Guild Wars 2

Xom.9264:

The main issue I think you have Mighty is you dont take into consideration team gameplay when you make builds. Sure a build might be good however if there is a class that fills that role better in Tpvp thats the class that gets the slot. Good necros understand other classes and their job in teams so when a good necro makes a build they will build to fill a spot in the group that other classes can not do better, this limits options a great deal its does for all classes.

Zerker guardians for example are fine and fun, but there are other classes that fill the role better.

Regarding Minions they can work great on close point however when you reach the highest rated teams limitations will show. You dont know this because you have not played the game at that level its also the reason why alot of your statements are considered jokes by some necros here. Its another game when you start fighting the best players instead of just average players.

Call the builds what they are, casual builds that do fine in spvp and very low level tpvp. Nothing wrong with running non-optimal builds I do it alot for fun and a change, I just dont fool myself into thinking they are top notch builds.

Yet again another insult to me as a player and a theory crafter. These builds will work, and most do not require heavy team changing for top levels of PvP. Everyone has gotten used to Necro being a babysit class, most of these builds do not have to be. I will work with a top PvP team to get them to understand this if need be.

Blaine Tog.8304:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

I have no intent on being polite to many of the people here, as they fail to be polite themselves.

First of all, this is not at all how the thread has played out. The first post in the thread that wasn’t completely on board with your builds was Xaragon and he was being extremely polite and complimentary, by virtually any metric. He basically asked you to be a bit more careful with your generalizations but to continue theorycrafting because he liked what he saw overall… and you bit his head off. You may have read it differently, but it struck me as extremely gentle criticism, especially considering how much of a cesspool these forums can be.

Secondly, it doesn’t matter anyway. If you’re trying to be a pillar of the community, you need to be the adult in the room. Whether you find criticism “annoying” or not, keeping a level head when responding is the difference between attracting and repelling people.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

However don’t intend me to ever respect/be polite to someone that comes into a thread made to better the community only to disrespect it completely due to personal reasons.

Then don’t expect anyone to take you seriously. You could maybe get away with that sort of attitude if you were a well-known professional player, but since you’re not, ire awaits you.

Sorry if that sounds harsh, but I’m just speaking practically. You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar, after all.

I do admit, I overreacted. However I was anticipating this. ANYONE that believes my builds to be bad can simply use them for themselves, and I’ll help them use them personally ingame. I can prove that they are good. I knew that there would be people that judge before using, and I saw him as the first one to do it. Anyhow, I don’t expect to be the pillar of the Necro community for the billionth time. These builds are good, and anyone whom uses them to their fullest knows it. I’m tired of seeing crappy 30/30/10 Necros, tired of seeing ignorance in regards to Necromancer, tired of seeing “necro cant bunk”, or “Necro cannot burst, it’s only viable build is Conditions”

I made these builds to conquer that ignorance. Believe it or not, that Potentate build is the best point-assualter build I have seen so far on any class. Ask anyone whom has tried defending against me when I’m using it. Remortis, was a guy I found randomly in a solo queue, at that time I had bought into the nonsensical belief that Necro was bad at everything. He was amazing, dominating points, and winning 2v1s using a Wellmancer. I didn’t think that was possible, especially against a semi-competent premade. I took a look at his build, and saw that it could be improved slightly. To this day I stand behind that build as being an incredible Necro Wellmancer that disproves any statement that “Necro can’t roam/burst” in tPvP.

Next, Spazzcromancer’s bunker build was something I never anticipated, once again, I found him in a solo queue. We were fighting against an earlier prepatch guild [tPvP], and he sat inside Clock Tower for the entire match. Surviving everything. He held his own against GC Thieves, HGH Engineers, and even BM Rangers in that tower. I had NEVER seen a Necro bunker before, and once again, my idea of how Necro worked was changed.

Most top PvP Necromancers don’t experiment or theory craft nearly enough. It’s those unique builds that I find on occasion when solo queuing that are truly amazing/ground breaking, and all of them were prepatch when we weren’t ‘viable’. I learned to NEVER judge a build at face value, but to experiment with it, test it, and improve upon it.

Since then, I have ran all-Necro premades, 2 players running Spazz’s bunker, 2 running Remortis’ potentate, and 1 running my conditionmancer. We rarely lose.

Now, Necromancer is blatantly overpowered, and people STILL don’t realize the potential, and they ruin it with a new bad meta. Which is the primary reason why I brought these builds out for everyone to see. So that I can combat ignorance of Necromancers.

Once again, I thought the same way the majority of players in this thread thought before, now I do not. I hope that each of you will put aside your annoyance with me and my kittenty attitude, to atleast experiment with the builds on that first post. If you learn to use them, I guarantee they will change your ideas about Necro.

Bhawb.7408:

Now that AI doesn’t require a ton of work, Minions are probably the easiest thing to do. You have a lot of CC to counter other people’s builds, but you can pretty easily do the offensive work (that isn’t based on countering things) by keeping minions up, and rotating through a few skills every time they come off CD.

There are plenty of builds for you to use, Sikari’s is a solid one, and it will probably work for what you want.

I would definitely agree, Sikari’s build is probably one of the best MM builds available for tPvP currently, with the added benefit of being easy to use.

Bhawb.7408:

You would have been on BoC already if you hadn’t gone out of your way to flame us; we’ve had on multiple people that don’t agree with us and we’ve had arguments with. The problem isn’t that you respond harshly to harsh people (that happens), but that you actually start fights that no one picked with you.

Read the first few posts, please. When someone that never even bothered to attempt to use your build tells you it is absolutely awful when you spent ages precision crafting/modifying something to make sure it’s as good as it can possibly be… to help the community. I think that merits getting P/O’d, no? Besides, as I said, I care not about fame or greatness in this game, I want to see better and more diverse Necromancers. We have so much untapped potential it’s ridiculous, and we had all of this potential prepatch to boot. I never asked to be on BoC, and I doubt I would want to be, since I feel I better the community far more teaching players ingame.

