Guild Wars 2

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

Yeah, ask Chaos and Alpha about that.

I read what Chaos said. I’ve also dueled Chaos on my kshot war.

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

Daniel Handler.4816:

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

Daniel Handler.4816:

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

“Complex positioning of pets is too easy already. Lets make it so all phantasms are crippled by default. Raise the skill floor.”

Except that wouldn’t raise the skill floor. At all. I’m simply saying, add some counterplay to CS because currently it’s extremely easy to use and the opponent can do very little to negate it. So add some counterplay to it. If some guy is fighting vs CS he should be able to do something to try and avoid it if he is skilled enough sso that he can also avoid mesmers burst.Or actually probably a better suggestion made my someone was to just to totally change what CS does. Which I think is a pretty good idea. Would let us create a skill that doesn’t overshine on the other two traits there in addition to dealing with CS. If I could go with either my original suggestion or totally changing what CS does I’d probably go with the second one. The question is, what would you replace it with? Something that fits with mesmer. Any ideas welcome. How about on interrupt create a clone with a 5-10 second CD?

EDIT: At this point IDK why I am surprised. After all, some of these guys were trolling in that mesmer dungeon chronomancer thread

Yes it would, and by quite a lot. Reducing the movement abilities of illusions makes them easier to kite. It would make it so people had to concentrate more on positioning their Illusions. Right now the only time we have to focus on positioning is for a chain daze.

Your argument is anecdotal and doesnt explain what should and shouldn’t have skill floors in this game. Extremely easy to use and no counterplay:
Auras
Stances
Virtues
Stat buffs that activate upon entering combat
…. Etc

You have to come up with some better explanation dude.

I am trying to to give you the benefit of the doubt but you keep repeating a non explanation.

You want counterplay to raise the skill floor. Tell us why.

Except you can’t really control where your illusions are once they are out………something minor again. And why do I want counterplay AKA higher skill floor? Because right now the effects of the stun are strong.

@Ross Biddle

And yet, CS would actually still compete with the other trait options in that line…………

They many times run in straight lines. We would have to use other phantasms that don’t move to guide people into getting hit.

And now finally we are getting somewhere.

Why are the effects of CS strong? There is an enormous amount of counterplay to cc in this game.

“They many times run in straight lines. We would have to use other phantasms that don’t move to guide people into getting hit.
"

WTF?

“Why are the effects of CS strong? There is an enormous amount of counterplay to cc in this game.”

Not against instant cast CCs. I’ve said this a thousand times but your like stability! Guess what? Can’t tell when to use it because it’s instant cast.

Times when you use stability-

• When I see the GS wielding Mesmer with two MoD charges on his bar. Pop Dolyak signet to cover any instant stun interrupts, pop bezerker stance to cover any blinds, stick a killshot right between the Mesmers eyes. Not dead? Fire a volley, or swap to sword in melee range and final thrust his kitten . Also works great against thieves. Done it hundreds of times.

get stunned first?

• Pop Dolyak signet and dodge, pop zerker stance, don’t worry about whatever burst you just ate as even on a zerker ammy you’re running 21k+ health. Pop zerker ammy, stick a killshot right between the Mesmers eyes. Not dead? Fire a volley, or swap to sword in melee range and final thrust his kitten . Disengage using leaps + superior swiftness access. Also works great against thieves with bask venom. Done it hundreds of times.

And I mean, I’m not even a great warrior player. I don’t even run a meta warrior build. It’s closer to an anti meta build -_-u But please, continue to tell us how bad of a player you are.

Ok. I validate your feelings.

~Validated.

Only 200 point margins?

Given i didnt have 9 losses in a row, but my two last night were complete roflecurbstomps. My teams got eaten alive -_-u

Previos 3 matches, two of those matches my team did the same thing to the enemy.

I run BD in my Mental Lockdown build. In PvP the Chaos line makes me near impossible to lock down, and the synergy of a stack of stability post burst into stomp is just to gud. Oh, also, bonus might on burst.

I just want to point out that you can now alter the stats on ascended armor/weapons in the mystic forge.

So your thread has boiled down:

• CS is so OP it should be totally removed from the game.

I’ve read the odd CS complaint here and there over the months since the patch, but you just took the cake.

Of course let’s be honest, this is what you wanted all along considering this was your actual suggestion on how to change it-

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

So here is my suggestion.

• Make the stun on daze stun on interrupt with daze.
• In addition add a 15 second internal CD.

Definitely a thread end if ever I saw one.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Fay.2357:

Menaka.5092:

it’s a weird question tho… you’re looking for a build for doing what in which gamemode?

He’s not looking for a build, he’s making a point.

That’s incorrect. I’m theorycrafting a build that uses chaos and inspiration but it is not coming together well. Part of the issue is the almost required use of greatsword in PvP.

You take illusions, drop GS, go condi/hybrid, take MH scepter, MH sword, and/or staff.

No one says it’ll turn out well :p

100% stability uptime? Who said that. You need 1 stack of stability for a fraction of a second. You don’t have to worry about boon strip as the MoD occurs before both the shatter and the mind stab.

Of course you don’t even need stability as there’s plenty of ways to mess with a Mesmer wanting to engage with a burst. How do you not know this?

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

Ross Biddle.2367:

So its time for another summary.

Frenchfry’s beef pretty much boils down to-

• “I want more counterplay to CS”

Ignoring, despite it having been pointed out, that there are numerous counters. The question thus becomes “How much more?” Though it’s not been asked/answered, the preemptive argument tacked on to the previously stated “I want more counterplay” is-

• “I don’t want to see mesmer butchered into oblivion. Hell, have some more buffs if you want, on me!”

So in exchange for playing a high risk, glass, high damage based build that can truly utilize the CC effect of CS under MoD, we can have…. more damage? More blinks? More evades? What I want to know is, what good is more of any of this in a high risk build where the landing of your burst is everything? And not just your role, but your very survival depends on your ability to land that burst to apply pressure. Failure to do so means you’re at a severe disadvantage.

More over, MoD + CS is hardly just an offensive tool. It can be used simply to create breathing room (get that thief off your back for a second to pop a heal), or to stop someone getting away (stun into iLeap imob), no damage necessary. The fact you think all MoD + CS charges are spent on GS bursts only further cements the ignorance of the realities within actual gameplay you’ve continued throughout this discussion. If I had a dollar for every MoD charge I’ve had to burn saving a downed allie, or getting a GS warrior off my back, Id buy Bill Gates.

