Can you name 1 significant bug that exists in WoW from release that has such a large impact on gameplay?
A bug that exists today? You can’t change the original 16 slot bag.
Bugs that took a long time to fix? There was this thing called parry haste where bosses instantly killing tanks and this was not fixed until Wrath of the Lich King in 2008. (WoW was released in 2004)
If you think WoW was a bug free game, then you clearly did not play the bleeding edge content, and/or missed their Cataclysm expansion completely.
The core fallacy of your entire argument against skipping and stacking is that it all comes down to your opinion: “I don’t like this being the best strategy.” As players we don’t make the rules; we just play the game. There’s nothing intrinsically more “legitimate” or “moral” about skipping versus killing trash or stacking versus spreading out. All I can say is: Sorry?
Infact I’m frankly getting very fed up with people who just burst into on-going discussions without even understanding the most basic principles of what’s being discussed, then expecting their words to carry more “weight” just because what they say is more redundant.
The worst feedback submitted is simply no feedback at all. While proposing the same thing for the umpteenth time can be annoying, (See: Dungeon Forums) it’s not much effort to direct someone to the past discussion if they have reached some conclusion. There is also value in submitting feedback that is not being heavily influenced from what has been said before.
And, I’m not really sure what you want me to say about your trust-level with the Dev team?
They don’t have a dungeon team at all. What more needs to be said about this matter? Any fixes to this will be crude, knee-jerked band-aids from people who don’t understand what the actual issue is or have the knowledge/experience to design something that’s remotely interesting.
In every video game ever created, players have always skipped trash when it wasn’t worth killing. Even when it is worth killing, players will skip it if it saves time. Why anyone would want to fight something that is nothing but an unrewarding, boring chose is beyond my comprehension. I’d rather be doing something actually fun, engaging, and hopefully rewarding for my efforts.
But ArenaNet is also afraid of ever rewarding players for completing challenging content. Just look at the Jungle Wurm boss: This requires way more effort to complete than the Marionette, and yet the Marionette showered the player with loot. The most rewarding thing a skilled players can do in this game is to sell dungeon runs. Good thing we have 10 threads complaining about that too.
The reason it isn’t getting fixed quickly is because it’s probably not an easy or cheap thing to fix. All dungeons were likely built using the same mechanics of the personal story, in which case the idea of an instance “owner” makes sense.
Not only would a new system have to be built, but every dungeon would need to be transitioned into it and they would need to test them all to make sure it did not break more things than it fixed. This would take a very long time and be quite costly.
It was auto-attack dagger (necro). Come to think of it, it’s happened in the past as well, when I had no lag — I just never thought about it much. But theoretically, it shouldn’t be possible to get frozen mid-dodge, right?
Auto-casting a fast spell can sometimes cancel dodge.
If you want to do a no-trash skipping dungeon, go to the Aetherblade path in Twilight Arbor. That’s fun; right guys?
If you don’t like stacking, then do most bosses in Fractals. Are all of you guys that are complaining about this stuff doing this riveting, engaging non-stacking, no-skipping content?
The way the OP and a lot of players who post these threads see it is, Stacking, Skipping, Zerking, ect. has become the first and usually only solution players use get past the challenges that dungeons present.
At the point a dungeon’s not a leisurely activity anymore, it’s a job akin to working grill at McDonalds. (although I could go so far as to say, the Grill presents more challenges and pays better)
Just so you know, skipping is never going to go away for the current dungeons; ever. If, for the sake of argument, they made creatures not have a leash in dungeons – guess what? Everyone would bring a Thief to Stealth past it all. They can’t make the creatures ignore Stealth, because it’s a core mechanic to that Profession.
As for stacking, they could make all creatures have collision so that you couldn’t just stand inside their models forever and run through them. However, I’m sure most players would find it impossible to adjust to this, and would complain endlessly about getting pinned against walls by the unfair monsters.
In short: Any change about stacking and skipping would result in making current dungeons harder for the average (and below average) players. I honestly have no idea why everyone is so fixated on tweaking the current dungeons meta and difficulty. I’d much rather they come out with something new, because everything has been done to death already.
Zergs are an indication that there is a reason for players to join forces, and if content is easy because of it then that is a problem with the content, not the zerging.
Spot on. The Jungle Wurm is an example of a boss that cannot be defeated unless a zerg splits their forces evenly, and further subdivide their efforts among specific roles among the encounter.
