It really hinges on how much of a role NPCs play. If they just do one-off tasks, that’s fine. If they’re actively involved in combat, it’s a shame the PvP team wasted so many resources just to release a horrible mode no one will play.
You mean something you won’t play.
A lot of people who play GW2 also happen to play Dota2, Smite and LoL. I don’t play mobas, but I welcome the style into GW2. It brings something besides conquest into the game. If it catches the attention of the people who do play Mobas and gives people options of game mades I don’t think the pvp team wasted any resources.
Hope OP realizes that T3 with or without mixed tiers would suffer still. The problem really doesn’t have much to do with matchmaking, as someone pointed out that higher tiers people get their spawn camp on too.
Now you are looking dumb. The build you posted and the one I posted have the same armor. If you need more than 2.6k armor now that is a l2p issue.
You know how easy is to remove the poison? Oh you dont even consider a burning skill that reapplies every second but you are considering poison on 9s cd? If you are talking about vs a class that wont clear condis then celestial is even more stronger than your build.
You are saying it’s an important to have 2k+ more hp on cele and then saying 2.6k armor is L2P?
That’s pretty silly considering in spvp the armor is 2.35k and 2.4k in wvw doesn’t account for the inflated power and condi stats in wvw.
Akeldama posted the correct answer ^, there is a 200 point rating gap because t2 doesn’t have the coverage to compete with t1, the gap between the tiers is not artificial, it’s there for good reason. Every time a t2 server competes in t1 it gets stomped, that is not a coincidence.
This is completely false. T2 has queues on weekdays. Last time I looked BG had no queues or very little queues and even outmanned in EBG for good periods of time.
Hey bring your t2 server up and try it out, nothing stopping you, then we see how it goes
Akeldama posted the correct answer ^, there is a 200 point rating gap because t2 doesn’t have the coverage to compete with t1, the gap between the tiers is not artificial, it’s there for good reason. Every time a t2 server competes in t1 it gets stomped, that is not a coincidence.
This is completely false. T2 has queues on weekdays. Last time I looked BG had no queues or very little queues and even outmanned in EBG for good periods of time.
Tired of listening to NA players complain about nothing relevant to the PvP scene. I’d actually rather google translate a french or a german forum, where the debate is on a higher level.
I’d rethink your first sentence. A lot of the current EU meta came from NA. While EU hasn’t influenced NA all that much in recent times.
Higher level debate? Whenever EU ESL’s are on it is just “omgersh Celemonkeys everywhere. So boring.” in the chat. From seeing both EU and NA members discuss stuff in this forum, I think there’s equal input by both communities. I think EU has a little edge in the maturity department.
If latency could be worked out where it was possible for EU and NA people to play together, instead of regional servers, I actually think it would be better for the game.
Full celestial ele is not optimal in WvW, even in 1v1s, because of the interaction of food buffs. The reason celestial ele is so powerful in sPvP is because (1) you maintain a LOT of pressure through high burning + poison uptime that let’s you outsustain your opponent; and (2) you have less control over your stat allocation; and
In WvW, almost every non-condi class will run lemongrass poultry for -40% condi duration, which means your burning and poison won’t last as long. To the point where it’s not even worth taking sigil of doom, which means your only real damage is coming from burning. On top of that, most of the builds you’ll be running against in WvW will have more condi clear (SA thieves, PU mesmers) so burning won’t stick nearly as long as it does against the meta builds you see in sPvP.
Unlike in sPvP, you generally can’t rely on out-sustaining your opponent in WvW because there’s no incentive for your opponent to stay in a losing fight. Most people will just back off and reset, with nothing lost. Or, during your 2-3 minute long fight, your opponent’s teammates come in and force you to retreat.
Against condi builds, you definitely need a lot more power damage to quickly take them down before their condis wear you down.
With full celestial, you’re basically trading burst damage and survivability for a moderate increase to burning damage. Not worth it.
