Guild Wars 2

gwawer.9805:

“As far as MMO’s go the balance in this game is good” that doesn’t really say much when this game is trying to become a top-notch PVP game. The PVP in other MMO’s have pretty low standards and aren’t even close to being a fair competitive game. I’d rather have this game have high standards and try to become a popular PVP game rather than some PVP tacked onto an MMO like the ones you find in all the other MMO’s. Who cares if it’s an MMO. The point here is the PVP part of the game, not the PVE or wvw.

Feel free to name a single competitive PvP game, outside of FPS shooters and I’ll show you a forum of balance whingers. People who whinge for a balanced state of nirvana never stop. They just keep on going, like a kitten cancer.

Every single game has this virus and I can understand why developers just outright ignore them unless its a bug or an unintended issue. You please one faction of the balance whingers and another one pops out and spreads like kittenroaches.

Shar.3402:

I’m hoping that by “pvp player rankings” it means our hidden matchmaking rank position (not the rating number ofc), if not it would be the most epic fail after the release of swtor XD

The irony.

SWTOR was rubbish, has no cross server functionality and probably still has more people doing ranked warzones then GW2 has doing PvP all together.

In fact, the pvp population of one swtor server probably outnumbers the sPvP population, let alone the tPvP population.

Pretty sure it’s your ranking relative to other players using your hidden MMR.

Not even arena net is silly enough to implement rankings based on glory rank.

Brutalistik.6473:

Valkyriez.6578:

I just can’t believe so may people think that improving game balance should be the number one priority?

A balanced game with no features is the exact same as a balanced game with no features, just slightly more boring.

No Spvp features you mean? That will come in time since they’re working on it which we know. A lot of people want profession balances because even if they have more features in the game. The profession balance will still remain crappy which will result to players taking more breaks and no coming back this time leading to a less pvp community. We will always be fighting the same players 24/7 with less servers and those players will either be the elitists or pve players knocking around in the pvp zone. It’s best to balance out the professions first bringing more versatility so players can get a feel on what they really want to play instead being this one or two builds to be viable in pvp. Some players may want to take different routes like hybrid Condi and burst, tank, condi and a little burst or all of every build though that build won’t be as efficient as others.

They’re striving for that Esport dream so they’re lots of reworking they’ll have to do and profession balancing is one of them. Then comes new the features everyone been hoping for.

As far as MMO’s go, the balance between classes in this game is fine. Some tweaks could be had, sure but overall nothing is game breaking at all and for 99% of the population, any build is viable.

The top 1% make do with what they have, this is true for any game.

Well played Arena Net, Well played.

You announced one of the three things I wanted, Leaderboards. Even if they are as hidden as your matchmaking rating, it’s another step in the right direction.

I like to think my Christmas ditty was the spur you needed, but I might be clutching at straws.

See you on the leaderboards, in 2 weeks sometime. Just click the tab, sort by ranking and go to the bottom. I’ll be there, cellar dwelling

Well played Arena Net, Well played.

You announced one of the three things I wanted, Leaderboards. Even if they are as hidden as your matchmaking rating, it’s another step in the right direction.

I like to think my Christmas ditty was the spur you needed, but I might be clutching at straws.

See you on the leaderboards, in 2 weeks sometime. Just click the tab, sort by ranking and go to the bottom. I’ll be there, cellar dwelling

I just can’t believe so may people think that improving game balance should be the number one priority?

A balanced game with no features is the exact same as a balanced game with no features, just slightly more boring.

The amulet removal idea is actually pretty solid IMO. Or go back to the old system with rings and amulet for more varied stat allocation.

Custom servers with really flexible and varied options is what this game needs right now to kick start the competitive scene out of its death throes.

They need to be readily accessible aswell, I’m dubious to anets plans on thier monitization though. One step in the wrong direction and they cost real cash or gems to use and the game will slide further downhill.

Oni.5429:

Staff is better than greatsword, focus is the primrary pick most good mesmer (including myself) goes in competitive play. Pistol isnt horrible, but in a meta that is designed around the mesmer not ever 1v1ing why would you sacrafice utility in exchange for 1v1 capability?