Most of the ‘flaming’ was because of Mammoth and a couple others’ irrational and annoying attitude towards my builds without ever using it. I know they didn’t use it, because I know all of my builds are better than the 30/30/10/0/0 because I USED 30/30/10/0/0 the moment the patch came out. Therefore when he tells people in my thread to leave my thread, ignore me, and go somewhere else because every single build I have painstakingly tested is terrible, then I get annoyed. The rest just piled on about my leaderboard rank.

Blaine Tog.8304:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Also, Bas, as you know me, I am not a nice person. I do not respond well to annoyance such as some of these people.

If you have aspirations of becoming a pillar of the Necro theory-crafting community, you may want to work on that. Make controversial statements and you’d better expect people to ask you to back them up. Snapping at them isn’t going to cut it, as evidenced by most of this thread. And it’s really only logical to keep your responses polite unless you WANT to drive people off.

I have no intent on being polite to many of the people here, as they fail to be polite themselves. I posted numerous effective builds that I spent alot of time making/testing to REPLACE the current metas, (Months of testing/experiments, teaching them to other people for more testing/experiments), and the first things I see in this thread are direct unprovoked insults to me and my skill/builds. I have no want to become the most famous/greatest Necromancer of eternity, I only want to see better Necro players. I’m not going to kiss kitten to get on SoAC, or be nice to complete kittens like Ascii either. These builds work, use them, or don’t. Ask for my help, or don’t. However don’t intend me to ever respect/be polite to someone that comes into a thread made to better the community only to disrespect it completely due to personal reasons.

Bhawb.7408

The game was a different thing entirely. Regardless of what you are playing with, there are certain things one could see about how you played that showed you weren’t of the highest caliber of player. I have no doubts that you might be a very good player, but the idea that you are going to teach the top tier Necromancers how to play is going to fall on deaf ears unless you actually show it. What you showed me was something that top tier players would have picked apart easily.

I didn’t show you much at all anyway, I wasn’t being serious, I was theory crafting. I spend 99% of my theory craft time solojoining or premading with experimental builds across all classes. I’m sorry if I don’t have a high rank because of that, and I’m sorry I don’t cream 30 players at once. Anyhow, I never said that I am the greatest player of all time, and I don’t expect to be. Gibbly is a better player than I. However I know more about Necro builds than he does. If you asked Gibbly prepatch if Necro could bunker/burst, he’d say no. If you asked me that, I’d show you ingame that we can, infact better than most classes.

Ostricheggs.3742:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

That depends entirely on the build you’re using with each class, what class you’re fighting as well. The game is based on matchups of build and class.

This for the most part.

I would honestly rate the classes based on how hard it is to do their job properly. A bunker might not be killing things but has one of the more difficult jobs in the game.

In terms of rating a classes difficulty I’d say that each individual class has a different skill floor and ceiling. When I’m talking about a skill ceiling I mean what does it take to play a class completely optimally and how much effort does it take to play a class at that level. A skill floor is just the opposite, how easy is it to pick up the class as a totally new player and do relatively well with the class. A new player can pick up a thief and spam backstab all day but will get absolutely destroyed against any good team, for example.

In terms of skill floor/ceiling for classes in general I’d rate them as:

Warrior: Skill floor 2/10, Ceiling 4/10
Mesmer: Skill floor 2/10, Ceiling 7/10
Ranger: Skill floor 2/10, Ceiling 4/10
Bunker Guardian: Skill floor 4/10, Ceiling 8/10
Thief: Skill floor 1/10, Ceiling 8/10
Necromancer: Skill floor 2/10, Ceiling 5/10
Elementalist: Skill floor 3/10, Ceiling 7/10
Engineer: Skill floor 4/10, Ceiling 9/10

Of course it all depends on spec and matchups and I’m sure I’ma get kittened at for this, but I think these numbers are pretty accurate yo.

I agree with this somewhat, but you have to remember, there are some viable builds that will take enormous quantities of skill to use on classes normally easy. I’m going to remake your list based on the hardest and easiest viable builds I have used for each class

Warrior: Skill floor 1/10, Ceiling 9/10
Mesmer: Skill floor 2/10, Ceiling 7/10
Ranger: Skill floor 1/10, Ceiling 2/10
Bunker Guardian: Skill floor 3/10, Ceiling 8/10
Thief: Skill floor 2/10, Ceiling 10/10
Necromancer: Skill floor 3/10, Ceiling 9/10
Elementalist: Skill floor 4/10, Ceiling 7/10
Engineer: Skill floor 3/10, Ceiling 9/10

Stealth.9324:

Oh wait, how long can Thief use Lysaa runes with Elite to cleanse Conds? kitten . How long can Thief use Hide in Shadow to cleanse Conds? 30s. How long can Thief cleanse Conds with Shadow Embrace trait? 3s in STEALTH to remove conds, but hey he is not immune to the new Conds that applied to him while in stealth. How long can thief use Shadow Step to cleanse Conds? 50s. Now back to Necros, how frequent can Necro applied 5+ Conditions on Enemy? Less than every 10s. Kudos to you. Now tell me, between a thief and a Bunker D/D Eles, who has more Conds removal? And I as a D/D bunker Eles still has trouble to cleanse them, save Thief. GG…

How long does it take to capture a point while a dumb Thief is hiding around in Stealth?

Ascii.9726:

No vampiric build works in competitive tpvp, period.

With that post you’ve made me laugh at myself for ever thinking you knew anything about Necromancers. Stop implying you need precision for any kind of vampiric build because you don’t. Vampiric Precision matches enhanced Vampiric at 40% critical chance, and the difference in effective health is over 7k (and lets not forget vitality for DS-Health).

If you want to do damage/crit procs with sigils, then you need critical chance. Vampirism will never be good for any sort of bunker build, therefore it has to be a sustain build. What is a sustain build without damage?