And all this is still ignoring all the counterplay that is present in the game… -_-u

Like I said, you really undermined yourself early on in this discussion. You used CS early on after patch and haven’t touched it since. CS is a great trait, it has good synergy with MoD, and even better in skilled hands with MA or PB. But given the rest of Mesmers features as they currently stand, it’s hardly some one shot, CS/MoD wins all OP powerhouse that requires changing, or at least changing in any way which you’ve suggested thus far.

CS has very litte counterplay.

“So in exchange for playing a high risk, glass, high damage based build that can truly utilize the CC effect of CS under MoD, we can have…. more damage? More blinks? More evades? What I want to know is, what good is more of any of this in a high risk build where the landing of your burst is everything?”

It once took skill to land your burst. With CS this has dropped a lot. Either add some more counterplay or make CS somehow still take more skill. And I’m sure there is plenty of ways you could buff mesmer.

Thanks for affirming my summary.

Other things you’ve failed to answer is

• Why you assert that lowering the skill level is bad (FOO strategies are a legit part of balance)

• Why you assert MoD stuns dont require an adequate level of skill as is?

• Why you continue to assert there isnt adequate ways to counter MoD stuns now when it’s already been stated there are numerous ways?

Basically you just keep stating the same things over and over again without any supporting substance, and no one appears to agree with you.

Chaos Archangel.5071:

I think this video is a good example of why CS doesn’t need to be nerfed:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fO8M0B4BIc

That, right there, is what people are complaining about. That’s pretty much the same whether or not you stun them.

Exactly.

If that Golem had CS equipped with MoD, he could have shut that Mesmers burst down hard and counter burst.

Which is both very important, and very healthy for the game.

Chaos Archangel.5071:

Tomorrow the winners will be announced, along with the final message to Lindsey Sterling (the winners may add whatever they’d like to the message).

“Dear Lindsey.

Thanks for letting me use your song as the backing track for my video, but at the end of the day we know who the real star is. And oh how they shined.

~Sincerely"

Rifle.

Discussion over.

No.

But looking into it I might be able to stomach something like this if I had to
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNArfRlsnhG1YZawINwtGLpGk5Ne+LIfwBCAaDy+UA-TlyEABGcEAoU9nkUGolSwBOBAQp07hDBga6DA4BAI3+DkCAmtAA-w

nearlight.3064:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Chaos Archangel.5071:

Hey Skcamow, here is one of the clips from the matches we played together:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98VHkMQPYWg

It doesn’t show much, unfortunately, but how smooth your beta-Mesmer looks. =P Though at one point in the clip someone on the enemy team is chastising their Mesmer because of how their damage doesn’t compare to yours

Chaos, I want to give you the benefit of the doubt, but having watched your two most recent chrono vids, I cant help but think your chrono build is innefective, or sub optimally built (or something). It’s not that it can’t do anything, but there’s constantly all these situations where I feel like you should be able to do more but you can’t :/

Just chiming in here, but I think a staff sw/shield well build would overall do better with a tankier amulet. In particular celestial comes to mind, though if you went that route it’d be wise to drop either dom or chaos for illusions to pick up maim, and if you kept Chaos and CI you could stack might fairly well with might duration runes. If you kept domination, you could make it work by using the traits to stack vulnerability to keep the sustained damage quite high for cele.

The other idea is to just conform to the meta hive-mind and use GS over staff for more focused burst damage overall, which would be a bit more optimized with marauder than staff would be, since sw/shield gives you enough survivability.

That’s the thing. So often Chaos is off point, and when on point not a particularly strong point holder. And since he’s not there contending points, you’d expect more direct pressure vs targets where’as they barely seem to sweat most of the time.

I know the weapons are certainly your “set”, Chaos, but are you sure this build is properly functional?

Fay.2357:

StickerHappy.8052:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Daniel Handler.4816:

I heard reports, didn’t know if it was true.

Regularly. Every time he gets rekt and spits his dummy. Anytime a toy gets taken away and he slams down his keyboard, messing up his hair. Usually the change is accompanied by a 45 minute video of dribble about why X is so much better than Y, and the new meta.

Shortly thereafter he’ll be back on Mesmer again. So I wouldn’t worry.

..though I wouldn’t worry regardless -_-u

Oh no! Ross Is Playing KS mesmer, I should switch soon!

The meta just calls to me :D

skcamow.3527:

Someone surely must have already said this, but confounding suggestions got nerfed by the following already:

• Mirror Blade nerf
• Harmonious Mantras nerf
• Indirect air sigil nerf
• Mantra auto refresh bug fix

It’s not like it has no counterplay. At the very, very least, increase the ICD or remove the daze duration increase, but for heaven’s sake, the daze=stun trait functionality is fine.

Skcamow, please, you’re making WAY to much sense.

Had 2 thieves, 2 mes, 1 necro the other day. Told my team to send 3 home, 2 far, and for the thieves to rotate like mad.

We won 500 – 70

Chaos Archangel.5071:

Hey Skcamow, here is one of the clips from the matches we played together:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98VHkMQPYWg

It doesn’t show much, unfortunately, but how smooth your beta-Mesmer looks. =P Though at one point in the clip someone on the enemy team is chastising their Mesmer because of how their damage doesn’t compare to yours

Chaos, I want to give you the benefit of the doubt, but having watched your two most recent chrono vids, I cant help but think your chrono build is innefective, or sub optimally built (or something). It’s not that it can’t do anything, but there’s constantly all these situations where I feel like you should be able to do more but you can’t :/

I’m playing Mental Lockdown (builds in sig including chrono variant), mostly in PvP

So its time for another summary.

Frenchfry’s beef pretty much boils down to-

• “I want more counterplay to CS”

Ignoring, despite it having been pointed out, that there are numerous counters. The question thus becomes “How much more?” Though it’s not been asked/answered, the preemptive argument tacked on to the previously stated “I want more counterplay” is-

• “I don’t want to see mesmer butchered into oblivion. Hell, have some more buffs if you want, on me!”

