Guild Wars 2

Riiiight.

Time to let this thread fall into obscurity.

Rai.9625:

You have access to stealth try swapping to bounding dodger. Damage +10% and leap finisher

I actually started with that before moving to Lotus Training, but found my survival in Unhindered. I figure that if I can build so that I don’t need stealth then it’s good all the same.

Todd.6573:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Todd.6573:

Ross Biddle.2367:

messiah.1908:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Can confirm: Tea running ranged DPS druid + my p/p venomshare thief = dead Chrono bunker XD

have you tried venom share and mm or rise necro?

I don’t even know what that means

Anyway, there’s a nice easy takedown of a chrono doing his thing at mid in this fight
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oL0SnGDCP5c

That wasnt a bunker. He’s running a traditional shatter with GS – S/X, of course he melts after burning all of his CDs in a second flat while being out of position.
Next!

Wait a minute, have you never killed a bunker chrono before?

Are you asking me? Yes, i have. But i rarely duel them since that would be a waste of time and outnumbering kills everything eventually..
I was simply pointing out that the linked video wasnt against a bunker mesmer.

Dueling a bunker is silly. Doesn’t matter what class the bunker is.

Anyway, the point being it’s irrelevant. Idle bunker at mid, all his CD’s, fully aware of inc, his only mistake was underestimating what was coming. This one’s dedicated to you T-man ;D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jRCmwfCEt0&feature=youtu.be

Supreme.3164:

BlackBeard.2873:

Arken.3725:

2 cents.

If all you do is nerf those 2, you’ll still have Tempests/Druids bunkering it up like before with Scrappers providing similar sustain with higher damage-output. Gotta look at the whole picture, not just these 2.

Agree with you here. EVERY SINGLE ELITE SPEC does too much, probably even berserker (although it is hard to tell b/c that mythical beast is rarely seen). If you nerf just the top dog, then the mantle just shifts slightly to the next guy and you don’t really change anything.

However, at least things like druid/tempest/scrapper etc. get their defense with a little more counterplay (not hard mitigation in the form of evades/blocks/invulns/etc.) making them succumb to focus-fire a bit easier. That isn’t to say they aren’t over-tuned, but since there is a stubborn refusal to do anything but the most token of balances, I’d say this the bare minimum.

At the very least, however, they should make well of precog give invuln and prevent capture-point contribution. That would at least make bunker mesmers much worse at holding 1vX for so long without getting decapped.

You can’t simply nerf bunkers while leaving the burst builds untouched, that’s just ridiculous

-Dragon Hunter, Burn Guardian, Thief, Chronoshatter, Reaper…these are not gone anywhere, they’re still here with us

Extreme bunkers exist as a consequence of Extreme Burst

Your argument is rhetorical. One could argue at extreme burst builds exist because of extreme bunkers. Of course neither of these statements have anything to do with why the meta is the way it is so let me enlighten.

Play to win: extreme bunkers are the strongest point holders in a game of conquest where taking and holding points indefinetly is the assured means to victory. In one circle there’s even money on the line.

This is why extreme bunkers exist, theyre the strongest approach to victory right now.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Upcoming-Balance-Changes-Week-of-December-14-2015/first

First nod to balance changes, Chrono block changes landing tomorrow.

Azukas.1426:

Sorry guys but we need to be gutted.

This pains me to say this about our class but for the good of the game we need to be gutted until anet can realistically implement chronomancers

Noone wants it here I get that but watching the pro league just confirms it.

Btw tempest/rev need the exact same treatment but I don’t main those classes

Eh, short sighted balancing if that’s your conclusion.

Mak.2657:

Distortions prevents capping a point. Blur (blurred frenzy, WoP) doesn’t.
Ppl cried (and still crying) about DH, but after some time they learned to counter or just escape fight with DH. I thought anet would give more time to adapt to chronobunker too.

In solo’q there’s ways to overcome a bunker mes, but if you look at the ESL’s right now a proper team comp will shut out any build capable of leveling the fight while shoring up the chrono bunks weaknesses.

Mantra of Distraction doesnt stun without Domination line and CS.

I mean, I don’t want to be the one to have to say it but, this build is sub-optimal at both bunkering, and/or as a damage dealer. It’s umm…. not worth the community running. But great that you’re having fun with it! I like to play a little bit of venomshare thief myself. I’m sure my team mates hate me for it :D

Todd.6573:

Ross Biddle.2367:

messiah.1908:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Can confirm: Tea running ranged DPS druid + my p/p venomshare thief = dead Chrono bunker XD

have you tried venom share and mm or rise necro?