Gs is nowhere near the power of staff, staff gives AMAZING mobility and utility. Phase retreat can be used to teleport to a highground at almost every single point and can allow some crazy good shortcuts (you can instantly port to clocktower with it, instantly up to trebs, instantly up from lower area to higher area in mansion, instantly to the bridge on legacy, etc)

Again, look at streamers. Stop being insulted by the thought that for example I know more than you. Learn from me. Learn from my hair.
http://www.twitch.tv/helsethgw2#

Ok. I’m not one of those people who can’t admit to be wrong. All the Mesmer streams I have watched, generally are shatter spec with staff & Sword/Pistol. If Helseth says that focus is more useful, then I’m inclined to change my tune and retract my previous post.

I know my spec is sub optimal, but I don’t play at the highest level. I que solo and generally have low MMR on my team so I don’t mind my phantasm spec that is GS based with sword/pistol. The stun on the pistol is a big one for me setting up burst or even stopping a Rez or stomp.

Helseth, can you post a link to your build or guide? I might give shatter another go and see if I like it.

I would have been overly happy with confirmation of just one feature for march patch, or even a dev post on what features won’t make it to patch.

The silence is bamboozling.

You can’t patch a major feature in without at least generating hype beforehand or at least a blog post on exactly how it’s going to work.

If they patch it in like a ninja and let the community figure it out on thier own……. That’s just lazy.

At least do one thing for me. Roll the tournament NPC into the PvP tab. Let me que for a tournament from anywhere in the game.

5 days till patch day and Anet said to me,
I’ll give you a ladder,
And custom servers,
“Soon”
Anet why do you hate meeeeeeeee…..

Haha.

If your not using sword/pistol, you’re doing it wrong.

PowerBottom.5796:

Besides the e-Sports Features (Obs-Mode, Custom Games and eventually a working matchmaking-system + Ladder), there is nothing inherently missing from GW2 to be a potential e-Sport.

Yes, we could talk about new game-modes, better balance etc., but those aren’t a necessity for e-Sports, because GW2 is a mechanically smooth, skill-intensive and fun to play/watch game.

The only thing besides the necessary features that GW2 needs to be an e-Sport is People playing the game. How they make it happen is another question:

1) New other Features that really make GW2 stand out, make ppl come back to it, tell friends about it etc.
2) A big Tournament with cash-prizes
3) Smart advertising of GW2 finally being e-Sport ready
etc.

This bloke has it right. Balance is the least of this games problems, and its not even worth discussing. A lack of features is what has, does and will hurt GW2’s chance even being a remotely competitive game let alone an Esport.

There’s a reason there’s had been next to nil meta changes or significant balance changes, because its not worth worrying about. The meta is in the hands of the community. The already stretched thin pvp team is working on features, however slowly and quite rightly.

Ladder, custom servers, observer mode and working matchmaking will be what sells copies and brings players in, not some I achievable state of balance bliss.

No competitive MMO (lol at that anyway) or MOBA is balanced. Feel free to argue that, but Ivan prove it.

Vanthian.9267:

Snizzy.5427:

Vanthian.9267:

Or instead of all this take the short cut and roll a d/d ele do whatever you want, or roll a bunker guardian and sit on a point. Tada, you are now the backbone of any tPvP group.

Why do you even reply with nonsense like this? If you want to be a 14 year old smart kitten then go back to WoW. This is a legitimate thread, with actual thought out responses. People like you are what is ruining this game, not the professions.

People are allowed to be sarcastic if they want to be and just because the joke rings true doesn’t mean you can tell me to leave. The fact you are even slightly irritated at the joke shows how true it is, which is sad. The balance is the fact and cause of this sPvP being so empty. Be glad that I am even here and a part of the 2,000 people community that remains in sPvP or even looks at it forums.

Edit: Changed sPvP () is to sPvP being.

Wrong.

Balance is the least of this games problems.

Matchmaking is like dragons, mythical and make believe.

Vain for SOTG!!!!!

Good to see you pop in mate. Ping can’t be that bad in Korea, kitten I play in Australia.

I had the funniest thought of Vain as Uncle Drew putting his team back together.

“This game has and always will be about stomps”
“I get stomps”

QT Hman can be Wes.

Lol, it’s early here in oz and I should stop watching YouTube.

