Guild Wars 2

shimmerless.4560:

The difference isn’t as wide as you’d think, Scepter has a good block on #2 which doesn’t provide invuln but has the advantage of not being a root/channel. It does fairly high damage, especially on a Power build.

The “permanent Vigor” is only the case if you’re specced heavily into crit. It also doesn’t proc on phantasms, limiting the choices available with which to get it.

I have tried about 4 or 5 builds now and I run full berserker because it is the easiest to use and sadly most effective, but even then on at least 3 of the other builds I still have permanent vigor. As low as 25-33% chance to critically hit is enough to keep vigor up most of the time.

Most Mesmers go at least 20 into dueling for clone on dodge which is roughly 10% critical chance. ( I believe it is 21 precision per 1% critical chance).

I just find that specter block is no where near as powerful as the intangible state. That is what makes it so ridiculous. I don’t think something like that should be on such a short cool down. I mean, it recharges before the other person can burst again.

shimmerless.4560:

The thing that bugged me on the War was that it felt very rock-paper-scissors-y, and that even when slotting heavy condi removal you’d constantly be chilled and crippled. I also don’t like that the GS feels mandatory and that 100b only ever seems usable with Frenzy (which I hate as a skill).

It is rock/paper/scissors in respect to skill level honestly. The Warrior profession is great at running over people who don’t know how to dodge or use their class, but come across someone who knows what they are doing… and it is not even a fight. Warriors have decent mobility, if they are running away. Rush is buggy at best when using it to actually close a gap. All you have to do is move left to right a couple of times and it will bug out and miss. 100 blades is very useless unless heavily set up, which is what makes the Mesmer so much easier in my opinion. It is not hard at all to create 3 clones/phantasmas then use mind wrack for basically the same damage as 100 blades plus confusion.

Eclispo.2703:

Van the problem with mesmers is this once somebody finds the real you and knows how to find the real you everytime your done for. Why? because you dont do as much damage as most classes when you really think about it the only reliable condition with have is bleed and we dont have tht without illusions. Yes sword have invul every 8 traited 10sec if not traited but why do we have it? Because the sword requires us to be in close quarters which we dont have the armor to survive and blurred is our only high damage reliable move our auto attack we dont use to often because we r getting blasted by aoes and everything to stay in melee range for that long. Yes blurred is strong but there is a trade off to using it. Dont look at pros look at the con’s also.

It is not just blurred frenzy, you also have access to permanent vigor. It is quite wop sided when compared to a Warrior and what his defenses are.

You don’t have to be in melee just because you carry the sword. In fact, 90% of the time I am ranged in most fights. The only reason I carry the sword is for “Blurred Frenzy” and “Illusory Leap”. I would go with specter but it is just not as good at defense. I can’t give up the 2 seconds of invulnerably.

Arganthium.5638:

.

You seem to off write phantasms and clones way to easily. They are very easily reproduced and quite fast. I hardly ever run into a situation where I have less than 2 in any fight.

Yes, you do have access to stealth and 8 seconds of stealth is quite a bit if you know how to use it properly and use it well. It can save you and destroy the opposition.

Thief might have a lot of stealth but never does that make him completely invulnerable to attacks. Thiefs are easily dealt with as you know where they are going. To your back the majority of the time. Also, most Thievies have to be close to deal damage, so just count the stealth out and then block/dodge. This is not how you deal with Mesmer stealth. Mesmers don’t’ have to go behind you, nor do they have to come close to deal damage. Also, shatters don’t have nearly as long as cool down as you think. Mind Wrack/Cry/Diversion/Distortion with full cool down reduction is like 10.5/21/31.5/42 seconds.

Arganthium.5638:

First, define to me what “OP” is. Overpowered relative to what? How is your idea of OP better than anybody else’s idea of what is OP? Tell me that, and then perhaps we can talk.

The definition is in the word… over powered. As in, greatly more powerful than other things available to others. A skill/ability that is truly above and beyond that of which most other professions have access too. No other profession can come close to blurred frenzy in terms of defense and offense.

Arganthium.5638:

So, tell me then- what makes mes so much easier, apart from your claims that mes just “is” easier? .

The fact that most damage is ranged and you have AI dealing your damage for you while you have invulnerable states, stealth, and clones to hide behind.

Arganthium.5638:

Anyways, please, QQ more..

I am not QQ merely stating a fact, nor did I come here with the intentions to show the people who should know best that the class is OP. If you want though I will start with a very easy example.

The fact Mesmers can be invulnerable every 8 seconds is ridiculous. Immune to all attacks and skill for 2 seconds every 8 seconds? How is that not OP.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blurred_Frenzy

This is such a well rounded skill that no other class has access too. It can be used defensively and offensively.

I ask you, how is this not OP?

I will tell you why you think it is not, because it only deals mediocre damage.

Not a lair nor do I intend to hurt. I am merely posting the truth of what the Mesmer class is and can do. It is truly a different world when playing a Mesmer than a Warrior. The amount of ease is staggering. I would suggest playing another class like Warrior as it would help you see how hard other professions have to try.

PREFACE
I am not claiming to be pro nor be the best. Simply stating what happened and how I came to what I think.

Finally tried out the Mesmer profession in sPvP. I am fairly adept with all classes having played all of them at least to level 50; I currently have most at level 80. I only played Warrior in sPvP because I liked the challenge. I finally decided to toss in my hat because it is obvious that Warriors will be broken for still quite some time, so I decided to give the profession I thought would be the most OP a whirl.