Another reason celestial is less useful in WvW is that, unlike in sPvP, you have a lot of control over how you allocate stat points in WvW. I would recommend a focus primarily on zerker/knight/soldier (adjust between tankiness<—->damage depending on how good you are at avoiding damage, what kind of builds your teammates run and how good they are at peeling for you, what kind of role you want to play for your team, etc.). Don’t get me wrong — it definitely makes sense to take a few pieces of celestial as needed to round out the stat spread you’re aiming for. But going full celestial is almost never a good idea for WvW unless you’re doing no food/oil duels in Obsidian Sanctum or something.
Celestial is still optimal for 1v1 duels even factoring food. Btw celestial even not counting condi still more stats than normal stats. Mix stuff will just nerf you. With a mixed stat ele you wont be able to 1v1 outlast a celestial ele with the same skill lvl.
You are not trading dmg and survivability for only condi. You can mix as much as you want you will end up lacking in other are and end up having less survibability or less dmg than cele.
Example:
celestial ascended helmet 22*7 = 154 stats
other stat helmet = 47+34+34=115
Even if you make 0 use of condi dmg (which is not the case) you still have more stat. You can mix in such a way you will have more healing power, thoughness, vit, crit dmg, ferocity, etc than celestial. You try to spread out with mix and lose stats and lack in other areas.
obs: talking purely about 1v1/small scale
This is slightly untrue.
Pair equally skilled eles in a duel. The one with more power based stats have an advantage over the celestial based on the fact the amount of condi cleanse available in the ele’s defensive kitten nal.
Burning doesn’t have as much value against other eles as opposed to say engies with limited condi removal.
Even if you completely ignore condi dmg (wich is not the case) celestial still has more stats.
More stats in what respect?
You can out perform on a power basis while maintaining the general stats of celestial. Even if you lower healing power by 100 or so, it doesn’t really nerf the sustain in a 1v1.
Full celestial ele is not optimal in WvW, even in 1v1s, because of the interaction of food buffs. The reason celestial ele is so powerful in sPvP is because (1) you maintain a LOT of pressure through high burning + poison uptime that let’s you outsustain your opponent; and (2) you have less control over your stat allocation; and
In WvW, almost every non-condi class will run lemongrass poultry for -40% condi duration, which means your burning and poison won’t last as long. To the point where it’s not even worth taking sigil of doom, which means your only real damage is coming from burning. On top of that, most of the builds you’ll be running against in WvW will have more condi clear (SA thieves, PU mesmers) so burning won’t stick nearly as long as it does against the meta builds you see in sPvP.
Unlike in sPvP, you generally can’t rely on out-sustaining your opponent in WvW because there’s no incentive for your opponent to stay in a losing fight. Most people will just back off and reset, with nothing lost. Or, during your 2-3 minute long fight, your opponent’s teammates come in and force you to retreat.
Against condi builds, you definitely need a lot more power damage to quickly take them down before their condis wear you down.
With full celestial, you’re basically trading burst damage and survivability for a moderate increase to burning damage. Not worth it.
Another reason celestial is less useful in WvW is that, unlike in sPvP, you have a lot of control over how you allocate stat points in WvW. I would recommend a focus primarily on zerker/knight/soldier (adjust between tankiness<—->damage depending on how good you are at avoiding damage, what kind of builds your teammates run and how good they are at peeling for you, what kind of role you want to play for your team, etc.). Don’t get me wrong — it definitely makes sense to take a few pieces of celestial as needed to round out the stat spread you’re aiming for. But going full celestial is almost never a good idea for WvW unless you’re doing no food/oil duels in Obsidian Sanctum or something.
Celestial is still optimal for 1v1 duels even factoring food. Btw celestial even not counting condi still more stats than normal stats. Mix stuff will just nerf you. With a mixed stat ele you wont be able to 1v1 outlast a celestial ele with the same skill lvl.
You are not trading dmg and survivability for only condi. You can mix as much as you want you will end up lacking in other are and end up having less survibability or less dmg than cele.
Example:
celestial ascended helmet 22*7 = 154 stats
other stat helmet = 47+34+34=115
Even if you make 0 use of condi dmg (which is not the case) you still have more stat. You can mix in such a way you will have more healing power, thoughness, vit, crit dmg, ferocity, etc than celestial. You try to spread out with mix and lose stats and lack in other areas.
obs: talking purely about 1v1/small scale
This is slightly untrue.