6 days till patch and Anet said to me,
Nothing at aaaaallllll,
Lucky I play this game for freeeeeeeeee.

Just did the survey. Good work IMO. The questions were a bit loaded and could have been better worded or more options but its the best survey Ive seen so far.

Rating classes 1-8 would have been nicer but harder to graph I spose.

That may be true, but they have repeatedly said that leaderboards, custom servers and spectator mode are in the internal testing phase so I’m fishing for an announcement that at least 1 of them will be in the march patch.

The suspense is killing me.

7 days to go now Arena-Net.

Any hints? Maybe a blog post or something?

LoL & Smite make you get to level 30 before you can do ranked game modes. Different games but the philosophy is sound. Rank 10 seems a happy medium.

Best to wait until after mid year IMO. Possibly last quarter. Get your fix somewhere else and come back and hopefully the systems will be relatively fleshed out.

Kind of the same as September last year except with a mythical matchmaking rating which works about as often as a unicorn sighting.

Confusion is a rubbish mechanic as it is, akin to damage reflection. It’s a passive way to kill someone and bads rely on it.

Here’s hoping. Balance changes aside, custom servers have to be the number one priority to revstilize the competitive scene. The solo/mixed team que won’t do it even with leaderboards (which I really want anyway as a solo player). But scrimmages and third party tournaments with spectator mode at least gives the high level players a platform for controlled environments.

Balance is the least of this games issues and should be one of its lowest priorities outside a few tweaks.

Features, features features.

Infrastructure and features sell games and bring players in.

Come on Arenanet.

Work with me here. Release a tidbit of what’s in store for us in the march patch.

Your silence speaks volumes.

No.

There should be multiple game modes all with thier respective leaderboards and you let the community decide which one is the preferred competitive mode.

As much as some minority is out there that dislikes it, I think a 3v3 or 4v4 team death match would emerge as the most played and most competitive mode. Let the player see decide, but you need to have options on the table first.

So, at this stage, we can safely say that no features are actually confirmed for the march patch. They are either still in development, or like leaderboards, custom servers and spectator mode are still in the internal testing phase.

I listened to the SOTG and had the impression that none of the above would make it to the March patch. I was hoping a dev could chime in and generate some hype/interest with a teaser for the march patch even if its not specific. Tell us that there’s something in there for us that’s on our list of things coming, even if its not which one.

Does anyone know of any definite features that are sPvP related that are coming in the march patch in 9 days besides the option to display your PvP gear at the character selection screen?

I don’t care a out balance changes, they are irrelevant. Will the march Patch have anything from the list of features that have been said to be coming soon?

Custom servers.

Spectator mode for hotjoin/custom servers.

First implementation of Ranking Leader Boards.

No speculation, no maybes. Is there anything, at all, that I have to look forward to in the patch in 9 days?

Since the 1 round tourneys were introduced, why would anyone bother?

Better rewards, less que times and less time commitment format. I haven’t qued for a 3 round since January and don’t plan to nor do I know of anyone else that does.

Demosthene.2195:

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/news/1070-gurus-spvp-state-of-the-game-w-tyler-bearce-jonathan-sharp-and-karl-mclain/

“Summarised” SoTG transcript for those that missed it. It’s a mixed bag of PvP and PvE stuff.

---

Here is my feedback on spectator mode.

Making it available only for hot-join and custom games is a mistake, because:

- it disconnects the general game audience from top-dog PvP game (unless they’re that lucky 0,1% at the top of the food chain, they don’t understand half the balance changes and how the profession is best played in current balance)
- it does a poor marketing job for both new and long-standing members, which either wish to dive into the PvP, give it another go or assess more carefully their profession choice for a mixed PvP/WvW/PvE venture

Reasoning for these limitations was alleged match manipulation. I ask, what match manipulation?

MOBA games either impose a delay on when a game goes live and can be spectated, or only allow own people / certified shoutcasters to show important tournament games. Combination of these and other techniques will deal with potential match manipulation, while not assassinating the fledgling spectator mode and it’s main purpose.