I understand most people think D/D Elementalist is OP, but that is only true when in a organized group of 3 or more. It is the combined healing/condition clearing that makes them a problem. I could kill unskilled/low skilled Eles on my Warrior as well as many other classes up to skilled level, but I decided to give up the struggle with trying to best someone that is really skilled and go on to something I thought would be easier.

….And boy… did I ever choose right. How over powered can a class be? How has no one noticed how disgusting this is? After 50 games and only leveling to 80 I went in to sPvP and SOLOED a Bunker Guardian and condition Necromancer AT THE SAME TIME. You can call me a lair if you want, but I 1v2 and won with ease. I left the fight with 80% health. Granted I had no cool downs left, but I won. I stomped both of them. To add to the shame, I am full berserker and have at least ten times the ability to survive than my Warrior.

Now, I will say they were not the best out of the bunch I have ever played, but they were not the worst either. The Warrior profession has trouble enough with one person. Dear Balthazar, throw in another you are practically dead on the spot. I easily 1v1 and 1v2 now. I have only died so far to mob balls in hot join. After playing the Warrior for so long switching to Mesmer makes me feel like a Giant walking among flees.

It is just outrageous that a professions can be so good while other suffer horribly. I will most likely not stick with Mesmer as there is no challenge what so ever in killing anyone.

So, congratulations I guess on picking the clearly OP class in this game. You can try to defend it but there is a clear gap in professions and Mesmer is sitting very high.

I will preface this with my own experience: I have played the Warrior class since 3 day head start. I also played Warrior in Guild Wars 1 (as a main) in PvP (real PvP) and PvE. The Warrior in Guild Wars 2 is no where near the Warrior in Guild Wars 1.

I will also assume you mean sPvP when asking about PvP because WvW is not PvP in the slightest. It is a giant mob. Case closed.

Marz.7498:

what exactly makes them so disregarded in PvP?

The reason for the Warrior class being down trotted in PvP is because of how this game works. With the mentality of “Heavy Armor & High Health” came the decision to give the Warrior nothing but a few stop gaps for survival utilities and traits. This has effectively killed the Warrior as a class.

The Warrior has trouble closing gaps and staying on top of decently skilled people. Most people will complain about the Warrior’s damage being too high, but it is actually not that outlandish in comparison to most other classes. Most of our “gap closers” are … how do you say… crappy at best. Rush is suppose one of the said “gap closers” yet it is completely nullified by cripple/chill/immobilization which most of every other class has very easy access to.

This brings us to the next major problem: Condition removal. Warriors have a lack of condition removal.
Removes one condition:
Skill:Shake it Off
Trait “Shrug it off”
Trait “Quick Breathing” actually converts one to a boon
Trait “Mobile Strikes” only removes immobilization on use of movement skill.

Removes Multiple Conditions:
Skill: Signet of Stamina
Trait: Restorative Strength

As you can see the Warrior has a few options, but in this game conditions are applied so easily and readily that even all of that will not stem the tide of what the other professions can throw at you. Mesmers/Rangers/Elementalists do not even have to spec into conditions to apply them constantly and actually make use of them.

Our basic lack of any type of sustain (which was slightly addressed with the new trait). Healing is okay, but this style of PvP is not based on face tanking damage then out healing (although some professions can do this and shouldn’t be able too). It is based on the denial of damage. This is where Warriors fail to live up to the other “bunkers” in this game. Take Guardians for example. They are hard to kill due too…
Permanent vigor (through Vigorous Precision a 5 point minor trait)
Passive blocks every 45 seconds or one on command (30 seconds if traited into)
One true invulnerably (Elite skill: Renewed Focus)

The biggest culprit is the permanent vigor. Other classes have this as well for almost the same ease. Elementalists/Mesmers are the other two. Rangers and thievies have different traits that allow them to dodge quite a few times more as well but nothing can match the permanent vigor. The ability to use dodges to get into a better position and use to evade attacks is huge in PvP. The fact that Warriors have 2 evades pre-loaded then 1 every 10 seconds afterwards is what kills our sustain. Where as Guardians/Mesmers/Elementalist and to lesser extents Thievies/Rangers can dodge to a hearts content. Very rare is it when those professions find themselves without a dodge.

Not to mention the fact that they also have protection (not the Thief, he has stealth instead of protection) and other boons to cover their backs which the Warrior lacks. The only boons Warrior can stack effectively are Might/Fury/Swiftness. Two of those (Might/Fury) do nothing if you can’t hit your target. Meanwhile most other professions have most of the boons to play with.

To cut this short: TO LONG DID NOT READ
Warriors have only one viable way to trait and that is Damage. This is due to other classes being more effective at clearing conditions and fighting sustained fights. This puts us at a huge disadvantage because the Warrior profession has nothing that is tricky nor class defining. All of our attacks are highly obvious and easily dodged. Meanwhile, even if we land a full combo all other professions can either full heal or run away easily.

To all of you “hot join hero’s” that beg to differ… please spare me the arguments. Everyone knows the Warrior is in a horrible position. You will only kill not so good/afk people with a Warrior. Fighting decent people is a death sentence on a Warrior.

If you want build advise I can give you two of my favorites. One of which is a dueling build and the other is a “mob ball” build used for WvW.

Edit: Needless to say, I can not write everything that is wrong nor address all the facts in one post. I will give you more of my opinion if you want but message me in game for that.

Good Job, Daecollo. That is actually a pretty solid suggestion.

Just goes to show, throw enough rocks into a desert you are bound to hit a lake at some point.

I see no one taking this into sPvP. I will not be giving up Balanced Stance for it, nor Bull’s Charge. I would consider swapping out Endure Pain for it but if swap for anything it would be Signet of Stamina (as it is actually slightly useful).