I don’t even know what that means

Anyway, there’s a nice easy takedown of a chrono doing his thing at mid in this fight
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oL0SnGDCP5c

That wasnt a bunker. He’s running a traditional shatter with GS – S/X, of course he melts after burning all of his CDs in a second flat while being out of position.
Next!

Wait a minute, have you never killed a bunker chrono before?

messiah.1908:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Can confirm: Tea running ranged DPS druid + my p/p venomshare thief = dead Chrono bunker XD

have you tried venom share and mm or rise necro?

I don’t even know what that means :D

Anyway, there’s a nice easy takedown of a chrono doing his thing at mid in this fight
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oL0SnGDCP5c

Short Gameplay Vid
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oL0SnGDCP5c

Build
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQNAqaVn8lCFNhNNBGmCsPhFZCjLQ1D2BzdwQYKUbPNFCAA-TZxBQBGc/hldKAAwDAwLlBwwRAAA

So I’ve never really cared to play thief with the exception of running superfuntime p/p builds. So the other day I decided to put something together, and while I know the inherent weaknesses in p/p (along with thief in general atm) I found quite a bit of success with this setup.

It’s a team fighting build using venom share, thus it’s strength lies in fighting from range with allies nearby. The more allies, the better. It suffers poor soloQ comps, but shines if you roll up a couple healthy bunkers. It’s potential, though, is in a coordinated effort, but it’ll still do ok with a pug effort focusing a target.

Since it has no easy stealth access, I went with traited physical skills along with Unhindered Combatant to keep those dodges and mobility high. It has great kiting potential to keep enemies from thinking twice about spending time on you, which also lends itself to the double ranged approach. As for stun breaks, Bandit’s Defence on a 12s cd is a nice low cost considering it’s all you’ve got.

Won’t rabbit on as I’m sure you forum pros can see right through the build. I will reiterate that it’s at it’s weakest while solo (not that it can’t deal with various enemies). Being venom share, Bas venom might seem like an obvious elite choice but I find more power in Thieves Guild despite its long CD. It essentially buffs up my team presence, lending itself to a stronger condi bomb. I can reliably remove an enemy from the fight with it, or drag up my own support if I’m solo on a side point.

Anyway, good times.

Here’s the P/P Daredevil build ive been working on in PvP

The only real thing going on here is that Anet gave a bunch of bunker features to a group of players who mained a class for THREE YEARS that, in order to be successful, had to learn under great strain to survive under ridiculous circumstances while working around remaining relevant by executing overly complicated attacks.

In otherwords a group of elite survivalist players with a whole set of new defensive tools are working wonders. And this is somehow surprising….

LOLL

Fay.2357:

Azure The Heartless.3261:

Silverkey.2078:

Some people just don’t want the mesmer to be in this game. And this is happening since game lauch: that explains why the mesmer has been in a non-stop nerfing train since launch. Evety time a viable build appears, it get nerfed to oblivion due to whinning. Seems like some people is still afraid of what they don’t understand.

I’d like to say something about thief, but I won’t because derailing.

The wheel does turn, does it not.

Irony. Not saying you’re wrong, just irony.

sweet smooth irony.

You can moan all you want with fake claims about how bad thief has gotten nerfed, but the fact remains that thief has been an essential part of the PvP meta from the launch of gw2, only dropping out of favor now with HoT. There is absolutely no comparison between the treatment thief received and the nerfs Mesmer got; nerfs that removed Mesmer from the competitive meta for multiple years.

Wait till Chrono dumps his essentials. Bring the right Daredevil setup. Pick your moment. Watch Chrono melt :D

https://youtu.be/oL0SnGDCP5c

vlad.4871:

Fay.2357:

vlad.4871:

the class should be disabled until the balance patch comes out,EASy.

Comments like this always raise interesting questions for me. Did the poster actually mean it? Are they serious or trolling? If they’re serious, how long did it take them to reach this level of crazy?

Yes I am serious,In every Competitive game if something it s broken they it s disabled until it s fixed,easy again.

Translation: “I can’t kill it quickly while on my standard meta class/bunker/rev/etc therefor remove it from the game so I don’t have to change my class/build or l2p”

Rofl

style.6173:

Let’s look at it this way. Right now a bunker mesmer is the best point holder in the game. What? A light armored class is the best point holder? It is obviously broken.

wait wait wait, have we forgotten the cele ele meta? Light armor AND lowest hp pool -_-u

For some reason I don’t feel your logic applies.