Bhawb.7408:

Bas.7406:

I will have to say I have never actually faced him in a queue for pvp, nor have I ever ran into someone who has. I am not saying he doesn’t pvp, but I think it would be interesting to see how many of the top teams he has crushed remembers it? Perhaps you can give us some names of players you have destroyed.

I have played him in tPvP, ran into him when I queued with some of the eSports guild guys (far from an amazing team we had). He isn’t top tier by any means. Now, I don’t mean that as an insult, because neither am I, but he isn’t anywhere close to the top tier players.

You fought me once, and I was recording gameplay with Potentate under lag, it wasn’t exactly nominal conditions. Regardless I still managed to hold off a 2v1 off point with a semi-GC Wellmancer. If you want to roll with me again, and play seriously, we can do so. I’m tired of this nonsense and if I have to prove my skill so people can shut up, I will.

Also, Bas, as you know me, I am not a nice person. I do not respond well to annoyance such as some of these people. I posted these builds because they are good at what they do, a team of 5 Necromancers using these builds effectively can dominate almost any other multi-class spec on even levels, and I am willing to stand by that. I do what I can for the community, and try my best to battle ignorance in builds/playstyles. If you want to judge me, judge my builds, not my attitude. Since I’m not going to change it simply because some people got offended.

Ascii.9726:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Ascii.9726:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Ascii.9726:

Go home Altroll, your drunk.

Vampiric builds are neither bad nor difficult to play (unless your running a trademarked mighty altroll’s mighty meta build, which are all meta by default). Personally i think a minion variation for vampiric builds works best rather then straight up, something along the lines of;

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQRBIbdG2IjWtepmrG9eCQ6R0UP9kCuBHSxuSD-TwAA1CtIMSZkzIjRSjsGNAZByGhJEA

The idea being you act as a giant CC shield and let the minions do there thing. The thing about minions and vampiric builds is there’s alot of room for adjustment (more offensive or control ect).

Power based Vampire builds are bad. I never said they were difficult to play, infact I said they were some of the easiest. Ascii, for someone that acts like he has alot of knowledge with Necro, you act like a child, far worse than you portray me.

Vampiric now scales with power.

6 points.

Dear lord have mercy, Vampires are viable and OP.

So what makes you think conditions are so much more superior then power for vampiric builds, judging from your meta setting “Condition Vampire” build you would actually go 30 points into Blood Magic just for the dismal chance returns on Vampiric Ritual and the almost 100% unusable Blood to Power.

Because it synergizes better. If you haven’t noticed, there is no decent toughness/precision/power amulet in PvP. Using Rabid’s Amulet, I can grant myself alot of survivability based on toughness and vampirism heals, whilst providing decent crit chance. It also synergizes with Undead runes. Lastly, Vampiric Rituals adds to your survivability, and is quite underrated. I’d advise you to test it out, say against pet builds.

Power Vampires do NOT work in tPvP, because Knight’s gear in PvE/WvW is different from Knight’s gear in PvP. If there were no difference, and it actually were Power, Precision, Toughness, then power Vamps would be quite effective.

That depends entirely on the build you’re using with each class, what class you’re fighting as well. The game is based on matchups of build and class.

Ascii.9726:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Ascii.9726:

Go home Altroll, your drunk.

Vampiric builds are neither bad nor difficult to play (unless your running a trademarked mighty altroll’s mighty meta build, which are all meta by default). Personally i think a minion variation for vampiric builds works best rather then straight up, something along the lines of;

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQRBIbdG2IjWtepmrG9eCQ6R0UP9kCuBHSxuSD-TwAA1CtIMSZkzIjRSjsGNAZByGhJEA

The idea being you act as a giant CC shield and let the minions do there thing. The thing about minions and vampiric builds is there’s alot of room for adjustment (more offensive or control ect).

Power based Vampire builds are bad. I never said they were difficult to play, infact I said they were some of the easiest. Ascii, for someone that acts like he has alot of knowledge with Necro, you act like a child, far worse than you portray me.

Vampiric now scales with power.

6 points.

Dear lord have mercy, Vampires are viable and OP.

Ascii.9726:

Go home Altroll, your drunk.

Vampiric builds are neither bad nor difficult to play (unless your running a trademarked mighty altroll’s mighty meta build, which are all meta by default). Personally i think a minion variation for vampiric builds works best rather then straight up, something along the lines of;

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQRBIbdG2IjWtepmrG9eCQ6R0UP9kCuBHSxuSD-TwAA1CtIMSZkzIjRSjsGNAZByGhJEA

The idea being you act as a giant CC shield and let the minions do there thing. The thing about minions and vampiric builds is there’s alot of room for adjustment (more offensive or control ect).

Power based Vampire builds are bad. I never said they were difficult to play, infact I said they were some of the easiest. Ascii, for someone that acts like he has alot of knowledge with Necro, you act like a child, far worse than you portray me.

By the way, since you’re directly going to insult me, I’m going to say that your builds are simply badly designed, if you’d like me to explain why, I’d be glad to.

Proven.2854:

Aether McLoud.1975:

If it takes a special class with a special build setup to even have a chance of killing a necro, that’s a sure sign that the profession is OP and needs heavy nerfing.

Awesome. Let’s get to nerfing those bunker Guardians then.

Special class? I don’t know about you, but with a good build I can kill any bunker Guardian on any class.

At this point I’m literally forced to play my Necromancer to have a chance against other Necromancers in tournaments. Even against bad ones. I have to outplay each and every Necromancer I fight with a similar build, because it’s quite literally the only consistent thing I have to counter them with. Ranger fails hard, Engineer fails, Thief fails, Guardian fails, Warrior fails, infact the only other class that doesn’t fail is Mesmer.

I said it before, I’ll say it again, get rid of Dhuumfire, remove Terror from Spectral Wall, and replace it with Torment.