If the enemy is blocking just wait the 3 seconds until it they are done.

Zenith.7301:

I heard necros only get 2 dodges and no vigor.

I believe you mean Warriors, which are that way —>
(Because lets be honest, no one is going to bring that useless Warhorn into sPvP).

Assassin Sharks.6104:

Honestly, I’ve just about had it with Anets dipkitten ideas… Why is it you nerf the non-meta semi-viable builds???

Non-meta? The majority of tPvP teams left are 1 Guardian + 3-4 Elementalists running the s/d or d/d build. When 80%, or 60%, of a team is running same thing time and time again, match after match, I do believe that is what they describe as the “meta”. There are literally matches where two teams run the same exact setup and 80% of the players are playing Elementalist!

There is a reason they run that many Elementalist. There is a reason all you “leet” players cry foul. You know the Elementalist needs a tone down but you don’t want to give up your easy street.

Ride the lighting needs a cool down increase for how effective it is in any situation. I will say 40 seconds is rough, but 20 seconds is far too low. If the Elementalist gets Ride the Lighting at 20 seconds then Warriors should have rush on a 8-10 second cool down. Even then, Rush is no where near as good/usable as Ride the Lighting.

ArtemisEntreri.4138:

If you are trying to say the Warrior is more capable in sPvP/tPvP than a Guardian then I am sorry for you. Even in PvE (including WvW) Guardians are more capable then Warriors.

15 gap closer? What skills are you talking about. Even if we had the option of 3 weapons sets we wouldn’t get near that number.

Lets look at a common sPvP build.
Greatsword + Axe/Shield Utilities: Bull’s Charge+Balance Stance+Endure Pain
I will humor you in saying that anything that makes the Warrior go forward slightly fast is a gap closer and anything that does cripple I will count as well.

You have: Rush, Whirlwind Attack, Eviscerate, Shield Bash, Bull’s Charge,Bladetrail, Throw Axe.

Oh boy, look at all of them. All 7 of them. Only, 3 of them are not honest gap closer because the range on them is less than 600. So that leaves us with 4 things to try and keep targets by us. Meanwhile, Bladetrail and Throw Axe can easily be dodged/cleansed by a majority of classes and once dodged/cleansed they have a decently long cool down compared to other classes. So that leaves 2 viable means to close gaps. Meanwhile, Rush works okay…..sometimes….

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

sigh..
What class can’t? Ever heard of stealth or Endure Pain?

Classes that can be invulnerable to all forms of attacks:
Guardian (Elite skill: Renewed Focus http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Renewed_Focus)
Engineer (Utility Skill: Elix S http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Elixir_S)
Elementalist (Utility Skill: Mist Formhttp://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mist_Form)
Mesmer (Class ability: Distortion http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Distortion)

Classes that can’t be invulnerable to all forms of attacks:
Warrior
Thief
Necromancer
Ranger

Just a short complied list. For a fuller version that includes PvE check here:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Invulnerability

Homonavn.6348:

Let me guess… You are warrior, you used to use this combo:

1. Bulls charge
2. Frenzy
3. Hundred blades

Am i right? 95% of the warriors did that, and i was SO HAPPY when it was nerfed. if you were one of them, please dont complain. You KNOW it was OP yourself, therefor if you didnt see the nerf coming.. Your problem, you should

but if your not one of them warriors, then i can KIND OF see what you mean. But when you find a build which absoloutly destroy everything you should expect a nerf

OP? That is laughable at best. It still took more time for a Warrior to pull that off than a Thief with Mug+CaD+Backstab+Heartseeker+Heartseeker. Also, the Thief deals more damage along with putting on one of the best anti healing conditions: poison.

Just because you have trouble dodging the most obvious utility skill in the game and do not have a stun breaker on your utility bar doesn’t make the very over rated combo OP. That combo has only ever been dangerous to new players or those who don’t dodge.

Hundred blades is by far one of the worst sPvP skills there is in this game. Self root, three and one half second channel (you can be crowd controlled and damaged while doing it unlike a Mesmer with Shatter+Blurred Frenzy). Blurred Frenzy is on a similar cool down as Hundred Blades and offers so much more to the Mesmer profession.

daydream.2938:

What is so weird that the strongest class in the game got a nerf?

A vast majority of them are riding coat tails, so they have to complain to continue to ride. Far be it if you ever see them have to actually try. As soon as they find out that Mesmer is more OP than Elementalist you will see flocks of people to Mesmer.

fost.9167:

Best thing I ever did was spec into 100% swiftness (and 80% ish for might I suppose).

Our stances need rework. We don’t “want” to be like guardians but they are a good example of a class with working synergy that has a lot of the points we complain about (however, guardians are not nirvana they have sore points as well I am sure)

The only sore points for a Guardian are little range options and far reaching mobility skills. However once in melee range with a Guardian it is very hard to escape a good one without stability. You can complain that the Warrior’s high health pool makes giving them protection too good is a shallow argument at best.

The point of the game is denial of damage. The Guardian has many more options available to them for avoiding/denial of damage than a Warrior with protection. This is not even going over the sources of healing (which is also more important that high health).

Forestgreen.7981:

Try gain 5% hp on using burst per bar USED*(This important as missing burst skills don’t actually drain the adrenaline). So 15% hp gain on using your full bar would be better. Looking at the numbers it would be decent and be an incentive warriors to actually their burst.

This is better and more balanced, but you need to look at the cool down of burst skills and the ease of gaining adrenaline. You would have nothing more than health stacking Warriors with power for heavy bursts and high heals.

