutes til they can summon another?

jweez.7214:

Wanze.8410:

jweez.7214:

Mounts could potentially add a cosmetic reward beyond the scope of anything we have in game. There are no downsides to adding mount.

Correction. As stated the man power and dev time needed is a downside.

Congratulations, you stated something that has already been mentioned hundreds of times and contributed absolutely nothing.

So aggressive for no reason at all. This is a forum so I thought I’d add how I felt about it.

I think the reason some people may be answering agressively is because you completely ignored the biggest downside …. players do not want mounts.

You act as if the ONLY downside is One of a technical nature. in stating that this is the ONLY downside you basically sidelined the large portion of players that do not want mounts.

People seem to think that whether devs want mounts or not is not Knowable. They ignore the biggest piece of evidence that best shows developer desire and intent when it comes to mounts….

The WP transit system.

If developers wanted mounts they would have given us mounts day 1. We are over a year maybe 18 months since launch and no mounts. except for a broom, and a drill.

The thing people forget is why do we even have a waypoint system? what is it a solution of?

Problem:
" How do we get players from point A to point B, as quickly as possible…. without mounts?"

Solution:

Waypoints.

Corpus Christi.2057:

That’s the reason why I’ve strated to think recently why GW3 would be great… with a sub fee, and I’m pretty sure that ANet or NCSoft stated they won’t consider another b2p/then f2p games in the future ( correct me if I’m wrong ).
I do understand that many of you dislike the idea, but tbh, a sub fee adds something that GW2 does not have – loads of new, permanent content, let’s say every 6-8 weeks.
Living story? Not really, at least not the way it is exectued in GW2, which is to say the least, ‘poorly executed’.
I’m ready to pay 15-20 dollars a month for a quality PERMANENT content every now and then.

I wish you enjoy your time in another game with a sub fee. This game is not that game, and never will be. Can I get your stuff?

UnYoYo.7402:

Nerelith.7360:

IIvIIozzie.9250:

Astralporing.1957:

Devata.6589:

Also when introducing them for new maps they can decrease waypoints so they would make the world feel bigger.

That’s an argument against introducing mounts. I like waypoints.
Also, i have noticed that you silently assumed that mounts would grant some sort of movement/speed bonus. This is bad, because it means they would become obligatory – also for the people that do not want them.
Which is why i don’t want mounts in the game – i would have no problem with them being only cosmetic, but talk long enough and all the people that want them eventually admit that they are after something more.

It doesn’t become obligatory, you don’t need to use them if you don’t want to, nobody would stop you. The majority of people do not want mounts that do nothing, of course people want them to do something more. What this whole argument boils down to is can Arenanet make mounts fun while also being balanced? I think that they can. I believe they have long considered mounts for the game and they’ve got some pretty solid idea’s for using them. All the hatred against this notion is pure prejudice.

Where is your evidence that the developers have long considered mounts? The game was designed with zero mounts. They would have to totally re-invent the WP system to Include mounts that grant a speed boost which seems to be what you want.

I Just do not understand how there can be players that do Not see that the Moment any Mount is added to the game, that grants even a 25 % speed boost while Mounted… suddenly it becomes mandatory for everyone in the game to have that mount… even if they never wanted Mounts In the game to begin with.

This is so clear that it doesn’t need explanation since it is clearly a case of being wilfully obtuse…. repeating over and over and over " I don’t understand that, and I disagree." til the other side tires.

Here are the facts. The developers have stated there is no intent to include any sort of mount at this time.

A large Portion of the playerbase agrees with the developers.

That means that the ONLY reason we need to NOT want Mounts is.." because we do not want them." We do not need any other reason. We like the status quo. Therefore the burden of coming up with decent reasons for their Inclusion is yours.

Next:

“We want them” is not enough. You need better reasons.

Next:

Saying " you need better reasons to exclude them. to keep us from having them." is totally untrue. All we need is." we don’t want them." That ’s it.

Last:

Your main argument seems to be " we want them Inspite of Developer stated Intentions, and we want them even if no one else wants them."

No one is saying you cannot want things… after all…

The dead men in hell want snow-cones.

make mounts with no m speed bonus (or flying mounts), and make some of them crafteables to increase the economy. so the wp problem is solved

rly? people have no mind for mounts or flying mounts on this game?