So in exchange for playing a high risk, glass, high damage based build that can truly utilize the CC effect of CS under MoD, we can have…. more damage? More blinks? More evades? What I want to know is, what good is more of any of this in a high risk build where the landing of your burst is everything? And not just your role, but your very survival depends on your ability to land that burst to apply pressure. Failure to do so means you’re at a severe disadvantage.

More over, MoD + CS is hardly just an offensive tool. It can be used simply to create breathing room (get that thief off your back for a second to pop a heal), or to stop someone getting away (stun into iLeap imob), no damage necessary. The fact you think all MoD + CS charges are spent on GS bursts only further cements the ignorance of the realities within actual gameplay you’ve continued throughout this discussion. If I had a dollar for every MoD charge I’ve had to burn saving a downed allie, or getting a GS warrior off my back, Id buy Bill Gates.

And all this is still ignoring all the counterplay that is present in the game… -_-u

Like I said, you really undermined yourself early on in this discussion. You used CS early on after patch and haven’t touched it since. CS is a great trait, it has good synergy with MoD, and even better in skilled hands with MA or PB. But given the rest of Mesmers features as they currently stand, it’s hardly some one shot, CS/MoD wins all OP powerhouse that requires changing, or at least changing in any way which you’ve suggested thus far.

Daniel Handler.4816:

I heard reports, didn’t know if it was true.

Regularly. Every time he gets rekt and spits his dummy. Anytime a toy gets taken away and he slams down his keyboard, messing up his hair. Usually the change is accompanied by a 45 minute video of dribble about why X is so much better than Y, and the new meta.

Shortly thereafter he’ll be back on Mesmer again. So I wouldn’t worry.

..though I wouldn’t worry regardless -_-u

Chaos Archangel.5071:

SlimChance.6593:

Chaos Archangel.5071:

…

*Confounding is fine. If you needa nerf something, nerf Mantra of Distraction. Confounding is only “OP” when combined with it, but in every other instance its fine… That doesn’t qualify a nerf.

…

I’m sorry Chaos, but I have to disagree with this. MoD has barely changed since release. The only real buff it has received as when it became AOE effect. And even then, it really didn’t see much play time. And never was an issue.

ONLY when CS became a 100% daze to stun, are players complaining about MoD. So to me, if anything should be nerfed it should be CS.

Yeah, and there’s the rub..

Mantra of Distraction shouldn’t be nerfed just because of CS. CS shouldn’t be nerfed just because of Mantra of Distraction.

… Though, honestly, I don’t think either of them need to be nerfed. -_- Nerf greatsword.

Wait.. lets not do that either.

Nerf these kinds of threads.

There’s enough tears about Mesmers already without Mesmer-mains needing to complain. How about we just.. enjoy what we have right now? Its bad enough Chronomancer is going to see nerfs without abusing core Mes.

All of these Mesmer features are nicely balanced at the moment. There was almost universal thumbs up approval at the full list of changes we got.

Outside of PU and the background mantra cd/spam the only place the QQ is coming from is these nicely balanced features being used in professional hands. When was the last time you went into PvP and found yourself worried by the presence of that Mesmer on the enemy team? Probably back in those first couple of weeks post-trait-patch when mirror blade had an extra bounce (GS was nerfed Chaos, remember?). Now it’s back to being a chicken shoot. There needs to be two of your average daily mesmers in the same place at the same time just to keep it exciting.

You want to nerf something, nerf the pros. Chop off one of Chaos’ fingers or something. That should keep him happy.

StickerHappy.8052:

Fay.2357:

StickerHappy.8052:

Ross Biddle.2367:

StickerHappy.8052:

Ross Biddle.2367:

StickerHappy.8052:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Fay.2357:

So the combo you’re seeing is greatsword 2 (mirror blade), dodge, mind wrack, greatsword 3 (mind stab).

This does a lot of damage, particularly if you don’t have toughness. The way to avoid this is to dodge immediately upon either seeing the animation of mirror blade, or as soon as you realize you’re taking damage. As you said, it’s an impossible fight against unsuspecting prey. Don’t be unsuspecting prey. When you know there’s a burst zerker mesmer on the other team, always be aware of where they are and be ready to avoid their burst.

I made this just before (for something else) so you can see what Fay is talking about.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OL5uco1fDWo

Vid is a comparison of Zerker GS burst under Power Block vs Mental Anguish, so the last 8 bursts are the harder hitting. Anyway, you can see the skills used and the damage totals on a lite golem.

So in ideal burst situations, PB hits harder right?

Eh, I don’t think so. A PB interrupt on a full zerk build can net you 2-4k extra damage, which brings them about even, more or less. The difference is ONLY made up in additional interrupts throughout the course of a fight, pulling PB ahead.

However, as any experienced player will know all the difference in a fight can occur in that burst instant. If the target scraped by with a few HP, they can pop their invulns and heals, prolonging the fight and potentially escaping danger altogether. So which is better? Circumstance is everything. You can’t just look at a few numbers and call it :p

But the same goes for mental, not alot of targets will eat your burst like the golem so you dont get the extra dmg multiplier. Unless they have no stun breakers

Well you always get the bonus 15%, that said the whole idea of Mental Anguish is maximizing its potential of burst under Lockdown. So if you can dump the full thing under 1s before a stun breaker/invuln reaction, then you’re golden.

obviously pre-empting the Mesmer is the strongest approach. Popping stability or invuln/blur/evade works really well. But the strongest defense? Weakness, lots and lots of weakness. It’s relatively low investment, shuts out anyone without condi cleanse, and can be reapplied even if it is cleansed :p.

Burst Mesmers worst nightmare :p

I get what you mean tho, but my argument still stands, on the video you posted, PB is almost the same as MA, without the HS damage, and granted you will get the modifier 50% since you Are hitting a golem.

So a very good Interrupt Mesmer will make use and outdamage MA repeatedly if he manages to Chain His interrupts. Like proper Clone positioning for Diversion.

Your argument is wrong. As long as you either bait a stunbreaker first or just execute your burst precisely fast, you’ll get the bonus damage every time. Executed properly, the mirror blade will land an instant after the stun, followed by the shatter. You can do the whole thing in less than half a second.

Here is the thing though, on a first engagment, how would you know how many stun breakers he has, you can bait the first one yes, but how bout the second? the third?