It is very, and I stress VERY, unlikely for them to make it a percentage base heal while healing power is in the game. If a change is going to be made it will be made in the form of Base Amount + (Level * Random Percentage)+(Healing Power * Random Percentage) or rather for a level 80 character Base Amount + (Healing Power * Percentage). You gain a higher percentage based on the tier of your adrenaline. You would heal for that amount every time you use a burst skill. I am not saying that is what I want, but that is more likely than a straight percentage base heal.

CookMETEnder.7582:

Aren’t we talking about WvWvW 0_0….?
Where in PvE or WvWvW do you find yourself under that many stacks of confusion?
I run a shout build so I rarely run into that kind of problem.

In WvW or sPvP any Mesmer can easily get 6 stacks of confusion on their target by pressing f2 (if they haven’t changed their hot keys and have 3 clones/phantasms out). When I play my Glamour Mesmer I can easily get up to 8-10 stacks of confusion in a “AoE” fashion.

Edit: As to the OP. Guardian is better straight out for a majority of things. The only thing Warriors can do slightly better, and I stress slightly, is in direct damage and condition damage.

If you choose to focus on PvE then it does not honestly matter which profession you choose. If you want to do a bit of WvW and sPvP then do not plague yourself with the choice of Warrior unless you want to struggle. Guardians can face roll sPvP pretty easily with their wiping 2 conditions every 10 seconds, heals on dodge, blocks, permanent vigor for insane amounts of dodging, and a invulnerable state. Pretty easy to duel with a Guardian, but you might have trouble if you are inexperienced with 1vX. The Guardian can do 1vX very easily though with just a little bit of practice. The Warrior however can not do 1vX unless your opponents are completely incompetent.

In all honesty, this is a pretty bad suggestion. You are talking about being able to regenerate 100% of your health in less than 1 minute at max adrenaline. This would stream line the class even further into not using adrenaline more so than it is right now, while we should be pushed in the reverse.

Olba.5376:

Yeah because we totally want Warriors to run around with 50% uptime on Protection on top of permanent fury, swiftness and 8+ stacks of might.

That change makes us like the Guardians! Wouldn’t want to be the Guardian profession… oh right, forgot they also have permanent vigor and regeneration. Guess even with this “OP buff” as you are claiming we still wouldn’t be any where near as good as a Guardian.

This is a balanced set up that I use to stun lock roaming Thieves. While hitting a stunned target I have a 100% chance to critical as long as I have fury up (82% without). This is without food of any kind. Only using “For Great Justice” and “Signet of Rage”.

Far left is without buffs. Middle is only “For Great Justice”. Last is both “For Great Justice” and “Signet of Rage”.

Notes: As soon as I get my second Ascended earring I will have 50% critical damage.

Duke Blackrose.4981:

Frankly, the fact that anyone is expressing envy over the Ranger’s “advantages” is quite frankly absurd.

I guess the realization of the Ranger being more proficient at staying in Melee than a Warrior has yet to dawn on you. It is “absurd” that Rangers are more capable in sPvP with a melee set up than a Warrior.

Ezeriel.9574:

I is so confused!?! Are these guys for reals? Ranger envy?

Who’s next? Engineers?

Perhaps if you took a moment to step outside of the zerg every once in a while and into PvP you would understand.

Why stop with just dueling welding greatswords? Why can’t we make Norns that duel weld Humans that in turn duel weld Asuras that in turn duel weld Greatswords? Image the 100000000000000000000000000 blades. Look like Edward scissors hands every 8 seconds (because who wouldn’t trait into that?).

Amiron.1067:

Warrior support is fan-freakin-tastic, however. Banners (with regen if traited), shouts (with heals if traited), and warhorn can really help a group out.

Just no… no… You invest to heavily for a very bad return. Most other professions already have nearly 100% up time of regen anyway, so you are really doing nothing for them. Healing shouts is mediocre at best. Heal five people for 1.1k-1.3k health… every… 20 seconds tops (if you run 3 shouts then 3.3k-3.9k health)… yeah there are a lot more things you could invest in that would keep them alive much longer and would be more useful. Such as…. grabbing a hammer and stunning the opposition for 2 seconds (stunning 5 targets for 2 seconds is denying a lot more than 4k health in damage).

To each his own I guess! But remember, Guild Wars 2 is not about healing; it is about the denial of damage. All classes (except Warriors) are good at healing themselves, however Warriors have a decent skill setup for crowd control. That serves us, and our allies, much better than the “support” traits.

Duke Blackrose.4981:

Okay, I’ll humor you:

You’re comparing apples to oranges. You can’t compare one ability from each weapon and say “Class x is worse off because Class y has a superior skill z.”

You are correct, I was amused by your comment.

1) The Ranger has a pet and doesn’t need to be in melee range to deal his max amount of damage at all times. His pet can sub in and actually CC the target for him to close gaps… so he really doesn’t need any gap closer to start.

If a Warrior is using Greatsword he needs to stay in melee range to do anything. The two “gap” closers on greatsword are questionable at best. Rush is horrible in almost all situations except straight runs (which only noobs run straight in sPvP when trying to escape a Warrior or in general. Best to zig and zag to confuse them and keep them guessing). Whirldwind is not a gap closer in a traditional sense but more of a evading attacking avoid high burst to stay in melee longer (also the range is very low to be consider a gap closer when most “escape” moves are 1000 range or longer).

2) That is straight out false. The Warrior’s greatsword attacks only hit 3 targets max with Skill 1, 2. It can hit up to 5 targets with Skill 3. It can hit as many targets that are in the path with skill 4, and only 1 with skill 5.