Or, another idea, nerf burning across all classes as a bonus, since it’s a rather overpowered condition to begin with.

TheMightyAltroll.3485

• Remove Fear from Spectral Wall

• Add Torment (6s) to Spectral Wall

• Remove “Dhuumfire”

• Add “Strength of the Underworld” to Grandmaster Spite tree.
  Strength of the Underworld
  Wells last 50% longer

• Make Greater Marks default on Staff

• Move Staff Mastery to replace Greater Marks

• Move “Death Nova” down to Master Traits

• Add “Vengeful Servants” to Grandmaster Death Magic tree
  Vengeful Servants
  When a Minion dies, you receive Fury(5s) and Vigor(5s) (Does not apply to Jagged horrors)

• Change “Vampiric Precision” to heal yourself for 20% of the damage you inflict from Critical Hits

• Move “Vampiric Precision” to Grandmaster Blood Magic tree

• Move “Vampiric Rituals” to Master Blood Magic tree.

• Move “Terror” to Grandmaster tree.

• Move “Withering Precision” to Master tree.

• Move “Target the Weak” to Grandmaster Spite trait

• Remove “Siphoned Power”

• Move “Furious Demise” to Minor Curses trait

• Move “Barbed Precision” to Master Curses Trait

• Increase bleed duration on “Barbed Precision” bleeds by 100%

• Add new trait “Myopathy” to Grandmaster Curses trait to replace “Target the Weak”
  Myopathy
  Apply 2 seconds of Immobilize and vulnerability when you apply Weakness (10 second CD)

• Remove trait “Reanimator”

• Move “Ritual of Protection” to replace “Reanimator” (Only applies protection once per well)

• Add new trait “Summoner” in Master Traits
  Summoner
  Summon 2 Jagged Horrors when you use a healing skill in combat. Capped at a maximum of 5 Jagged Horrors. (Remove the constant negative health effects from Jagged Horrors)

• Remove trait “Strength of Undeath”

• Add trait “Specter” to replace “Strength of Undeath”
  Specter
  You regenerate 50% of your life force when out of combat.

Above is a nerf to the OP Terrormancer you see lately, and a buff to lesser used builds, also a buff to make Vampires viable. Numerous fixes to crappy traits too.

I wouldn’t say it’s super complicated, it used to take alot of skill, but post patch practically everyone is facerolling Necro now.

I have a school for teaching Necro if you want to join it.

Vampire and Minionmancer are not very complicated to play, albeit they are somewhat bad.

Berserker Guardian is not a hard counter to Necromancer. No matter what you may believe yourself to think, Xom.

uberkingkong.8041:

Ken.9018:

I find necro easy to kill on my d/p + shortbow glass cannon thief

Same here, I don’t main thief but I’m a champ shadow and I’ve found necros 2nd easiest to deal with, because so many people rely on fear, I take the fear but then shadowstep right next to them which they don’t expect and start ticking at there hp and draining it so fast they don’t know what to do and I time when I expect them to do a skill and daze kitten out of em as well. Also gotta love powdered shot. Pretty much guarantees a stomp against necro and other classes as well.

That would only work well on bad and ignorant Necromancers that put all their reliance on CC. A good Necromancer is incredibly hard to defeat by any Thief.

Craptrain.7203:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

I may be arrogant, and I deem top players ignorant, but I feel I have good reason to.

Yeah, that just about says it all right there. The issue is (and what many of us have been saying) is that you actually don’t have any reason. It’s like saying that Usain Bolt is ignorant about sprinting, when the best you’ve ever run is a 13 second 100m.

You do not know what I have done. You’re judging me based on qualifications that are biased and moronic. Use my builds for yourself, and if you cannot use them effectively then I’ll show you how to use them. If you’re too blind to perform such a test yourself, and unwilling to allow me to demonstrate to you why they are superior to the meta builds that ‘top’ Necro players flaunt about, then you have no right to judge me.

I could stand here all day and judge that you’re the worst player in history, without ever seeing you play, but that doesn’t make me right.

That is my final statement to all of you.

Korusef.3714:

Great idea, going to work on the app

EDIT:
I did send you PM but got some weird forum error so if you do not get anything, could you PM me back?
And if you get it multiple times I am sorry.

I did not receive your application, unfortunately, please send it again.

dargosian.2704:

IGN: Ja Ur
Want to learn: Mesmer
Secondary class: Warrior (kitten yeah! ~ actually Warr used to be my main but there was no way I was getting into any team with one)
Student

Sure, add me and whisper me ingame when I’m on.

dragonrhapsody.6198:

In game name: Khallum Dragonscale

What class do you main: Ranger

What class(es) do you play as your secondary/tertiary: Everything else, mostly mesmer after ranger.

Are you applying as a teacher, or a student: Teacher

How many hours on your class do you have: Let me get back to you on that…

How many builds have you theory crafted: Honestly, I lost count… Because I make builds for my own (mostly rangers and mesmer) and customize builds for others based on how and what they want to play on their characters.

Would you consider yourself a good contributor to your community: I am sorry, I can’t be the judge of that, Someone else has to judge me.

Are you friendly/helpful: I cant be the judge of that either, Someone else has to judge me.

Would you be willing to prove your skill/knowledge ingame: yes

Very well, I shall contact you ingame.

GiggleFairy.3807:

enjoying the Condition Vampire build in WvW right now. thanks for sharing.

No problem, I’m glad you enjoy it.

Bamboocha.8129:

How about this 30/0/0/20/20 axe/focus Zerker build for PVE/Dungeons?:
http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=;00;4IkI0343KVJ0;9;4T;0JJ17B;447-15;9;6kKcFT

Seems solid to me!? Major traits could be changed…

What do you think?