Have put a lot of time into playing zerker berserker, know how to play it properly, know its strengths and weaknesses.

Played today with guild group, a mix of strong meta players and pve’rs. Organized strategy, 1 home, rest mid, PvE pro class to nix beast on way just for kittenz and giggles.

Arrive 10 seconds late to mid fight to no real detrament. Bunkers and bruisers climbing all over eachother as they like to do at mid.

Pick out targets, berserk, dump high DPS into kitten first at range (rifle), then with melee (GS). Time taken to wipe enemy team at mid fight after arriving? 10 or so seconds.

Rolled around like thunder there’after, rotating and destroying where needed.

Yeah war and thief are weak in the meta, yeah forging out reliable builds and rolls in an all in bunk meta is troublesome, but there are a couple of ways which the classes can shine IF you roll a half decent team comp. And that’s the problem.

Yes, we all know neither will work in top tier grand torny play. But so what, only 3 classes with 3 builds exist there, which has nothing to do with war or thief -_-u

In conclusion: Nerf revs, buff war sustain, give thieves a purple heart.

Jooks.3741:

DH is fine right now.

Bunker mes is what needs to be fixed. Make it so their invuln well prevents point capture at a minimum.

So long as all evades are like this I see no problem. Got to be consistent.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Evade

You can keep dodges.

Fay.2357:

Kharne.8613:

Fay.2357:

Since no balance will happen for another 1.5 months minimum, I’m expecting folks up top to eventually realize that counters to bunker Mesmer exist, they just have to play them.

They’ll catch on eventually, they generally do. It just usually takes them a while.

You speak of counters, yet you do not list them to try to get your point accross.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Is-it-possible-to-kill-a-bunker-mes-in-PvP/first#post5839080

Heh

Soa Cirri.6012:

I dunno, that’s just off the top of my head.

I read the whole thing (forum text walls are usualy trash) and would like to subscribe to your magazine.

Anet, let’s do what this guy said for the reasons outlined above.

Im guessing for PvE?

MetaBattle is your one stop shop for meta builds
http://metabattle.com/wiki/MetaBattle_Wiki

Agemnon.4608:

Forget pro-level, what about people queuing as warrior that wind up on your team when you’re 4 pips away from the next tier and the only teams that make a comeback are always someone else’s team?

What I hate is queing as berserker and carrying the team hard, but like with any class you bring, sucky team mates will always drag you down and there’s nothing you can do about it

:)

Cynn.1659:

Teamplay is diamond skin counter. You just have to burst down the guy as a taem. Before he gets healed. And this is coming form someone who plays diamond skin ele. Eles have great sustain in 1v1 fights, but in teamfights. Just focus them down, and they will run out of heals eventually.

A match is 10-15 minutes long. So you’ve got plenty of time to focus them down…

-_-u

What if we made into the void unblockable?

Would it provide enough incentive?

Can confirm: Tea running ranged DPS druid + my p/p venomshare thief = dead Chrono bunker XD

Alpha.1308:

anyone else notice in the presence of other chronomancers using it you don’t get the 10s recharge reduction?

i wanted to see if multiple chronomancers could reduce each others cooldowns with it (which, obviously i realized was a long shot, but hey, you know the bugs in this game)
but none of us are even getting our own reduction from our own Tides of Time

Is it the case that others are proccing your ICD, and thus when you come to use yours your reduction is already on CD?

nearlight.3064:

Fith, I guess I won’t play this class at all if people like you are just going to be a kitten about it.

I was gonna say something about builds etc but then I read this and decided I just wanted to say:

This has nothing to do with any response you’ll get from other people and everything to do with you. If you don’t want to play warrior, don’t. If you do, do. That’s your decision, it’s your responsibility XD

Just increase the scoring demands of the premade. If the weaker, soloQ team scores over 100 the elite premade doesn’t get their free farm pip, and the crappy bunch of solo’s do.

Everybody’s happy

Silverkey.2078:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Silverkey.2078:

All of this would be a nerf to bunker mesmer, but not a nerf to core mesmer nor a nerf to PvE mesmer.

Rofl. There is no core Mesmer in PvE. There is only Chronomancer which you just nerfed.

While I should have been more explicit, what I meant was:
All of this would be a nerf to bunker chronomancer, but not a nerf to core mesmer nor a nerf to PvE chronomancer.