Do you really expect a boss that 10 players can fight will scale up to be an equivalent challenge for 50? The creature would have to have different mechanics, essentially making a different boss entirely for a certain threshold of players.
Sounds cool to me.
Sounds like a gigantic waste of time to spend building multiple bosses for one creature. I’d rather they just build bosses targeting certain groups of players, or build better dungeons instead.
The bosses were supposed to scale with the amount of players. What happened to that? I think Anet got very lazy and as long as people like you blinding drink their Kool-Aid nothing will change or improve.
Do you really expect a boss that 10 players can fight will scale up to be an equivalent challenge for 50? The creature would have to have different mechanics, essentially making a different boss entirely for a certain threshold of players.
No, it doesn’t come back to any of that.
Who cares what the status quo is when the devs have stated they intend to change it?
The designers are slightly nerfing Critical Damage damage by 10%. It’s still going to be the best.
By the way, this is the quote:
Jon peters
We are trying to take steps to address some of the dominance of Berserker/DPS players. More info next week, I think.
Jon
“Next week” they announced the change to Critical Damage. They aren’t going to do anything about “skipping” or “stacking”, because last I heard everyone can do both of those things. Wasn’t that the entire point of this thread?
There’s no perfect solution for Defiant, but I think it’s generally agreed upon its current implementation is very poor.
Other games have Defiant-like mechanics. For instance, Wildstar and Dragon’s Quest have “Interrupt Armor.” This effect regenerates itself over time. Once players do enough interrupts/crowd controls against the creature, it will no longer be protected by it. At that point, there is a window of time whereby it can be subject to all forms of CC/interrupts, and after a short moment it regains all of its Interrupt Armor.
How things operate now has been identified as a problem to which devs announce they’re seeking a solution. All that’s left to discuss at this stage is how, not if.
Can you source this? (So we can see if it exists, and if it does, to what extent you’re twisting the truth about it)
Do you know why people stack? Almost every creature is a complete and utter joke. How about this for a crazy solution: Make the monsters actually threatening to the party. The fact that players solo dungeons should speak volumes about how true this is.
There are creatures players don’t stack on. The Flame Shaman in the Volcano Fractal is an example. This monster is actually dangerous, especially at high levels. There’s also the Frizz fight in the Aetherblade Fractal, where players cannot stand still. (Unless using some exploit to bypass one of the walls)
The problem is creature design, not the mechanics of the game.
I have too many examples to list, but the point is that their is NO META!!! There IS, however, a huge group of mathletes that think they have it ALL figured out and that their way is ‘optimal’/superior to anything/everything else. The whole point/consequence of the build system is that there IS NOT a ‘one to rule them all’ build and anyone who thinks otherwise is fooling themselves, a complete tool, or both.
The whole concept of dealing damage is actually just math. And if you think math is some weird witchcraft, then here’s are some examples:
Have a Power-based team attack a Husk on the Wurm fight. Then have a Condition-based team attack a Husk on the Wurm fight. The Condition build can kill three Husks before the Power build can even kill one.
Have a Power-based team attack a gadget. Then have a Condition-based team attack a gadget. Guess who wins? The power builds, by a landslide!
Do you know what the difference is between someone following a cookie-cutter meta build, and someone who refuses to believe their build is ineffective at anything? Nothing; they’re both ignorant.
A meta build is not be the best, but it can be the best atsomething.
On Crimson, it takes 25-30 Phytotoxins to fill up one extractor. For 5 people, they’d need to run 6-7 laps around the arena. That takes way too long to actually bring Crimson down in a reasonable amount of time.
With just a handful of players doing reflects/projectile destroying skills, the battlefield will only be full of Husks and Juvenial Wurms. There’s no reason to devote a large force to mob clearing when ideally there shouldn’t be that many.
Play the game the way you want to play it seems a distant memory.
The Wurm fight is quite varied and allows for many different builds to shine. If you aren’t useful on one aspect of it, you’re likely good (or even great) at another. You can play the game however you wish, but you should know that there is always going to be a build that is the most efficient at doing [something].
Such as: No matter how much you want to “play how you want”, your damage is still going to be next to nothing if you’re not a Condition damage build versus the Partially Digested Husks. (These creatures have incredibly very high Toughness, but relatively low Health, making them ideal for Condition-based Professions to kill)
The biggest problem is the structure of the achievements. They encourage people to play in counterproductive and selfish ways. It’s gotten to the point where on any attempt that that doesn’t successfully kills all 3 heads, whichever one was left alive will be overloaded with players on the next run. There have been times where I’ve gotten to the Second Phase, and then learned afterwards that several groups of players had dropped combat during the transition and then Waypointed over to whatever head they needed for their title.