If he has 2 or 3, how many is off CD , how many Isnt? How many is almost off CD?

Unless you can predict it 100% of the time then yeah for sure MA will always outdamage PB.

Fay isnt wrong. It is easier to land the burst in that fraction of a second than it is to react and time the stun break, which is why I said it’s easier/smarter to pre-empt the Mesmer, and if you can dump weakness on them. Generally speaking, this is also why Mesmers will +1 burst, that way the target is even more distracted and will be almost guaranteed to be unable to react.

All this aside, like I said you can’t just look at numbers. To maximize damage an interrupt Mesmer running PB is going to allow his opponent to open up, thus the target can begin new channels with which to be interrupted. MA works better in a lockdown setup, therefor he can more easily chain his CC, not worrying about interrupting skills, and continually land his, and his teams damage. When targets become locked down in a PB Mesmers scenario, he’s effectively locked out of his additional damage .

runeblade.7514:

Ross Biddle.2367:

runeblade.7514:

Velimere.7685:

Impact.2780:

It does need a very short cast time with no after-cast, though,

I disagree with you, and so does ArenaNet… Cheers!

Impact.2780:

It also means when you see the mesmer’s burst coming, and you dodge it, you will successfully counter play it instead of having your dodge suddenly interrupted or prevented.

The counter-play is the long charging time of the mantra skill itself plain and simple.

runeblade.7514:

Easy to achieve actually when accounting to all those hip defensive skills.

They have long duration, enough to get the mantra up.

Your point does nothing to refute my own. You’re still blowing a necessary defensive recharge in order to charge your Mantra of Distraction. This is about as wise as a Celestial Dagger/Dagger Elementalist blowing his or her Lightning Flash to land Churning Earth. If you think that’s also a good idea, then you and I have nothing more to discuss.

Wrong. My points counters yours. Mesmers have so many of those hip defensive skills, and the stealth skills last pretty long thanks to PU. The recharge is low enough for all of them to be on-demand whenever necessary.

The difference between Lightning Flash + Churning Earth vs. The prestige + Mantra of Distraction is that The Prestige + Mantra of Distraction is worth it. The instant MLG stun is leagues better than a few stacks of bleed. lol. I can’t believe you actually compared the two.

Wait, so I have to take the Chaos line + PU + a torch and or Decoy and or mass invis so I can run MoD? I thought there was no cost/investment?

Anyway, how many hip defensive skills do Mesmers have exactly (how many’s “so many”) to serve in the use of recharging mantras? Can you list them for us? I’m fascinated.

• Mind Wrack- Blinds with Blinding dissipation
• Cry of Confusion- Blinds
• Diversion- Instant Daze/stun interrupt
• Distortion- Invulnerability
• Decoy- Stealth
• Portal- if you so choose.
• Blink- Teleport
• Mass Invisibility- Stealth
• The Prestige- Stealth
• Illusionary Wave- Knockback to keep melee away.
• Illusionary Leap- For MLG teleport.

Learn your class

Ok so lets cut it down to an actual practical list of those with which to safely channel MoD.

• Diversion- Instant Daze/stun interrupt (useless against ranged interrupts, useless against stability, it’s something, but not necessarily reliable, could easily eat a burst in a MoD channel, but ok)
• Distortion- Invulnerability
• Decoy- Stealth
• Portal- if you so choose. (long CD, unlikely to be available, rarly taken in conjunction with MoD (decoy/blink/MoD) but ok)
• Blink- Teleport (Gap opener, but no guarantee you’ll be safe to channel without LoS, situational)
• Mass Invisibility- Stealth
• The Prestige- Stealth

So 4 truly reliable options, one requires taking torch which yes, is a big build investment. Two require burning a stun break, one an elite. Distortion is Mesmer biggest “OMFG!” button and isnt something you burn soley to recharge MoD. So yeah, in practical gameplay terms you’re not using any of these soley to get MoD recharged. You’ll wait for an opportune moment either amidst your rotations, when you’ve had to cycle out of combat, or you go without.

Learn my class.

StickerHappy.8052:

Ross Biddle.2367:

StickerHappy.8052:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Fay.2357:

So the combo you’re seeing is greatsword 2 (mirror blade), dodge, mind wrack, greatsword 3 (mind stab).

This does a lot of damage, particularly if you don’t have toughness. The way to avoid this is to dodge immediately upon either seeing the animation of mirror blade, or as soon as you realize you’re taking damage. As you said, it’s an impossible fight against unsuspecting prey. Don’t be unsuspecting prey. When you know there’s a burst zerker mesmer on the other team, always be aware of where they are and be ready to avoid their burst.

I made this just before (for something else) so you can see what Fay is talking about.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OL5uco1fDWo

Vid is a comparison of Zerker GS burst under Power Block vs Mental Anguish, so the last 8 bursts are the harder hitting. Anyway, you can see the skills used and the damage totals on a lite golem.

So in ideal burst situations, PB hits harder right?

Eh, I don’t think so. A PB interrupt on a full zerk build can net you 2-4k extra damage, which brings them about even, more or less. The difference is ONLY made up in additional interrupts throughout the course of a fight, pulling PB ahead.

However, as any experienced player will know all the difference in a fight can occur in that burst instant. If the target scraped by with a few HP, they can pop their invulns and heals, prolonging the fight and potentially escaping danger altogether. So which is better? Circumstance is everything. You can’t just look at a few numbers and call it :p

But the same goes for mental, not alot of targets will eat your burst like the golem so you dont get the extra dmg multiplier. Unless they have no stun breakers

Well you always get the bonus 15%, that said the whole idea of Mental Anguish is maximizing its potential of burst under Lockdown. So if you can dump the full thing under 1s before a stun breaker/invuln reaction, then you’re golden.

obviously pre-empting the Mesmer is the strongest approach. Popping stability or invuln/blur/evade works really well. But the strongest defense? Weakness, lots and lots of weakness. It’s relatively low investment, shuts out anyone without condi cleanse, and can be reapplied even if it is cleansed :p.

Burst Mesmers worst nightmare :p

StickerHappy.8052:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Fay.2357:

So the combo you’re seeing is greatsword 2 (mirror blade), dodge, mind wrack, greatsword 3 (mind stab).