Pair equally skilled eles in a duel. The one with more power based stats have an advantage over the celestial based on the fact the amount of condi cleanse available in the ele’s defensive kitten nal.
Burning doesn’t have as much value against other eles as opposed to say engies with limited condi removal.
Justification is: they don’t have weapon swapping, must use utility slots for added weapon skills which shorts them on potential defensive skills, and as a mid-range skirmisher Engi doesn’t have the luxury of hanging back at 1200 range and “pewpewing” with full efficacy. Typically an Engi has one utility slot it can afford for a stun break, which is what makes Tool Kit (not just Gear Shield) so desirable as a kit option.
There are actually a lot of skills that bypass Block
What is the justification behind random spamming nades on any corpses and making ressing impossible even when having massive healing, blocks, vigor, good health pool, kittenload of armour, massive condi damage and massive power damage?
What is the justification of any class cleaving downed bodies?
30 sec cd, 3 sec block. Almost twice as inefficient as the engi gear shield (since you can get almost 2 gear shields off for every one warrior block).
Not to mention, the warrior has only 17 skills while the engi has 22 in the current meta spec which makes the gear shield yet another 22% more efficient since it can be used in conjunction with other skills so that the engi never experiences low points in combat (ie never has to worry about cds and just auto because they have sooo many skills).
But lets not forget the engi even has combo fields it can play off of while the warrior ONLY has fire field.
In short: there is no justification for gear shield being SO powerful.
Lets look at warriors defenses in a broader sense compared to engies.
Dogged March, Cleansing Ire, possible Shield block, warhorn’s utility, the ability to break stuns up to 5 times or more a minute compared to 2 on an engie (unlike on an engie a warrior won’t nerf themselves if they run more stun breaks), armor+toughness differences are better on warrior, access to a lot of stability. Warriors have equal or better abilities to kite than engies depending on what set ups the two have.
3 sec block on 16s CD isn’t like some end all and be all defense compared to what other classes have.
The only thing I’m disappointed in so far is no nerf to turret engineers. I don’t really have an issue as a player playing against them. However, they and other AI bad are generally bad for skill progression of players in general.
Ow look, more unwarranted nerfs in pve and wvw based on pvp QQ. Boy I do sure enjoy having the moaning from a gimmick gamemode with a tiny active playerbase be the sole basis for profession balance in this game.
And make sure to absolutely not distinguish between gamemode’s.
Also a good thing you didn’t get fooled arenanet and nerfed the stuff that has been around for a long time and was just fine, instead of all the new things that happen to be involved in all the complained about builds.
Wouldn’t want to push out a nerf without kittening over everyone that can’t just hobble over to a vendor and completely change their gear, runes and sigils for absolutely free.
Bravo, bravo once again.
Is PVE really that hard? You having to spend 1 more minute in CoF really make you that bothered?
Stop saying Mesmer is still played or is somehow valuable in high tier PvP, because it is not. ALL the PRO mesmer players stopped playing the class because it doesn’t worth anymore to be a heavy fat baby that needs to be babysited by your team.
The only thing that changed about Thieves is that they aren’t soo required anymore to be in big fights brusting key targets (only if there is a Mes or w/e) because of how they suffer from all the AoE from Cele Ele/Engie, but they are still a good addition because of their roamming, decap and how they easily turn a 1×1 to a 2×1 in favor of their team.
Yet somehow we have seen Helseth in finals recently, and had another mesmer in the finals of the NA ESL cup yesterday.
And yes, thief does keep non-Guardian berserkers out of the meta due to their relentless gap closing ability, hard countering builds with an over-reliance on good positioning to protect themselves.
Thieves do have a great amount of gap closing abilities, but if we look at say a fresh air elementalist, they not only have the higher burst, which happens to be completely uncounterable, but they also have range and invulnerabilities.
???
4 Gap closers isn’t sufficient?
Is that what I wrote? Interesting analysis.