Last time I checked Guild Wars 1 had a robust spectator mode accessible in the game’s UI from every game outpost, and it helped breed better understanding for current balance issues & how the game is played, on top of luring new players to the pvp game and generating interest, not to mention the sheer entertainment of a little downtime watching matches either for fun or to learn & analyse.

The way I understand it, GW2 spectator mode won’t even have it’s own UI accessible from anywhere, but you’ll simply right-click a match in hot-join/custom game lobby to watch it. If anything, the whole purpose of spectator mode is to allow people to browse from a list of most-serious, top pvp matches – get to know the PvP elite, learn from the best and understand how game is fundamentally played.

Bleed-over from PvP to WvW & PvE is also a nice bonus in terms of the “balance game” and game design problems, not apparent without hard data and access to high-end games & players. Inferior quality of extremely biased feedback you get from your average players is a direct result of poor feedback loop you get from playing the game itself.

Sidenotes:

Update skill, trait, consumable and rune descriptions, so that they truly reflect what a skill, trait, consumable or rune does. For instance, if interrupting the skill makes it go on a full cooldown, the said fact must be reflected in the skill’s tooltips.

It should be also stated in food item’s description, that it’s one of two distinct types of food items, and that effectively two food items of different categories can be combined without overwriting their effects.

Create a public list of malfunctioning runes, consumables, traits and skills. State what the bugs are, how the skills/traits/consumables/runes currently function and estimated date of fix.

There are some shameful examples of traits and runes bugged since game’s release, with absolutely no communication from you as a company. Not acknowledging a bug doesn’t make it go away, and I’m calling you on that.

There should be a tab in Hero’s Panel for WvW and sPvP statistics separately, starting with introductory page on the mechanical differences between PvE and these two game modes, examples:

- “XX consumables cannot be used in YY mode”
- “XX boosters cannot be used in YY mode”
- “XX skills and YY traits and ZZ runes have the following different effects in ABC mode: blah blah blah”
- “confusion has halved damage in XX mode”
- “maximum number of stacks/total duration of XX boon in YY mode”

Similarly, if you’re in sPvP or WvW, your trait, skill and rune descriptions should fully reflect all the differences when you hover over them, on top of the list itself.

Considering the plan is for custom arenas to replace hotjoin to an extent, spectator mode for CA is the best option. Third party tournaments and organised scrimmages between high level players will have the spectator mode with shout casting.

Much better then tournaments in their current state.

I’m pretty sure it will eventually roll out to all modes of pvp though but at first implementation this is a really good way if instantly boosting he competitive scene.

Oni.5429:

Phantasm is rubbish for decent level play though.

I wouldn’t disagree with you there, but as a solo que player I can’t really coordinate portal and Timewarp so I don’t bother. I went shatter for a while, and the burst is good, no doubt.

But when no one does revives etc its just better to get up high and put those GS berserkers to work.

Oni.5429:

Verdelet Arconia.6987:

Lady Sara Goldheart.2764:

Rangers have the least condition removal…lol.
Not in tPvP. They are on the top spots for condition removal.

Edit: Every class has some condition removal and warriors even have some decent. But the shout build nor some other builds from other classes have so much viability as the mainstream builds.

ah sorry Best Guardian in Asia,i wasn’t clear with my last statement, Rangers have the least condition removal with regards to conditions applied to the ranger.

You have to take into account what the actual competitive builds are. Ranger has one of the best condi removal on bm builds. Who gives a kitten about the wiki? What matters is what is actually being used. In this regard Mesmers are the absolutely worst at removing condis, having zero condi removals in this meta

As a phantasm spec I personally use null field and arcane thievery. I think thievery bugs out sometimes though.

“It’s only through the use of our own personally built characters can you ever have a true ladder rank system that reflects each players ability, tactics, and personalised character builds (not cosmetic).[/quote]

Um, not sure how to tell you this, but any ladder, in any game, hat has varying levels of gear is worthless. There’s a reason all he top pvp games, of any genre, are built around cosmetic incentives and progression through rankings and not a power curve.

Besides, it’s already in game. Just grind hose exotics and jump into WvW. I’m sure you and all the other PvE players will fit right in with each other.

Let the real pvpers have their equal footing thanks.

Sure, it will bring people into hotjoin to join the circle jerk.

Double Dutch rudders all round.