This does a lot of damage, particularly if you don’t have toughness. The way to avoid this is to dodge immediately upon either seeing the animation of mirror blade, or as soon as you realize you’re taking damage. As you said, it’s an impossible fight against unsuspecting prey. Don’t be unsuspecting prey. When you know there’s a burst zerker mesmer on the other team, always be aware of where they are and be ready to avoid their burst.

I made this just before (for something else) so you can see what Fay is talking about.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OL5uco1fDWo

Vid is a comparison of Zerker GS burst under Power Block vs Mental Anguish, so the last 8 bursts are the harder hitting. Anyway, you can see the skills used and the damage totals on a lite golem.

So in ideal burst situations, PB hits harder right?

Eh, I don’t think so. A PB interrupt on a full zerk build can net you 2-4k extra damage, which brings them about even, more or less. The difference is ONLY made up in additional interrupts throughout the course of a fight, pulling PB ahead.

However, as any experienced player will know all the difference in a fight can occur in that burst instant. If the target scraped by with a few HP, they can pop their invulns and heals, prolonging the fight and potentially escaping danger altogether. So which is better? Circumstance is everything. You can’t just look at a few numbers and call it :p

runeblade.7514:

Velimere.7685:

Impact.2780:

It does need a very short cast time with no after-cast, though,

I disagree with you, and so does ArenaNet… Cheers!

Impact.2780:

It also means when you see the mesmer’s burst coming, and you dodge it, you will successfully counter play it instead of having your dodge suddenly interrupted or prevented.

The counter-play is the long charging time of the mantra skill itself plain and simple.

runeblade.7514:

Easy to achieve actually when accounting to all those hip defensive skills.

They have long duration, enough to get the mantra up.

Your point does nothing to refute my own. You’re still blowing a necessary defensive recharge in order to charge your Mantra of Distraction. This is about as wise as a Celestial Dagger/Dagger Elementalist blowing his or her Lightning Flash to land Churning Earth. If you think that’s also a good idea, then you and I have nothing more to discuss.

Wrong. My points counters yours. Mesmers have so many of those hip defensive skills, and the stealth skills last pretty long thanks to PU. The recharge is low enough for all of them to be on-demand whenever necessary.

The difference between Lightning Flash + Churning Earth vs. The prestige + Mantra of Distraction is that The Prestige + Mantra of Distraction is worth it. The instant MLG stun is leagues better than a few stacks of bleed. lol. I can’t believe you actually compared the two.

Wait, so I have to take the Chaos line + PU + a torch and or Decoy and or mass invis so I can run MoD? I thought there was no cost/investment?

Anyway, how many hip defensive skills do Mesmers have exactly (how many’s “so many”) to serve in the use of recharging mantras? Can you list them for us? I’m fascinated.

Impact.2780:

The issue is it’s intended to be used to interrupt foes, to benefit from on-interrupt traits. It does need a very short cast time with no after-cast, though, so it can still serve its purpose without allowing the mesmer to be casting a burst combo at the same time. An “activation time” as previously mentioned could also work, but would create yet more particle effects around the mesmer.

It also means when you see the mesmer’s burst coming, and you dodge it, you will successfully counter play it instead of having your dodge suddenly interrupted or prevented.

Dodges can’t be interrupted.

Anyway, you acknowledge MoD is intended for interrupts (though dazes have many intentions not limited to this) yet suggest a cast time…. which flies in the face of interrupt play. Interrupts require high reaction time already. Vs many skills a cast time would make interrupting impossible.

All that aside, if you want to talk intentions seriously, the Intention of Mantras is that they be charged and instant cast. So you can’t talk about intentions and not eat intentions too

-_-u

Fay.2357:

So the combo you’re seeing is greatsword 2 (mirror blade), dodge, mind wrack, greatsword 3 (mind stab).

This does a lot of damage, particularly if you don’t have toughness. The way to avoid this is to dodge immediately upon either seeing the animation of mirror blade, or as soon as you realize you’re taking damage. As you said, it’s an impossible fight against unsuspecting prey. Don’t be unsuspecting prey. When you know there’s a burst zerker mesmer on the other team, always be aware of where they are and be ready to avoid their burst.

I made this just before (for something else) so you can see what Fay is talking about.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OL5uco1fDWo

Vid is a comparison of Zerker GS burst under Power Block vs Mental Anguish, so the last 8 bursts are the harder hitting. Anyway, you can see the skills used and the damage totals on a lite golem.

Zenith.7301:

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Xaylin.1860:

Embolism.8106:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Silverkey.2078:

I saw somewhere a suggestion to simply remove the trait and instead “your control effects remove an additional stability” which I think made sense.

I’d never willfully use a control effect to remove a stack of stability -_-u

I want the control effect. If I could remove the stability it’d be in some other way prior to using my CC.

That actually sounds pretty strong with Diversion. Fits Mesmer better than Revenant anyway IMO.

What’s the point of it, though? We already got Shattered Concentration. Yes, you could use the new CS without shatters but in the end it will most likely not add much to Mesmer gameplay.

While CS should be changed I still got to say: Making it on interrupt is dumb. There is absolutely no point in using it then especially since Chaotic Interruption exists.

And don’t forget it ruining Mental Anguish, since you’d never take anything other than Power Block ever again.

If you take mantra of distraction your going to take power block anyway. With or without the change to CS.

“Making it on interrupt is dumb. There is absolutely no point in using it then especially since Chaotic Interruption exists.”

I fail to see how this is reason not to make the change. So if you go lockdown it isn’t as useful. The same goes for shatter and condition damage builds.

Not really. You take MoD to get some self peeling breathing room on classes like thief with a guaranteed stun, and because power block doesn’t remotely affect most of their crap, why not take mental anguish which adds another whopping 15% bonus to mindwrack on stunned targets and as a trait is more universal?

+15% bonusbonus damage, and +30% damage vs inactivity.

Anyway I made a short vid doing bursts on golem with PB and MR, using the exact same setup otherwise.

https://youtu.be/OL5uco1fDWo

Mental Anguish front loads the burst damage, Power Block needs that interrupt on burst to compare. PB also gives you more outgoing damage over time if you land all your interrupts.

Of course if you can down your opponent in one, you don’t need to keep interrupting.

So, for an interrupt build, sure take all your interrupt traits. For a lockdown build, Mental Anguish is sound, simple, straight forward pick.