Greetings

It looks quite solid, I would advise however that you change the Soul Reaping trait to “Soul Marks” and equip a Staff with Sigil of Flame/Energy for a bit of LF Generation/AoE. Since that build lacks a significant amount of condition removal, I’d also change Well of Blood out for Consume Conditions. Well of Blood makes for a very good heal if you’re specced for healing, but a mediocre/crappy heal if you’re not.

koolmutt.9827:

There’s alot of uncalled for backlash. The guy made a thread which has many very use-able builds for people to try out and experiment with, and if I were a new necro I’d find this thread to be a great starting point to learn a variety of builds post-patch. He’s even taking the time to answer questions that people are posting, so there’s no reason for others to look to discredit him.

Does he sound slightly arrogant? Yes.
Did he say a few things regarding top necro players, that he probably shouldn’t have? Yes.
Is he sounding like a know it all in certain posts? prolly
But he’s actually taking the time to help in his own way, and instead people are flaming him about his leaderboard rank. Leaderboard rank means nothing except for how good your team is and how often you decide to destroy your rank by doing solo queue. I’ve been in and out of the top 50 and yet I do think he’s quite knowledgeable about the class.

Either way, lighten up and let him help in his own way, rather than continually flaming someone when they’re doing far more to help the necro community than others are. If the way he carries himself in his posts bother you, then why not just leave the thread?

edit: some of these posts about qualifications and such are so silly. Just because at one point I was 26 on pvp leaderboard somehow make me some guru that all should listen to? No, your rank or ‘qualifications’ aren’t a huge deal when you’re trying to help new players with very use-able builds.

Don’t bother with them, I’m just going to ignore them from now on. I may be arrogant, and I deem top players ignorant, but I feel I have good reason to. These players do not bother to take the time to test out/use my builds properly to judge for themselves, so I’m not going to take the time to prove myself to them. Forum warriors, I’ve dealt with their kind before on other games.

Zuer.2814:

I don’t run sPvP but I do a lot of WvW. I’ve been running a 30/20/0/20/0 build using carrion armor with rabid trinkets. 5 runes of the adventurer with 1 rune of the undead. Hybrid power and condition build using wells. Axe/focus for boon stripping and higher direct damage when in death shroud. Scepter/dagger for quicker condition application. Sigil of earth and sigil of accuracy in main and offhands respectivly.

I’ve had pretty decent success with it sitting at about 1200 condition damage with 2700 attack and 46 crit. 22k health with 2k armor. That part kinda stinks but I’ve barely noticed it. I though about taking 10 out of curses and putting it into death for protection on well use. May do that tonight to test.

Just thought I’d share my build.

You might try running 60% Carrion, 40% Berserker’s. What you want to achieve is getting around 1200 condition damage WHILE getting 3,000 attack. Crit chance should be around 28%, but you also want to have that fury, so taking 10 out of curses would be a big no-no. Try running Signet of Spite with it (With Signet Mastery), it’s an incredibly useful Hybrid tool. Thieves Runes also make a very useful hybrid tool imo. You already have decent condition application, and you might want a bit of a better burst. Try using Sigils of Air and Geomancy on your weapons, far more effective for a hybrid build. Good build, thank you for posting it.

vicious.5683:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Craptrain.7203:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Craptrain.7203:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Craptrain.7203:

This has obviously degraded into an kitten measuring contest.

The builds posted may very well be good for people to use a springboard, but trying to paint them as “meta” strikes me as false advertising. Sure, they may very well be effective. I won’t contest that. However, efficacy is not the measure of whether or not something is the current meta. The current meta is the effective build the fits within the overall team structure. If a 30-30-10 is the best way for a necro to fulfill it’s given role withing a team, then it is the meta. It may not be the best 1v1 build out there. It may not be the best hot join hero out there. However, neither of those matters. What matters is what the top teams are using a necro for. That’s the meta.

I appreciate your effort in collecting effective builds for players to use, tweak, or experience, but maybe present them a bit differently in the future to avoid threads like this.

My point of posting this was to clean ignorance from any top players, to show what Necro is capable of. Spazzcromancer never allowed me to post his amazing Bunker build, but all of these builds are good for a number of things, from roaming, to tanking, to bursting, to bunkering, to supporting, to controlling. Unfortunately, I have to post gameplay videos, and apparently teach them how to use the kitten ed class before they learn that Necro can do more than spam DoTs.

Question: you’re trying to actually teach the top players that they’re the one playing incorrectly? I don’t mean this to sound blunt, but what are your qualifications that will make a top player take your word over their own experiences?

If they think Necro cannot burst or bunker effectively, but I have done it before, and I know people that bunker/burst effectively. Then they must be wrong, no?

You didn’t answer my question. What exactly are your qualifications? Are you highly ranked on the leaderboard? Have you taken down a top-rated tournament team in competitive play? Do you have an in with Jonathan Sharp? Do you have a widely popular stream? I honestly don’t know anything about you, which is why I’m asking.

I fight highly competitive players often, I discuss builds with them, I learned how to play from competitive players of every class. I have defeated competitive teams, and I know what they are capable of. I have been in competition on numerous games ranging from fighters to FPS games. I learned how to play the game, and I learned it well. I don’t see how a stream, ranking on the leaderboards, or an ‘in’ with Jon matters for qualifications, as far as I’m concerned, that means you’re simply a popular bad player.

You make videos against training golems
You say you know a magical build to bunker, but you never post it
The one video you uploaded in tpvp (the power well bombing build) was meh.
You say you have a “school” but none of your “students” post here in your behalf, supporting your words.
You post a lot of well-known builds with names but nobody calls them like that.
You say necros are OP and ask for nerfs, but you have not prove necros are OP in any way.
You say you are a troll.

see why ppl don’t trust you?

A) I have never made a video where I specifically attack training golems, I was explaining how to make/use a build.

B) It’s not my build, it’s Spazzcromancer’s build, talk to him.

C) Video recording software lags my computer, so it’s difficult to play a competitive match to be uber impressive.

D) I don’t ask them to.

E) None of the builds I have posted are well known, if they are, then I have never seen them posted on here.