The skill level I tournaments has dropped a bit, but you do get the odd game where your MMR kicks in and you get some decent team mates and opponents.

I’ve found that you have to take it upon yourself more now to try and carry your team and cover thier deficiencies. I made a bunker guardian for this very reason. Sure it’s boring as hell to just hold home point and no one comes to help even when you long your minimap a thousand times, but meh, whatever. If it nets the occasional win then I get a chest and some rank points.

I also get the odd whisper and invite to a decent group because they see how I play. If I get a mate to bunker mid point, then I’m back on the dps Mesmer wreckin dudes and carrying the rest of the team.

I just hate the million thieves getting around. But that’s a personal bias. I think I might roll Caeds build and just follow the herd.

The only way to counter the game crashing and replacement issue is a 2min timer and after that it replaces them.

Game crashes aren’t that common, so catering to the lowest denominater shouldn’t be done. Implement a timer to start at the DC and replace them 2 minutes later. A panelty needs to be put in for leavers etc and if the odd person who crashed gets a 15min no que debuff, so be it.

It’s not that common for a DC nowadays, don’t let leavers etc get away with zero punishments just because a few DCs will upset people. Other competitive games do just fine with very harsh panel ties.

I play phantasm Mesmer most of the time now and pound for pound, a shortbow ranger will drop me quicker then I can drop him. Depending on utilities of course, but I run arcane thievery, null field and decoy so not many escape options.

With a bit of burst from me in a hidden position, boon steal and pistol stun, I can get him down if he doesn’t expect it.

Moa for a sure kill.

Nexon? You mean NC Soft?

I have a feeling that CTF would be rubbish in this game withou some pretty heavy restrictions put on carriers.

Meh, I would rather a 3v3 arena mode anyday, even if it was for just a fun mode with no rankings at all.

Blackmoon.6837:

Valkyriez.6578:

I’ll say it again, balance discussion doesn’t bring players to the game or keep players in.

Yes, yes it does. Forcing players to commit to meta builds is a tragedy to all competitive games. On the other hand, giving players the opportunity to create something for themselves in all aspects serves as a foundation for making any game great.

The one thing everyone can agree on is that customization is a major influence in what makes games enjoyable. Meta game defeats the purpose of customization by excluding play styles from the equal chance at winning; regardless of player skill.

Balance is key to the future of this game and it should be a priority.

On the subject of balance, we can look at how bunker builds seem to be current meta. In an ironic way, this justifies why Anet needs to implement new game modes other than conquest.

The meta builds…..

Theres nothing significantly wrong with the balance in this game besides a few minor tweaks. It certainly shouldn’t get 1 hour out of a 1 hour 20 min SOTG discussion.

Agree/Disagree as you like. My point still stands, no one ever sold a game on it being superbly “balanced”. Being severely unbalanced can drive players away, sure. But every competitive game, whether it be a RPG or MOBA, has more then enough balance whinges on the forums regardless of the state of the game and players generally know this.

Oh well, it falls on deaf ears anyway. I switched it off and was disappointed and so would have anyone else who was interested in where the game is headed features and gameplay wise. There just wasn’t enough discussion on it and it left a hollow feeling at the end of it.

Just watched the whole thing, and I have to say I’m a little disappointed. Not in the developers though, but in the way content of the discussion was pushed toward the balance side of things.

I believe balance to be the least of this games problems. You cannot market a game on “good balance” because most of the time it’s subjective. Gamers do not tell thier friends to come try out GW2 “cause its so balanced”. It’s not a selling point and never will be.

Features are what sell and grow games. Any of the top PvP games out there have features and balance is secondary and generally looks after itself.

I wanted to know more in depth info on custom servers, how will they work, are they monetized, how much will they be if they are? What are the restrictions on them? How will spectator mode work and what are some of the cool things that are unique to GW2 spec mode?

Features promote games and get new, old and disinterested players back in. I couldn’t give the proverbial flying fock Bout the overall balance discussion because balance is already relatively ok.

There isn’t a single non GW2 player out there, on the planet, that just got excited about a feature coming to the sPvP scene that would intice him to come check it out and give it a go.