Misread, thought that read “do not have a great amount of gap closers.”
And yes, thief does keep non-Guardian berserkers out of the meta due to their relentless gap closing ability, hard countering builds with an over-reliance on good positioning to protect themselves.
Thieves do have a great amount of gap closing abilities, but if we look at say a fresh air elementalist, they not only have the higher burst, which happens to be completely uncounterable, but they also have range and invulnerabilities.
I wouldn’t mind the six month periods between patches if at some point the Devs would sit down and share some of what they’re working on in regards to balance with us quarterly. Maybe give approximate schedules for patches, etc.
I like Anet for the most part, but the secretiveness or ambiguous statements is frustrating over a long period of time. Other MMOs and games I have played have had rather open relations with the players, and the communities were less frustrated when they understood that Devs were working towards fixing or balancing certain things.
Try to look at it from the eyes of a beginner guys.
The NPCs award points, and give you a buff. Who wouldn’t want that?
It takes a higher level of understanding of the both the map and conquest mechanics to get that securing mid is important.
How would you guys suggest we go about teaching this to players?
There lies in the problem.
You are matching beginners with people who have 1k+ games on their account who understand the game better.
Example of one of the silliest things I have ever seen with beasts in Forest was yesterday a Mesmer and Necro crossed the beach somewhere around the 10 minute mark. An Ele on my team left me 1v2 and attacked the beast even though he clearly saw the mesmer. I never seen something as crazy as that before.
The ele did kill the beast and immediately died, I had to leave the point, they capped it and kept it capped for a few minutes. The Ele probably didn’t even realize he traded 25pts for 5pts to the other team and whatever pts the team gained in the few minutes they had our home capped.
Think trying to figure out why you lost is the wrong way to go about it OP.
At the end of the day most of the reasons why a team loses when not on voice comms together is because too many errors to count.
Instead I’d suggest look at what you can better in a match. I played a game earlier where I made correct decisions and still lost. So it doesn’t bug me. Not to say I don’t have room for improvement, but it doesn’t suit anyone to dwell over losses that were out of their hands.
the thing is, it’s a team game. who is the best PLAYER is completely irrelevant. Who is the best TEAM is all that matters in conquest game mode.
The problem with this is that yes it is a team game. However, that being said, random players teaming are handicapped from not having voice comms and cohesion that naturally forms over time.
It’s why I think the merging of solo and team queues is mostly a failure.
I actually think OE’s record is a ton more respectable than Backpack’s record.
Abjured and frands set to get the best win/loss ratio possible by always queueing premades. Which is fine. Doing so doesn’t really tell the tale of who the best individual players in Ranked though. That’s the major issue with merging solo and team queuers together.
You shouldnt blame/insult/kitten talk anyone for any reason.
Everyone has been newbie once, people don’t have the same skill, and even the do things that you may find absurd…but that’s not a reason to send them back to PvE or tell them to don’t do ranked. Anyone is free to play any available game mode in the game, and also they shall learn something from defeats, as I, and other players did in the past.
Also I have to say that actually, It’s no their fault they are not being matched with other players of their own skill level
I suggested in the NPE feedback thread why not locking Ranked until you meet certain conditions (Winning 5 unranked matches or something like that) since ranked matches it’s really unfriendly to beginners
If I’m playing ranked and others still haven’t learned the mechanic they deserve to catch some heat. Ranked is supposed to be competitive, not noob central.
is the most cancerous thing ever. Spam all the buttons and never die and its just soo boring to watch, long drawnout and meaningless fights that goes nowhere. Idk why the camera was always on the eles, its a good way to lose viewers.
Anet should of just gut the celes ele build already if they don’t know how to balance it, its better dead then alive especially of how disgusting the spec is.
I’m going to guess you are a bad player who doesn’t understand what’s going on when you watch the Cups, and probably die to cele eles because you don’t understand that it isn’t mindless spamming of skills, but somewhat complex skill usage when played right.
That is fair and as I stated above, cleansing Ire with LB need to be adjusted. The fix I mentioned earlier would certainly help but do nothing for the might-stacking.