PD: meaby first of many times i will suggest this but check last post to know about my idea about flying mounts.

the problem i see for mounts is that they will deface the style of the game if u for example make a dodo for mount or other things like others mmo but have hope that they will use gw2 style to make theyr own mounts.

We do not want mounts of any sort. Craftable, …not-craftable… gem shop purchased… quest reward mounts… we do not want any mounts.

PS There is No WP problem, there are just players that have a problem with WP’s. But that is a personal problem that players have. Not a WP problem.

MAD CAT.9321:

There isn’t any proof anywhere that the devs are against mounts. What’s wrong with the TERA method of using mounts? You still see plenty of the world on riding mounts, they look cool as heck, don’t go too fast either so you are able to explore and they don’t clutter up anything imo. They would not ruin anything if you asked me.

There is evidence that the developers do not have any intention of adding mounts at this time.

There is also a LOT of evidence that the developers are doing everything they can think of to make ground mounts completely, and totally unnecessary.

It’s called " The Waypoint System"

What is wrong with the Tera method of using mounts is simple.

1. This is Not Tera.
2. We do not wish any ground mounts in any way, shape, or form. Tera mounts, WoW mounts, Uncle Jo Shmo’s used mounts….

That is what is wrong with Tera’s way of using mounts…they are mounts. We do not want mounts.

Corpus Christi.2057:

That’s the reason why I’ve strated to think recently why GW3 would be great… with a sub fee, and I’m pretty sure that ANet or NCSoft stated they won’t consider another b2p/then f2p games in the future ( correct me if I’m wrong ).
I do understand that many of you dislike the idea, but tbh, a sub fee adds something that GW2 does not have – loads of new, permanent content, let’s say every 6-8 weeks.
Living story? Not really, at least not the way it is exectued in GW2, which is to say the least, ‘poorly executed’.
I’m ready to pay 15-20 dollars a month for a quality PERMANENT content every now and then.

Last time I checked a sub fee doesn’t guarantee anything other than the fact that every 30 days, there will be a charge on your debit or credit card.

Just saying.

Dark Catalyst.1028:

Nerelith.7360:

The ONLY problem with your argument is… that:

1. You can buy gems with in game Gold.

and

2. Many of the new games that have a subscription also have a cash shop. And that is a Shop where the Only way to buy items is with cash, NOT gems which can then be purchased with in game gold.

Is there a temptation for some players to NOT be patient, earn the Gold, buy the gems, and instead use cash? Of course there is, but is that Anet’s fault? How hard is it to simply play for free… save up your gold, buy gems… and have whatever it is that someone that uses cash to buy gems can also buy?

Name ONE item that can be bought for cash that cannot also be bought with in game Gold? well the ONLY thing you Buy with cash..is gems… and you can also buy gems… with GOLD.

Last time i checked… the amount of gems you can by with Gold…varies based on demand.

TESO has a subscription fee…and a cash shop.
WoW has a subscription fee…. and a cash shop.

it seems to me that if you were discussing " MMO’s that ONLY have a subscription… compared to MMO’s that have a cash shop" you might have a point.

The problem is, that in today’s market, it’s " MMO’s that charge a subscription and also have a cash shop… vs… gw2…. No subscription + Gem store, where you can play for free if you wish…. and buy gems with in game gold…if you wish."

The problem as I see i is ..most people do not play the game for free out of their own desire to have things NOW…so will spend cash…but..NO one is forcing them to use cash… they can play for free…. but that requires…patience. Something which most of today MMO’ players seem to lack.

How much time would it take you in game to earn enough gold to to buy 800 gems? Why would I grind all that gold when I can work at my job for a fraction of an hour, buy what I want, and spend the time I would’ve spent grinding for gold doing whatever I found fun.

WoW has a cash shop, yes. But that cash shop only a few mounts, a few pets and dumb looking transmog helms that everyone mocks if you dare show your face in game with one of them on.

Meanwhile, I can get hundreds of mounts and pets in game.

As I said. That is your choice. Anet has not forced you to spend your cash for those Gems.

Seems that people Like to say " it’s cheaper to play a sub only game. Ok, I may be a Bit ignorant, it happens… what game is subscription only, what is it’s subscription amount… and tell me How it can Possibly be cheaper than playing for free. No Monthly, and then using in game gold you aquire as you play the game… to buy the stuff on the gem store?