Even worse is that it wouldn’t have interested a single WvW or PvE player to come try it out. Go look at the WvW forums, they call sPvP the “forgotten game mode that nobody plays”. I don’t even like WvW or its concept, but there’s more people playing WvW for the server Sea of Sorrows the. There would be in the entire EU and NA sPvP scene.

If we can’t encourage these guys to try sPvP, when they already own and like GW2, then there no point. You need to generate Interest from your in house population first, and 1 hour of balance discussions in a monthly SOTG and only 20 mins and little depth to the future features section won’t help.

Grouch, Nero and Xeph. I appreciate what you guys do and really think you guys are doing a great job. But I think the conversation was prioritized wrong.

I’ll say it again, balance discussion doesn’t bring players to the game or keep players in. The best balance in the world won’t make me feel any better if the game feels stagnated and there is t hope on the horizon.

My 2 cents.

Skyro.3108:

Valkyriez.6578:

I haven’t watched it yet, but was there any mention of sPvP getting anything new, Anything at all, in the coming March 26 patch?

Custom servers? First implementation of leader boards? A new map is in the pipeline with another unique secondary objective?

I don’t care about balance changes. I just want to know if there is any features, at all, in the march patch or is the end of April the ETA on something for sPvP?

The repeatedly said they were already internally testing leaderboards, custom servers, and spectator mode and they just have to make sure there are no bugs with them before shipping them out, so they sound very close to being done.

Patch drops in 2 weeks, here’s hoping.

I haven’t watched it yet, but was there any mention of sPvP getting anything new, Anything at all, in the coming March 26 patch?

Custom servers? First implementation of leader boards? A new map is in the pipeline with another unique secondary objective?

I don’t care about balance changes. I just want to know if there is any features, at all, in the march patch or is the end of April the ETA on something for sPvP?

It’s not about substituting the game mode for something different. It’s about adding a game mode, that’s entirely optional and you let the player base decide what they want to play whether that be casually or competitevely.

The balance argument is null and void. No one can agree with balance as it is, for one game mode and they never will. Balance is subjective. Just let TDM are as be an option and go from there IMO.

You would think that when you solo que and get 4 theirs on the other team it would be easy toget a win.

Apparently not so. Eles are rare compared to those little buggers all runnin around with the same google haste heartseeker spec. I only have so many dodges.

15k HS dmg in 3 hits is kind of horrendous. I’ve learnt to laugh it off now tho, cause chances are those same 4 thieves will be on my team the next round, against a team 3 thieves. The only thing better then killing a thief is watching them kill each other then one of them does a /say “lol HS spammer”.

The mind boggles.

Jacobin.8509:

Valkyriez.6578:

Well done Grouch. Ignore the naysayers, what you do for this community alongside high level players is far and above what anyone else is doing.

To Arena-net, thankyou for taking the time out of your busy schedules to do these SOTG discussions, this is also far and above what you are required to do as game developers and in my experience over many MMO’s, you are the only dev team to consistently interact with the community in this way outside of forum posts and should be commended for it.

To players wanting to put the developers under siege or over the coals so to speak, remember this, they don’t have to do a SOTG at all and Xeph has it right, it’s a nicety and a way to build a relationship with the players, not a medium to rage or put the hard word on them.

Sorry but devs appearing on a show like this is not some form of charity that players should be thankful for.

We want to know where the game is going in order to determine whether or not we should bother to continue to playing it.

Its the DEVS who should be thankful that anyone is even willing to listen to them at all at this point when none of the features that people want work correctly or are even in the game after 8 months and millions of box sales.

Taking people’s money and then stringing them along with a copy and pasted promise list month after month is not exactly a great way to build consumer confidence.

People just want to know if / when key features will be in the game. If Anet just dodges those questions, talks about unrelated topics, or just flat out deny that issues like low population exist then there is no point in having them talk about the ‘state of the game’.

Wrong. There’s plenty of games out there that the devs don’t do sitdowns once a month for, and they are worse for it.

Anet might be lacking in some areas, but being willing to talk on the SOTG isn’t one of them. I wish thier forum communication was just as strong though.

As said, it’s a step in the right direction. If its not too much resources to use, a daily rotation on the map would be even better. Twice a week is certialy better then weekly though.