3) Trait support? There is literally only 2 trait that affects the greatsword.

Now the traits that affect the greatsword: “Forceful Greatsword” which reduces cool down by 20% and gives might on critical for greatsword and spear. “Slashing Power”, which increases the damage by 10% of both spear and greatsword.

….and there you have it! All of those plentiful traits…… all two of them.

Quickly looking over the ranger traits it seems they have 2 traits that affect the greatsword (as well as other things).

4) So… you are complaining about a Warrior who has to spend 100% of his time in melee range to do anything that deals maybe…. maybe 10%-20% more damage than a ranger that is full berserker while being 10000000000 times more likely to die.

You deal less damage because no range in any game will ever out damage a melee. It would be stupid if they did. Granted the numbers are not even that big of a difference in most situations which is why Guild Wars 2 should be renamed Ranged Wars 2. Ranged is seriously over powered in this game for any type of PvP (or the PvD {player versus Door}). Have you not noticed that Warriors are completely stripped of anything in PvP? Our 10-20% more damage does nothing against your ranged burst/boons/defensive abilities/and the naturally awesome weapons you have. Seriously, you have the same amount of evades on sword/dagger as a Warrior with greatsword plus his dodges (lets not forget to mention that yours are on shorter cool down).

Also, just for kicks, you have to compare professions…. this is how you, I don’t know, BALANCE the game.

edit: Correction on trait.

I applaud them on this attempt. I can understand why they made it soul bound. I would much rather have it soul bound and not on a horrible RNG.

As to whether it will be the best pick forever… I have my doubts. I assume they will keep the item the same when they release the expansion but add another tier of mats.

Kichwas.7152:

Daecollo.9578:

Warriors are not tanky, reroll to a Guardian. We have support.

That’s foolish.

That is far from foolish; in fact, it is the truth. If you want to tank Guardians can tank several times over the amount a Warrior could dream of tanking. Warriors have almost zero ways to sustain themselves once in combat and must retreat to the back for cool downs/healing. A Guardian can stand in the front for days without worry of turning up dead unless there are 25+ hitting him. It only takes two people pressuring a Warrior for around 10 seconds to kill him. There is a vast difference between the survival of the Guardian and Warrior and I will say this one last time: Guardian comes out ahead by miles.

Today I learned that Hammers “slash”.

After searching for a very long time I have finally found the look I wanted.

Dagger/Dagger Elementalist is the worst case of face roll I have seen in a mmo to date. Make a mistake? No problem, you have at least 3 get out of jail free cards and full heal.
Not to mention they are on a decently short cool down compared to some other classes.

I still play Warrior in Hot Joins. I do fairly well considering the majority of people who roll Thief/Mesmer/Elemenalist in Hot Joins are people who are not very skilled and are trying to face roll. As long as the person behind the other classes are okay or worse, I usually win one versus one.

I just hope they give us abilities that have 3-4 things happen for one push like most of the other classes. Such as… make Rush like Ride the Lighting. With Ride the Lighting you are invulnerable, are not slowed by snares, travel a very good amount of distance, and deal damage at the end. What does Rush do? Takes you a okay amount of distance given that you are not crippled/chilled and deal damage if the target has not moved left to right or any direction really. Seems fair.

Speaking in general, the Warrior class.

Do you think they will ever get around to actually helping the awful professions? Giving them something so they can actually stand up? It gets old going into hot joins, destroying one versus one then getting mobbed. It seems like every game I play I always end up in a two versus one (as in the room has three people total). It is just not worth it any more. Maybe I should just create a Elemeantalist and face roll and look at the screen on occasions to see if I should stomp? Or maybe a regen Ranger?

Any advice to a Warrior that is constantly put at a two versus one? Hopefully beside re-roll.

People make the mistake of claiming they are over powered because they fail to realize how uesless they really are in the game. Sure, you can face roll open PvE but take that Warrior into a dungeon in full berserker gear… you are going to have a hard time. I have had a group do CoF just as fast, if not faster, and safer than a Warrior group most of the time I play.

To be over powered one has to be proficient in all aspects of the game and not in a single corner. The fact that the “CoF Dream Team” can only operate effectively in CoF path 1 (and to some slight extent path 2) should be a very well lit light for most people.

To answer the question: No, they are not OP. They just deal high damage and excel at clearing no skill content.

I have to remind myself not to read chat every time I go in. I have no need for face rolling Thieves to yell at me for destroying them on my Warrior. This is also true for the very rare occasion that I run into a bad Mesmer/Elemenatlist/Ranger as well.

I also don’t’ read chat to remind me not to rage in chat while I get face rolled by a Mesmer/Elemenalist/Ranger. It is not losing that makes me angry. It is the horrible balance of these professions that makes me angry.

Vicarious.3047:

But anyway thnx for all the info Vanthian, I’ll prob try this build out. I know, I know….. I’m probably just about to go torture myself some more with warrior gameplay but I CAN’T HELP MYSELF!!!!!!!! I just like the warrior class too much… no matter how much Anet screws it over… and over… and over…… ;-;

EDIT: Also ummmmmm… what amulet are you using? lol

No problem. I am using a berserkers amulet. You could go with knights if you want more toughness, but you will give up a lot of your damage and health and only gain some more armor. I find that high health helps more in sPvP with Warrior since you already have decent armor with your traits and the base armor.

matthen.5024:

I don’t have any problems with this build, but I think you should make it clear that Bull’s Charge is a knockdown… and not a stun. As a result, while it baits/burns stun breakers, it will not trigger the +50% crit of Unsuspecting Foe. Someone should correct me if I’m wrong here.