Looks like it gains Determined if it goes anywhere near the boundaries of the event area. Do all the Wurms gain it together, or just the Wurm that goes near the edge?
Content wasn’t nerfed, they merely fixed the exploit of the event w/o using the phrase “exploit”.
It’s effective health is at least 10% lower than it was before. I’m not sure what they did to fix the exploit, but I think they gave him a leash like any other creature.
We (TTS et al) just had Cobalt again make a run for the water, noone was over in that direction, everyone was behind him. Boom, invulnerable. If they wanted to “fix” this issue, why not simply restrict it’s pathing to within the event circle? Very disappointed in this band aid “fix”. Kudoes to Attuned for having the luck to not have this happen.
How far away was your raid when you stacked? I’ve noticed that Wurm will not use Chomp if the raid is too far (900+), where it’ll sit there Flopping. If a creature or a player was in the wrong spot, and close enough, it would favor them instead.
It might even target pets and clones. If this is the case, I think it should only target players.
No, most people don’t lose that battle because the timer runs out.
I have no idea what planet you’re from, but on Earth most of the time the platform fails due to time. It’s very easy to keep people alive by reviving each other.
But this is exactly like I said, you fail because of the timer. You don’t fail because a player failed to dodge an attack, or was fighting poorly. You fail due being unable to bring down the health bar of the bosses before time runs out.
You do know that Marionette has a timer for the arena phase… right?
Marionette has the same concept of a DPS check, except it’s more forgiving. In other words, it’s just easier because it allows you to fail on a massive level up to four times before you lose on the fifth.
Now we have part-time dungeon team who are back to square one in dealing with this issue and Arah’s added invisible wall counts are now higher than the infamous CM back in it’s day.
Someone who places invisible walls does not have the same skillset or experience to go through and redesign the gating mechanics behind NPC triggers. It also would also definitely require a lot less testing to make sure it didn’t break more than it fixed.
Regardless of what happened it’s good that TTS killed the Wurm and they should be happy about that. Getting even Phase 1 down is not an easy task, and they obviously put a lot of time and effort into this fight. It’s really just bad timing that this thing surfaced when it did. With 150 people, and who knows how many more not on the map, or TS, etc., you can’t really expect everyone to know what’s going on with the weird shenanigans with the bugs. So congratulations!
I don’t think anyone “exploited” this bug on purpose considering it was unknown to everyone before this and Anet has been present for a lot of wurm raids. Not to mention nobody even knows how wurm aggro even works at this point.
I’m wondering how long this bug has been around because I’ll be really upset if that kill was only from a bug. It would be a real shame is all the firsts were because of this bug from what I hear all the kills have at least one wurm head escaping.
No one can fault the guilds that got the early kills because they simply did not know why it was losing health. However, now that we know better, it is obviously an exploit to use it fully to your advantage. It should have been reported right away. It’s certainly not something to brag about either.
And you forgot, you then need to waste laurels you need for ascended gear for levels instead. It’s not as easy as you people try to make it out so you can stop with the “buy levels” garbage, we have heard it dozens of times already and just because you keep repeating it does not make it any better.
I haven’t forgotten anything. Sorry that your Gift of Battle isn’t free anymore because you happened to do some PvE Achievements. You don’t have to do WvW, so you have nothing to complain about. If you want to save on Laurels, then go to WvW. The point is you have options, and have absolutely nothing valid to complain about.
However, ask a WvW’er what they need to do to get a Legendary. They have to go to Dungeons, and they would definitely spend Laurels as a substitute if they were given that choice. Either go to WvW or spend your Laurels. It’s ridiculous that the Gift of Battle was essentially free due to the Achievement chests.
Well now you know how the WvW players feel about being forced in doing PvE to get that higher tier gear….
PSA: You can obtain Badges of Honor from Achievement Chests.
You can gain ranks from Laurels.
You do not need to enter WvW, except for a brief moment to buy your Gift of Battle.
I don’t agree with getting ranks using Laurels. We need for force these players to touch every aspect of the game before being able to craft a Legendary.
I was just pointing out these players saying they are “forced to WvW” are simply wrong.
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