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Xaylin.1860:

Embolism.8106:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Silverkey.2078:

I saw somewhere a suggestion to simply remove the trait and instead “your control effects remove an additional stability” which I think made sense.

I’d never willfully use a control effect to remove a stack of stability -_-u

I want the control effect. If I could remove the stability it’d be in some other way prior to using my CC.

That actually sounds pretty strong with Diversion. Fits Mesmer better than Revenant anyway IMO.

What’s the point of it, though? We already got Shattered Concentration. Yes, you could use the new CS without shatters but in the end it will most likely not add much to Mesmer gameplay.

While CS should be changed I still got to say: Making it on interrupt is dumb. There is absolutely no point in using it then especially since Chaotic Interruption exists.

And don’t forget it ruining Mental Anguish, since you’d never take anything other than Power Block ever again.

If you take mantra of distraction your going to take power block anyway. With or without the change to CS.

Oh how the ignorance continues to shine.

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

Mogar.9216:

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

Mogar.9216:

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

Mogar.9216:

it’s face roll vs zerker players with low skill level. It’s not really oped at all. I actually started to save my dazes for defense lately rather than using it to land shatter. A decent player knows a shatter is inc once they get mantra stuned and will pop a breaker and dodge so the stun really becomes a tell for your opponents.

You can time the stun with your burst so that they can’t stunbreak it in time 99.999999% of the time unless you have a teleport like blink.

That WAS true before they nerfed mirror blade. You can cast mirrior blade and then stun blink and shatter. But ever since they nerfed mirror blade damage by nearly a 1/3 it’s no longer possiable to shatter burst someone 100-0 anymore. The shatter damage is never instant. You have to cast MB, hit stun, blink and shatter. while blink and shatter are both insta you still need to wait for blink to happen before hit shatter which is enough time to stun break and dodge.

Yeah, it depends on what class your fighting and what build depending on the one shot. But it’s still a lot of damage that has very little counterplay. And I’m a bit confused by what your saying. While blink and shatter are both insta you still wait for blink to happen? When it’s instant? Think you meant to say mirror blade. Which is true butttt you can time it so they don’t have time to stun break. Simply start casting GS 2, before they have time to react and dodge pop CS and by that time it’s normerly too late.

You want to shatter while you are on top of the player because you want to make sure you shatter yourself for more damage. While blink casting is instant the blink itself is not really instant. The sequence goes like this: You see target, Cast gs2, While gs2 is in air daze stun the target, blink there and shatter + gs 3 . If you use a macro you can maybe pull it off as a insta but in real life that is awful a lot of keys to press where 2 of them are ground targeted. So in real life there is usually time to react when you are stuned. Not a large window but enough never the less, I do it on my mesmer all the time both landing and try to avoid bursts .

Landing two AoEs isn’t really that hard, especially because you don’t even necessarily need greatsword 3. And you don’t always need to blink in. As long as you are in melee range or somewhat close to melee range your good. Even if not you can still get make the guy use a stunbreak and catch him 5-10 seconds later with the second charge.

^ Golems in the mists can confirm.

;D

Xaylin.1860:

Embolism.8106:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Silverkey.2078:

I saw somewhere a suggestion to simply remove the trait and instead “your control effects remove an additional stability” which I think made sense.

I’d never willfully use a control effect to remove a stack of stability -_-u

I want the control effect. If I could remove the stability it’d be in some other way prior to using my CC.

That actually sounds pretty strong with Diversion. Fits Mesmer better than Revenant anyway IMO.

What’s the point of it, though? We already got Shattered Concentration. Yes, you could use the new CS without shatters but in the end it will most likely not add much to Mesmer gameplay.

While CS should be changed I still got to say: Making it on interrupt is dumb. There is absolutely no point in using it then especially since Chaotic Interruption exists.

And don’t forget it ruining Mental Anguish, since you’d never take anything other than Power Block ever again.

Zenith.7301:

The problem is mantras, really.

They’re either really strong in some people’s eyes because of their instant nature, or they’re so weak in their active effect that they’re not worth the channeling.

Quite frankly I just wish they’d retool the mantras or replace them with hexes as a new category.

Confounding Suggestions isn’t really that strong when used with other mesmer CC’s that have cast/animation times.

The problem then is that mantra of distraction is kinda weak by itself when it doesn’t have CS to prop it up.

I see what you’re saying. Nerf CS, remove the stun on daze, and make it a flat +50% daze/stun duration. Then buff MoD by making it a 1s stun. All problems solved :p

EremiteAngel.9765:

i thought mantra of pain casting was instant…you can hear the sound and dodge in time?

also what is a good time to use mantra of pain?

Oh, if you hear the first one you know the second isnt far behind :p, not to mention mirror blades, mind wracks, the works ;D

StickerHappy.8052:

EremiteAngel.9765:

baylock.1703:

Thing most ppl dont know is when you run forward when phantasm berzerker is summoned you only get 25% of its dmg

But yes always dodge gs 2

i didn’t know that..this is a good tip…this saves a much needed dodge…

especially against mesmers that run triple cast mantra of pain…my gosh the pain…
i can dodge his gs 4 and gs 2 and sword 3 but the mantra of pain my gosh just spams into me and bites into my HP

Most mesmers just mindlessly spam mantra of pain tho, its funny.

When I hear that sound I dodge retarget the mes and burst .

nearlight.3064:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Instead of becoming a mist, instead player becomes a vampire, gets locked in a box, and burried in the ground.

During day, player becomes a vampire and combusts due to sunlight.

This is splendidly fun idea too Ross! I myself toyed with the idea of forced vampire transformation procs, but I felt as though it would have felt too punishing on certain pvp maps that have more sun exposure. Though it might not be too much of an issue as long as raid on the capricorn never gets played on again.

In WvW they can introduce a new sunscreen consumable. Lasts for 8 hours. Washes off in water.

Instead of becoming a mist, instead player becomes a vampire, gets locked in a box, and burried in the ground.

During day, player becomes a vampire and combusts due to sunlight.

Simonoly.4352:

Eugh CS is such a headache of a balancing issue. It’s ridiculous when paired with MoD and possibly Diversion (although it’s OTT nature is also highly amusing) but it’s a non-issue with other daze sources on Mesmer.