My changes ensure that the core feature of chrono in PvE (alacrity and quickness) are still good. I reduce only personal alacrity, not shared one, and by making it a boon, you allow boon duration which is often maxed in PvE (and not in PvP, thus allowing proper balance of both game modes).

For the sake of balancing keeping it as a set buff and not a boon is entirely more practical.

I’m sure boonshare builds/classes would LOVE it if you made it a boon -_-u

Silverkey.2078:

All of this would be a nerf to bunker mesmer, but not a nerf to core mesmer nor a nerf to PvE mesmer.

Rofl. There is no core Mesmer in PvE. There is only Chronomancer which you just nerfed.

Fay.2357:

Embolism.8106:

MailMail.6534:

Dragonhunter + Reaper takes care of any bunker Chronomancer with no problems. This is of course assuming the Chrono has no additional support.

Which incidentally are the two professions that fell out of favour with Metabattle as the Chronobunker rose.

Primarily due to the effect of mallyx revenants.

Said it first, will say it again, nerf Rev, let the meta shift around the Mesmer.

Once the planets are properly aligned glory will become the earthethenandstuff.

Drennon.7190:

Not as bad, but kinda shocked I lost a pip for this.

That pip was holding you back anyway.

You got 10 points for a decap, vs that team yours was actually pretty OP.

Bring a zerker berserker Rifle War, bring sig of might, +1 on the bunker mes, sustain ranged pressure then berserk + gunflame + unblockable during mes block. Time shots between defenses.

I’m still going with the GS/Rifle, Strength over Defense, no endure pain setup XD

Melee burst is the same stun into bursts + hundred blades, but sigil of paralyzation to make the stun 4s (better than rage on your build imo). But that rifle means you can sit off point to pick off targets, particularly things like DH who oh so love their trap play. But I get the axe/shield.

Also how do you feel about sig of leadership vs hoelbrak on your build?

Trigr.6481:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ClH8E5M4zw

I felt kinda obligated to make a video coming up with reasonable nerfs for bunker mesmer as I was the first to pretty much bring it into light after the expansion.

Countless

Lol. What a joke.

No wives, no kids, no lives. Just GW2 and obtaining capture points.

Bah. you don’t nerf bunker Mesmer, and certainly not mesmer in general. You rotate the world around Mesmer to bring everything into alignment.

For starters you heavily nerf the actual OP problem which is Rev. Then allow counter classes in to better deal with the Mes.

Always +1, I like zerker berserker with rifle, timing berserk with gunflames and SIG of might. Unblockables are your ace in the sleeve but otherwise you have to maintain that ranged pressure and hit while they’re distracted by your friendly contender.

Fortus.6175:

Ross Biddle.2367:

• Balanced team tokens – Grants an assured balanced team while solo-Q

• No Revs token – Next match 100% assured no Rev’s in it

;D

Wait, can I get one where I see no bunker mesmer/engi ?!

Don’t be such a buildist. Classist is fine.

This is funny.

Rev pushes anybody not bunker out of the meta.

It takes some non-bunkers to deal with things like Mes.

You blame mes/bunkers for the problem XD

If you can’t take down a Mes, you either need a dose of L2P, or a class/build that can do the job.

If however you can’t take down a Rev, I’m sorry, nobody can blame you for that one :p

Look deep into your soul and you shall find your answer.

Jiggawattz.2697:

I would forgo the entire reward system, literally give up every reward in spvp and go back to getting nothing if Anet would bite the bullet and kittening balance the game like they need to.

Now you’re just being crazy. At least my ideas were reasonable.

I think the point is that Rev is OP. But we all know this, irregardless of if this vid shows it or not :p

• Balanced team tokens – Grants an assured balanced team while solo-Q

• No Revs token – Next match 100% assured no Rev’s in it

;D

twojackson.5607:

All the pro teams are pretty embarassing at the moment. I don’t see any sort of creativity amongst them. And honestly, having faced double revs and bunker teams before, they are pretty easy to kill if you are in fact a good player.

There were plenty of downs. Followed by instant resses.

Just shows Bunkers arent strong enough.

More buffs.

That and more anti bunker builds.

Timston.1976:

It’s ok I have the same problem, it might involve the premades

Did you take that image on your phone?

I got through tier 1 emerald in about 8 games (or something), and did so on full glass berserker

:D

Before builds come rolls. Though vanilla mesmer is limited in choices -_-u