F) I shouldn’t have to, but as I have said, if you want to learn Necro, I’ll gladly teach you.

Craptrain.7203:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Craptrain.7203:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Craptrain.7203:

This has obviously degraded into an kitten measuring contest.

The builds posted may very well be good for people to use a springboard, but trying to paint them as “meta” strikes me as false advertising. Sure, they may very well be effective. I won’t contest that. However, efficacy is not the measure of whether or not something is the current meta. The current meta is the effective build the fits within the overall team structure. If a 30-30-10 is the best way for a necro to fulfill it’s given role withing a team, then it is the meta. It may not be the best 1v1 build out there. It may not be the best hot join hero out there. However, neither of those matters. What matters is what the top teams are using a necro for. That’s the meta.

I appreciate your effort in collecting effective builds for players to use, tweak, or experience, but maybe present them a bit differently in the future to avoid threads like this.

My point of posting this was to clean ignorance from any top players, to show what Necro is capable of. Spazzcromancer never allowed me to post his amazing Bunker build, but all of these builds are good for a number of things, from roaming, to tanking, to bursting, to bunkering, to supporting, to controlling. Unfortunately, I have to post gameplay videos, and apparently teach them how to use the kitten ed class before they learn that Necro can do more than spam DoTs.

Question: you’re trying to actually teach the top players that they’re the one playing incorrectly? I don’t mean this to sound blunt, but what are your qualifications that will make a top player take your word over their own experiences?

If they think Necro cannot burst or bunker effectively, but I have done it before, and I know people that bunker/burst effectively. Then they must be wrong, no?

You didn’t answer my question. What exactly are your qualifications? Are you highly ranked on the leaderboard? Have you taken down a top-rated tournament team in competitive play? Do you have an in with Jonathan Sharp? Do you have a widely popular stream? I honestly don’t know anything about you, which is why I’m asking.

I fight highly competitive players often, I discuss builds with them, I learned how to play from competitive players of every class. I have defeated competitive teams, and I know what they are capable of. I have been in competition on numerous games ranging from fighters to FPS games. I learned how to play the game, and I learned it well. I don’t see how a stream, ranking on the leaderboards, or an ‘in’ with Jon matters for qualifications, as far as I’m concerned, that means you’re simply a popular bad player.

Xom.9264:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

If they think Necro cannot burst or bunker effectively, but I have done it before, and I know people that bunker/burst effectively. Then they must be wrong, no?

Then let them post about their exploits, you are a tiresome troll.

Any Necro that doubts the effectiveness of these builds and my strategies/skill, can talk to me ingame. I will devote portions of my time to TEACH YOU how to use them. So you can judge, unbiased, whether or not they are good. Until then, your opinions are moot.

Craptrain.7203:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Craptrain.7203:

This has obviously degraded into an kitten measuring contest.

The builds posted may very well be good for people to use a springboard, but trying to paint them as “meta” strikes me as false advertising. Sure, they may very well be effective. I won’t contest that. However, efficacy is not the measure of whether or not something is the current meta. The current meta is the effective build the fits within the overall team structure. If a 30-30-10 is the best way for a necro to fulfill it’s given role withing a team, then it is the meta. It may not be the best 1v1 build out there. It may not be the best hot join hero out there. However, neither of those matters. What matters is what the top teams are using a necro for. That’s the meta.

I appreciate your effort in collecting effective builds for players to use, tweak, or experience, but maybe present them a bit differently in the future to avoid threads like this.

My point of posting this was to clean ignorance from any top players, to show what Necro is capable of. Spazzcromancer never allowed me to post his amazing Bunker build, but all of these builds are good for a number of things, from roaming, to tanking, to bursting, to bunkering, to supporting, to controlling. Unfortunately, I have to post gameplay videos, and apparently teach them how to use the kitten ed class before they learn that Necro can do more than spam DoTs.

Question: you’re trying to actually teach the top players that they’re the one playing incorrectly? I don’t mean this to sound blunt, but what are your qualifications that will make a top player take your word over their own experiences?

If they think Necro cannot burst or bunker effectively, but I have done it before, and I know people that bunker/burst effectively. Then they must be wrong, no?

flow.6043:

Rennoko.5731:

…or another necro with plague sig.

Or just any necro who also uses Doom.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

If they were to attempt to stun break it, they would need to use 2-3 stunbreaks almost immediately after another.

Or as a necro, you could use Well of Power and be immune to that whole rotation.

Doom would activate my Reaper’s Protection, which would also kill them keeping in mind my build’s fear duration. Also, Well of Power would be quite viable, but I don’t know any Necromancers that are packing it.

Craptrain.7203:

This has obviously degraded into an kitten measuring contest.

The builds posted may very well be good for people to use a springboard, but trying to paint them as “meta” strikes me as false advertising. Sure, they may very well be effective. I won’t contest that. However, efficacy is not the measure of whether or not something is the current meta. The current meta is the effective build the fits within the overall team structure. If a 30-30-10 is the best way for a necro to fulfill it’s given role withing a team, then it is the meta. It may not be the best 1v1 build out there. It may not be the best hot join hero out there. However, neither of those matters. What matters is what the top teams are using a necro for. That’s the meta.

I appreciate your effort in collecting effective builds for players to use, tweak, or experience, but maybe present them a bit differently in the future to avoid threads like this.

My point of posting this was to clean ignorance from any top players, to show what Necro is capable of. Spazzcromancer never allowed me to post his amazing Bunker build, but all of these builds are good for a number of things, from roaming, to tanking, to bursting, to bunkering, to supporting, to controlling. Unfortunately, I have to post gameplay videos, and apparently teach them how to use the kitten ed class before they learn that Necro can do more than spam DoTs.

Cempa.5619:

How do you pull that off if the other guy expects you to pull it off? Moreover; when your foe knows to stay over 600 range away and pref +900?