That is why I use the bull’s charge for baiting and not actual cc. As to it affecting the Unsuspecting Foe, I honestly don’t know because I use it to bait. I will test it out later today to see.

Edit: Bull’s Charge does not gain benefit of Unsuspecting Foe.

Scotto.3609:

i assumed you would be auto attacking mace primary as you said somewhere you should stay in that set the majority of the time and because the 3rd chain is a beast if it lands and i really wished someone figured out how to use it… but from what ive tryed to re read (i know you have it in a good layout but i just cant seem to concentrate atm), your entire build is a watered down version of 100b?

From what i can picture in my head you are faking people out with weapon swaps to GS and fake stuns, slowly prodding their health down enough to finish them off with a partial 100b from a 2 sec stun from bulls charge or mace f1 that is so slow it hardly lands all the while you are somehow sticking to people like glue with ur only slow which is from GS that lasts 4 seconds.

Not poo pooing the build, just trying to understand how it would work. If the above is not accurate then i dont understand how if you are not atleast bursting in some form, why the enemy doesn’t just kite your auto attacks, burst you to use ur block/endure pain, avoid or just take the few moves you have that aren’t an auto attack and just out health you to death?

A video of this in action would be very helpful.

That is actually about right. It is more effective than you think.

Sadly, Warriors only have two major ways of dealing damage. Either go axe and auto attack & Eviscerate or go greatsword and hundred blades. You can try out hammer but it is so slow. You will be hard pressed to do decent sustain damage on top of the hammer f1 burst. Where as with greatsword you have a okay auto and a decent burst skill.

Skull Crack is actually much easier to land than you think. After you bait all the stun breakers they usually resort to back peddling. It is really easy to smack someone with it in that case or you can precast before you are in range. Since the animation of skull crack is not well known and is kind of hard to see not many people dodge it. Although, the best way to land it would be to waste their stun breakers then use your greatsword 4 to immobilize them (throw it so it goes in the open so it can hit them again on its way back) then hit them with skull crack while they are immobilized.

Also, around 30% of your damage should come from Greatsword auto attacks. How I play the build is generally this….

Mace/Shield start——>get close to Shield Bash—→Switch to Greatsword—>100blades (they will waste a stun break)—>auto attack while keeping on them—→whirlwind when they use their burst or cc—→ switch to Mace/shield for blocks and leeching—→Daze them while using their channeled heal or skills—→Bulls Charge and swap to greatsword for hundred blades (waste stun breaker)—→Switch to Shield Mace—→Shield Bash (waste last stun breaker—it has been at least 20 seconds at this point)—→dodge get in range and skull crack—>swap and hit with full hundred blades—→greatsword 4—>auto attack—→whirlwind to stay on top of them dodge cc—→switch to mace—→daze—→ skull crack—→bulls charge—>greatsword (if they are still alive at this point) hundred blades—-blah blah…

Now that is a perfect fight with me dodging and evading all the dangerous things. You have 3 oh crap buttons. One for direct damage and two for conditions. Most of your healing is coming from swapping weapons a lot, but the majority of your health is saved by good dodges and timed evades.

Scotto.3609:

so how are you landing mace auto attacks exactly?

You are not understanding the build if you think the Mace/Shield is the damage of the build.

That is your defensive set. You start with it and stay with this set so you can easily bait out stun breakers and block/survive long enough to actually have a chance at killing the foe.

You will be switching weapons a lot though. Every time you stun them (aka shield bash and bull’s charge) you should flop to greatsword. Most of the time just seeing the greatsword is enough to bait out stun breakers (Save skull crack for when they have no stun breakers) from most people. You can auto attack some with the greatsword but when they start to apply pressure on you again you switch back to the defensive set.

As I stated in the original post this is not a “hit them now, hit them hard” build. This is a defensive style of play. Instead of being the one to cause the action you will be reacting to it. This lets you control the flow of the battle a lot easier than trying to lead with offensive measures. Reacting to the situation is the reason this build was made, not to try and auto attack someone to death with a mace.

In case it is still blurry, you should not be auto attacking with the mace. If you are, you are playing the build wrong.

Runes for this build are very standard.
Runes: Rune of Lyssa
Lyssa because this helps our passive critical chance, gives us a boon on heal for 10 seconds, and wipes all conditions on use of the elite skill.
The utilities will round out this build and then I will begin to explain how I play this build.
Healing Skill: Mending
You take mending because of the great connection it has with the Strength trait, Restorative Strength. This will allow you to remove all moving impairing effects plus 2 additional conditions. Also with out runes we will get a random boon for 10 seconds which is nice.

Utility 1: Bull’s Charge
This will round out our crowd control effects so we can bait out stun breakers and then finally hit them with the real one.

Utility 2: Balanced Stance
Warriors should not leave home without this skill, period. It will save your life more times than you can count.

Utility 3: Endure Pain
This skill will allow you a brief rest against direct damage which will be well needed in some matches. It is highly effective against the Thief and the “One Shot Build”.

Elite Skill: Signet of Rage
The only reason we take this skill because:
1) it has the shortest cool down of our elites.
2) Warbanner will not help you in a duel/most fights that occur.
3) Rampage is horrible. Point blank.

The build highlights are this:
1) You have 3 blocks: Mace 2, Shield 5 (these two things can turn a tide of a duel. Reflecting while blocking is a great way for Warriors to get conditions on others that we normal do not have access too. It is amazing against Rangers. Reflecting their poison back at them is one of the best ways to win the duel), and Elite skill boon buff form runes. (Please note: You can not block Necromancers wells. Do not waste your shield 5 on them).