Oh, I also think that Guardians probably need some love over other classes needing to be nerfed.
The real problem with Warrior is the LB. It CC’s, blinds, removes condis whether you hit or not, has fire fields, etc. They should fix Cleansing Ire and LB working together without hitting enemies.
for the last time!
the warrior long bow combustive shot is fine.
adrenaline was already butchered and you guys are asking for more unreasonable nerfs? please be fair okay?
like i said earlier, if you want to deny long bow combustive shot, activate your blocks and stand in the epic center where combustive shot lands exactly. the fire field will NEVER be activated at all.
combustive shot activating cleansing ire most of the time is working as intended, GET OVER IT already!
If I were to touch on something probably two powerful on warrior it is that you can have 5 stun breaks a minute if you want to, and 4 with the shout warrior build with Shake It Off being 20s stun break, and Balanced Stance every 40s.
sure, after all those stun breaks, the warrior will be dead anyway.
LB needs to be changed where you have to land CS to clear condis just like hammer or any other weapon set.
Overcharged Shot: Again, instant-cced skills need to go. Give this a 1/2-3/4 cast time.
Warhorn: Increase the cd’s to 20 and 25 respectively. The amount of condition-removal on-top of it’s low cd makes this off-hand a tiny bit too strong in that department.(As well as 1 being a blast finisher)
Neither of these are good suggestions….
1) As engineer you have to buff check before using the skill. It is not a brainless skill. Besides Rangers basically have the same instant knockback without CC’ing themselves. You can argue the .5s timer on it. But still there’s no penalty for using it like OS.
2) Reducing condi removal on classes is the step in the wrong direction.
Sorry bro, i’m not budging one the 1st on because you believe it not to be mindless. It has a very short cd, is instant and does exactly what you want it to do for any ranged spec…push you back. It needs a cast-time. I’m not saying it’s completely brainless but by no means is it balanced. Oh also, your argument leads to no credibility since the ranger skill HAS a tell and cast-time.
Edit: On the 2nd, the Warrior now has more consistent condition-removal than a Guardian. Granted you don’t see the dmg output of Elementalist’s and Engineer’s, they still have the insane amount of sustain/condition removal/burst healing/mobility and Might-stacking.
On OS… It may be instant cast, but you refuse to look at the fact that what comes after the OS is not instant because you’re on your back briefly. If I’m within 400 range of you there’s only two rifle skills I’m looking to really use on you, Blunderbuss and OS. If there weren’t a limited range on OS like the Ranger’s knockback I might agree with you.
The problem isn’t condi removal with warrior. Condi removal should be left alone on classes that have it, because condi metas just are in general two steps lower than the current meta. Look at WvW for instance.
The real problem with Warrior is the LB. It CC’s, blinds, removes condis whether you hit or not, has fire fields, etc. They should fix Cleansing Ire and LB working together without hitting enemies.
If I were to touch on something probably too powerful on warrior it is that you can have 5 stun breaks a minute if you want to, and 4 with the shout warrior build with Shake It Off being 20s stun break, and Balanced Stance every 40s.
Overcharged Shot: Again, instant-cced skills need to go. Give this a 1/2-3/4 cast time.
Warhorn: Increase the cd’s to 20 and 25 respectively. The amount of condition-removal on-top of it’s low cd makes this off-hand a tiny bit too strong in that department.(As well as 1 being a blast finisher)
Neither of these are good suggestions….
1) As engineer you have to buff check before using the skill. It is not a brainless skill. Besides Rangers basically have the same instant knockback without CC’ing themselves. You can argue the .5s timer on it. But still there’s no penalty for using it like OS.
2) Reducing condi removal on classes is the step in the wrong direction.
Either Lich or Plague form on top of regular hp bar and DS
What I mean not to tank everything is I see a lot of necros not really aware of where they are at in team fights and why it is bad to be in the center of an AoE and cleave party.
Also from playing engie I can say a lot of necros don’t pay attention to what tool kit is my hand because I land a good amount of my pry bars on necros.
, then we see how it goes