I adapt to my terrain. If they are close by, I use the Spectral Wall. If they are at a distance, I’ll Deathshroud 2, Deathshroud 3, then Spectral Wall, Reaper’s Mark. I can trap them in a corner, knock them off ledges. It isn’t a set thing, and that is why it works against live players.

If they were to attempt to stun break it, they would need to use 2-3 stunbreaks almost immediately after another.

Necro started out with 50% Life force every test.

I firmly believe that if you absolutely want to try your best to kill Thieves in WvW (Unlikely), then you should try a very tanky/bursty Axe/Shield and Rifle build. Rifle is enormously useful for killing Thieves due to 2 (using Leg Specialist) and 3 working against stealthed opponents.

Mammoth.1975:

Question 5: Have you ever considered mastering the fundamentals before trying to innovate?

Actually, it’s not a fair question, because I think innovation attempts are fine whether or not you have a grasp on the fundamentals.

The better question would be: Have you ever considered mastering the fundamentals before trying to trash them?

Considering my very first build was 30/0/10/30/0 Vampire with Soldier’s Ammy. I’d say yes. So what exactly the point to this line of question, Mr Rank 100 tPvP Pro who has posted more builds than anyone ever.

Mammoth.1975:

Yeah, I enjoy playing with kittens, I’ll be there for sure o.0

I’ll bet. You can show off your amazing 30/30/10/0/0 build no one has heard about until now. I might even see if some of the cross guild teachers want to see the best Necro performance ever.

Mammoth.1975:

I told you what the builds burning is worth in terms of dps. Why are you so upset about that?

I’m not upset. You seem to credit everything to how something appears on paper from a first glance. That’s an impressive skill. Must be why you probably thought Necro was UP prepatch.

Tell you what, since it’s not every day I get to fight alongside an absolute living LEGEND rank 100 such as yourself, when I get on tomorrow, I’ll invite you to a tourney group, and you can show the entire Necro school your l33t skillz.

Mammoth.1975:

You still didn’t grasp the concept of uptime? The difference between damage per second and damage per tick on a five second burn that is on a minimum ten second cooldown?

So, you’re going to tell me, that a build is bad, because of the application of the burn being 4 seconds on a 10 second CD.

Someone buff Engineers, they’re unviable.

You’re still wrong, by the way.

Mammoth.1975:

Because I’m inactive too. When I played seriously I was top 100, as you’d know if you weren’t so new it hurts.

“30/10/20/10/0 Rabid Amulet = Burn 275”

You should sign up for my Necro school, I’ll gladly help you.

Blaine Tog.8304:

Absolutely not. Fear being the Necro’s unique damaging condition (other professions have fear, no one else’s deals damage) is what makes condi Necros somewhat viable and scary. That should not be changed.

If Terrormancers are too good, just revert the change to Spectral Wall and they should be fine again.

Terror + Torment + Burn = OP

One of those things has got to go. It’s not the fact that they are there, it’s the fact that they have so much synergy. Necro without Terror would simply be an Engineer, the fact that it’s a Hard CC condition that ticks for so much, allowing other conditions to tick for so much, makes it way too strong.

Mammoth.1975:

Question #3 for example. If you were at least rank 200 or something, you’d get a lot less people disagreeing with you. Of course that’s mainly because you’d stop posting such crap if you’d played somewhat competitively, but that’s besides the point. Why not give it a shot? Should be easy for you since you know so much more about necro than those nasty elitist top players.

I’m not interested in putting together a team of semi-competent players to play consistently against bad pugs to get a few wins on a crappy leaderboard system where players that are inactive have higher ranks than you. The people that disagree with me based on rank are ignorant.

Also, you think burn hits for 275 with a Rabid Amulet (See above posts), so I stopped taking you seriously quite some time ago.

Mammoth.1975:

You should seriously consider what your answers to those questions might be. For your own sake.

You should seriously consider why I should seriously bother caring about what you’re saying. You’re obviously nothing more than an elitist with nothing going for him. I help the community and you snub your nose at me. What have you done? Nothing.

I play competitively, and I have played competitively, not just on this game, either. I don’t care about playing in a ‘top’ team. I don’t care about ‘top’ players. You’re not even a ‘top’ player yourself, so why should I care about your opinion, by your logic. Infact, some of the top players barely even know their own class.

All I see is that you got P/O’d at me and are now struggling to discredit me to the last of your ability. Bravo.

Mammoth.1975:

What does the fact that you usually solo join have to do with queuing a team into the 60% bracket and being surprised that you win?

Why do you think solo join is an excuse for 60%?

Why don’t you stop solo queueing and get some rating so you know what competitive tournament play looks like before sharing your opinions on competitive tournament play?

Why aren’t teams falling over themselves to get you to queue with them?

Perhaps you should learn to play before you share an opinion about learning to play. Because we all know I only kill bad players, infact I’ve never ever ever seen a good player before.

No really, so far all you have done is try to discredit me. It’s amusing. Keep going.

Chesire.9043:

I’ve still not mastered it, sadly. I even think I gave up Spectral Wall because it didn’t fill the role I used it for pre-patch.

/sigh

I don’t even sPvP much anymore. Mainly stick to WvW.

Well, if you need any help mastering something or becoming more skilled with Necro, you can always join my school. We’re up to around 6-7 skilled teachers, and 40+ students. I’d be glad to help you get into a niche.

Chesire.9043:

Takes a lot of practice and timing to get it locked in on good players though.

True, but it is achievable on live players once you master it. I’ve feared numerous people off of cliffs, or into chokepoints with that strategy. Hell, I’ve even feared some of them into Svanir/Chieftain which makes me lawl. It’s much harder to do in 1v1s, however, due to the fact that they can then focus their stunbreakers specifically for you.

Zzod.5791:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

infantrydiv.1620:

In its current state I’d guess a well played full necro team could absolutely steam roll just about any other team comp lol

Been there, done that. The teachers of my Necro school and I got together, played around 14 matches, didn’t lose a single one.