I’d be happy if they just removed the stun and made the trait a +50% daze duration.
I want me an extra half a second on my dazes!

Give me 100% daze, 50% stun, and I’ll consider it.

Oh and some sort of ticking damage while under the effect of a daze/stun just for kicks.

Really though, CS has great synergy with Mental Anguish. Better to leave it as is.

1/2 cast time to a mantra which mantras, as the feature of their design, is to be insta cast. Er, no, now you’re just being silly.

The whole concept of mantras is that you pre-cast the charges for instant use later. Adding a cast time to the casts is asinine. Many players have a hard enough time playing with Mantras as it is.

apharma.3741:

I’m sorry but I see no reason why a mesmer cannot have a build that will gently ease you into the class.

Why is it every other class is allowed all the cotton wool padding, warm gentle hugs and passive kitten but noooo memser can’t have anything remotely like that. I mean I can’t even find a single auto immune trait in the entire class outside of pairing blurred inscriptions with SoI auto cast on phantasms.

No, mesmer needs to immediately pound the faces of anyone that wants to play it 6 feet under the dirt, stomp on it a few times. If they didn’t get the idea from that the class immediately sets fire to the player for good measure. Heaven forbid it be an enjoyable and welcoming class to play with no bugs and grossly unfair PvE mechanics rendering the class almost unusable.

You know what’s funnier? To make the most out of this proposed “easy mesmer setup” you’re talking about playing into a power/glass build (to make use of those bursts under those stuns). While CS makes for an easier feature to use amongst the various Mesmer kitten nal, it’s best associated with the least forgiving stat setup -_-u

+1 Apharma

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

Ross Biddle.2367:

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

@Ross Biddle

The burden is indeed on me. And thus I have told you why. Because it’s too easy and has very very little counterplay. Then you come in and are like, nope. And so I’m asking why. And now your like the burden of proof is on me. And I’m like, wah? I just did that! I just showed why the change should be made! Why should the change NOT be made? The only reason you gave is because it’s a nerf. And I said to that if you really think it’s too big of a nerf you can just buff some other mesmer trait. So my question remains, why not make CS have more counterplay and make it harder to use?

The question of counterplay was already address in this thread. To counter dazes including MoD specifically, classes have stability, blinds, aegis, channeled blocks, and of course evades. Good players will see the MoD charges on your bar and bait the MoD casts with evades, thieves in particular do this. More’over the following bursts are mitigated with invulns. I do enjoy a good Ranger who waits to use his Lightning Reflects on an MoD stun/interrupt because he not only gets the stun break, the imob cleanse, but also an evade and gap opener. Most players just build tankier though and avoid the danger of a big burst to begin with. Now, before you go wiping all this away with a haphazard “but stability gets stripped”, so what? Stability is still a counter to CC. Stripping is the counter to the counter. That we need counters, and counters to counters means things are working well.

The conclusion here is that CS has plenty of counterplay already, and making it harder to use equates to little more than redesigning it poorly. Oh and another GM that’d be ushered into obscurity with the suggestions you’ve made would be Mental Anguish. It’d no longer compete with Power Block, and sees little enough use as is.

Here is the only good change I’ve seen suggested to CS, and if I remember rightly it was made under the old “bugged” mantras.

Increase the icd to 10 seconds. Make the idc local to each enemy player as the blind on ineptitude is.

“To counter dazes including MoD specifically, classes have stability, blinds, aegis, channeled blocks, and of course evades.”

Problem is there is no tell for mantra of distraction. Which leads us to the following:

“Good players will see the MoD charges on your bar and bait the MoD casts with evades”

I’m a bit confused as to what you are saying here. Are you trying to say you dodge and after you dodge the enemy uses the stun? If so I don’t see how that quite works. The only counterplay right now to it is predicting it. Which only works if your enemy is a complete idiot and does everything pretty much exactly the same. Having fought a ton of thieves I know what a pain predicting can be. Fortunately most thieves blow there steal when at a distance. Vs a mesmer you don’t have this.

Yes… much gameplay across the classes in GW2 involves prediction. While obviously I’m not going to say something like “spam both dodges, hope for the best”, every time I play PvP I encounter players on every class that are good enough to go deeper into the mind games that come with the gameplay. Maybe you don’t like this. Maybe you’re not there. But it exists and happens every day, and it’s great to be a part of.

Other things that’ve been nerfed since the CS change are the mirror blade bounce, further reducing the might and damage associated with the lockdown burst.

Silverkey.2078:

I saw somewhere a suggestion to simply remove the trait and instead “your control effects remove an additional stability” which I think made sense.

I’d never willfully use a control effect to remove a stack of stability -_-u

I want the control effect. If I could remove the stability it’d be in some other way prior to using my CC.

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

@Ross Biddle

The burden is indeed on me. And thus I have told you why. Because it’s too easy and has very very little counterplay. Then you come in and are like, nope. And so I’m asking why. And now your like the burden of proof is on me. And I’m like, wah? I just did that! I just showed why the change should be made! Why should the change NOT be made? The only reason you gave is because it’s a nerf. And I said to that if you really think it’s too big of a nerf you can just buff some other mesmer trait. So my question remains, why not make CS have more counterplay and make it harder to use?

The question of counterplay was already address in this thread. To counter dazes including MoD specifically, classes have stability, blinds, aegis, channeled blocks, and of course evades. Good players will see the MoD charges on your bar and bait the MoD casts with evades, thieves in particular do this. More’over the following bursts are mitigated with invulns. I do enjoy a good Ranger who waits to use his Lightning Reflects on an MoD stun/interrupt because he not only gets the stun break, the imob cleanse, but also an evade and gap opener. Most players just build tankier though and avoid the danger of a big burst to begin with. Now, before you go wiping all this away with a haphazard “but stability gets stripped”, so what? Stability is still a counter to CC. Stripping is the counter to the counter. That we need counters, and counters to counters means things are working well.

The conclusion here is that CS has plenty of counterplay already, and making it harder to use equates to little more than redesigning it poorly. Oh and another GM that’d be ushered into obscurity with the suggestions you’ve made would be Mental Anguish. It’d no longer compete with Power Block, and sees little enough use as is.

Here is the only good change I’ve seen suggested to CS, and if I remember rightly it was made under the old “bugged” mantras.