No, WoW nor TESO qualify. They also have a cash shop.

The person I responded to, did not qualify the type of cash shop the games with monthly subscriptions had, she simply said " subscription only."

You mention

Why would I grind all that gold when I can work at my job for a fraction of an hour, buy what I want

This is your decision, Anet did not force you to use your cash to buy gems, that is the choice you made. It just seems Interesting that you feel that Anet is more expensive than a subscription based game, because you lack the control, to NOT spend real cash.

Im Mudbone.1437:

I’d like to see you even TRY to elaborate on that, just too LUDICROUS, grabs popcorn.

No reason to elaborate. it is pretty straight foreward english. The devs don’t want ground mounts, those of us that do not want ground mounts need no other reason than " we do not want them."

Even if it takes One Iota of energy to add them…. it is still One iota too much effort. Until you give compelling reasons for the devs to add mounts.

You have not given any compelling reasons. Therefore… any energy… even an erg…. is too much energy for the addition of ground mounts to this game.

Azreell.1568:

GoddessOfTheWinds.2937:

HHR LostProphet.4801:

Teon.5168:

GoddessOfTheWinds.2937:

Sorry but I might play a bit to try and finish WvW Season 2, but I no longer am addicted. Until they change a lot of stuff, I’m not going to drop another cent at this game.

How do you drop another cent on this game when there is no monthly fee?

You can moan in the forums as long as you want. If you want to hit them really hard, you just stop buying gems. I think lots of people used to do that and I think lots of those people will step away from buying any more stuff if they don’t make the game more thrilling.

That’s the point… Why am I dropping cash on a game that isn’t adding permanent new interesting stuff to the game? Why am I dropping 10+ a month if they almost didn’t add permanent stuff? Where is my money going? I don’t like how it’s turning, so no more gems for me.

It has been proven that sub games offer more bang for your buck.

In fairness Anet has to make a profit and GW2 is not free as many people keep trying to say.

But, The micro transaction model nickle and dimes each and every player if given the chance and the fanboi’s will tell you that you don’t have to spend a dime – but the honestly truth is YES people do have to spend money on the gem shop in order for GW2 to continue to be profitable and stay open.

It costs more for the above then a simple sub fee and you also get more with a sub fee.

Also, This next patch offers many changes but none of which is any type of content. The next time we see something will likely be after season 2 which is FAR FAR to long.

The ONLY problem with your argument is… that:

1. You can buy gems with in game Gold.

and

2. Many of the new games that have a subscription also have a cash shop. And that is a Shop where the Only way to buy items is with cash, NOT gems which can then be purchased with in game gold.

Is there a temptation for some players to NOT be patient, earn the Gold, buy the gems, and instead use cash? Of course there is, but is that Anet’s fault? How hard is it to simply play for free… save up your gold, buy gems… and have whatever it is that someone that uses cash to buy gems can also buy?

Name ONE item that can be bought for cash that cannot also be bought with in game Gold? well the ONLY thing you Buy with cash..is gems… and you can also buy gems… with GOLD.

Last time i checked… the amount of gems you can by with Gold…varies based on demand.

TESO has a subscription fee…and a cash shop.
WoW has a subscription fee…. and a cash shop.

it seems to me that if you were discussing " MMO’s that ONLY have a subscription… compared to MMO’s that have a cash shop" you might have a point.

The problem is, that in today’s market, it’s " MMO’s that charge a subscription and also have a cash shop… vs… gw2…. No subscription + Gem store, where you can play for free if you wish…. and buy gems with in game gold…if you wish."

The problem as I see i is ..most people do not play the game for free out of their own desire to have things NOW…so will spend cash…but..NO one is forcing them to use cash… they can play for free…. but that requires…patience. Something which most of today MMO’ players seem to lack.

Zaxares.5419:

Please, by the Six, not a return to Spamadan.

East Commonlands ??

Azrael.4960:

Nerelith.7360:

The player Economy is an important part of MMO’s. Removing the trading post is a non-starter, as far as ideas for any MMO, Not just this one. If it ever happens I’ll eat my hat.