In…the 60% bracket.
[ ] Relevance in establishing credibility in tpvp

Zzod.5791:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

infantrydiv.1620:

In its current state I’d guess a well played full necro team could absolutely steam roll just about any other team comp lol

Been there, done that. The teachers of my Necro school and I got together, played around 14 matches, didn’t lose a single one.

In…the 60% bracket.
[ ] Relevance in establishing credibility in tpvp

I solo join 80% of my matches. If you actually use that as a test of skill/competence, I suppose your opinion is about as useful as a crumpled tissue.

TheMightyAltroll.3485

The Tormentor (Terrormancer Variation of “Death” (Overpowered post patch))
0/30/20/0/20
IV, X, IX, II, VIII, IV, IX
6 Runes of the Necromancer
Carrion Amulet (Rabid Jewel)
Staff (Sigil of Parylization)
Scepter (Sigil of Parylization) Dagger (Sigil of Geomancy)
Consume Conditions, Spectral Wall, Plague Signet, Well of Darkness/Spectral Walk, Flesh Golem

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/necromancer/The-Mighty-Altroll-s-Mighty-Metas/first

I agree, that’s why my goal with these schools is to take some of the burden off of the individual.

Interesting idea, but it’d just make us overpowered in a different way. Most of our problems lie in traits/trait distribution, but making it scale with power would be a bit wrong. Power works, and works quite well, it doesn’t need a buff, however, Vampires/Minionmancers are simply jokes in tPvP. While I dislike Minions considerably, I cannot be biased in the fact that they need a buff.

I posted the below a little while ago, these would keep Necro competitive, while still making other builds viable and nerfing the ones too strong.

TheMightyAltroll.3485

• Remove Fear from Spectral Wall

• Add Torment (6s) to Spectral Wall

• Remove “Dhuumfire”

• Add “Strength of the Underworld” to Grandmaster Spite tree.
  Strength of the Underworld
  Wells last 50% longer

• Make Greater Marks default on Staff

• Move Staff Mastery to replace Greater Marks

• Move “Death Nova” down to Master Traits

• Add “Vengeful Servants” to Grandmaster Death Magic tree
  Vengeful Servants
  When a Minion dies, you receive Fury(5s) and Vigor(5s) (Does not apply to Jagged horrors)

• Change “Vampiric Precision” to heal yourself for 20% of the damage you inflict from Critical Hits

• Move “Vampiric Precision” to Grandmaster Blood Magic tree

• Move “Vampiric Rituals” to Master Blood Magic tree.

• Move “Terror” to Grandmaster tree.

• Move “Withering Precision” to Master tree.

• Move “Target the Weak” to Grandmaster Spite trait

• Remove “Siphoned Power”

• Move “Furious Demise” to Minor Curses trait

• Move “Barbed Precision” to Master Curses Trait

• Increase bleed duration on “Barbed Precision” bleeds by 100%

• Add new trait “Myopathy” to Grandmaster Curses trait to replace “Target the Weak”
  Myopathy
  Apply 2 seconds of Immobilize and vulnerability when you apply Weakness (10 second CD)

• Remove trait “Reanimator”

• Move “Ritual of Protection” to replace “Reanimator” (Only applies protection once per well)

• Add new trait “Summoner” in Master Traits
  Summoner
  Summon 2 Jagged Horrors when you use a healing skill in combat. Capped at a maximum of 5 Jagged Horrors. (Remove the constant negative health effects from Jagged Horrors)

• Remove trait “Strength of Undeath”

• Add trait “Specter” to replace “Strength of Undeath”
  Specter
  You regenerate 50% of your life force when out of combat.

Above is a nerf to the OP Terrormancer you see lately, and a buff to lesser used builds, also a buff to make Vampires viable. Numerous fixes to crappy traits too.

Plague Signet is a useful stunbreak, and allows you to use an opponent’s condition burst against them.

flow.6043:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Toughness alone won’t make you tanky. It’s generally the utilities/traits that makes one tanky.

I know.
But with that statement you are not only arguing against your earlier “glass < 2k” claim, but you also make a point for everyone here who said 30/30/10 isn’t a glasscanon. Because all you need is defensive utilities, like Well of Power, Plague Signet, Spectral Wall…

Not necessarily, it depends on what you’re building to be tanky for. You must also remember that not everything that ‘looks’ good on paper works as properly as advertised. 30/30/10/0/0 looks great on paper, didn’t work out when I used it. Personally, I prefer HP over Toughness anyway when building more for survivability, toughness really doesn’t work without heals to accompany it, we lack the proper healing capability other classes have on high-toughness builds. So we tend to work with high HP and nothing else, therefore using full damage mitigation such as Blindness/Transfers works well for us.

Mammoth.1975:

I’d love to know what you mean by this

I doubt you could use a single build I listed up there effectively without my help. I bet you haven’t even tried, again, you’re looking at it from “oh those look awful” perspective, therefore your opinion is moot, and I’m going to ignore it until something constructive appears.

I’ve looked at your posting history, nothing but sheer Elitism, wrong opinions, and nothing to merit either. You haven’t helped the community at all.

Mammoth.1975:

The 60% bracket isn’t ‘competitive tpvp’.

So fighting against the players you worship makes me bad? Simply because I do not accept your 30/30/10/0/0 glass build as the best thing ever, you’re all going to come into a thread I started to HELP THE COMMUNITY to flame me. Pathetic. It’s a wonder why anyone takes Necromancer players seriously anymore the way they’ve been behaving the past 4 days, I’m starting to become ashamed of my own people.

Alot of people have been having difficulty understanding me when I say “Use fear to move your opponents to where you want them”, so to demonstrate, I made a video. Hope it helps.

It’s not hard to do, but you have to remember to chill them before you can manipulate them effectively. I have used it to great effect many times in tPvP group fights.