Increase the icd to 10 seconds. Make the idc local to each enemy player as the blind on ineptitude is.

Wishes.3021:

CS is cancer in combination with distraction mantra because it allows unskilled players to easily land bursts willy nilly. Skilled players don’t need a kitten insta-cast stun to land a burst and thus there are far better options other than mantra of distraction as far as utility skills go. CS is essentially a skill for noobs. Better remove it from the game entirely so people actually have to learn how to play without training wheels.
Memser is now a class for noobs between PU, CS, and the entirely passive chaos and inspiration traitlines.
I main mesmer by the way.

Playing to win
http://www.sirlin.net/articles/playing-to-win

Balancing for skill
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EitZRLt2G3w

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

“Pretty much its time for a recap.

1) Your best argument is that you feel its “faceroll”
2) You also think it makes Mesmer to “easy”

So you’re toiling in a world of the subjective right now."

Are you trying to say spamming 3 buttons to get off your burst is NOT super easy? Just want to double check before I burst out laughing. I pressed P R and E fast while typing pressed I’m so pro.

“3) Particulars of your sub arguments, including nerfing ideas, have been outargued.”

I already addressed everything of yours. Mind showing where I went wrong? So far the only half competant thing you said was because it wouldn’t work well with CI and thus would nerf lockdown builds ( it would also nerf power and condition damage builds ). And I said you can buff some other mesmer trait if you really thing it’s that big of a nerf. Totally ignoring the fact chrono is on the way.

“Leaving the thread back at-

4) A justified explination of what’s really wrong with CS, and how it’s OP."

Like I have already said, CS should get changed because the trait has very little counterplay/is too rewarding for the skill required.

“Let’s also point out at this point that CS was changed from a 50% chance to 1s stun on daze to a 100% chance to 1s stun on daze by the devs for a reason.”

Just because a dev made a change doesn’t make the change a good one.

Something that may seem totally random now but may have to be used in a upcoming example if you continue on with this. Would you consider a nerf to burning good or bad? Presuming you could nerf the damage done by however much you wanted. If not, what other significant change would you want made to game balance?

EDIT:

“So to put it plainly – You’re asking for changes to a feature you’ve not been using since it was introduced on a class you main that doesn’t use it anyway, and apparently that’s a nerf to you too, but also you feel you have the experience to speak authoritatively on it in any practical way?”

You know WHY I haven’t been using it? You don’t have to have used CS for days on end to be able to discuss a nerf about it. Surprisingly. And the one guy was talking about me whining just because I lost a duel. If that was really the case why wouldn’t I take CS? And if that was the case, this whole nerf thing because I got beaten by a mesmer with CS would equally nerf me. Also I’m still waiting for you have to come up with another idea as to what’s wrong with mine. All of yours got shot down. Or you could try and revive them again. Either way, your last reply was kinda useless. Oh and yeah this whole burning or balance change you would make would like for you to include that in your next post if you reply.

The comparable nerf of my example about the dev to burning would be that burning was changed by a Dev. People biggest fear is its return (for some classes if not all) to obscurity.

Demanding I come up with anything is misguided. The burden of proof is on you.

And yes, you can discuss CS, or whatever you like. Just because you can discuss it doesn’t automatically mean you’ve got anything meaningful to say.

Case in point, if you were using CS out of the gate when everybody was running their latest zerker builds, and MoD had a behind the charge cd going etc, yeah it was super effective in play.

Now though like the other poster said, everybody’s adapted. CS is still good, but what exactly is the problem with it again?

Here you go

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Build-Full-Bunker-Chrono/first#

From what I saw, bunker Chrono was doing just fine.

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

Windwalker.7421:

That’s a whole lot of tears over a very short duration single target stun with a 5 sec CD. Your suggestions are ludicrous to say the least, might as well remove CS as an option if you’re going to bury it like that.

Sounds like the typical “someone got owned in 1v1 in a GvG/WvW game” whine thread.

In the list of things that need balance adjustments in regards to 1v1 balance, if that should ever be Anet’s goal, I’d say there are at least a dozen other issues of higher priority.

I fail to see how CS would be so bad it might as well not exist. A 1 second stun on interupt with a daze on a 10 second internal CD is just fine. If your good you can just interupt one of there abilitys and burst. And a 10 second CD prevents this from being too strong.

And seeing as I’m a main mesmer this is one I happens to notice. So I’m pointing it out and discussing a solution. In fact I have refused to take CS a couple of days after the june 23rd patch hit to now except for a few times.

So to put it plainly – You’re asking for changes to a feature you’ve not been using since it was introduced on a class you main that doesn’t use it anyway, and apparently that’s a nerf to you too, but also you feel you have the experience to speak authoritatively on it in any practical way?

The way you talk about “burst”, and your balance suggestions, really doesn’t give me confidence in your ability in these areas.

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

’This would ruin CS. Let’s look at a practical example of what you’re suggesting. So I use my GS5 knockback, not to set up a burst, but to create some space. I accidently interrupt a skill while I’m doing so, causing a 1s stun from CS to proc. The stun goes unnoticed because the knockback is in itself a stun and the player has to recover from the knockback animation. Now my CS is on a 15s ICD and all synergy is gone from MoD. Also, anytime I interrupt on a pistol 5 (2s stun), CS procs and goes to waste under the other stun. Focus 4’s into the void. Etc."

True, didn’t think about the fact that the stun would override the nockback and stuff. It was a hastily thought out idea on the spot. I was thinking it would help out the nerf to CS.

Pretty much its time for a recap.

1) Your best argument is that you feel its “faceroll”
2) You also think it makes Mesmer to “easy”

So you’re toiling in a world of the subjective right now.

3) Particulars of your sub arguments, including nerfing ideas, have been outargued.

Leaving the thread back at-

4) A justified explination of what’s really wrong with CS, and how it’s OP.

So do you have anything to answer 4 with without saying 1 and 2? 1 hasnt been justified (and good luck doing it), and 2 presumes it’s a problem beyond your feelings of not liking it -_-u.

IF you can get through the above part, then you’re welcome to suggest an suitable change, though it’s fair to note you’ve not done a good job at that. Let’s also point out at this point that CS was changed from a 50% chance to 1s stun on daze to a 100% chance to 1s stun on daze by the devs for a reason.