2) You have a evade: Greatsword 3 (do not use this skill after one hundred blades just because… that is a MAJOR WASTE of this skill. Keep it locked away for when you know something big is coming your way. Such as a Guardian Greatsword 5, Thief with Basilisk, or the epic way to use it over a Necromancers well bomb. This is one of our only defense moves, do not waste it).

3) You have 1 Daze: Mace 3 (This can be used to bait out stun breakers. Don’t ask me why. Some people panic and use a stun breaker on this).

4) You have 3 Stuns: Shield 4 (awesome skill that will break immobilize for us plus stun the target for 1 second plus with the above set up. This is another skill that is used to bait out stun breakers). Bull’s Charge (this is also a immobilize breaker and stun break baiter). SKULL CRACK mace f1 (this bad boy right here is what gives us the chance at taking someone from 100% to around 40% in one go if you have baited all of their stun breakers. Simple bait, then land this and swap to greatsword and one hundred blades. With this build you will have a 97% chance to critically hit someone who is stunned).

5) We have 2 ways to gain Stability: Balanced Stance (for stun heavy foes or to break out of a Thief’s burst) and Rune of Lyssa boons on elite.

6) We have 2 ways to wipe a great deal of conditions. With our heal combined with the trait and our elite skill. It is basically a full wipe of conditions every 25 seconds and 48 seconds (plus a boon every 25 seconds for 10 seconds and all boons on elite useage).

The Best way to make this build effective is to use your dodges wisely. This is very important, DO NOT FREAK OUT AND USE EVERYTHIGN AT ONCE. Warriors do not have a multitude of “oh crap” buttons. If you are stunned, use one stun breaker; not both.

That is all I have for now guys, best of luck in game.

Hey everyone, just thought I would post my build here since I have been asked for it before. This is by no means a post saying this is the best build ever. I am just suggesting that you give it a look and if you feel like it try it out. This is not a team build. It can be used effectively in teams, but there are better weapons and traits for team play. On with the build.

I will start with the traits since that is what makes the play style of the build.

The trait distribution is 10/10/20/10/20.

Strength Tree: 10 Points: Adept trait: Restorative Strength
This trait allows the Warrior to get rid of the most damaging conditions to us with a heal. I will explain more later.

Arms Tree: 10 Points: Adept trait: Unsuspecting Foe
This allows us to actually deal damage against some bunkers after baiting out their stun breakers.

Defense Tree: 20 Points: Adept trait: Missile Deflection
Master trait: Shield Mastery or Sure Footed
Missile Deflection is one of the biggest things in this build. It will allow you to reflect poison shots (Rangers) and blinds (Guardian focus/Thief pistol). These can be major things that affect the out come of a fight.

Shield Mastery is only in case you want more blocks. This is what I personally use.
Sure Footed will let you stay in your stances longer; Why this is good is down below.

Tactics Tree: 10 Points: Adept trait: Leg Specialist
This trait works very well for only 10 points and can also change a fight if used in the right moment.

Discipline Tree: 20 Points: Adept trait: Signet Mastery
Master trait: Mobile Strikes
Signet Mastery is solely so we can keep our Elite up longer and reap the benefits of our runes (more about this below).
Mobile Strikes is to get out of bad situations quickly.

Now the traits by themselves do nothing without the right weapons. When using this set up with the follow skills and weapons you can really bring them out to shine.

Weapons: Mace/Shield——-Greatsword

Now I know most of you are thinking “Oh great, another 100blades noobzers”. This is a different type of play style and not a “Hit it now, hit it hard” build.

Mace/Shield…. this is your main set and will be using for the majority of the time.
Sigils: Mace—-Sigil of Paralyation
Shield—-Sigil of Leeching
The Paralyation sigil will increase your stun times so you can actually get some damage in, while the Leeching will give the Warrior a little bit of sustain. You should be swapping weapons as much as possible (when you need to, not just because you can) to proc this Leeching effect. Do not swap weapons solely to proc the leeching, that is a good way to die.

Greatsword—-Sigil of Strength or Leeching
I personally run strength over leeching. With the traits above and the constant critical chance we already have strength will give us a lot of might when we use one hundred blades. Go with leeching if you feel you need to heal more often and do enough damage.

Ayrilana.1396:

Actually you have it backwards. The first example is misleading. The percentage difference between items is irrelevant when comparing the impact they have when equipped. An item that has 30 points is 200% better than an item that has 10 points. The impact of this change radically changes when the base stat is included. You must include the base stat when determining the impact of the character between the two items.

If you have 100 base points then the difference is 18.18% [(130-110)/110]. If you have 200 base points then the difference is 9.52% [(230-210)/210]. If you gave 300 base points then the difference is 6.45% [(330-310)/310)]. I think you can see my point. The reasoning behind this is called diminishing returns. As you add more points, they gradually have less of an impact.

This is why going by just the stat differences between exotics and ascended by themselves is misleading. It doesn’t show the impact that it will actually have on your character. This is what the argument is as arguing about the stat difference between the items is pointless.

I’ll also add that an item that gives a 4% increase does not go to 8% when another item with a 4% increase is added. It doesn’t work like that. I know you didn’t state that in the post but this is more for everyone in general since I wouldn’t be surprised if someone jumped to that conclusion. I just don’t want to see someone claiming that equipping all 12 slots (minus weapons) with items that have a 4% increase yields 48% overall.