I’ll pay you 5G if you do

My hat is made of Chocolate :-)

nibblesalil.3561:

Blude.6812:

Why no auto targeting nuclear rocket launchers that turn into rainbow colored mounts to ride towards the target and then mushroom cloud them out and transport you to the to the end of the Not So Secret jumping puzzle that always drops a legendary??

i agree !!! we want it multicoloured that springs multiple rockets at the same time as lasers shooting out of your eyes LOL

I want sharks with lasers on their heads!

The player Economy is an important part of MMO’s. Removing the trading post is a non-starter, as far as ideas for any MMO, Not just this one. If it ever happens I’ll eat my hat.

Conncept.7638:

OptimistPrime.9283:

Conncept.7638:

OptimistPrime.9283:

Conncept.7638:

OptimistPrime.9283:

each armor, including heavy, medium, and light for EACH race would have to work with the horse model, which does not exist.

OptimistPrime.9283:

I never once said they would have to redo armor.

?

I am not entirely sure what you are missing. I never said armor would be redone for the mount. The mount model, however, would have to work with every race’s armor (light, medium, and heavy) to avoid clipping, which is already an issue. (Look at Charr armor, for instance).

Not once did I state that any armor would have to be redone. Maybe you should squeeze a few language courses into your studies.

So, in other words, you said major work would need to be done on already completed armor models (read your own post)… Because I can tell you not only would armor not have to be ‘redone’, there would not need to be any work on any armor models at all.

I am honestly surprised you managed to write an Abraham Lincoln quote without misquoting him. Go back and read my post, which you so obviously love to bring attention to. Never do I say that armor needs to be edited. Quite the opposite, actually. What I was saying was that the mount model would have to reflect a wide variety of armor types. Making the mount work for each unedited armor type per race would be difficult to make aesthetically pleasing.

This has nothing to do with changing already existing armor, which you decided to fabricate in your first reply. (Go back and read the thread, as you advised me to do).

And if you are going to pretend you are literate enough to quote a historical leader, at least pretend you pulled your head out of the sand long enough to read my post as well, the next time you decide to misquote me.

And again arguing a semantical choice of words (on both your part for saying ‘armor’, and mine for saying ‘redo’) rather than actually defending what you said on the issue. Simple fact is, adding mounts would not require the work you claimed it would have, and you don’t know that because you don’t know anything concerning the subject at all.

This argument (the actual argument, not your nitpicking about vocabulary) can be solved simply. Explain the exact technical limitations which would prevent mounts from being added if you are able. If not, then you do not know what you are talking about, and as I said, should try actually addressing the subject in a context you are capable of instead of acting as if you know something you do not in order to protect your wounded pride and irrational hatred of the subject at hand.

This is a Ludicrous argument. Saying that " Unless you can state exactly what work is necessary to have mounts added to the game you cannot say how hard it would be to do."

You Know, I cannot say How to pilot a plane , from the Moment the doors are closed at one airport, until passangers are disembarked at their destination either. That doesn’t mean I cannot say that " Piloting a 777 is hard."

A player doesn’t have to be abl to state the exact steps needed to add mounts to say " adding mounts would be hard." But… adding mounts doesn’t have to be hard.

See this is another form of invalidating anti-mount arguments.

Since the devs have stated that it is NOT their intent to include ground mounts at this time, and since a LOT of the player base agrees with the devs. All we have to prove is… and PLEASE Pay attention:

" ADDING MOUNTS TO THE GAME IS HARDER THAN …NOT ADDING MOUNTS TO THE GAME."

Which is absurdly simple. If even one “Man-second” of work is required to add mounts it is harder than leaving the game exactly as it is.

smekras.8203:

no, i am just pointing out that he is using a flawed argument. if he wants to argue against mounts (and in my opinion mounts have no place at all in gw2) then he should do so without using a weak argument like “lore is against mounts” when every example of lore he gave can be taken as an argument -for- mounts

counterproductive a bit, don’t you think?

I can understand your position, I am simply saying taking what you are arguing it can be very easilly believed you are pro-mounts.

that is all I said.

As to needing a rationale to be anti-mount. I do not need lore, although I can see How Dusty got to the Position that the Lore is anti-mount, Not pro-mount.

All I need is.." the devs are against mounts, so am I."