You are wrong. You are giving and asking for two different values. Asking for the base stats including is asking for a overall power difference on the character and not of the item. We are discussing the overall increase of the item, not the character. In my example I am showing the overall percentage increase of the item, because that is possible at the moment. Trying to give a exact number on what the overall affect of Ascended gear will be when more than half of it is not released is not possible. You can do a estimate if you like, but it will likely be off. However you can clearly see the power increase percentage by looking at the two rings. The difference in percentage (the formula that has been thrown around this forum) does not matter because it will not give you the actual increase of power or any other stat on the item.

You can do a partial over view of the actual increase of the gear if you want since we have: Backpieces/Rings/Earrings/Amulet. You can see the difference in what having those Ascended trinkets will do versus the Exotics if you wish, but that is not what I was showing nor was it what the original person I quoted was trying to show.

CobaltSixty.1542:

I believe you will find that there are exactly 0 scenarios in Guild Wars 2 where your base stats are not taken into account.

If I gave you a full set of exotic gear and a full set of ascended gear and asked you to compare the stats and give me a percentage increase that the ascended gear afforded you, would you give me the (incorrect) value of 10% or the correct value of 3%?

The point of the argument is not a overall estimate of the power gain as we can not know that at the moment. I am arguing for the power increase for the items that we have now. I am simply showing the increase from one Exotic ring to a Ascended ring. Base stats are not on the ring. Trying to include numbers not on the item is skewing the result.

Base stats affect overall character potential and not the increase in power on the item. It is a importance difference the majority of the community is misrepresenting.

Also to your question: The full difference just between the exotic set versus the ascended set <—— asking in this manner does not include the base stats. You are asking questions you don’t fully comprehend. If you want a overall power difference of the character with the exotics versus the ascended then you will need what the others posted. Yet, that is not possible at the moment as we do not know by how much each item is going to increase (aka what I am showing you for one of the items now).

Warriors are far from good in WvW. The only reason why people think they are doing something is due to everyone having almost 0 impact on the zerg of 100+. You can not gauge a professions strength in a group of 100+ when your skills are limited to affecting 5. Thief is not the second worst by any means in Hot Joins (maybe in tPvP). Thief is one of the better classes for Hot Joins considering they can go invisible and run the course of the entire map and spike a person without a stun breaker from 100% to down in less than 2 seconds without haste.

In my original post I wasn’t blaming the Charr for anything they have not done. They are currently mining the ever living crap out of their home land. Just look at the Black Citadel in comparison to other major capitals. The Charr themselves have no care for the land they walk on. I am with the majority on the Charr were nomads who truly didn’t “claim” any one true land but anything they walked across.

Now, since they over threw the Flame Legion sect they have consistently mined and drilled for their “advancement”. The Humans have achieved most of the same technology advancements as Charr but at a much lesser toll on their Environment around them.

I grant the majority of the Airships to Asura and anything that is truly worthy of praise is more than likely a Asura invention. So in essence, the Charr are destroying the land they killed a Kingdom to get (Ascalon and Drascir is not the only part of the Ascalonian Kingdom) for almost no innovation for the whole of Tryia.

Jski.6180:

@ Vanthian.9267
Sry not to many are going to read what you posted its a bit too much for non math major. The point was that even if with the numbers as they are will not excludes you from content in the game making all Ascended WANT and not NEED.

This is the point of this thread beyond that your getting off-topic badly.

It is still very much on topic. The higher numbers will be needed and required eventually. Do they scale FotM with Masterwork Gear in mind? No, they do not. They are designing the high levels for Ascended.

You can say that, “But… but… that is only one place in the game!”. That is very true, at the moment. That does not lend towards the future in which they have stated that more Agony bosses will filter their way into the game at some point. Which means that eventually Ascended items will be needed for the game (as it is now).

My first example still stands. Why would you stand around eating nothing but Jelly sandwiches when you can be having a 3 full course meal?

Also, taking out the base stats shows the pure increase from Exotic to Ascended and not the buffed base numbers. Consider this simplified version.

Exotic gear gives: 5 Power
Ascended gives: 7 Power
So the increase is: 40%

Now, say base stats where 10 each.
Then you would have…
Exotic gear + Base = 15 Power
Ascended gear + Base = 17 Power
Which comes to: 13.33333%

As you can see, the second example is miss leading in the actual increase of the single items power. The second example is a overall increase. Very different things.

Please note: When presenting a percentage as fact while using a formula that gives something completely different than what you are trying to prove is a way of trying to sway a crowd. Politicians and polls do it all the time.

So when talking about a Percent Increase of a item; show the increase form item to item… not the overall increase or the difference percentage between the two.

Playing Hot Joins and Stun Locking a Thief usually makes me pretty happy. I have honestly thought about switching classes many times now, but I am going to wait out this long winter in hopes that some day we will see the sun.

The only suggestion I have is to not join the 16 size Hot Joins. The Warrior gets worse the more people he faces. Also, the number one rule of Hot Joins: Your team will more than likely not help you. So never get in a place as a Warrior that will require your team mate to actually defend and help you, because that is not going to happen 9/10.

To prove the point, something that happened to me not but 10 minutes ago. Elementalist went down to a Guardian and Thief, I jump in and rez the Elementalist popping my Balanced Stance + Endure Pain to survive and get the rez. Low and behold the Elementalist Rode the Lighting Out as soon as he was up :/. Left me in the dust with my strongest utilities on cool down.

I just wish they would show what class the top 100 play so we can see a bunch of Elementalists/Mesmers/Guardians/Rangers up on the board. Maybe then they would be forced to equalize the balance, but I dream big …..